NationStates Jolt Archive

I have to say that I'm cooling on the idea of becoming Britain-- I've come to like Australasia quite a lot and I'm less inclined to have it be absorbed back into Britain. I don't see it happening the other way around, though. I think we'll just need a new player for the UK.

I could take over as the UK? Like i said before im not exactly doing anything, what with the Saharwi still failing to post

I think Spyr/Saharawi is busy. (Spyr is Saharawi, right?)

If anyone's bored, perhaps a well-placed foreign power could try to influence the upcoming chinese referedum on Republicanism.

A bump of sorts, and something to perhaps inspire lurkers with interest in areas where we've ended up with holes...

----------------------

France
http://academic.brooklyn.cuny.edu/history/dfg/core/versail.jpg
The Glory of Kings has been restored to the fields of France, the lights of Versailles illuminate the land for all to see! For King and God, you fight now to restore French rule to Western Africa, to bring light to those dark and barbaric peoples which they have not seen since last your nation held them in its embrace. The world has risen against your noble sacrifice, the bourgeois objections of banal powers intermingled with the taint of Satanic communism, and even the great Holy League you forged seems to sit unsteady at your back... will you press onward trusting to the blessings of the Lord, or must you halt to preserve the current glories of the Throne, until the eyes of Limes and Reds are turned from you, and you may thunder forth once more?

Italy
http://www.natashatynes.com/mental_mayhem/images/thecenturions.jpg
The Roman Empire once ruled the world, and perhaps it will do so again. In the chaos following the Second World War, forces emerged in Italy calling for a return to a glorious past, the promise Mussolini never delivered and which had no place in the views of the Boot’s Allied conquerors. A coup saw a Christian emperor take up a crown of golden laurels and a crested helm, raising Legions of citizens to enforce his vision while a senate of the wealthy discussed matters of policy. Those of lesser stature, criminals and the conquered, were reduced to their proper place: slaves for the proud citizens of restored Rome, and the blossoming of a mushroom cloud marked Italy’s ascension to the community of nuclear powers. But all has not been easy... Italy is a member of the Holy League, but it is viewed by its more potent allies as it was by the Nazis, a soft underbelly vulnerable without their support. It claims to be successor to an Empire which once spanned the Mediterranean, but its armies have yet to take a single colony. Now, will Italy seek to prove the strength of a new Rome by joining its fellows in the African war, or will its people rise against its current regression and seek to chart a new course?

Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Kuwait, Jordan
http://www.sacredsites.com/middle_east/saudi_arabia/images/mecca_mosque_H_500.jpg
Since the days of the Ottoman Empire, you have been a state united... seated atop the world’s most vital resource, you have not squandered your wealth, but ensured the rise of industry and military might to stand now equal to the world’s great powers. But this achievement has come at a great cost: for your state has been ever ruled by a dictatorship, one which pursued a course of secularism with great ferocity. Now, from the northern remnants of the Ottoman Empire, the rough lands of Central Asia, the jungles of Indonesia, voices rise in chorus to proclaim the glories of Islam, while its holy sites and its first peoples remain silent.
In Saudi Arabia, life is far different than it might have been, for you have never been ‘Saudis’, nor likely will you ever be... the Elian state was thorough in obliteration of the Al Saud, and equally so in destroying the Wahhabi sect, while the southern borders still shift as easily as the desert sands. Yet, here lies Mecca, where all the Faithful of the world must come, the heart of Islam if there ever was one... as you build your identity, will you join the new wave of devout voices rising in the streets of Mecca, or will you seek a different path to make a nation where there has been none before?
In Jordan, the refugees from Palestine have always been restless... the Elian government was firm in its support of the Israeli state, and neither the armies of Syria nor Egypt were able to aid you in its ouster. Worse, as your own monarchy was forced from the land by an attempted coup, Baghdad exerted its power against YOU and pulled you directly under its power. Now, freedom is within reach, but you are a small state surrounded by greater powers, including an Israel that has gained both military power and assent from much of the Arab world. With little to start with and little to stand for, what will you do to find a place in this Modern World?
In Egypt, you escaped the rule of Walmington into the rule of Baghdad, a closer master but still perhaps hard to stomach for a land in the shadow of the Pyramids and other remnants of an ancient civilization. You have always been able to maintain a certain degree of autonomy, and are perhaps best able to adapt to the fall of United Elias, but at the cost of an economy somewhat less potent than that of those who once ruled you. Still, though you do not sit atop great lakes of black crude, you are home to what is perhaps an even greater resource: the canal at Suez, object of desire for a hundred states and petty empires. This channel alone may bring you great wealth and influence... or may find you subject to invasion and imperialism. That choice may rest outside your control, but what will you do to prepare for what may come?
In Iraq, long the center of the Elian state, its weakening is most frightful of all... do you seek to preserve the integrity of this dying land, or do you gather up what you can and seek a new path side-by-side?

Thailand, Cambodia, Laos
http://www.thisisthelife.com/photos/experiences/large/angkor-wat-cambodia.jpg
The lands of Southeast Asia are home to ancient cultures, the towering structures the left a testament to former glories. It is also home to structures in commemoration of empires from much more modern times. The years of the Pacific War were hard... Japanese empire reached out to grasp the former French colony of Indochine, and sought to squeeze it dry in the service of its war effort. In the aftermath, revolution swept through the land, and neighbouring Siam, pushing weaker governments aside. This too eventually fell, as son replaced father and fascist capitalism replaced Stalinist rule. There was prosperity and pride for a time, but when such glory faltered the state that was Marimaia unraveled, its ruling officials fleeing as Thai, Lao, and Khmer rose up to assert the independence of their nations. Now, after years spent finding their legs, three states stand where for decades there was one, and he who last ruled them together now lounges on the throne of Japan.
Thailand, once the heart of Marimaia and still most powerful of its former parts, is uncertain of its place... is it time to secure its independence through cooperation with neighbours over which it once was dominant, or will it seek to replace the state it helped dissolve, this time with the Thai at the helm?
Laos, smallest of the three, has long held close relations with neighbouring Vietnam, and aid from them and their socialist allies in India has been of great help, though at the cost of allowing those allies influence within the Pathet Lao. But, though landlocked and encircled, Laos persists in its independence... the question remains: what will be done with it?
Cambodia is the middle power of the former Marimaia, large enough to avoid domination but to small to exert much power over its neighbors. In the north, the Khmer Rouge rise, backed by Hanoi and its Indian sponsors, while in the south a few parliamentarians, purses suspiciously brimming with French francs, reminisce wistfully of the glories and joys once gifted to the land by the noble French, when Cambodia was part of their Indochine colony. Will one influence emerge dominant, or is there a different path ahead for the people of Cambodia?

Venezuela, Colombia, Ecuador, southern Guyana, Suriname
http://www.greenanarchy.info/anarchy.gif
The governments of Neo-Anarchos are in anarchy... but that is, after all, the point. Here for many years the very principle of authority has remained ever-challenged, with efforts at communal economy and direct democracy having displaced the tin-pot dictatorships, corrupt democracies, and pseudo-socialists that came before. These successes have been applauded by the leftist world, while nearby empires look on with suspicious silence, but times have been difficult as well: true freedom and democracy have left the peoples of this land hesitant to join their more activist brethren on the world stage, and even at home the north of Guyana rests under the influence of the Roycelandian Empire, while a French colony next door houses the world’s most vicious prison and a ‘space’ launch facility from which attacks have been made against the cities of those who oppose the feudal powers. Now, with consensus increasingly difficult to achieve, will this great bastion of anarcho-syndicalism stand, or will some seek by force of arms to enforce their rule upon a people loathe to surrender their lives of freedom?

Yugoslavia, Belarus
http://www.slavicfestival.com/Slavic/images/Slavic%20Logo%20color400.jpg
Long have the peoples of the Baltics been weak and divided, subject to the influence of outside powers... but in recent years all that has changed. The Pan-Slavic movement has risen from humble roots to the greatest heights, forming a federation against the looming threat of the Tsar in Russia and stepping onto the international stage as champion of those who seek no alignment with the globe’s great power blocs. Today, Yugoslavian weapons and experts can be found across the Third World, and recent victories in forcing Austria out of the Holy League are a source of pride. But, not all internal divisions can be cured with such achievements... will Yugoslavia be able to hold together on its lonesome self-appointed path, or will it splinter once again?
In Lavrageria, known to some as Belorussia, life is very hard indeed. A nomadic culture in the heart of Europe, just beginning to explore the trappings of modernity, it was set upon with ravenous hunger by neighbouring monarchies, reduced in size significantly after treaties saw thousands of Lavragerians left under the rule of a foreign Tsar. Now, landlocked and surrounded by hostile armies, its leaders and greatest minds departed south to lead in Yugoslavia, the people are engaged in a constant battle to survive, and to prepare for the invasion that approaches inexorably across the horizon. Can Lavrageria find a way to improve upon its wretched lot... can it even find a way to survive?

Yeah, Austria is back.

I am still kicking myself for losing to the Slavs, I am still hearing about it.

Oh well, did Yugo Slavia leave or something? That's to bad, he seemed like such a good chum, even as he was whipping my good forces into paste.

I am always on a un-steady track until summer, but I am sure during the summer it will pick back up again. But honestly, we do need more members.

Changes of Interest, Capital, and Ideals:
Article Found In: The Independent, Finance B1 and B4

Austrian corporations, even subtracting my bias for them, have been some of the best and most productive companies in Europe. They have no transformed, that is too much of a strong word, more like gave Europe a wake up all to what a real business does. It seems, it has finally thrown in the rag.

Gizatte, and Rearden Materials' latest investor meetings have brought an interesting variable to the forefront. Nigeria. While more of a hot topic than let us say Cameroon or Mauritius. Nigeria has a bigger foundation and population to which base new investments off of.

Ask any regional manager from Stille Incorporated, Gizatte, AMW, or Rearden and you will get the same two answers when you ask the two questions: "What is the drawback of Mauritius, Cameroon?"

It will always be population, and then infrastructure. Mauritius have been mostly tapped out. Its modest land mass and population mean the only increase in productivity will come more from increasing workers personal productivity than by building more factories or better roads.

Cameroon, on the other hand, is almost the opposite. Where it has too many people, it does not have enough of anything. Almost single-handily, Stille Incorporated had to supply its regional headquarters with electricity, water, and sewage treatment. Having to manufacture all of the power lines and pipes, install them, and re-furbish the power plant, water treatment, and water pump stations.

Nigeria, has more of both. It also already has a more forward thinking populace, already associated with the Tsar Wingert and his Czarist Russia. Few others have attacked communism on that scale.

Shifting back the focus to European affairs. In 2004, Germany's anti-trust commission sent three individual 100-page reports to Gizatte, Fokker Aeroplanbau, and AMW on their "monopoly" tactics. The three banded their anti-anti-trust committee and promptly sent back a 600-page report to the German government explaining themselves and declaring that the board was being un-fair by trying to protect BWW and Airbus. The situation has deteriorated since and it seems the corporations are giving the German government, and the branches in Britain a good swift kick and leaving.


Austrian Investors Increase Investments Abroad:
By: The Independent, Finance B9

Austrian investors have increased their funding of Nigeria resident companies by 100% this month. From a low of 1.000 SM (Silvarian Marks, or around 10.000USD) a quarter to a all time high of 1.000.000SM.


Rearden Materials Listed on Highest Capitalization List:
By: The Independent, Finance B9

The most highly sought after and closest brotherhood accepts a new member today. Interestingly, Rearden did not seek this membership, which some say exclude not politically "safe" companies, instead it was hinted at in May and finally given. It will not affect it in any large amount, but will now make the membership to 10.


Capital Groups Formed:
By: Wein Times, Finance B9
With more and more smaller investors wanting to make it "big" a spree of new groups of investors and managers are making their own capital groups..... One, Wein Capital, is actually based in our beautiful city of Wein!

erm... I think your mixing up Nigeria (Tsarist protectorate which overthrew a crackpot Stalininst dictatorship) and Niger (the neighbouring ECOWAS state which they have just invaded).

Actually, I would argue that Australasia could absorb Britain. It can be done as a sort of dual-referendum, meaning that it's an equal partnership between two equally potent powers. Then you can sort of merge the two states, giving Britain more of an Australasian flavor and vice versa, while maintaining an overall Australasian tone.

erm... I think your mixing up Nigeria (Tsarist protectorate which overthrew a crackpot Stalininst dictatorship) and Niger (the neighbouring ECOWAS state which they have just invaded).

Maybe... Okay, your right.

I still think that th rightful heir to Britian is the new Dual Monarchy of Austro-British!

Hm... perhaps. I sort of feel that I wouldn't do justice to AMW (and RL) Britian by absorbing it into one of its colonies... my only real concern with joining the two would be losing a lot of the work that I've done... having to rewrite my factbook and armed forces and suchlike.

Oh, whatever. I'll bite the proverbial bullet and take on Britian when Walmington/Dra-pol leaves, and save unification (or lack thereof) until summer when I'll have, you know, time.

Right now, I'm struggling to survive Chemistry, which seems to be something else we have in common. ;)

EDIT: What are we going to do with Malaysia?

Hmmm...

Is the north of Brazil still open?

I may look into something there.

We had a claim by someone... don't recall who... but he never did much with it and may have given up on the thing. I don't know what to tell you, really. Just be aware, I own a strip of land from Cabo Frio to the southern border with Uruguay (I also own Uruguay) that includes Rio, Sao Paulo and Porto Alegre. It's a narrow strip, bordered on one side by the ocean and on another by the Great Escarpment. So... Brazil in AMW is a fair bit smaller than Brazil in RL population-wise, and I kinda stole your major ports/cities. You still have Brasilia, Salvador and Recife, so you're not so screwed, just not as much of an economic powerhouse.

We would, of course, request a sample of RP to decide if you qualify.

What did the Southern Confederacy hold? I forgot, but I don't think he had Brazil. So if you want Brazil go ahead, it's fine from my point of view.

Fran? No. He had Argentina, Chile and... Bolivia, I think. Someone else had the Federated Republic of Greater Brazil, which was Brazil minus my bit, part of Paraguay and part of Peru.

Fran? No. He had Argentina, Chile and... Bolivia, I think. Someone else had the Federated Republic of Greater Brazil, which was Brazil minus my bit, part of Paraguay and part of Peru.

Oh okay, to bad Fran had disappeared off of the face of the collective world of AMW.

im still going, if anyone wants to do anything involving Morocco. Has NG or Mac been active recently? If not i could take control off all three nations temporarily to keep things going.

Jean is back, and we're working out what's going on with him now. For news, check the A Modern World region board and the offsite forums. Mac seems to be gone, but we'll see.

I have made it! Took me a few hours and I am rather proud of it.

It does sound rather statistical, no emotion, but overall I think it will be just fine.

Basically, a new crack pot has taken control, declared war on Mauritania, and generally reforming Austria into a more imperialistic version. Now I am hoping Crooked Beak (LRR) could jump in as Mauritania and ECOWAS forces. Mauritania was mentiond once not to be in ECOWAS, but it could be reasoned that it is a close ally of.

If the venerable Crooked Beak could jump in and RP against my markedly inferior skills (I don't plan to win this war mind you) I will be posting a lot on the weekends. While on the weekdays, not so much. Since I am forced *sigh* to go to school and laugh at my Geometry teacher as she teaches the round about and wasteful methods of the public school system, be somewhat of a friend, and try not to flunk biology.

An End of Capitalist Austria; Go Forth, Imperialism (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=11934175#post11934175)

At least I've regained access to the forums at last!

Bump for membership! We need an Africa!

And we're also taking applications for membership in an apparently 'open' Middle East. Nows the time, friends, step right up!

Unrestricted bumping is occuring, the reason: we need a player for Germany, The Middle East, and to have a government in South America.

Current claimed areas and Claimants listed below:

RL United States, RL Mexico, territories thereof, certain parts of North Korea (which parts?)
-Quinntonia/Quinntonian Dra-Pol

Britain, Ireland, New Zealand
-Walmington on Sea

The Lyong Peninsula*, Java, part of Sumatra, Lesser Sunda Islands
-Spyr

Cuba, Jamaica, Hispaniola, Nevis, St. Kitts?, (which others?) Sudan, other parts of Africa (which ones?)
-Roycelandia

Austria, Slovenia
-Moorington

France, Algeria
-Nova Gaul**

Russia
-The Estenlands

The Former Yugoslavia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia (I think)
-Yugo Slavia

Australia, the city of Buenos Aires, Uruguay, part of the Brazilian coast from Cabo Frio to the Uruguayan border, territories/dependencies of Australia.
-Gurguvungunit

Someone help me out with LRR and BG, please?

China
-AMW China

Japan
-Dai Nippon Koku

Part of the Korean Peninsula
-Dra-Pol

The Andaman Islands, The Nicobar Islands
-Andaman and Nicobar

Morocco
-Spizania

* The Lyong Peninsula is a fictional landmass. See first page.

** Nova Gaul currently roleplays the forces of Spain, France and Italy, but would probably like some help. Spain and Italy have lots of history and call for skilled RP.

Note: There is an urgent need for players in the Middle East, as well as Spain and Italy. There is a less urgent need for players in Africa. All of these regions require very skilled RP, and are currently involved in a major crisis/war thing. Someone can fill you in on the history involved.

Okay, I know I'm missing people. Strath, what's your claim? There's bits of Africa that I don't even understand, ditto for Eastern Europe and the Indian Subcontinent. What, exactly, does the Combine look like? Help me out?

At any rate, this'll some day soon be a list of what IS claimed, so that new applicants can have a look. Perhaps Quinn wants to update his post on the first page with the places we've lost and the ones we've gained?

The Socialist Republic of Slovenia is well and truly part of Yugoslavia :) The term, "the former Yugoslavia" surely covers Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina (and the Republika Srpska), Macedonia, and Serbia (including Vojvodina, Kosovo, and Montenegro). The and should be Bulgaria, which is the only part of AMW Yugoslavia that was not part of the real thing.

Austria has, however, maintained the port city of Trieste.

Roycelandian East Africa also includes Kenya and Uganda. Then, erm, do they have part of Nigeria, part of Algeria, and part of Gabon, too? Oh, and Socotra?

Obviously the Estenlands has Ukraine, Moldova, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, and Kazakhstan as well, and half of Lavrageria (Belarus) while the other half of that is... rather up in the air, just now!

Then Depkazia has Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Kyrgyzstan, er, some parts of Afghanistan, some parts of Pakistan, erm, and LRR/TCB has the rest of Pakistan but not in one unified nation, erm, and... this is why Royce refuses to get involved in a land war in Asia :)

We migt as well add that Turkey is with Yafor (who shows up every now and again), Czech Republic with Fleur, and Quintonnia has "Hamhung", there was a map somewhere that showed Quintonnia Dra-poel, but I forgot where I saw it.

The Roycelandian Empire as at 25/11/2006:

Home Islands:

Cuba, Jamaica, Hispaniola, The Bahamas, and St Kitts & Nevis, numerous smaller islands in the same area.

(The Capital City, Port Royal, is in Jamaica)

Self-Governing Colonies

Roycelandian East Africa (Kenya, Uganda, The Sudan, Socotra)

Roycelandian Equatorial Africa (Western Gabon)

Cape Verde Islands

Roycelandian Vanuatu

Crown Colonies

Goa

Roycelandian Southern Algeria

Roycelandian Polynesia

Basse de Terre (uninhabited)

Protectorates

Western Nigeria

Northern Guiana

Status Undetermined

Lusaka (Regarded by the Roycelandian Government as being "Roycelandian Territory under the temporary administration of a foreign Government")

French Guyana ("Under the temporary administration of the Roycelandian Empire, to be reviewed upon cessation of hositilited comprising World War III")

That would actually be Russia, Kazahkstan, Ukraine, Moldova, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia, as well as Nigeria.

Tsar Wingert the Great.

I wrote this TWICE, but I lost internet connection both times. Needless to say I forgot to save. So, if I forgot anything, drop me a line or five- it was probably somewhere in the first two.

New Switzerland has been governed by the Royalty and Parliamnet, but the banks have been gradually taking control. The governing banking board, GBB, has experienced a rise in political and enonomic power. Knowing this, the Queen has pressured the Parliament to take a peaceful step-down, as not to destabilize the government any further than it needs to be. The GBB of twelve members, in concurance with the Queen's help, has allowed the title of Royalty to be kept for cultural value, but the members of Parliament have been disbanded.

Economically, New Switzerland is more approving of the big corporations, and is offering Microsoft, Stille Inc, et al. incentives to move branches to New Switzerland.

Politically, New Switzerland retains its cordial position to the Holy League, and thinks all progressive countires are backwards. Many fractions make up the GBB, for all views were accepted to gain power in order to hold a candle to the government and make them seriously consider stepping down.

On the far conservative right is those who wish, for considerable sums of money, to comprimise banking records of known criminals in the name of 'justice'. (Hey, I'm telling it like it is ;) ) Only two members uphold this theme- The moderately-conservatives (two members) are slightly disdainful of the far right's opinions on privacy and the fact it tarnishes the right's titles. The moderates are a mixture of both left and right, and are by far the greatest number of members with six of twelve, and hold conservative views on economic issues such as taxes and welfare, but are liberal on social and moral issues like abortion and gay rights. One of the least popular groups, the liberals focus on freedom of choice, and are against monopolies, but since the bankers formed a monopoly on banking, it rather undermines their view. The only redeeming aspect is their strict privacy policy.

Well, cross my fingers and hope the internet connection doesn't give out...

PS I suppose this would be a good time to mention I am still playing, hence, still on the 'claimed' list.

Looks good, may need some editing, but overall it looks like a country that can fill the void that capitalist Austria left.

I hope our previous arrangments haven't soured over time.

Bump for members!

Bumpity! Any new members out there? I know this thread may look a little dull but there is acouple active ones that are taking up most of our RPing.

Apparently UAE (comprising Yemen and Oman) is open...
How much freedom would I have regarding factbook...would I need to run with what the previous player had, or could I shake it up a bit? (I'm alright with either)

Oh, and are you going to want any RPing samples?
*goes to search out a couple*

FT background stuff (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=487700)
(I'm a bit short on MT stuff, I've only ever jumped into ongoing ones, and they've mostly been shit.)
FT...war preparations. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=506992&page=2)
Oh, and part of an ongoing PT project...aiming for a bit more realism than most. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=504875)

TERROR, i aint seen you in a while
I vouch for Terror Incognita, hes a better RPer than i am

TERROR, i aint seen you in a while
I vouch for Terror Incognita, hes a better RPer than i am


*Whispers*

Spiz, clean up your post so the vouch looks good.

*Speaks Loudly*

Well, good to have you aboard, this community hasn't died yet, and I have participated in one form or the other for about a year or two now. So don't worry about joining some lame ass bunch of noobs that stop being active a day after joining.

United Arab Emirates is a country you are probably going to have to accept the history, which is thankfully a good one. Mainly it involves the eradication of extreme Islamists and Wahabism while forcing itself along a more modern and moderate path. Similar to modern day Turkey.

If yu want a better history summarization, ask Quintonnia or BG, or Nova Gaul, or Spyr; one of the elitists. ;)

I am not a approver kinda of person (mainly because I don't feel I have the proper authority), but I could technically approve you also. Nevertheless, I will wait and see what all the rest of the guys do.

Ok, that sounds fine. So a moderate, if still autocratic, state; Arab Muslims a vast majority; extremism largely eradicated. Oil wealth significant. Military (I assume) fairly well supported, definitely well equipped, training reasonable.

Also for population, GDP, and so on...are changes so far in the RP going to massively affect the RL figures? Or am I looking at roughly 30 million people, GDP of c170 billion USD, etc?
[rough figures from wiki].

Ok, that sounds fine. So a moderate, if still autocratic, state; Arab Muslims a vast majority; extremism largely eradicated. Oil wealth significant. Military (I assume) fairly well supported, definitely well equipped, training reasonable.

Also for population, GDP, and so on...are changes so far in the RP going to massively affect the RL figures? Or am I looking at roughly 30 million people, GDP of c170 billion USD, etc?
[rough figures from wiki].

I think you hit it right on the nose-

I give my tenetative approval, but I still request that you wait until Quinntonia, NG, nad BG sign on.

Check the regional page, there is a link there for our off NS forum, go on there and read about United Elias. That is the territoty that you are going to be making a claim against. He was a really important player that recently retired.
WWJD
Amen.

Sorry, are you claiming the UAE, or Yemen and Oman, or all three?

I'm fine with it, I think, but for some reason I've always had a bit of a mental block about that part of AMW, and can never remember much of its history and status. I think it has mostly been occupied by very short-term members who didn't stick around long enough to do an awful lot, and has probably been quiet for a few IC years, anyway.

Your nation's wealth can more or less be what you want to make of it, I suppose, so long as it makes some sense. China in AMW is a step ahead of RL China (due to the harsh development of the Sinoese junta), half of India is in the Soviet Commonwealth and about twice as prosperous as in reality (due to a totally different than real history), the Benelux nations are several thousand dollars per capita to the bad in their AMW form (due to autocratic controls).

I imagine you'll be potentially significant in the Suez crisis at the moment, and potentially tangled-up in the rising Islamist tide coming out of Central Asia. Good to have you -hopefully- on board, TI.

Replacing United Elias? Ah...I understood I was taking over the UAE, Yemen, Oman combo held by Halberdgardia or somesuch...
Wasn't United Elias Iraq, Jordan, Syria? Ok.
*thinks*
For the UAE, Oman, Yemen, I'd propose to build it up economically, while retaining a strong military and developing a longer reach - more blue water navy, assault ships, that sort of thing. Eventual aim: make it into a nation you don't mess with on home turf, and listen to in itis region.
For Iraq, Jordan, Syria...that would be harder, more challenging, but possibly more rewarding.
I would propose there to initially follow United Elias' policies, once I've worked out what they are, and only gradually move away from them as I get more of a sense of what's going on; so more a succession than a take-over.
Eventual aim: to change over to my own policies with what is clearly a Great Power in this timeline.

I'd rather take over Iraq, Syria and Jordan, now I'm aware United Elias has left. However, I understand if you're uncertain about letting me have so crucial a territory from the off, so I'm happy to just take the Emirate, Oman, Yemen combo - it has some potential.

For the UAE, Oman, Yemen, I'd propose to build it up economically, while retaining a strong military and developing a longer reach - more blue water navy, assault ships, that sort of thing. Eventual aim: make it into a nation you don't mess with on home turf, and listen to in itis region.

[...]

I would propose there to initially follow United Elias' policies, once I've worked out what they are, and only gradually move away from them as I get more of a sense of what's going on; so more a succession than a take-over.
Eventual aim: to change over to my own policies with what is clearly a Great Power in this timeline.

If you'd care to look at these maps- do excuse the somewhat quaint spellings, His Majesty does rather like them- you'll note that one of your nearest neighbours is the Roycelandian Empire. We enjoyed a very close and beneficial relationship with the United Elians, and naturally we'd like to enjoy the same with any Governments arising thereof in the region. Of course, that means there's a certain amount of... balance required.

Naturally, of course, alliances with Roycelandia have many benefits, including complimentary SMLE Rifles, generous trade deals, and for Government officials, unlimited free travel on The Spirit of Africa (the Cape-to-Cairo Railway operated by Imperial Railways[/i]. And did we mention the blackjack and hookers? :D

I like UAE, Oman, and Yemen a little more than the wohole United Elias - that's incredible power to give to someone, especially someone new.

Indeed, Yemen-Oman-UAE would seem a better starting point than the rather gargantuan UAE. Though, honestly I've been hoping that the Elian monolith will emerge in a divided form, perhaps Mesopotamia-Arabia-Egypt in keeping with UE's military regions and Jordan falling under Ottoman influence due to the Sultan's Hashamite connections. Perhaps even smaller states could be imagined, but it would seem condusive to good 'diplomacy' roleplay to have vital oil resources in the hands of several powers rather than a single monolith. And, conveniently, it would reduce the size of individual Mideast states down to something more appropriate for new members.

Yeah, I would like to see parts of UE continuing to be played. TI stands to border an important NPC nation with no decisions on its future having been made in the group... having him play part of the former UE would finally explain what happens to it!

Syria is under Al Khali control, now, isn't it? But Mesopotamia, Arabia, and Egypt, or whatever form the federation may take, are going to need players eventually.

We're nervous about giving them to a new player, but the alternative seems to be... giving them to an old player, which raises the question of, you know, who that should be.

I wouldn't mind seeing TI make a nation out of a part of the former UE, just not the whole thing. It'd be great if the Soviets, Combine, Roiks, et cetera could all pile in, have a bit of a barney in the ME, and then agree to create the nation of Iraq or something, and withdraw, but we'd all lose hundreds of thousands of personnel trying that, and probably wreck the place entirely.

No, I didn't say thta you should take all of it, just that the region that you are looking at is fested in UE history and tradition. Now, what I thought was that you could take some portion of UE and start with that. I truly believe that the UE should be divided and multiple players should get in there and start to squabble for control and somesuch, you know many oil rich nations that can play other powers off eachother and so on. It would be a lot more interesting. In fact, I am currectly talking with a player that might be interested in coming over that might want to take a peice.
I think that regional politics oin the ME could be a lot more interesting than they have been.


WWJD
Amen.

Ok. Something of a consensus seems to be emerging; that I should take part of United Elias, as was.
So as a firm proposal, I'd like to take the United Arab Emirates, Oman and Yemen. I'm happy to accept advice/suggestions, that's just...something I'm happy with unless any significant problems/better ideas come up.

That's something that isn't too huge, but big and stable enough to have some impact elsewhere.

Why not Iraq? That is a bigger state after all, with one hell of a metropolis. Just a thought. Bigger population too, and perhaps the most valuable piece of real estate in the world.

Good suggestion. It's almost as thrown together as what I'd proposed would be, but not quite.
Ok, suggestion is now Iraq. I can't see that I'd reasonably want more territory than that. So yeah, I'll hang on for a bit, see if anyone has any objection to my taking Iraq, and start working out how I'd RP the initial takeover, and what I'd do then.

I'de be supportive of the Iraq thing, but you would definately need to take UE into major account.

Here is some stuff on that. Oh, and BTW, it does help if you move to the A Modern World region, as we do a lot of interbal communication there, but not a requirement.

http://z9.invisionfree.com/NS_Modern_World/index.php?showtopic=32

http://z9.invisionfree.com/NS_Modern_World/index.php?showtopic=40&hl=

http://z9.invisionfree.com/NS_Modern_World/index.php?showtopic=39&hl=

http://z9.invisionfree.com/NS_Modern_World/index.php?showtopic=182&hl=

http://z9.invisionfree.com/NS_Modern_World/index.php?showtopic=176&hl=

http://z9.invisionfree.com/NS_Modern_World/index.php?showtopic=155&hl=

http://z9.invisionfree.com/NS_Modern_World/index.php?showtopic=78&hl=



This is all stuff on the invision board that was posted by UE in regards to his nation. A lot of the feel and doctrine of the nation, as well as some hard facts can be gleaned.

WWJD
Amen.

Posted on that forum a bit of military information, taken by assuming an enterprising general has taken control of the 6th Army district (Iraq and Kuwait).
I'm still working on the political set-up, which can be assumed to be somewhat fluid in the early stages immediately following a coup.
All information posted there is provisional, and I'm willing to take advice on it.

Can i set up some kind of Nordic Union, containing Iceland, Greenland and the Faroe Islands? The main industry would be direct smelting of iron and aluminium, which are found in Greenland, and large amounts of fish farming and energy intensive industries such as shipbuilding. Unlike Iceland, the Faroe islnads or Greenland, they would have a fairly decent military, but it would be fairly small, using high grade equipment to make up for there tiny numbers.

What would the government type be? And what would happen to Morocco and Spain?

Morocco and spain are going to be going back to the quiet and furious retooling stage in military evolution after the peace deal goes through, which means they wont be much posting needed for them.
The Government type would be a liberal federal democracy with a desire to maintain a substantial presence in the north atlantic, which they consider to be there backyard.

Morocco and spain are going to be going back to the quiet and furious retooling stage in military evolution after the peace deal goes through, which means they wont be much posting needed for them.
The Government type would be a liberal federal democracy with a desire to maintain a substantial presence in the north atlantic, which they consider to be there backyard.

Their backyard? I feel they are going to but heads with Her Majesty's Service.

Intro/diplomacy thread. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511416)

With that up, I'm all set to start. yay!

well, being as they are islands in the North Atlantic for the most part, it really would be there backyards.
Im thinking the army would be a very small helo-mobile infantry force with maybe a few light vehicles, with the air force and navy being the only forces of reasonable size. Including a couple of battleships that were purchased from American in the early forties (just prior to the US joining the War) to help defend Denmark (which the union still has close ties with) from German Agression, they remained in service after the war and have been constantly upgraded to increase combat effectiveness and reduce crew requirements. Most of the rest of there fleet would be made up of something similar to a Perry Class Frigate with a couple of light carriers thrown in for variety, the airforce would also be almost totally based around defending the homeland and maintaining patrols over the North Atlantic, and mounting ASW and ASuW missions over that territory.
Economy would be based around massive energy intensive industries, such as direct reduction iron and aluminium technologies, computer chip manufacturing and other such things, based in Iceland, mineral extraction for export and use in those industries, based in Greenland and Iceland, and the exploitation of oil and gas reserves (Faroe Islands and to a limited extent Greenland)
Population would probably be around 2.5 million people, since the mass exodus that has and is still happening to Denmark wouldnt have happened so quickly, since the country would be more prosperous than IRL, with better transport and schooling, making it more attractive for young people to stay in the Union. Plus the oil industry would be attracting loads of foreign workers, as it is beginning to do now, much in the same way as the Saudi Phenomenon.

Morocco and spain are going to be going back to the quiet and furious retooling stage in military evolution after the peace deal goes through, which means they wont be much posting needed for them.
The Government type would be a liberal federal democracy with a desire to maintain a substantial presence in the north atlantic, which they consider to be there backyard.

I have to say no to this. I would love to have someone playing the Scandinavian countries, but you seem to have your hands full running Spain/Morroco. I woulsay that you stay that way and work out who is really in charge of Spain, you or NG? I think that having a strong and militaristic nation like that with a powerful force projection fleet and many read-made allies should be fine for you for now.

I just can't get behind this. You seem to never be happy where you are, and I want to see you play for awhile in one spot before you skip over to another nation.

BTW, are you recognising the HL/Anglo peace treaty, you seem to be still moving your fellt towards Britian? Or am, I reading that wrong?

WJD
Amen.

Wholeheartedly agree with Quinntonia. Spiz, you do not RP whatsoever except for moving military forces here and there, there is as much depth as a coy pond. Spain needs a real commitment, it is not a cool bag of military toys for you to use. What gets me is when you said :

“Morocco and spain are going to be going back to the quiet and furious retooling stage in military evolution after the peace deal goes through, which means they wont be much posting needed for them.”

When there at peace will be an intense period of internal RP no doubt. Now, I know that I have been accused as a warmonger, but everyone here must admit that Restoration France is not only about war, and has many internal scenario RPs. We RP trade etc…in other words, I am in it to play the nation, not just its wars. So, you figure when the war dies down you take this new land and leave Spain and Morocco, a huge bloc in its own rite, to just vegetate while you go off on another adventure?

The only requests I get from you are “move a fleet there” or “an army there”, there has not been one character RP from you. Our new Rome fellow has done more to display the setting than you have, and he hasn’t even posted IC yet. So, although you can do tactical moves, I feel that here in AMW we need people who are willing to take a nation and stick with it. So, on that area, we need a new Spain. Will Mac come back? Or can we search for someone new. Again, I don’t mean to be a jerk, but I wont have months of intense realistic RP ruined by several moding moves and abandonment.

Wholeheartedly agree with Nova Gaul. Spiz, you do not RP whatsoever except for moving military forces here and there, there is as much depth as a rain puddle. Spain needs a real commitment, it is not a cool bag of military toys for you to use. What gets me is he's right, not that I have payed the strictest attention to your RPing.

Now, I know that New France has been accused as a warmonger, but everyone here must admit that Restoration France is not only about war, and has many internal scenario RPs.

Leave Spain and Morocco, a huge bloc in its own rite, to just vegetate while you go off on another adventure? Not the standard I approve of-

Our new Rome fellow has done more to display the setting than you have, as has our Iraq fellow, and they haven't even been here more than a week. So, although you can do tactical moves, here in AMW we need people who are willing to take a nation and stick with it.

((Interesting idea I tried to go with, support the opinion by being like the opinion, name of the game- I am not deciding to go on a copy NG to the letter, nor am I to lazy and write a completely unique reply.))

So, on that area, I am now seriously doubting the standards and time which you are putting into your nation. Now I don't want to sound like the kids that get mad about the most trivial stuff, like free, cheap internet games. But I feel that just because it is free and cheap, you shouldn't at least respect people who have given much to a hobby they obviously devote their imagination and free time to.

well, I'm interested. I'd like a nation that can focus on either land or sea, so if you'll have me and there are any suggestions that'd be good.

i must say, I've got some ideas for some military techs and tactics and so on... but I'm a bit hazy on the specifics of modern tech in a lot of areas. heck, in any era. [as Terra can probably attest... hehehe.]

also, a territory with enough people/resources/money/ whatever to actually be able to go a conquering would be dandy :)

is there a readily accessible summery of the current state of the RP somewhere?

I'm also curious as to how you're handling time.

in fact, the whole of the above can mostly be read as "I'm interested but clueless. please help" or something. hehehe.

i usually RP past tech... anything from the bronze age through to napoleon, so far.

... you know, i had a more coherent set of statements and questions when i started. ugh.

[totally loving the Firefox 2 spell checker. :D ]

Hey, I know you from one of those dead end RPs that I continually join and then promptly lose interest in!

First off, don't take this in a bad way, but you could consider running all of your sentences in just one, two, or three paragraphs. Makes it look a lot more professional, while that is a maybe, one thing that is needed ASAP is a spell and grammar checker. Primarily- we must be able to understand what you are trying to say. Actually, the main part of the whole post (that I got) was "I'm interested but clueless. please help."

Basically, we have Nova Gaul (France) trying to gain control of Africa at the moment. To oppose him we have several loosely aligned ECOWA, domestic, African powers and a slew of other powers ranging from Britain, China, Beth Gellert (who is most of India), Australasia and Lusaka trying to stop him. Quintonnia, a crazy religious version of America is thankfully sitting in the bleachers preaching doom onto those who will use nuclear weapons.

The people who are helping NG are Spain and Morocco (Spiz, but formerly Mac and Spiz), Russia, Tulgary, and Austria.

Some minor conflicts include a forcible shifting of rulers in Depkiziah (sp?), which is mainly Holy League-less, something is happening in Indonesia, and Austria has launched an offense into Hungary.

Mainly, the Holy League is out of everyone one of those minor side shows except for Austria, which is then a tenuous connection. Austria has its own slew of problems (which I am intimately acquainted with) mainly starting with and ending with Yugoslavia. Some of Austria's allies could include the erratic and eccentric New Switzerland, the Czech Republic, and France (who has pledged mutual understanding with Yugoslavia).

Some major battles could include the big war of the coast of Portugal, or somewhere, between the navies of Britain, Australasia against France's.

humm. i did run the Firefox spell checker over that post. did it not do as well as i thought?

i tend to break things up into a kind of 'thought a paragraph' format for ooc posts. makes it easier to find the relevant bits of information later, among other things. if you actually take a look at my IC posts from the various RPs I've been in, the usual complainant is that they're too long and detailed. several full paragraphs of preparations and motion when most would simply say "they attacked" and the like.

as you can see, when i actually have my thoughts together, i can write full paragraphs with ease. i was unaware of any grammar errors beyond my tendency towards run on sentences. every checker I've ever found for grammar tends to object to things I've got right and ignore my actual errors anyway. This kind of paragraph is why i often don't write full paragraphs. it just doesn't work, as the thoughts are hardly connected one to another.

as for the main part you got, well, that's probably because it was the most coherent statement in there. i couldn't even get the thoughts organized enough, due to lack of information, to be able to form proper questions and the like. i realized this, and thus said that.

oh, when i said "Terra" i was referring to "Terror Incognitia" ... there's a back story to that one. just to clear that up.

lets see if i can put the rest of my thoughts more coherently on the second run through:

if i am allowed to join i would like to place my nation somewhere where i only have to worry, at least to any degree, about land Or sea, not both. i have some brilliant ideas for armies and navies, but I'm not 100% sure on what i can and cannot do within the tech scope of this world, not being 100% clear on the details even of reality in that regard. this is partially because i usualy play past tech, and partially i problem i have with any era. i would also rather not play a nation that is in such a position that it could not possibly win a war, or even realistically fight one. i requested that if people were willing to let me join, some suggestions be made as to where i would base myself that would fit these requirements.

the request for a summery has been answered, and i was curious as to weather you used fluid time, or X real time = Y game time type arrangements, or something totally different.

i also stated that i had run the spell checker that is part of Firefox 2 over my post before i posted it.

i believe that was all. is this clearer? i can link examples of my RP if you so wish, ranging from when i first started out [one of my better thought out nations, but spelling errors to the point where even i find it painful to read] to the one I'm currently involved in [the nation isn't as well thought out, but the military and diplomatic aspects are more developed] as well as some failed fragments in between.

and I'm back to the paragraph thing again: personally, i find looking professional to be HIGHLY secondary to actually getting the information across clearly. when my thoughts are as fragmented as they were at that point, well, putting them into paragraphs like this would have done nothing to add to it beyond make it even harder to follow, at least in my opinion.

and now, i think that's the extent of this post.

edit: ok, my other obvious grammar error seems to be my bad habit of forgetting sentence capitalization and using it for emphasis instead. i do see that, i just do it so often [and I'm doing it now!] that I'd have to go back through the whole post after I'm done [and you can see how bit my posts are. my ic posts tend towards this size often enough as well] and fix it in every case...

I think people can just learn to cope with that one.

Hm, there's lots of space left in the world. Some territory is virtually blank, some NPC nations have relationships with active states, but you could still take-over.

You don't have to pick a real nation, you can use part of one or more than one to make a fictional nation with its own history, if you like... so long as that history does not conflict with established history in AMW (which is something that just has to be worked-out as we come to it).

I think that Scandinavia is empty, Poland, Romania, Greece, Albania.

South Africa, some African countries like the Central African Republic and Chad. Congo is now without a player but has a big RP history, same for Tanzania, Zimbabwe, and Zambia. Madagascar is free and has just a little history involved with it (the Indian Soviet Commonwealth and Roycelandia fought there, the former defending the Malagasy Republic against the latter). Angola used to be partly under Congolese sway, so has some history to consider, but could still be used quite easily.

Most -but not all- of Brazil is empty (part of the coast, including Rio et cetera, is under Australasian control), along with Paraguay, Chile, Surinam(e). Argentina may be... we had a player, but I'm not sure if he's still active. Peru is free, but may have some RP history, however brief. Ecuador, Colombia, Venezuela, and half of Guyana used to be an anarchist union, but the player has been regrettably absent for a while... there's a lot of things involved there, though, and if you wanted to play a non-communist/anarchist/socialist nation there you'd have to fight for it, and the Indian Soviets would certainly try to stop it from happening.

Canada is playerless, but is known as Hudecia due to a formerly important player/nation there. Most of Central America is free save Mexico (joined the US), and the Panama Canal is under US control. The Caribbean islands are the heart of the Roycelandian Empire, however. Belize was part of United Elias, a Middle Eastern power, but that state recently collapsed leaving the remote outpost to its own devices.

In Asia, Mongolia is free but in a less than enviable location, Thailand has just come out of being part of a local power and now needs to find its own way, Laos and Vietnam are under Soviet influence but could be taken, and Cambodia is in civil war and you could take either the Khmer Rouge (backed by the Soviets) or the government, or some third faction there. Malaysia came out of another empire and is in a bad way. Burma has some RP history but could be taken. Bangladesh is aligned with the Soviets but again could be taken, and has received a lot of development aid from the Indians. The tiny northeastern states of India are free, along with Bhutan. The Philippines have been the scene of massive dispute between powers from all sides of the world, and might possibly benefit from a strong and uniting leadership, though it's always likely to have some internal problems.

The reason I talk about RP history... well, it's like, take this example: Libya can be taken, but not without conditions/a fight, as it is heavily influenced by the Soviets who have bases and troops there supporting Colonel Gadaffhi... so you could either use him or his successor and stay friendly with the Soviets, or you could RP a revolt or something, which the Soviets might try to quash.

Similar things would happen in a lot of countries, but it can all be discussed before hand.

Do you know what sort of nation you'd like to play, Angermanland? We have Celtic liberal-communists in India, autocratic royal families ruling Europe, Christian fundamentalists leading a United States that includes Mexico, strong 'market-socialist' and 'Islamic-socialist' movements in East Asia, a Muslim fundamentalist/Turkic-nationalist force in Central Asia, almost hive-like conformist communist East-Asians in Persia, and all sorts...

We need a nice clean thread with up to date information, again, really.

hum... i think I'd reserect and modernize my original PT nation.

it's a sort of anarcho-feudal representative-bureaucratic-monarchy thing. hehe. Big on heraldry. the Prince is theoretically an absolute monarch, with various councils and houses of representatives being little more than advisers, or part of the bureaucracy, depending on the level. in reality it's a bit different, as all the many and various corporations, guilds, unions, houses, and other factions each have their place in the bureaucracy as well, so if the prince wants anything done without massive difficulty, and possibly revolt, he's got to keep people happy. the fun bit is that while the prince is not Elected, he can be voted Out [though the position it's self is entrenched]. there's a lot more to it than that, but that's the gist of it.

perhaps in Scandinavia. then i could make it a naval power, again, much as the original was meant to be. heh. a lot of things in that one were driven by the weird resource availability in RL New Zealand. i don't know so much about Scandinavia, but i suspect it would present similar interesting opportunities.

though, placing it there sort of removes my capacity to be all expansionist and imperialist... but i suppose the modern era isn't quite the right one for that anyway. and Scandinavia doesn't really have a Lot of people... makes it hard to improve quickly. oh well. it could be interesting anyway :)

a nice and shiny clean updated thread would be very nice indeed. how do you split things up thread wise in this RP, anyway? I've got used to having a central ooc thread, with all the links and data on the first page, each player having their own thread starting with their fact book and containing all IC things going on within [or near] their borders, and another thread for major wars.

come to think of it, that governmental system was a constitutional monarchy who's actual workings were best described as "organized chaos". does let me do awesome things like paint my units interesting colours and cover them in symbols though. not brilliant camouflage, but... hehehe

as for racial traits, well, Viking/Maori/Scott hybrid, probably. the first for the possibility of berserks, and physical traits, the second for their mythology and weaponry, and the third... well, Scots are just cool. highlanders and the like, you know?

hehehe. perhaps i shall resurrect the Angermanlandij language as well. get all gung-ho about it.

now, i must ask about technology, as i have some ideas that could be done perfectly well with modern processes and materials, But are very much on the "out there" list... which, admittedly, is what i specialize in.

examples include some [totaly unpowered] infantry armor, battleships, cruisers, and military transports with curved armor, and a few other odds and ends as i come up with them.

I'm just wondering how much i can get away with and how much people will jump up and down about, not because it's impossible, but because it's highly improbable [which, as i said, is my specialty]. that, and while i can come up with these great ideas, the more Normal elements of things escape me sometimes. for example, i came up with some awesome transports which could probably have been built in the 60s... and completely forgot about little details such as sensors and the like.

obviously, things that actually exist IRL are valid. LAV IIIs, rocket propelled grenades, etc. but i must admit ignorance to the capabilities of a lot of these things. wiki is your friend, but it only goes so far.

my military doctrine tends toward artillery, infantry, and mobility, and at sea tends to treat aircraft carriers as simply large anti-aircraft platforms [that is, they carry fighters/interceptors, mostly, with escort and anti-submarine warfare tasks in mind rather than attack] relying on battleships and cruisers to dish out the main damage, and frigates for all the many and various 'anti X' duties.

I'd also tend towards electrics over electronics when electrics is all that is required, and the mechanical over the electrical in the same manner. which isn't to say i won't automate things when i need to. just that i won't when i don't.


that give you enough information? like i said, if anyone wants it i can link my old RPs

As a general rule, we frown on tech that's theoretically possible, but just hasn't been made yet- not because we're anti-tech, but because it always ends up in massive arguments over what is and isn't possible.

For example, Commercial Space Travel is theoretically possible, but it's nearly 2007 and I still don't have my own flying car or the opportunity to take Pan Am Clippers to space stations en route to a Holiday Inn located on the Moon's Surface.

Having said that, you don't have to work exactly with what's available now- the Roycelandian Empire still use Dreadnoughts and Flying Boats, for example.

Creativity is good, though- it gets boring if everyone except Roycelandia and France are using M-16s, F-22s and M1A1 Abrams tanks.

One other thing: We value grammar and correct spelling. Doesn't have to be 100% perfect, but little touches like beginning sentences with capital letters and paragraph breaks are greatly appreciated. ;)

Oh, he did decide to jump in...
My experience of Angermanland dates back to when I started RPing.
His good points are these:
He has never, to my knowledge, dropped out of an RP before it was definitively dead.
He develops an entire society; trade, internal tension, culture, etc.
When he's going off the wall, a gentle talking to can bring him down to earth (I've persuaded him to give up on several insane tech ideas in PT before).

Bad points are the spelling and grammar, as people have already noted.

So, what I'm saying is get him in, to add another consistent member to this RP.

On a completely separate note, thus the separate post:

I want to push for a Pan-Arab federation. Not a replacement for United Elias - much looser in control, and broader in scope.
This would initially be in terms of a military pact, and a trading zone.
Obviously, all this would have to be RPed, the probably fraught negotiations between Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Mesopotamia, various smaller players, possibly even the Ottomans.
My problem, the reason why all this is starting in OOC, is that most of these nations are NPC. Would it be possible for some relatively disinterested party to RP the response to the initial negotiations?

If Iceland and some northern part of Scandinavia(preferrably the north of Finland) is still available, my NS Nation, Raksgaard, a 1984-type state but one that is surprisingly liberal when it comes to education and drugs, would fit nicely, I believe.

p.S. Good for you guys on creating a realistic place for NS RP'ers. It's high time there was a contiguous world where I didn't have to worry about being blotted out of existance by 5000 'bunker buster' nuclear warheads launched from one goddam submarine.

feh. i do the best i can do. you don't like it? i'm gone. bye now.

On a completely separate note, thus the separate post:

I want to push for a Pan-Arab federation. Not a replacement for United Elias - much looser in control, and broader in scope.
This would initially be in terms of a military pact, and a trading zone.
Obviously, all this would have to be RPed, the probably fraught negotiations between Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Mesopotamia, various smaller players, possibly even the Ottomans.
My problem, the reason why all this is starting in OOC, is that most of these nations are NPC. Would it be possible for some relatively disinterested party to RP the response to the initial negotiations?
I would happily RP Egypt in this pan-Arabia treaty, I know the Ottomans have a somewhat active player, and I would recommend having Fleur get one of the other states. Mainly because me and him are still waiting for Buristan to do something, so we feel its fair to overrun Hungary.


If Iceland and some northern part of Scandinavia(preferrably the north of Finland) is still available, my NS Nation, Raksgaard, a 1984-type state but one that is surprisingly liberal when it comes to education and drugs, would fit nicely, I believe.

p.S. Good for you guys on creating a realistic place for NS RP'ers. It's high time there was a contiguous world where I didn't have to worry about being blotted out of existance by 5000 'bunker buster' nuclear warheads launched from one goddam submarine.
Well, I see now reason not to allow that claim, but procedure is needed, do you have any previous RPing you would like us to be impressed by? If not, it would be beneficial to your cause to RP something with your hypothetical nation. Like a trial; RP a diplomatic visits (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511416), RP people (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511248) inside your nation (providing us with a better picture of your nation), or anything you come up with.




feh. i do the best i can do. you don't like it? i'm gone. bye now.
Before you go bye-bye for good, I want to mention that these claims take a long while. Maybe to encourage everyone to give a okay to your claim, you should consider giving us an idea for your claim, and a little RP for us to be content with.

*Is ecstatic to see so many new faces interested in AMW, of the course the finest RP group in existance*

Step right up! Step right up, ladies and gentlemen! Come and join the amazing AMW, where you can accuratley live out your dictatorial and/or marxist and/or white bread liberal fantasies!

*Circus music*

Hey guys, I have a link for everyone that should help somewhat, this is the Great AMW Timeline Project, in which various RPers are posting up their nations histories, and we are trying to create a cohesive and comprehensive history that is easily accessible for new people to access.

Check it out; it gives a few really good ideas:
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=12108314#post12108314

Now, to comment on some of the things said here:

Angermanland: Two major things, the application process for AMW takes awhile, and we are looking for a professional looking and easy to take group of writings to represent what we believe to be the best closed RPing group in NS. WE expect a high level of intellectual capacity and commitment here, and when you can’t seem to capitalize anything, we all get turned off. We have I think one PhD involved in this group already, and I am personally working on Masters towards a PhD. We have a member who is at Law School, and many others who are in advanced classes. The average age of this RPing group is a fair bit higher than the rest of NS, and these factors all means that we demand more.

The application process was originally that you must make a single claim, detailing the nation(s) that you wanted, along with population and a post that describes your idea for that nation. That initial post is very important and should reflect some understanding of the area your nation is in, your neighbors, etc. If you don’t know that information, do some reading or ask, we are all ready to help. Of course, that application process is a little changed now, as originally, we only asked for two members of the group to endorse you to get in, over time that has improved to gaining a consensus of members to get in. That means that if you really want in, you need to be able to take criticism and fix any problems that we may have. We have been burned too many times by Newb players. If you are unwilling to do that, you have proven that you aren’t appropriate for AMW.

But, the grammar and capitalization, along with run-on sentences would have to completely go, I can’t even read your posts, I have little or no idea of what you are trying to say.

Terror: You have an interesting idea there, but I think that we need to focus on getting more players for the Middle East before you move on anything like that. WE have RPed UE breaking, up and that is a tragedy, because he was a great RPer, but it is also a great opportunity, because having only one major power in the ME has made it an RPing black hole for years. Now, we have an opportunity to break that down into smaller competing powers so that a flourishing regional RP can take place. So, I would not support that yet, but if it happens through the course of natural RP, great! I have a couple of players that I am trying to recruit that are fairly interested in the ME in general, and in Egypt and the Suez in particular (though his ideas may not work in my favor at all-LOL!). I would say that you RP for awhile getting your own nation established. You have the skills, but I think before you start adding to yourself, we all want to get to know what your nation is like, especially with your obvious RP skill.

Raksgaard: I would be supportive of your claim, but Scandinavia has been played as a liberal democracy to this point, so you may need to explain the sudden shift, which I am sure you can, just see above in my post to check out the application process. I would say that a Finland/Sweden/Norway Scandinavian Federation would be acceptable, but you would have to explain the sudden shift, and would start with the military that they have currently prior to building something new. But it sounds exciting!

Moorington: How’s your Spanish?


WWJD
Amen.

The Reason i dont RP any more than I do is because military strategy is the only area where I even approach the level of skill you people display in all your posts.

Que bueno Quintonia, que beuno. Yo creo senor Moorington hablas espanol muy beuno, perfectamente, verdad Moorington? Pero si Moorington gustar Austria, debemos apprender un nuevo persona por Espana.

The Reason i dont RP any more than I do is because military strategy is the only area where I even approach the level of skill you people display in all your posts.

I don’t buy that at all, there are different styles of RP, and you are good at some of them. I am not the character RPer that NG is, I tend to not have all of the military tactic stuff down that you do, but I do the best I can, and try to add flavor to my posts. I have seen you do it, and you are capable, but you need to be consistent, and take direction from those who are trying to help.

WWJD
Amen.

okay, maybe il start trying to exercise my design skills by looking at what the Spanish and Moroccan Militaries will look like after the war is over. EXPECT LOTS OF SHINY BATTLESHIPS!

The Reason i dont RP any more than I do is because military strategy is the only area where I even approach the level of skill you people display in all your posts.
While no doubt true, we still feel that some (no matter how poor or misguided) content should be made on the political, domestic, and economic outlook of the Kingdom of Spain, and to a lesser degree Morroco.


Hey guys, I have a link for everyone that should help somewhat, this is the Great AMW Timeline Project, in which various RPers are posting up their nations histories, and we are trying to create a cohesive and comprehensive history that is easily accessible for new people to access.

Check it out; it gives a few really good ideas:
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=12108314#post12108314


Moorington: How’s your Spanish?


WWJD
Amen.

Yeah, even I contributed, meaning there is no excuse for your participation, or lack of, in this illustrious compilation of quality, integrity, and time (read: our nation's histories).

Well, my Spanish is pretty bad, just stuff that us people close to the border pick up from first language speakers. Like 'Bano! Bano? Como est stas Bano?!' Or something akin to that-

I guess I could consider playing Spain, but I confess to putting to much into a country, which was to be, starter nation for me until you guys were assured that I was competent enough to accept something more on the size of a revenant Prussia. I have long ago given up thought from changing from Austria, and feel that if I switched countries right now, I would never stop thinking of what could happen as the controller of Austria. So I guess I could play as two nations, but undoubtedly that will produce significantly lesser quality works for Spain, if not for Austria as well.

Thanks for the offer though- I feel like my RPing isn't mundane as it was, obviously, since Quinntonn(p)ia feels I bring something to the imaginary 'table' of AMW.

Couple of OOC notes.
One is in response to Quinn's major OOC in the Suez thread.
I reckoned it was reasonable for the men of the Egyptian FSB, since they were recently comrades of the men of my FSB, to pull one trick to help out their buddies. I'll edit it out as part of a general moratorium on actions in Egypt - just to be even-handed here - but I see it as roughly on a par with having your own intelligence operatives act in a nation.

T'other is with regards to the Pan-Arab thing - I'm not really trying to expand my control. I'm aiming to RP negotiations, the goal of which is to set up a form of Arab Defence League, drawing in the old UE, the Ottomans, etc; along with possibly a trading bloc.
The justification is that they used to be safe as part of UE; and now as seen in Egypt they're at the mercy of the actions of greater powers than they. Obviously has to be RPed, but it's a reasonably attractive prospect. I might kick off a thread for that tonight; if you get someone in for Egypt then great, otherwise Moorington said he could RP Egypt in the negotiations.

Oh, please don’t view my comments as critical, I completely understood what you were doing, and I even think that it is reasonable, just as I think that the Roycelandian stuff is reasonable. I have just seen this happen too many time in the past. Several people all try and speak for the same nation, and eventually there is chaos and maybe even hurt feelings. All I was saying was that even though that is not happening as of yet, I can see the seeds, and wanted to nip it in the bud at this level so no one starts to dig in their heels.

Also, I love the idea of the Pan-Arabic Defense Pact or whatever it will finally be; I was just thinking that it would not be in the spirit of AMW to start to include NPC nations in your current negotiations. I want to see a thread where that is happening, I just want it to be between many ME players; that would be my goal.

Anyways, thanks for taking that in the spirit in which it was meant.

Ta!

WWJD
Amen.

T'other is with regards to the Pan-Arab thing - I'm not really trying to expand my control. I'm aiming to RP negotiations, the goal of which is to set up a form of Arab Defence League, drawing in the old UE, the Ottomans, etc; along with possibly a trading bloc.
The justification is that they used to be safe as part of UE; and now as seen in Egypt they're at the mercy of the actions of greater powers than they. Obviously has to be RPed, but it's a reasonably attractive prospect. I might kick off a thread for that tonight; if you get someone in for Egypt then great, otherwise Moorington said he could RP Egypt in the negotiations.


For the omitted afore comment, all I can say is that it comes down to the fact that your opinion that this buddies can help out these buddies is all biased. I feel, from what I can stab out, a united UE force will most likely suffer the way of politicians. They will care for only their district, so why care about former army members living in, and part of, Iraq?

The Arab League idea is cool, but it still begs to wonder what the certain elements of UE would do, obviosuly we need a devoted RPer for the nations, so that they may make if not the wisest decision, they will at least know they will have to live with it.

Yah, I'm biased...then again, don't underestimate the tendency of old comrades to help each other out in need, rather than serve their political masters. Anyway, no point discussing that one further, as I've edited it out in favour of sending my own men in; I can RP their intervention further later on.

Yah, I'm biased...then again, don't underestimate the tendency of old comrades to help each other out in need, rather than serve their political masters. Anyway, no point discussing that one further, as I've edited it out in favour of sending my own men in; I can RP their intervention further later on.

Ooops, now I feel remarkably idiotic. Thanks for changing it-

Any new members? I know you guys are out there!

*looks up from drafting table* FEAR THE MIGHT OF THE MIGHT TWO SHIP CLASS THAT IS THE Granada-Class, the most advanced * battleships afloat [/plug]

* = this is only the case when the battleships are actually built, right now they are in the design stage

Spz, perhaps you should focus on Morocco for now. That is your original claim, and it needs some major attention.

WWJD
Amen.

I'm not entirely sure this is the best place for this particular post, but it seems as good as any, so I'm going to voice a few concerns here.

Firstly, I'm starting to feel that there's... a lack of recognition for the contribution Roycelandia makes to AMW. I don't mean in a military sense, just that it feels like, well, I'm not making a difference. In other words, I feel like I'm being ignored a lot. Roycelandia only seems to merit attention when we do something important like have a Roycelandian company take over the Suez Canal or try and annex the Philippines. Otherwise, we might as well be invisible- and whenever we're explaining what AMW is all about to new players, I don't see anyone mentioning Roycelandia in the "We have some interesting countries in AMW!" spiel.

Secondly, I've decided I won't be approving any new players until at least some of them incorporates some kind of pro-Roycelandian stance in their country's make-up... using Roycelandian equipment, favourable trade deals, that sort of thing. Why? Well, basically, the whole "sometimes it feels like I'm being ignored" thing.

I know, it's all a little complex, but I ask you to bear with me, there's a point to all this. I think...

Hey buddy. I'm sorry about the lack of recognition thing. I think it was more of the intense war in Africa thing and polarizing effects thereof. I dont think anyone is ignoring Roycelandia at all, it just didnt come up because it wasnt in your neck of the woods so to speak. I think everyone nearly in AMW incorporates some Roik technology, AMW France for one uses sooo many Roik machines I couldnt list them all here, from dreadnaughts to helicopters to those smashing Lancasters you turn out. I think its fair that new nations should acknowledge your contributions, but I might be wrong, havent they?

I can of course only speak for myself. But speaking for myself I say absoltuley Roycelandia has not been ignored. I even made sure to refernce your unique nation several times in the AMW Timeline, even when there was no direct impact. I cannot imagine an AMW without Roycelandia, in point of fact. Cannot.

Don't worry, NG, it's not the old hands like you or Quinn or Gurg or BG I'm really talking about, more the newer players who seem to... "blank out" the entire Empire, so to speak, and focus purely on Quinntonia and the Soviets.

Ever have one of those days where you can't really communicate what you're getting at? I'm having one of those. Very frustrating...

I understand what you are saying, old friend. You are one of the most powerful nations in the world, but I guess the fact that you haven't been directly involved ina major polarizing conflict for awhile you tend to be ignored a little by the newer players. I think what would help would be a comprehensive military factbook, wait, do you already have one? That is my favorite way to get people to actually evaluate the power level they are going up against when taking on my nations. I think part of the probelm may be just that, to most people the military juggernaught that is the Imperial Army is just a vague idea, not a concrete idea.

I think it is valid though, the new players hsould really take an interest in a major first world power with a force projection capacity second only to Quinntonia by sea, and a large African Colonial Empire with a massive military to bring to bear there as well. Not to mention an exceptional and modern air force.

And this all complicated by your unique international position as being the closest ally to the Quinntonians depite being aetheistic and the closest non-HL "friend" to France. Your ability to sway world events is second to none.

Let's put it to you this way, there is a reason that Quinntonia overlooks the "Blackjack and hookers" thing so much, you are the only nation that could really hurt it. Not even Britian or China could get close to the Quinntonian main without being blown out of the water. But you have the second largest Navy in AMW after Quinntonia, with the largest Battleship Fleet, and you are right on my doorstep. We're a little afraid of you.

Just thought you should know.

WWJD
Amen.

Syria (Al Khals) wants weapons for gas-rights, doesn't it? Or is that all covered by the USQ?

And we'll never ignore you. Kill and deride, but not ignore =)

He wants them, I am giving them to him. Ooh, the gas rights.

WWJD
Amen.

A military factbook might be an excellent idea, actually.

I have to confess I have no idea how I'd go about actually making one up, and more importantly, I'll be completely honest and say Modern Tech combat as a whole completely baffles me.

My interest- as you all know- is Colonial/WWI/WWII firearms and military history. I look at "modern" battles and wonder how on earth they can last more than one or two posts- basically, whoever launches the missiles first wins, or so it seems.

I've got the techie specs for most of the Roycelandian planes worked out- the only ones I don't have are for the Jetfire, although I'm pretty sure Australasia and I worked something out for those a while back. (Not as fast as some of the other planes, but better armaments, onboard systems, and defensive capabilities)

Roycelandia's airforce would be larger than Quinntonia's, although many of the extra aircraft would most likely be transports- Sunderland Flying Boats, DC-3/4s, C-130s- and the like. Spitfires are cheaper to make and maintain than Jetfires and Harriers, which would also enable us to have slightly more aircraft than one might otherwise expect...

I am not sure that you could support an air force that was larger than mine, though with heavy militarisation you might be able to appraoch what Russia has. I would say that you should probably focus on maybe 3,000 fighters of all types, and leave it at that. Just based upon your population, focus on ground forces necessary due to your large border areas in Africa, etc.

If you want hlp making a factbook, look at the Quinntonian and Estenlandian efforts. They are studies in someone not knowing anything about Modern Tech and still writing a factbook. Luckily the USA has about a billion wikipedia and globalsecurity.org and so on and so on pages that detail types and amounts of everything they have, so I just need to read up on that, extrapolate given the AMW enironment, and viola! Much of the Tsarist Empire is the same, as the Russians and the Soviets have a plethora of information about their stuff.

But, at the beginning of both factbooks, I have included the basics of my breakdown, and left it at that. I am not one for posting every damned rifle and pistol and type of armour, but amounts of armour and so on can be assumed.

Check it out, it might be helpful.


WWJD
Amen.

do we have a world map? That would help me visualise this alot more easily

do we have a world map? That would help me visualise this alot more easily

I was thinking of making one for Europe, and maybe Africa if I get LLR and Nova Gaul's help. How I would go about making one, I have no idea.

Looks cool!

Doesn't it Mojo?

Looks cool!

Doesn't it Mojo?

Many countries are still open!

I made a map of Europe, the only problem on there is the issue of Lavargeria, or whatever that state was called, how much is under Estenland control, and how much is under Yugo Slavia control?

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/4586/mapofeuropeoa6.png (http://imageshack.us)

C'est si bon Morrington! Thank you for turning it out my friend. Yes, Lavrageria will have to be clarified by Wingert and the SFRY, but it is the country of RL Belarus. Just one note, could you color Algeria blue too ;). Southern Algeria is Roycelandian, but the north, what appears in the Europe map, is the Kingdom of Algeria and French. Good on Tulgary too. Spain, very good.

C'est si bon Morrington! Thank you for turning it out my friend. Yes, Lavrageria will have to be clarified by Wingert and the SFRY, but it is the country of RL Belarus. Just one note, could you color Algeria blue too ;). Southern Algeria is Roycelandian, but the north, what appears in the Europe map, is the Kingdom of Algeria and French. Good on Tulgary too. Spain, very good.

Edited, and now just awaiting Tsar Wingert's approval. Thanks NG, the support is appreciated. Addded Spiz's claim, or the part of it- but I do not know if the claim is still valid. Did he move, stay, or what?

Perfectamente! I think that is fine, the Spanish/Moroccan situation is a work in progress, but what you have posted fits all well. Thanks again.

Looks good, you know, if you would do a African map, that would be really good. At the best of times, I barely know what is going on there.

As for Lavrageria, the portion bordering Lithunia, and running a strip south taking up a little les than 1/3 of Belarus, is Republican Lavrageria. On the Polish border side and the Belarus side and the rest of the nation, is Tsarist Lavrageria. Of course, Lithuania is Tsarist as well, but you have that there. The important thing to note is that with the exception of the Lithuanian border, it is completely sorrounded, a nation within a nation.

WWJD
Amen.

It seems as though I bit off more than I can chew, I think that I am going to claim a nation that is not currently at war with someone, I am so sorry if there is any incovenience, if you would rather I do not RP in this, I accept this understanding that I am not consistent in my interests, and that I left you hanging out to dry with the whole Hungary thing.

ON the map, the United Arab Emirates is claimed, however, in the list of claims there is no mention of them. If they are indeed taken, I ask if I may claim Cyprus and Lebenon. If I am allowed to claim the United Arab Emirates, I will write up a new history for the Arab Federation of Buristan, if I am allowed Cyprus and Lebenon, I will make a history for the nation (haven't thought of a name yet)

Which map? The UAE isn't on the map of Europe shown above...

The one on the first page.

Ah. Well out of date. I think I was offered UAE when I was thinking of joining, a few days ago, so as far as I know it's free.

Perfectamente! I think that is fine, the Spanish/Moroccan situation is a work in progress, but what you have posted fits all well. Thanks again.
Thank you for the comments and the compliments.
Looks good, you know, if you would do a African map, that would be really good. At the best of times, I barely know what is going on there.

As for Lavrageria, the portion bordering Lithunia, and running a strip south taking up a little les than 1/3 of Belarus, is Republican Lavrageria. On the Polish border side and the Belarus side and the rest of the nation, is Tsarist Lavrageria. Of course, Lithuania is Tsarist as well, but you have that there. The important thing to note is that with the exception of the Lithuanian border, it is completely sorrounded, a nation within a nation.

WWJD
Amen.
Sadly, your and mine outlooks on the situation in Africa is one and the same. Yet, I suppose with enough work I'll be able to do something.

So basically a little strips of land on the far eastern bit of Bel- somethin or other?

It seems as though I bit off more than I can chew, I think that I am going to claim a nation that is not currently at war with someone, I am so sorry if there is any incovenience, if you would rather I do not RP in this, I accept this understanding that I am not consistent in my interests, and that I left you hanging out to dry with the whole Hungary thing.
Don't sweat it, so many more countries are open, and both of your initial claims are open.

I for one, would give my go ahead to anything you finally settle down with.

Yup, that is about right. But, oh man, if you could do Africam that would earn you the eternal gratitude and respect of every player here, as it is for lack of a better word, a schmoz.

WWJD
Amen.

I will then claim the United Arab Emirates, I will write up a history pretty quick for it, after I go sledding, it will not be in as much detail as my original history, as I do not have the time, nor the will to re-write something that has taken me over a month to compile, I hope you find this acceptable. I will go under the name of the Arab Federation of Buristan

Uhh, Quinn, perhaps it would behoove us to wait until the end of the war to do the Africa map. It is still a work in progress, so to speak.

I se your piont, but it would really help me to figure out what the hell is going on during the war. I am sure it will help Wingert out too, I hear that he is just as confused as I am.

WWJD
Amen.

Uhh, Quinn, perhaps it would behoove us to wait until the end of the war to do the Africa map. It is still a work in progress, so to speak.

Or, why not just color it a certain blue shade and call it good?
;)

I'll try to make some initial fumbles for Africa, and leave most of the countries bordering Strait of Guinea up in the air.

Maybe you could shade in Germany as well because although I have not yet taken possession of it I still have a claim to it.

So, I would use mostly French technology correct, since Buristan was ruled by them for many years, correct, also, how would I go about purchasing land from a country that it not played by anyone (I want to purchase Oman)

Maybe you could shade in Germany as well because although I have not yet taken possession of it I still have a claim to it.

Your claim is not being disputed, but I am trying to make a more RL-AMW sort of map, not an OOC AMW one. Your claim, by all rights, is still valid.

Don't forget the British Isles, eh.

The Buristan History (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511884)
In this, Oman is called Burran, and was originally ruled by the French. Many of its consituents consider themselves Buristanian

So, I would use mostly French technology correct, since Buristan was ruled by them for many years, correct, also, how would I go about purchasing land from a country that it not played by anyone (I want to purchase Oman)

Well, more likely former French technology, because at the moment France is pretty strict on who gets what, especially when they are not part of The Holy League. You could RP becoming a French allied state though, NG is always open for some good pawns.

As for the British Isles, I didn't really know if they should be included. Mainly because Dra-pol seems happy to entertain the new dictatorship in Ethiopia, and Gug is still technically only Australasia, and never seemed strong about the idea of controlling Walmington.

So, I would use mostly French technology correct, since Buristan was ruled by them for many years, correct, also, how would I go about purchasing land from a country that it not played by anyone (I want to purchase Oman)

I am not sure if the UAE is right for you, I think that you should take on a minor nation for awhile, and prove to us that you can hack it. That is what Fluer is doing, and due to his great RP so far, we are going to accept him for the much larger and more dangerous Germany. I mean, we tried to do that for Hungary, but you dropped the ball. I know you said that was because it was in the middle of a conflict, but that happens all of the time.
We wanted to see you handling a small nation in a quick and dirty RP. If you want to be taken seriously by what we all think is the best RPing group in NS, you have to step up to the plate.

Perhaps you should do up a claim for someon like Greece, we need a player there, it has the potential to be a regional player, and lots of history. But I would say that you have to construct a total factbook, (try the style of the one I posted for Hungary) and a bck story post that can be debated here before we even look at giving you another claim. The Middle East needs experienced players, and frankly, I want you to prove it to us.



WWJD
Amen.

I am not sure if the UAE is right for you, I think that you should take on a minor nation for awhile, and prove to us that you can hack it. That is what Fluer is doing, and due to his great RP so far, we are going to accept him for the much larger and more dangerous Germany. I mean, we tried to do that for Hungary, but you dropped the ball. I know you said that was because it was in the middle of a conflict, but that happens all of the time.
We wanted to see you handling a small nation in a quick and dirty RP. If you want to be taken seriously by what we all think is the best RPing group in NS, you have to step up to the plate.

Perhaps you should do up a claim for someon like Greece, we need a player there, it has the potential to be a regional player, and lots of history. But I would say that you have to construct a total factbook, (try the style of the one I posted for Hungary) and a bck story post that can be debated here before we even look at giving you another claim. The Middle East needs experienced players, and frankly, I want you to prove it to us.



WWJD
Amen.

Well if Quinntonnia leans that way, I lean accordingly.

I am not sure if the UAE is right for you, I think that you should take on a minor nation for awhile, and prove to us that you can hack it. That is what Fluer is doing, and due to his great RP so far, we are going to accept him for the much larger and more dangerous Germany. I mean, we tried to do that for Hungary, but you dropped the ball. I know you said that was because it was in the middle of a conflict, but that happens all of the time.
We wanted to see you handling a small nation in a quick and dirty RP. If you want to be taken seriously by what we all think is the best RPing group in NS, you have to step up to the plate.

Perhaps you should do up a claim for someon like Greece, we need a player there, it has the potential to be a regional player, and lots of history. But I would say that you have to construct a total factbook, (try the style of the one I posted for Hungary) and a bck story post that can be debated here before we even look at giving you another claim. The Middle East needs experienced players, and frankly, I want you to prove it to us.



WWJD
Amen.

OK, I guess that I can do this, I will take Greece. Need to know, however, is there an EU, also, what is the status of Yuogslavia/Serbia & Montenegro/Serbia.

OK, I guess that I can do this, I will take Greece. Need to know, however, is there an EU, also, what is the status of Yuogslavia/Serbia & Montenegro/Serbia.
No European Unioun, and Yugoslavia is a in a depressingly high state of militerization, with all of former Yugoslavia and Bulgaria under his control.

No European Unioun, and Yugoslavia is a in a depressingly high state of militerization, with all of former Yugoslavia and Bulgaria under his control.

So it would be in my best interests to sign an NAP with him

So it would be in my best interests to sign an NAP with him

Undoubtedly so.

I am going to give you a couple of links to get you started:
https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/gr.html

That should give you some information to start, political style, history, level of mod-cons, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greece

There is some in depth stuff including ancient history. Take that stuff in. One thing you should really note is that the religion in Greece is 98% Greek Orthodox. That does mean Christian, but not Catholic, and not Protestent, find out what it is, it is hugely importnat to the Greeks:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_Orthodoxy

FYI, the Tsarists are Orthodox Christians, but Russian Orthodox, same theology, different language.


Here is some military equipment listings for their army:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_equipment_of_the_Hellenic_Army

The listings for the navy:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenic_Navy

Listings for their air force:
http://www.ellinikos-stratos.com/eksoplismoi/maxitika.asp
(Hmm, I forgot for a second that not everyone can read Greek, I think you can tell the list, there are numbers and words like Mirage next to them, middle of screen-I'm not sure where else to look)

Nver mind, found it in Englis, man I love wiki for NS:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Hellenic_Air_Force_aircraft


The main military page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_military



So, you have some reading to do. You don't have to learn Greek to do it even! If you get these numbers, make up a factbook, and get a feel for the current system of government and all there, and then get a base understanding of Greek history. After that, feel free to get creative! Just make sure that you tie in AMW history sonehow, perhaps read the timeline project.

WWJD
Amen.

Or, why not just color it a certain blue shade and call it good?
;)

Have you been poking around in the Imperial Map Room? ;)

How did you guess?

my first AMW thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511983)

any ideas on how else to reduce the budget and how I could find a budget report for Greece. I just saw that they had a gigantic deficit, my goal is to get it down to 3% by the time this thread is over, that is about the average deficit amount.

Greek Factbook (in progress) (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511997)

Greek Military Page (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511998)

What does everyone think about Buristan's new effort, I think that he is beginning to show that he is serious. Keep up the good work Bur!

WWJD
Amen.

Good work. Everyone needs a bit of encouragement to get started.

my first AMW thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511983)

any ideas on how else to reduce the budget and how I could find a budget report for Greece. I just saw that they had a gigantic deficit, my goal is to get it down to 3% by the time this thread is over, that is about the average deficit amount.

Greece's budget issues are largely caused by a problem similiar to one we have in the US. Here we call them earmarks, but I don't know the Greek name for it. Basically, for a bill to move onto the full on Parliament, it has to get out of committee, and in this committee, it only takes one or two MPs to shoot it down. To gain the support of MPs, huge amounts of spending projects for their individual districts and such are basically traded back and forth, which eventually results in giant, bloated bills passing. These bills are full of useless projects a district would generally not pay for itself, so it gets the federal governent to cover the tab.

Additionally, Greece has severe labor market restrictions and multiple state controlled industries, both of which hamper Greek business and force the government to pay extensive subsidies.

Hello everybody. After finally defeating the Joltist juggernaut, I have gained the ability to post in NS-related threads, so I have come here to stake a claim. Having been introduced by Quinn some time ago to NS, and more recently to AMW, I would like to lay claim to the RL territory of Egypt:

--------------------------


In Cairo, amidst the chaos and confusion, a small secretive group decides to make their move, after having bided their time underground for generations. Led by a middle-aged hotel and resort businessman who now calls himself (and truly believes himself to be...he's a tiny bit delusional) Amun-Ra, this group has no name, only an agenda and a roster comprised of some of the wealthiest and most powerful families in Egypt.

Amun-Ra and his followers are dedicated to restoring the ancient gods and the Pharaoh's throne to Egypt, bringing the old empire back to glory. Because of the political upheaval within the country right now, and because of several high level Egyptian military, police, and intelligence contacts, Amun-Ra and his people have little difficulty seizing control.

:mp5: :sniper: :mp5: :sniper:

Intelligence experts around the world are baffled as to where this group came from and how they gained control. All they know is that Amun-Ra looks a lot like an Egyptian named Ammon Abubakar Ini-herit, who attended Harvard University in the late 1980s and married the daughter of a Quinntopian mid-level naval officer, before returning to Egypt to take over his family's chain of resorts, hotels, and restaurants, with properties throughout Africa and Europe.

Not knowing about where the group comes from, there can be nothing but uninformed speculation as to where they intend to go, or in which direction they intend to steer Egypt. The world can only watch and wait.

--------------------------

OOC: Please can I play?:) I can have a Factbook ready for Egypt within the week, and much of the history already exists as the United Elias, the collapse of which has paved the way for Amun-Ra in Egypt.


Pharaohia

OOC: Please can I play?:) I can have a Factbook ready for Egypt within the week, and much of the history already exists as the United Elias, the collapse of which has paved the way for Amun-Ra in Egypt.


Pharaohia

The smilies make me uneasy. Try to avoid 'em, it'll quickly get you branded as a 'noob.'

Otherwise I'd say you seem fine. Your idea seems a bit interesting---I wonder if the Holy League would go so far as to accept a pagan monarch into its fold...

Yeah looks interesting but like AC I dislike emoticons. This will change the Suez conflict considerably.

What's your position towards the Roycelandian Empire?

I guess that my main questions would center around your foriegn policy in such a contentious area. I will take it upon myself to sit down and get a factbook cranked out with the Pharaoh, butyou will need to answer some tough questions probably from every side.


I guess I would ask how a mostly Muslim nation would allow itself to be rules by pagans. Also, what would be the government's views on the Coptic Christian minority there?

Just so you know guys, this is another one of my recruitments, and I am currently in negotiations with two others!!

WWJD
Amen.

An interesting proposal, certainly... it would be useful to get a proper player established in there.

On the issue of Egyptian Muslims, might it be argued that the old pantheon might have become a symbol of nationalism for many Egyptians? They've been administered by foreign authorities for an extensive period, Walmington before UE, and others before that, despite having substantial national pride, and their first modern 'independence government has given administration rights for their major strategic waterway to a foreign concern, resulting in what essentialy boils down to a squabble amongst outsiders over just who gets to sail through their country.

Not that such means that the populace will have converted away from Islam, but it certainly seems possible that they might see the symbolism as representing a common goal of Egyptian independence and pride. As it seems the proposed government is rooted in a secret society of sorts, the general population might not be aware of just how seriously the new leaders take things.

Humblest apologies on the emoticons. I shall discontinue their use as it makes others uneasy, but I am pleased that this simple point is the single biggest fault with my application.

As to the Empire of Roycelandia, I only ask thet you respect the sovereignty of Egypt and its territories and resources, including the Suez Canal, and I am sure we can work together in peace and friendship. At this point, Amun-Ra extends allegiance to no state, but neither does he express displeasure with any state. Instead, Pharaoh wishes to wait and observe the outcome of the current Suez Crisis, to see who is worthy of Egypt's friendship and who is not.

Pharaoh wishes harm to no man, but will tolerate no mistreatment of the noble Egyptian people. He is greatly disturbed by the current conflict on his soil and wishes an immediate end to all hostilities, and is willing to host negotiations between all involved parties so that there may be a peaceful resolution rather than a nuclear escalation. He does point out, however, that he will be nobody's puppet.

To speak to the religious issue, there shall be a massive re-education campaign, teaching the truth to the Egyptian people who have been led astray for so many centuries. There will not be any penalty or persecution, however, for any person who chooses not to worship the anccestral gods. Amun-Ra is the epitome of fairness, and will not force any down a path they do not desire.

Any further questions will be addressed in as prompt a manner as possible, dependent upon the cooperation of the Joltist Forum Masters.

To be fair, a Muslim nation turning pagan is not much stranger than a swathe of modern, secular European nations turning the clock back to the 1700's.

Obviously Mesopotamia will be watching Egyptian developments with interest, and government policy will be supporting any attempt by Egypt to stand on its own two feet. (Basically we think our chances of taking you over are virtually zero, so better you be strong and independent than some other nation's puppet).

Can we accept that the Muslim population would be amicable to having a ruling class that holds values at such divergence with its own? I see your point, Spyr, but I am wondering if the idea that an atheist can’t get elected President would apply in a funny way here.

Quinntonia would be concerned about maybe a couple of issues. Our foremost concern would be the almost 8 million Christians in your nation, including almost 7 million Coptics. In RL, they are incredibly persecuted by the Islamic majority, and in AMW, that only stopped when UE annexed Egypt and enforced their brand of Islamic secularist government. I did kind of get the idea from UE that this was more institutional and didn’t translate well into the day-to-day. But, this does translate into better treatment and more rights for the Christians, the ability to do things like charge Muslims with sexual crimes, repair their own church buildings, hold religious festivals, pray in public, convert Muslims without facing the death penalty, act as a witness against a Muslim in a court of law, able to press charges against Muslims if they are attacked or murdered, be considered a human being in the eyes of the law, etc.

The second would be your relationship towards the major power blocks, the Progressive States, the Holy League, and NATO/SEATO.

WWJD
Amen.

Yeah, well, they were fine under a secular dictatorship, so long as the new boy doesn't leave them poor I expect a lot won't care... so long as the Depkazi Caliphate can be kept at a distance. Islam in AMW has been pretty insignificant for generations, compared with reality, until probably the very late C20th, no? I've perceived it often more like the Church of England... people associate themselves with it, but when little Timmy, filling in a form that asks his religion, asks what, "Muslim" means, she says, "oh, it doesn't matter, just put it" or such. Until Bonstock, UE, DR Al Khals, and the Atheist Labour Republic all collapsed in quick succession Islam didn't really feature strongly in any RP at all. I don't think that it would be a stretch for Pharaohia to claim that the bulk of the Egyptian populace hasn't been very observant, and that a conversion to Egyptian paganism is just as possible as the conversions from paganism have been through history.

That's not to say that there wouldn't be trouble, especially if the Caliph sticks his oar in and starts ruffling people's feathers.

You'll have to do a little better than "Our Official Position Is We Have No Official Position" with regards to Egypt's foreign relations, I'm afraid.

Roycelandia and UE were very close- allies, in fact- and having a major chunk of the former United Elias turn around and basically act like the large Empire next door is a complete stranger just isn't cricket, I'm afraid.

Similarly, you don't want to annoy the Persians or the Soviets or the French... it's a delicate balancing act, I'm afraid.

Might be an idea to have a quick brush up on AMW history, just to get you up to speed...

I did give him the link to the timeline project.

WWJD
Amen.

Couldn't we just retconn Egyptian Islam out of existance, like I did with the Combine? It's never played that big a role in RPs, has it?

Couldn't we just retconn Egyptian Islam out of existance, like I did with the Combine? It's never played that big a role in RPs, has it?

For that matter, UE basically did the same with Islam in his country. It was never really RPed much.

Here's an idea, it might seem a bit insane and bizarre, but go with me on this.....

If you start a new RP thread, post it here. That way, everybody knows what everyone else is doing; at the moment people seem to be just posting threads and other AMW members have to come across them on their own. Otherwise we'll end up with one person invading somewhere, then another person will start up a new thread invading the same area when it could all be dealt with one thread.

Also, why all the land/client grabbing all of a sudden? Are we expecting a Fourth World War? Actually, question while I'm here; has the third one actually finished yet or are we still in the grip of a 'global conflict'?

Islam in Egypt did play a role in UE history, though... Baghdad took over from a frustrated London and suppressed the rather prominent Muslim Brotherhood there.

Controlling a state with a substantial muslim populace, I'd be nervous about simply eliminating the religion entirely, even if it has not made an RP appearance... both UE and Bonstock (at least until the very end) made little mention of Islam, but what did exist were policies of enforced moderation and secularism. The collapse of those two states has led to a rather wonderful burst of radicalization, seen perhaps most prominently in Indonesia and central Asia. Very interesting times indeed.

I think that, despite the fact that German Lutheranism not having figured in RP, Quinntonia might object to off-hand removal of German protestant faith for similar reasons. In this case, particularly because of the Combine's presence eliminating the Muslim faith in Persia, I'd be uncomfortable seeing Egypt without a history of Islam, at the very least.

Erm, and also would like to second DNK's idea. We really ought have a central thread depository of some sort, with an 'its not official AMW RP until a link is posted here' policy or somesuch.

That's not to say that there wouldn't be trouble, especially if the Caliph sticks his oar in and starts ruffling people's feathers.

Excuse me, the real Caliph is in the Ottoman Empire. ;)

On the issue of Islam, I'm not really on either side. I'll stay on the fence until it becomes clear which side the winds are blowing.

Pfft, says you!

People listen to Chingiz Khagan Depkazi. He is recognised from Nukus to Peshawar as leader of the Ummah, and now by the Kazakhs as well, and has the ear of Mumbai and the ire of Constance, Beijing, and the whole Strainist movement.

The house of Osman once got atheist Yugoslavia to send a diplomat or something.

;)

Er, what were we saying?

I think the rightful caliph would start a holy war against the HL and distract their attention from Central Europe.

Um, the Kazaks didn't actually do that just yet. They said it was possible, it just hasn't been implemented yet.

WWJD
Amen.

Hi all just to say that for the next wee while i am back.

I would like to appologuise for just slipping out of AMW but i got a bit side tracked and i needed the BIG numbers wanky escapism of Crookfur to get me back on an even keel (goodness that makes me sound stupidly messed up).


Now as with everyone else seemingly i need a quick update as to where things are if such an update would be possible.

*murders Depkazia gruesomely* No, really, though, the true Caliph is in the Ottoman Empire, but the guy who acts like the true Caliph is in Depkazia. He might get shot sometime soon, though.

Did I just say that? :p Anyway, let's get off of this little tangent, shall we?

Hi all just to say that for the next wee while i am back.

I would like to appologuise for just slipping out of AMW but i got a bit side tracked and i needed the BIG numbers wanky escapism of Crookfur to get me back on an even keel (goodness that makes me sound stupidly messed up).


Now as with everyone else seemingly i need a quick update as to where things are if such an update would be possible.
NATO and The Holy League, which means Walmington and France, are having some kind of peace.

The Balkans has taken a turn for the better, with the whining heretics of Hungary firmly under the boot of Austria/Russian domination. Sadly, the atheist buggers of Yugoslavia and the backward state of the Czech Republic have invaded the rightous institution of Austria. While those attacks could be depressing in their magnitude, God has not left the Austrian state out to dry. Meaning the divine powers of the most Christian and benevolent Holy League have stepped up to support Anthony Drekcsler's ideals and idea for a truly Christian country in the pagan Balkans. Quintonnia has made some serious airstrikes within Hungary, at Austrian forces, using ordnance in such quantities not seen in the Balkans since WWII.

Premier Maxen has established himself a pet country in the Mauritius; Crooked Beat's intentions on whether or not this grass roots democracy will stand is still up in the air. While the intentions of this little state are unsure, it at least has the far-flung financial assets, and thus financial and real capital, to pull itself into the semblance of a real nuisance to those who Maxen feels is to cozy with the French. Whom he hates with a burning desire.



Here's an idea, it might seem a bit insane and bizarre, but go with me on this.....

If you start a new RP thread, post it here. That way, everybody knows what everyone else is doing; at the moment people seem to be just posting threads and other AMW members have to come across them on their own. Otherwise we'll end up with one person invading somewhere, then another person will start up a new thread invading the same area when it could all be dealt with one thread.
I like this idea, I put my support behind the proposal.

Yeah I can't imagine Maxen would feel very friendly towards the French. The whole trying to kill him thing and all.

Though he would probably appreciate the rest of the HL, running to his defence and all.

Oh, no, wait. That's Drekscler. Well, then Maxen would have reason for intense loathing and spite to the HL.

I would like to take the opportunity to bring the worlds attention to a situation in Cyprus, as suspected Communist rebels have attacked a Greek oil tanker, possibly igniting a major ecological crisis in the region.

Guys, if I could have a second of your time.

I'm sorry to say that my time here in AMW has come to an end. I wouldn't be surprised if there are some stifled cheers at that, but whatever. I've been pondering it for a long time, because the truth is that I no longer fit in around here. AMW used to be good political RP and the occasional war, but these days it seems to be war as a top priority and politics if it's remembered. As most of you guys know, I'm not exactly a competent war roleplayer, and geting dragged into a war would only serve to show that even more.

There are other reasons for my decision to leave, and I hope that those who I have talked to about them can understand them. AMW hasn't been fun for me for a long time; I've just hung around, occasionally getting involved but nothing even remotely near the participation that a nation like Japan deserves. I just think Japan is doomed in AMW; first the Ringists and the Bonstock saga, now my own tenure. I've been with AMW since the very beginning in one form or another, and this isn't the easiest thing for me to say, but if I stay any longer then Japan's quality will continue to nosedive.

I think that my continued use of Chiisu has been a factor in the decline of things, so he and Tian will be leaving as well. Japan will go to Quinntonia as a client state with RL Emperor Akihito as Head of State; that way, a new Japan player won't have to worry about any complicated backstory. Well that and the fact that the two characters have had a lot of time invested in them; I admit that I'm being protective of them.

I apologise to the few people who I was involved in a thread with, and I will be privately saying goodbye to those that I had fun with. Both DNK and Marimaia will be moved out of the region as soon as I find another one for them to go to, although DNK won't be around for much longer anyway. I would just like to say thank you for having me, and I hope that AMW continues to thrive and prosper.

Though he would probably appreciate the rest of the HL, running to his defence and all.

Oh, no, wait. That's Drekscler. Well, then Maxen would have reason for intense loathing and spite to the HL.

Yeah I can't imagine Maxen would feel very friendly towards the French. The whole trying to kill him thing and all.
It does have some fun political and unconvincing posturing potential, you know, a little tinpot country who manages to stay in the papers by talkingabout how it has nuclear weapons from the Soviets.

Guys, if I could have a second of your time.

I'm sorry to say that my time here in AMW has come to an end. I wouldn't be surprised if there are some stifled cheers at that, but whatever. I've been pondering it for a long time, because the truth is that I no longer fit in around here. AMW used to be good political RP and the occasional war, but these days it seems to be war as a top priority and politics if it's remembered. As most of you guys know, I'm not exactly a competent war roleplayer, and geting dragged into a war would only serve to show that even more.

There are other reasons for my decision to leave, and I hope that those who I have talked to about them can understand them. AMW hasn't been fun for me for a long time; I've just hung around, occasionally getting involved but nothing even remotely near the participation that a nation like Japan deserves. I just think Japan is doomed in AMW; first the Ringists and the Bonstock saga, now my own tenure. I've been with AMW since the very beginning in one form or another, and this isn't the easiest thing for me to say, but if I stay any longer then Japan's quality will continue to nosedive.

I think that my continued use of Chiisu has been a factor in the decline of things, so he and Tian will be leaving as well. Japan will go to Quinntonia as a client state with RL Emperor Akihito as Head of State; that way, a new Japan player won't have to worry about any complicated backstory. Well that and the fact that the two characters have had a lot of time invested in them; I admit that I'm being protective of them.

I apologise to the few people who I was involved in a thread with, and I will be privately saying goodbye to those that I had fun with. Both DNK and Marimaia will be moved out of the region as soon as I find another one for them to go to, although DNK won't be around for much longer anyway. I would just like to say thank you for having me, and I hope that AMW continues to thrive and prosper.

Well that sure puts my day off to a bad start. I was really thinking you were getting around to be more active, then poof! I will accept all the responsibility for all the war, and politics second. But really, I don't consider getting some more living room and trying to arrest some Hungarian backed terrorists is actually war. :)

Bur', I want (in fact, should) get involved, but your timing is totally wrong. I have finals up in a week and I really need to study (and I am). Which obviously kills any hope of NS for a little bit. Sorry.

Communist Rebels in Cyprus (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=514471)

I would like to once again bring the attention of the world to the situation in Cyprus, and ask the friends of the Hellenic Republic to sympathize with our situation, and send in teams of ecological experts to help clean up the extreme oil spill that kills of more and more wildlife every day.

I really want to do a different RP before I move into the war stage of this, a show of international effort to stop a severe oil spill, I think that it would be kind of fun.

DNK...

Is there anything I could do to convince you to stay? I know a lot of the politics of AMW has taken a backseat to the war; the problem is that the massive African thing never presses forward because we're constantly missing each other due to RL incidents. But I'd really like to retain you here---I still remember fondly the Mafia dealings with Chiisu, and now that I'm finally getting back in the thick of things I'd love to continue to mess around with you. (...that did not come out right.) Please, DNK, give us a second chance. You won't regret it.

Armand, any chance of a response to my actions over your blockade in gunboat diplomacy?

I'll be doing that tonight. Sorry for the delay!

Darn, the Korean role-play is that bad? ;)

Seriously, It will be sad to see you go. However, have you considered a change of scenery? Perhaps playing as a different nation that gets some more involvement might rekindle your interest.

Aw, heck! Just yesterday I was thinking that I kinda miss Marimaia.

I can't imagine that anyone will be cheering your departure, mate. It's a loss to the group.

You're sort of right about the wars, but I think that's just the period that our world is going through, there's a lot of upheaval at the moment. I think that there's still a lot of other things going on, though. The progressive world certainly is involved in a lot of decision making right now.

Does AMW have a UN? If not, I will make one if you alll wouldn't mind.

Does AMW have a UN? If not, I will make one if you alll wouldn't mind.

We wouldn't mind, but that may be the point which prevents it from getting off the ground. The UN is so nice because is has the full support of everyone that's anyone. Here, I doubt the HL would join or really listen, or the Progressives who really aren't interested in partaking in another bourgeoisie scheme at control.

We wouldn't mind, but that may be the point which prevents it from getting off the ground. The UN is so nice because is has the full support of everyone that's anyone. Here, I doubt the HL would join or really listen, or the Progressives who really aren't interested in partaking in another bourgeoisie scheme at control.

Do you have a list of the Holy League members, and also, I have not heard of the progressives.

Do you have a list of the Holy League members, and also, I have not heard of the progressives.

France, Spain (including Portugal), Italy, Tulgary (Belgium, Netherlands, and Luxembourg), Russia and Austria (in everything but name). So just about all of Europe.

The Progressives is just a fancy way to say communists. While their actual position is usually fragmented, when they are all in accordance they're grouped. Yugoslavia would say no, continuing his policy of twiddling its collective thumbs while jumping on Austria when it wants a change of pace, BG could ,but I doubt it, and Spyr wouldn't because it would follow with the mentality of just another attempt at restricting his free will.

France, Spain (including Portugal), Italy, Tulgary (Belgium, Netherlands, and Luxembourg), Russia and Austria (in everything but name). So just about all of Europe.

The Progressives is just a fancy way to say communists. While their actual position is usually fragmented, when they are all in accordance they're grouped. Yugoslavia would say no, continuing his policy of twiddling its collective thumbs while jumping on Austria when it wants a change of pace, BG could ,but I doubt it, and Spyr wouldn't because it would follow with the mentality of just another attempt at restricting his free will.

Damn, well, I think that I may wait until this whole Austrian thing calms down, and everyone wants to talk peace. I hope to be able to host the peace talks.

Good luck with a UN.

I'd be happy to join, but Mesopotamia is quite a minor power, which can be ignored by the big boys in anything but our own region.

I was thinking of setting up a smaller but more ambitious Arab League, but I gave up on that because the rulers of Syria and the Ottomans would never agree to it; relations with Syria are distinctly shaky at the moment, and might even lead to outright conflict.

Good luck with a UN.

I'd be happy to join, but Mesopotamia is quite a minor power, which can be ignored by the big boys in anything but our own region.

I was thinking of setting up a smaller but more ambitious Arab League, but I gave up on that because the rulers of Syria and the Ottomans would never agree to it; relations with Syria are distinctly shaky at the moment, and might even lead to outright conflict.

As I said before, I think I am going to make it after this whole thing in Europe calms down (I have hidden my country in a bunker, and when it is all over, I will peep my little head out and run amok through the entire Contient, it will be mine, mine I tell you :) Jk)


I would really like to get some reations with you though, as you have this black slimy stuff that would benefit my nation very much. What is your AIM terror?

Don't have AIM. I can send you my MSN if you have that. (check TGs).
Otherwise feel free to work things out IC as we go in my thread:
Mesopotamia! (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=511416)

Basically we'll deal with just about anyone, though we're wary and distrustful of the Holy League.

In AMW history, there was already one attempt to form an 'United Nations', spearheaded by Russia's Vladimir Putin. Obviously, it failed to come to fruition, due to lack of support if I recall correctly. Spyr for one objected to use of 'God-given rights' in the proposed charter, ostensibly on behalf of those who did not hold religious views, though it is likely such objections would have vanished had the phrase been changed to 'rights under Heaven'.

I had always imagined the most secure base for a forum of world governments would be an expansion of the International Law of the Sea... while the nature of such treaties as the Geneva Conventions has not really been established in AMW, the Law of the Sea was oft quoted in AMW's first roleplay (the Malacca War), firmly establishing both its existence and its seriousness... it was a violation of it that justified war against the Federal Republic of Bonstock by a coalition of states with otherwise-divergent political views. Something neither wholesale violations of sovreignty, violations of 'human rights', nor even genocide have managed to do.

Putin sort of gave up on the idea after he realized it would hamper his schemes for the Baltic invasion...I'd say the best way a UN could form is if it started, as Spyr suggests, as a means to regulate international waterways. If we had an organization in charge of the Suez and Malacca, then we could perhaps avoid such crises.

Uhm, sheepish look from the Al Khali corner

I think that I have made a mistake.

I have wanted to lead a sort of revolutionary movement and state, and not one that is lovely and democratic like the Indians, or even prosperous and successful like the Combiners, Strainists, and Yugoslavians. Hence the Ba'ath aspect of Qottar's Al Khali restoration. It seems that we have a shortage of failing revolutions in AMW, given how unstable the world is. Everyone who tries to bring liberty or prosperity, whatever be their aim, seems to achieve it, whether by direct democracy, workplace self-management, or monarchist restoration.

I've gone too far ahead of myself in Syria. Qottar is already established, he has somehow managed to win too many friends, and at the same time if he starts trouble with his Mesopotamian neighbours there is no real prospect of anything but almost immediate and total defeat. I want to play a bit of a disaster or, no, a struggle, not a hapless puppet!

I am finding much appeal in the idea of a Latin American revolution. Probably Central American. It might be inspired by the apparent victory of the Anarchists to the south, but it certainly would not proceed in the same fashion.

I thought to perhaps slip Syria back into NPC, now that we have at least one or two active Middle Eastern players (in places more important than Syria!), though it would be fine if Qottar's Ba'athists remain in power, just replacing the RL Ba'athists and shaking impotent fists at Baghdad as Washington pressures them into unblocking the vital waterways into Mesopotamia.

And to make a fictional country out of Costa Rica and Panama...

I realise that the Panama Canal exists by that name and is under US control, but if anything that might be a partial cause of trouble. I would have to talk to Quinntonia about the history and operation of the Canal, but I am sure that we could find a friendly way to make the people resentful!

I would like to try to conduct a very organic revolution and create a totally inexperienced government struggling in a mire of constant counter-revolution, corruption, insurrection, criminality, and North American meddling.

CR and P. would give a population of about 7.25 million, but I recognise that in reality Costa Rica is relatively stable and prosperous, so would have to work out a revised history. Perhaps Panama's break from Gran Colombia and Costa Rica's from the United Provinces of Central America the two created a new federation in the late 1830s. This new country would have been the one that negotiated for the construction of the Panama Canal, and Costa Rica would have inherited something of Panama's history of trouble with Colombia and the United States.

I am not sure if people will object to me jumping around like this, but I do confess that I went about things entirely the wrong way in Syria and would like a clean slate on which to do them right.

Also, the country may be a source of amusement due to its attempts to function on a global stage in spite of dramatic ineptitude and catastrophic inexperience in both revolutionary politcs and governance on the part of the leadership.

Well, there, I have said it!

What is it about me and canals?

Aww, I was looking forward to bullying you over the canals.

Not least because with the tension with the Combine over their blockade, and a wary eye on Ottoman ambitions in Jordan, tension with Syria left me a very high chance of over-stretching myself if I wasn't careful or lucky.
An informal deal has been reached with the Combine; a deal with Syria, while ICly welcome, leaves me with only Jordan to watch, essentially.
That's fine; it leaves a different set of challenges, including facing off against a power of unknown strength, with possible Quinntonian support, over an external territory. It'll just be a little less fun.

Al Khals, that's some freaky timing considering that I too came up with a Central/South America idea, although it's not for an actual nation, per se.

After receiving quite a few TGs asking me to reconsider and bombarding me with new ideas for me to try in AMW, alright, I'll stay. Japan can be moved into semi-NPC status, with or without Emperor Shinseiki depending on what people think is best. A factbook for Japan will be completed so that if we get someone new who wants to try their hand at Japan, they'll have all the info at hand. If any RPs desperately call for Japan to be involved, then I'll do my best.

Now, on to *the idea*. There are a lot of loose ends in South America, like the vacuum left by the death of the Mafiya and the Pacific Lotus moving to Japan, as well as the various states which have been abandoned both by new players who left and the alts which established players created and later dumped. The idea also draws on an old idea of AC's, if you remember the Apostles. Basically I propose to play a shadowy group which steps into the vacuum and begins consolidating itself before becoming a thorn in the side of just about everyone in the region (or an ally of convenience if someone is interested enough).

Now for the bit that I expect will be the largest bone of contention. This organisation has been inspired by both fictional and factual groups such as the Kameradenwerk, ODESSA, Millennium (cookie for those who know that one), the Ahnenerbe, and others. Saying this, I know what the NS rules on that type of thing are, so we're not talking full-fledged Nazis goosestepping through the streets of Lima or rants about 'international Jewry' or things like that. We're talking occasional recognition of the group's roots but that's about it. No Hitler clones or Bormann living in South America either. It probably doesn't need to be said, but I shall state the disclaimer anyway: I am not a Nazi, this organisation would not be glorifying Nazism, it is for the purpose of roleplaying only. Yes, I'm hammering home the message.

So....a bit too controversial or is it permissible?

I've also thought of RPing again in South America to be honest. I have been in touch with Franberry about the state of things in the Confederacy, and basically I would be playing a Chinese-sponsored military coup in La Plata given the good relations between the ROCA and the Confederacy armed forces.

Only if no one else wants to claim the country of course, It will be more of a part-time RP to fill an empty region of the world - which would actually be best served by a couple of full-time RPers.

I support Al Khals' and DNK's proposals. I've moved around enough myself, so there's no grounds for me to object, and it will be nice to have some full-time players in South America. Indeed, I think the INU is not exactly the most realistic of nations, and if I could do it again I'd make it more alike the RL Republic of India.

Anyways, full approval for Al Khals and DNK seems to me completely reasonable. Also, if you ever find yourselves getting lonely, I've also considered a move to Central America, on account of nothing has happened for some RL months in the Commonwealth of Mozambique. And if you find Central Asia not to your liking, there are still India's seven sisters for the taking.

I have a few issues with the Al Khals thing, but not that many. I would love to see some activity in Central America, or even South America, my only issue would be with the Panama situation. The USQ considers the Panama Canal its rightful possession and part of the strategic plan of all NATO military movement. As such, it has a major military presence in Panama, though it doesn’t interfere with local government beyond providing aid and keeping up the canal but sharing its profits with the Panamanian government. It would most likely not be threatened by a local change in government, but any move to nationalize the canal would be considered and act of war on USQ itself, and would be responded to by total regime change to a more genial government, using whatever means necessary to achieve that task.

Beyond that, the RPing opportunities are pretty open. USQ aid money could float a corrupt government, you could whine about NATO interference in the canal. Even attempts to nationalize the canal could be fun, but I assure you short lived as Royce and I invade your nation with one soldier for every 6-7 people. But USQ would pretty much stay out of your business as long as you stayed out of its.

But as for Syria, I would say that you should keep it as your nation as well, as you have invested much in it, and it is pretty important to the region that it is in, now that UE is gone. I would hate to see you leave the Middle East.

WWJD
Amen.

Bump to get views for my previous post.

There would certainly be a lot of focus from the revolutionaries on the real and imagined corruption/oppression/imperialism/theft of the USQ and NATO in regards to the Canal Zone and the military presence, but it would be in character and usually backed up by inept if well-meaning/determined/brave actions... or nothing more than ranting to gain political Brownie points at home. Heck, we might even end up looking for agreements to sustain belligerence in order to give the people an enemy and make the revolutionaries look heroic!

...though that would probably be exposed and lead to another coup attempt, of course!

I wouldn't mind some meddling from DNK's lot, so long as I can keep up.

I think that I may go back in time to begin the revolution, and come up to the present day, perhaps when the rebels win. Perhaps.

Jumping around like this from continent to continent I can't really object to China's plans, or at least the attempt of them.

I was tempted to ask for a sort of United States of Central America thang with Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, and El Salvador in there as well, and a big problem with Belize (what's going on there since UE collapsed?) and Yanqui imperialism in Mexico! But I think that having a country that sucks might be more fun. Perhaps we'll make the USCA our lofty revolutionary ambition in which we have about as much chance of success as a monarchist restoration in the Soviet State of Sri Lanka.

I'd be glad to see neighbours in Nicaragua et cetera, anyway. Co-conspirators or dastardly juntas, it's all good.

I'll be willing to be a part-time Syria, if people desire it. A new player can take my place there at any time, either as the Ba'athists or their successors, but if you need to contact Syria until then I shall still respond on their behalf. At the moment it is safe to assume that Qottar is desperately trying to find a way to save face while backing-down on his dam idea, and wants to shoot down a few HL bombers to that end.

Now only one thing remains... what to call my little country!

How about I seize Syria in a coup? I've always wanted to add another jewel to my Combine empire...

How about I seize Syria in a coup? I've always wanted to add another jewel to my Combine empire...

You're free to try, but obviously that would make me, um, *extremely uncomfortable*, so my intervention would probably match yours in scale to keep things bogged down without resorting to open war.
Could be fun though, proxy war in Syria.

I was tempted to ask for a sort of United States of Central America thang with Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, and El Salvador in there as well, and a big problem with Belize (what's going on there since UE collapsed?) and Yanqui imperialism in Mexico!

Belize is a Roycelandian quasi-Protectorate, in that we're supplying arms and training etc to the Belizians, but we have no real military presence in the country. Our role basically involves having the Belizian Dollar pegged to the Imperial Wibble, having a couple of Dreadnaughts in the area if needed, and generally making sure that life in the Caribbean goes on as normal...

We need some South American players. But if anyone tries to do anything Soviet crazy Germany will invade.

Im back, and im extremely bad, :)

How about I seize Syria in a coup? I've always wanted to add another jewel to my Combine empire...

*cough* NotunlessIgetitfirst *cough* I didn't say anything. :D Anyway, as TI proposed, proxy war in Syria might be an interesting little exercise. I'm all for it.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=515839

Two bullets begin the production....

*cough* NotunlessIgetitfirst *cough* I didn't say anything. :D Anyway, as TI proposed, proxy war in Syria might be an interesting little exercise. I'm all for it.

Looks like me and you might be engaged in Syria and Jordan at the same time....I don't know whether to look forward to that or dread it, largely because I have no idea how strong the Ottomans are...

Ah, yesss, all of you assorted infidels engaged in Syria, a perfect back door for the Amir al-Muminin and his Mujahideen into not just Syria but Mesopotamia, Anatolia, and maybe more!

And fingers steeple...

Looks like me and you might be engaged in Syria and Jordan at the same time....I don't know whether to look forward to that or dread it, largely because I have no idea how strong the Ottomans are...

Stronger than you. :p No, really, economic powerhouse (at the moment!), and their military has been heavily revamped, so, yeah.

So....a bit too controversial or is it permissible?
I adore the idea of an active South America, it has always seemed a little half baked, to many people without enough skill coming in and leaving.

Actually, I think you watered down the whole idea to the degree the question beomes repetitive.

I like the idea of a Neo-Nazi movement in South America with some historical facts to back the idea up, maybe have a Catholic State, always ready to jump of the cliff if the Pope says so, that eagerly accepted European 'refugees' in return for less time in the purgatory. Yet as more of these refugees appeared to have significant ideas, and a receptive popular base, the government launched an attempt to re-educate them which just lead to a power strugle with a Neo-Nazi government.

Of course you can do whatever, I'm just brainstorming.

I've also thought of RPing again in South America to be honest. I have been in touch with Franberry about the state of things in the Confederacy, and basically I would be playing a Chinese-sponsored military coup in La Plata given the good relations between the ROCA and the Confederacy armed forces.

Only if no one else wants to claim the country of course, It will be more of a part-time RP to fill an empty region of the world - which would actually be best served by a couple of full-time RPers.

It sure doesn't sound to orignal, which is always the point in having a second country, but maybe with all these idealists there needs to be a cynical, down to Earth, government.

Of course! I think AMW is lacking in right-wing military dictatorships, mass disappearances of political opponents, and drug wars since Sino left. (Which is really what I would like to do for a while - China is too socialist to really have fun with lately)

greek elections! (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=516070)

At one point UE indicated that the Elians had supported Pinochet's dictatorship in Chile, or a similar government, up until the present day. With the collapse of United Elias, that might be a jumping-off point for someone's South American roleplay.

I adore the idea of an active South America, it has always seemed a little half baked, to many people without enough skill coming in and leaving.

Actually, I think you watered down the whole idea to the degree the question beomes repetitive.

I like the idea of a Neo-Nazi movement in South America with some historical facts to back the idea up, maybe have a Catholic State, always ready to jump of the cliff if the Pope says so, that eagerly accepted European 'refugees' in return for less time in the purgatory. Yet as more of these refugees appeared to have significant ideas, and a receptive popular base, the government launched an attempt to re-educate them which just lead to a power strugle with a Neo-Nazi government.

Of course you can do whatever, I'm just brainstorming.

I do admit that my group are watered-down Nazis, but then again there's no point in including Nazi-esque elements if they aren't needed to tell the story. There may be the occasional salute to the leader of the group and mention of their past but I have no plans for them to be an overt group. Nazism received an almighty smackdown the first time round; it changed the world, but not in the way that Hitler may have wanted. Odds are that an overtly Nazi state anywhere in AMW would not be able to last very long; this group are very realistic about their chances. Working through others and keeping to the shadows allows for greater chance of survival.

Maybe there will be a new Fatherland carved out of South America with this lot lighting the way, but that's not a consideration for now.

Fatherland you say? I'd be cool with that.

Would anybody object if I took to RPing as El Salvador for a little while? Not much is happening down in Mozambique, and I'd love to get in on this exciting new strain of South American business.

If approved, I plan to play El Salvador as the Republic of Cuscatalan, headed by the eccentric and brutal Generalissimo Hector-Dominic de Guzman, a strongman's strongman.

Eh, works for me.

Go for it. More right wing dictators in AMW the merrier!

::Shifts eyes towards Germany:: In most places, that is...

But a Christian theocracy on your border that believes that you are dragging the name of Christ through the mud is better? LOL!

WWJD
Amen.

Well, Ill take what I can get.

I would rather have Shultz than Hitler.

/me mobilizes troops

Let's remember that most of the atrocities perpetrated by Nazis against the French were French collaberators, not occupiers. If you are speaking about the holocaust, that is.

WWJD
Amen.

Let's remember that most of the atrocities perpetrated by Nazis against the French were French collaberators, not occupiers. If you are speaking about the holocaust, that is.

WWJD
Amen.

Same shit different smell, it hardly matters, it's not like the French made up the idea of Jewish destruction all on their own, because remember the saying "it's the thought that counts." In this case meaning they styled themselves after the Germans, it hardly mattered they were from France.

Hey, would any of you guys be into placing an AMW tech cap at, say, 1955? It seems like doing so would reduce the amount of disputes we have over each other's capabilities etc. Not to mention, it would be wicked cool. Personally I strongly advocate this because it would be awesome, and would level the playing field somewhat. Fighting would, it seems to me, become more straightforward, since we could use known history as our reference. A past-tech conversion would take a bit of time but I think it would be worth it both in awesomeness and in ease of operation, so to speak. We've already got something like that going with Al Khals and Costa Paz, and it looks extremely promising.

I might argue the exact dating, but I would be for a tech cap at some piont. Maybe 1955 might be a little much, though.

WWJD
Amen.

I've often thought about a WWII-era or early Cold War AMW, and found it appealing, but thought it likely to be too much work.

I don't know. I'm interested, at least. I suppose I could start using my created technology in mainstream NS so it wouldn't feel like a waste. But I'm not sure if everyone would feel the same way. And how would we go about it?

If nothing else, would we re-write the history, rewind it, or simply ignore any inconsistencies that arise?

I'd be in favour of capping Military tech at c. 1965.

Computers, TVs, DVD players, the internet, cars, etc could be as modern as the player liked, but military tech would basically be limited to what was in existence at the outbreak of the Vietnam War.

Oddly enough, this basically wouldn't involve changing much, if anything, from Roycelandia's point of view :-P

That would be...bizarre. We would need some justification for why military technology hadn't moved on while new materials revolutionised so many other things.
Infantry is the combat arm least affected by new technology, and yet...From the return of (reasonably) effective body armour after several centuries, to ever lighter, faster-firing rifles, to far, far better combat radios, better boots, everything a modern infantryman carries is better than what his predecessor in the 60's had, sometimes almost beyond compare.
My point, I guess, is that in every example I'm aware of, the military is first with new technology; even when it isn't developed for the military it is soon picked up.
It's only human, and a world of the 2000's with military equipment stuck in the 60's just doesn't fit. Either we take everything back, or nothing, or we lose any claim to realism we could ever have had.

Here's the problem: It's almost impossible (IMHO) to have decent RPs based around modern tech, because it all degenerates into number-wanking.

I mean, really, for all practical RP purposes, there's no appreciable difference between a Quinntonian F-22, a Roycelandian Jetfire, or a Soviet... whatever they use. ;)

Air-to-Air combat involving guided missiles does not make for good RP, I'm afraid.

Similarly, it really doesn't matter whether soldiers on the ground are armed with M-16s, AK-47s, SLLE Mk IIIs, L1A1s, or INSAS rifles. In fact, I think part of the reason we have such major set-piece Naval Battles is because that's about the only area where individual units can have some kind of appreciable advantage over another kind of unit...

Hey, would any of you guys be into placing an AMW tech cap at, say, 1955? It seems like doing so would reduce the amount of disputes we have over each other's capabilities etc. Not to mention, it would be wicked cool. Personally I strongly advocate this because it would be awesome, and would level the playing field somewhat. Fighting would, it seems to me, become more straightforward, since we could use known history as our reference. A past-tech conversion would take a bit of time but I think it would be worth it both in awesomeness and in ease of operation, so to speak. We've already got something like that going with Al Khals and Costa Paz, and it looks extremely promising.

It sure sounds promising; I don't really care, there are benefits for using MT (Who doesn't like having some uber-MBTs?) and APT (Almost-Past Tech, historical references).

Well- Id be happy capping it at around, say, the C 18th, but oh well. Capping everything that is, say, in 1788?

I like the idea. And I agree with Royce's comments in regards to naval battles. Especially for players like myself, who are not that technologically literate, the idea would be especially easy to implement.

To be sure, I dont know how it would work into the current war. Almost seems to me like well have to wait until thats done, at least resolved in some fashion, before a reboot occurs.

Still, very ambitious. I just saw a fantastic version of one of my favorite classics Les Liasons Dangereuses the other night, set in 1960's high society France. Stunning. Catherine Deneuve was ravishing, and the props and such were typically and elegantly classic French. So yah, lets go back to the sixties, and I will make it considerably less groovy.

I think this requires some major thought before we move on it. Would we just move AMW back to 1965 en masse? And then push our histories back? So, the restorations would have occurred in the 50's? No Soviet Russia at all? These are major considerations. I might be more in favour of a later cap, but whatever. My basic issue is with so many people having "theoretical tech" and claiming that the latest "Roman Class Cruisers" are far more advanced than a RL equivalent. I think that if we had to make a comprehensive list of all of our equipment that included direct equivalents to RL tech, it would solve a lot of the problems. I see that LRR did that on invision.

So, for Royce, I would say that a list of your equipment would have something like Spitfire, equivalent to F/A-18s, Lancaster Bomber, equivalent to Lancer Bomber, etc. That would stop the frustration of trying to play “modern tech” but having people constantly claim that if you use RL tech, that their tank or whatever is a whole generation more advanced than yours. I think we are on the right track with sensing a problem, but I am not sure that backdating is the best way to go.

Though, an offshoot RP set in 1960’s would be pretty cool. The one that is started is promising.

WWJD
Amen.

I'm in favour of a tech-change; an across the board change to about 1960, conducted after the resolution of the Suez Crisis.
What I'm not sure about, however, is how we treat the history - whether everything that has happened, has happened with lower technology, whether this means playing our nations as they were in 1960, or something else...

I honestly don't care that much. Ottomans are in the 60s, anyway (or were, until the Roycelandians and Quinntonians got involved. Meddlers!). Whatever we choose, I'll go with the flow.

To be honest as giulty as i am of tachwanking ever so slightly ;) it really wouldn't change things all that much for strathdonia if a move to the 1960s occured: the army would still have centurions and shermans for its tanks, the infantry would have FALs and brens and SMLEs and the airforce would still have jet fighters (ok so gnats, vampires and at huge stretch Lightnings!!!!).
In the civilian sector things wouldn't be too difficult to adapt to, while IT industry offshoreing wouldn't exist a alrgish pool of well educated yet cheap engineers plus reasonable industrial caapcity woudl help thigns along, as would a non drought blighted agriculture sector, heck strathdonia could even be biulding comets and tridents under license!!!

of coruse histroically Strathdonia was still part of Rhodesia-Nyasaland at the time(from what ic an gather from the acient SSa back story)

Now, if the point of this is to stop the arguments, though, I think it is still doomed to failure. There is still much room to argue.
WWJD
Amen.

What I had in mind was indeed a cap on military tech, although limitations on technology in general would likely have to follow.

The issue of history is sticky indeed, and I admit I didn't give it too much thought. My initial idea had been to keep things as they are, and simply to back-date all our technology. Perhaps the first world war had more the character of the Franco-Prussian War, and the Second World War was more alike the first.

Restorations could have, I think, taken place during the 1950s, especially in France. Perhaps De Gaulle's role was taken by a member of the Bourbon family, whose absolutism was nonetheless attractive to Frenchmen suffering from government instability following the termination of the second world war. Equally Tsar Wingert could have taken advantage of the situation in postwar Russia to launch a revolt against Stalin and ensure an independent Ukraine. Of course, there are a great many other historical concerns that would remain to be resolved, and it seems easier just to back-date technology.

I guess my main concern remains our ability to come to a consensus on modern-tech issues. By back-dating our technology, and thus limiting ourselves to only the most basic missile armaments, we remove a major point of contention, and rely only on proven technologies which might be easier to reference.

Personally I am somewhat tired of RPing in modern tech. Too much advanced technology. But whatever we decide to do, I'll follow. And if its any help, I'll gladly adjust the militaries of AMW to 1960s tech.

I dont think we will suddenly make people stop arguing. They will just start arguing about old tech. Like Quinn said, nothing will change.

Yeah, because, like, I'll have to point out that what Royce said doesn't make a blind bit of sense, unfortunately, because, as we've seen, even infantry arms do make a huge difference. The Drapoel slaughtered their enemies at range by using 7.7mm long rifles against chumps with 4.6mm personal-defence-weapons, and Hotan would probably be dead or in Quinntonian custody today were it not for that simple fact alone, utterly changing the course of AMW history from the get-go.

Sometimes I think that it's just easier to argue, when cases can be dismissed as easily as that =/

I don't think that it is going to be possible to put AMW back without killing far too much of it, ignoring more than can reasonably be ignored, and so on. Plus, the name would kinda ring a little bit false, eh?..

I do want to do this kind of pre-modern RP, but I doubt that I'd have time to do pre-modern stuff and AMW, and doing this would be to do something other than what AMW is, so, I suppose, it would mean the death of AMW. That was a bit clumsy, but I'm busy with Wiki and it's stealing half of my concentration.

I guess I can't input much since I've been drawn away from AMW for RL reasons lately, but personally, I'd rather avoid going back. I prefer modern tech for the vast capabilities it gives us in RP---limited primitive tech may be simpler to deal with, but it's just not as exciting, to be honest. Technical gadgetry and innovation add a lot of character, and make things more pressing and modern. I'm all for a past tech RP side bit, but not a full on one. Plus I feel it wouldn't really solve the problem; we'd just be arguing past tech as opposed to current tech.

How about we make equivalents, and then base our victories not on who has better technical knowledge but who has better strategy?

But using different equipment correctly is part of employing the right tactics, of course. The Drapoel could have used their closest equivalent to the P90 when western forces attacked Da'Khiem, but then they would have had to overwhelm the enemy at close quarters and the battle, and following diplomacy, would have been different... the enemy made the wrong equipment choice and got a kicking for it. That happens in real life. It'd be much too formulaic if we all had equivalent technology, and I wouldn't be able to get over how unrealistic it is for the United States to be using post-mounted SAMs on its newest warships, or for the Nigerians to have dual-range VLS banks, whichever way we equalised things.

snippet
How about we make equivalents, and then base our victories not on who has better technical knowledge but who has better strategy?

I argee one hundred percent, not having equivalants gets irritating pretty quickly. Not having a list makes the argument degenerate into, its better and superior because i say so.

I think our minds are just made to debate and changing the era A Modern World operators out of is just treating the symptoms (debating over technology) and not the actual disease. I hardly think the disease can be treated, unless gene therapy for less defined features of the brain like self-worth and "I'm always right"-ness. We're just going to (gasp!) get along, understand that Russian's don't thro rocks these days and African nations do have the ability to do more then send a WWI-era biplane in the sky.

But using different equipment correctly is part of employing the right tactics, of course. The Drapoel could have used their closest equivalent to the P90 when western forces attacked Da'Khiem, but then they would have had to overwhelm the enemy at close quarters and the battle, and following diplomacy, would have been different... the enemy made the wrong equipment choice and got a kicking for it. That happens in real life. It'd be much too formulaic if we all had equivalent technology, and I wouldn't be able to get over how unrealistic it is for the United States to be using post-mounted SAMs on its newest warships, or for the Nigerians to have dual-range VLS banks, whichever way we equalised things.

Having equivalents does not mean we'd be equalizing anything, BG; it'd just mean that any Nigerian fighters I invented, for example, would have to have an equivalent to another RL fighter. But that fighter would be an old, less reliable type suitable for my nation.

I don't really see the point. Except for people who don't want to sit around designing systems for their nations. If anyone wants to detail their machines well enough then people can read and understand their capabilities. If they can't do that (understand the significance of given specifications) then they can't understand what it means to be equivalent to a MiG-29A or a Tornado GR.1, anyway.

I'm going to be completely honest with you guys on something here, and it's a little... embarrassing, but here we go:

I just can't follow modern military tech. I don't understand how Guided Missiles work (beyond the basic principles), I don't understand how Anti-Guided Missile Defence Systems Work, nor do I understand thrust-to-weight ratios, nor how ANY modern military item (except firearms) differs from any other in any real practical sense.

Tanks and infantry related stuff I can work with, but I'm at a loss to understand how Naval Battles nowadays don't involve massive Destroyers trying to shell each other. I just can't see missile duels as being... practical for some reason.

There, I've said it. I'll be in the corner drinking my sorrows away if anyone needs me... :(

Well, we've a land-war in East Africa coming on, and General Aiyana is in a bit of a tizz over his lack of healthy, ready manpower in the face of what is likely to be a combined Soviet-Hindustani-Combine invasion of his Empire-in-waiting. And it's not like he'll need to actually end up with Eritrea, Somalia, and Djibouti. Cough cough.

There are plenty of modern things that I don't understand. That's why neither Dra-pol nor Abassamara are well known for, you know, having electricity. Witchery.

I'm going to be completely honest with you guys on something here, and it's a little... embarrassing, but here we go:

I just can't follow modern military tech. I don't understand how Guided Missiles work (beyond the basic principles), I don't understand how Anti-Guided Missile Defence Systems Work, nor do I understand thrust-to-weight ratios, nor how ANY modern military item (except firearms) differs from any other in any real practical sense.

Tanks and infantry related stuff I can work with, but I'm at a loss to understand how Naval Battles nowadays don't involve massive Destroyers trying to shell each other. I just can't see missile duels as being... practical for some reason.

There, I've said it. I'll be in the corner drinking my sorrows away if anyone needs me... :(

It's inevitable that you won't be the only one. The only solution I can see is to have rough equivalents, so consider SA80 equivalent to M16, for example, and SLR equivalent to the M14, and then RP as though equivalents are the same, thus if both sides are using M16-equivalents the victor comes down to RP, not tech.
That doesn't allow for special capabilities (e.g. M40 grenade launchers), and I suppose we'd have to make some allowance for things like that, but...it gives us a bodge solution that should work well enough.
The reason why that makes turning back the tech desirable, of course, is that it means _everything_ will have some RL equivalent, whereas in modern times something being developed now might well not have a direct equivalent, and can thus be argued as better than all that has come before, with no inconvenient RL teething troubles.

EDIT: I've realised one reason I haven't used much military hardware yet, is that I don't really understand where Elias' old kit comes on any scale. Half his stuff, I have no real idea what it equates to, or what role it should be used in.

Most of UE's old stuff was pretty high end or at least high end upgrades of older designs, such as his bomber force which consisted of very well upgraded former russian cold war bombers (Tu-22Ms i think).
His helos were vaguely similar to the MD-90, UH-1Y, OH-1 and Merlin witha fair few upgraded Mi-8/17/24s thrown in (i know this as i operate a number of Elain upgraded Hips and Hinds). probably the msot far out design he had was the EA-220 stealthy light bomber which was basically the US navy's cancelled A-12 design and was actually originally a NS joint development, there may even be a few Crookfur parts mentioned in the write up.


On the issue of equivelents, things do tend to depend on the scale being RPed. For example in a tight focus squad-paltoon level rp the difference between different rifle designs will be a major factor, but by the time you get above battalion levels the amount of men and heavier equipment pretty much renders diffrrences between indivdual small arms pointless as it really wont make a difference either way wither troops have AKs, M16s or FALs just as logn as they have some kind of self loading rifle.
if we move into the field of missiles exactly how much do you need to know? you simply point them at the target wait for the lock signal and fire them hoping that they hit. Ok so that over simplfies things but in a alrge scale Rp do we really need to know how the pilot or WO uses the different radar modes, cues up the missile and yells "Fox 2" while mashing the pickle button? The answer is no, in practice with air to air missiles you have 3 catagories dog fighting missiles (sidewinder etc), medium range BVR missiles (AMRAAM, sparrow, R-77 etc) and logn rnage missiles (Pheonix, meteor etc).


Actually even as i think about, turning the clock back will not sovle thigns as it will (almsot invairably for a UK player) lead to the rebirth of various "failed" projects, i.e. a semi intelligent UK government in the Uk enviroemnt would not have scrapped the EM-2, Rotodyne or TSR-2 and msot likely never have published the lunatic white paper on the demise of manned aircraft, leading to many of the british cold war aircraft actually getting the attention they deserved. The same would likely be true for a number of other nations. The Rotodyne probabaly is the best example of a what might have been as if the government hadn't bowed to US preasure to buy the chinook then the world vtol market would be very different as if the Fairey design had suceeded you can bet the russians would have made more of an effort on thier versions of the concept.

*snip*

Don't worry Royce' - I don't get much of this type of thing either. *goes off to sit in the same corner* I manage to survive, though, by using amazingly primitive technology, and only recently upgrading to slightly used US tech. Yup, that's me.

I don't think any of us are military engineers nor do we study at military academies. Any knowledge we have is probably gained from wikipedia, hardly an authoritative source, or maybe like Quinntopia we have read a couple of books. Sure technical things are occasionally interesting but a quality RP should be the goal, not about who knows the most about thrust weight ratios.

It's inevitable that you won't be the only one. The only solution I can see is to have rough equivalents, so consider SA80 equivalent to M16, for example, and SLR equivalent to the M14, and then RP as though equivalents are the same, thus if both sides are using M16-equivalents the victor comes down to RP, not tech.
That doesn't allow for special capabilities (e.g. M40 grenade launchers), and I suppose we'd have to make some allowance for things like that, but...it gives us a bodge solution that should work well enough.
The reason why that makes turning back the tech desirable, of course, is that it means _everything_ will have some RL equivalent, whereas in modern times something being developed now might well not have a direct equivalent, and can thus be argued as better than all that has come before, with no inconvenient RL teething troubles.

The irony is that firearms are the one area of modern military tech that I *do* have a comprehensive understanding of. It's just that most of the tanks and aeroplanes all seem much the same nowadays, which makes it hard to see how they differ from one another in any meaningful sense.

Eh, you guys are right, as usual.

It would still be cool, that I maintain, but, yes, likely unworkable in the present AMW framework.

Still, I do agree with the sentiment of simplifying things a bit. I'm a writer and amateur politician by trade, not a military engineer; I try to learn as much as I can, but honestly, most of the technical details are far beyond me. That's one reason why I tend to engage only in wars where I have massive numerical superiority and why I use the undisputable best equipment---no one's going to argue over the technical differences between an F-22 and a WWI era biplane.

I still find the idea of pre-modern RP appealing, but doubt either that it would solve technical disputes or that I would have enough time for it.

I'd like to make the Geletian charge a larger part of Beddgelen warfare, again. Maybe one day we should do a retrospective RP deep in the past, and India would be a good place for it. The Armandians and Geletians slashing at one another, the Roycelandians, Tulgarians, the rising Walmingtonians, French, and others trying to impose their claims on the sub-continent's resources and pitting muskets against compound bows and broadswords...

Oh, damn it, I've already got too much to do, including finding a new job. Ach, back to the search.

I think the biggest flaw with AMW, more than any technological aspects of RP, is the lack of character driven RP. In other words, the majority of posts we do is about war/troop movements/war-related topics, not all that different from NS general.

I think the biggest flaw with AMW, more than any technological aspects of RP, is the lack of character driven RP. In other words, the majority of posts we do is about war/troop movements/war-related topics, not all that different from NS general.

Quite right, my favourite AMW Rps have been the bits i have done surrounding Derek Morgan (reminds me i need to finish off McGhinty's escape from Lusaka and capture by the NBS so that i cna get Morgan shifted up north to give the french a good kicking. NG do you have any really nasty stereo typical hollywood special forces officer baddy types kicking around for Morgan to spar with? or maybe even the Scarlet Pimpernil? i promise not to make Morgan too much like Chuck Norris...).

Yes, Id love to! The Scarlet Pimpernel is available, and working with his crack team, the same that bested the A-Team now two years ago.

I think a duel between monarchist and devoutly Catholic thug teams and your enterprising protestant mosque brigades would be superb. I have only one question:

When and where?

You coming to me, or am I coming to you?

Bested? I beg to differ! Who ran off with billions worth of French gold, mmm? I say this calls for a return of Mr. T...

Damn straight AC. Lets get this on! All we need is a tableau...or tableaux...where shall our duels be gentlemen. I think Paris sounds fun, I havent had a chance to do much RP there, but there has already been somewhat of a duel there. Suggestions? Plot? Agenda?

Personally i find that the situation needs to be really bad for Morgan to be involved and he is most defiantly not a spy or secret agent so actually inflitrating anywhere would be out of the question, which would bring us nicely to western Africa: lots of conflict, a rapidly shifting frontline and plenty of ongoing behind the lines action.

Maybe Morgan is leading a particularly succesful group of resistance fighters in one of the ECOWAS antions aiding them with good radios, electroncis and nice upto date intel sat imagery "aquried" from various soruces.
If Morgan is involved in or around ECOWAS then it would likely be in a far more official role than usual and he might not just be there with mercenaries instead having a few "men who foccially don't exist or are offically in a special isolation block of the SDF stockade" aroudn to help, oh yeah and McGhinty will be paying back his dues, mainly by makign things explode in interesting ways...

of coruse to get to that point i have a fair bit of back story to finish...

Mes amis!

I have opened a new thread for our spy games, with a bit of back ground myself!

Enjoy!

Spy vs. Spy vs. Spy (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=518294)

Our spy games: Asim Bahir is, I suppose, a "super-spy", but not in the traditional mould.
At least in the sense that he doesn't drink, doesn't take drugs, doesn't sleep with women (though he'll happily wine and dine them). Just so everyone knows, though I'm sure it'll come out in the next few posts.