NationStates Jolt Archive

Although I think both sides have good points, I think I'll vote for a restart. Restarted E20 would be much more realistic without four (maybe five if we continue) world wars and multiple super states.

As an addition to the mod list, I'd suggest (when an appropriate organization is founded) a UN mod, as the UN thread can and has gotten very chaotic at times, and its never entirely clear who is on the security council.

Also, I'd like to change my vote to an abstention. I don't know as much about the early 20th century, but having WWV, where even more countries get nuked, isnt something I look forward to. Besides, it will be interesting to see how things turn out another time through (maybe Israel will exist, or communism will develop differently, etc.)

Current Vote Standings:
For Restart: 8
Against Restart: 7
Abstain: 3

As an addition to the mod list, I'd suggest (when an appropriate organization is founded) a UN mod, as the UN thread can and has gotten very chaotic at times, and its never entirely clear who is on the security council.

Perhaps we could broaden the Mod's jurisdiction to include all International Organizations (such as the Red Cross/Crecent, UNICEF, League of Nations ect.) as, in the event of a restart, the United Nations won't be an issue for quite some time.

I vote for a restart for some private reasons that I have explained to some people, and because I think we will do a better job the second time around. We have some serious issues in this timeline at this point. There are also some rules flaws that need to be fixed.

Namely, industrial / producton centers are too cheap, and need to be made more expensive OR restrictions on growth instituted. We have too many nations industrializing too quickly.

Nuclear weapons and delivery systems are too cheap and readily available

We had no real rules for tech level advancements until late in the game.

We had no rules for realistic military builds until relatively late, and that caused problems early.

I have dominated events as the US player for much of the game, while trying to be an impartial mod as well, and that caused problems. Regretably, I couldn't get anyone to play the US for much of the game either. Hell, I asked someone to take over the US as soon as I was made Economic Mod (see the original thread) and was told to continue as US. Now they don't call the 20th Century the American Century for nothing, but there was perception of unfairness frequently.

As chief mod I will handle the rules, major wars (especially the global ones), and NPC nations, and will not play a country this time.

I want an assistant to deal with administrative matters (like player conflicts, new players), this person would also do any misc research we need as we need it.

another assistant to monitor economic spending to ensure someone is watching. This person will asist with NPC builds as the number of NPCs grows. Players will be assigned NPC nations to do builds for as well along the way.

another assistant to assist with minor wars, this assistant will also handle Chinese issues for a while until actually conventional fighting begins to get big enough to make it a major war.

that should be enough to start with. Plus Kirstinia has done an excellent job with things like the Olympics

I think he should continue to handle that, along with Nobel Prizes, World Cups, Worlds Fairs etc

a UN mod isn't needed until we actually get a League of Nations, and that won't show up until the need for it is demonstrated (a First World War for example).

A volunteer to handle the map threads is also welcome

Well I think that settles it then. Restart it is, I guess.

A volunteer to handle the map threads is also welcome

If you would not mind, I would gladly fill in that position (as I do have significant experience in Cartography from previous RP's).

The UIR (not sure of the background on this one)
The Union (now dissolved, and pretty unrealistic.)
Various Conglomerations of Middle Eastern States (bad blood in this area runs deep)



Answer to theses one...UIR for me for personal reasons was not thought out right for the era in my personal opinion

The Union, Vas did alot of research on that matter before even doing it..the events that lead the creation of Union were seen by all, like a Commie Germany and Russia...

The MEU wasn't well thought out....yet it wasn't stable...it had a number of uprising and civil wars...the Arab Federation I can see happening in rl...which it did..it only fell apart in rl do to coups.

Perhaps we could broaden the Mod's jurisdiction to include all International Organizations (such as the Red Cross/Crecent, UNICEF, League of Nations ect.) as, in the event of a restart, the United Nations won't be an issue for quite some time.

Agreed...

Don't forget the Aborigines Protection Society and the Congo Reform Association, two very important human rights groups at the turn of the century (I suggest the book King Leopold's Ghost by Adam Hochschild).

As I stated earlier, I wish to play France.

If you would not mind, I would gladly fill in that position (as I do have significant experience in Cartography from previous RP's).

I could also fill that position. However, if not, I suggest to lachenburg that he uses the Wikipedia map as the basis to the E20 map, because when we used another base the map was all confusing and such.

NPC mod - old position: manage reactions of the NPC nations to PC decisions, perhaps has a few deputies to assist him, also makes rulings on mergers/splittings of nations.

I can be a deputy NPC mod

Awww Horseshit....

BTW, the stupid school decided it would be a good idea to give us new computers but not internet...

Damnit... I was hoping I would have time to think about what country I was gonna be (like 10 months or something....) but apparently you all are rushing everything...

Hmm... I would like to apply for some sort of Mod, but preferably something light since I'm a Senior and all. Also, I know you all are all anti-China being a PC, but I would like to put forward my application(?) for China and barring that, I would like to handle Germany again. Although, I don't know if I can trust any of you...

Damn it all...

in any event, we have a major problem with this RP at this time as Sharina can't post and China is the center of action, diplomatic activity and is one of the most important powers at the moment.

Until he either can post, or we all decide that regretfully we will have to replace Sharina as China I don't see an alternative to the pause we are in now

which is another major reason a restart appeals to me

Well, if we're gonna restart, then here's my list in order from most preferred to least:

1. Kuomintang Party (aka Nationalist China)

2. Russia (then Alexander Kerensky woot woot)

3. Germany (bah, why not)

4. United Kingdom (don't mean to hate on LR, just figured I'd show my true feelings)

5. Persia ( :p )

6. Venezuela ( :p )

Let's do it. Ready to rock.

I would kill to play Japan or Germany. If neither of those are available, then Argentina is my next preference.

BTW, would like to be Russia

A Slightly Bigger Mexico (Latin American nations have always clung to independence historically; even when Bolivar tried to unite Gran Colombia it fell apart.)

Firstly, you're wrong, there was no slightly bigger Mexico. Mexico was just a state within the states. Secondly, this happened before in history, and lasted at least a decade in one instance. Thirdly, the nation in Central America that has always been historically against unity was excluded from the union. And lastly I invested money in to the merger to ensure things went smoothly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_state_leaders_in_1906
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_leaders_in_1906
(On those two links just change the date at the end to get the data on the relevant year)
I say Canadstein should be Moresnet if you don't want him to be anyone powerful, although I'm fine with him being The Netherlands.

Anyway, I would like to play as:
Mexico
Portugal (if we start in 1910)
UK (if LR doesn't want to play as it)
Bulgaria (if the current player doesn't want to play as it)
Greece

I'll volunteer for a mod position, I don't really mind which. Whatever job GB thinks i'd be best at will suit me fine.

Are you talking about this Morsenet? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moresnet
Because I would just quit if I had to play that. At the begining of a World War I would be annexed before the fighting would begin.

No, you could make something of it. You'd just have to try. Although I meant it as a joke.

Their leader is a mayor. Wow. The only thing I could do is mine.

Of course the only thing you could do would be yours.

I would just start a rebellion, then have a massive battle inside the country.

May I suggest all player nominations/voting be put on hold? We have so far came to two major points of agreement:

We are restarting
We need a new forum


Invisionfree is a good service, which I've used before, although if anyone else knows a service they prefer, that's fine as well. I'd suggest, regardless of the service chosen, that GB actually create, so he has admin abilities (make people mods, set up forums, etc.)

May I suggest all player nominations/voting be put on hold? We have so far came to two major points of agreement:

We are restarting
We need a new forum


Invisionfree is a good service, which I've used before, although if anyone else knows a service they prefer, that's fine as well. I'd suggest, regardless of the service chosen, that GB actually create, so he has admin abilities (make people mods, set up forums, etc.)

If we use a new forum, I fear that this RP shall collapse, for the sole reason that it is impractical for some people to RP on two or more different forums.

Thanks to Lachenburg for keeping the vote going while i was away.

And thanks to everybody else for putting up with it in the first place. I do appreciate your patience explaining perspectives to me.

I guess my problem with this whole thing is that it is being called a restart. I know it's just a word, but it seems too much like giving up to me. However, there are really too many good reasons at this point for not playing again, and doing better. So:

--It is a pity we are moving from jolt, if only because the forums have been working perfectly for me. Weird. I only RP in E20, so the difference is minimal to me, but if we had a choice, jolt would be nice for any new blood that comes along.

--Once I am back at Rice next week I will have much more constant computer access. I would volunteer for maps again, although it looks like others are interested in that, or any other positions that need filling.

Guess thats all for now. I'm glad a decision has been made one way or the other. I lift a glass to E20 mark 1 though, just the same.

I too would rather keep at least some representation on Jolt just to attract new comers which we need to keep the RP alive. Perhaps keeping IC stuff on jolt and OOC stuff on invision, or vice versa. I just think that moving entirely to another forum will cut us off from our only source of recruitment.

We don't necessarily need a new forum, but as GB said, we need a site where we can store all our info. I could get us hosted somewhere which would give us a site and a board (just to discuss OOC matters, and suggest things).

Don't think we should rp off jolt at all. We could use another forum as a backup for all our info, but as far as rping we should do it here on jolt so we can keep a steady flow of new players to keep E20 going. And you can't recruit on Jolt unless you actually rp on jolt, the mods don't allow it, they shut down the old W@W recruitment threads many times.

I agree. We should stay on Jolt. It may be tempermental, but it does bring in the new recruits.

I for one fully intend to use Jolt.. in spite of its irritations, it generally works

Available as player countries 1911
Europe
United Kingdom
German Empire
Republic of France
Austria-Hungarian Empire
Russian Empire
Kingdom of Belgium
Kingdom of Netherlands
Kingdom of Italy
Kingdom of Sweden
Kingdom of Rumania
Kingdom of Greece
Kingdom of Spain
Kingdom of Portugal
Kingdom of Serbia
Kingdom of Bulgaria
Kingdom of Norway

South America
Republic of Brazil
Republic of Argentina
Republic of Chile

North and Central America
United States
Dominion of Canada
Republic of Mexico

Oceania
Dominion of Australia

Africa
Dominion of South Africa
Kingdom of Ethiopia

Asia
Kingdom of Siam
Empire of Japan
Ottoman Empire
Persian Empire
KMT party in China

NPC countries (not available as PC countries under any circumstance, some will be PC countries later though)
Europe
Switzerland
Andorra
Liechtenstein
San Marino
Monaco
Denmark
Luxembourg
Montenegro

Africa
Liberia
Morocco

Caribbean and Central America
Haiti
Dominican Republic
Cuba
Guatemala
Honduras
Panama
Costa Rica
El Salvador

South America
Paraguay
Peru
Ecuador
Venezuela
Colombia
Uruguay
Bolivia

Asia
Nepal
Afghanistan
Bhutan
various Chinese warlords and Qing Dynasty
Chinese Communists
other communists

Oceania
New Zealand

I agree, staying on Jolt is in E20's best interests. Keeping reference information and OOC stuff off-site is fine, but I think we should keep the main stuff here.

In addition, I'll volunteer my services for whatever mod position needs handling, though I'm back at school starting tomorrow, so my online time will be limited.

Just for the record, I'm leaning towards Argentina as my new nation, with the WZO as a second choice.

i take it then that colonies like British India and the Dutch East Indies are not playable at this time?

And out of curiosity, why is Chile playable while Colombia and Venezula are not?

Are you talking about this Morsenet? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moresnet
Because I would just quit if I had to play that. At the begining of a World War I would be annexed before the fighting would begin.

Actually me and several players believe you would not be happy with Holland, which IC would be neutral in any real conflict. We think you would be more suited for the Kingdom of Serbia, when it comes into existence.

I would like to state that 1906 is the agreed upon date for starting and I think that makes sense. 1911 may have more countries available, but so does starting in say 1921 or 1991, so we should start in 1906. What the Great Powers do those five years will be crucial towards futures attitudes, relations, and divergences.

We should start in 1906, no later date.

Also, starting in 1911 would give players far far less choice, the reason 1906 is a good idea is it gives everyone who has a country plenty of options, plenty of chances for fun realistic divergence that effects the development of other nations, and plenty of differing goals.

For example, starting in 1911 means the Ottoman Empire, Austrian-Hungarian, Russian, and Italian player would not have to deal with the Balkan restructuring... For example, Serbia or Albania could end up stronger or weaker then they did historically do to differing actions.

Another example, btween 1906 and 1908 Count von Zeppelin develops several airships and in 1908 acquires enough funds to found the Luftschiffbau Zeppelin GmbH, how countries could have reacted to that is fun to think about (minor issue, but still fun).

1911 would result in a stuffy game with fewer choices.

i take it then that colonies like British India and the Dutch East Indies are not playable at this time?

And out of curiosity, why is Chile playable while Colombia and Venezula are not?

better economy, more stable government, and both Colombia and Venezuela are acted on more then acting early in the century. They will be available later however.

Colonies aren't playable yet, but nationalist movements will be later

Bulgaria and Montenegro become independent in 1908, China has its revolution in 1911

I can go either way after researching the various colonies, nothing major happens between 1906-11 in that respect. 1911 is a watershed year.. we had the Moroccan Crisis in Europe, Chinese Revolution and next year the Balkan Wars and Italian War with Ottoman Empire occur.

Although both the Triple and Double Alliances exist by 1911, and don't in 1906, there is no reason the players must continue them.

I will get back to you on start date

Although both the Triple and Double Alliances exist by 1911, and don't in 1906, there is no reason the players must continue them.

Actually the Triple Alliance did exist in 1906...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_Alliance_%281882%29

I will get back to you on start date

1906 is the best starting date.

OK, all this discussion about restarting is fine and dandy, but I do think we should end this thing, or at least write a history or something. But simply abandoning it does us no good and at least a meteor striking the Earth and wiping out all of Humanity would be at least SOME way to end this.

lol. Definately no meteors, but you are right, there does need to be some sort of closure.

I would prefer one of course where the human race survives, but whatever.

On another note, I prefer 1906 as a start date, if only because I like to see more in the hands of the players. The more divergence from RL, the better as far as I am concerned...

I agree with Amestria that 1906 is a better time, although my reasons are more selfish :p

It would give me 5 weeks to research stuff and get settled into school.

Personally, my puritanical side demands that we start at 1900 but I can handle without it.

Parthini']OK, all this discussion about restarting is fine and dandy, but I do think we should end this thing, or at least write a history or something. But simply abandoning it does us no good and at least a meteor striking the Earth and wiping out all of Humanity would be at least SOME way to end this.

I don't think there ever really could be an end, just a point were we stop. As for a history, that is a good idea, I suggest a wiki or wikipedia article.

Parthini']I agree with Amestria that 1906 is a better time, although my reasons are more selfish :p

It would give me 5 weeks to research stuff and get settled into school.

Personally, my puritanical side demands that we start at 1900 but I can handle without it.

in a perfect world i would prefer 1900 too, but since 1906 is pretty much already decided on, i have decided to choose my battles.

I'm ok with 1906. I'm leaving for Verdun tomorrow (WWI tour, maybe I'll get some ideas ;) ) so I wont have internet acces till Friday at least.

Updated my navies list for 1911 (seems like we're going back to 1906 again, but I can change it again). It now has a list of every ship in the British, German, French, Chinese, Japanese, Austro-Hungarian, Swedish, Spanish, Turkish, Dutch, Uruguayan and Portuguese navies (except for subs). Still to come: Russian, Italian, American, Norwegian, Argentine, Brazilian, Chilean, and Danish.

I'd prefer the 1911 starting date so that we do not have to worry about all of the small chinese warlords fighting for dominance and the Ottoman Empire is starting to break up. Plus the fleet lists are done for 1911 and i'd rather not sort them out for 1906 again (though I can do so, just takes some more time).

1911 navy lists (http://ajdumelow.tripod.com/navy.htm)

I'd prefer the 1911 starting date so that we do not have to worry about all of the small chinese warlords fighting for dominance and the Ottoman Empire is starting to break up. Plus the fleet lists are done for 1911 and i'd rather not sort them out for 1906 again (though I can do so, just takes some more time).

The Chinese warlord era was from 1916 to the early 30s, so you would still have to worry about them, also the Balkan players would actually like to RP the breakup of the Ottoman Empire, the most significant geopolitical event of the century until the outbreak of the first world war.

1906 is thus the best time to start, 1911 is far too stuffy. By 1911 far too much is set in stone.

i would reiterate that 1906 is a superior start date for flexibility reasons. The more RP time the better.

LR, sorry that it is more work, but I definately prefer having the extra five years to play with

I've got to agree with Cylea and Amestria. Five more years of RP is five more years of RP...

I will support the 1906 crowd on this matter for the reasons they have already espoused. However, in the event we start in 1911, I will not mind.

Also, about the NPC nations, why did you include Denmark, GB? Although they certainly aren't the most important nation in the world, they do have a somewhat large navy, a colonial empire and significant economic influence in Northern Europe.

In reality, if you were to exclude a Scandinavian nations from being claim, your best bet would probably be Norway as it currently has the least amount of influence/power in Scandinavia.

And as for the forum thing, I highly suggest we keep as much of the RP as possible on NS as almost every off-site RP I have seen/participated in has been a miserable failure (even the 'hybrid' RP's which have parts both on-site and off-site). Plus, despite the amount of clutter and occasional technical difficulties, Jolt seems to have the most features and is the easiest to use (In my opinion).

Colonial possessions and overseas territories 1910
Useful link
http://www.worldstatesmen.org/COLONIES.html


United States
Puerto Rico
Philippines
Hawaii (includes islands like Midway and Johnson Island)
Alaska
American Samoa
Panama Canal Zone

Netherlands
Dutch East Indies
Aruba
Bonaire (Dutch Antilles)
Dutch New Guinea

Spain
Rio De Oro (Spanish Sahara)
Canary Islands
Centa (enclave on Moroccan coast)
Rio Muni (West Africa)
Balearic Islands

Portugal
Azores Islands
Madeira
Portuguese Guinea (modern Guinea Bissau)
Angola
Mozambique
Cabinda (modern part of Angola north of Zaire)
Cape Verde Islands
Goa (Portuguese India)
Macao (Portuguese colony in China)
Portuguese Timor (modern East Timor)
Sao Tome and Principe (islands in Gulf of Guinea)

Denmark
Greenland
Iceland
Danish Virgin Islands (modern US Virgin Islands)
Faeroe Islands

Belgium
Belgian Congo

Italy
Massawa (modern Eritrea)
Italian Somilaland (northern part of modern Somalia)

Japan
Bonin Islands
Karafuto (southern Sakhalin Island)
Chinese eastern Railway Zone (de facto control of all railroads and cities hooked up to them in Manchuria)
Port Arthur/Kwangtung peninsula (China)
Korea
Okinawa and Ryukyu islands
Formosa (modern Taiwan)
Volcano Islands
Kurile Islands

France
Algeria
Tunisia
French West Africa
Ivory Coast
Chad
French Equatorial Africa
Madagascar
Amsterdam and St. Paul Islands (north of Antarctica)
Comoros Islands (a client state but essentially French owned)
French Indochina
Clipperton Island (off Pacific coast of Mexico)
Corsica
French India (consists of Chandernagore, Pondicherry, Karikal, Yanaon, and Mahé)
French Polynesia
French Caribbean (Guadeloupe and Martinique)
Mauritius
New Caledonia
Spratley Islands
Wallis and Futuna Islands (near Fiji)

Chinese Empire
Tibet
Outer Mongolia (modern Mongolia)
Singkiang

Russian Empire
Azerbaijan
Armenia
Aland Islands (Baltic)
Belorussia
Crimea
Estonia
Finland
Georgia
Kazakstan
Kyrgyzstan
Latvia
Lithuania
Bessarabia (Moldova)
Poland (Warsaw/Lublin and central and eastern Poland)
Northern Sakhalin
Tajikistan
Turkmenistan
Ukraine
Uzbekistan

Ottoman Empire
Albania
Arabia (modern day Saudi Arabia)
Crete (until 1908)
Bulgaria (until 1908)
Egypt (technically only, really British controlled)
Sudan (technically only, really British controlled)
Libya
Iraq
Kosovo
Kuwait (technically only, actually a client state of British and Turkey)
Lebanon
Syria
Palestine
Jordan
Macedonia
Qatar
Rhodes
Samos
Yemen (except for Aden which is under British control)
Rumelia (part of modern Greece)

Austrian Hungarian Empire
Bohemia (modern Czech Republic)
Bosnia-Hercegovina (occupied 1738, annexed 1908)
Bukavina (part of Moldavia)
Dalmatia (part of Yugoslavia)
Croatia
Krakow (part of Poland)
Fiume
Lvov
Hungary
Austria
Ruthenia (part of modern day Ukraine)
Slovakia
Southern Tyrol
Trieste
Slovenia
(misc border parts of modern day Germany, Poland, Rumania, Yugoslavia, etc)

German Empire
Burundi
Caroline Islands
German East Africa (Tanzania)
German Southwest Africa (Namibia)
German Togoland (Togo)
Tsingtao (German treaty port in China)
Mariana Islands
Marshal Islands
Memel (part of modern Lithuania)
Pleasant Island (modern Nauru)
Rwanda
Silesia (part of post 1945 Poland)
Palau
Alsace Lorraine (pre 1870 belonged to France)
Western Samoa
Cameroon

Australia
Papua
Torres Strait Islands
Northern Territory (as in Darwin area is still under British rule at this time)
Christmas, Cocos and Keeling, Norfolk Island and Coral Sea Islands are essentially Australian controlled

British Empire
Aden
Andaman and Nicobar Islands
Anglo Egyptian Sudan (Sudan)
Anguella
Antigua
Ascension Island
Australia (Dominion)
Bahamas
Baker Island
Baluchistan
Bahrain
Barbados
Barbuda
Bechuanaland (Botswana)
British India (includes Pakistan, various Marajah states)
Bermuda
Bhutan
Guyana
Belize
Indian Ocean Territory
Burma
British Virgin Islands
Brunei
Canada (Dominion)
Canton and Enderbury islands
South Africa (consists of several colonies, Dominion status 1910)
Ceylon
Cyprus
British Guinea
Dominica
Pitcairn Island group
Falkland Islands
Rhodesia
Fiji Islands
Gibraltar
Gilbert and Ellice Islands
Grenada
Hong Kong
Ireland
Isle of Man
Channel Islands
Oman (technically independent but a client state)
Jamaica
Kuwait (technically part of Ottoman Empire but a client state)
Laccadive Islands
Seychelles Islands
Maldives Islands
Malaysia
British Borneo
Mauritius
Nepal (client state)
Bhutan (client state)
New Hebrides (Vanatu)
Newfoundland
Nigeria
Kenya
Malawi
British Virgin Islands
Grand Caymans
British Antilles
Sierra Leon
South Georgia and Southern Sandwich Islands
Suez Canal Zone
Trinidad and Tobago
Windward Islands
Zanzibar (part of modern Tanzania)
Malta

GB, we want to start in 1906...


Belgium
Belgian Congo


BTW: It was the Congo Free State until King Leopold sold it to the Belgian Government. King Leopold ruled the place as his own personal possession, being the King-Sovereign of the Congo in addition to being King of Belgium.

GB, we want to start in 1906...



BTW: It was the Congo Free State until King Leopold sold it to the Belgian Government. King Leopold ruled the place as his own personal possession. Being King-Sovereign of the Congo in addition to being King of Belgium.

actually, some of you indicated you want to start in 1906. But not all.

1911 gives us South Africa, KMT party in China, Bulgaria, Montenegro
1906 doesn't have them, but we can go with 1906

as far as the colonies go, the only changes between 06 and 11 are indicated in parenthesis

the actual de jure ownership of the Congo is irrelevent... bottom line, its a de facto Belgian possession for the purposes above...eventually even the Belgian government gets horrified and takes it away from the King

the actual de jure ownership of the Congo is irrelevent... bottom line, its a de facto Belgian possession for the purposes above...eventually even the Belgian government gets horrified and takes it away from the King

Not before some time, and its a rather important event from the standpoint of the history of human rights... Its official title until it was sold to the Belgian Government was "Congo Free State," a fairly twisted name.

Actually me and several players believe you would not be happy with Holland, which IC would be neutral in any real conflict. We think you would be more suited for the Kingdom of Serbia, when it comes into existence.

It's fine. Actually I wanted to play a neutral country. While everyone killed each other I would just improve my country. I might make the Netherlands a country like Swizterland.

It's fine. Actually I wanted to play a neutral country. While everyone killed each other I would just improve my country. I might make the Netherlands a country like Swizterland.

I don't think Switzerland is actually claimable in this version.

yeah..I would rather have the rp start in 1906 then 1911..too much would be set in stone..

1906 seems preferable to me from what I've heard so far, but I trust Galveston Bay's judgement on this one.

I don't think Switzerland is actually claimable in this version.

Sorry I didn't mean that. I want to make the Netherlands a more neutral country.

i would be a lot more eager to try my hand at a nation in the balkans if that pesky rule about loser nations getting their players bumped wasnt around.

Which I'm not a fan of by the way. Doesnt that mess with continuity? If you want a penalty for losing a war, just have an NPC mod say there is unrest in the nation...

i would be a lot more eager to try my hand at a nation in the balkans if that pesky rule about loser nations getting their players bumped wasnt around.

Automatic loss of a country only applies in the event of total defeat, in other words, your country completely defeated, think Germany 1945.

I like 1906, but only if it doesn't require GB and LR to do to much work trying to switch any 1911 stats they might have compiled over to 06 stats as they do not deserve to have more work piled on.

Automatic loss of a country only applies in the event of total defeat, in other words, your country completely defeated, think Germany 1945.

iono, i can think of a couple scenarios off hand where serbia (one of my front runners right now) gets raped pretty well in a balkan war gone wrong or WW1

So I guess a lot happened in the last few days that I missed eh? We're restarting obviously. Either at 1906 or '11 and....yeah, did I leave anything important out?

Obviously I would like to lay claim to Austria-Hungary as I was its original player (for all of something like 6 years).

iono, i can think of a couple scenarios off hand where serbia (one of my front runners right now) gets raped pretty well in a balkan war gone wrong or WW1

I also think the rule only applies if other people want to RP that country...(assuming the nations that defeated Serbia don't make it a former country).

Alright, now that we have decided on whether or not to restart, along with the general era (seems to me 1906 will take the cake), I think it's about time we organize potential claims and/or interested parties. Obviously there will be more than one player intent on claiming a certain nation, but I believe that with everything organized onto a single list, we might be able to speed up this process.

Thus, based on previously stated interests, the list is as follows:

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini
Whittlesfield
The German Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Middle Snu
Safehaven2
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star
Kordo
The Russian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Kilani
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Cylea
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Cylea
The Kingdom of Bulgaria ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Norway
World Zionist Organization ~
Malkyer

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Middle Snu
Malkyer
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Safehaven2
- The Dominion of Canada
- The United States of Mexico ~
Whittlesfield

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam
- The Empire of Japan ~
Rodenka
New Dornalia
Haneastic
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif
Abbassia
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Abbassia
- The KMT party in China ~
[NS]Parthini
V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

For those of you who I may have missed or are interested in laying a potential claim, please inform me so I may put your name on the list.

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

I'd like to play Spain in the restart, or barring that, I'll take Rumania again.

Change Amestria to Red, everyone has agreed to my claim.

I'm going for Germany or America.

After careful thought, Canadstein has been nominated for The Kingdom of Ethiopia.

Edited.

Ottoman Khaif and Abbassia both wish to be the The Ottoman Empire...

Abbassia has also meantioned Persia...

After careful thought, Canadstein has been nominated for The Kingdom of Ethiopia.

seconded whole-heartedly.

In addition. Put Cylea down for Italy and Serbia (Italian claim is merely expressing interest, as i believe Artitsa among others wanted that nation). Thanks.

Oh, and perhaps a green that doesnt make me put on sunglasses? Sadly my computer screen is too bright for that...

What why Ethopia? Are you trying to do something? I'm onto you Amestria.

Put Malkyer down for Argentina, and the World Zionist Organization as a second choice (though I don't where you'd put that...Europe maybe, or America?)

You forgot to put me down as the KMT.

[NS]Parthini also wants the The KMT party in China (I believe that is his first choice).

Oh, and since no one else wants it, I'll also go for Japan.

I'm taking Japan (1st Choice), KMT Party (2nd Choice)

Awww...put me down for Romania.

Haneastic wants to be Japan.

Malkyer wants to be Argentina.

Haneastic wants to be Japan.

Damn...too slow. Well, the spot is still blank, and on an unrelated note I do remember calling the KMT first anywho.

Damn...too slow. Well, the spot is still blank, and on an unrelated note I do remember calling the KMT first anywho.

Both will be voted for in the event of conflict.

Updated yet again. For nations claimed by more than one player, I suggest you guys discuss such matters amongst yourselves and come to a agreeable solution. As for the players who have chosen more than one nation (including myself), I suggest you make up your mind in the near future.

Please note that I do not have the power to actually confirm your claim. I only can list potential claims and/or claims that have already been confirmed.

Lesser Ribena wants England.

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini
Whittlesfield
Lesser Ribena
The German Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Middle Snu
Safehaven2
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star
Kordo
The Russian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Kilani
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Cylea
Artitsa
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield
Cylea
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Cylea
The Kingdom of Bulgaria ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Norway
World Zionist Organization ~
Malkyer

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Middle Snu
Malkyer
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Safehaven2
Cylea
- The Dominion of Canada
- The United States of Mexico ~
Whittlesfield

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam
- The Empire of Japan ~
Rodenka
New Dornalia
Haneastic
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif
Abbassia
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Abbassia
- The KMT party in China ~
[NS]Parthini
V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

I propose that we set a date for people to nominate themselves, so that we can get rolling.

I say, by Friday the nominations for nations close and voting begins which will last, say, 4 days?

Colonial possessions and overseas territories 1910
Useful link
http://www.worldstatesmen.org/COLONIES.html


United States
Puerto Rico
Philippines
Hawaii (includes islands like Midway and Johnson Island)
Alaska
American Samoa
Panama Canal Zone

Netherlands
Dutch East Indies
Aruba
Bonaire (Dutch Antilles)
Dutch New Guinea

Spain
Rio De Oro (Spanish Sahara)
Canary Islands
Centa (enclave on Moroccan coast)
Rio Muni (West Africa)
Balearic Islands

Portugal
Azores Islands
Madeira
Portuguese Guinea (modern Guinea Bissau)
Angola
Mozambique
Cabinda (modern part of Angola north of Zaire)
Cape Verde Islands
Goa (Portuguese India)
Macao (Portuguese colony in China)
Portuguese Timor (modern East Timor)
Sao Tome and Principe (islands in Gulf of Guinea)

Denmark
Greenland
Iceland
Danish Virgin Islands (modern US Virgin Islands)
Faeroe Islands

Belgium
Belgian Congo

Italy
Massawa (modern Eritrea)
Italian Somilaland (northern part of modern Somalia)

Japan
Bonin Islands
Karafuto (southern Sakhalin Island)
Chinese eastern Railway Zone (de facto control of all railroads and cities hooked up to them in Manchuria)
Port Arthur/Kwangtung peninsula (China)
Korea
Okinawa and Ryukyu islands
Formosa (modern Taiwan)
Volcano Islands
Kurile Islands

France
Algeria
Tunisia
French West Africa
Ivory Coast
Chad
French Equatorial Africa
Madagascar
Amsterdam and St. Paul Islands (north of Antarctica)
Comoros Islands (a client state but essentially French owned)
French Indochina
Clipperton Island (off Pacific coast of Mexico)
Corsica
French India (consists of Chandernagore, Pondicherry, Karikal, Yanaon, and Mahé)
French Polynesia
French Caribbean (Guadeloupe and Martinique)
Mauritius
New Caledonia
Spratley Islands
Wallis and Futuna Islands (near Fiji)

Chinese Empire
Tibet
Outer Mongolia (modern Mongolia)
Singkiang

Russian Empire
Azerbaijan
Armenia
Aland Islands (Baltic)
Belorussia
Crimea
Estonia
Finland
Georgia
Kazakstan
Kyrgyzstan
Latvia
Lithuania
Bessarabia (Moldova)
Poland (Warsaw/Lublin and central and eastern Poland)
Northern Sakhalin
Tajikistan
Turkmenistan
Ukraine
Uzbekistan

Ottoman Empire
Albania
Arabia (modern day Saudi Arabia)
Crete (until 1908)
Bulgaria (until 1908)
Egypt (technically only, really British controlled)
Sudan (technically only, really British controlled)
Libya
Iraq
Kosovo
Kuwait (technically only, actually a client state of British and Turkey)
Lebanon
Syria
Palestine
Jordan
Macedonia
Qatar
Rhodes
Samos
Yemen (except for Aden which is under British control)
Rumelia (part of modern Greece)

Austrian Hungarian Empire
Bohemia (modern Czech Republic)
Bosnia-Hercegovina (occupied 1738, annexed 1908)
Bukavina (part of Moldavia)
Dalmatia (part of Yugoslavia)
Croatia
Krakow (part of Poland)
Fiume
Lvov
Hungary
Austria
Ruthenia (part of modern day Ukraine)
Slovakia
Southern Tyrol
Trieste
Slovenia
(misc border parts of modern day Germany, Poland, Rumania, Yugoslavia, etc)

German Empire
Burundi
Caroline Islands
German East Africa (Tanzania)
German Southwest Africa (Namibia)
German Togoland (Togo)
Tsingtao (German treaty port in China)
Mariana Islands
Marshal Islands
Memel (part of modern Lithuania)
Pleasant Island (modern Nauru)
Rwanda
Silesia (part of post 1945 Poland)
Palau
Alsace Lorraine (pre 1870 belonged to France)
Western Samoa
Cameroon

Australia
Papua
Torres Strait Islands
Northern Territory (as in Darwin area is still under British rule at this time)
Christmas, Cocos and Keeling, Norfolk Island and Coral Sea Islands are essentially Australian controlled

British Empire
Aden
Andaman and Nicobar Islands
Anglo Egyptian Sudan (Sudan)
Anguella
Antigua
Ascension Island
Australia (Dominion)
Bahamas
Baker Island
Baluchistan
Bahrain
Barbados
Barbuda
Bechuanaland (Botswana)
British India (includes Pakistan, various Marajah states)
Bermuda
Bhutan
Guyana
Belize
Indian Ocean Territory
Burma
British Virgin Islands
Brunei
Canada (Dominion)
Canton and Enderbury islands
South Africa (consists of several colonies, Dominion status 1910)
Ceylon
Cyprus
British Guinea
Dominica
Pitcairn Island group
Falkland Islands
Rhodesia
Fiji Islands
Gibraltar
Gilbert and Ellice Islands
Grenada
Hong Kong
Ireland
Isle of Man
Channel Islands
Oman (technically independent but a client state)
Jamaica
Kuwait (technically part of Ottoman Empire but a client state)
Laccadive Islands
Seychelles Islands
Maldives Islands
Malaysia
British Borneo
Mauritius
Nepal (client state)
Bhutan (client state)
New Hebrides (Vanatu)
Newfoundland
Nigeria
Kenya
Malawi
British Virgin Islands
Grand Caymans
British Antilles
Sierra Leon
South Georgia and Southern Sandwich Islands
Suez Canal Zone
Trinidad and Tobago
Windward Islands
Zanzibar (part of modern Tanzania)
Malta


reminder

I also say, not to make Lachenburg's job any harder, everyone picks their nation in order of priority, and then Lach puts that on the list. That way, we can tell who wants what and if someone gets voted for one that is their top choice we can take them off the list.

I for one fully intend to use Jolt.. in spite of its irritations, it generally works

Available as player countries 1911
Europe
United Kingdom
German Empire
Republic of France
Austria-Hungarian Empire
Russian Empire
Kingdom of Belgium
Kingdom of Netherlands
Kingdom of Italy
Kingdom of Sweden
Kingdom of Rumania
Kingdom of Greece
Kingdom of Spain
Kingdom of Portugal
Kingdom of Serbia
Kingdom of Bulgaria
Kingdom of Norway

South America
Republic of Brazil
Republic of Argentina
Republic of Chile

North and Central America
United States
Dominion of Canada
Republic of Mexico

Oceania
Dominion of Australia

Africa
Dominion of South Africa
Kingdom of Ethiopia

Asia
Kingdom of Siam
Empire of Japan
Ottoman Empire
Persian Empire
KMT party in China

NPC countries (not available as PC countries under any circumstance, some will be PC countries later though)
Europe
Switzerland
Andorra
Liechtenstein
San Marino
Monaco
Denmark
Luxembourg
Montenegro

Africa
Liberia
Morocco

Caribbean and Central America
Haiti
Dominican Republic
Cuba
Guatemala
Honduras
Panama
Costa Rica
El Salvador

South America
Paraguay
Peru
Ecuador
Venezuela
Colombia
Uruguay
Bolivia

Asia
Nepal
Afghanistan
Bhutan
various Chinese warlords and Qing Dynasty
Chinese Communists
other communists

Oceania
New Zealand


reminder 2.. NOTE THE NPC countries

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini
Whittlesfield
Lesser Ribena
The German Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Middle Snu
Safehaven2
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star
Kordo
The Russian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Kilani
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Cylea
Artitsa
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Cylea
The Kingdom of Bulgaria ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Norway
World Zionist Organization ~
Malkyer

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Middle Snu
Malkyer
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Safehaven2
- The Dominion of Canada
- The United States of Mexico ~
Whittlesfield

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam
- The Empire of Japan ~
Rodenka
New Dornalia
Haneastic
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif
Abbassia
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Abbassia
- The KMT party in China ~
[NS]Parthini
V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim


anyone who plays Japan must understand the importance of navies and seapower.. same for UK and US. They are the dominant sea powers of the 20th Century. If you don't understand seapower, and I demonstrated very thoroughly its importance in the RP that we just did, then don't play those countries.

Whoever gets Austria Hungary and Serbia should be willing to accept getting pummeled and possibly wiped out in a war, same for Belgium and even Japan and Germany.

Also, add Cylea to the US list, he indicated interest to me by TG. Sharina has not been able to read or post, and should be given consideration as well

Parthini']I propose that we set a date for people to nominate themselves, so that we can get rolling.

I say, by Friday the nominations for nations close and voting begins which will last, say, 4 days?

I think that would be perfectly acceptable.

Parthini']I also say, not to make Lachenburg's job any harder, everyone picks their nation in order of priority, and then Lach puts that on the list. That way, we can tell who wants what and if someone gets voted for one that is their top choice we can take them off the list.

I suppose such a thing could be done. However, do not expect an update until tommorow afternoon when I may continue unimpeded.

Why is Denmark an NPC?

If I cannot get Austria-Hungary, I would like to play as Suid-Afrika.

EDIT: After some consideration, I have decided to change my first choice to the KMT, Japan second. Apologies for the inconvience.

Why is Denmark an NPC?

a very good ooc reason based on last RP, and because its basically powerless

a very good ooc reason based on last RP,

I doubt Moorington will show up again.

and because its basically powerless

So are Belgium and Portugal...

To quote someone else...

Also, about the NPC nations, why did you include Denmark, GB? Although they certainly aren't the most important nation in the world, they do have a somewhat large navy, a colonial empire and significant economic influence in Northern Europe.

EDIT: After some consideration, I have decided to change my first choice to the KMT, Japan second. Apologies for the inconvience.

Made some changes. Much apologies.....:(

I doubt Moorington will show up again.



So are Belgium and Portugal...

To quote someone else...

removes temptation

and Belgium is one of the 10 largest industrial nations in the world while Portugal has a really strategically important empire and possibility of getting help from Brazil.

Danish colonies are valuable only because of their fishing, and Denmark cannot field any kind of army or navy and is not even in the top 10 industrial nations in Europe

I think I'll go for Chile and if TLS takes it then I'll settle for Brazil.

removes temptation

Rather unilateral and arbitrary in my opinion...

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini
Whittlesfield
Lesser Ribena
The German Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Middle Snu
Safehaven2
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo
The Russian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Kilani
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Cylea
Artitsa
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka
Canadstein
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield
Cylea
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Cylea
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Bulgaria ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Norway
World Zionist Organization ~
Malkyer

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan2
Kordo
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Middle Snu
Malkyer
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star3
Koryan 1

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Safehaven2
Cylea
- The Dominion of Canada
- The United States of Mexico ~
Whittlesfield

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam
- The Empire of Japan ~
Rodenka
New Dornalia2
Haneastic1
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif
Abbassia
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Abbassia
- The KMT party in China ~
[NS]Parthini1
New Dornalia1

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star3
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

The following players need to make up their minds on what they want:

Canadstein, Whittlesfield, and [NS]Parthini

Rather unilateral and arbitrary in my opinion...

is there someone who actually wants to PLAY Denmark?

my daughter tells me that all the time

Amestria feels that the following players are best suited for the following countries:

Lesser Ribena: Great Britain

Safehaven2: The German Empire

Kilani: The Russian Empire

Artitsa: The Kingdom of Italy

The Lightning Star: The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary

Rodenka: The Kingdom of Serbia or The Kingdom of Rumania

Haneastic: The Empire of Japan

Ottoman Khaif: The Ottoman Empire

Abbassia: The Qajar Persian Empire

Koryan: The Republic of Chile

Malkyer: The Republic of Argentina

Kordo: The Republic of Brazil

Whittlesfield: The United States of Mexico

[NS]Parthini: The KMT party in China

Canadstein: The Kingdom of Ethiopia

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini
Whittlesfield
Lesser Ribena

My recommendation is for Lesser Ribena to play the UK again based on his previous fine job in last RP. But see special note below on what my real choice would be.

The German Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Middle Snu
Safehaven2

I recommend Safehaven for Germany as he has demonstrated a very strong grasp of strategy, which is critical for the German player. Parthini has indicated stronger interest in China, while Middle Snu as Poland (when it comes into being) would be very interesting. Would like to see Middle Snu help me again with economic refereeing, as he has excellent attention to detail.

The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria

Kilani would also be a good choice, but has not indicated interest that I am aware of. Amestria has demonstrated a goodly amount of knowledge. Strategic skills are unproven but then France in RL had a few problems, so I guess we will see.

The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo

Either would be good in this role. My biggest concern regarding Kordo is reliability, but he did a fine job last time. So he has my recommendation

The Russian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Kilani

Kilani has indicated a strong interest, while Parthini has indicated more interest in China. Recommend Kilani

The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg

Did a good job last time

The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
Canadstein

I am inclined to recommend Canadstein be given a chance at this. If necessary, other arrangements can be made.

The Kingdom of Italy ~
Cylea
Artitsa

I recommend Artitsa for this role, as I think Cylea would be excellent as the US.

The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg

Recommend Middle Snu, but if he isn’t interested, if Lachenburg would rather play Sweden makes sense. However, I think Kirstina would be best here, as Sweden is mostly neutral, and in addition to handling things like the Olympics etc, he could also handle the Nobel Prizes.

The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka
Canadstein

Recommand Rodenka for this

The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield
Cylea

Recommand Whittlesfield for this role, as Greece gets an early trial by fire during the likely crisis in the Balkans.

The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka

or he could play Spain, which ever he prefers. Middle Snu would be good here too.

The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Cylea
The Kingdom of Bulgaria ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Norway
World Zionist Organization ~
Malkyer

Recommended these players for other roles, but Malkyer would be interesting if Israel comes into existence

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan2
Kordo

Recommanding Koryan as recommended Kordo for Austria Hungary

- The Republic of Argentina ~
Middle Snu
Malkyer

The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star3
Koryan1

Recommending Lighting Star for South Africa, and Malkyer for Argentina unless Israel comes into existence

-
III. North America:
- The United States of America
Safehaven2
Cylea

Recommending Cylea as Safehaven has indicated stronger interest in Germany

- The Dominion of Canada
- The United States of Mexico ~
Whittlesfield (see above)


IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam
- The Empire of Japan ~

Recommand Sharina, Haneastic or New Dornalia. Based on player goals, think Sharina would make the game interesting. I think New Dornalia and Haneastic should play a small country initially so they get a chance to be either the Reds or Whites (Haneastic) if Russia has Civil War or Communists when China (New Dornalia) has one.

Rodenka
New Dornalia2
Haneastic1
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif
Abbassia

Hmm, Ottoman did an excellent job last time. That said, recommending Abbassia has he has also done an excellent job and someone else should have a turn. My actual preference would be to let Ottoman Khaif play the British, and have Lesser Ribena play Australia and provide principal referee assistance for me.

- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Abbassia

both recommended for other roles

- The KMT party in China ~
[NS]Parthini1
New Dornalia1

Recommending Parthini, with New Dornalia playing the Red Chinese

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star3
Recommending Lightning Star

- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein
recommended for another job

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia
recommending Lesser Ribena


I am not trying to be mean or harsh here. I honestly think these players would find these roles challenging, and would challenge everyone else in these positions. My recommendations are based on previous RP, strategic and economic ability demonstrated, and my gut feeling.

I will take Ethopia then since it seems like you think it's the best choice for me, but later on I might change to the Netherlands.

I don't mind switching to a different nation to give others a chance at the UK. I'm considering Australia, though perhaps Denmark as well. I'll let you know later! Though if no established players want the UK I can take it up again if necessary to play it strictly historically as was my plan for the restart, which shouldn't compromise my position as cheif assistant to GB or whatever. Though as I say i'm not really bothered either way, if someone wants the UK and the other players are agreed that they can handle it, they can have it.

Are we settled on a start date yet? If so I can finish off the fleet lists today and get started on land forces, ready for the restart. In the meantime i'll change the lists for 1906 as that seems to be the consensus, it's not really that much trouble, i'd just finished changing them for 1911 when it was decided to have it start in 1906 so I was being grouchy!

I'd like AUstralia. I'll take Australia. I'd prefer the Kingdom of Spain, but I will take Australia as a secondary choice.

Damn being late sure did put a crimper on this one.

Uh and as for whether we restart or not, I gather that vote was settled while I was gone.

Turkish forces were expelled from Crete in 1898.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cretan_Gendarmerie
Cretan Republic would be a NPC.

HMMM seems everything is taken already. HMMMM.....

Not quite everything. Just tell us what you want!

I'd like to play Spain personally. It's in Europe, but far enough away from the major enemies that it's not in the thick of it. It's also large enough to be semi-important if handled correctly, but not neccesarily a world power. It's not automatically weak, but not automatically strong either. That's why I want it. Also it's easier for me to understand the culture than some of the others.

If not that I'd like Australia for similar reasons, though Australia has to work intrinsically with the UK, which I don't mind. At this moment.

I'm pretty sure you'd be able to have Spain.

I have no interest in Sweden at all, principally because Safehaven2 has already given Sweden a supurb play that really couldn't be improved on much.

Spain would be of greater interest to me, but others have already claimed Spain. All things considered, I would be happy to play the Kingdom of Siam until something more enticing opens up. It is, at least, an interesting nation to play.

OHH!!! I see no one has claimed Canada. I think I might take them as well. It might be a country to expand on and make much more important than in real history. Sooo....

My first choice is SPain. My second Choice is Canada. My THird Choice is Australia. And that's how it works. Sooo I want to be in the running for those and that's it. And yeah.

Sweden or Norway would be ideal for me at this point...maybe Switzerland if possible because of its neutrality. I am also willing to renew my IOC duties as well in the New E20...

I have no interest in Sweden at all, principally because Safehaven2 has already given Sweden a supurb play that really couldn't be improved on much.

Spain would be of greater interest to me, but others have already claimed Spain. All things considered, I would be happy to play the Kingdom of Siam until something more enticing opens up. It is, at least, an interesting nation to play.

I would encourage you to play the United Kingdom then, as apparently Ottoman Khaif is not excited about playing the British Empire.

I thought he was being though of for playing the Ottoman Empire? Little confused and all. I don't see him for the list for the United Kingdom. Uhh Ottoman Keif THat is.

Fleet lists are updated once more for 1906 this time, pretty much every navy is listed as long as you have a cruiser at least. Still have to get round to doing US and Danish navies, plus everyone's subs and stuff but they'll be up soon.

Having reconsidered (once again) I can see many advantages to me not having a country at all and becoming a full time mod with GB, helping manage the NPC reactions (being less passive this time around) and other things. That is if we can find someone experienced enough with the RP to take on the UK and empire.

Frankly, the British Empire scares me somewhat... Britain is a large and complex power at the moment, and I'm not sure how much time I'll have to roleplay once the school year begins. I'd be more comfortable with someone like Artitsa taking over the Brits and myself becoming a more easily handled power, such as Italy.

Fleet lists are updated once more for 1906 this time, pretty much every navy is listed as long as you have a cruiser at least. Still have to get round to doing US and Danish navies, plus everyone's subs and stuff but they'll be up soon.

Having reconsidered (once again) I can see many advantages to me not having a country at all and becoming a full time mod with GB, helping manage the NPC reactions (being less passive this time around) and other things. That is if we can find someone experienced enough with the RP to take on the UK and empire.

don't worry about the US Navy, I have them and will email them to you

So Artitsa, want to be the British?

UMMM!!! Where are the fleet lists that Lesser Ribena is talking about? Just curious about the link and all. Never mind. Found it already. It's set as 1911 and such. Are the new links set up in the front? *Runs to check.*

Ah must have forgotten to link it, ah well.

Here it is:

navy lists 1906 (http://ajdumelow.tripod.com/navy.htm)

Links can't be added to the front page as Sharina has no access. Though there will undoubtedly be a new page ready for next Monday's kick off.

Groovy. So I guess airforces will have to be started from scratch as I don't think any country had an airforce or an air corp in 1906. And the rest of the build information will be provided after the votes.

Groovy. So I guess airforces will have to be started from scratch as I don't think any country had an airforce or an air corp in 1906. And the rest of the build information will be provided after the votes.

France, Germany, and England were the first countries to get air forces...which remained part of their armies and navies until later. As Spain you do realize you will not be able to avoid the very bloody Spanish Civil War...

What? The Spanish Civil War is very avoidable. If, instead of adopting a left-wing Republican government Spain had voted in a right-wing conservative government it probably wouldn't have happened. It's certainly not as insurmountable as, say, turning Germany Communist.

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini
Lesser Ribena
The German Empire ~
Safehaven2
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo
The Russian Empire ~
Kilani
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Artitsa
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg
Kirstina
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield
Cylea
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka
Sukiaida
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Cylea
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Bulgaria ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Norway
Kirstina
World Zionist Organization ~
Malkyer

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan2
Kordo
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Middle Snu
Malkyer
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star3
Koryan 1

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Cylea
- The Dominion of Canada
- The United States of Mexico ~
Whittlesfield

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam ~
Middle Snu
- The Empire of Japan ~
Rodenka
New Dornalia2
Haneastic1
Sharina
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif
Abbassia
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Abbassia
- The KMT party in China ~
[NS]Parthini1
New Dornalia1

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star3
Sharina
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia
Lesser Ribena

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

That and if Spain saw the loss of it's colonies as a blessing in disguise, it could also be avoided. Hell despite the defeat by the United States, it still held off the Civil War by 40 years. The Spanish Civil War would most likely have happened in 1899 or 1900 if the Spanish American War hadn't happened.

So I agree it is avoidable. It's alot less inevitable than the American Civil War. And if I have to go through it anyways, then I get to be Francisco Franco. Fun fun fun and double fun. I mean a Civil War doesn't mean I can't play SPain anymore does it? Does it?

I mean a Civil War doesn't mean I can't play SPain anymore does it? Does it?

Civil War results in you playing one side (Government) and another player playing the other (rebels, revolutionaries).

Ergo if the revolutionaries win, I can't play it anymore.

LR, where are you getting your numbers? Not to be a pain or anything, but here (http://www.battleships-cruisers.co.uk/brazilian_navy.htm) and here (http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Brazil#Navy) say Brazil had more than three cruisers. I saw you had some blanks so maybe you just forgot to add them.

If it'll help Lesser Ribena at all, I looked on Wikepedia and found the Populations for 1907. A little forward of 1906, but helpful none the less. It's at this link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1907_populations

So uhh there if it helps at all.

FINALLY!

Able to get back into Jolt after 8 long days.

I take it GB recommended me for Japan? If so, I'm up for it.

So, it turns out it's me and LR for Britain, and if he would rather do Mod or pick another country and wouldn't mind me ruining his country ( :p ) then I will be The British Empire.

THIS IS SO IN PROGRESS, BUT GIVES YOU A TASTE. I AM NOT FINISHED BY ANY STRETCH WITH THIS

Economic situation 1906
Europe
United Kingdom
Population: 44 million, Tech level 5, production centers 14 (London 2, Birmingham 2, Liverpool 2, Manchester 2, Edinburgh 2, Belfast 1, Portsmouth 1, Leeds 2),

German Empire
Population: 60 million, Tech level 5, production centers: 15 (Koln 2, Dusseldorf 2, Hamburg 1, Berlin 2, Essen 2, Munich 1, Breslau 1, Leipzig 1, Stettin 1, Frankfurt 1, Strasbourg 1) Resources: 2 (Saarbrucken 1, Breslau 1), Oil 1 (Hannover 1)

Republic of France
Population: 38 million, Tech level 4.5, production centers: 7 (Lille 2, Paris 2, Marseilles 1, Nantes 1, Brest 1)

Austria-Hungarian Empire
Population: 50 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 6 (Vienna 1, Budapest 1, Prague 2, Zagreb 1, Krakow 1)

Russian Empire
Population: 150 million, Tech level 4.5, production centers: 6 (Warsaw 1, St Petersburg 1, Moscow 1, Kiev 1, Minsk 1, Tula 1), Resources: 16 (Kiev 5, Minsk 1, Rostov 2, Omsk 2, Irkutsk 1, Sverdlovsk 2, Kharkov 2, Tbilisi 1) Oil 10 (Baku 5, Grozny 2, Maikop 3)

Kingdom of Belgium
Population: 7.25 million, tech level 4.5, production centers: 2 (Brussels 1, Liege 1)

Kingdom of Netherlands
Population 6 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Rotterdam 1) plus colonial income

Kingdom of Italy
Population 34 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 4 (Turin 1, Milan 1, Rome 1, Naples 1)

Kingdom of Sweden
Population 5.5 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Stockholm 1) Resources 2 (Stockholm 2)

Kingdom of Rumania
Population, tech level , no production centers, resources 1 (Bucharest 1), oil 3 (Ploesti 3)

Kingdom of Greece
Population, tech level, no production centers, resources 1 (Athens 1)

Kingdom of Spain
Population, tech level, production centers 1 (Madrid 1), resources 3 (Ferrol 1, Malaga 1, Seville 1)

Kingdom of Portugal
Population, tech level, production centers 0, resources 1 (Lisbon 1)

Kingdom of Serbia
Population, tech level, production centers 1 (Belgrade 1)

Kingdom of Bulgaria
Population, tech level, production centers 0, resources 1 (Sofia 1)

Kingdom of Norway
Population 2.3 million, tech level, production centers 0, resources 1 (Stavanger 1)

South America
Republic of Brazil
Population, tech level, production centers 1 (Recife 1) Rosources 1 (Manus 1)

Republic of Argentina
Population, tech level, production centers 1 (Buenos Aires 1)

Republic of Chile
Population, tech level, production centers 0, resources 3 (Santiago 3)


North and Central America
United States
Population 90 million, tech level 5, production centers 20 (New York City 3, Boston 1, Philadelphia 2, Chicago 2, Pittsburgh 2, Kansas City 1, Houston 1, New Orleans 1, Milwaukee 1, Cleveland 1, Cincinnati 1, Denver 1, San Francisco 1, Los Angeles 1)
Resources: 13 (St. Louis 1, Sacramento 2, Seattle 2, Anchorage 1, Dallas 2, Memphis 2, Denver 1, St Paul 1, Minneapolis 1)
Oil: 20 (Houston 5, Shreveport 2, Philadelphia 1, Bakersfield 2, Helena 1, Los Angeles 2, New Orleans 2, Odessa / Midland 2, Oklahoma City 2, Dallas 1)

Dominion of Canada



Republic of Mexico

Oceania
Dominion of Australia

Africa
Dominion of South Africa
Kingdom of Ethiopia

Asia
Kingdom of Siam
Empire of Japan
Ottoman Empire
Persian Empire

NPC countries (not available as PC countries under any circumstance, some will be PC countries later though)
Europe
Switzerland
Andorra
Liechtenstein
San Marino
Monaco
Denmark
Luxembourg
Montenegro

Africa
Liberia
Morocco

Caribbean and Central America
Haiti
Dominican Republic
Cuba
Guatemala
Honduras
Panama
Costa Rica
El Salvador

South America
Paraguay
Peru
Ecuador
Venezuela
Colombia
Uruguay
Bolivia

Asia
Nepal
Afghanistan
Bhutan

Republic of France
Population: 38 million, Tech level 4.5, production centers: 7 (Lille 2, Paris 2, Marseilles 1, Nantes 1, Brest 1)

France in 1906 had a population of 41,067,000...

38 million is way off

Where does everyone get their stats? How is the Industrial Centers, Population, and Resources for this year start?

Where does everyone get their stats? How is the Industrial Centers, Population, and Resources for this year start?

I'd imagine once the whole nation claiming thing gets sorted out and mods are appointed, the Economic Mod/Head Mod will create a new Economic Thread or update the old one with the 1906 stats.

I haven't been able to get on much lately, but I would like Canada or the World Zionist Organization. Failing either of those, I will take Persia or any minor European power (Belgium, Greece, Portugal, whatever is free/needed), and I put my full trust in whatever GB recommends. I feel I probably have the best grasp on the history of the WZO, although I can always read up on the nation I play.

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini
Lesser Ribena
The German Empire ~
Safehaven2
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo
The Russian Empire ~
Kilani
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Artitsa
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg
Kirstina
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield
Cylea
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka1
Sukiaida
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Haneastic2
The Kingdom of Norway
Kirstina
World Zionist Organization ~
Elephantum

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan2
Kordo
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Malkyer
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star3
Koryan 1

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Cylea
- The Dominion of Canada
- The United States of Mexico ~
Whittlesfield

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam ~
Middle Snu
- The Empire of Japan ~
Haneastic1
Sharina1
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif
Abbassia
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
[NS]Parthini
Abbassia
- The KMT party in China ~
[NS]Parthini?
New Dornalia1

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star2
Sharina2
- The Kingdom of Morocco ~
Abbassia
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia
Lesser Ribena

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

Kingdom of Belgium
Population: 7.25 million, tech level 4.5, production centers: 2 (Brussels 1, Liege 1)

Two questions:

First, wouldn't Antwerp also be considered as a major production centre do to its significant Port infastructure and Diamond exchange? And secondly, although the Congo Free State isn't technically owned by the Government, wouldn't it still be providing the nation with some type of return equating to a point value (sure, most of the profits went to Leopold and his shareholders but such capital and raw materials would eventually "trickle-down" into Belgian markets)?

Sorta the same note for Barcelona and Cevilla in Spain. As the uhh important industrial centers.

GB is still working on things...

GB is still working on things...

I understand. Just trying to make sure everything has been considered.

I nominate Haneastic for Serbia in the event he does not get Japan.

I understand. Just trying to make sure everything has been considered.

Made up your mind on what you want so we can tidy up the list?

I would like to nominate Haneastic for Japan.

I would like to nominate Haneastic for Japan.
I second this idea

I second this idea

Thirded. I know I'm a candidate, but if I don't make it, he should be the one.

Amestria, you can take Bulgaria off your list of player nations. Bulgaria didn't gain complete autonomy until 1908.

https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/bu.html#Govt

And since it appears that Parthini wants Great Britain, you can mark me down as "confirmed" for Siam.

I will support Hanaestic for Japan, and drop my claim for said country. I also vote for myself for Spain.

Well, they decided it would be cool to block Chatzy on my school and I really can't think of a good reason to get them to unblock it, so Chatzy will be limited to maybe only a few weekends.

Sorry all.

Parthini']Well, they decided it would be cool to block Chatzy on my school and I really can't think of a good reason to get them to unblock it, so Chatzy will be limited to maybe only a few weekends.

Sorry all.

What school do you go to that banned the glorious Chatzy program?

I'll support Kordo for Austria-Hungary, since he did a great job going down with the ship last time, and it'll be interesting to see if he manages better this time.

Players and recommended countries

Principal moderator – Galveston Bay (responsible for
rules, and handles major wars, economic crisis and
trends and adjudicates disputes). Assist with NPC
builds
Senior moderator – Lesser Ribenia (assists with NPC
reactions, handles intelligence matters, handles other
things like space missions, arctic exploration etc,
assistant researcher regarding naval matters) also
assistants with warfare by handling low intensity
conflicts like insurgencies, minor rebellions,
terrorism etc. Assist with NPC builds

Galveston Bay and Lesser Ribenia will not have a
player country, but will handle the NPCs.

Assistant moderator – Kirstiriera (handles things like
the Olympics, Nobel Prizes, World Fairs)
Assistant moderator – Malkyer (checks builds for
accuracy under the rules and fulfillment of
requirements for tech level advancement) assist with
NPC builds, hopefully Middle Snu can help with this as
well)
Assistant moderators – Sharina and Parthini (checks on
player histories when new players want into the game).

Assistant researcher -- Amestria (fact checking and
general research as needed)
Assistant moderator – Safehaven2 (assist with NPC
builds)

My Recommendations (by approximate seniority, as in
approximate total playing time in old RP including
time lost as was unavailable)
Kirstiriera – Kingdom of Sweden, also assistant mod
(see above)

Sharina -- ? I honestly don't know. He wants Japan. His access problems are making that iffy at this time.
Artista – Italy
Parthini – British
Malkyer – wants Argentina, and Israel should it get
created
Ato-Sara – ? but something important
New Dornalia -- KMT China
Ottoman Khaif -- Ottoman Empire
Abbassia – Morocco, later first major Arab country
The Lightning Star – South Africa
Safehaven2 – Germany
Kordo – Austria Hungary
Elephantum – ? but also something important
Cylea – USA
Kilani – Russian Empire
Koryan – Brazil
Rodenka – Rumania
Haneastic – Japan
Middle Snu – Siam
Danard -- not sure
Lachenburg – Canada
Sukiaida – Spain
Whittlefield – Greece
Amestria – France
Warta Endor -- even more unsure
Canadstein –Ethiopia


India (as in the Indian Independence movement), Zionist movement, Red Chinese, Bolvsheviks, and eventually the Vietminh and Indonesian nationalists will deserve players at some point. Some of the NPC countries can be made available if needed for players

Updated List

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini GB Recommend
The German Empire ~
Safehaven2 GB Recommend
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria GB Recommend
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo GB Recommend
The Russian Empire ~
Kilani GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Artitsa GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Lachenburg
Kirstina GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka1
Sukiaida GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
The Kingdom of Norway ~
Kirstina
World Zionist Organization ~
Elephantum

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan2
Kordo
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Malkyer GB Recommend
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star3
Koryan 1

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Cylea GB Recommend
- The Dominion of Canada
Whittlesfield
- The United States of Mexico ~
Lachenburg GB Recommend

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam ~
Middle Snu
- The Empire of Japan ~
Haneastic1
Sharina1
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif GB Recommend
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
- The KMT party in China ~
New Dornalia1 GB Recommend

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star2 GB Recommend
Sharina2
- The Kingdom of Morocco ~
Abbassia GB Recommend
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein GB Recommend

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

The demographic figures I cited are not just from the wikipedia (which by itself is not trustworthy), but several other sites as well (sites that are not wikis), and all claim the following...

1906: 41,067,000

figures from 1801 (included) onwards are based on the official French censuses

figures are for metropolitan (i.e. European) France only, excluding overseas départments and territories, as well as former French colonies and protectorates. Algeria and its départements, although they were an integral part of metropolitan France until 1962, are not included in the figures.

Conveniently all references are in French...sigh.

I have in my possession an atlas issues in 1936, recording the world at 1936 (inherited it from an uncle, very interesting), anyway, it gives the population of France in 1936 as 41,905,968, although roughly 400,000 less then the figures I am using, it does not contradict the figures I have presented.

1901: 40,681,000
1906: 41,067,000
1911: 41,415,000
1921: 39,108,000
1926: 40,581,000
1931: 41,524,000
1936: 41,502,000
1946: 40,503,000

Pual Kennedy could easily have made a mistake in estimating the French population at 38 million as French demographics have often been odd, particularly the lack the growth at the end of the 19th/begining of the 20th century (owing to the losses of young healthy people in the Napoleonic wars), the population loss and overall ageing following World War One (or as French Generals called them, "the lean years") owing to the loss of many healthy young men and fewer children conceived during the periods of mobilization (the French were very strict when it came to leave, which was almost non-existent early on, once again due to the fact they were outnumbered by the Germans and felt they could not spare anyone), and was thus stagnant (little growth) until after World War Two (thus a nervous 1930s French Government enacting financial incentives to have children), after which there was a population boom (France having one of the highest growth rates in Europe).

Clearly this is an issue that will have to be resolved otherwise it will further throw off Frances future demographics in this RP. One way to resolve the issue is find either a third source (someone other then Pual Kennedy) or get our hands on a copy of the Official 1906 Population Census of France (I'm sure one of use who attends University could order up an English translation)... Or we could just accept the figures I have presented and use them.

LR, where are you getting your numbers? Not to be a pain or anything, but here and here say Brazil had more than three cruisers. I saw you had some blanks so maybe you just forgot to add them.

I get my stats largely from the Battleships-cruisers site which you linked. If you check it you will see that all of the Brazilian battleships are coastal defence battleships which despite the name are not battleship sized, but are more like very small cruisers with shallow draughts which allow them to operate well in home waters but have very poor blue water capabilities (ie they are likely to be swamped or else very unstable in open sea). Brazil had yet to start a destroyer building program (until 1909), it also changed one of it's 4 cruisers to a minelayer in 1898 so that took it down to 3 cruisers (2 of which are obsolete anyway).

I will probably list people's coastal defence battleships later today once I have finished the subs, they were generally just used to patrol littoral waters and provide supporting coastal artillery fire against invasion fleet sand sometimes to support ground attacks in coastal areas.

We're still working out a few things regarding the various game mechanics systems and I still have to get a list of military units sorted and coastal battleships may get a section there, but they may be omitted for ease of play. It depends how complicated it gets.

Conveniently all references are in French...sigh.

I could translate if needs be.

I am just getting everyone's armies sorted and have a proposal for consideration by GB and others:

In the early 20th century the vast majority of the world's armies relied upon conscription, Britain being one of th3 few exceptions. Britain's army is volunteer based and hence small but very well trained. In my lists Britain has trained regulars and standard reserves, I have provided everyone else with standard troops as regulars and 1/3rd of their reserves as substandard (many kept people on reserves list until their 40's and reserves get the worst trainign and equipment anyway). In order to keep this trend going when players take over their militaries (I'd like to keep it going for realism purposes) I'd like to suggest an alteration to the size rule:

You can chose to have either a volunteer military or a conscripted/draft military. Your choice will have an effect on your military composition:

Volunteer
In peacetime, the limit on regulars is one corps, 4 divisions, 12 brigades, or 6 naval units per 5 million people in your nation. You may have up to 2 reserve units per regular unit. Up to half of your regular army can be elite and the remainder highly trained, your reserves can all be standard if wanted.

Conscript
In peacetime, the limit on regulars is two corps, 8 divisions, 24 brigades, or 12 naval units per 5 million people in your nation. You may have up to 6 reserve units per regular unit. No more than 1 unit in every 8 of your regulars may be highly trained or elite, at least 1 unit in every 3 of your reserves must be substandard. Your navy will also have a slight disadvantage when facing up against better motivated and trained volunteer navies. You can expect economic repercussions (decided on a case by case basis) if all of your reserves are called up a once.

------------------------------

Otherwise the military system will be much the same as previously.

That I believe covers the advantages and disadvantages of the two types very well and allows the Europeans to keep their stupidly high number of divisions in their army reserves which they had historically whilst maintaining the disadvantages of having aging and poorly trained conscripts on the reserve lists (some nations kept their reserves up until aged 45). If all of the reserves in some nations are called up fully 8-10% of their entire population is in uniform.

Any input guys? It shows the differences between the two army styles in use at the start of the century and isn't too much trouble to work out, you just have to chose which style to use and stick with it.

EDIT: Everyone's navies are now done and will be online soon. I have done around 1/3rd of everyone's armies at present (that just includes the nations with a navy though, small places such as Ethiopia, Arabia, Persia etc will have to wait until I finish them). They will be online later today.

Haneastic wants to be Japan.

Thanks for reminding people while I was gone. Still reading through but 1906 is good and I will probably be back on tommorrow. Supporting Amestria (for what it's worth, Kordo for A-H, Rodenka for Spain, and myself for Japan.

Amestria, I believe I now have 3 votes, counting Kordo's nomination, and my vote

EDIT- actually, I think it's 6 now,with me, Ottoman, New Dornalia, Kordo, and Rodenka, and Amestria saying I'd be best there (page 176 I think)

Basically, I vote for everyone who's voted for me unless they're competing, and I'll change that when i get back on

Big Thank you to those who voted for me!:D

Might I suggest 1906 (which begins Monday if I understand correctly), be a two-week year so people can better establish themselves in their new positions, get used to new rules, and such?

Sounds sensible enough to me, that's what happened in the first year last time anyway (so many months ago now, there's only a few of us original E20ers around I think!).

I suggest we wait and see if an extra week is necessary before deciding such.

I vote for:

Haneastic as Japan (did a fine and honorable job last time)
Rodenka as Spain (if he wants it)
Kirstireira as Sweden (was a good Bulgaria this time and is well suited to a pretty neutral country)
Sharina as South Africa (interesting country that will not stop play if player is unavailable)
Kordo as Austria-Hungary (already said this but my vote wasn't counted)

And of course myself as Siam, although I'm unopposed.

If Malkyer takes the WZOI could take either a minor role now (Serbia or something), and take something else when new countries become available, or take control of one of the various movements (Bolshevik, Chinese Communist, Indian Independence, whatever).

If Malkyer takes the WZOI could take either a minor role now (Serbia or something), and take something else when new countries become available, or take control of one of the various movements (Bolshevik, Chinese Communist, Indian Independence, whatever).

Malkyer is going to take Argentina I believe.

If Malkyer takes the WZOI could take either a minor role now (Serbia or something), and take something else when new countries become available, or take control of one of the various movements (Bolshevik, Chinese Communist, Indian Independence, whatever).

pick a movement, but the Bolsheviks are likely to come up first. They are plotting in Switzerland after failing to get a successful revolution in 1905

But at this point practically all of these movements are in the nascent stages

Serbia is a good choice and needed at the moment

I vote Sharina for Japan or South Africa.

Made up your mind on what you want so we can tidy up the list?

I guess I will take another swing at Canada (as per GB's recommendation).

Hey again, guys. Jolt is starting to work more consistently for me.

There's an issue that has come to my attention that I feel needs to be addressed. I was told that Haneastic has 6 votes as Japan, correct?

I believe Japan needs a new player, considering Haneastic has already played Japan and its my honest opinion that Japan needs a whole new player. Even Parthini and Safehaven have switched nations, and virually all E20 players with the possible exception of Abbassia and Rodenka have switched to totally new nations that they have never played before. Therefore, I believe Haneastic should be given a nation other than Japan to give another players a chance at trying to play Japan.

Dominion of South Africa
Population 5.3 million (10% white,10% mixed, remainder Black with no rights), tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 3 (Pretoria 2, Capetown 1)

I hate to be nitpicky, but according to the best of my knowledge South Africa's white population was higher than 10% in 1906...closer to 20%, or a little over a million. My South Africa in E20 had an inflated European population (all those world wars led to a lot of immigrants from Europe), but in rl South Africa the white population peaked at about 25% of the total population in first couple of decades of the 1900s, with a slow and steady decline over the rest of the century as the white population's low growth and collective aging couldn't match the Africans (in 1985, for example, whites were 15% of the population; in 2005 they were less than 10%).

That said, I will support Sharina for South Africa, and no matter who gets it I'll volunteer advice and help if wanted, because South Africa (especially those pesky Boers) can be complicated and confusing, to say the least.

Hey again, guys. Jolt is starting to work more consistently for me.

There's an issue that has come to my attention that I feel needs to be addressed. I was told that Haneastic has 6 votes as Japan, correct?

I believe Japan needs a new player, considering Haneastic has already played Japan and its my honest opinion that Japan needs a whole new player. Even Parthini and Safehaven have switched nations, and virually all E20 players with the possible exception of Abbassia and Rodenka have switched to totally new nations that they have never played before. Therefore, I believe Haneastic should be given a nation other than Japan to give another players a chance at trying to play Japan.

Agreed.

Hey again, guys. Jolt is starting to work more consistently for me.

There's an issue that has come to my attention that I feel needs to be addressed. I was told that Haneastic has 6 votes as Japan, correct?

I believe Japan needs a new player, considering Haneastic has already played Japan and its my honest opinion that Japan needs a whole new player. Even Parthini and Safehaven have switched nations, and virually all E20 players with the possible exception of Abbassia and Rodenka have switched to totally new nations that they have never played before. Therefore, I believe Haneastic should be given a nation other than Japan to give another players a chance at trying to play Japan.

totally disagree--i believe haneastic should get Japan.

The japan he played as in the previous round is completely different than the one he was in E20 mark 1. I would argue it is in someways just as drastic a change as the one that I am taking.

totally disagree--i believe haneastic should get Japan.

The japan he played as in the previous round is completely different than the one he was in E20 mark 1. I would argue it is in someways just as drastic a change as the one that I am taking.
I second this thought, Haneastic was only Japan for a short period, don't use it against him...besides we had six different players as Japan..if Haneastic was the sole player for the entire game , then it would be difference story..therefore he has my total support to be Japan.

I heartilly disagree with Kordo being the Austro-Hungarian Empire; he already played it, for one thing, and he lead it head-first to its demise. I say there should be a chance for someone ELSE to play it (preferrably me, of course, but even if not me someone else).

Available as player countries 1906
Europe
United Kingdom
Population: 44 million, Tech level 5, production centers 14 (London 2, Birmingham 2, Liverpool 2, Manchester 2, Edinburgh 2, Belfast 1, Portsmouth 1, Leeds 2), Coal 5
Colonial Resources: British Guyana 1, Burma 1, Cyprus 1, India 4, Malaya 2,

German Empire
Population: 60 million, Tech level 5, production centers: 15 (Koln 2, Dusseldorf 2, Hamburg 1, Berlin 2, Essen 2, Munich 1, Breslau 1, Leipzig 1, Stettin 1, Frankfurt 1, Strasbourg 1) Resources: 2 (Saarbrucken 1, Breslau 1), Oil 1 (Hannover 1) Coal 3 + 1 point from Denmark

Republic of France
Population: 41 million (includes ethnic French in colonies), Tech level 4.5, production centers: 7 (Lille 2, Paris 2, Marseilles 1, Nantes 1, Brest 1)
Colonial resources: Algeria 1, Indochina 1, New Caledonia 1, + 1 point from China (for Hainan)

Austria-Hungarian Empire
Population: 50 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 6 (Vienna 1, Budapest 1, Prague 2, Zagreb 1, Krakow 1) Coal 3 (Prague 2, Zagreb 1)

Russian Empire
Population: 150 million, Tech level 4.5, production centers: 6 (Warsaw 1, St Petersburg 1, Moscow 1, Kiev 1, Minsk 1, Tula 1), Resources: 17 (Kiev 5, Minsk 1, Rostov 2, Omsk 2, Irkutsk 1, Sverdlovsk 2, Kharkov 2, Tbilisi 1, Helsinki 1) Oil 10 (Baku 5, Grozny 2, Maikop 3)


Kingdom of Belgium
Population: 7.25 million, tech level 4.5, production centers: 2 (Brussels 1, Liege 1)
Colonial resources: Belgian Congo 1

Kingdom of Netherlands
Population 6 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Rotterdam 1) colonial resources Dutch East Indies 2 + 4 oil,

Kingdom of Italy
Population 34 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 4 (Turin 1, Milan 1, Rome 1, Naples 1), Hydroelectric 1,

Kingdom of Sweden
Population 5.5 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Stockholm 1) Resources 2 (Stockholm 2) Coal 1, Hydroelectric 1

Kingdom of Rumania
Population 6.5 million, tech level 3, no production centers, resources 1 (Bucharest 1), oil 3 (Ploesti 3) Coal 1 (Bucharest)

Kingdom of Greece
Population 5 million, tech level 3, no production centers, resources 1 (Athens 1)

Kingdom of Spain
Population 19.2 million, tech level 4, production centers 1 (Madrid 1), resources 3 (Ferrol 1, Malaga 1, Seville 1)

Kingdom of Portugal
Population 5.7 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 1 (Lisbon 1)
colonial resources Angola 1, Mozambique 1

Kingdom of Serbia
Population 2.6 million, tech level 3, production centers 1 (Belgrade 1) , Coal 1

Kingdom of Bulgaria
Population 4 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 1 (Sofia 1), Coal 1

Kingdom of Norway
Population 2.3 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 1 (Stavanger 1)

South America
Republic of Brazil
Population 20 million, tech level 3 , production centers 1 (Recife 1) Resources 1 (Manus 1)

Republic of Argentina
Population 5.4 million, tech level 3, production centers 1 (Buenos Aires 1), Coal 1 plus 1 point from Bolivia

Republic of Chile
Population 3.4 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 3 (Santiago 3), Coal 1

North and Central America
United States
Population 90 million, tech level 5, production centers 20 (New York City 3, Boston 1, Philadelphia 2, Chicago 2, Pittsburgh 2, Kansas City 1, Houston 1, New Orleans 1, Milwaukee 1, Cleveland 1, Cincinnati 1, Denver 1, San Francisco 1, Los Angeles 1)
Resources: 13 (St. Louis 1, Sacramento 2, Seattle 2, Anchorage 1, Dallas 2, Memphis 2, Denver 1, St Paul 1, Minneapolis 1)
Oil: 20 (Houston 5, Shreveport 2, Philadelphia 1, Bakersfield 2, Helena 1, Los Angeles 2, New Orleans 2, Odessa / Midland 2, Oklahoma City 2, Dallas 1)
Colonial resources: Mindanao 1 + 3 from South America

Dominion of Canada
Population 6 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Toronto 1), resources 5 (Vancouver 1, Regina 2, Winnipeg 1, Montreal 1), coal 5 (Regina 5), oil 1 (Regina 1)

Republic of Mexico
Population 14.5 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 2 (Chihuahua 1, Leon 1), Oil 2 (Yucatan 2)

Oceania
Dominion of Australia
Population 4 million, tech level 4, production centers 1 (Sydney 1), resources 2 (Melbourne 1, Perth 1)

Africa
Dominion of South Africa
Population 5.3 million (20% white,10% mixed, remainder Black with no rights), tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 3 (Pretoria 2, Capetown 1)

Kingdom of Ethiopia
Population 12.5 million, tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 1

Sultanate of Morocco
Population 4.5 million (including modern day Western Sahara which the Spanish haven’t seized yet), tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 1 (Casablanca 1)

Asia
Kingdom of Siam
Population 7 million, tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 1

Empire of Japan
Population 46.7 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 5 (Tokyo 1, Osaka 1, Hiroshima 1, Kure 1, Nagoya 1), resources 1 (Sapporo 1), coal 1 (Sapporo),
Colonial resources: Formosa 1, Seoul 1, + Japan gets Harbin 1, Port Arthur 1 (from China) and 2 coal each Harbin and Shenyang

Ottoman Empire
population 21 million (based on this http://www.library.uu.nl/wesp/populstat/Asia/turkeyop.htm)
Tech level 4, Production centers 1 (Izmit 1), resources (Samsun 1, Damascus 1) Coal 2 (Samsun 2) + 1 point a year from Haj

Persian Empire
Population 10 million, tech level 2, production 0, resources 0, oil 1 (Ahvaz 1)

Chinese Empire
Population 430 million, tech level 2, Production centers 1 (Shanghai 1), Resources 11 (Harbin 1, Port Arthur 1, Beijing 2, Chungking 2, Changsha 1, Lanchow 1, Chengtu 1, Hainan 1, Kwieyang 1), Coal 12 (Shenyang 5, Harbin 4, Chungking 3) (2 resources go to Japan, along with 4 coal, 1 resource from Hainan goes to France)


NPC countries (not available as PC countries under any circumstance, some will be PC countries later though)
Europe
Switzerland
Andorra
Liechtenstein
San Marino
Monaco
Denmark 1 resource (goes to Germany),
Luxembourg
Montenegro

Africa
Liberia

Caribbean and Central America
Haiti
Dominican Republic
Cuba resources 1 (goes to US)
Guatemala
Honduras
Panama resources 1 (goes to US)
Costa Rica
El Salvador

South America
Paraguay
Peru 1 resource (goes to US)
Ecuador
Venezuela
Colombia
Uruguay
Bolivia 1 resource (goes to Argentina)

Asia
Nepal
Afghanistan
Bhutan

Population will be done as needed, as will builds. Essentially they have sufficient income to run their governments and provide for a militia unit in some cases. None have a sizeable army (corps sized or bigger) or navy to speak of except for a glorified coast guard in some cases. Only Switzerland can field an army at all, and only if invaded. The few nations with a resource have that resource go to their principal trading partner.

Note that a lot of colonial territories have no significant economic value

I have to object on the whole "what NPCs have resources give them to priniple trading partner." What's the basis for that?

Updated List

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini GB Recommend
The German Empire ~
Safehaven2 GB Recommend
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria GB Recommend
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo GB Recommend
The Russian Empire ~
Kilani GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
Lachenburg
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Artitsa GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Kirstina GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Rodenka1
Sukiaida GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
Whittlesfield
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
The Kingdom of Norway ~
Kirstina
World Zionist Organization ~
Elephantum

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan2
Kordo
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Malkyer GB Recommend
- The Republic of Chile ~
The Lightning Star3
Koryan 1

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Cylea GB Recommend
- The Dominion of Canada
Lachenburg GB Recommend
- The United States of Mexico ~

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam ~
Middle Snu
- The Empire of Japan ~
Haneastic1
Sharina1
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif GB Recommend
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
- The KMT party in China ~
New Dornalia1 GB Recommend

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star2 GB Recommend
Sharina2
- The Kingdom of Morocco ~
Abbassia GB Recommend
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein GB Recommend

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

Just of curiosity, would (Southern) Rhodesia be a PC or NPC? I noticed it's not listed as either on the big shiny list.

If it's NPC, Britain should get a couple of resource points from it to account for agricultural products, chrome, diamonds, and whatever other valuable mineral Rhodesia produces (I can't remember which at the moment).

GB: Not to be troublesome, but does not France get rubber, ivory, and timber from the French Congo, which would be quite valuable? Is this because in 1906 the colony is not developed/profitable enough to justify a resource point?

Just of curiosity, would (Southern) Rhodesia be a PC or NPC? I noticed it's not listed as either on the big shiny list.

If it's NPC, Britain should get a couple of resource points from it to account for agricultural products, chrome, diamonds, and whatever other valuable mineral Rhodesia produces (I can't remember which at the moment).

I also believe Rhodesia is a big exporter of Platinum.

I also believe Rhodesia is a big exporter of Platinum.

That's the one. Thanks.

Hmm...I kind of want to try out Rhodesia in the 1960s and 1970s, if only because I didn't get to have UDI and Second Chimurenga last time around.

What about trade points? I would assume I get a lot...

Yep I will play one of the countries to be free and to have defeated a European power.

Updated List

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini GB Recommend
The German Empire ~
Safehaven2 GB Recommend
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria GB Recommend
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo GB Recommend
The Russian Empire ~
Kilani GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Artitsa GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Kirstina GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Sukiaida GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Elephantum
The Kingdom of Norway ~
World Zionist Organization ~
Elephantum

II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Malkyer GB Recommend
- The Republic of Chile ~
Sharina

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Cylea GB Recommend
- The Dominion of Canada
Lachenburg GB Recommend
- The United States of Mexico ~

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam ~
Middle Snu
- The Empire of Japan ~
Haneastic
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif GB Recommend
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
- The KMT party in China ~
New Dornalia GB Recommend

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star2 GB Recommend
- The Kingdom of Morocco ~
Abbassia GB Recommend
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein GB Recommend

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

Updated List
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo GB Recommend

Both Haneastic and Middle Snu have supported my appointment to Austria-Hungary

Both Haneastic and Middle Snu have supported my appointment to Austria-Hungary

Yeah? Well, Jesus supported me being Austria-Hungary, so I get 1000 votes :p

Why are you guys fighting over a doomed country anyways...

Actually, I'd like to change my vote to TLS being the Austro-Hungarian Empire.

Sorry, Kordo, but I just want to have fun watching Lightning Star go on a mad rampage.

Parthini']Why are you guys fighting over a doomed country anyways...

Because the thrill is in how you go about dooming yourself obviously.

Heh.... Kordo... you could be Australia or South Africa and be my man servant again :p

Because the thrill is in how you go about dooming yourself obviously.
Indeed...I enjoy Kordo rping as AH...it would be fun to see him get PWN again..just I support his bid for AH...

Just of curiosity, would (Southern) Rhodesia be a PC or NPC? I noticed it's not listed as either on the big shiny list.

If it's NPC, Britain should get a couple of resource points from it to account for agricultural products, chrome, diamonds, and whatever other valuable mineral Rhodesia produces (I can't remember which at the moment).

its on the colony list a few pages back

as mentioned in Chatzy, resources will increase as tech level go up as some of the products of the colonies aren't worth enough to justify a point in value yet, but that changes as technology increases and industrialization increases.

commerce and food production haven't been added yet but will

some NPC and PC nations will gain resources, especially oil, as discoveries are made as well.

I'm already thinking up ideas to do with Ethopia. You better be ready.

I have a question if the Conscript/Regular Army thing is what happens. Can a country have a regular Navy and have a conscript army? Cause personally I was thinking that you could make the Navy the sort of high end Officer class thing with regular troops, while your army is based on Conscripts and such. Just curious if you could do that? Or is it one whole kitten caboodle. Personally as SPain I gotta overhaul my entire Navy anyways, and my army too. Fix those Mauser's I got and get newer ships. Probably just forget empire at all cause it's a drag on Spain to tell the truth.

And ok trade and crops. Spain has 1 Industrial center, but when it comes to trade and agricultural resources, they are normally abundant. At least in the early 20th century they were if I remember right.

So it's all settled then. And no one is portugal yet? That's odd. I put my vote for Lightning Star in AUstria Hungary.

yes, you can have a conscript army and regular Navy.. the US military is a good example (it operated that way 1945-1973)

The main disadvantage of a volunteer army is size.. even with patriotic fervor during wartime there is a maximum number of people willing to serve, generally about 5% of the population (normally its only 3%), while conscription can get you 10%. Which is why even volunteer armies like the British and Americans switched to conscription during big wars and long term situations like the Cold War.

I don't suppose there is room for a newcomer in the later stages of this reset is there?

It depends... Personally, I wouldn't mind if you took Belgium or Australia.

Cool then I think I'd go with that. And so 1 out of 8 and... I hope that the direct rules are put in the economic thing cause right now I am just about to post a new thread to get it all together. For myself that is.

Available as player countries 1906
Europe
United Kingdom
Population: 44 million, Tech level 5, production centers 14 (London 2, Birmingham 2, Liverpool 2, Manchester 2, Edinburgh 2, Belfast 1, Portsmouth 1, Leeds 2), Coal 5
Colonial Resources: British Guyana 3, Burma 3, Cyprus 3, India 12, Malaya 6, Rhodesia 2, Nigeria 1, Jamaica 1, Kenya 2, New Zealand 2, Egypt 6, Suez Canal 6, Ireland 2
Food production: UK 31,
British Empire
Ireland: food production 6, population 4.4 million
India food production 320, population 318 million (includes Bangladesh, India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka)
British East Asia: food production: 40, population 35 million
British East Africa: food production 6 , population 4 million
British West Africa: food production 28, population 19 million
British Rhodesia / Botswana / Zambia food production 3, population 2 million
British Caribbean food production 3, population 2 million
New Zealand and Fiji and Oceania: food production: 5 population 1.3 million
Commerce: 40 shipping units, 10 ocean liner units

Special rules: The British have 2 armies, the British Army, and the Indian Army, but one Navy (Royal Navy). The RN and British Army are limited in size based on population of the UK and Ireland, while the Indian Army is limited to size restrictions based on India. Conscription is not allowed for the Indian Army, but it can serve anywhere. British shipping is drawn from the population of the entire empire.

German Empire
Population: 60 million, Tech level 5, production centers: 15 (Koln 2, Dusseldorf 2, Hamburg 1, Berlin 2, Essen 2, Munich 1, Breslau 1, Leipzig 1, Stettin 1, Frankfurt 1, Strasbourg 1) Resources: 2 (Saarbrucken 1, Breslau 1), Oil 1 (Hannover 1) Coal 3
Food production: 47
German Empire:
Pacific territories: Resources 1, food production 2, population 2 million (tech level 0)
German East Africa: Resources 3, food production 4, population 3.5 million
German Equatorial Africa: Resources 1, food production 2, population 2 million
German Southwest Africa: Resources 1, food production .5, population .5 million
Commerce: 6 shipping units, 2 ocean liner units

Special rules: Germany can raise a colonial army, but is limited to the population base of its colonies. Conscription isn’t allowed in the colonies. Shipping and the Imperial military forces are drawn from the population of Germany only.

Republic of France
Population: 41 million (includes ethnic French in colonies), Tech level 4.5, production centers: 7 (Lille 2, Paris 2, Marseilles 1, Nantes 1, Brest 1)
French Colonies:
French West Africa resources 1, population
French Equatorial Africa resources 2
Madagascar and Indian Ocean territories resources 2
French India resources 1, food production 3, population 3 million
Algeria Resources 6, food production 11, population 5.2 million,
Indochina Resources 6, food production 17, population 16 million
New Caledonia Resources 6, food production 1, population 1 million
French China concessions (Hainan) resources 6, (food and population part of Chinese total)
Commerce: 6 shipping units, 2 ocean liner units

Special rules: France has 2 armies, the Metropolitan Army and the Colonial Army plus the Legion Estranger. The Legion is limited to 3 brigades in size and can only be used in the colonies except during wartime. The Colonial Army is volunteer only, and initially is drawn only from a population of 5 million (representing French living overseas, and a cadre of regulars from France). The Metropolitan Army can be a conscript force drawn from the population of France only and cannot be sent to garrison or fight in the colonies, except for Algeria (which is considered a department of France). Shipping is drawn only from the population of France, not the colonies.

Austria-Hungarian Empire
Population: 50 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 6 (Vienna 1, Budapest 1, Prague 2, Zagreb 1, Krakow 1) Coal 3 (Prague 2, Zagreb 1) food production 33,
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Russian Empire
Population: 150 million, Tech level 4.5, production centers: 6 (Warsaw 1, St Petersburg 1, Moscow 1, Kiev 1, Minsk 1, Tula 1), Resources: 17 (Kiev 30, Minsk 6, Rostov 12, Omsk 12, Irkutsk 6, Sverdlovsk 12, Kharkov 12, Tbilisi 6, Helsinki 6) Oil 10 (Baku 5, Grozny 2, Maikop 3) food production 125
Commerce: 4 shipping units (2 in Baltic, 1 each Black Sea and Pacific)

Kingdom of Belgium
Population: 7.25 million, tech level 4.5, production centers: 2 (Brussels 1, Liege 1) food production: 6
Colonial Empire: Belgian Congo resources 6, food production 5, population 4.5 million
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Netherlands
Population 6 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Rotterdam 1) food production: 18
colonial Empire
Dutch East Indies 12 + 4 oil, food production 50, population 45 million
Dutch Caribbean 1 resource (food and population included in Dutch figures)
Commerce: 3 shipping units (Netherlands may draw from Colonial population to man shipping)

Kingdom of Italy
Population 34 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 4 (Turin 1, Milan 1, Rome 1, Naples 1), Hydroelectric 1, food production: 45
Italian East Africa has no resources, food production 1, population .4 million
Commerce: 4 shipping units

Kingdom of Sweden
Population 5.5 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Stockholm 1) Resources 12 (Stockholm 12) Coal 1, Hydroelectric 1, food production: 8
Commerce: 2 shipping units

Kingdom of Rumania
Population 6.5 million, tech level 3, no production centers, resources 6 (Bucharest 6), oil 3 (Ploesti 3) Coal 1 (Bucharest), food production: 12

Kingdom of Greece
Population 5 million, tech level 3, no production centers, resources 6 (Athens 6), food production 16
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Spain
Population 19.2 million, tech level 4, production centers 1 (Madrid 1), resources 18 (Ferrol 6, Malaga 6, Seville 6) food production: 44
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Portugal
Population 5.7 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 6 (Lisbon 6) food production: 11
colonial Empire:
Angola resources 6, food production 5, population 4.5 million
Mozambique resources 6, food production 3, population 2.4 million
Timor, Goa and Macau have no resource value, and require food imports for their total combined population of less then 1 million
Commerce: 2 shipping units (Portugal may use its colonial population to man its shipping)

Kingdom of Serbia
Population 2.6 million, tech level 3, production centers 1 (Belgrade 1) , Coal 1, food production 4

Kingdom of Bulgaria
Population 4 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 1 (Sofia 1), Coal 1, food production 4

Kingdom of Norway
Population 2.3 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 1 (Stavanger 1) food production: 7, commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Denmark
Population 2.5 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 6 (Copenhagen 6), food production: 8
Colonies: Iceland, Faeroe Islands, Virgin Islands, Greenland (negligible population that require food imports), however Fishing rights provide Denmark with 1 resource a year
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

South America
Republic of Brazil
Population 20 million, tech level 3 , production centers 1 (Recife 1) Resources 6 (Manus 6), food production: 75

Republic of Argentina
Population 5.4 million, tech level 3, production centers 1 (Buenos Aires 1), Resources 6 (Buenos Aires) Coal 1 plus 3 points from Bolivia, food production 24

Republic of Chile
Population 3.4 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 12 (Santiago 12), Coal 1, food production 7.5

North and Central America
United States
Population 90 million, tech level 5, production centers 20 (New York City 3, Boston 1, Philadelphia 2, Chicago 2, Pittsburgh 2, Kansas City 1, Houston 1, New Orleans 1, Milwaukee 1, Cleveland 1, Cincinnati 1, Denver 1, San Francisco 1, Los Angeles 1)
Resources: 84 (St. Louis 6, Sacramento 12, Seattle 12, Anchorage 6, Dallas 12, Memphis 12, Denver 6, St Paul 6, Minneapolis 6, Honolulu 6)
Oil: 20 (Houston 5, Shreveport 2, Philadelphia 1, Bakersfield 2, Helena 1, Los Angeles 2, New Orleans 2, Odessa / Midland 2, Oklahoma City 2, Dallas 1)
Food Production: 212
Colonial Empire:
Panama: Resources 6, food production 1, population .4 million,
Puerto Rico (included in US totals)
Philippines Resources 6 (Mindanao) food production 16, population 7.7 million
US Oceania food production sufficient to feed its population of under 20,000
Commerce: 10 shipping units (doesn’t include US coastal and inland waterway shipping)

Dominion of Canada
Population 6 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Toronto 1), resources 30 (Vancouver 6, Regina 12, Winnipeg 6, Montreal 6), coal 5 (Regina 5), oil 1 (Regina 1)
Food production: 28, commerce 1 shipping unit


Republic of Mexico
Population 14.5 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 12 (Chihuahua 6, Leon 6), Oil 2 (Yucatan 2) food production 35

Oceania
Dominion of Australia
Population 4 million, tech level 4, production centers 1 (Sydney 1), resources 12 (Melbourne 6, Perth 6) food production 32


Africa
Dominion of South Africa
Population 5.3 million (20% white,10% mixed, remainder Black with no rights), tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 18 (Pretoria 12, Capetown 6), food production: 8

Kingdom of Ethiopia
Population 12.5 million, tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 3, food production: 13

Sultanate of Morocco
Population 4.5 million (including modern day Western Sahara which the Spanish haven’t seized yet), tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 6 (Casablanca 6), food production 5

Asia
Kingdom of Siam
Population 7 million, tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 6, food production: 21

Empire of Japan
Population 46.7 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 5 (Tokyo 1, Osaka 1, Hiroshima 1, Kure 1, Nagoya 1), resources 6 (Sapporo 6), coal 1 (Sapporo),
Food production: 80
Imperial territories:
Formosa resources 6, food production: 6.5, population 3 million
Korea resources: (Seoul 6), food production: 43, population 12.5 million
Commerce: 4 shipping units
Special Rules: Japan gets Harbin 3, Port Arthur 6 (from China) and 2 coal each Harbin and Shenyang but population and food production are part of Chinese totals. Japan can only use its home island population to draw on for military and shipping

Ottoman Empire
population 21 million (based on this http://www.library.uu.nl/wesp/populstat/Asia/turkeyop.htm)
Tech level 4, Production centers 1 (Izmit 1), resources (Samsun 6, Damascus 6) Coal 2 (Samsun 2) + 1 point a year from Haj, food production is 31

Persian Empire
Population 10 million, tech level 2, resources 2, oil 1 (Ahvaz 1) food production is 10

Chinese Empire
Population 430 million, tech level 2, Production centers 1 (Shanghai 1), Resources 66 (Harbin 6, Port Arthur 6, Beijing 12, Chungking 12, Changsha 6, Lanchow 6, Chengtu 6, Hainan 6, Kwieyang 6), Coal 12 (Shenyang 5, Harbin 4, Chungking 3) (2 resources go to Japan, along with 4 coal, 1 resource from Hainan goes to France), food production is 450

NPC countries (not available as PC countries under any circumstance, some will be PC countries later though)
Europe
Switzerland
Andorra
Liechtenstein
San Marino
Monaco
Luxembourg
Montenegro

Africa
Liberia

Caribbean and Central America
Haiti
Dominican Republic
Cuba resources 6 (6 goes to US) (US client state)
Guatemala
Honduras
Costa Rica
El Salvador

South America
Paraguay
Peru 6 resource (3 goes to US as essentially a US client state)
Ecuador
Venezuela
Colombia
Uruguay
Bolivia 6 resource (3 goes to Argentina as essentially an Argentine client state)

Asia
Nepal
Afghanistan
Bhutan

Population will be done as needed, as will builds. Essentially they have sufficient income to run their governments and provide for a militia unit in some cases. They generally can feed themselves or have low enough population that importing food isn’t a problem.
None have a sizeable army (corps sized or bigger) or navy to speak of except for a glorified coast guard in some cases. Only Switzerland can field an army at all, and only if invaded. The few nations with resources have a portion of their resources go to their principal trading partner, as they are either de facto or de jure a client state (US client states are essentially dominated by Big US businesses, not the US government. Dollar diplomacy goes back a long way)

Do any of the countries start with a social program? If not I gather the price of starting one will be furnished.

What about Qingdao and Jinan for Germany?

Can you explain exactly how food production works?

1 Food Point feeds a million still right GB?

1 Food Point feeds a million still right GB?

Yes.

BTW: Your Spain, so when we start the first year (1906) on Monday your going to have to jump right into the Algeciras Conference (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algeciras_Conference).

I'll also have to get the King of SPain to marry King George of the UK's neice. And then their wedding day has to have an anarchists attempt to kill them both. I'll stick with what happened in history for that event simply because it's more complicated to have the huge changes start there.

I'll also have to get the King of SPain to marry King George of the UK's neice. And then their wedding day has to have an anarchists attempt to kill them both. I'll stick with what happened in history for that event simply because it's more complicated to have the huge changes start there.

Lets have one of the mods roll to see if the anarchist is successful.

Uhhhhh.... why? Later on I don't mind. But right out of the gate I really don't need the political repercustions if King George's Neice dies. Well actually it'd make Britain extremelly anti-German when they learned the assassin Mateu Morral became an anarchists and got his regicide ideas from the Germans.

Are resources just 1 point a year? Also, are you going to have revised economic rules up? And what is the max for commerce?

Uhhhhh.... why?

Because of January 1, 1906 the game is afoot.

Well alright, but in truth it's one inept assassin whose only plus was the ability to make a decent bomb. So it's not a 50/50 thing. I'd personally recommend a D6.

1 Bomb Doesn't Go Off
2 Bomb Goes Off Killing Bystander's. No Royal Family Hurt (WHat Really Happened.)
3 Bomb Kills/Harms a Royal Dignitary or person of Importance beyond the Actual Royal Family.
4 Wounds the King or Queen.
5 Kills Either the King or the Queen. (Other Die with Even being King and Odd being Queen.)
6 Both Are Killed.

That would be fair right?

I just did a little more research into the incident. Holy crap on a turn. The Queen lived because she turned to look at a church her husband was showing her. If she hadn't her jaw would have been taken off by the bomb. Damn on a simple movement the world spins.

There were like 3 attempts to kill Franz, my AP Euro teacher did a hilarious discussion on that.

I think I am Japan now, so does a resource point equal a point? And does Seoul have 6 resource points or 6 production centers?

EDIT- It also appears that I won, so it might take a little while for me to get a thread up, but one will be put up.

Sharina, I do understand your point, but the Japan I took was so radically changed that there wasn't a whole lot to build off. In 1906, there was so much more potential for Japan, and I want to build on that. I've read some excellent books on Japan in WW2, and they had much more potential that I originally thought (for instance, they only produced 10,000 planes a year but could have produced 55,000, but Army-Navy squabbles reduced it)

Well that was an organized attack by a cell of people. This one was some whacko with a bomb. Difference between Al Queida and Lee Harvey Oswald.

Uhhh what does resources mean anyways? We have 6 and then Coal is 1. But uhh what are the other 6?

geez, well this time of the day I have a hell of a time getting into either Chatzy or Jolt, so I don't know if edits I made in the economic post got through or not, and naturally I haven't been able to answer questions

yes, 1 food production point feeds 1 million... if you don't have enough, its assumed you get it on the world market. Using 2005 data, as its all I can find, but modifying it downwards (dividing by 700 or 800 instead of 400) so I can adjust it for tech advances later. Some adjustments also made so that nations that were feeding themselves in 1906 could actually do so.

Food production will only be really critical if you get a famine, or blockaded or have a civil war.

Resources listed are what you get each year from that source, they aren't adjusted by economic policy, only production centers are. Merchant shipping is based on best information I could find.

No tourism yet, as only the rich could afford it, but the Haj is factored in

resources represent things like significant gold, iron deposits etc, or valuable ag products like wine and cotton, or natural products like rubber etc. In other words, extraction, not production.

Production centers are developed infrastructure like factories, corporate farms etc that produce finished goods like cars, planes, canned food etc.

commerce rules will be the same that they were in the previous RP, includes limits on maximum number of commerce points and ships allowed.

Just because you have a production center at tech level 4 does not mean you can build tech level 5 American aircraft for example. You can build tech level 4 American small arms like the 1903 Springfield though.

At this point only social spending levels 1 and 2 are available (if you can afford them) if you are tech level 4.5 or lower. Social spending 3 arrives at tech level 5, and this represents social changes that occur with more industrialization more then the invention of such things like old age pensions.

Available as player countries 1906
Europe
United Kingdom
Population: 44 million, Tech level 5, production centers 14 (London 2, Birmingham 2, Liverpool 2, Manchester 2, Edinburgh 2, Belfast 1, Portsmouth 1, Leeds 2), Coal 5
Colonial Resources: British Guyana 3, Burma 3, Cyprus 3, India 12, Malaya 6, Rhodesia 2, Nigeria 1, Jamaica 1, Kenya 2, New Zealand 2, Egypt 6, Suez Canal 6, Ireland 2
Food production: UK 31,
British Empire
Ireland: food production 6, population 4.4 million
India food production 320, population 318 million (includes Bangladesh, India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka)
British East Asia: food production: 40, population 35 million
British East Africa: food production 6 , population 4 million
British West Africa: food production 28, population 19 million
British Rhodesia / Botswana / Zambia food production 3, population 2 million
British Caribbean food production 3, population 2 million
New Zealand and Fiji and Oceania: food production: 5 population 1.3 million
Commerce: 40 shipping units, 10 ocean liner units

Special rules: The British have 2 armies, the British Army, and the Indian Army, but one Navy (Royal Navy). The RN and British Army are limited in size based on population of the UK and Ireland, while the Indian Army is limited to size restrictions based on India. Conscription is not allowed for the Indian Army, but it can serve anywhere. British shipping is drawn from the population of the entire empire.

German Empire
Population: 60 million, Tech level 5, production centers: 15 (Koln 2, Dusseldorf 2, Hamburg 1, Berlin 2, Essen 2, Munich 1, Breslau 1, Leipzig 1, Stettin 1, Frankfurt 1, Strasbourg 1) Resources: 2 (Saarbrucken 1, Breslau 1), Oil 1 (Hannover 1) Coal 3
Food production: 47
German Empire:
Pacific territories: Resources 1, food production 2, population 2 million (tech level 0)
German East Africa: Resources 3, food production 4, population 3.5 million
German Equatorial Africa: Resources 1, food production 2, population 2 million
German Southwest Africa: Resources 1, food production .5, population .5 million
Commerce: 6 shipping units, 2 ocean liner units

Special rules: Germany can raise a colonial army, but is limited to the population base of its colonies. Conscription isn’t allowed in the colonies. Shipping and the Imperial military forces are drawn from the population of Germany only.

Republic of France
Population: 41 million (includes ethnic French in colonies), Tech level 4.5, production centers: 7 (Lille 2, Paris 2, Marseilles 1, Nantes 1, Brest 1)
French Colonies:
French West Africa resources 1, population
French Equatorial Africa resources 2
Madagascar and Indian Ocean territories resources 2
French India resources 1, food production 3, population 3 million
Algeria Resources 6, food production 11, population 5.2 million,
Indochina Resources 6, food production 17, population 16 million
New Caledonia Resources 6, food production 1, population 1 million
French China concessions (Hainan) resources 6, (food and population part of Chinese total)
Commerce: 6 shipping units, 2 ocean liner units

Special rules: France has 2 armies, the Metropolitan Army and the Colonial Army plus the Legion Estranger. The Legion is limited to 3 brigades in size and can only be used in the colonies except during wartime. The Colonial Army is volunteer only, and initially is drawn only from a population of 5 million (representing French living overseas, and a cadre of regulars from France). The Metropolitan Army can be a conscript force drawn from the population of France only and cannot be sent to garrison or fight in the colonies, except for Algeria (which is considered a department of France). Shipping is drawn only from the population of France, not the colonies.

Austria-Hungarian Empire
Population: 50 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 6 (Vienna 1, Budapest 1, Prague 2, Zagreb 1, Krakow 1) Coal 3 (Prague 2, Zagreb 1) food production 33,
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Russian Empire
Population: 150 million, Tech level 4.5, production centers: 6 (Warsaw 1, St Petersburg 1, Moscow 1, Kiev 1, Minsk 1, Tula 1), Resources: 17 (Kiev 30, Minsk 6, Rostov 12, Omsk 12, Irkutsk 6, Sverdlovsk 12, Kharkov 12, Tbilisi 6, Helsinki 6) Oil 10 (Baku 5, Grozny 2, Maikop 3) food production 125
Commerce: 4 shipping units (2 in Baltic, 1 each Black Sea and Pacific)

Kingdom of Belgium
Population: 7.25 million, tech level 4.5, production centers: 2 (Brussels 1, Liege 1) food production: 6
Colonial Empire: Belgian Congo resources 6, food production 5, population 4.5 million
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Netherlands
Population 6 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Rotterdam 1) food production: 18
colonial Empire
Dutch East Indies 12 + 4 oil, food production 50, population 45 million
Dutch Caribbean 1 resource (food and population included in Dutch figures)
Commerce: 3 shipping units (Netherlands may draw from Colonial population to man shipping)

Kingdom of Italy
Population 34 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 4 (Turin 1, Milan 1, Rome 1, Naples 1), Hydroelectric 1, food production: 45
Italian East Africa has no resources, food production 1, population .4 million
Commerce: 4 shipping units

Kingdom of Sweden
Population 5.5 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Stockholm 1) Resources 12 (Stockholm 12) Coal 1, Hydroelectric 1, food production: 8
Commerce: 2 shipping units

Kingdom of Rumania
Population 6.5 million, tech level 3, no production centers, resources 6 (Bucharest 6), oil 3 (Ploesti 3) Coal 1 (Bucharest), food production: 12

Kingdom of Greece
Population 5 million, tech level 3, no production centers, resources 6 (Athens 6), food production 16
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Spain
Population 19.2 million, tech level 4, production centers 1 (Madrid 1), resources 18 (Ferrol 6, Malaga 6, Seville 6) food production: 44
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Portugal
Population 5.7 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 6 (Lisbon 6) food production: 11
colonial Empire:
Angola resources 6, food production 5, population 4.5 million
Mozambique resources 6, food production 3, population 2.4 million
Timor, Goa and Macau have no resource value, and require food imports for their total combined population of less then 1 million
Commerce: 2 shipping units (Portugal may use its colonial population to man its shipping)

Kingdom of Serbia
Population 2.6 million, tech level 3, production centers 1 (Belgrade 1) , Coal 1, food production 4

Kingdom of Bulgaria
Population 4 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 1 (Sofia 1), Coal 1, food production 4

Kingdom of Norway
Population 2.3 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 1 (Stavanger 1) food production: 7, commerce: 1 shipping unit

Kingdom of Denmark
Population 2.5 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 6 (Copenhagen 6), food production: 8
Colonies: Iceland, Faeroe Islands, Virgin Islands, Greenland (negligible population that require food imports), however Fishing rights provide Denmark with 1 resource a year
Commerce: 1 shipping unit

South America
Republic of Brazil
Population 20 million, tech level 3 , production centers 1 (Recife 1) Resources 6 (Manus 6), food production: 75

Republic of Argentina
Population 5.4 million, tech level 3, production centers 1 (Buenos Aires 1), Resources 6 (Buenos Aires) Coal 1 plus 3 points from Bolivia, food production 24

Republic of Chile
Population 3.4 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 12 (Santiago 12), Coal 1, food production 7.5

North and Central America
United States
Population 90 million, tech level 5, production centers 20 (New York City 3, Boston 1, Philadelphia 2, Chicago 2, Pittsburgh 2, Kansas City 1, Houston 1, New Orleans 1, Milwaukee 1, Cleveland 1, Cincinnati 1, Denver 1, San Francisco 1, Los Angeles 1)
Resources: 84 (St. Louis 6, Sacramento 12, Seattle 12, Anchorage 6, Dallas 12, Memphis 12, Denver 6, St Paul 6, Minneapolis 6, Honolulu 6)
Oil: 20 (Houston 5, Shreveport 2, Philadelphia 1, Bakersfield 2, Helena 1, Los Angeles 2, New Orleans 2, Odessa / Midland 2, Oklahoma City 2, Dallas 1)
Food Production: 212
Colonial Empire:
Panama: Resources 6, food production 1, population .4 million,
Puerto Rico (included in US totals)
Philippines Resources 6 (Mindanao) food production 16, population 7.7 million
US Oceania food production sufficient to feed its population of under 20,000
Commerce: 10 shipping units (doesn’t include US coastal and inland waterway shipping)

Dominion of Canada
Population 6 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 1 (Toronto 1), resources 30 (Vancouver 6, Regina 12, Winnipeg 6, Montreal 6), coal 5 (Regina 5), oil 1 (Regina 1)
Food production: 28, commerce 1 shipping unit


Republic of Mexico
Population 14.5 million, tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 12 (Chihuahua 6, Leon 6), Oil 2 (Yucatan 2) food production 35

Oceania
Dominion of Australia
Population 4 million, tech level 4, production centers 1 (Sydney 1), resources 12 (Melbourne 6, Perth 6) food production 32


Africa
Dominion of South Africa
Population 5.3 million (20% white,10% mixed, remainder Black with no rights), tech level 3, production centers 0, resources 18 (Pretoria 12, Capetown 6), food production: 8

Kingdom of Ethiopia
Population 12.5 million, tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 3, food production: 13

Sultanate of Morocco
Population 4.5 million (including modern day Western Sahara which the Spanish haven’t seized yet), tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 6 (Casablanca 6), food production 5

Asia
Kingdom of Siam
Population 7 million, tech level 2, production centers 0, resources 6, food production: 21

Empire of Japan
Population 46.7 million, tech level 4.5, production centers 5 (Tokyo 1, Osaka 1, Hiroshima 1, Kure 1, Nagoya 1), resources 6 (Sapporo 6), coal 1 (Sapporo),
Food production: 80
Imperial territories:
Formosa resources 6, food production: 6.5, population 3 million
Korea resources: (Seoul 6), food production: 43, population 12.5 million
Commerce: 4 shipping units
Special Rules: Japan gets Harbin 3, Port Arthur 6 (from China) and 2 coal each Harbin and Shenyang but population and food production are part of Chinese totals. Japan can only use its home island population to draw on for military and shipping

Ottoman Empire
population 21 million (based on this http://www.library.uu.nl/wesp/populstat/Asia/turkeyop.htm)
Tech level 4, Production centers 1 (Izmit 1), resources (Samsun 6, Damascus 6) Coal 2 (Samsun 2) + 1 point a year from Haj, food production is 31

Persian Empire
Population 10 million, tech level 2, resources 2, oil 1 (Ahvaz 1) food production is 10

Chinese Empire
Population 430 million, tech level 2, Production centers 1 (Shanghai 1), Resources 66 (Harbin 6, Port Arthur 6, Beijing 12, Chungking 12, Changsha 6, Lanchow 6, Chengtu 6, Hainan 6, Kwieyang 6), Coal 12 (Shenyang 5, Harbin 4, Chungking 3) (2 resources go to Japan, along with 4 coal, 1 resource from Hainan goes to France), food production is 450

NPC countries (not available as PC countries under any circumstance, some will be PC countries later though)
Europe
Switzerland
Andorra
Liechtenstein
San Marino
Monaco
Luxembourg
Montenegro

Africa
Liberia

Caribbean and Central America
Haiti
Dominican Republic
Cuba resources 6 (6 goes to US) (US client state)
Guatemala
Honduras
Costa Rica
El Salvador

South America
Paraguay
Peru 6 resource (3 goes to US as essentially a US client state)
Ecuador
Venezuela
Colombia
Uruguay
Bolivia 6 resource (3 goes to Argentina as essentially an Argentine client state)

Asia
Nepal
Afghanistan
Bhutan

Population will be done as needed, as will builds. Essentially they have sufficient income to run their governments and provide for a militia unit in some cases. They generally can feed themselves or have low enough population that importing food isn’t a problem.
None have a sizeable army (corps sized or bigger) or navy to speak of except for a glorified coast guard in some cases. Only Switzerland can field an army at all, and only if invaded. The few nations with resources have a portion of their resources go to their principal trading partner, as they are either de facto or de jure a client state (US client states are essentially dominated by Big US businesses, not the US government. Dollar diplomacy goes back a long way)


semi final results... will check one last time before I place it on the website on Saturday, but figure this is more or less what things will look like at the start.

I figure, pending approval, I'll play as Serbia (or Bolsheviks or Communist Chinese/Germans/Scots/Whatever happens to be needed most in 1906) and take over as the WZO when it becomes more able to do something, or Serbia/various militant faction is destroyed (whichever happens first, Tel Aviv is founded in 1909, although to get some serious action among the Zionists something drastic would either have to happen in Russia (mega-pogroms, or something to drive large amounts of Jew to flee) or the Ottoman Empire (large Arab revolt or other loss of control).

It depends... Personally, I wouldn't mind if you took Belgium or Australia.

Groovy. I was going to choose Australia too...

Is there some sort of process here that I'm interrupting or is joining as simple as that?

Oh, New Dracora, not New Dornalia...sigh.

- The KMT party in China ~
New Dornalia GB Recommend


I did what now? :p

Groovy. I was going to choose Australia too...

Is there some sort of process here that I'm interrupting or is joining as simple as that?

this is a closed RP, so yes you have to get approved, and it will have to wait until monday for that to begin, as we still have players from last RP picking countries

Ok then, sorry for interrupting. I'll wait for you to let me know once you're finished if I can come in or not.

*Goes and sits quietly in the corner, grabbing a Cosmo on the way.*

Come on it's only for two days that you have to wait and those two days people will just still be deciding countries.

While you wait, I suggest you look over some of the previous economic and military rules, New Dracora, so you are oriented as to how the game goes and such.

GB, can you re-post the website, or direct me to where that is?

Also, so resource points count as points toward economic builds?

And should we start getting our factbooks up?

Actually if it's the same as the old rules, I think I can afford to have a social spending of some sort. ANd it'd lesson the threat of revolution in Spain likewise.

I am curious about non-ship trade. Like I mean France and Belguim don't really need to trade by ship. Soooo is there an intercontinental trade scheme or anything? I know I am full of questions.

Unfortunately, no, there isn't. Proposals come up every now and again, but never a balanced one, so overland trade has not been implimented.

Ok my last question before starting. What is the equivalent for each Tech lvl. I know tech lvl 7 and round about 6. But what is tech lvl 5 and 4 and 3? I mean what is their equivalent. I gather that tech lvl 5 is basic early 20th century. Like WWI technology.

The tech levels used were based off the traveller RPG tech levels originally. A detailed description and analysis of which can be found here:

http://www.freelancetraveller.com/features/culture/reference/tech.html

But essentially (with approximate RL Earth advanced nations dates in brackets):

TL 0 = Stone Age (prehistory)
TL 1 = Bronze Age (3500 to 1000 BC)
TL 2 = Iron Age (1000 BC to 1400 AD)
TL 3 = Gunpowder Age (1400 AD to 1820 AD)
TL 4 = Colonial Age (1820-1900)
TL 5 = WWI (1900-1935)
TL 6 = WWII (1935-1955)
TL 7 = Early Cold War (1955-80)
TL 8 = Information Age (1980-2000)
TL 9 = Modern Age (2000-)

With half tech levels being used to show the minor tech lead of some nations over others and having some advantages (eg better or more choice of military units).

That's roughly what happens, though tech advancement speeds up in certain circumstances (eg. cold wars between nations causes more scientific breakthroughs).

That's how the system started anyway, there may be a few refinements to it. I believe tech 3 and 4 are closer to 1900 than in the traveller system to allow easier differentiation between some nations.

So basically a lvl 3 is sorta at the begining of the technological industrial revolution. (Where Britain was in the 1840's and the US in the 1860's.) And a lvl 4 is sorta right in the middle of the Industrial revolution kinda thing. And lvl 5 is just getting into the more refined parts. I think I get it. THanks. Waiting for this all to begin.

And I gather how we move from tech levels 3 to 3.5, 3.5 to 4, 4 to 4.5, 4.5 to 5 and 5 to 5.5 will be furnished when the economic thread is made.

THat and the armies available. Cause navies are done, now onto armies. Are they the same cost?

Has it been decided who shall play Austria-Hungry?

Updated List

I. Europe:
The United Kingdom of Great Britain ~
[NS]Parthini GB Recommend
The German Empire ~
Safehaven2 GB Recommend
The Third Republic of France ~
Amestria GB Recommend
The Dual Monarchy of Austria-Hungary ~
The Lightning Star1
Kordo GB Recommend
The Russian Empire ~
Kilani GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Belgium ~
The Kingdom of Netherlands ~
The Kingdom of Italy ~
Artitsa GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Sweden ~
Kirstina GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Rumania ~
Rodenka GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Greece ~
Whittlesfield GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Spain ~
Sukiaida GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Portugal ~
The Kingdom of Serbia ~
Elephantum GB Recommend
The Kingdom of Norway ~
World Zionist Organization ~


II. South America:
- The Republic of Brazil ~
Koryan
- The Republic of Argentina ~
Malkyer GB Recommend
- The Republic of Chile ~
Sharina

III. North America:
- The United States of America
Cylea GB Recommend
- The Dominion of Canada
Lachenburg GB Recommend
- The United States of Mexico ~

IV. Asia:
- The Kingdom of Siam ~
Middle Snu
- The Empire of Japan ~
Haneastic
- The Sublime Ottoman State ~
Ottoman Khaif GB Recommend
- The Qajar Persian Empire ~
- The KMT party in China ~
New Dornalia GB Recommend

V. Africa:
- The Union of South Africa ~
The Lightning Star2 GB Recommend
- The Kingdom of Morocco ~
Abbassia GB Recommend
- The Kingdom of Ethiopia ~
Canadstein GB Recommend

VI. Oceania:
- The Dominion of Austrialia

Key:
Green ~ Potential Claim
Red ~ Confirmed Claim

I guess Kordo would become since more people support him.

to define it more closely...

tech level 0 is tribal / stone age. Examples at this point are limited to isolated areas of New Guinea, the Arctic, Amazon, and portions of Africa and Oceania.

tech level 1 is pre industrial, no signficant transportation network outside of limited regions, no significant machinary, and few products from higher tech are found. Examples would be Rome or Middle Ages England or most of Africa 1920 in RL.

tech level 2 is still pre industrial, but significant commerce between regions occurs, some machinary exists (mills for example), and some products from higher tech levels are commonly found (like weapons, tools, clothes etc). This is the gunpowder era, and centralized states are the norm. Example would be UK about 1650 or much of the colonial nations and parts of Latin America in 1900.

tech level 3 is non industrial, but generally a lot of commerce, communications and machinary can be found, and significant and even large amounts of products from higher tech levels are in use everywhere. Railroads and barge traffic are often found as well, its just that the engines and locomotives are imported. UK around 1820, or most modern but not industrialized nations 1906.
A typical soldier has a rifle and artillery is generally muzzle loading unless imported breech loading weapons have been introduced.

tech level 4 is coal and steam powered technology. Even if the industrial base doesn't exist to build products of tech level 4 -5, often the ability to repair or provide parts exists. Iron is common as a construction material. Equilivant tech is USA or UK circa 1860. Generally soldiers are equipped with single shot breech loading rifles (or imported magazine rifles) but machine guns are rare and artillery is still only capable of direct line of sight fire. Warships are made of iron or wood sheathed in Iron.

Tech level 4.5 is still coal and steam powered tech, but the first internal combustion engines are found. Steel is common and replaces iron. The automobile, telephone, and aircraft are invented in this time period or shortly after. Equilivant tech is USA or UK circa 1895. Soldiers have magazine fed rifles, and have access to machine guns in limited numbers but artillery is capable of indirect fire. Warships are made of steel and have electrical equipment aboard.

Tech level 5 is the beginning of the age of oil and gasoline powered technology. Aluminum becomes available as a construction material. Radio as first a communications medium and then as an entertainment medium comes about. Biplane Aircraft become a weapon of war, as do trucks, and then armored fighting vehicles. Warships are made of steel and reinforced steel, and have artillery capable of reaching 12 or more miles. Submarines become an effective weapon of war, and eventually ships capable of carrying aircraft are introduced. Silent movies become a common entertainment. Chemical weapons such as Mustard Gas are introduced. UK 1905 - 1927.

Tech level 5.5
Aluminum becomes a common building material. Radio becomes common, and television is invented. Sound movies are invented and become common. Improvements are made in tech level 5 tech, and radar is invented. Soldiers frequently have a submachinegun or rifle, and tanks and trucks are normal weapons of war, as are monoplane aircraft.

Tech level 6 is the beginning of the electronics age. Weapons introduced at tech level 5 become powerful, larger and more reliable. Chemical weapons such as nerve gas are invented, as are city busting atomic weapons. Helicopters, jets, and rockets are introduced and then become common. Radar, Television and Sonar come into use. The first assault rifles come into service along with antitank rocket launchers. Half tracked vehicles capable of carrying infantry cross country alongside tanks come into service. US circa 1945.

Tech level 6.5 The Nuclear age. Atomic weapons become more powerful and eventually the thermonuclear weapon is invented. Color motion pictures become common, as does broadcast television. Heavy jet military aircraft come into service, while civilian airliners become common for domestic airlines. The Passenger train and Ocean liner face their first serious competition. Soldiers generally have an assault rifle. Slow but capable infantry carrying armored personnel vehicles come into service. US circa 1955.

Tech level 7 The Space Age. Tactical nuclear weapons are introduced, as are turbine engine helicopters, jet transport aircraft, and light infantry carrying armored personnel carriers. Anti vehicle and aircraft missiles come into service, as do Mach I and then Mach II combat aircraft. First satellites and orbital manned missions to space occur. Electronic mainframe computers are invented and become somewhat common. Soldiers generally have an assault rifle and relatively lightweight body armor. Nuclear powered warships are introduced. Plastics become a common material for consumer products. USA circa 1960

Tech level 7.5 The Space Age II. Improvements on preceeding technology and missions to the Moon are possible. Computers become more powerful, but still bulky. Plastics are common and are more durable. First lightweight electronic computers are invented and show up in some military aircraft and warships. USA circa 1972

Tech level 8 Postindustrial Age. Desktop computers are invented and become common, as does the VCR. The Space shuttle becomes available, as do complex long duration satellites. The internet is invented as a military communications system. Cable television becomes common. GPS is invented. USA circa 1985

Tech level 8.5 Information age. The internet becomes a communications medium, as well as a medium of commerce. Computers are common in all vehicles, and briefcase sized computers become common. Cellular phones and satellite phones become common. USA circa 2006

Tech level 9... you will find out when we get there

Whoa cool. THanks for the in depth explanation. Though of course SPain is a Lvl4 Tech, but they bought a ton of Mauser 1898 Rifles for their army, during the 1890's. Now only need the parts for lvl 4.5 and I'm all set. And my army of course.

Well, I'm back from Verdun, it was very impressive...

I saw that both Italy and the Netherlands were free. If possible, can I RP one of them?

Italy is taken, Holland however is free.

Well...hmm.. ineed to get a couple production centers up and running so I cna get up to 4.5. And I probably import Russian Mosin-Nagant 1891 rifles...

Yeah me and you both Rodenka. Of course I'll just import more Mauser's and then modify them for a new weapon. Maybe get my hands on some French 75's or so. And get to 4.5 myself. Waiting to see what I need to do to get to 4.5 before I make my spending plans. That and the armies. Poor GB and the others. They are working hard. Hope they don't get burned out.

Russia needs friends in the Balkans. Who would like to be friends with Russia? :D

Protect the Slavs and all that?

For that matter, the KMT needs money and support....anybody willing to donate? :(

Ethopians don't care.

-To Kilani, not ND

Ooh, ooh, Serbia does! Austria-Hungary is pretty big and scary from over here, plus they rule over a bunch of Serbs in Bosnia.

Maybe some kind country can donate some bolt action rifles to Ethopia with a couple of Machine Guns. If they do I will tell them about Plan X I have for Ethopia that will be put into played in the next couple of years.

How come South Africa is only Tech Level 3?

Maybe because it was recently just got out of a War?

How come South Africa is only Tech Level 3?

Because it’s in Africa!

Maybe some kind country can donate some bolt action rifles to Ethopia with a couple of Machine Guns. If they do I will tell them about Plan X I have for Ethopia that will be put into played in the next couple of years.

I believe the British and French have already given your Kingdom a significant amount of small arms several years past in order to fight off the Italians. You should be able to make due with that for the time being (although a few Machine-guns and Field-Artillery pieces might be nice to have at hand).

I meant mostly machine guns and artillery and to have advisors train my army.