NationStates Jolt Archive

I just realised something. According to My Calculations (http://www.freewebs.com/thelightningstar/Inida%20Economic%20Growth.txt) (which don't include factors such as war, the plan for the railway in Afghanistan, etc), the earliest I could support my current population on my own is 1951, although I could support my projected population then a mere 4 years earlier (growth really picks up in the early 1950's, where I get about 2 points a turn from growth. Of course, that's if I round, which I presume I'm allowed to). Now, that's a long time, I admit, but compared to RL India, I think I'm doing pretty well.

I hav just had an idea.

Shouldn't railways and super highways give commerce points too?

My idea for this is that a country gets 1 commerce points for every country it is connected to via a continous railway or super highway network.
The conditions for this would be:

1. Countries that you are connected too must have an internal railway or superhighway network that connects at least four major cities and the capital together.

2. You country's network must be directly or indirectly connected (E.g Via someone elses network or your own, but networks must be connected)

3. A freight company must be built for each country that you are connected to. Costs 2 points.


Example:
The USEA is directly connected to China and Siam, it is indirectly connected to Korea, Manchuria and the Soviet Union.
The USEA has built five freight companies, it therefore gets five commerce points a turn from it's railway connections.

If only this were implemented! Then I would have a zillion points, since I'm connected to like a zillion nations! However, Middle Snu is right. It isn't that realistic.

How about you get points for every nation you connect to directly? Like for me, Afghanistan (after we build the railway), Burma, the Union, the M.E.U. and China. Although we aren't directly connected to the Union. So I only border about three of those nations :(

To be blunt, that doesn't strike me as particularly realistic. For instance, Manchuria is connected to the Union, which is connected to France. But I can't see a lot of Franco-Manchurian trade happening, can you?

Besides, it complicates things, something I'm not in favor of.

EDIT: Also, it encourages splintering nations. A clever Union could split Mongolia up into seven or eight nations, and get points for each of them... that doesn't seem right.

Hmm then maybe a limit to the amount of stacked indirect connections you can have e.g. USEA can connect with Korea (Two indirect connections) but not with Afganistan (Three indirect connections).

As for the splintering I think that the condition that says that connected countries must have at least four major settlements [This could be made higher] and the capital connected by railway would stop that. If it didn't you could implement a economic level (Say four points of industry) that connected countries must be above so that you get a point from being connected.

Less bad, but you still have to wonder why France doesn't get points from the Union... is Burgundy really so much of a barrier to trade?

Besides, I dislike any approach that is simply based on countries. Logically, the size of the country's economy should matter...

And let it be said that I'm not actually biased, since I'm bordering Chile, Bolivia, Uruguay, Paraguay, and Brazil. This plan would help me a lot.

Well, the Mods will rule. But I'm opposed to it on principle, just because it makes an already complicated system more complicated. This is, in my opinion, something to be avoided.

Well thats only my rough idea i'm sure GB could streamline it to make it better.

Well, the Mods will rule. But I'm opposed to it on principle, just because it makes an already complicated system more complicated. This is, in my opinion, something to be avoided.

But I have a gillion miles of railway and I get no economic benefit :(

New Japanese Builds for 1938
National Effort (Last Year)
62(x2) + 30 Shipping Units + 2 Points (3% Growth 2x for NE) = 156

Military Maintenance: 49.5 Points
Domestic Services = 21 Points
1 National Airlines = 5
1 International Airlines = 6
Aid to Siam = 7.5 Points
Investment in Japan = 48 (+2 Points to Base Points next year)
6 Points for Investment (6/24)
2 Marine Corps = 8 Points
Aid to Rebels in Dutch East Indies = 5 Points

Total:156 Points Spent

But I have a gillion miles of railway and I get no economic benefit :(

I think we already have benefits from building lots of railroads and superhighways. GB said that they will accelerate tech development or allow nations to catch up in tech's faster. In other words, if India and China were to build more railroads and highways, we can catch up to the Union, USA, UK, Japan (all Tech 6.5) then we all develop at the same rate afterwards (we hit tech level 7 at the same time). Unless I'm mistaken.

Command Economy National Effort, Income doubled, growth 1% (requires level 5 social spending to offset social costs)

Market Economy Wartime (not available until second year of war), Income x 3, growth 1%

Command Economy Wartime (not available until second year of war), Income x 3.5, no growth

Market Economy Total War (not available until second year of war), Income x 4, no growth first year, -1% growth second and additional years. Plus -2% growth for each year postwar for every year Total War economy was in place. (simulates post war recession, large budget deficits)

This is to simulate the fact that Market economies have more capital available and more slack then Command economies but are slower to respond.

What I call "Level IV" social services is spending 5 points per 10 million people. Other people would call that Level 5. Which is it here?

Also, it seems to me that it's too easy for a Market Economy to switch to "Total War." Should it really be that quick? (I'd recommend third year of war, but I'm not an economist.) Or is it just discouraged by the punishments?

What I call "Level IV" social services is spending 5 points per 10 million people. Other people would call that Level 5. Which is it here?

Also, it seems to me that it's too easy for a Market Economy to switch to "Total War." Should it really be that quick? (I'd recommend third year of war, but I'm not an economist.) Or is it just discouraged by the punishments?

Say a person uses total war for, say, 5 years. Lets say they have a base of 100 points, right? Now, for four of those years they get -1%. Then for five years after that they get -2%. When they cease using the Total war (at the end of the five years), they'll only have 96 points. Then, after adding in the 5 years of -2% growth, they will have 86 points. That means that there will be 10 years of looses, which bring down your economy 14% (in this case). If they had gone with just war, in those 10 years they would have gained about 11 points (which is what command economies would get anyhoo). That gives command economies the advantage after the war ends.

New Japanese Builds for 1938
National Effort (Last Year)
62(x2) + 30 Shipping Units + 2 Points (3% Growth 2x for NE) = 156

Military Maintenance: 49.5 Points
Domestic Services = 18 Points
1 National Airlines = 5
1 International Airlines = 6
Aid to Siam = 7.5 Points
Investment in Japan = 48 (+2 Points to Base Points next year)
2 Marine Corps = 8 Points
Aid to Rebels in Dutch East Indies = 5 Points

Total:147 Points Spent

I made some of the changes you suggested Middle Snu, but I still don't have as many points left over as you said I would. I think this is because of my poor addition skills the first time. Or is it something I did this time?

Something you did the first time. While you listed 150 points spent, you actually spent 158. However, you are now 9 points underspending. I recommend the following:
Spend 3 more points for Social Services. You need 21 points, not 18, to get level III.
Spend the other 6 doing something else. Give them to an ally, build up your military, or do a little bit of investing for next year.

New Japanese Builds for 1938
National Effort (Last Year)
62(x2) + 30 Shipping Units + 2 Points (3% Growth 2x for NE) = 156

Military Maintenance: 49.5 Points
Domestic Services = 21 Points
1 National Airlines = 5
1 International Airlines = 6
Aid to Siam = 7.5 Points
Investment in Japan = 48 (+2 Points to Base Points next year)
6 Points for Investment (6/24)
2 Marine Corps = 8 Points
Aid to Rebels in Dutch East Indies = 5 Points

Total:156 Points Spent

Updated it.

Rumanian Build
Market Economy
Base Economy:21+7 from commerce
Total Points:28

Military Upkeep
1xMechanised Corp-.5 Points
2xMotorised Corp-.5 points
1xAlpine Corp-.5 points
2x Field Artillery-.5 points
1xFighter-1 Point
1x Single Engine Bomber-1 Point
2x Pilots-.5 points
2x Light Cruisers-.5 points
1x Heavy Cruiser-.25 points
1xLight Ship Counter(10 Destroyers)-.25 points
Total:5.5 points points

Military Expenditures
1x Mechanised Artillery-3 points
Upgrade 2 Motorised Corps to Mechanised-2 points
1 X Mechanised Corp-4 Points
1x HQ-6 Points

Total Spending:15 Points

Domestic Spending
5 Points for Level 4 social services for 13 million people.

TOTAL SPENDING:25.5 Points

You've got 2 points missing. If you've got nothing else to do with them, build a fortification. Fortifications never hurt.

Yugoslavia
1939

Base Income: 26
Merchant Marines: 19
Foreign Assistance: 12
Total income: 57

Maintenence:
4x to military
10x to welfare

National Builds:
1x Submarine 4 points
2x Alpine Reserve Corps 6 points
1x Fighter [FW-190] to replace IK3 fighter unit 2 points
1x Light ship unit[10 destroyers] 8 points
1x Field Artillery unit 2 points
7x Merchant marine 21 points

Total used: 57

TLS: YOU are complaining that you have too much railroads? I own a railroad that covers the entire Eurasian Continent. Do you really want to give the Soviets that many more points? I mean, not like I won't take it... A lot of people seem to forget that the Union actually OWNS that railroad.... Best damned thing I ever did ;)

Parthini']Snip
Parth - to the War Room!

am i allowed in the war room?

Parthini']TLS: YOU are complaining that you have too much railroads? I own a railroad that covers the entire Eurasian Continent. Do you really want to give the Soviets that many more points? I mean, not like I won't take it... A lot of people seem to forget that the Union actually OWNS that railroad.... Best damned thing I ever did ;)

Hey man, as long as you don't plan to invade me and wipe me off the map, you can have as many points as you want. Sure, I'm a member of the LTA, but I'm not stupid. I realise that I am surrounded by pro-Pact nations, so I'm not trying to get anyone angry at me.

Also, did you see the railroad plan on the Soviet thread?

What is the war room?

What is the war room?

The room that they plan their wars together in?

What does economic growth basicly mean? I just want to be sure

War room? What war room? I don't know about any war room and you don't either, if you know waht's good for you...

c'mon Kiliani i've been always curious to see what goes on behind the scenes with the pact.

What does economic growth basicly mean? I just want to be sure

Example. You have 100 points. You have 3% growth every year. So, this is what happens:

100 +3% = 103.
103+3% = 106.09 (rounded to 106)
And so on and so forth.

If you have negetive growth, it would be:
106 -1% =104.94 (rounded to 105)

c'mon Kiliani i've been always curious to see what goes on behind the scenes with the pact.

There is no war room. IT a is a figment of your imaginations. No such place exists. And we certainly don't make secret plans for world domination there, either.

There is no war room. IT a is a figment of your imaginations. No such place exists. And we certainly don't make secret plans for world domination there, either.

Pfft, yeah right. That's like me saying I don't have plans to conquer the Himalayan states, Afghanistan, Burma, and Ceylon.

Oops.

What do we with growth which is less than 1 point?

like if you get .3 a year, just wait 3 years for it to equal .9 which is close enough to 1.

What do we with growth which is less than 1 point?

What IM said.

Or, if it's something like .78 or something, just round up.

Oh alright

So you'll have 12 points in 1942. Then 13 in '45, etc.

Rounding up strikes me as odd. It means that there's no difference in growth between an economy with 50 points and 2% growth and an economy with 40 points and 2% growth.

I've always kept track of growth to two decimal places. It is the One True Way.

Rounding up strikes me as odd. It means that there's no difference in growth between an economy with 50 points and 2% growth and an economy with 40 points and 2% growth.

I've always kept track of growth to two decimal places. It is the One True Way.

We need to regulate this more. There needs to be a firm decision on rounding.

1939:<Normal Spending>
Algeria (LTA)
Population:7.5 million people, Conservative Republic, Market Economy.

Economic Index: 10 points
Commerce: 1 point (Oil Exporter)
Growth:0.3 points
Total=11 points

Millitary Maintenance: 1 point.
Social Spending (Level II): 1.5 points.
Building Shipping: 3 points.
Pilot Training: 2 points.
Fortifications: 2 points.
Sent to the US: 1 point.
Gift to Morocco: 0.5 points.

Standing Millitary:
1 Tech 6 Infantry Unit
1 Tech 5 Millitia (Police) Unit
1 Tech 6 Flak Artillary
1 P40 "Warhawk" Fighter Unit
1 Pilot

Reserve Millitary:
3 Garrison Units, 1 Cavalry Unit

Shouldn't I be tech level 5 anytime soon?

Shouldn't I be tech level 5 anytime soon?

not yet, after a few years of oil production though you will move up quickly

We need to regulate this more. There needs to be a firm decision on rounding.

I round to the nearest for NPC countries, so that is reasonable.

The Republic of Gran Colombia (1939)
Population:13 million
1939 builds: 30 points base (I got four from Panama Canal, hoorah), plus 34 for shipping and airlines, total of 64 points

Education and Safety net (medical, welfare). - 5 points basic schools, clinics, high schools, public hospitals, orphans and widows assistance, public universities, social security type assistance for the elderly and disabled, unemployment insurance, food assistance (like food stamps), junior colleges, free health insurance, and a basic living allotment to all who aren't working.

National Maintenence:
4 x Garrison = 1p (3 ON RESERVE - So only .25p)
3 x Alpine Corp = 3p
1 x Mechanized Corp = 1p
1 x HQ Unit = 1p
1 x Motorized Artillery = .5p
1 x Theatre Supply Unit = .5p
8 x Fighters = 8p
1 x Light Bomber = 1p
2 x Light Ships = 2p
3 x Flak Artillery = .75p
2 x Carrier Fighter Units = 2p
1 x Carrier Bomber Units = 1p
3 x Fleet Carrier = 3p (Vincente Sewell, Dario Echandia, Francisco de Paula Santander)
2 x Cruiser = 1p (Manuel Ancizar and Alberto Lleras Camargo)
TOTAL: 25p

National Builds: (34p left)
3 x Fortifications (2p each) = 8p
6p to Argentina
5p to Farmer Assistance (aka Subsidies, and to bring down costs of food)
10 Points to Research (Tanks and Armoured Vehicles. Better Armours and better Tank Guns)
5p to Tax Cuts for people with Three or More Children.

Mega Projects: (0p left)
None

I round to the nearest for NPC countries, so that is reasonable.

Ok, good.

I have a question.

Does Rural Electrification need 2 years to complete? Meaning it finishes at the beginning of 1940 for China, and then apply the 10% bonus increase at the beginning of fiscal year 1940?

Just asking as I already paid for it in full in 1938- 53 points for it, so I don't need to put more points for it in 1939, assuming it does take 2 years to finish "building".

USEA 1939 build
Population: 21.7 Million
Representative Democracy, Market Economy
Normal spending

26 points ( 10 from Industry (factories in Cam Ranh, Saigon, Hanoi, Phnom Penh and Vientiane) + 1 point from natural growth + 12 from 6,00,000 tons of shipping + 3 points Aid from USA)

Domestic:

Level IV social spending 10 points

Expansion of railway network 12 points

1x shipping unit (500,000 tons) 2.5 points [to be completed next year]

Military:

Military Maintenace:
2x Infantry corps free
3x Garrison corps free
1x Motorized .25 points
1x fighter unit .5 points
1x Marine unit .5 points
1x Light ship unit .25 points

Total = 1.5 points

1937 Cut Government Spending

Points-24 Base Factory point, 30 trade, ,+9 from total growth
46.5 points to spend


5.75 points-maintenance(Huge problem here, my comp is fried, thats why I haven't been online for a while, and with my comp I lost my records of my military which were saved on my comp, I only know the maintenance cost from digging through this thread and finding it, I'll try to dig somewhere in the hopes that I posted the numbers, otherwise I dunno)

6 points- Lv 4 welfare
1 point-rural electrification
10 points-5 fortifications
5 points-minefields, and other sea defenses, in the waters I control(And in the ones i don't)
4 points-extra training for armed forces with upcoming war
8 points-help bring up tech lv of the whole SU
5 points-Start building contacts and bonds with the Finns

11 points extra...I have no idea what to do with them? Gues surplus if thats possible.

1937 Cut Government Spending
5 points-minefields, and other sea defenses, in the waters I control (And in the ones i don't)
That is so not a good idea, considering what waters are near you that don't control - that's either me or Britain.


5 points-Start building contacts and bonds with the Finns

That means me. What do you want?

IC:

Korean Build-1938
Market Economy National Effort, Income doubled, growth 1% (essentially simulates large scale budget deficits)-10 points, plus 17 extra from Union and 3 from US, so 30.1 points.

devotion of 15 points (8 donated (Union), 7 domestic) to support for basic schools, clinics, high schools, public hospitals, orphans and widows assistance, plus to back public universities and social security type assistance for the elderly and disabled, plus unemployment insurance, food assistance (like food stamps), junior colleges-Level V spending

2 Points to go to Nationalist China for Social Aid

2 points for upkeep of Korean Armed Forces

3 points for Rural Electrification

3 points for a shipping unit

5 points for an airline to serve Inter-Korea Traffic, covers cost of men, appropriate aircraft.
-------------

OOC:

I think I also had some twin engined transport aircraft from before, and one or two pilots-how much would it cost to make them into an airline?

The Republic of Gran Colombia (1939)
Population:13 million
1939 builds: 30 points base (I got four from Panama Canal, hoorah), plus 34 for shipping and airlines, total of 64 points

Education and Safety net (medical, welfare). - 10 points basic schools, clinics, high schools, public hospitals, orphans and widows assistance, public universities, social security type assistance for the elderly and disabled, unemployment insurance, food assistance (like food stamps), junior colleges, free health insurance, and a basic living allotment to all who aren't working.

National Maintenence:
4 x Garrison = FREE
3 x Alpine Corp = 1.5p
1 x Mechanized Corp = .5p
1 x HQ Unit = .5p
1 x Motorized Artillery = .25p
1 x Theatre Supply Unit = .5p
8 x Fighters = 4p
1 x Light Bomber = .5p
2 x Light Ships = .5p
3 x Flak Artillery = .75p
2 x Carrier Fighter Units = .5p
1 x Carrier Bomber Units = .25p
3 x Fleet Carrier = 1.5p (Vincente Sewell, Dario Echandia, Francisco de Paula Santander)
2 x Cruiser = 1p (Manuel Ancizar and Alberto Lleras Camargo)
11 x Pilots Upgrade = 2.75
TOTAL: 15p

National Builds: (44p left)
3 x Fortifications (2p each) = 8p
6p to Argentina
5p to Farmer Assistance (aka Subsidies, and to bring down costs of food)
10 Points to Research (Tanks and Armoured Vehicles. Better Armours and better Tank Guns) (14 next year to complete)
5p to Tax Cuts for people with Three or More Children.
5p in hold

Mega Projects: (0p left)
None

Turns out I've been paying to much for upkeep for sometime now... certainly free'd up some points... ten!

French Builds, 1939

Base: 73+24 commerce (97 total)

Economy Type: Market

Growth: 3%

Military Spending

Active Military
2xMechanized Corps (1 point)
2xAlpine Corp (1 point)
1xMechanized Artillery (.25 points)
1xHQ (.5 points)

1xLight Fighter Unit (.5 points)
1xLight Bomber Unit (.5 points)
1xNaval Bomber Unit (.5 points)
3xPilots (.75 points)

2xCarrier Fighter Units (1 point)
2xCarrier Bomber Units (1 point)
4xCarrier Pilots (1 point)

2xDestroyer Units (.5 points)
2xSubmarine Units (.5 units)
5xLight Cruisers (1.25 points)
2xHeavy Cruisers (.5 points)
1xFleet Carrier (.5 points)
2xEscort Carriers (1 point)
1xTech 6 Battleship (.5 points)

Reserve Military
18xCoastal Artillery Units (4.5 points)
2xFlak Artillery (.5 points)
2xMechanized Corps (1 point)
1xMarine Corp (.5 points)
1xAlpine Corp (.5 points)
1xMechanized Anti-Tank Unit (.5 points)

2xFighter Units (1 point)
1xLight Bomber Unit (.5 points)
1xNaval Bobmer Unit (.5 points)
4xPilots (1 point)

Total Upkeep: 24 points

Military Builds/Research

1xMechanized Corp (4 points)

1xColonial Mechanized Corp (Based in Africa, made up of mostly Africans, French equipment, 4 points)

1xFighter Unit (2 points)

1xPilot (2 points)

4xFlak Artillery (Deployed on Atlantic Wall, 8 points)

FS Jean-Bart (4.5 points)

Multi-Stage Rockets (2 points)

Total: 27.5

Domestic Spending
Level IV Social Services for Continental France (25 points)

Level III Social Services for French West Africa (12 points)

French West Africa RR (5 points, 10 left)

Rural Electrification: 4.5 points
Total: 46.5

TOTAL: 97 points

1939 Argentina build

12 points base+34 commerce+6 from Colombia.
Cut government spending for 46 points

Military Expenditures
Maintenance: 4 points.
3x fortification: 6 points.

Domestic Expenditures
Level III social services: 3 points.
Rural electrification: 1 point (year 2/2)
Increased Transit System: 2 points

Foreign Expenditures:
8 points to Great Britain (24/48 paid)
.5 points to Bolivia (level II social services)
.5 points to Bolivia (discretionary)
3 points to Bolivia (for a domestic airline)
18 points to Chilean investment (18/18 paid)

Military-End of Year
2 mechanized corps, 2 infantry corps, 3 garrison units, 3 fortifications, 1 HQ, 2 fighter units (A6M), 1 bomber unit (Mosquito), 6 pilots, 2 tech level 6 County type light cruisers, 10 tech level 6 destroyers (modernized), 30 shipping units, 1 national airline, 1 international airline. Maintenance: 4 points.

Economy-End of year
14.58+34 commerce=48 points

1939 Bolivian Build

3 points+3.5 from Argentina
Upkeep-.25
1 motorized infantry-3
Domestic Airline-3
Military, end of year-1 garrison unit (reserve), 1 fortification, 2 motorized infantry, domestic airline, pilot. Maintenance: .5 points.

5 points-minefields, and other sea defenses, in the waters I control (And in the ones i don't)

You know that contravenes all recent conventions on naval warfare right?

In that you are free to lay minefields in your own territory, but try it in international waters or another nation's territory and thats breaking international law. Could land you in some deep trouble.

Oh and I presume that all these minefields are signposted so that foreign shipping doesn't have any accidents?

Does having Level V social spending (10 points per 10 million) mean you only have 1% natural growth?

Also when will the USEA be tech level six?

EDIT: Another question, what are the economy caps for each tech level? They arn't on the front page.

Does having Level V social spending (10 points per 10 million) mean you only have 1% natural growth?

Also when will the USEA be tech level six?

EDIT: Another question, what are the economy caps for each tech level? They arn't on the front page.

To questions 1 and 2, I don't know, but gettng Level V social spending is extremely hard for everyone.

To question 3, you can only get 2 base points per 1 million people for levels 4-6, and 4 per 1 million for tech level 7.

Japanese Builds for 1939
66 + 34 (Shipping Units + Airlines ) + 2 Points (3% Growth) = 102

Military Maintenance: 50.5 Points
Domestic Services = 21 Points
Aid to Siam = 10.5 Points
Points for Investment = 19 (24/24)
Aid to Rebels in Dutch East Indies = 2 Points

Total: 102 Points Spent

OOC Coments:
Japan’s ‘gift’ to Siam to cover Siam’s portion of the railroad is included in the aid package which however, only received a three point boost this turn.

New British economy stuff (1939),

Population: UK: 48m, Empire: 63m, Representative Democracy, Market Economy.

a standard economy, 4% growth,

86 British base points (86/96 capacity, 90%)
43 Empire base points (43/126 capacity, 34%)
4 from airlines
30 from shipping
8 from Argentina in loan repayments
5 from growth (@4%)
TOTAL = 168 points.

MILITARY MAINTENANCE

Total: 51 points

MILITARY EXPANSION

3 points to build 1 4 engined bomber unit adapted to Carry “Tallboy” AP bombs
2 points for 1 pilot unit for the above.

Plus pre-paid construction:
4 Tech 6 Battleships attack 5, protection 8, speed 6, range 7 (16" guns) 1 left in 1940 to be known as HMS Thunder
1 Tech 6 Super battleship attack 6, protection 8, speed 5, range 5, (18" guns), ready 1941 (No relevant class) To be known as HMS Vanguard, being built at Clydeside drydocks in Scotland
1 tech level 6.5 heavy fleet carrier 12 points, to be known as HMS Sovereign of the Seas, being built at Clydeside drydocks in Scotland

total: 5 points

ROUTINE DOMESTIC OUTLAYS

5 points per 10 million people= 23.5 points on level IV welfare, yields a NHS, basic education, income support etc.

ROUTINE EMPIRE DOMESTIC OUTLAYS

5 points per 10 million (EMPIRE)= 31.5 points on level IV welfare

EXCEPTIONAL EMPIRE OUTLAYS

0 points to invest in Oil Infrastructure in Nigeria (already paid for 2/2 years complete)
31 points to invest in industry (alongside proposed US and SA investment)

total: 31 points

RESEARCH

Anglo-American Nuclear Research (paid for)
The Anglo-American jet engine which has already been invested in (Already paid for)

Total: 0 points

FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH AID

26 points to India

Total: 26 points


GRAND TOTAL=168 POINTS SPENT THIS TURN

South African 1939 Economy
Population: 10,644,000; Representative Democracy; Market Economy 3% growth
Production: 32 points (20 base, 12 commerce)
Foreign Aid: N/A

Constant Costs
Military Maintenance-2.75 points
Level III Social Services-3 points

Government Projects
4x Shipping Units-12 points
Sub-Saharan Development-11.25 points (to complement British and American spending)
International Airline-[paid for by United States]
1x Pilot Unit-2 points
Rural Electrification-1 point (completed this year, 10% increase goes into effect 1940)

Points Spent: 32
Surplus: 0
1940 predicted income: 46 points (20 base, 14 shipping, 4 airline, 4 colonial, 10% growth from RE)

USA 1939
US Population (1935) 145 million, Representative Democracy, Market Economy
290 points base income (includes growth and rural electrification and adjusted growth from previous years incorrectly determined)
3 points debt repayment from Canada
9 points income from the Philippines and Oceania
34 points from commerce

Total points 336 points

Military maintenance 105 points
National Safety net (level 5 spending)(unemployment insurance, food stamps, junior college system) 70 points
National Safety net for Philippines (level 2 spending) 2 points
10 points to Japan (represents US oil and steel exports to Japan)
10 points to Central America (NPC nations, for social service assistance)
197 total points

Under construction (already paid for)
Panama Canal expansion (year 4 of 4)(opens January 1940) +10% bonus to Gran Colombia economy
Saint Lawrence Seaway project (year 4 of 4) (opens April 1940) + 3 points to Canadian economy , + 1 point to US economy, Great Lakes cities become seaports.
Intercoastal Waterway project (year 4 of 4)(opens April 1940)+10% bonus to US economy (worth 22 points)
3 Midway class carriers (Year 2 of 3)
1 Iowa class battleship (year 2 of 2.5)

137 New Construction points available
Television guided bombs and missiles research (very secret) 4 points
Atomic energy research (powerplant applications)(very secret) 8 points (8 more points needed)
Multi stage rocket research 3 points (14 more points needed)
3 Iowa class battleships (year 2.5 of 2.5) 18 points (available July 1939)
4 anti aircraft cruisers 24 points
40 destroyers (4 light ship units) 32 points
20 submarines (2 submarine units) 8 points
6 points for South African international airline
36 points of infrastructure in British Africa

Can you remind me gain how is the US improves my oil infrastructure? and how am I paying it back?

I remember that the US sends 12 points (one time) and that should be enough so that in 1940 I can get 5 points from my oil. In the mean time I get 2 points, half of which goes to the US for 13 years.

Is this correct?

How does having oil affect my economy? I was never too clear on that.

Can you remind me gain how is the US improves my oil infrastructure? and how am I paying it back?

I remember that the US sends 12 points (one time) and that should be enough so that in 1940 I can get 5 points from my oil. In the mean time I get 2 points, half of which goes to the US for 13 years.

Is this correct?

yes, and the US doesn't expect its 1 point until you actually reach the 5 points a year level.

Australian Builds for 1938
Population: 6.5 million
Parliamentary Democracy
Market Economy

Points: 13 + 5 from commerce + 2 from colonies + 11 from US = 31

Military Maintenence:
2 Tech 6 Fighter Squadrons = 1 pt
1 Naval Air Unit (4 engine) = 2 pts
2 Tech 6 Battlecruisers = 1 pt
2 Tech 6 Heavy Cruisers = 1 pt
4 Tech 6 Light Cruisers = 1 pt
1 Tech 6 Sub Unit = .25 pts
2 Tech 6 Destroyers = .5 pts
2 Tech 5 Garrison Units = .5 pts
Training for 3 Tech 6 Pilots = .75 pts

Upgrades:
3 Tech 6 Motorized Infantry to Mechanized Infantry = 3 pts
2 Tech 5 Garrison Units to Tech 6 = 3 pts

Economic Aid:
3 points to New Zealand to build 1 merchant marine

Unit Purchases:
2 Pilot Units = 4 pts
1 Domestic Airline = 3 pts
1 International Airline = 4 pts

Domestic Spending:
Level III Safety Net = 3 points

Total Spent: 31 pts

EDIT:

Stupid Jolt made me quad-post through lag and "Website Error!"

EDIT:

Stupid Jolt made me quad-post through lag and "Website Error!"

EDIT:

Stupid Jolt made me quad-post through lag and "Website Error!"

Chinese Build for 1939:

Converts to Market Economy as popular support shifts to Nationalists (who advocate capitalism and free market) with the progress of the Rural Electrification project (already paid for in 1938).

Converts to Peace-time Spending Mode.

I'm assuming Rural Electrification won't give the bonus until its completed in end of 1939 (bonus starts in 1940 if I'm not mistaken)

Income:

3% growth = 4 additional industry points (3% of 129 income points not including Korean aid = 4).

100 points industry
4 new industry from growth
29 points commerce (25 merchant marine and 4 from airlines)
2 points aid from Korea

Total: 135 points.

Expenses:

Build Expenses:

5 Merchant Marine for 15 points.
4 garrisons upgraded to Mechanized Infantry (for 1 point total with US aid / equipment)
1 Armored Corps purchased from France (250 Panther and 250 Tiger tanks) for 6 points.

Build Total Expenses: 22 points.

Social Spending:

90 Points for Level II Social Services for 450 million Chinese.
8 Points for Level I Social Services for 80 million Chinese.

15 points military maintainence (extra training for pilots included).

Total Expenses: 135 points.

Remaining points: 0

% applies to total; Base and commerce. I asked that question myself, and that's what GB said. He said that's why the U.S. joined NAFTA in RL.

% applies to total; Base and commerce. I asked that question myself, and that's what GB said. He said that's why the U.S. joined NAFTA in RL.

Oh, thanks. I appreciate the tip, TLS. :)

Oh, thanks. I appreciate the tip, TLS. :)

I might be wrong, though. But I'm pretty sure I'm not.

I might be wrong, though. But I'm pretty sure I'm not.

your not

your not

Touchdown!

*yaaaaaay! Yaaaaay!*

In talks with China, the US agrees to allow China to purchase older aircraft, tanks and other military equipment and vehicles from the United States.

ooc
P47 fighters (1 point each), B25 bombers (2 points each), Sherman tanks with 75 mm guns, modern anti aircraft guns and artillery etc. Basically to buy, spend 1 point per fighter, 2 points per bomber, and .25 points per ground unit to represent the arms purchases desired. By the way, the P47 is equal to any Japanese or Union fighter at the moment.

OOC:

I can start buying US stuff in 1940 when I get my extra few points from rural electrification and natural growth.

EDIT:

Change the Yugoslavian IK-3 purchase point to buying 4 American land based Artillery units (for .25 points each and not coastal artillery so to avoid breaking the Japanese peace treaty).

Also, how should we handle upgrading some Chinese stuff to use US equipment? I want to upgrade my Garrisons to Mechanized Infantry and my flak units to modern American flak units at some point within the next few game years, and build some artillery, tanks, and anti-tank bazooka units.

OOC:

I can start buying US stuff in 1940 when I get my extra few points from rural electrification and natural growth.

EDIT:

Change the Yugoslavian IK-3 purchase point to buying 4 American Artillery units (for .25 points each).

Also, how should we handle upgrading some Chinese stuff to use US equipment? I want to upgrade my Garrisons to Mechanized Infantry and my flak units to modern American flak units at some point within the next few game years, and build some artillery, tanks, and anti-tank bazooka units.

you pay normal upgrade costs, its just that the units are equiped with US stuff. Remember, the artillery is that cheap only if its upgrading an existing artillery unit, otherwise you have to buy the actual unit and its assumed that the equipment is US.

To questions 1 and 2, I don't know, but gettng Level V social spending is extremely hard for everyone.

To question 3, you can only get 2 base points per 1 million people for levels 4-6, and 4 per 1 million for tech level 7.

Level V social spending is not as hard as you think, I should be able to support it by 1943, however I don't want to do it untill I know it will affect my country's natural growth.

Level V social spending is not as hard as you think, I should be able to support it by 1943, however I don't want to do it untill I know it will affect my country's natural growth.

it won't

you pay normal upgrade costs, its just that the units are equiped with US stuff. Remember, the artillery is that cheap only if its upgrading an existing artillery unit, otherwise you have to buy the actual unit and its assumed that the equipment is US.

Thanks for the clarification.

Would upgrading 4 of my 13 garrison units to Mechanized Infantry cost .25 points a piece (for total of 1 point) with US gear, then?


EDIT:

I apologize for the confusion. What exactly does the discount prices apply to? The 1 point for fighter, 2 point for bombers, and 0.25 points for ground units- are they the actual upgrade costs? If so, then would it be correct if I upgraded 4 garrisons to Mechanized Infantry for 1 point (at 0.25 points a piece), upgrade my 5 DW-520 fighters to 5 P47 Mustangs for 5 points (at 1 point a pop), and the 2 A-20 bombers to 2 B25 bombers for 4 points (at 2 points a pop)?

it won't

It says it affects growth in the same way as national effort on the front page.

tis only 1% growth then. Im at level 5, and I have no where to grow to. In the real world, if my economy was not growing, and I WASN'T providing that much social services... well... I'd be out of power.

But as it is, Colombian, Venezuelans, and Panamanians have it the best right now.

I still want to buy Dutch Guyana though... but apparently theres a big US company in there...

It says it affects growth in the same way as national effort on the front page.

Level 10 has that effect, not level 5

tis only 1% growth then. Im at level 5, and I have no where to grow to. In the real world, if my economy was not growing, and I WASN'T providing that much social services... well... I'd be out of power.

But as it is, Colombian, Venezuelans, and Panamanians have it the best right now.

I still want to buy Dutch Guyana though... but apparently theres a big US company in there...

The US government has no objections and will ensure that Alcoa doesn't either

Level 10 has that effect, not level 5
See, that's what's confusing. What you call Level 5, I call Level IV, and what I call Level V, you call Level 10.

We should standardize the terminology. I like mine better.

See, that's what's confusing. What you call Level 5, I call Level IV, and what I call Level V, you call Level 10.

We should standardize the terminology. I like mine better.

I will fix it... and call them level A - F (chuckle)

Eww. If that's what it takes, though.

Do I, or do I not have the highest social safety net or not.. cause if not, Im willing to spend more money.

Australian Builds for 1939
Population: 6.5 million
Parliamentary Democracy
Market Economy

Points: 13 + 9 from commerce + 2 from colonies = 24

Military Maintenence:
2 Tech 6 Fighter Squadrons = 1 pt
1 Naval Air Unit (4 engine) = 2 pts
2 Tech 6 Battlecruisers = 1 pt
2 Tech 6 Heavy Cruisers = 1 pt
4 Tech 6 Light Cruisers = 1 pt
1 Tech 6 Sub Unit = .25 pts
2 Tech 6 Destroyers = .5 pts
Training for 3 Tech 6 Pilots = .75 pts
3 Mechanized Infantry Units (reserve) = 1.5 pts

Upgrades:
2 Tech 5 Garrison Units to Tech 6 (reserve) = 3 pts

Domestic Spending:
Level III Safety Net for Australia = 3 points
Level III Safety Net for Islands and New Guinea = 2 points

Military Spending:
2 Tech 6 Garrison Units = 6 pts


Total Spent: 23 pts
1 Point in Reserve

Level 10 has that effect, not level 5

Ahh that's thae one I was talking about.

1939:<Normal Spending>
Algeria (LTA)
Population:7.5 million people, Conservative Republic, Market Economy.

Economic Index: 10 points
Commerce: 1 point (Oil Exporter)
Growth:0.3 points
Total=11 points

Millitary Maintenance: 1 point.
Social Spending (Level II): 1.5 points.
Building Shipping: 3 points.
Pilot Training: 2 points.
Fortifications: 2 points.
Upgrading Infantry to motorised: 1 point.
Gift to Morocco: 0.5 points.

Standing Millitary:
1 Tech 6 Infantry Unit
1 Tech 5 Millitia (Police) Unit
1 Tech 6 Flak Artillary
1 P40 "Warhawk" Fighter Unit
1 Pilot

Reserve Millitary:
3 Garrison Units, 1 Cavalry Unit

GB: What sort of effect will our investment in Africa have? Increase in tech level, industrial output, a combination or something else?

A run down of investment:

Britain: 31.5 points on level IV social services (5 points per million)
31 points other investment
USA: 36 points investment
South Africa: 11.25 points investment

Total: 109.75 points invested.

Colombia will contribute points in 1940. (Maybe 20)

GB: What sort of effect will our investment in Africa have? Increase in tech level, industrial output, a combination or something else?

A run down of investment:

Britain: 31.5 points on level IV social services (5 points per million)
31 points other investment
USA: 36 points investment
South Africa: 11.25 points investment

Total: 109.75 points invested.

Master plan
population of roughly 35 million in British Africa and Liberia. 12 points a year for 3 years to improve transportation network (roads and some rail). 6 points for South African airline and 5 points for a Liberian airline and 5 points for a Nigerian airline and 5 points for a Kenyan airline gives airports throughout British Africa. In short, in three years improves tech levels from 1 or 2 to 3.5 and 4. Tied in with British social service spending, and we have sufficiently educated workforce for industrialization to have a chance of success. That accounts for 64.5 points a year for 3 years. That leaves 45.25 points remaining a year. The two little homeland areas in South Africa
Basutoland and Swaziland, can be handled by rural electrication, as they are artificial entities and are really just part of South Africa. Figure 2.25 points a year for 3 years.

40 points is split 5 ways to start industrialization at Freetown (Sierra Leon), Lagos (Nigeria), Mobasssa (Kenya), Salisbury (Rhodesia/Zimbabwe), and Dar es Salaam (Tanzania). In 3 years each will have 1 point each (primarily food processing and textiles industries with supporting services), which gives them the start they need. Remaining 3 points a year spent on extending railroad from Broken Hill (Rhodesia) to Mombassa by way of Dar es Salaam, and eventually more points spent to extend it to Ethoipia and and then Sudan and eventually Egypt (the grand Cape to Cairo rail project).

See this map
http://www.lib.msu.edu/coll/main/maps/mapscan/af1922l.jpg

In addition to resources already being received by Britian, this will give Britian 4 more point a year, plus South Africa will get 3 more a year as resources will flow more easily from Bechuanaland and Rhodesia (which essentially are linked to South Africa economically). Right now the cost of extracting resources from those areas exceeds costeffectiveness, but this will change all of that. The airlines for Nigeria and Kenya will give them both another point a year as well (which goes to Britian), while the Liberian airline gives Liberia a point (which goes to itself, but is enough to actually enable it to make some progress).


More will need to be done after this, but its a really good start. British Africa should be able to reach tech level 5 within a few years after this is done.


ooc
and incidently save tens of millions of future Africans from the dismal 20th Century they had in real life.

when all is said in done
British East Africa increases from 6 points a year to 7 points a year in 1940, and increases to 9 points a year in 1942 (and becomes tech 4 that year).

British West African increases from 11 points a year to 12 points a year in 1940, and 14 points a year in 1942 (and becomes tech 4 that year).

South Africa increases to 9 points a turn in commerce, and eventually gets 3 colonial points a turn beginning 1942, with Botswana (Bechuenaland) and Zimbabwe (Rhodesia) essentially having the same tech level as South Africa for all major purposes.

Liberia goes from tech level 2 to tech level 4 and produces 2 points a turn instead of zero, meaning it can actually afford level 2 social spending on its own. However, it is being subsidized, so it will use its points for infrastructure as well, and creating a garrrison unit to ensure political stability and government control over the countryside.

Would each of these "countries" be able to build merchant marine as well?

Would each of these "countries" be able to build merchant marine as well?
Not unless I'm allowed to build separate merchant marines for Russia, Poland, Livonia, Germany, Finland, and Ukraine. And separate airlines for all eight of the Union's Republics.

I mean, I'll accept that. But I doubt you guys would.

Good work in Africa, though. The Union salutes you.

Would each of these "countries" be able to build merchant marine as well?

no, at least not until they are semi independent (get Dominion status). At which point Britain would no longer be getting their points, so not the outcome desired at this point. They get the airline bonus ONLY because of the geography of the area and the lack of roads and railroads makes air travel a practical necessity for the economy to move from village level to national level.

Actually Vas, I am inclined to allow the Union to have 2 national airlines because of how huge in land area it is.

Not unless I'm allowed to build separate merchant marines for Russia, Poland, Livonia, Germany, Finland, and Ukraine. And separate airlines for all eight of the Union's Republics.

I mean, I'll accept that. But I doubt you guys would.

Good work in Africa, though. The Union salutes you.

Like we'd even notice the extra hundred or so points added to your budget, you pointfilled bastard. [/sarcasm]

Great plan for Africa GB.

I'll probably funnel some more points in next year to try and build them up further, it's not like there's much else to do with the points for Britain anyway.

woo, turns out Africa won't be so bad in this timeline as in real life anyway.

I hav just had an idea.

Shouldn't railways and super highways give commerce points too?

My idea for this is that a country gets 1 commerce points for every country it is connected to via a continous railway or super highway network.
The conditions for this would be:

1. Countries that you are connected too must have an internal railway or superhighway network that connects at least four major cities and the capital together.

2. You country's network must be directly or indirectly connected (E.g Via someone elses network or your own, but networks must be connected)

3. A freight company must be built for each country that you are connected to. Costs 2 points.


Example:
The USEA is directly connected to China and Siam, it is indirectly connected to Korea, Manchuria and the Soviet Union.
The USEA has built five freight companies, it therefore gets five commerce points a turn from it's railway connections.

No

At tech level 3 - 6, railroads are required to even become industrialized and to move up tech levels. Not having them, or a sizeable inland river commerce system, prevents the mass movement of raw materials needed to export or provide for an industralized economy. Tech level 3 - 6 roads are not superhighways, a superhighway is a tech level 7 innovation. In addition, your suggestion doesn't work because the US, Canada and Union all have far more land area than everyone else, and the same amount of roadway in the US would stretch clear across 6 countries in Europe.

Easier just to consider roads and railroads infrastructure needed to move up tech levels than to try to figure commerce based on tonnage of commerce and cargo moved.

Speaking of railroads, I need to connect the Vladivostok terminus to the Wensan-Changchun line. It's not even a full hex on the combat map.

I also want to connect Astrakhan, Guryev, and Kuibyshev, but that's not as high a priority.

No

At tech level 3 - 6, railroads are required to even become industrialized and to move up tech levels. Not having them, or a sizeable inland river commerce system, prevents the mass movement of raw materials needed to export or provide for an industralized economy. Tech level 3 - 6 roads are not superhighways, a superhighway is a tech level 7 innovation. In addition, your suggestion doesn't work because the US, Canada and Union all have far more land area than everyone else, and the same amount of roadway in the US would stretch clear across 6 countries in Europe.

Easier just to consider roads and railroads infrastructure needed to move up tech levels than to try to figure commerce based on tonnage of commerce and cargo moved.

So if I build more railroads (which I hardly think is possible, since they're already everywhere :p), I will move to level 7 faster?

...Although, the north-western part of India (mostly Jammu and Kashmir) don't have railways...

So if I build more railroads (which I hardly think is possible, since they're already everywhere :p), I will move to level 7 faster?

the first page of the thread talks about increasing transportation infrastructure and its cost Lightning Star.

Vas, that is roughly 200 miles, figure 2 points to connect to Manchuria. Don't worry about the other, that can be assumed as you are more industrialized than historic Russia at this point.

the first page of the thread talks about increasing transportation infrastructure and its cost Lightning Star.

Vas, that is roughly 200 miles, figure 2 points to connect to Manchuria. Don't worry about the other, that can be assumed as you are more industrialized than historic Russia at this point.

Man, that means I have to spend 80 points for 2 years to increase my transportation network! I just want to do it in one tiny area!

the first page of the thread talks about increasing transportation infrastructure and its cost Lightning Star.

Vas, that is roughly 200 miles, figure 2 points to connect to Manchuria. Don't worry about the other, that can be assumed as you are more industrialized than historic Russia at this point.
Thanks.

Japanese National Effort Declared
66(x2) + 34 (Shipping Units + Airlines ) + 2 Points (3% Growth x2) = 170 Points

Builds
Previous Planned Builds = 102 Points

Jan/Feb – 12 Points
2 Carrier Fighter Units (A6M) – 4 Points
3 Pilots – 6
1 Theater supply unit – 2 Points

March/April – 12 Points
1 Carrier Fighter Units - 4
4 Infantry Corps – 8
3 Pilots (Paid) (2/6)
1 Theater supply unit (Paid) (2/2)

May/June – 11 Points
2 Mechanized Corps – 8
1 Garrison - 3

Chinese Build for 1939:

Converts to Market Economy as popular support shifts to Nationalists (who advocate capitalism and free market) with the progress of the Rural Electrification project (already paid for in 1938).

Converts to Peace-time Spending Mode.

I'm assuming Rural Electrification won't give the bonus until its completed in end of 1939 (bonus starts in 1940 if I'm not mistaken)

Income:

3% growth = 4 additional industry points (3% of 129 income points not including Korean aid = 4).

100 points industry
4 new industry from growth
29 points commerce (25 merchant marine and 4 from airlines)
2 points aid from Korea

Total: 135 points.

Expenses:

Build Expenses:

5 Merchant Marine for 15 points.
4 garrisons upgraded to Mechanized Infantry (for 1 point total with US aid / equipment)
1 Armored Corps purchased from France (250 Panther and 250 Tiger tanks) for 6 points.

Build Total Expenses: 22 points.

Social Spending:

90 Points for Level II Social Services for 450 million Chinese.
8 Points for Level I Social Services for 80 million Chinese.

15 points military maintainence (extra training for pilots included).

Total Expenses: 135 points.

Remaining points: 0


assuming Chinese National Effort as it is now at war.
204 points - 135 for committed spending leaves 69 points plus 2 from Korea plus 4 points for airlines = 75 points divided by 6 = 12.5 points a turn.
So in January February the Chinese get 15 points to spend
March April 12 points to spend

Future turns depend on damage taken. No merchant shipping points for the first 2 turns, but if still blockaded, will get 1 point a turn for every 10 surviving merchant shipping units. 4 shipping units are caught in home ports at start of war and do not provide points. Rest are at sea or in foreign ports.

assuming Chinese National Effort as it is now at war.
204 points - 135 for committed spending leaves 69 points plus 2 from Korea plus 4 points for airlines = 75 points divided by 6 = 12.5 points a turn.
So in January February the Chinese get 15 points to spend
March April 12 points to spend

Future turns depend on damage taken. No merchant shipping points for the first 2 turns, but if still blockaded, will get 1 point a turn for every 10 surviving merchant shipping units. 4 shipping units are caught in home ports at start of war and do not provide points. Rest are at sea or in foreign ports.

China decides to build the following (for the first 2 "turns")

2 HQ units and 1 field artillery unit in January / Feburary.

6 infantry corps in March / April.

However, I have a question. I remember during the last war, China could build 1 infantry unit for 1 point instead of 2?

China decides to build the following (for the first 2 "turns")

2 HQ units and 1 field artillery unit in January / Feburary.

6 infantry corps in March / April.

However, I have a question. I remember during the last war, China could build 1 infantry unit for 1 point instead of 2?

not yet, and by the way, you got bombed, and can only build 3 infantry corps in March April.. see war thread.

not yet, and by the way, you got bombed, and can only build 3 infantry corps in March April.. see war thread.

Where? I don't see any new posts in "War in China E20" thread. :confused:

Where? I don't see any new posts in "War in China E20" thread. :confused:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=463247

OOC: Have I mentioned how old all this combat in the pacific is getting? Since Australia is maintaining a bigger military as a result of all the instability, what will be the economic/domestic repercussions? I believe I am right at the borderline right now if all my land units are reserves.

OOC: Have I mentioned how old all this combat in the pacific is getting? Since Australia is maintaining a bigger military as a result of all the instability, what will be the economic/domestic repercussions? I believe I am right at the borderline right now if all my land units are reserves.

so far so good, and at this point, the Australian people like having a solid military with all of the wars going on nearby

so far so good, and at this point, the Australian people like having a solid military with all of the wars going on nearby

::breathes sigh of relief::

No more build ups until we actually start to fight though. How long till Tech 7 for me if I invest 15 something points in the nation's infastructure each turn?

::breathes sigh of relief::

No more build ups until we actually start to fight though. How long till Tech 7 for me if I invest 15 something points in the nation's infastructure each turn?

a year or so after the Americans and British do (1945 for them and the Union)

In an effort to bring India, the Soviet Union, and the Middle Eastern Union closer together, as well as benefit the nation of Afghanistan, we have decided to create a rail-way system throughout the Kingdom. Now, while we are certainly willing to do this project ourselves, we see it as a valuable opportunity to bring together the three great powers of the region.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v626/Thelightningstar/AfghanistanRailLines.png

The red-lines are single-track, and the blue ones are double. Now, normally one would build double track everywhere, but, after careful examination of Afghanistan, we have to say, in the majority of cases you only need single-track rail (especially if you're talking about a country in need of as much help as Afghanistan). We only intend to put in the double track for areas that could have trains going two ways.

(OOC: This is re-posted from the NPC diplomacy thread. It's a bit re-worded, and I edited the map a bit, but besides that it's the same).
Forgot about this. What's the Union's share in 1939? I might have to have Finland go on deficit spending . . . Or better yet, let's plan this for 1940.

Forgot about this. What's the Union's share in 1939? I might have to have Finland go on deficit spending . . . Or better yet, let's plan this for 1940.

If we do this in 1941 (When the M.E.U. will have probably ended it's civil war and recovered), I could probably give 4 points, the M.E.U. could give 10, and you could give 10. In exchange for me only spending 4 points, we will use the gauge that you and the M.E.U. use.

If we do this in 1941 (When the M.E.U. will have probably ended it's civil war and recovered), I could probably give 4 points, the M.E.U. could give 10, and you could give 10. In exchange for me only spending 4 points, we will use the gauge that you and the M.E.U. use.
It's a deal. Even if we're in the middle of World War Three by then.

It's a deal. Even if we're in the middle of World War Three by then.

I deffinetly don't plan on participating in WWIII. I participated in the last one, with not-so-swell results for India.

Don't blame you. I'd rather sit it out myself.

Don't blame you. I'd rather sit it out myself.

Yeah, but at least if you get involved, you have high chances of coming out on top. I, on the other hand, have high chances of coming out with civil war, a destroyed infrastructure, and an all-around bad time.

USA 1939
US Population (1935) 145 million, Representative Democracy, Market Economy
290 points base income (includes growth and rural electrification and adjusted growth from previous years incorrectly determined)
3 points debt repayment from Canada
9 points income from the Philippines and Oceania
34 points from commerce

Total points 336 points

Military maintenance 105 points
National Safety net (level 5 spending)(unemployment insurance, food stamps, junior college system) 70 points
National Safety net for Philippines (level 2 spending) 2 points
10 points to Japan (represents US oil and steel exports to Japan)
10 points to Central America (NPC nations, for social service assistance)
197 total points

Under construction (already paid for)
Panama Canal expansion (year 4 of 4)(opens January 1940) +10% bonus to Gran Colombia economy
Saint Lawrence Seaway project (year 4 of 4) (opens April 1940) + 3 points to Canadian economy , + 1 point to US economy, Great Lakes cities become seaports.
Intercoastal Waterway project (year 4 of 4)(opens April 1940)+10% bonus to US economy (worth 22 points)
3 Midway class carriers (Year 2 of 3)
1 Iowa class battleship (year 2 of 2.5)

137 New Construction points available
Television guided bombs and missiles research (very secret) 4 points
Atomic energy research (powerplant applications)(very secret) 8 points (8 more points needed)
Multi stage rocket research 3 points (14 more points needed)
3 Iowa class battleships (year 2.5 of 2.5) 18 points (available July 1939)
4 anti aircraft cruisers 24 points
40 destroyers (4 light ship units) 32 points
20 submarines (2 submarine units) 8 points
6 points for South African international airline
36 points of infrastructure in British Africa

US Defense Supplemental Bill
290 additional construction points available
Reserve Fleet placed in shipyards for return to duty (2 fleet carriers, 4 light carriers, 8 old battleships, 15 cruisers, 2 amphibious fleets) 25 ships x 2 points each = 50 points (all enter service beginning September)

8 more points into atomic energy research (paying for it)
14 more points into multistage rocket research (paying for it)

100 destroyers (10 light ships) 80 points (January 1940)
15 escort carriers 60 points (January 1940)
15 carrier pilots 30 points (March 1940)
15 carrier aircraft units 30 points (January 1940)
2 amphibious fleets (September 1939) 12 points

5 Strategic bomber units 20 points (March 1940)
5 fighter units 10 points (September 1939)
5 bomber units 15 points (September 1939)
10 pilots 40 points (March 1940)
1 transport aircraft unit 3 points (September 1939)
1 heavy transport aircraft unit 4 points (November 1939)

Is that really how you want to play it?

We weren't threatening you before - just hoping to be able to defend our coasts against you.

An All-Union National Effort will be undertaken in response to this. You asked for it.

Is that really how you want to play it?

We weren't threatening you before - just hoping to be able to defend our coasts against you.

An All-Union National Effort will be undertaken in response to this. You asked for it.

ooc
remember the British and American historical response to the German naval build up prior to World War I? Its entirely consistent. In addition, strategic bombers are very good ASW aircraft, among other things....

I know, it's plausible. But that doesn't change the fact that it's annoying as hell to have to redo my budget to reflect an arms race. It's OoC, don't mind me. Just venting.

1939:<Normal Spending>
Algeria (LTA)
Population:7.5 million people, Conservative Republic, Market Economy.

Economic Index: 10 points
Commerce: 1 point (Oil Exporter)
Growth:0.3 points
Total=11 points

Millitary Maintenance: 1 point.
Social Spending (Level II): 1.5 points.
Building Shipping: 3 points.
Theater supply unit comstruction: 2 points.
Fortifications: 2 points.
Upgrading Infantry to motorised: 1 point.
Gift to Morocco: 0.5 points.

Standing Millitary:
1 Tech 6 Infantry Unit
1 Tech 5 Millitia (Police) Unit
1 Tech 6 Flak Artillary
1 P40 "Warhawk" Fighter Unit
1 Pilot

Reserve Millitary:
3 Garrison Units, 1 Cavalry Unit

Vas, how much would it be for me to purchase plans for using the MP-40?

Vas, how much would it be for me to purchase plans for using the MP-40?
An indefinite Non-Aggression Pact, requiring six months' notification of withdrawal.

That's pretty much just our standard for sharing any military technology.

An indefinite Non-Aggression Pact, requiring six months' notification of withdrawal.

That's pretty much just our standard for sharing any military technology.

Deal. I have no intention of war with the union.

Sovereign People’s Conciliar Union

[ Research and Development = 78.5
30 pts for applied advanced physics (complete)
24.5 pts for RADAR guided AA missiles
24 pts for TV guided missiles



The only SAM type missile at this tech level is Wasserfall, which was never tested. I am going to stick with SAMs being a tech level 7 technology. My suggestion, research rocket planes (which are needed to break the sound barrier which is required for supersonic jets later on). Those don't become available until you have multistage rocket technology, which both the Union and US and UK now do.

The TV guided missiles are possible, but expensive, and I am still pondering rules for those. Probably a special attack bonus, and limit the availablity to no more than 10% of the available bombers of any air force equipped with them.

Remember the rules for nukes, because we haven't been as bloody minded in the world as in real life, no atomic weapons until 3 years of war, and then requires 24 points for infrastructure (Los Alamos, Oak Ridge and Hannover type facilities).

Nuclear, Chemical and biological weapons cannot be delivered by missiles at this tech level (just in case someone is thinking evil thoughts). Atomic bombs require a large B29 sized bomber (and not every 4 engined bomber will work). At this tech level, atomic weapons are huge.

In addition, unless specificially spent for, I am going to assume no one has started a biological weapons program. That takes 3 years, and costs 30 points at this tech level. The end product is determined by the referee (as I will have to research them, although I have some handy sources).

Remember the rules for nukes, because we haven't been as bloody minded in the world as in real life, no atomic weapons until 3 years of war, and then requires 24 points for infrastructure (Los Alamos, Oak Ridge and Hannover type facilities).

When you say 24 points for infastructure, does that mean 24 points invested into nuclear research, or 24 points spent specifically on "infastructure," and then additional points spent on the actual R&D?

I'm still thirty-eight years away from nukes if I go by RL, but I'd like to know all the same.

When you say 24 points for infastructure, does that mean 24 points invested into nuclear research, or 24 points spent specifically on "infastructure," and then additional points spent on the actual R&D?

I'm still thirty-eight years away from nukes if I go by RL, but I'd like to know all the same.

specifically for infrastructure, which is seperate from researech (plutinium processing plants don't grow on trees after all)

Right. That's what I figured.

Check your TGs.

Middle Eastern Union builds for 1939
Government: Westminster Parliament system
Economy: Market Economy (Wartime)

60 points from the industries, then 80 points from the Soviets, and 21 points from Commerce, 161 points in total

96 points for Government Investment in Arms production industries in Ankara region (so by next point I will get 4 extra points)

30 points for 10 shipping units

6 Pilots for 12 points

21 points for Social Services and Healthcare (Level III)

Ottoman, pilots cost 2 points, it just that it takes 6 turns to train them.

time is frozen for 24 hours as the Jolt has been flaky and to give everyone a chance to read what has happened so far

Bulgaria is now changing to a War-time National Effort temporarily until the New War ends and then after the war the economy is to revert to the 1937 level yet more advanced gradually (War-Time, National Effort, then Back to Normal Peacetime...)

Wait, what New War?


With the 6 points in aid from the Union, Rumania build the following:

1x submarine unit-4 points

She's (He's?) referring to the MEU Civil War, not to the looming of Allied forces in the North Sea in preparation for a preemptive strike against us.

By the way, Warsaw suggests you mobilize you military forces and declare a National Efort, because of the looming of Allied forces in the North Sea in preparation for a preemptive strike against us.

Bucharest follows this advice, mobilising it's miltary and recalling all reservists. A National Effort is declared.

36 Points for Last Half Year in National Effort

18xMilitia Units (18 Points, Posted on Atlantic Coast)

Upgrade all Militia to Garrisons (18 Points)

TOTAL: 36 Points

Yugoslavia, National Effort Declared
1939
Base Income:52(26x2 for national effort
Shipping: 19
Foreign Assistance: 12
Total: 83

Maintenence:
4x army maintenence
20x Social maintenence(level 5 to offset national effort)

National Builds:
1x Submarine 4 points
2x Alpine Reserve 6 points
1x fighter[FW-190] 2 points
1x light ships [10 destroyers] 8 points
1x Field Arty 2 points
7x Merchant Marine 21 points

International Builds:
2x Pilots(Russian/German) 4 points Finished beginning of 1940
2x Fighters[FW-190D](Union) 4 points Finished in August of 1939
2x Type IXD Submarines(Union) 8 points

Total Used :83

Australia will go to national-effort in May. Builds will be put here later (I get one half of my annual points again, correct?)

Edit: so apparently this wont be my placeholder. Go to the end of the thread to see what is up

Although this really has nothing to do with me, how much would building the Thai Canal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thai_Canal) cost?

Although this really has nothing to do with me, how much would building the Thai Canal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thai_Canal) cost?

some study will be required for the answer to that, I will get back to you

some study will be required for the answer to that, I will get back to you

Ok then. It's not really high priority on my list, though, so you don't have to push everything aside to find it out.

Australia will go to national-effort in May. Builds will be put here later (I get one half of my annual points again, correct?)
Two-thirds, since it's one-third of the way through the year.

New British economy stuff (1940),

Population: UK: 49m (1939) Empire: 65m, Representative Democracy, Market Economy.

a national effort economy, 1% growth,

88 British base points (88/98 capacity, 88%) (x 1 2/3 for nat. effort) = 147
51 Empire base points (51/130 capacity, 39%) (x 1 2/3 for nat. effort) = 85
4 from airlines
30 from shipping
8 from Argentina in loan repayments
3 from growth (@1%)
TOTAL = 277 points.

MILITARY MAINTENANCE

Total: 54 points

MILITARY EXPANSION

10 fighter units (20 points)
21 pilots (42 points)
5 mech corps (20 points)
5 2 engined naval air units (15 points)
5 4 engined strategic bombers (20 points)
5 FLAK artillery (10 points)
1 HQ unit (6 points)
2 field artillery units (4 points)
1 airborne corps (3 points)
1 4 engined air transport (4 points)

Plus pre-paid construction:
4 Tech 6 Battleships attack 5, protection 8, speed 6, range 7 (16" guns) 1 left in 1940 to be known as HMS Thunder
1 Tech 6 Super battleship attack 6, protection 8, speed 5, range 5, (18" guns), ready 1941 (No relevant class) To be known as HMS Vanguard, being built at Clydeside drydocks in Scotland
1 tech level 6.5 heavy fleet carrier 12 points, to be known as HMS Sovereign of the Seas, being built at Clydeside drydocks in Scotland

total: 144 points

ROUTINE DOMESTIC OUTLAYS

5 points per 10 million people= 23.5 points on level IV welfare, yields a NHS, basic education, income support etc.

ROUTINE EMPIRE DOMESTIC OUTLAYS

5 points per 10 million (EMPIRE)= 31.5 points on level IV welfare

EXCEPTIONAL EMPIRE OUTLAYS

total: 0 points

RESEARCH

Rocket Plane Research (36 points)

Total: 36 points

FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH AID

NONE (INDIA, due to impending war I can no longer subsidise you social services (though a few extra points could be found if you committed yourself on the side of the LTA and Commonwealth, as the military situation wouldn’t be so harsh)

Total: 0 points


TOTAL=277 POINTS SPENT THIS YEAR

Hear ye, hear ye! In an effort to modernize it's army with the best weapons possible, the Indian Army is requesting the plans for the following weapons:

The MP44 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP44), the FG42 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FG42), the Panzerschreck (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzerschreck), the Panzerfaust (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzerfaust), the Karabiner 98k (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karabiner_98k), the Walther P38 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walther_P38), the Flammenwerfer 35 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flammenwerfer_35), the Junkers Ju 87 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_87), the Focke-Wulf FW 190 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focke_Wulf_Fw-190), the MG42 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MG42), the Arado AR 232 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arado_Ar_232), the Leichter Panzerspähwagen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leichter_Panzerspahwagen), the Schwere Panzerspähwagen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwerer_Panzerspahwagen), the Jagdpanzer IV (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jagdpanzer_IV), the Panzerwerfer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzerwerfer), the Flakpanzer IV Ostwind (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostwind), the Kübelwagen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kubelwagen), and the Panzer IV (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzer_IV).

(OOC: I'm not sure if all of these weapons have been developed or not, so if they weapon I specify doesn't exit just tell me so.)

Hear ye, hear ye! In an effort to modernize it's army with the best weapons possible, the Indian Army is requesting the plans for the following weapons:

The MP44 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP44), the FG42 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FG42), the Panzerschreck (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzerschreck), the Panzerfaust (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzerfaust), the Karabiner 98k (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karabiner_98k), the Walther P38 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walther_P38), the Flammenwerfer 35 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flammenwerfer_35), the Junkers Ju 87 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_87), the Focke-Wulf FW 190 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focke_Wulf_Fw-190), the MG42 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MG42), the Arado AR 232 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arado_Ar_232), the Leichter Panzerspähwagen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leichter_Panzerspahwagen), the Schwere Panzerspähwagen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwerer_Panzerspahwagen), the Jagdpanzer IV (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jagdpanzer_IV), the Panzerwerfer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzerwerfer), the Flakpanzer IV Ostwind (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostwind), the Kübelwagen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kubelwagen), and the Panzer IV (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzer_IV).

(OOC: I'm not sure if all of these weapons have been developed or not, so if they weapon I specify doesn't exit just tell me so.)
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c6/hrstrovokia/pactpostercopy.jpg
Courtesy of Jensai/Kilani.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c6/hrstrovokia/pactpostercopy.jpg
Courtesy of Jensai/Kilani.

Pffft. The Pact doesn't look scary with just 4 flags and 4 nations in it. ;)

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c6/hrstrovokia/pactpostercopy.jpg
Courtesy of Jensai/Kilani.

If I have to join the Pact to get all that stuff, forget about it. I don't want to be drawn from one side in a doomed conflict to another.

For frick's sake, people, it was a joke. And Sharina, there are six countries in the Pact, one of which is the Union, which counts for at least eight just by itself.

If Delhi wants all those goodies, I'm cool with it (though even I don't know if all of them are invented yet). But we'll need compensation. Whatever the costs of upgrading your military, we can just say the Union gets it.

For frick's sake, people, it was a joke. And Sharina, there are six countries in the Pact, one of which is the Union, which counts for at least eight just by itself.

If Delhi wants all those goodies, I'm cool with it (though even I don't know if all of them are invented yet). But we'll need compensation. Whatever the costs of upgrading your military, we can just say the Union gets it.

For real? Ok, deal. When we get around to upgrading our army (prolly around 1942 and continuing for a few years), you'll get your cash.

http://img280.imageshack.us/img280/4707/propganda17tf.png

I can jest as well. ;)

I can jest as well. ;)
What do you mean? That's still only two-a-half countries. And a bunch of flags.

What do you mean? That's still only two-a-half countries. And a bunch of flags.

Two and half, eh?

By that reasoning, Yugoslavia and Romania together don't make half a country. ;)

Two and half, eh?

By that reasoning, Yugoslavia and Romania together don't make half a country. ;)
Oh. Your witty repartee has stung me to the quick.

Even if it is bashing my own side, to be fair, a few of those LTA nations have about 20 minutes to live in the event of a European war (cough: Belgium : cough:))

Even if it is bashing my own side, to be fair, a few of those LTA nations have about 20 minutes to live in the event of a European war (cough: Belgium : cough:))

Belgium will die gloriously, Burgundy will not

I have added economics rules to the World War III Thread.... very important stuff

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=463543

The Republic of Gran Colombia (1939)
The Republic of Gran Colombia (1939)
Population:13 million
1939 builds: 30 points base (I got four from Panama Canal, hoorah), plus 34 for shipping and airlines, total of 64 points

And then OMFG national effort. Extra 30 points from starting in May, 1939.

Education and Safety net (medical, welfare). - 10 points basic schools, clinics, high schools, public hospitals, orphans and widows assistance, public universities, social security type assistance for the elderly and disabled, unemployment insurance, food assistance (like food stamps), junior colleges, free health insurance, and a basic living allotment to all who aren't working.

National Maintenence:
4 x Garrison = FREE
3 x Alpine Corp = 1.5p
1 x Mechanized Corp = .5p
1 x HQ Unit = .5p
1 x Motorized Artillery = .25p
1 x Theatre Supply Unit = .5p
8 x Fighters = 4p
1 x Light Bomber = .5p
2 x Light Ships = .5p
3 x Flak Artillery = .75p
2 x Carrier Fighter Units = .5p
1 x Carrier Bomber Units = .25p
3 x Fleet Carrier = 1.5p (Vincente Sewell, Dario Echandia, Francisco de Paula Santander)
2 x Cruiser = 1p (Manuel Ancizar and Alberto Lleras Camargo)
11 x Pilots Upgrade = 2.75
TOTAL: 15p

National Builds: (44p left)
3 x Fortifications (2p each) = 8p
6p to Argentina
5p to Farmer Assistance (aka Subsidies, and to bring down costs of food)
10 Points to Research (Tanks and Armoured Vehicles. Better Armours and better Tank Guns) (14 next year to complete)
5p to Tax Cuts for people with Three or More Children.
5p in hold

Mega Projects: (0p left)
None

May Builds:
35 points to spend

Garrison Upgrade to Infantry, then Mechanized Corp = (2p, 2 turns)
Garrison Upgrade to Infantry, then Mechanized Corp = (2p, 2 turns)
Garrison Upgrade to Infantry, then Mechanized Corp = (2p, 2 turns)
1 x Armoured Corps (6p, 4 turns) (Won't be ready till next year...)
1 x Armoured Corps (6p, 4 turns) (Won't be ready till next year...)
1 x Armoured Corps (6p, 4 turns) (Won't be ready till next year...)
= 24p

Oil Production:
6 Points Venezuela
1 Point Colombia
7 Points turns into 140 Oil Points
(For sake of easiness) 15 Points used by Colombia, 125 available to allies.

Production Facilities:
15 - 3 Bogota, 3 Cali, 3 Caracas, 2 Panama, 2 Maracarbillo, 1 French Guyana, 1 Barranquilla

Rail Moves:
Apparently none?

Australian Emergency Spending for 1939---16 additional points plus 1 reserve point saved:

1 point of aid to USEA:

1 Point to upgrade Garrison in Sydney to Amphibious Corps
1 Point to upgrade Garrison in Melbourne to Amphibious Corps
(are these finished in July?)
6 points to create Amphibious Engineering Corps--finished May 1940
6 points to create Headquarters Unit--finished May 1940

2 points in reserve

6 Factories located: 3 Melbourne, 2 Sydney, 1 Perth
1 Railmove per turn

The Republic of Gran Colombia (1939)
The Republic of Gran Colombia (1939)
Population:13 million
1939 builds: 30 points base (I got four from Panama Canal, hoorah), plus 34 for shipping and airlines, total of 64 points

And then OMFG national effort. Extra 30 points from starting in May, 1939.

Education and Safety net (medical, welfare). - 10 points basic schools, clinics, high schools, public hospitals, orphans and widows assistance, public universities, social security type assistance for the elderly and disabled, unemployment insurance, food assistance (like food stamps), junior colleges, free health insurance, and a basic living allotment to all who aren't working.

National Maintenence:
4 x Garrison = FREE
3 x Alpine Corp = 1.5p
1 x Mechanized Corp = .5p
1 x HQ Unit = .5p
1 x Motorized Artillery = .25p
1 x Theatre Supply Unit = .5p
8 x Fighters = 4p
1 x Light Bomber = .5p
2 x Light Ships = .5p
3 x Flak Artillery = .75p
2 x Carrier Fighter Units = .5p
1 x Carrier Bomber Units = .25p
3 x Fleet Carrier = 1.5p (Vincente Sewell, Dario Echandia, Francisco de Paula Santander)
2 x Cruiser = 1p (Manuel Ancizar and Alberto Lleras Camargo)
11 x Pilots Upgrade = 2.75
TOTAL: 15p

National Builds: (44p left)
3 x Fortifications (2p each) = 8p
6p to Argentina
5p to Farmer Assistance (aka Subsidies, and to bring down costs of food)
10 Points to Research (Tanks and Armoured Vehicles. Better Armours and better Tank Guns) (14 next year to complete)
5p to Tax Cuts for people with Three or More Children.
5p in hold

Mega Projects: (0p left)
None

May Builds:
35 points to spend

Garrison Upgrade to Infantry, then Mechanized Corp = (2p, 2 turns)
Garrison Upgrade to Infantry, then Mechanized Corp = (2p, 2 turns)
Garrison Upgrade to Infantry, then Mechanized Corp = (2p, 2 turns)
1 x Armoured Corps (6p, 4 turns) (Won't be ready till next year...)
1 x Armoured Corps (6p, 4 turns) (Won't be ready till next year...)
1 x Armoured Corps (6p, 4 turns) (Won't be ready till next year...)
= 24p

Oil Production:
6 Points Venezuela
1 Point Colombia
7 Points turns into 140 Oil Points
(For sake of easiness) 15 Points used by Colombia, 125 available to allies.

Production Facilities:
15 - 3 Bogota, 3 Cali, 3 Caracas, 2 Panama, 2 Maracarbillo, 1 French Guyana, 1 Barranquilla

Rail Moves:
Apparently none?

Look out!

Colombia ain't no push-over anymore. ;)

By the way, can I get my hands on some of that oil should the LTA or other Chinese allies somehow break the Japanese blockade?

The Republic of Gran Colombia (1939)
Rail Moves:
Apparently none?
Place your factories in your cities to determine your strategic moves.

Place your factories in your cities to determine your strategic moves.

In Gran Colombia's case, as well as other Latin American countries, as they aren't on the map for this purpose....and North America too, as hexes there are 4 times bigger than the European map

Rail moves
Canada 3
USA 12
Mexico 1
Gran Colombia 2
Argentina 2
Brazil 1
Chile 1

no others

1 of the Venezulean oil resources shown on that map actually is Dutch (Curacao and Aruba)

Rumanian Loan

4 points to refit 2xBBs
4 points to refit 2xFleet Carriers
2xpoints to refit 1xLight Carrier

GB, did you get any estimate on how many points the Kra Canal would cost? Also, by how much would it help the local economy (how much of a percent increase would it give to the country which controls it?

GB, did you get any estimate on how many points the Kra Canal would cost? Also, by how much would it help the local economy (how much of a percent increase would it give to the country which controls it?

Roughly 30 points to build, it will take 4 years, and its not economically viable yet. Main reason it will be later is to shorten the sea route for Japan and China when they import Mideast oil, especially for security reasons. At this time, there is not a serious piracy problem to justify it either (unlike present day in real life). In addition, the Malacca Strait is a strategic issue for Japan and China, but the fact that China has no navy and the LTA Navy and IJN are about to fight it out is a more serious strategic issues.

Interesting idea though, bring it up again later.

New Zealand Spending for 1939--5 points on National Effort = 8

(this will be the only time I will post separately for NZ and Aus.)

1 Point to upgrade Infantry Corps to Motorized Corps--avaliable July
2 Points to buy F4 Corsair Unit--Available August
3 Points for Motorized Corps--Available September

1 Point to Level 2 Safety Net

1 Point in Reserve

Roughly 30 points to build, it will take 4 years, and its not economically viable yet. Main reason it will be later is to shorten the sea route for Japan and China when they import Mideast oil, especially for security reasons. At this time, there is not a serious piracy problem to justify it either (unlike present day in real life). In addition, the Malacca Strait is a strategic issue for Japan and China, but the fact that China has no navy and the LTA Navy and IJN are about to fight it out is a more serious strategic issues.

Interesting idea though, bring it up again later.

Awww, shucks. Ah well. My economy isn't read for such a project yet anyhoo. Probably for the best to not attempt it now.

USEA cities with production centres:

Cam Ranh, Saigon, Hanoi, Phnom Penh, Haiphong and Vientiane


1939 aid from Austrailia go to building:

1x garrison unit (Saigon) 1 point [To be completed next year]

Yugoslavia-last revision
1939
Base Income:52
Shipping: 19
Foreign Assistance: 12
Total: 83

Maintenence:
4x army maintenence
20x Social maintenence

National Builds:
1x Submarine 4 points
2x Alpine Reserve 6 points
1x light ships [10 destroyers] 8 points
1x Field Arty 2 points
7x Merchant Marine 21 points

International Builds:
2x pilots 4 points (Union)
2x Fighters[FW-190D) 4 points (Union)
2x Type IXD subs 8 points (Union)

Foreign Aid:
2 points to France

Total Used :83

Yugoslavian Aid
1xInfantry Corp (2 Points)

I'm confused. If I switch to National Effort in May, how many points would I get?

If I double my 1939 points I'd have 64 points, but since I've already allocated 32 of those, would I just get 32 more points for the remainder of the year, or what?

I'm confused. If I switch to National Effort in May, how many points would I get?

If I double my 1939 points I'd have 64 points, but since I've already allocated 32 of those, would I just get 32 more points for the remainder of the year, or what?
May is 5/12 of the way through the year, so the extra points you get for 1939 would be equivalent to 7/12 of your baseline income. If your baseline income is 32, then 32(5/12)=18 + 2/3. So, basically, you get 18.67 extra points for commencing deficit spending in May.

Actually, Malkyer has 20 base points +12 commerce points. This means that he would get 20(5/12) points, or 8.32 points.

Current British oil consumption (if it makes GB's life any easier). I have not counted commercial units, I am not sure if I need to pay oil points for them, if I do then I apologise. Also unit sthat are currently being constructed are not paid for, which I assume is the case.


The Army

1 HQ unit
3 mechanized corps
2 armoured cavalry corps
2 motorised field artillery units
1 amphibious marines unit
2 garrison units

TOTAL: 2.5

The Royal Navy
4 Tech 6 Battleships attack 5, protection 8, speed 6, range 7 (16" guns) (1 in 1940)
1 modernised HMS Hood (which becomes 4 attack, 5 defense, 7 speed and range 6), HMS Hood
2 Modernised Nelson class battleships (which become 5 attack, 6 defense, 3 speed and 5 range), HMS Nelson, HMS Rodney
5 King George V class battleships (4 attack, protection 5, speed 6 and range 5). HMS King George V, HMS Prince of Wales, HMS Duke of York, HMS Anson, HMS Howe
3 Tech 6 Fleet carrier protection 2, speed 6, range 6, (80 – 100 aircraft), HMS Hermes, HMS Eagle, HMS Vindictive,
4 Tech 6 Light carriers protection 1, speed 6, range 6, (40 -55 aircraft), HMS Courageous, HMS Glorious, HMS Furious, HMS Argus
8 Tech 6 submarine units (80 submarines), attack 1, protection 0, speed 3, range 5,
20 Tech 6 Light ship (200 destroyers ) attack 1, defence 1, speed 7, range 4
10 Tech 6 heavy cruiser attack 1, defense 2, speed 7, range 6, HMS Hawkins, HMS Vindictive, HMS Raleigh, HMS Frobisher, HMS Effingham, HMS Caroline, HMS Cambrian, HMS Centaur, HMS Caledon, HMS Ceres, HMS Carlisle,
20 Tech 6 light cruiser attack 1, defense 1, speed 7 range 6, HMS Bristol, HMS Chatham, HMS Weymouth, HMS Birkinhead, HMS Birmingham, HMS Manchester, HMS Glasgow, HMS Edinburgh, HMS Falmouth, HMS Nottingham, HMS Derby, HMS Yarmouth, HMS Dartmouth, HMS Chester, HMS Dublin, HMS Gloucester, HMS Chicester, HMS Liverpool, HMS Belfast, HMS Lowestoft, HMS Newcastle, HMS Southampton, HMS Kilmarnock, HMS Leicester, HMS Cambridge, HMS Oxford,

TOTAL: 24

Naval Reserves
4 modernised Queen Elizabeth class battleships (which become 4 attack, 5 defense, 4 speed and range 5), HMS Queen Elizabeth, HMS Warspite, HMS Barham, HMS Valiant,

CURRENTLY MOTHBALLED

Fleet Air Arm

7 carrier fighter-bomber units (De Havilland Mosquitos)
9 naval aviation pilots

TOTAL: 1.75

The Royal Airforce

3 2 engined fighter-bombers (De Havilland Mosquitos)
5 bombers (Avro Lancasters)
5 UK fighters (Supermarine Spitfires)
16 pilot units

TOTAL: 18.5

The Army Reserves

2 Field Artillery
8 8 point mechanised corps
1 HQ unit
2 Garrisons (London, Dover)

TOTAL: 2.5

The Merchant Navy

35 merchant shipping units
10 Tech 6 Ocean Liners (represents 20 Queen Mary sized ocean liners). Protection 2, range 5, speed 6,

TOTAL: NONE (COMMERCIAL)

Merchant Airforce

2 pilots
1 domestic airline
1 international airline

TOTAL: NONE (COMMERCIAL)

Other Defences

4 Flak artillery (Coventry, Dover, Scapa Flow, London)
2 Coast artillery (Dover, Scapa Flow)
2 Fortifications (Dover, Scapa Flow)

TOTAL: 1.5

GRAND TOTAL: 50.75 oil points

Actually, Malkyer has 20 base points +12 commerce points. This means that he would get 20(5/12) points, or 8.32 points.
Glad one of us is paying attention. That didn't even occur to me to factor in. Except that it's 20(8/12), including May (which I forgot the first time around myself), which is 13.33.

Hopefully we haven't just made this even more confusing.

Note: I edited my 1936-'41 build, so now in 1942 I will have a total of 47, with 22 base points and 25 commerce. Of course, I haven't factored in the aid I might be getting for 1940 and 1941, so I'll keep yas posted.

1938 Cut Government Spending

Points-24 Base Factory point, 30 trade, ,+12 from total growth+6.6 points from electrification

51 points to spend+11 left over from last turn

5.75 points-
6 points- Lv 4 welfare
1 point-rural electrification(done)
5 points-extra training for armed forces
13 points-help bring up tech lv of the whole SU
5 points-Continue building contacts and bonds with the Finns
6 points-2 shipping units
20 points-beautify Stockholm, parks, zoos, statues, fountains squares, monuments, museums, exc. Trying to make it a major cultural and tourist location.



1939 Cut Government Spending

Points-24 Base Factory point, 30 trade, ,+21
54 points to spend

5.75 points-
6 points- Lv 4 welfare
5 points-extra training for armed forces
12 points-help bring up tech lv of the whole SU
5 points-Continue building contacts and bonds with the Finns
20 points-beautify Stockholm, parks, zoos, statues, fountains squares, monuments, museums, exc. Trying to make it a major cultural and tourist location.

1938 Cut Government Spending
5 points-Continue building contacts and bonds with the Finns

1939 Cut Government Spending
5 points-Continue building contacts and bonds with the Finns
What exactly is this? Are you giving me extra points? 'Cause I'll take 'em. Or are you trying something you really shouldn't be trying? 'Cause you already know what'll happen then.

Alt Aus, I would strongly recommend that you spend those points, as well as the points spent to beautify Stockholm, to a more productive pursuit. Such as building a better military, or building airlines.

Also, please note that it is not necessary to distinguish between "factory" and "growth" points- the only needed distinction is between commerce and base points.

IC:

Korean Build-1939

Market Economy National Effort, Income doubled, growth 1% (essentially simulates large scale budget deficits)-10 points, plus 5 extra from Union and 3 from US, so 18.2 points.

devotion of 10 points (4 donated (Union), 6 domestic) to support for basic schools, clinics, high schools, public hospitals, orphans and widows assistance, plus to back public universities and social security type assistance for the elderly and disabled-Level III spending (ICly, Rhee Gov't Wartime Austerity)

2 points for upkeep of Korean Armed Forces

3 points (US) for Rural Electrification

3.2 points for an Alpine Corps.

OOC: When should National Effort Penalties start kicking in?

IC:

Korean Build-1939

Market Economy Cut Spending, Income doubled, growth 1% (essentially simulates large scale budget deficits)-10 points, plus 17 extra from Union and 3 from US, so 30.2 points.

Since the Union isn't really in the business of supplying aid to countries we're about to be at war with, unless the KWP seizes power and repudiates china's entry into the Seoul Conference, aid shipments will stop in May. You'll receive only 5 points of Union aid for the year, therefore.

And we'll recover 12. Which we'll undoubtedly spend on military stuff. Yay.

Since the Union isn't really in the business of supplying aid to countries we're about to be at war with, unless the KWP seizes power and repudiates china's entry into the Seoul Conference, aid shipments will stop in May. You'll receive only 5 points of Union aid for the year, therefore.

And we'll recover 12. Which we'll undoubtedly spend on military stuff. Yay.

Why do you have to go to war agian, i've sort of forgotten.

May--- Belgium mobilizes and declares national effort. Using its 10 additional points, it purchases 3 pilots, which will train in North America (available May 1940), and spends 4 points to purchase 1 Commando unit (available in September) and 1 Naval commando unit, and to upgrade 1x5 point garrison unit to a motorized infantry unit.

Portugal declares national effort, mobilizes and uses its 2 extra points to buy an infantry corps (available in July).

Spain (PC, but no word is some time) mobilizes, declares national effort and uses its 10 points to purchase 5 infantry corps (available July)

Burgundy mobilizes, but the Left defeats an effort to declare national effort.

Italy mobilizes, declares national effort, and uses its 14 points to purchase 2 armored corps (shows up in November) and 1 infantry corps (July) ooc although likely to remain neutral, Italy has been invaded before and is being prudent.

Chile declares national effort and uses 4 points to purchase 2 infantry units that it intends to send to Spain (available July), and activates a commerce unit as a transport. (using cultural solidarity here)

Morocco declares National effort, mobilizes and uses its 2 points to form a horse cavalry corps for service in the Sahara.

Canada mobilizes, declares National Effort, uses its 12 points to purchase 2 pilots (available May 1940), 1 armored corps (November), 1 infantry corps (July)

Why do you have to go to war agian, i've sort of forgotten.

the forces of momentum are heading that way....

Since the Union isn't really in the business of supplying aid to countries we're about to be at war with, unless the KWP seizes power and repudiates china's entry into the Seoul Conference, aid shipments will stop in May. You'll receive only 5 points of Union aid for the year, therefore.

And we'll recover 12. Which we'll undoubtedly spend on military stuff. Yay.

OOC: We're just mobilizing for domestic defense, as it were, we haven't openly declared war, rather, a state of emergency. As it is though, we will accept the cut in aid (Syngman Rhee rejoices), though the KWP is perplexed at Warsaw's decision (complaints of "We need the money!" arise).

Also, new Build up.

Why do you have to go to war agian, i've sort of forgotten.
Because we hate the Chinese, and they hate us, and the possibility of them actually becoming strong enough to challenge us must be quashed. And also because we need the IJN in order to even stand a shot at defeating the Americans in the Pacific.

We did warn both you guys several times that you were needlessly involving yourselves in something that would destroy you.

But whichever of us wins (Soviet or Amerikan), you'll probably be rebuilt.

We did warn both you guys several times that you were needlessly involving yourselves in something that would destroy you.

But whichever of us wins (Soviet or Amerikan), you'll probably be rebuilt.

Well, I did get the warnings.

But besides that, I am not sure how to respond. The only thing I can say is: I'd rather like to be rebuilt by the US than the SPCU, thank you, when and if war occurs. And, as I have said, Korea has not made any official declaration of war. That should say something.

Well, I did get the warnings.

But besides that, I am not sure how to respond. The only thing I can say is: I'd rather like to be rebuilt by the US than the SPCU, thank you, when and if war occurs. And, as I have said, Korea has not made any official declaration of war. That should say something.

Japan technically hasn't declared war on China yet either...

Japan technically hasn't declared war on China yet either...

Yes, but Korea isn't actively terrorizing women and children; we're handling our mobilization differently. Besides that, touché.

Well, I did get the warnings.

But besides that, I am not sure how to respond. The only thing I can say is: I'd rather like to be rebuilt by the US than the SPCU, thank you, when and if war occurs. And, as I have said, Korea has not made any official declaration of war. That should say something.
Not really, no. You're now China's ally, whereas I am Japan's, which means when I go to war against the Chinese, I'll be forced to go to war against you.

Besides that Warsaw's pretty ticked that after all we've done for Korea (tons of aid, ships, etc.) Seoul went and joined the enemy, and for no discernable reason (after all, I assured you again and again that neutrality would be respected).

ooc
Historically, Korea has always been pretty prickly about being bullied, and Japan did bully. That and the fact that traditionally the Koreans hate the Japanese (and have a long history of fighting them) makes it reasonable to me. Koreans don't like the Manchurians much either.

Hard to change millenia of traditional hatreds.

Besides that Warsaw's pretty ticked that after all we've done for Korea (tons of aid, ships, etc.) Seoul went and joined the enemy, and for no discernable reason (after all, I assured you again and again that neutrality would be respected).

To me, Seoul (or at least Syngman Rhee) had a reason; trying to build a credible third-party alliance by inviting one of the major Asian players in.

Also, factoring in GB (the Japan thing was a big factor too, you don't use chemical weapons and not scare your neighbors into trying to band together).

ooc
Historically, Korea has always been pretty prickly about being bullied, and Japan did bully. That and the fact that traditionally the Koreans hate the Japanese (and have a long history of fighting them) makes it reasonable to me. Koreans don't like the Manchurians much either.

Hard to change millenia of traditional hatreds.

But, I won't belabor the point; this is a game, and this argument is really taking needed space for builds.

South African 1939 Economy
Population: 10,644,000; Representative Democracy; Market Economy 3% growth
Production: 32 points (20 base, 12 commerce)
Foreign Aid: N/A

Constant Costs
Military Maintenance-2.75 points
Level III Social Services-3 points

Government Projects
4x Shipping Units-12 points
Sub-Saharan Development-11.25 points (to complement British and American spending)
International Airline-[paid for by United States]
1x Pilot Unit-2 points
Rural Electrification-1 point (completed this year, 10% increase goes into effect 1940)

Points Spent: 32
Surplus: 0
1940 predicted income: 45 points (20 base, 18 commerce, 3 colonial, 10% growth from RE)

South Africa has switched to a National Effort type economy in May 1939, and has recieved 13.3 addition points of production, to spent as follows:

2x Pilot Unit-4 points
1x Naval Air Unit (4 engine)-4 points
1x Motorized Infantry Corp-3 points
1x Infantry Corp-2 points

Points Spent: 13
Predicted 1940 Income: 67 (20 base x2 National Effort, 18 commerce, 3 colonial, 10% growth from RE)

I have 11 points left over, you want them Korea?

I have 11 points left over, you want them Korea?
Good luck getting them through our fleets.

Good luck getting them through our fleets.

That's a "Yes, the Union would be glad to take them."

I have 11 points left over, you want them Korea?

I'll take them, but it'll take some doing. I must admit, the Union is playing hardball, and I must tip my hat to them, albeit nervously.

And, one final edit to my Builds-

IC:

New Korean Build-1939

Market Economy National Effort, Income doubled, growth -2% (essentially simulates large scale budget deficits)-10 points, plus 5 extra from Union and 3 from US, so 17.83 points.

devotion of 9 points (4 donated (Union), 6 domestic) to support for basic schools, clinics, high schools, public hospitals, orphans and widows assistance, plus to back public universities and social security type assistance for the elderly and disabled-Level III spending (ICly, Rhee Gov't Wartime Austerity)

2 points for upkeep of Korean Armed Forces

3 points (US) for Rural Electrification

2 points for an Infantry Corps.

GB, when will the MEU hit tech 6?

GB, when will the MEU hit tech 6?

whenever your civil war ends

Dude! It doesn't cover how to upgrade mein airkraft in the post ab00t military stuff. Ness.

Dude! It doesn't cover how to upgrade mein airkraft in the post ab00t military stuff. Ness.

maintenance covers the costs, and since you don't have an aircraft industry, someone has to let you purchase aircraft who is an aircraft manufacturer.. Italy is neutral, everyone else is at war.

US gets supplemental points from Allies (Mexico, Central America, Cuba, and Virgin Islands plus Chile so I don't have to deal with that apparently abandoned PC country)... 27 points divided by 6 (halfway through year) or 13.5 points.

Points are used to purchase 6 P47N fighter units (available July) for the Chinese Air Force, whose 6 pilots are training in Arizona.

Plus 3 points for Dutch West Indies (prorated) to purchase an A26 bomber unit (available September)

US gets supplemental points from Allies (Mexico, Central America, Cuba, and Virgin Islands plus Chile so I don't have to deal with that apparently abandoned PC country)... 27 points divided by 6 (halfway through year) or 13.5 points.

Points are used to purchase 6 P47N fighter units (available July) for the Chinese Air Force, whose 6 pilots are training in Arizona.
Don't we get some too, from Sweden and Denmark? Maybe Kashgaria or Afghanistan (if they have any)?

US gets supplemental points from Allies (Mexico, Central America, Cuba, and Virgin Islands plus Chile so I don't have to deal with that apparently abandoned PC country)... 27 points divided by 6 (halfway through year) or 13.5 points.

Points are used to purchase 6 P47N fighter units (available July) for the Chinese Air Force, whose 6 pilots are training in Arizona.

As I recall, Chile has already declared national effort and sent two infantry units to Spain.

Somebody's got a puppet.

If i enter National effort now how many extra points will I get?

maintenance covers the costs, and since you don't have an aircraft industry, someone has to let you purchase aircraft who is an aircraft manufacturer.. Italy is neutral, everyone else is at war.

I bought alot of planes from the commies. I think I bought the Focke Wulf Fw-190 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focke_Wulf_Fw-190), and I'd most deffinetly like the German planes over the Italian ones...

As I recall, Chile has already declared national effort and sent two infantry units to Spain.

Chile is rasing 2 units for service in spain, but has not sent anything anywhere yet. Chile was a PC country, but the player has vanished, and to make life simpler for me as a referee, its easier to just bring his points in this way, so I have one less economy to deal with.

If i enter National effort now how many extra points will I get?
Bump

Bump

take your peacetime budget (what you spent at the start of the year), double it, and then prorate for what month we are in (May), so you get half that figure (actually 5/12, but use half for everyones sanity).

Nations that declared National Effort in January will be able to declare wartime level budgets for 1940. For playability, nations that did that in March can do the same. Nations that went to National Effort in May will be able to declare wartime spending beginning May 1940

The penalities for growth under National Effort should be factored in, and remember that wartime spending has penalities too

Ah so Ill get 5 extras, hmm If only i could have built that railroad, there would not have been any need for national effort.

Extra may 1939 points

1 x headquarters unit

1 more point to Garrison aleady under construction

a new economic thread will be created when game restarts

OOC
will eventually be placed in the new economics thread when I create it. Ongoing as I update the situation. The strain of war has been so great, that national effort or higher CANNOT be done for the next 2 years without risking severe domestic consequences. ALL ANTHRAX damage has been cleared up, as have radiation hotspots. So you don't have to pay for that.

Sample
Russia (includes Siberia and Transurals regions)
Prewar: 100 (50 Russia, 30 Urals, 20 Siberia)(Moscow industry has been moved)
Prewar population: 95 million Postwar population 85 million
Vitebsk 5, Kalinin (5), Moscow (5), Minsk 5, Tula (3), Kursk (2), Saratov 5, Volgograd (3), Krasnador 2, Gorki (3), Yaraslavl (2), Smolensk 2, Rostov 3,
Oil points at Grozny, Maikop,
Kazan (5), Perm (5), Sverdlovsk (5), Magnitogorsk (5), Kubyshev 5, Omsk (5) Oil points at Perm
Novosibirsk (5), Irkustk 5, Chita 5,
Permanently lost Petrograd 5 (to Finland)/Vladivostok (5) to Manchuria
Total production centers available: 36
Needing repair: 59
Commerce: 2 points (national airline, no merchant shipping remains)

Russia has no direct access to the Atlantic Ocean or Baltic Sea, but does have access to the Black Sea and limited access to the Pacific Ocean.
In 1944, Russia has a military force of 6 infantry corps, 2 air transport units, mostly used for disaster relief and to deal with rebel communist guerillas.
Russia is at Peacetime for 38 points, most of which are used for repairing production centers and providing a social safety net as best it can. (Level 1 social spending for 8.5 points, Civil defense for 8.5 points, military for 4 points, 12 points to fix Kursk production, 5 points to create international airline. Russia has lost the Kuriles to Japan, but keeps Sakkalin Island.

how things are looking so far

upgrades within the tech level are handled by maintanence. Upgrades to a higher tech level are not handled by maintanence.

This will be very important as we get to higher tech levels by the way. Ground Units will also get smaller at tech level 7 (divisions instead of corps) but will remain at around the same price. Air units and naval units will be smaller and become more expensive. Electronics, jet engines, missiles... they are damned expensive and the reason why even the Soviets and the Americans couldn't keep up the arms race by the end of the Cold War. Tech level 8 is even worse (when everything starts getting computers etc).

a reminder as we are getting close to tech level 7

I can accept a +1 point cost for level 2 and 3 services, and + 2 for level 4 and + 5 for level 5 services at Tech level 7.

At tech level 8 they go up again. Mainly because historically, the costs of these services do increase much faster than the inflation rate because they become more complex to deliver, the bureaucracies become bloated no matter what is attempted, and more goodies are added. It is also a way to simulate some of the inefficiencies built into socialist or regulated capitalist economies in a relatively simple manner.

(my college minor was public policy studies, and I have worked in social services for nearly 20 years (ack) which is why I feel justified on my facts on this one).

also about to be relevent

I'm wondering...

When will China, India, Korea, USEA, etc. hit Tech level 6.5 then level 7? I'd like to know as this will probably effect social services and as I remember, factories get upgraded to 4 points per 1 million population at Tech Level 7?

I'm wondering...

When will China, India, Korea, USEA, etc. hit Tech level 6.5 then level 7? I'd like to know as this will probably effect social services and as I remember, factories get upgraded to 4 points per 1 million population at Tech Level 7?

not for a while yet, China lost some ground because of war damage for example.

Former Pact States

Far East and Asia


in process of adjustment

a lot of countries have been updated, more will be added today

a lot of countries have been updated, more will be added today

Hurrah.

more added

India (India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, plus UN Mandate Afghanistan, Iran)
Population: 350 million (plus another 15 million Iran, 1 million Afghanistan)
Tech level 6
Production centers: Lucknow 2, Madras 2, Nagbar 2, Karachi 2, Delhi 2, Multan 2, Calcutta 2, Bombay 2, Patna 2 plus 15 shipping units, 1 national airline, 1 international airline, 5 colonial points Iran, 1 colonial point Afghanistan, 3 oil points (Iran)
1944 Budget provided level 1 social services for all, plus paid for 6 garrison units, 4 mechanized infantry divisions, 1 HQ, 2 C47 transport units, 2 average pilots, 1 Mosquito bomber unit, 1 light ship unit (20 corvettes)
Anthrax, Rice Blast and radiation cleanup has been completed.

in process of adjustment
So how many points total?

So how many points total?

see first post... if you go with peacetime, then you have 18 production+19 commerce+6 colonial+3 oil= 46 points
go with national effort, the production increases to 36 plus commerce and colonial and oil

see first post... if you go with peacetime, then you have 18 production+19 commerce+6 colonial+3 oil= 46 points
go with national effort, the production increases to 36 plus commerce and colonial and oil

Okieday, thanks.

Also, is there any way I can make Afghanistan and Iran not colonial but actually part of my country?

Was there something about penalties for ex-Pact nations doing National Effort?

BTW, thanks for the aid LTA :)

Okieday, thanks.

Also, is there any way I can make Afghanistan and Iran not colonial but actually part of my country?

not yet... neither much like the Indians for reasons dating back to the dawn of civilization.. that will take a substained effort for a while.

Parthini']Was there something about penalties for ex-Pact nations doing National Effort?

BTW, thanks for the aid LTA :)

Nations that have damaged production can do a national effort without penalty but all points generated by that national effort must be allocated to rebuilding, or the population will not be amused.

A few more questions:

Shouldn't I have 37.5 points (28+5 shipping and 2 airlines), instead of just 28?

Also, what various projects (electrification, etc.) have I done? I want to make Germany nice again before I go a' slaying.

Any chance you can hit up Chatzy?

Nations that have damaged production can do a national effort without penalty but all points generated by that national effort must be allocated to rebuilding, or the population will not be amused.

In that case, I'd like China to be on National Effort until *ALL* my factories are fixed. This should occur without penalties, correct?

What about War-Time or Total War economies if they are used solely to repair damaged production centers? Or is the "no penalty" only applicable to National Effort only?

Parthini']A few more questions:

Shouldn't I have 37.5 points (28+5 shipping and 2 airlines), instead of just 28?

Also, what various projects (electrification, etc.) have I done? I want to make Germany nice again before I go a' slaying.

Any chance you can hit up Chatzy?

the 37.5 points was from the 1944 budget, figure your new budget based on your production centers available this year, plus your commerce and any aid anyone gives you

In that case, I'd like China to be on National Effort until *ALL* my factories are fixed. This should occur without penalties, correct?

What about War-Time or Total War economies if they are used solely to repair damaged production centers? Or is the "no penalty" only applicable to National Effort only?

national effort only... further wartime effort is going to cause A lot of trouble, including a general economic collapse. So National effort only for China.

national effort only... further wartime effort is going to cause A lot of trouble, including a general economic collapse. So National effort only for China.

Works for me. I'm just happy to be able to rebuild my economy from the war so I'll take any break I can get.

Yay I get Thailand!!!!

too tired to finish tonight, but need to finish South America and the rest of Europe (Italy, Scandic Union, Bulgaria plus the Swiss I suppose)

then I will check for anything I missed.

forgot to add Burgundy, since fixed


fairly sure I got everybody, but let me know if anything important is missing (Middle Snu, please check this for me)

Some nations did not have their 1944 budgets done completely, but sufficient points were available for the adjustments made post war.

I will handle the NPC nations, but you PC nations are now ready to go as far as your economies go.

Parthini and others, I will not be available much today, if you need help, I suggest Middle Snu for advice, or Malkyer or Safehaven2

1944 budgets were at the cut spending level for practically everyone, as the voters were rather insistent in democratic states. Some (listed as National Effort which is actually peacetime spending in this case) were able to get the voters to allow spending at a higher level.

Most were not. Any growth gained was actually plowed into repairs or the UN or LTA relief budgets, of which sizeable amounts of help went to the most damaged nations.

US economy 1945
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10372771&postcount=574

The US is starting its Postwar economic boom.

44 Points to Spend:

Domestic Spending:
Level 5 Social Services in Australia and New Zealand--5 points
Level 1 Social Services to Islands and New Guinea--1 point
Level 2 Social Services to Indonesia = 6 points (ooc: this is why big populations SUCK)
Subtotal = 12 points

Military Upkeep:
2 Cruisers--1 point
20 Destroyers--1 point
4 Pilots at Expert Level--1 point
HQ Unit--1 point
4 Garrison Units at Average level--1 point
2 Light Marine Brigades (highly trained)--1 point
1 Airborne Brigade (highly trained)--0.5 points
Airforce (1 jet fighter, 1 light bomber, 1 fighter-bomber, 1 transport)--1.25 points

Please note 10 outdated Submarines have been scrapped and 2 battlecruisers have been retired to parks in Sydney and Perth
Subtotal = 7.75 points

Builds:
1 Merchant Marine = 5 points

Other:
19 points of aid to China

12+7.75+5+19 = 43.75 points spent (+0.25 allocated to advertising in China and India of immigration opportunities--see new Australian Thread) = 44

Korea and Vladivostok Protected City:

Population 33 million
Tech level 6.5
Constitutional Monarchy
Market Economy, peacetime

Production centers: Seoul 3 Pusan 1 Pyongyang 1, Vladivostok 2, 10 shipping units, 1 national airline

144 points to spend

Level 4 social spending- 15 points

Foreign Aid-
24 points to China (food, industrial aid, Bank of Korea low-interest loans)
24 points to FAS (food, industrial aid, Bank of Korea low-interest loans)
24 points to Germany (Bank of Korea loans)


Korean Armed Forces

Korean Army:

2 infantry division .5 points
2 mountain infantry brigades .5 points

Korean Air Force:

1 F86 fighter unit –.5 points
2 Corsair fighter bomber units .25 points
1 C47 transport unit .25
4 expert pilots 1 point

Korean Navy:

1 Light Cruiser, .5 matenance
1 Destroyer Squadron, .25 matenance

Total: 5 points. Two obsolete submarine units are being disbanded, due to postwar budget cuts.

Things to buy-

2 group of attack submarines (modernizing existing submarine stocks as part of a two year program)-10 points

1 Production Center near Pyongyang-24 points

1 HQ unit- 10 points

1 Parachute Brigade unit- 2 points

USEA 1945 build

Population: 40 million
Tech level: 6
Government: Social Democracy
Economy: Captalist [Peace time {3% growth}]

Economic budget: 21 points (Production centers: Hanoi 2, Saigon, 2, Vientene 2, Pnomh Penh 1, Bangkok 1. Commerce: 1x National Airline 2, 10x Shipping Units 10 [5,000,000 million tons]. Natural Growth: 1 )

Domestic:

Level 3 Social spending- 12 points

1x Shipping unit (500,000 tons)- 2 points [To be completed next year]


Military:


Maintenace:
4 infantry corps 2 points,
1 parachute brigade .25 points,
1 HQ unit 1 point,
1 marine light infantry brigade .25 points,
2 flak groups .5 points,
1 mechanized infantry division .5 points.
-
1 F84 fighter bomber unit .5 points,
1 C47 transport unit .25 points,
1 AD1 Skyraider light bomber unit .25 points,
3 expert pilots .75 points,
-
1 light ship unit (10 destroyers) .25 points,
2 light ship units (40 corvettes) .5 points,

TOTAL= 7




I think that should be about right.

Also GB could we have the info on rural eletrification put up again please.

Gran Colombia (Colombia, Venezuela, Panama, Ecuador, Surinam, Guyana, French Guyana, Martinique, Guadeloupe)
Population: 14 million
Tech level 6.5
Production centers: Panama 5, Cartegena 2, Mariacoba 2, Caracas 2, Bogota 3
Oil Points: 6 Oil Points from Venezuela
Special: 6 points from Panama Canal, 2 points from Ecuador (cash crops and minerals), 1 point from Surinam (minerals), 1 point from Guyana (cash crops)

1944 budget: 42 points + 14 more from national effort + 34 points from International Trade = 90p

Level 5 social spending 7 points, remainder available for military and relief efforts (83 points)

Upkeep/Military (Im paying for level 7, because it saves me time in the long run, and I don't care.):
6 x Mechanized Divisions = 6p (Elite Training)
4 x Armoured Divisions = 4p (Elite Training)
10 x Mountain Brigades = 5p (Elite Training)
1 x Mechanized Artillery = .5p
2 x HQ Unit = 2p
1 x Theatre Supply Unit = .5p
10 x Jet Fighters (Me-17) = 5p
1 x Jet Light Bomber (B57) = 1p
2 x Flak Artillery = .5p
2 x Carrier Jet Fighter Units = .5p
1 x Carrier Light Bomber Units = .25p
3 x Fleet Carrier Battlegroup= 3p (Vincente Sewell, Dario Echandia, Francisco de Paula Santander)
2 x Cruiser = 1p (Manuel Ancizar and Alberto Lleras Camargo)
3 x Light Ships (15 Destroyers) = .75p
14 x Pilots Upgrade = 7p (Elite Training)
Total Cost: 36p

Builds (47p remaining)
2 x Cruiser upgrade to Heavy Missile Cruiser (4p total)
3 x Fleet Carrier Battlegroup upgrade to use Jet Aircraft (6p)
1 x Frigate Flotilla = 5p
1 x Frigate Flotilla = 5p
24p to Advanced RADAR and Electronic Communications Research
3p to Reserve

Gran Colombia Builds (47p remaining)
2 x Cruiser upgrade to Heavy Missile Cruiser (4p total)
3 x Fleet Carrier Battlegroup upgrade to Heavy Carrier Battlegroup (6p)
1 x Frigate Flotilla = 5p
1 x Frigate Flotilla = 5p
24p to Supersonic Aircraft Research
3p to Reserve

don't need to conduct the supersonic aircraft research, as the US provided you with its own. Fleet carrier doesn't become a heavy carrier, just a fleet carrier (jet capable).

Heavy carriers are 60,000 - 90,000 tons
fleet carriers are 30,000 - 50,000 tons.

USEA 1945 build

Population: 40 million
Also GB could we have the info on rural eletrification put up again please.

Rural electrification costs the same as level 1 social service spending for 2 years. So 4 points in 1945 and 4 points in 1946 will do it. Provides a 10% bump (in your case, would add 1.6 or round up to 2 production centers, 1 each for Phomh Penh, Cambodia and Vientene, Laos (the most rural areas)

44 Points to Spend:

Please note 10 outdated Submarines have been scrapped and 2 battlecruisers have been retired to parks in Sydney and Perth
Subtotal = 7.75 points

you might want to keep the submarines until you replace them to maintain the capability.

Also, your political opposition isn't happy about inviting in a "bunch of wogs" (to use the terminology of the day) into Australia. Remember, Australia kept a whites only immigration policy well into the 1960s. You will need to come up with a good reason to change that.

If I understand correctly, I have 6 points, minus .75 for maintenance. So, with my 5.25, can I buy 3 Infantry divisions and 100 average fighters?

OOC:

I can't post my build yet until I know what other aid I'm recieving (if any) from the UK, South Africa, and other nations.



EDIT:

China (includes Manchuria, Mongolia, Formosa, Hainan)

Income: 20 points from industry + 34 points from commerce + 5 from Japan (59 points total)

China declares National Effort. Income is revised to 79 points total.

Expeditures:

7 points for military maintainence.
49 points for Level I social services.

Remaining points: 23 points

------------------------

Therefore this is where I need to know what foreign aid and how much of it I'm recieving this year so I can add these points to the amount I have to "spend" on factory rebuilding.

Scandinavian Union-Normal Spending
33 prod centers-66 points+34 commerce points

30 points maintainence(Writing up military now)
6 point-lv 3 social
24 nuke research
36- repair 3 prod centers in Petrograd(2 remain)
2 point- upgrade cruiser to missile cruiser
2 points-upgrade motorized corp to armored

Two things- Prod centers give off 2 points in peacetime but because I have so many prod centers I have more points than the pop limit, shouldn't affect my build because if needed I could just go national effort. Also, do I get any points, like Colombia does from the Panama Canal, from owning the routes Russian trade would have to take to get to the Baltic or Atlantic and vice versa? Also for the Kiel Canal?

Scandinavian Union-Normal Spending
33 prod centers-66 points+34 commerce points

30 points maintainence(Writing up military now)
6 point-lv 3 social
24 nuke research
36- repair 3 prod centers in Petrograd(2 remain)
4 points-reserved

Two things- Prod centers give off 2 points in peacetime but because I have so many prod centers I have more points than the pop limit, shouldn't affect my build because if needed I could just go national effort. Also, do I get any points, like Colombia does from the Panama Canal, from owning the routes Russian trade would have to take to get to the Baltic or Atlantic and vice versa? Also for the Kiel Canal?

remember, when you hit tech level 7 next year you will have a higher limit

also, technically, the Kattegatt is considered international waters. Something I never mentioned during the war, but the Keil canal isn't wide enough for some of those super battleships the Union built. Not that it was a real concern, and I figured mentioning it would have just pissed them off... not that it mattered eventually.