NationStates Jolt Archive

If I stay in this RP, I will hit something devastating to you, Amestria. Believe that.

If I stay in this RP, I will hit something devastating to you, Amestria. Believe that.

Define devastating... Because I doubt your 24 troops could do as much damage as the SF bombing raids/Artillery strikes...

Actually, a take that back. It'll be fun just randomly hitting your troops and pissing them off.

Actually, a take that back. It'll be fun just randomly hitting your troops and pissing them off.

Yes it would, just edit the post so they are flown into Olympia...

Now take a gander, Ames. Pleased yet? Or do I need to put my guys in too-toos also?

Your sarcasm is quaint and the post is fine…

Kahanistan, there is an Xirnium agent holding a gun on Kimblee and that agent had announced his pressence...

Read Xirniums post...

I posted Kimblees response to the Xirnium agent and now Xirnium says that happens after the Kahanistan soldier reacts to Kimblee's remarks about the Xirnium agent...

:confused: What is happening now?

Since Kahanistan has modified his post to correct the timeline I will too, and all shall be good.

Amestria, if your intelligence officer can transmit information, and presumably the Kahanistanians can as well, then so can the Inquisition.

Besides, I understand that jamming works on receivers, not transmitters.

Inquisition transmission devices use enhanced spread spectrum modulation systems that are not suseptible to the general jamming that you claim to have over Torontia. Perhaps, if you are lucky, you may prevent them from recieving orders from the High Council, but preventing them from transmitting reports is impossible.

The Amestrian is transmitting on a short wave within BC; your agent is sending information across countries...

In addition, I understand that one can block the frequencies used to transmit information...

Besides, how is that magical device transmitting anyway, is it satellite or digital or radio? There is no internet in BC and all radio signals are surpressed (whether from BC to Xirnium or from BC to a satellite...)

Inquisition transmission devices use enhanced spread spectrum modulation systems that are not suseptible to the general jamming that you claim to have over Torontia.

Mind describing it in a way that I can understand, please dispense with the tech-no-babble...

And saying it is highly advanced is no answer as my forces could easily have a counter in place.

all radio signals are surpressed
Explain how. You can't physically stop radio transmissions from going in all directions. You can jam receivers by transmitting signals that overide any others, but you can't stop transmitters.

Explain how. You can't physically stop radio transmissions from going in all directions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_jamming

That's nice, notice this:

"A transmitter, tuned to the same frequency as the opponents receiving equipment and with the same type of modulation, can with enough power override any signal at the receiver."

Since you aren't jamming the Synod's receivers, all is well.

Amestria is jamming the frequency they would use to receive the information.

Besides, how does that little thing transmit accoss continents?

The synods reciever will recieve nothing but static or garbled code from BC... The reciever is not being directly jammed but every radio frequency is!

every radio frequency is!
It is not, because if it were Amestrians inside Torontia could not communicate with the outside world. You can't jam every frequency. That means that a frequency hopping and spread spectrum transmission can defeat it.

Xirnium and Kahan, TG's. Amestria, prepare for a transmissions directly from the Chairwoman of the Commonwealth.

Amestria, prepare for a transmissions directly from the Chairwoman of the Commonwealth.
You can't, they're jamming everything! :rolleyes:

It is not, because if it were Amestrians inside Torontia could not communicate with the outside world. You can't jam every frequency. That means that a frequency hopping and spread spectrum transmission can defeat it.

It would take a little more then, one click, and the whole world knows... And frequency hopping and spread spectrum transmission takes time (you are fighting the information warfare equipment of a Million man army, you can't just go click the whole world knows...)

And for your information, the Amestrian forces in BC comunicate to the outside world through a few official phone lines...

You can't, they're jamming everything! :rolleyes:

ONLY IN BC! BC transmissions have been jammed since the rebellion...

ONLY IN BC! BC transmissions have been jammed since the rebellion...
Fine, then they transmit over shortwave to every agent in Torontia who then transmit to the Synod. Same result.

frequency hopping and spread spectrum transmission takes time (you are fighting the information warfare equipment of a Million man army, you can't just go click the whole world knows...)

I don't see why this should be the case, the Inquisition has the resources to use frequency hopping and spread spectrum transmission devices. The common Torontian's do, but the largest intelligence organisation in Xirnium does.

Xirnium and Kahan, TG's. Amestria, prepare for a transmissions directly from the Chairwoman of the Commonwealth.

All Amestria wants is guarantees that the SF forces cannot be used for offensive operations...

Fine, then they transmit over shortwave to every agent in Torontia who then transmit to the Synod. Same result.

No, because the signals from BC are being jammed, the agents else where just get static or garbled code...

No, because the signals from BC are being jammed, the agents else where just get static or garbled code...

Do you remeber saying this:

The Amestrian is transmitting on a short wave within BC

If he can do it, we can too.

Within BC, Within BC, that changes nothing...

All Amestria wants is guarantees that the SF forces cannot be used for offensive operations...
Well you know they won't be, but you won't get that guarantee. After the combined assaults of the Yallak and Amestrian armies...and the subsequent withdrawl of Yallak ground forces back to the OP, Amestria is lucky to get any chance of peace.

Amestria, if you can transmit within BC then you can transmit out, and from there to the rest of the world.

Well you know they won't be, but you won't get that guarantee. After the combined assaults of the Yallak and Amestrian armies...and the subsequent withdrawl of Yallak ground forces back to the OP, Amestria is lucky to get any chance of peace.

As Amestria has two million troops in Torontia I somehow doubt they would lose an all out battle...

Amestria, if you can transmit within BC then you can transmit out, and from there to the rest of the world.

On short frequancies within the BC province, you can not transmit out of BC (even the Amestrian Military can't)

On short frequancies within the BC province, you can not transmit out of BC (even the Amestrian Military can't)

You've not explained why you can transmit shortwave inside BC but not out.

Assuming the black arrows represent short range frequencies that you can transmit within BC, why wouldn’t this allow you to get a message to the outside world?

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/Dennis134/diagram.jpg

You've not explained why you can transmit shortwave inside BC but not out.

Assuming the black arrows represent short range frequencies that you can transmit within BC, why wouldn’t this allow you to get a message to the outside world?

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/Dennis134/diagram.jpg

All waves from BC to the outside world are being jammed, but shortwave signals inside BC are not being jammed, the signal would be blocked at inquesitor three...

All waves from BC to the outside world are being jammed, but shortwave signals inside BC are not being jammed, the signal would be blocked at inquesitor three...

That is absolutely ridiculous and with no feasible explanantion. You jam frequencies, not their destinations. If shortwaves are not jammed inisde BC then they aren't jammed at all.

No matter, Inquisitor 2 will walk a little bit and then transmit. In the interest of ending this argument.

SF, you are not going to continue the war without negotiating?

No matter, Inquisitor 2 will walk a little bit and then transmit.

Inquisitor 2 would have to leave BC... That takes time as well...

Instant communication between the agents and their headquarters is not going to happen...

He gets out of BC, somehow, he can transmit without problems...

As Amestria has two million troops in Torontia I somehow doubt they would lose an all out battle...
Sure they have two million troops in Torontia, but I can increase my troops numbers quite easily. And with my forces on the defensive, and the Torontians on the defensive, your couple troops that are not swarming over the coasts or suffocating BC can be easily wiped out if they tried to enter any built up area.

Sure they have two million troops in Torontia, but I can increase my troops numbers quite easily. And with my forces on the defensive, and the Torontians on the defensive, your couple troops that are not swarming over the coasts or suffocating BC can be easily wiped out if they tried to enter any built up area.

Reenforce your troops quite easly? I could just sink the ships comming to reenforce your positions...

Also, reenforcements would take awhile...

Attempt to sink them. I dare you. You will just begin digging yourself a huge whole. With two million troops deployed to Torontia, it doesn't leave you very many of your eligible military population left to man your navy, your air force and your other land forces plus logistical units and police forces.

SF, respond to my IC TG regarding my assistance. It involves Hailandkill...

Attempt to sink them. I dare you. You will just begin digging yourself a huge whole. With two million troops deployed to Torontia, it doesn't leave you very many of your eligible military population left to man your navy, your air force and your other land forces plus logistical units and police forces.

Hey genius, Amestria has over 1,500,000,000 million people and has had a draft in place for months in case there were additional conflicts...and one million of the troops are Torontian...

Amestria has millions more troops to spare.

And its a moot point because Amestria has agreed to the ceasefire...

Amestria, until you can give me a halfway credible reason for why you seem to have the magical ability to jam all shortwave signals from BC to the outside world and yet leave those from BC to within BC unjammed then I am assuming my transmission hopped all the way out of BC and then to the Synod.

You don't have some mysterious energy barrier blocking transmissions out of BC. Either shortwave is blocked or it isn't, and since you yourself have said it is not blcoked then there is nothing more to talk about.

Amestria, until you can give me a halfway credible reason for why you seem to have the magical ability to jam all shortwave signals from BC to the outside world and yet leave those from BC to within BC unjammed then I am assuming my transmission hopped all the way out of BC and then to the Synod.

The transmissions within BC are not touched if they are military (there is a communications blackout to prevent radio communication between rebel groups, if any are left), but all those leaving BC are blocked (short and long)... A signal within BC is not viewed as threatening while a signal from BC to whereever is... I see no reason why the short range signals leaving BC could not be blocked as the jamming would be the same...

And you have still not provided me with the details on how those tricorder things work...

The transmissions within BC are not touched, but all those leaving BC are blocked (short and long)... A signal within BC is not viewed as threatening while a signal from BC to whereever is... I see no reason why the short range signals leaving BC could not be blocked as the jamming would be the same...

Impossible. You have a very few options. Jam HiFreq, VHF, UHF, or all three. Unless your jammer has some FT Artificial Intelligence chip in it, you really can't just block the channels leaving BC. Note that jamming isn't 100% effective. Freq Hopping and signal bursts are usually pretty good ways to break a jam.

The transmissions within BC are not touched, but all those leaving BC are blocked (short and long)... A signal within BC is not viewed as threatening while a signal from BC to whereever is... I see no reason why the short range signals leaving BC could not be blocked as the jamming would be the same...
I'm sorry, but that's all gibberish. You block frequencies. Your jamming stations cannot tell where a signal is going and see if it as "threatening" or not, and then jam certain waves and not others. Its preposterous.

And you have still not provided me with the details on how those tricorder things work...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spread_spectrum

Using frequency hoping and spread spectrum does not qualify my transmitters as "tricorders"

Impossible. You have a very few options. Jam HiFreq, VHF, UHF, or all three. Unless your jammer has some FT Artificial Intelligence chip in it, you really can't just block the channels leaving BC. Note that jamming isn't 100% effective. Freq Hopping and signal bursts are usually pretty good ways to break a jam.

I am not saying the jam is unbeatable, a concentrated effort could best it... I just doubt the Xirnium agents have the time or equipment to do so...

And Artifical Intelligence in PMT (Kraven has cyborgs and Xirnium supermen with tricorders, and Amestria can't have a sophisticated information warfare system that can pose a reasonable barrier to communications?)

1.5 billion allows for an absolute maximum of roughly 150 million military personnel during wartime (most will be unable to take part off the mainland). That's 10% of your population. Such a level of active personnel cannot be continued for very long without effecting the economy. A figure of 5% or 75 million is a bit more realistic for a level of high alertness while 2% or 30 million is apparently the standard for most nations over a billion. Realistically however, China with a population of 1.3 billion has a military force of just over 2 million (0.0015%),and India with a population of just over 1 billion has a total manpower of 1.3 million (0.0013%).

So you see, having such large numbers isnt exactly as realistic as youd like to think, nor is it possible to keep such a large force trained, organized, deployed, supplied, armed, equipped, supported and based. However for NS' sake, i can see having millions of troops. Just a little food for thought.

Xirnium supermen
In practise the Inquisitors are RPed no different from any other elite soldier. More realistically then some, I might say, you don't see them taking on ten men at once or shots to the body without going down.

with tricorders,
Substantiate that, please. Sophisticated transmission systems are tricorders? Small fax machines are tricorders? Electronic organisers are tricorders?

1.5 billion allows for an absolute maximum of roughly 150 million military personnel during wartime (most will be unable to take part off the mainland). That's 10% of your population. Such a level of active personnel cannot be continued for very long without effecting the economy. A figure of 5% or 75 million is a bit more realistic for a level of high alertness while 2% or 30 million is apparently the standard for most nations over a billion. Realistically however, China with a population of 1.3 billion has a military force of just over 2 million (0.0015%),and India with a population of just over 1 billion has a total manpower of 1.3 million (0.0013%).

So you see, having such large numbers isnt exactly as realistic as youd like to think, nor is it possible to keep such a large force trained, organized, deployed, supplied, armed, equipped, supported and based. However for NS' sake, i can see having millions of troops. Just a little food for thought.

I never said my standing troop levels were as high as 30 million, I would say somewhere over 10 million standing at present (one million in Torontia)...not counting reserves.

Oh, and Ching only spends 60 billion on military matters (slightly more if you factor in their secret projects)... While Amestria spends two trillion...

You take everything to the extreme...

I am not saying the jam is unbeatable, a concentrated effort could best it... I just doubt the Xirnium agents have the time or equipment to do so...

And Artifical Intelligence in PMT (Kraven has cyborgs and Xirnium supermen with tricorders, and Amestria can't have a sophisticated information warfare system that can pose a reasonable barrier to communications?)

Okay, let's say you wanted to jam all possible freqs on the UHF transmitters. There's roughly 13 million freqs in UHF for use. If he's smart, he's freq hopping through a set number of these freqs. Yeah, there's a randomizer for hopping, which makes it look completely random but it's actually a set code. The only way you'd actually stand a chance in successfully jamming a complete transmission would be to break his randomizer code, and jam all the freqs he's using. Otherwise, you try jamming as many freqs as you can on the UHF. It'll blow your system. And if he's using the burst method it'd be even harder, as he'd shoot out a signal, and then the next transmission would be a whole different set of freqs.

HF is a lot easier, though. Only 84,XXX freqs. More for VHF, but I don't really remember.

But as for an AI system capable of tracking and jamming his systems, I suppose you could try, but it would be time consuming, trying to find his transmissions, decoding his transmission, comprehending it to see if it's evil or not, and then jamming it. Chances are it'd already be out of there. But go ahead, this is your tea-party. Just making some input.

SF: TG. Please respond ASAP, and in the IC thread, accordingly.

We are talking about a Military system...sigh

Xirnium, can you at least post on your agents being frustrated and having to spend a great deal of time transmitting the information out of BC... The jamming system may be imperfect and unable to stop the transmissions, but it should be an aknowledged barrier that has to be overcome...

currently replying to it.

We are talking about a Military system...sigh

Xirnium, can you at least post on your agents being frustrated and having to spend a great deal of time transmitting the information out of BC... The jamming system may be imperfect and unable to stop the transmissions, but it should be an aknowledged barrier that has to be overcome...

I just showed you an, in my opinion needlessly complex, "hoping system" that my Inquisitors need to go through just to get that message out. How much more frustrating could it be then needing to "leap-frog" a message out of Torontia, through more then half a dozen agents?

The Inquisition has very few agents, they are extremely frustrated that so many are being wasted in Torontia for a cause they care nothing about. Does that make you feel better? :D

I'm certainly not suggesting that they've just come in and beaten everything with ease, this is a vast drain on stretched resources.

We are talking about a Military system...sigh

Xirnium, can you at least post on your agents being frustrated and having to spend a great deal of time transmitting the information out of BC... The jamming system may be imperfect and unable to stop the transmissions, but it should be an aknowledged barrier that has to be overcome...

I'm simply talking from my experience with the stuff and what I was taught. I'm no subject matter expert by any means, I'm just giving my knowledge. And Xirnium, that proposal does sound right. He may not be able to jam it completely, but you're still going to have a time avoiding his jammers.

Since we have taken up over one page argueing about radio signals, you might as well do a post on the specifics of the leap frogging...

sorry for being unneccessarly difficult...

SC, believe me, we really appriciate your assistence in this matter as someone expierenced...

Look, you said you don't jam shortwave, right?

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/Dennis134/diagram.jpg

So I "leap-frog" the message out of your radio blocking zone to where it can be transmitted long distance.

Anything wrong with that? Sniper Country, feel free to jump in here if you see a problem.

SC, posted and sent a TG.

Look, you said you don't jam shortwave, right?

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a25/Dennis134/diagram.jpg

So I "leap-frog" the message out of your radio blocking zone to where it can be transmitted long distance.

Anything wrong with that? Sniper Country, feel free to jump in here if you see a problem.

Seems oddly pointless to me...

Well, between your men you'd need it to be a flat area, like, only trees and small stuff blocking the way. If there's a large hill or mountain, or even a tall building in the direct path of the signal, you can hang it up. That signal is designed to go straight from the transmitter to the receiver. The longrange is designed to go up, hit a sattelite, and come back down (or bounce of the atmpsphere, but that's slightly more technical), allowing it to "jump" over mountains and such.

Even so, if he's still jamming on your freqs, be it HF, VHF, or UHF, and you're freq hopping, there will be a few seconds where your transmission will be hanging there in the open. Especially if you have a wide range of freqs you are hopping. If you're hopping a relatively few number of freqs, it will be easier to send and receive, but easier also for him to jam. It's give and take. Chances.

SF, respond to my IC TG regarding my assistance. It involves Hailandkill...
Well, SF?

SEA, a ceasefire is in effect, so you can cease being passive aggressive...

I know, but that TG was before the ceasefire agreement, and since I'm not using fluid time, I'm waiting for an answer. The armed forces would never arrive...

Just because there is a cease-fire doesn't mean it will hold. The last one didn't. We still sit in the same position...two governments....one effective, one belligerant. Until the Provisional Government or whatever it is you control, is folded, the Interm Government of Torontia will remain the ruling party over Torontia. Expect some "rulings" that effect Amestrian occupied Torontia from the Interm government.

Like hell, the TPG has been very effective (and has 100% control over 100% of its territory, which is more then can be said for the TIG).

The TIG can make as many rulings as it wants, they will be ignored by the TPG.

So far, the TPG has withstood two insurgencies, one mass epidemic, raids from hostile foreign powers, and two wars... Its not going anywhere, it is in Torontia to stay…

Yes but it allowed the outbreak of two insurgencies, a mass epidemic, raids from foreign powers and two wars to happen.

The Interm Government of Torontia or IGT (please note the proper abbreviation) has been invaded by 2 completely numerically superior enemies and has beaten them back, one of them being you. It has not taken part in atrocities...at least any that were made public (they are careful with such things), nor has it deliberately targeted civilians in its attacks. It has, in a short period of time, got the Torontian economy back on its feet, rebuilt the healthcare system and established trade and foreign relations...unlike anything the TPG has done.

The TPG also rebuilt its section of the Torontian economy and social system... And Yallak withdrew because of Xirniums meddling, so do not say you defeated him...

Also, the outbreaks of violence started before the TPG had those areas under control...

The TPG has also held elections...

It has, in a short period of time, got the Torontian economy back on its feet, rebuilt the healthcare system and established trade and foreign relations...unlike anything the TPG has done.

Do not take your propaganda too seriously; Amestria has also done extensive rebuilding...

Since this is a military conflict, what lessons have you all learned people? Are you all gonna sharpen your technology up to more 'NS grade' standards, and have you made better strategies to overcome your foes?

you have not posted any rebuilding...you have only said you have rebuilt. anyways, TG.

you have not posted any rebuilding...you have only said you have rebuilt. anyways, TG.

I have posted rebuilding and I will provide the links...

Here are some of the posts which mention rebuilding in the Amestrian Zone:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9940066&postcount=4

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9928015&postcount=729

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9914787&postcount=688

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9900417&postcount=569

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9958372&postcount=147

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9885718&postcount=281

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9959371&postcount=60

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9920603&postcount=709

Seems oddly pointless to me...

Very well, I’ll go with the original plan then, using adaptive frequency hoping over large range and with burst transmissions, which is what you recommended.

Since this is a military conflict, what lessons have you all learned people? Are you all gonna sharpen your technology up to more 'NS grade' standards, and have you made better strategies to overcome your foes?
Well? And SF, respond to my TG!

First link:
The Torontian military was rebuilt. That's the first thing you did. Crime is extremely high and the measures you have implemented are insufficient. Somehow effective social services are being provided. Contradiction, I think do.

Second link:
The civilians have ration cards which is the result of a food shortage. The Amestrians have been too busy with the military aspect and have neglected to feed the Torontians. Military doctors providing care for civilians is just another example. Military doctors are generally used for combat related injuries, not diseases and illness like ear infections and chicken pox. Maybe instead of paying Torontian doctors, the money would be better spent training and developing new ones and proper medical facilities?

Third link:
A reduced curfew. If crime is low and there is no threat of violence, why is there still a curfew?

Fourth link:
More military expansion. A couple shed are built and broken window fixed.

Fifth link:
Only conditions 1 and 6 were met.

Sixth link:
Refers to the Commonwealth forces as rebels and restricts travel. Restricts the political freedoms of the Torontians by prohibiting parties and people from running. Setting up commissions is all well and good, but does nothing for the people of Torontia when they need food.

Seventh link:
All you did was announce to give 2 billion. You didn't start rebuilding, you just said "Here, I'll give you 2 billion dollars to rebuild" if I were you, I'd ask where the hell my money went!

Eighth link:
You finally lifted martial law in the OP but then implemented it and a curfew on BC.

You have not rebuilt much. Western Torontia is still the pile of shit it was before you arrived, now only the Torontians are equipped with modern, military weapons.

And whats this about Sarz having an ignore on Mckagan?
There was a dogpile/counter-dogpile involving Leafanistan and McKagan that resulted in the ruining of the rp, or so Sarzonia says, along with Halberdgardia. Can someone please send me the link to that thread so that I can read for myself what things went wrong there?

I posted on the spending of 30 billion...

And SF, why don't you provide me with some of your rebuilding posts so I can pick them apart?

First link:
Fifth link:
Only conditions 1 and 6 were met.


Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong!

Red Tide paid the money and it was spent!

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9959222&postcount=155

Link 1: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9869841&postcount=8
The Holy Empire of Saint Fedski plans elections in one year's time. Currently one month away. Contracts are opened to nations to start rebuilding Torontia.

Link 2: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9871490&postcount=24
The first official message from Governor Sean Keane. Asserts Saint Fedskian dominance in the region. The positions and goals of that statement have changed very little between then and now.

Link 3: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9872062&postcount=25
Czardas recognizes Saint Fedski has the primary contributor to peace in Torontia by announcing the same goals as Governor Keane and giving $10 billion to Torontia.

Link 4: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9872062&postcount=25
The Holy Empire of Saint Fedski lays down the law and establishes its quest for peace. The main point in the argument, stays true to this day.

Link 5: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9884821&postcount=257
International passenger flights are resumed and local airfields are opened to Torontian Civilains and the future is outlined, rather briefly.

Link 6: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9884821&postcount=258
Plans for a brand new hospital are laid.

Link 7: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9885704&postcount=280
The beginning of the first peace conference.

Link 8: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9885821&postcount=284
North Saint Clair (A member of the Commonwealth) landed engineering units and search and rescue teams.

Link 9: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9890094&postcount=347
Seminars and conferences are held to increase the awareness of the Torontian citizens

Link 10: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9895045&postcount=473
This states that the bunker complex is nearing completion. Also, if Amestria wishes to try to invade Olympia again, they will have to deal with this.

Link 11: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9895697&postcount=476
The Nuclear Facility has been brought back to life.

Link 12: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9910666&postcount=641
Reestablishment of Industry

That's all I'm going to search for. If its really that important to you, you can search for the rest and pick them apart.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong!

Red Tide paid the money and it was spent!

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9959222&postcount=155
Where's the apology and where's the transfer of cash?

SF, now can you respond to my TG?

am doing it right now!

-Snip- (Saint Fedski government talks allot and passes out cash. Amestria's done the same.)


Link 5: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9884821&postcount=257
International passenger flights are resumed and local airfields are opened to Torontian Civilains and the future is outlined, rather briefly.
After the fall of the First Insurgant group until the Virus attack the Vancouver Airport was running all flights.


Link 6: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9884821&postcount=258
Plans for a brand new hospital are laid.
I think everyone was rebuilding things like hospitals.


Link 7: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9885704&postcount=280
The beginning of the first peace conference.
That failed


Link 8: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9885821&postcount=284
North Saint Clair (A member of the Commonwealth) landed engineering units and search and rescue teams.

Link 9: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9890094&postcount=347
Seminars and conferences are held to increase the awareness of the Torontian citizens I think everyone did this also.


Link 10: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9895045&postcount=473
This states that the bunker complex is nearing completion. Also, if Amestria wishes to try to invade Olympia again, they will have to deal with this.

And how would that help Torontia after it was all over?


Link 11: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9895697&postcount=476
The Nuclear Facility has been brought back to life.
AND THE SUPLUS NUCLEAR MATERIAL STOLEN BY SAINT FEDSKI!!!


Link 12: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9910666&postcount=641
Reestablishment of Industry
Again normal things that would happen anyway.


That's all I'm going to search for. If its really that important to you, you can search for the rest and pick them apart.
Saint Fedski has done nothing more nor less than the other factions you just made sure to brag about it all the time so you have proof.

You see this is a thing called Role Playing. I have been told that you do not assume very often in role playing. since this RP is based on rebuilding Torontia, it only makes sense that there are many posts regarding the rebuilding of Torontia.

So let me tear you a new asshole as well, asshole.

Saint Fedski government talks allot and passes out cash. Amestria's done the same.
Saint Fedski doesn't pass out cash. Instead it constructs stuff so it knows the cash doesnt go to waste.


After the fall of the First Insurgant group until the Virus attack the Vancouver Airport was running all flights.
Where's the post that says that? Up until I opened the airport, there were no commercial flights in or out of Torontia.


I think everyone was rebuilding things like hospitals.
Show me a post that says other people have built hospitals.


I think everyone did this also.
Nobody else made posts of that sort. The only posts even close were draft notices and announcements.


And how would that help Torontia after it was all over?
It would provide a safe area for the Government to call home. In case of an Amestrian or Yallak attack. If there was an attack, the government would be able to withstand the initial pounding and then escape through the tunnels, much like Tanakis did.


AND THE SUPLUS NUCLEAR MATERIAL STOLEN BY SAINT FEDSKI!!!
The surplus nuclear material was secured by Saint Fedski. Nothing has been moved from said location. I know that because it hasn't been RP'd.


Again normal things that would happen anyway.
There was no RPing of that sort. Once again, the RP is to rebuild Torontia, not to assume it was rebuilt and then fight over it.


Saint Fedski has done nothing more nor less than the other factions you just made sure to brag about it all the time so you have proof.
Saint Fedski has done much more than anyone else. To prove it, keep going through the 2 threads. There are plenty more examples of SF rebuilding or fixing things.

I doubt everyone wanted to spend a post posting every single thing they did in roleplaying, if so it would take around 200 posts to discribel just repairing a city. I'm going by what most nations would do when they rebuild a nation. Do you really think that the RP could have gone this far if the Amestria part of Torontia was exactly in ruins as it began? Please I guess you want RPs to go like:

(Nation Paved a road today)
(Nation Paved another road)
(Nation turned power on in one building)
(Nation Paved another road)
(Nation Paved another road)
(Nation changed a lightbulb in a building)
Should we all RP that way? Would that make you happy? :headbang:

Where's the apology and where's the transfer of cash?

Where's the apology and where's the transfer of cash?

It happened and that was that. Ask Red Tide.

Also, there were commercial flights out of the Amestrian zone (they were all shut down during the virus). Amestria has constructed quite a bit in Torontia, its just I did not need to feel the need to post specifics. There are however many posts in which restructuring/rebuilding are referenced as well as Peacekeeping. I also posted that Amestria was paying for the entire Torontian Government and that the Torontian Ministry of Finance was controlled by Amestria so as to prevent corruption. (I also mentioned a great deal in the OOC thread on this subject).

Western Torontia is as economically well off as the SF zone (better even considering electronic equipment in Olympia and Seattle were fried, and Seattle’s airport wiped off the map.)

Several factors to consider:

1. As travel between Western and Eastern Torontia were restricted, there was no opportunity for economic exchange.

2. There would be a large degree of uncertainty, which would hamper investment. There would be a great deal of fear and worry for the future.

3. Eastern Torontia has many lawless areas...still...

4. In the post collapse world of Torontia crime went up (what do you expect when the government collapses and the threat of destruction advertised by a foreign power). That is why I posted on the crime, it is not because Amestrian forces were unable to prevent it or neglecting the rebuilding, and it is because crime is what the reality was. The crime rates of Western Torontia and Eastern Torontia were equal but now I consider Western Torontia's crime rate to be lower.

5. Do to the divided nature of the country, rationing of necessities is common sense. The Free Market would be unable to provide them under current conditions in a timely, reliable, and affordable manner. The TPG has the resources to provide its citizens with supplies directly. The citizens of Western Torontia have plenty of food.

6. Heavy industry is rare in Western Torontia because it is not economically feasible under current conditions, however, job creation programs have been enacted and the service sector and small business sectors are doing well considering the current climate of economic and political uncertainty...

So you see, the ITG never had that great of an economy to begin with and the TPG has engaged just as much in rebuilding. I consider SF's remarks meaningless OOC nitpicking (along the lines of when I had that dispute with Xirnium on the trial, my objections on similar grounds where nitpicking and naturally over-ruled) and as far as I am concerned, there has been extensive economic rebuilding/restructuring in Western Torontia.

Kahanistan, TG...

as far as I'm concerned, Amestria has not properly documented their "contributions" and "achievements" ICly. Only when confronted with the Saint Fedskian achievements did amestria post what they claim to have accomplished...and OOCly at that. With that said they have not happened. End of story.

as far as I'm concerned, Amestria has not properly documented their "contributions" and "achievements" ICly. Only when confronted with the Saint Fedskian achievements did amestria post what they claim to have accomplished...and OOCly at that. With that said they have not happened. End of story.

They have happened and I have posted a great deal on "rebuilding", end of story! (and that was before your "great claims" by the way) I have provided plenty of proof of a general atmosphere and policy of rebuilding...enough said...

Oh, and SF, here is the requested information. The Airport south of Port Angeles you mentioned is a closed civilian airport. There are no further Amestrian Military Airports near the SF lines (and if there were they are now being relocated).

As for depots and officers, Amestria has over 50 Lieutenant and Major Generals in Torontia (and one General of the Armies) and over two million troops to supply. There are depots everywhere and a Brigadier General or a Lieutenant Colonel is a dime a dozen, so it is okay if you post the location of a depot (provided you go over the details with me first…)

By the way SF, your economic claims are a moot point anyway, as the conflict would have demolished both economies through fear alone... but there were bombing campaigns also...

Xirnium, TG.

And Amestria...over 50 LT and Maj Generals? That would imply you have over 50 Corps and more than a couple armies in Torontia. Either way, a brig general would have a lot of information. so thats still the target.

One Major General per division... each Amestrian division has 20,000 soldiers (sometimes more)... An Amestrian Corps is 60,000 Soldiers, or three divisions...

Amestria has 50+ divisions in Torontia... So Amestria has about 16+ Corps in Torontia...

Do you have a factbook or an order of battle?

I am still working on my factbook and I do not have an order of battle (besides that which I have posted in Torontia)...

Just to point out for everyone, there are two TPG divisions on the border seperating the SF zone from BC, and they are fortified...

Just to point out for everyone, there are two TPG divisions on the border seperating the SF zone from BC, and they are fortified...
No there aren't. I asked you repeatedly to post exactly where your forces were, and you didnt. This announcement was only made when X radioed the SF base in Blaine.

No there aren't. I asked you repeatedly to post exactly where your forces were, and you didnt. This announcement was only made when X radioed the SF base in Blaine.

I posted that there were! Here is the link!

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10055959&postcount=207

I have also posted it on the OOC thread! I have repeatedly posted where my border forces have been stationed! They are there and they are fortified!

So are we allowed to make it complete hell in Eastern Torontia? We've been itching to try out some new toys. Well technically they are obsolete toys but damned if we aren't persuasive.

I posted that there were! Here is the link!

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10055959&postcount=207

I have also posted it on the OOC thread! I have repeatedly posted where my border forces have been stationed! They are there and they are fortified!
my mistake. I apologize.

my mistake. I apologize.

Your units would be shot down if they tried to enter BC airspace, there are over 100 SAMs in BC and 50 F-16s have been scrambled, I suggest you edit your posts...

and 50 F-16s have been scrambled

I find it very hard to believe that you can scramble 50 F-16s on a dime. A small group of Saint Fedksian assualt helicopters could be there long before your fighters have even been launched.

Kahanistan, between the BC border and the SF safezone are 40,000 entrenced TPG troops... and they are still miles from the border anyway, even using fluid time they would not arrive before the choppers got there...

if I am standing beside you and i strike out to punch you....with no warning or even looking. you dont have a chance of stopping it. The F-16+s and the aircraft are that punch. They are based less than 10 minutes away. The fighters would be there before you could say Saint Fedski sucks, and the helicopters would be there before you could say it twice. Not to mention they are at tree trop level, flying on the edge, if not below the RADAR umbrella. most AA defences, would be completely useless against the F-16+s at that point in time. The helicopters could be engaged by auto cannons, but would be long gone before they could be acquired and before the AA guns could be positioned to fire.

I find it very hard to believe that you can scramble 50 F-16s on a dime. A small group of Saint Fedksian assualt helicopters could be there long before your fighters have even been launched.

Then there are the 100 SAMs, which can and would be fired on a dime!

fire all the SAMs you want....they would be ineffective at such low altitudes. They would just give the SF CAP something to fire at.

if I am standing beside you and i strike out to punch you....with no warning or even looking. you dont have a chance of stopping it. The F-16+s and the aircraft are that punch. They are based less than 10 minutes away. The fighters would be there before you could say Saint Fedski sucks, and the helicopters would be there before you could say it twice. Not to mention they are at tree trop level, flying on the edge, if not below the RADAR umbrella. most AA defences, would be completely useless against the F-16+s at that point in time. The helicopters could be engaged by auto cannons, but would be long gone before they could be acquired and before the AA guns could be positioned to fire.

Then there is the Amestrian fleet patroling the BC coasts...

And then there is the fact that the Amestrian helocopters are closer, about three minutes away and sonic boom or not, they would arrive first!

I am angry for the following reasons!

1. SF in deploying his air units did not give the Amestrian airdefenses a chance to fire!

2. The Amestrian helocopters where already airborne and three minutes away. The SF helocopters had to take off and where ten minutes away. The same with the planes...

3. The BC border has 40,000 entrenced TPG troops and the defectors are still far from it!

And then there is the fact that the Amestrian helocopters are closer, about three minutes away and sonic boom or not, they would arrive first!

Despite the fact that the Xirniumites actually planned this extraction with the Saint Fedskians in advance and you have only just now learnt about an assualt on a Kahanistanian roadblock you claim your helicopters will get there sooner?

The SF choopers had to take off while the Amestrian ones where already airborne over BC! They would be fired upon by the airdefenses! And the Amestrian choopers are closer, period!

And the Amestrian choopers are closer, period!

We are right near Blaine, where are your nearest aerodromes?

I am angry for the following reasons!

1. SF in deploying his air units did not give the Amestrian airdefenses a chance to fire!

2. The Amestrian helocopters where already airborne and three minutes away. The SF helocopters had to take off and where ten minutes away. The same with the planes...

3. The BC border has 40,000 entrenced TPG troops and the defectors are still far from it!

1) The Amestrian Air Defences wouldn't have a chance to fire. Well they would, but they wouldn't hit anything.

2) The Amestrian helicopters are being boomed by the F-16s, I don't think they would be able to fly straight.

3)The roadblock is 20km north of the border. Which is only a couple minute car drive and much, much less for quick, agile helicopters and FAR FAR FAR less for a supersonic fighter. Hell the Leopard 2s could cover the distance in half an hour at half speed!

1) The Amestrian Air Defences wouldn't have a chance to fire. Well they would, but they wouldn't hit anything.

Does not matter, not giving my airdefenses a chance is godmoding, pure and simple!


2) The Amestrian helicopters are being boomed by the F-16s, I don't think they would be able to fly straight.

First, the helocopters are not altogether, second, how would the F-16s know where they where? Third, they would be at the roadblock before the SF craft could get there!

This is becoming annoying, Amestria. What possible reason could you have for your helicopters being right next to the Merkava? Saint Fedski has a reason for his helicopters being near at hand, we planned it after all. Amestria is in the dark, by rights they shouldn't even have been aware we were anywhere near this part of BC!

Spawning a frontline to stop me is one thing, and I can accept that. But magically having helicopters right on top of me is quite another.

If you want my 10 Defender 500s (6 armed with M134 7.62-mm 6x barrel, Gatling type twin MG pods and the other four armed with M260 2.75-in Hydra 70 rocket pods (7 or 12 each)) to engage your helicopters. We can do that. If you want my F-16+s to take out your aircraft. We can do that. It's better for your sake if there is no combat or you will lose 3 aircraft and quite possibly numerous SAM sites and front line postions. Then the war will have restarted and well...you know what will happen if the war restarts.

I posted that Amestrian helocopters where launched to search the area where the Xirniumite agents where believed to be hiding, then I posted on the Special Forces...

They took off before the SF and where over the general area... And may I remind you that the only proof I have that SF planned this with you is your word...

I am annoyed that SF has magically appeared to rescue the agents in the nick of time...

I posted that Amestrian helocopters where launched to search the area where the Xirniumite agents where believed to be hiding, then I posted on the Special Forces...

That "area where the Xirniumite agents where believed to be hiding" is BC, and BC is large. Are you telling me you have helicopters within 3 minutes of every position in BC?

how would the F-16s know where they where? They are flying at regular combat height which is available on RADAR. In the future, please, please, please note the details.

That "area" is BC, and BC is large. Are you telling me you have helicopters within 3 minutes of every position in BC?

Around the area where Kimblee was assualted, it does not take much brain power to guess the general area where the Xirniumites would be...

I am annoyed that SF has magically appeared to rescue the agents in the nick of time...
magically = quickly and effectively using the best equipment available for such missions.
Don't even get me started as to what I'm annoyed about.

If you want my 10 Defender 500s (6 armed with M134 7.62-mm 6x barrel, Gatling type twin MG pods and the other four armed with M260 2.75-in Hydra 70 rocket pods (7 or 12 each)) to engage your helicopters. We can do that. If you want my F-16+s to take out your aircraft. We can do that. It's better for your sake if there is no combat or you will lose 3 aircraft and quite possibly numerous SAM sites and front line postions. Then the war will have restarted and well...you know what will happen if the war restarts.

Your two planes against 50 enemy craft? And you are assuming the TPG troops don't have shoulder fired anti-helcopter weapondry...

Around the area where Kimblee was assualted, it does not take much brain power to guess the general area where the Xirniumites would be...

As Kimblee said himself, the Kahanistanians are no where remotely near the front lines, therefore your aircraft are searching in the wrong place and therefore your helicopters are nowhere near the Merkava.

magically = quickly and effectively using the best equipment available for such missions.
Don't even get me started as to what I'm annoyed about.

The Amestrian copters were closer! They took off before the SF copters, are also the best equipment, and so would arrive first!

As Kimblee said himself, the Kahanistanians are no where remotely near the front lines, therefore your aircraft are searching in the wrong place and therefore your helicopters are nowhere near the Merkava.

But they are in the general area, it would not take long for the helocopters to get there...

the 50 aircraft were scrambled well after the 2 SF F-16s were booming the target area. and as soon as your aircraft appear on RADAR, the F-16s of the Torontian Air Force and the F-16+s of the Commonwealth Air Force will be scrambled, along with 30 F-5s Super Tigers from the two aircraft carriers in the "zone" between BC, Victoria and the OP.

I demand the following.

1. Amestria helocopters, being closer and already airborne, arrive first and deploy there units...

But they are in the general area, it would not take long for the helocopters to get there...

Remember this post you made:

Kimblee gave an unnerving smile. "We are far from the front Lieutenant, and as Kahanistan is neutral in this conflict I doubt I am in any danger... What you doing outside of the base I wonder, out here..."

Since you are searching the general camp area you are not searching the front lines. Your helicopters would take much longer then the Saint Fedskian ones to get there.

The Inquisitors are in "the general area" of the Kahanistanian camp as much as any other place in BC is in the camp's "general area", that is to say not all.

the 50 aircraft were scrambled well after the 2 SF F-16s were booming the target area. and as soon as your aircraft appear on RADAR, the F-16s of the Torontian Air Force and the F-16+s of the Commonwealth Air Force will be scrambled, along with 30 F-5s Super Tigers from the two aircraft carriers in the "zone" between BC, Victoria and the OP.

The Amestrian aircraft would not cross into SF airspace and the AOA would complain...

I want it RPed, not godmoded!

The Amestrian copters were closer! They took off before the SF copters, are also the best equipment, and so would arrive first!
I do not consider UH-1 HUEYs to be the best equipment. YOU HAVE TO POST DETAILS! DETAILS ARE WHAT MAKE THE RPS GOOD! I remember what you TG'd me, but that doesn't make a difference. If you need time to read it over, take all the time you need! If you have questions, ask! I would love to help as would X and Kahan and any other NSer. Don't just immediately started ranting in the OOC thread or via TG when you don't like what goes on.

You post too quickly and I have to get your attention before too much is put down and it becomes "too late", I hate when that happens...

I did post on the Osprey, which can go up to 350 miles per hour...

The Amestrian aircraft would not cross into SF airspace and the AOA would complain...

I want it RPed, not godmoded!
IT doesn't matter who's air space they were in...if I had fighters in the area and 50 enemy fighters began showing up on RADAR, I would immediately deploy all available units to take out the threat, regardless of who's airspace they were in. I ICly don't recognize any Amestrian borders or space.

IT doesn't matter who's air space they were in...if I had fighters in the area and 50 enemy fighters began showing up on RADAR, I would immediately deploy all available units to take out the threat, regardless of who's airspace they were in. I ICly don't recognize any Amestrian borders or space.

Well there are 100 fighters kept on a scheduled patrol, as I posted a while back, so I guess we should already be at war...

The V-22 has a topspeed of 276.18 mph (240 knots). But in order to reach said speed, it must convert, while in the air to a plane, and then must slow down before reaching the target area and convert back into a helicopter to land...making it completely useless for short hops when compared to a proper helicopter, especially one like the Defender 500.

The V-22 has a topspeed of 276.18 mph (240 knots). But in order to reach said speed, it must convert, while in the air to a plane, and then must slow down before reaching the target area and convert back into a helicopter to land...making it completely useless for short hops when compared to a proper helicopter, especially one like the Defender 500.

It is a V-25, improved and more powerful, 350 mph, and it was in the air first and three minutes away, by your own estimate, the SF helocopters where 10 minutes away...

I hate arguements, how can this be resolved...

It was in the air first and three minutes away

I have issues with this. The fugitives could be anywhere in BC and yet your V-25 is three minutes away? That sounds like a godmod.

I have issues with this. The fugitives could be anywhere in BC and yet your V-25 is three minutes away? That sounds like a godmod.

They are within a general area, they could not have gone that far by foot and then tank in a couple of hours...

Your V-25 would still have to find the area, speed up, slow down, and convert while the SF aircraft knew exactly where to go, where to land and how long to stay.

Your V-25 would still have to find the area, speed up, slow down, and convert while the SF aircraft knew exactly where to go, where to land and how long to stay.

They know exactly where to go because of the distress signal (issued before the SF forces took off), and unlike the SF force, do not have to take precautions...

(even if the SF forces are not fired on, they would take precoutions in anycase)

Anyway, how can this be resolved?

This can resolved by:

1) Letting things go without any combat...a win-win situation for everyone.

2) RPing the combat now with all the scrambled fighters and my naval vessels, as the two sides meet over the target zone. Resulting in a definite loss for someone and the beginning of an allout war and the entrence of the rest of the commonwealth.

3) RP limited combat in which the 3 Amestrian aircraft are destroyed by the SF helicopters and producing the same results as number 1, only with Amestria losing forces and SF taking a slower way home.

They are within a general area, they could not have gone that far by foot and then tank in a couple of hours...

A good soldier can march up to 40 miles in a day. Assuming the fugitives were only travelling for that long and only at that speed (and they could well have been travelling for longer, and quicker, given that they were running for their lives) your aircraft would need to search an area of 13,273 square kilometres.

And that was before they commandeered the tank and rapidly increased the pace of their journey, travelling at least another ten kilometres and adding 4,398 square kilometres to your search area.

Which means I seriously doubt you can get to the fugitives in anything remotely like 3 minutes, and certainly not before the Saint Fedskians who actually knew where to go and where ready to go there.

This can resolved by:

1) Letting things go without any combat...a win-win situation for everyone.

2) RPing the combat now with all the scrambled fighters and my naval vessels, as the two sides meet over the target zone. Resulting in a definite loss for someone and the beginning of an allout war and the entrence of the rest of the commonwealth.

3) RP limited combat in which the 3 Amestrian aircraft are destroyed by the SF helicopters and producing the same results as number 1, only with Amestria losing forces and SF taking a slower way home.

4) The Amestrian helocopters arrive first and there is limited combat, the SF helocopters arrive second, we then go from there...

A good soldier can march up to 40 miles in a day. Assuming the fugitives were only travelling for that long and only at that speed (and they could well have been travelling for longer, and quicker, given that they were running for their lives) your aircraft would need to search an area of 13,273 square kilometres.


They have only been running for several hours, perhaps a quarter of a day at most, not a full day... (unless I am completely screwed up, I hate fluid time...)

That would require editing all the posts which I will not do. I will not go back and change the past like has been done so many times in this RP. If there is a "limited combat" that is not initiated by the Commonwealth an all out war will follow resulting in the destruction of the Amestrian Armed Forces. by The Commonwealth, Xirnium, possibly Kahanistan and an undisclosed ally.

Thats why I started "ranting" on the OOC thread, because now it is "too late"

That "past" is incorrect and I refuse to recognize it and I am not going to change my mind because of OOC threats (hell the Amestrian and SF forces might not even exchange fire, but we might never know because you just godmoded them there!)

I gave plenty of indication I had a problem... but you ignored and dismissed me...

They have only been running for several hours, perhaps a quarter of a day at most, not a full day... (unless I am completely screwed up, I hate fluid time...)

Not several hours, at least a day. If it was only several hours we would be near the front line, we'd almost be on the front line, not "no where near" as your man said.

Even a single day's forced march is not very far from the front line, but we can settle for that if you like. Or perhaps I can make it several days, but it must be at least one day's march.

There was no godmoding. I posted that my forces were minutes out exactly five minutes before you posted your forces as being a "few minutes" out. The Fighters would intercept your aircraft before they could get close to the zone and providing that failed the SF helicopters would arrive at the same time and begin shooting them down. You may not open fire, but I will.

If it was more then a day there would be more then helicopters there launched by a Lieutenant Colonel...

It doesn't matter how many helicopters you launch, the area is huge. Say you launched 50 (which I seriously doubt you can) you would have each one searching zones 353 km square.

Having arrived at the roadblock less than 10 minutes after taking off,


As you posted, my helocopters would arrive first, and if your forces restarted the conflict your allies would not jump in...

This can resolved by:

1) Letting things go without any combat...a win-win situation for everyone.



Fine, fine, fine...

But I want something in return...

282km/h for 20km. Do the math and tell me how long it will take for the helicopters to get from Blaine to the roadblock.

It should be 4 minutes and 15 seconds for the 10 Defender 500s. For the F-16+s less than minute....less than 30 seconds infact. Actually 26 seconds.

I have deleted my objection posts on the IC thread... but I would like something in return... perhaps one of the SF helocopters crashing because of an accedent or pilot error (it is dark is it not and they are flying close to the ground)...

How about this...it will prove useful in the near future. One of the straps holding an Elite Guard breaks, causing the soldier to fall to the ground, maybe breaking an ankle or something, however, because the Amestrian forces...(you have 2 divisions there remember) were alerted to the activity and rushed to the area, the Elite Guards were forced to leave the soldier behind. They tried to kill him buy shooting at him, but it may or may not have worked. Either way, he will be captured and his uniform will provide proof that there are SF special forces in the area...which will come in handy when the SC commandos begin their activities. And this can set the stage for a rescue RP if the soldier is still alive and doesn't take his cyanide pill.

If not, a helicopter crash will work.

I have work now. Back in 9-10 hours.

That would work as well, but he would have to be captured alive... he could lose his cyanide pill...

Either that or one of the choppers crashes...

I will leave it up to you...

They have no clue what's going on with Xirnium and their investigation, but a supposidly allied Tank that opens fire on it's own side just screams 'traitor or Terrorist.' and with the helicopters aiding them, says the same. But by the time the LA interceptors reach the sound the helicopters will be in the safety of the Commonwelth Navy and they'll break off before getting in range of AAs.

Hi everyone; I've been kinda... gone.

Can anyone give me a small SitRep?

The war is over for one... and the ghosts of BC are comming out to haunt Amestria...

Basically, two Kahanistan soldiers and two Xirniumite Inquisitors went to Eastern Torontia with classified information about alleged Amestrian war crimes, and all hell broke loose.

Can anyone give me a small SitRep?
Lou's got all the dirt on Amestria that he could ever hope to have, copies of the execution order, coordinates for mass grave sites, everything. All courtesy of an Inquisition intelligence service broadcast to the entire world.

Soon there'll also be a Kahanistanian defector going to the press detailing the warcrimes. I imagine it will get quite a lot worse from there on.

Looks like my work here is done..

The war is over for one... and the ghosts of BC are comming out to haunt Amestria...

Should I have Lou play a DART video?

Kahanistan, TG...

Lou's got all the dirty on Amestria that he could ever hope to have, copies of the execution order, coordinates for mass grave sites, everything.

Soon there'll also be a Kahanistanian defector going to the press detailing the warcrimes. I imagine it will get quite a lot worse from there on.

Looks like my work here is done..

Did you make an IC post on this? (just curious)

Lou's got all the dirty on Amestria that he could ever hope to have, copies of the execution order, coordinates for mass grave sites, everything.

Soon there'll also be a Kahanistanian defector going to the press detailing the warcrimes. I imagine it will get quite a lot worse from there on.

Looks like my work here is done..

The Kahanistanians would only know about roughly 300 to 500 bodies... (out of over 5000)... the remainder were buried by Amestrian/TPG troops without Kahanistans knowledge...

Did you make an IC post on this? (just curious)

He has not been RPed leaving yet...

Did you make an IC post on this? (just curious)

Link (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=10164502#post10164502)

There are a lot of IC posts before and after that explaining how it was found.

The Kahanistanians would only know about roughly 300 to 500 bodies... (out of over 5000)... the remainder were buried by Amestrian/TPG troops without Kahanistans knowledge...
True, but a couple of mass grave sites are enough for a political firestorm.

True, but a couple of mass grave sites are enough for a political firestorm.

I'm not worried...

I'm not worried...

You should be.

Ok people; this is the point where this RP isn't going to be closed anymore. Let's face it: if a major international news agency came out with proof a nation commited War Crimes, it wouldn't be a confined conflict anymore. If I have Lou bring this out, i'm making a new thread that will be open; is that ok with everyone?

Of course, it would be pointless otherwise. In my opinion.

I mean, most of the actors already in this rp knew the truth. There'd be absolutely no reason for the Inquisitors to have gone to all the trouble of uncovering the evidence at great personal risk and not have the rest of the world know and act.

No, the proof of warcrimes is debatable and I want this to remain closed for now.

I veto any motion for a new thread as well...

the newsreports have not even been published yet...

So does that mean I'm clear to start making a thread?

No, I veto it for now...

Of course, it would be pointless otherwise. In my opinion.

I mean, most of the actors already in this rp knew the truth. There'd be absolutely no reason for the Inquisitors to have gone to all the trouble of uncovering the evidence at great personal risk and not have the rest of the world know and act.

The rest of the world can hear about the debate, but I do not want this closed thread to become open. That is very unfair from my prespective...

As a person who invested huge amounts of RP into finding the evidence I demand this be made open. There is absolutely no reason not to.

The cat is out of the bag, you must RP the entire international community getting involved.

I do not want this closed thread to become open. That is very unfair from my prespective...

No it isn't. This is a very new RP that needs new parametres, not those of the old one. It needs to be open.

Ok; just a suggestion here. Could everyone NOT let other media sources know? Then, leak it to SRN. It makes for a MUCH better story if Lou gets to release it in the first place.

As a person who invested huge amounts of RP into finding the evidence I demand this be made open. There is absolutely no reason not to.

The cat is out of the bag, you must RP the entire international community getting involved.

No, they can become diplomatically involved (they are already), but I do not want any more Nations sending forces to Torontia. Torontia itself will remained closed!

And you are assuming the "evidence" has an effect before it is even published!

Kahanistan, another TG...

Ok; just a suggestion here. Could everyone NOT let other media sources know? Then, leak it to SRN. It makes for a MUCH better story if Lou gets to release it in the first place.

I'd have to edit an IC post, though. What if Lou had the first exclusive interview with the Kahanistanian defector?

No, they can become diplomatically involved (they are already), but I do not want any more Nations sending forces to Torontia. Torontia itself will remained closed!

We aren't talking about the war, that is a different RP. This is a new RP about the warcrimes, therefore it is open.

No it isn't. This is a very new RP that needs new parametres, not those of the old one. It needs to be open.

Look I have been fair but this is still the old RP and 500 bodies with no clear evidence of what happened is no reason to make this open (the war did not make this open and niether will this).

My veto stands! I am putting my foot down, it is still the same RP and it is closed!

It's not unfair if this thread goes open, IMO. It just means that Amestria will have to conduct its business much differently; or be crushed. This RP is kinda getting dull even WITH my massive spinoff creation wizzard. We could make a whole new RP out of that. IF it is leaked, it NEEDS a new thread. The current one is so cluttered it's hard to navigate. The conflict was closed when people were still establishing themselves in the theatre. That has been done. It is time to expand.

We aren't talking about the war, that is a different RP. This is a new RP about the warcrimes, therefore it is open.

What are you talking about:confused:

(PS: Remember the defector has not made it out of BC yet...)

My veto stands! I am putting my foot down, it is still the same RP and it is closed!

You can't put your foot down. A new thread will be created about the warcrimes in Torontia and it will be open.

You can't close an RP for no reason, and you've offered none.

It's not unfair if this thread goes open, IMO. It just means that Amestria will have to conduct its business much differently; or be crushed. This RP is kinda getting dull even WITH my massive spinoff creation wizzard. We could make a whole new RP out of that. IF it is leaked, it NEEDS a new thread. The current one is so cluttered it's hard to navigate. The conflict was closed when people were still establishing themselves in the theatre. That has been done. It is time to expand.

No, I disagree, besides if it becomes open I will not have enough time to do some of the stuff I have been waiting for a moment of calm to attempt...

I'd have to edit an IC post, though. What if Lou had the first exclusive interview with the Kahanistanian defector?

Fine by me, but the Kahanistan media won't sit on it either. Within a few days, there will be MASSIVE demonstrations in Kahanistan against the involvement in Torontia.

You can't put your foot down. A new thread will be created about the warcrimes in Torontia and it will be open.

You can't close an RP for no reason, and you've offered none.

1) they have not been RPed leaving BC, so this is premature.

2) The Torontian RP has been closed since the begining of this thread and I do not at present want it moved to a new thread.

Exactly: I'm not seeing a viable option for making the RP closed.

(Just an FYI; as long as people are fighting, i'm not making a thread)

If you want a seperate thread about the diplomatic/media fallout, then okay. But the actual Torontian RP will itself remain closed.

2) The Torontian RP has been closed since the begining of this thread and I do not at present want it moved to a new thread.

No it hasn't. It started as an open one. It was closed after most of the main players went in.

Also, we're not talking about moving the Torontian RP. A spinoff thread where Amestria is accused of genocide and warcrimes probably wouldn't even involve Torontia itself.

1) they have not been RPed leaving BC, so this is premature.
Who cares that he has not left yet? There is more then enough evidence that can be used to begin a thread about the warcrimes in Torontia (the order, the warcrimes sites, the DART video).

2) The Torontian RP has been closed since the begining and I do not at present want it moved to a new thread.
This is a new RP (the fact that it originated in the Torontian RP doesn't mean it is the Torontian RP) and it would be ridiculous to have it closed for the simple reason that the sensational nature of the claims demands others' media organisations and governments become involved.

Mckagan, the order's legitamacy is debatable...

I think we had a miscommunication, I have no objection to a diplomatic/Media thread on the accusations...

I thought you were talking about opening up the main Torontian RP...

Just to point out, I'm the self proclaimed propaganda artist here. SRN is the best place for it to be released.

At that, i'll only have SRN release it once all the information is there; i'd rather rate to everyone has moved their assets. I'm not doing something based only on DART Recon right now, I want more substance (and plausable deniability.)

Who cares that he has not left yet? There is more then enough evidence that can be used to begin a thread about the warcrimes in Torontia (the order, the warcrimes sites, the DART video).


I would like time for the Amestrians to begin a preemptive media attack (they know a defector escaped and they are reacting as we speak...)

I would like time for the Amestrians to begin a preemptive media attack (they know a defector escaped and they are reacting as we speak...)

It will be after the Inquisition's message, which I may as well repost in the new thread. You should probably repost your responce to it as well. Any suggestions for a thread title?

Just to make clear, this is just a media/diplomatic thread I would like it spelled out that the RP proper is still closed...

Title, title, how about "Ghosts of BC"

Kahanistan, TG...

"Proof of Amestrian War Crimes! (Torontian Spinoff, OPEN)"

"Proof of Warcrimes?" (Amestria will dispute so its truth is not established before hand...)

Ghosts of British Columbia?

Ok, posting now.

[Edit, Actually, McKagan's is more catchy)

The Kahanistan defectors are not to be RPed talking about the accusations until they are RPed leaving BC...

just a reminder to everyone...

Ghosts of British Columbia?

Ok, posting now.

[Edit, Actually, McKagan's is more catchy)

I do not want Amestria's name in the title and I want a question mark!

I do not want Amestria's name in the title and I want a question mark!

My apologies, I didn't notice your post in time. Anyway, it's not so important, its only a thread title indicating the claims of SRN. We can press on, can't we?

To make a new thread would be painless...

SF: You gonna reply to my guys, so we can start killin'?

To make a new thread would be painless...

It's hardly worth the effort. Look, titles are not IC, they are just snappy things to get people's attention. Since this is about McKagan accusing Amestria of warcrimes, I don't see the problem with making a claim in a title.

It was a mistake but not a serious one. Just post your IC objections, and let us get on with it.

SC: SF is at work, but I gave him the information so he will post as soon as he gets back...

Xirnium, I see a big problem with the title, it severly puts Amestria at a disadvantage by confering guilt immediately (and only upon Amestria), and the thread should be about everyones crimes (like the Xirnium agents who killed how many in BC?)

Look, I’m making a stand for sanity here. I won't change the title.

People post claims all the time in their threads, even untruths. If I went out right now and posted a thread entitled “McKagan’s Government is Evil/Corrupt/Hopelessly Inefficient!” I’m sure I wouldn’t get OOC complaints from him about the title, saying that I was "putting him at a disadvantage". I would get IC refutations of my argument though, and that is what you can do also.

I’m not going to go to the effort of changing a thread title for no reason. I’ve said I’m sorry for not noticing your post, and that is it. Now, please, let’s just move right along…

The thread starter can make a post in the Moderation forum asking the Mods to change titles, I've seen it before, and 90% of the requests are for II.

Personally, I think "Atrocities in Torontia?" sounds good, but whatever gets the RP moving...

Amestria, stop filling up my thread with OOC nonesense. Either repost your IC response or don't post at all.

I will use the thread but I want the title changed if possible...

Amestria, stop filling up my thread with OOC nonesense. Either repost your IC responce or don't post at all.

I just deleted all the OOC nonsense...

I don't want the title changed. That's how things work on NS. The best thing for Amestria to do is dig up some dirt about someone else and either use it to counter in the current thread or make his own thread where *gasp* he gets to choose the name!

I thought the title was a matter of consenius (ideas where asked of everyone)

Also, someone should put up a note in the atrocity thread that all OOC goes here and not in the atrocity thread. Might want to have the Mods take care of the "This message has been deleted by..." stuff too. Either that or start a new thread.

I want the title changed if possible...
I wont change the title and I explained why above. I'm making a last desperate stand for sanity, on a matter of principle. That principle is not to have to change ever little minor thing for no reason at all. This just isn't an issue to get worked up over. Titles aren't IC, they affect nothing. Now, moving along to the next issue..

Thank you for implying I am insane*... I already said I would use the thread...

(*written in jest.)

I have posted Amestria's response...

Sniper County, could you provide me with some details on your commando teams and some of their operations... (some links if it’s not too much trouble)

I have not fought them before and I would like to become familiar with them and your RPing style...

Amestrian Military Positions: Updated

There are 1,145,000* Amestrian troops stationed in Torontia.
1. 350,000 are stationed in BC.
2. 200,000 stationed along the Amestrian/SF border, fortified.
3. 300,000 stationed on the OP (25,000 in Port Angeles, 100,000 protecting the coastline)
4. 300,000 in Vancouver and surrounding areas (South)


There are 1,700,000* TPG troops stationed in Torontia.

1. 400,000 stationed in BC, 100,000 of which are protecting the coastline.
2. 400,000 stationed along the Amestrian/SF border, fortified.
3. 400,000 stationed on the OP (25,000 in Port Angeles), 100,000 of which are protecting the coastline.
4. 500,000 stationed in Vancouver and surrounding areas (South), 100,000 of which are protecting the coastline.

(*The Amestrian numbers are lower by a few thousand because of causalities, but I am rounding up. The TPG military has increased its troop levels by 500,000 due to the draft that was implemented.)

The Coastline of South West Torontia (Washington State) is roughly 200 miles (I am once again rounding up, it may be smaller, but I can’t get a more precise estimate, it is annoying). With 300,000 Amestrian/TPG soldiers guarding the south west coastline, that comes down to 1,500 soldiers per square mile…(assuming they were all mobilized at once). No one can land in Western Torontia by sea as they will be shot down the moment they approach the shore.

(Note: By coasts it is meant the channel coasts as well.)

SF, how is that plane going to fly into Western Torontia...?

And where have you placed this base, OP or South Vancouver?

(I am currently assuming the OP...)

yes it is the OP. Elma is 40km west of Olympia. And which plane? There will be a couple to choose from. There will be some decoy flight, some sonic booming so high altitude flights, some low altitude flights, some fast, some slow, some obvious decoys, others not so obvious. It'll be at night so troops on the ground wont be able to see them, only hear them. There will be RADAR jamming in effect, chaffing all sorts of counter measures and distractions. Just wait until it begins. It will be a good read.

A little obvious that you are trying to land commando forces...

Do not expect the element of surprise the following day...

Also with so many planes in the air, you cannot expect zero causalities...

The ENTIRE Commonwealth will be against you.
Kahanistan and Xirnium will be against you.
There's a good chance that Yallak will join in.
There's also a chance Southeast Asia might feel the need to jump in.
Amestria may even see it as a threat to peace in the region and attack you.
Actually Saint Fedski, The Lone Alliance is one of my closest friends as he was one of the first people I got friendly with on NS (ICly and OOCly). So the Union would probably try and convince the ASTLA and the CSF to come to a conference table and compromise.

Also SF, as I have posted, there are 100 TPG F-16s patroling above South Western Torontia at all times... So your planes would not be crossing into empty sky...

They will be flying over Amestrian airspace, over concentrated forces with sophisticated anti-air defenses, and with enemy fighters already in the air...

It will be a good and interesting read...

Kahanistan, I have created the relationship thread, Link:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=461318


I am going to bed and will be asleep for eight hours... I have two general requests...

1. That SF and SC, if they go through with the raid, then they have to let my air-defenses react to them crossing into Amestrian airspace. They can't just swoop in and be successful...

2. Kahanistan I would like to do some additional RPing before the defectors go public (and I would also like to remind everyone Kahanistan RPs the defectors).

So would everyone be ok with me joining the story if I put it in a seperate thread or what? Fourhearts would basicly be attempting to 1) Inspect the prisons so they can get to the root of the accuasations and 2) Try and barter a peace between all the nations involved.
Unfortunately, it seems that some of the 'main participants' are not exactly keen on letting in new players, so you'd might as well screw the idea. Check your TGs Fourhearts, and please respond via TG.

Just make sure you make a post of a standard patrol in the air at the time. None of the 100 aircraft Constant air patrols...because that would be completely unsustainable. Impossible to keep that going for very long.

And incase I make my "menacing OOC threats" reality, I would like a map of the Amestrian mainland and the neighbouring nations. As well as the Amestrian colony in the Hogsweat region.

By constant I mean rotational...unless there is a state of high alert.

It would take time for me to get a map for the Amestrian mainland...(I am still working on the fact book)

By the way you never answered my question, where is SF on the world roughly?

Parts in Ontario, Parts in Australia/Oceania
forget the factbook and get a map.

Amestria is in Europe (or where Europe would be), Western/Central Europe to be exact. SF is no where near Amestria so I don't think an invasion would be an immediate threat... I will finish the map with the factbook...

May I remind SF that only 1/11th of Amestria's current military strength, and 1/75th of its war time strength is in Torontia (and that is assuming Amestria itself does not come under attack, as then there will be emergency call ups)...

Does SF have a map, because Amestria might take the offensive in any open war?

look in my sig. It's rather outdated, but its being updated with extreme detail.

By the way SF, just as a heads up, that resistence report did not meantion the TPG Police Force. They may not be as heavily armed or trained as the soldiers, but they have radios and numbers and can assist the TPG and AOA militaries in countless ways...

look in my sig. It's rather outdated, but its being updated with extreme detail.

The sig. is not working for me (don't know why)... Can you make it a direct link?

the police force is no worry. and if there is an open war...it will be started by the commonwealth because like you said, you dont want to fight...You will cause it, but I will start it ;)

And why would SF want to bring so much destruction to itself and Torontia?

It would be a fruitless conflict with no winner...

(PS: I have talked to Xirnium and they have a policy of splendid isolationism. Kahanistan is a friend of Amestria so they will not join in. The Commonwealth would be all by its lonesome.)

And Amestria will not cause anything, it will be SF that causes any further conflict. Amestria is going to be nice a stay in its side of Torontia and blast anyone that steps into it...

Another thing SF, I want a full breakdown of your military budget, because I have a sneaking suspicion that those ships may break the bank...

And that's exactly what will cause it. My characters don't recognize any Amestrian borders or boundaries or anything. The recognize that a rebel/terror group has managed to take control of half the country. When the Commonwealth Aicraft do their patrols, if they get fired on, that will be the trigger to start the war.

Sure the Commonwealth will be by itself, but

Population/Economy/Defence Budget
McFarland - 464 million/Very Strong/2.78 trillion (minus some for non-military reserve police forces)
North Saint Clair - 409 million/Strong/0.7 trillion
Thorns (Thornz) - 400 million/Very Strong/1.86 trillion (minus some for police forces)
Pink (Pink-) - 150 million/Very Strong/0.54 trillion (the military is the police)
*Communist Revolution - 1.3 billion/Very Strong/1.3 trillion

Amestria - 1.6 billion/Powerhouse/2.7 trillion
**Commonwealth - 2.723 billion/NA/6.64 trillion

* Not an official member yet.
** Including CR but omitting The Islands (The Islandz) and The Fish (The-Fish)

I know population and budget doesn't mean much, but I believe that's where you were heading.

Heres food for thought, Yallak still has his fleet off Torontia and still has two million troops in WT (he never withdrew from Torontia, just the alliance). I would wait before doing anything stupid just yet...

His stated goal is to end "all conflict" in Torontia... That does not sound good for warmongering...

If another war happens Torontia will burn... What happened to the idea about a conference, you by the way OOC promised me a conference in exchange for me not taking a break and finishing the war. You OOC promised a conference! I want to have a conference held!

Your exact words.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10160441&postcount=962

So you OOC lied to me when it came to ending the conflict!

THIS IS OOC!! CANNOT BE USED ICLY! Your post is nonsense too.

Amestrian Military Movements

The 600,000 Amestrian/TPG troops along the Amestrian/SF front begin the construction of massive fortifications. Massive walls of concrete/razor wire are thrown up, further trench works dug, pillboxes and gun emplacements of concrete and steel are erected.
This is fine. But it will take quite some time. By constructing said fortifications, you are ICly warmongering and therefore Yallak would be more inclined to attack you, as I am not contructing massive fortifications.

200,000 Amestrian Combat troops are flown into Torontia.
Godmode. Coming from say Europe...it would take quite sometime to get there, not to mention flying through the air patrols of the inbound convoy. So therefore they have not arrived yet nor are they anywhere close to arriving. Secondly, this will be seen as warmongering by Yallak, where I have started ICly that I am simply bringing my existing formations up to strength.

The Amestrian Fleet, with the exception of several frigates (which maintain standard patrols) moves out of the strait and takes up position along Torontia’s southwest coast.
That's entirely fine.

Top Secret: 30 N2 bombs are flown into Torontia. They resemble on the exterior normal surface-to-surface offensive missiles. During the night, they are set up on camouflaged mobile launching platforms (missile trucks). They are set to fire at a moments notice upon the SF front lines if so ordered by the Supreme Commander.
Godmode. Once again, it would take time, not to mention having to pass through the air patrols. And anything being set up would immediately be noticed by satellites, air patrols, recon units, the intelligence bureau, intelligence bureau field agents operating inside Western Torontia

Top Secret: The Amestrian Occupation Authority begins preparations to move its Central Command from Port Angeles to Raymond.
This is reasonable as well.

Other Activities

The Amestrian Occupation Authority begins the task of cleaning up the damaged/destroyed areas that were bombed during the war, de-mining the few harbors that were successfully mined, and cleaning up the wreckage in Port Angeles harbor.
This is also reasonable.

I have only publically told you that there are transports coming, I have not made any reference to an escort aside from the latest post and that is definitely not public knowledge. It is only there so you can't say I godmoded anything into existance.

If another war happens Torontia will burn... What happened to the idea about a conference, you by the way OOC promised me a conference in exchange for me not taking a break and finishing the war. You OOC promised a conference! I want to have a conference held!

Your exact words.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10160441&postcount=962

So you OOC lied to me when it came to ending the conflict!
THEN MAKE A BLOODY CONFERENCE THREAD. Location: Camp Weasley Harris.

Godmode. Coming from say Europe...it would take quite sometime to get there, not to mention flying through the air patrols of the inbound convoy. So therefore they have not arrived yet nor are they anywhere close to arriving. Secondly, this will be seen as warmongering by Yallak, where I have started ICly that I am simply bringing my existing formations up to strength.

Godmode. Once again, it would take time, not to mention having to pass through the air patrols. And anything being set up would immediately be noticed by satellites, air patrols, recon units, the intelligence bureau, intelligence bureau field agents operating inside Western Torontia


They are being flown over the polar ice caps, so they are not flying over SF airspace... Would it make it acceptable if I gave it a weeks worth of fluid time...

As for what is warmongering, I will let Yallak decide... Amestria is just reinforcing its position to take into account SF's more belligerent posture (the raid on BC, the increased troop strength, est.) and Amestria's less secure position...

Unfortunately, it seems that some of the 'main participants' are not exactly keen on letting in new players, so you'd might as well screw the idea. Check your TGs Fourhearts, and please respond via TG.

This is not true, the warcrimes thread is open to everyone. As a self-declared liberal nation I'm suprised you haven't posted in it yet, Southeast Asia.

Link: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=461289

THEN MAKE A BLOODY CONFERENCE THREAD. Location: Camp Weasley Harris.

I want a Conference held in a neutral country with members of the SF and Amestrian governments who have not been involved in this conflict; in fact, I will make an IC post proposing just that.

This is not true, the warcrimes thread is open to everyone. As a self-declared liberal nation I'm suprised you haven't posted in it yet, Southeast Asia.
I thought he was talking about the MAIN thread Xirnium, The Liberation of Torontia. And I will be posting in it.

What's the difference, Southeast Asia? If you hurt Amestria in that thread you hurt them in every thread, especially the war in Torontia thread.

All RPs are linked together, a change in one affects the other.

SF, I have edited the post into the following. Do you approve or are there still problems... (I listen to people when they have issues...)

Amestrian Military Movements

The 600,000 Amestrian/TPG troops along the Amestrian/SF front begin the construction of massive fortifications. Massive walls of concrete/razor wire are thrown up, further trench works dug, pillboxes and gun emplacements of concrete and steel are erected.

Over the week 200,000 Amestrian Combat troops are flown into Torontia.

The Amestrian Fleet, with the exception of several frigates (which maintain standard patrols) moves out of the strait and takes up position along Torontia’s southwest coast.

Top Secret: Over the week 30 N2 bombs are flown into Torontia. They resemble on the exterior normal surface-to-surface offensive missiles. During the night, they are set up on camouflaged mobile launching platforms (missile trucks). They are set to fire at a moments notice upon the SF front lines if so ordered by the Supreme Commander. Satellites would be able to pick up the activity, but it would be viewed in light of the strengthening of fortifications.

Top Secret: The Amestrian Occupation Authority begins preparations to move its Central Command from Port Angeles to Raymond.

Other Activities

The Amestrian Occupation Authority begins the task of cleaning up the damaged/destroyed areas that were bombed during the war, de-mining the few harbors that were successfully mined, and cleaning up the wreckage in Port Angeles harbor.


Meanwhile in BC

The Amestrian Special Forces arrive at the destroyed checkpoint and downed SF Helicopter. They collect evidence.

Fair enough. But you must get a map of Amestria out as soon as possible, or atleast tell us a map that we can use for reference. ICly I will not allow much more Amestrian military forces to arrive in Torontia before I begin attacking them.

Would it be possible for their to be a McKagan sponsored Peace Conference IN McKagan?

I have a feeling that I could perhaps fix Torontia for good; at least establish SOME sort of lasting peace.

But you still haven't developed enough character development for Tanakis now that you control the Torontia account. Perhaps you should talk to Magdha (aka Roach-Busters)...

Would it be possible for their to be a McKagan sponsored Peace Conference IN McKagan?

I have a feeling that I could perhaps fix Torontia for good; at least establish SOME sort of lasting peace.

Sure! I see no reason why not, I always wanted to have some of my characters vist Mckagan...

I will have the Amestrian government ask for a neutral party and Mckagan can step in...

However, there is...

Kahanistan or Southeastasia...

Tanakis is on paid MCID vacation off the coast of Saharistan. He isn't going to be doing much now. The MCID is handling his affairs, so there's nothing Tanakis would do that would suddenly change the course of the RP.

McKagan, even if Tanakis cannot do anything, then the MCID can. Perhaps they should contact RB to help out their operations... ;)