NationStates Jolt Archive

Do you believe human beings should be treated as human beings, or as machines to be squeezed and crushed for ever more senseless profit, and robbed of the fruits of their labour?

Vote for a party which recognises you as a human being!
Vote for a party with real policies for a better society!

Vote UDCP!

VOTE
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MOBRA we have Cookies and Wrath!

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I notice that 'freedom' is on the left, while you're a right wing party...:p

VOTE ESP - BECAUSE I CAN'T THINK UP A WITTY SLOGAN RIGHT NOW!

No, I got the idea to post on this thread because I was an MP in the last parliament which Ariddia unilaterally disbanded
When Parliaments are unable to pass legislation, they become disbanded; such is the nature of the Parliamentary system.

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BUMPed by The MLP

END 6 MONTHS OF CONSERVATIVE LED GOVERNMENT!
VOTE FOR CHANGE!



This time...
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Vote for the UDCP! Vote for change that actually means something!

Vote for the ESP! Vote for change that actually means nothing!

hmm, an Alliance between the New British Imperialist Party, Emphatically Silly Party and Mole and Other Burrowing Rodents' Alliance would put them straight into second place, only one vote behind the current leaders.

Surely their policies aren't so different that they wouldn't take this opportunity to emerge as the surprise winners?

Vote for a Government led by Silly British Moles!

VOTE
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I am a conservative but that is a crap logo

NSCONSERVATIVEPARTY Checklist

Support Freedom [X]
Support Democracy [X]
Support the right to earn [X]
Support the right to life [X]
Ban Puppet Voting [X]
Be the only party to do anything last term [X]

VOTE
NSCONSERVATIVEPARTY
Why vote anything else?

Support the right to earn [X]


So I'm confused. How do you ensure that people earn?

So I'm confused. How do you ensure that people earn?
It's presumably a reference to their policy to oppose gun control, so you can have a right to earn by embarking on a career of violent crime.

When Parliaments are unable to pass legislation, they become disbanded; such is the nature of the Parliamentary system.

Who says they were "unable" to pass legislation? Because they didn't? Maybe there was no legislation that needed passing. Maybe NS General is better off without a Parliament. If so, why disband it and reform it again?

Well, look at who's doing the disbanding and reforming. Comrade Dictator Ariddia. Now it makes sense doesn't it?

If at first you don't get a majority, disband the system and reform it in your own image until the capitalists bow down to your iron fist.

Be the only party to do anything last term [X]
So, you're gonna be the only party to do anything last term? What is this, Alice in Wonderland?

So, you're gonna be the only party to do anything last term? What is this, Alice in Wonderland?

Sorry for the mis-type

After calls from my party I am officially asking the NBIP to ally with the NSCP.

After calls from my party I am officially asking the NBIP to ally with the NSCP.

An allegiance of two out of the four silly parties. Makes sense.:D

Who says they were "unable" to pass legislation? Because they didn't? Yes.

Maybe there was no legislation that needed passing. Maybe NS General is better off without a Parliament. Possibly, but then again, how often does a thread get nearly 300 votes in such a short time period? Isn't one of the ways to measure what's good for NS General to look at which threads are popular? If people like the thread and like the idea, then why not do it?

If so, why disband it and reform it again?I don't see why one failed experiment should lead to the conclusion that it is unnecessary, perhaps 3 or 4 would do so.

Well, look at who's doing the disbanding and reforming. Comrade Dictator Ariddia. Now it makes sense doesn't it? Well, typically the Head of State disbands a Parliament when the Parliament doesn't function. The NS General Parliament hasn't planned for the position of a Head of State...not very characteristic of a Parliament that doesn't need to do anything.

If at first you don't get a majority, disband the system and reform it in your own image until the capitalists bow down to your iron fist.Well, then both Ariddia and you will be unhappy; the DSP is winning, Ariddia would dislike this because they're capitalist, and you'll dislike it because they're market interventionist.

Yes.


That's idiotic. I don't do jumping jacks every morning. That's not because I am unable to.


Possibly, but then again, how often does a thread get nearly 300 votes in such a short time period? Isn't one of the ways to measure what's good for NS General to look at which threads are popular? If people like the thread and like the idea, then why not do it?

Of course, a good portion of those are puppet votes. Thus making it useless as measuring anything. People may like the thread and the idea, but ya know, most people also like spam threads too. Why not have those too eh?

I don't see why one failed experiment should lead to the conclusion that it is unnecessary, perhaps 3 or 4 would do so.

Yeah, I bet you feel the same way about invading other countries to combat terrorism. Afghanistan and Iraq are failed experiments, hmmm maybe we should invade Iran and Syria too.

Well, typically the Head of State disbands a Parliament when the Parliament doesn't function. The NS General Parliament hasn't planned for the position of a Head of State...

And instead of proposing it to the existing NS General Parliament, Ariddia decided to take the role of Head of State himself. Despite his only being a "MP." Kinda throws away the whole concept.

Well, then both Ariddia and you will be unhappy; the DSP is winning, Ariddia would dislike this because they're capitalist, and you'll dislike it because they're market interventionist.

Yeah, and Ariddia will eventually disband this one and have another election crawl out of his ass. Oops.

That's idiotic. I don't do jumping jacks every morning. That's not because I am unable to.It isn't your sole purpose to do jumping jacks, either, unlike a Parliament, whose sole purpose is to do something.

Of course, a good portion of those are puppet votes. Thus making it useless as measuring anything. There have been allegations of puppet voting, but no proof.

People may like the thread and the idea, but ya know, most people also like spam threads too. Why not have those too eh?There's a forum for them, so as long as they stay in that forum, that's fine.
This forum deals with things related to nation states, and the idea of a Parliament is related to nation states.

Yeah, I bet you feel the same way about invading other countries to combat terrorism. Afghanistan and Iraq are failed experiments, hmmm maybe we should invade Iran and Syria too.I think you could drop that at "invading other countries"...this has failed many times, regardless of the reason, and should not be attempted again.

Edit: in this case, however, the first Parliament was successful in getting things done, and should not be considered a failed experiment at all.

And instead of proposing it to the existing NS General Parliament, Ariddia decided to take the role of Head of State himself. How could he have proposed something to a non-functioning body?

Despite his only being a "MP." Kinda throws away the whole concept.If it's so important to you to have it proposed to the Parliament, why didn't you do so?

Yeah, and Ariddia will eventually disband this one and have another election crawl out of his ass. Oops.Well...I should say that not having a contingency plan means that you have to improvise once or twice...if there isn't a plan for what to do when Parliament fails to do something (either have a Head of State dissolve it or to disband Parliament entirely) then I would agree that it's a bad idea.

This isn't to say your concerns are without merit; on the contrary it is always important to make a fuss when somebody does something contrary to established procedure...it's just in this case, there is no established procedure.

Yeah, and Ariddia will eventually disband this one and have another election crawl out of his ass. Oops.
ariddia does not disband parliament. it was decided in cross-party discussions following the first election that an election is to be held every 4 months. it's in the rules. this not being a professional policial machine, we missed the last election by about 3 weeks and are now holding it late. ariddia is no more "dictator" than you or i - in fact he asked if i'd like to run the election this time... so anyone can start the election thread/process off at the end of a parliament's session - it doesn't have to be him (i said i'd rather he ran things this time again as he has more experience than i do (and i'd rather not cock up something which only happens 3 times a year...)


edit: that said, i do think some of the parliamentary rules could be up for discussion again - such as what to do if parliament is ineffective (does it really matter anyway?), contingency plans, laying down who can run elections and how (and when) they should be started once more, and the issue of having a head of state or prime minister.

ariddia does not disband parliament. it was decided in cross-party discussions following the first election that an election is to be held every 4 months. it's in the rules. this not being a professional policial machine, we missed the last election by about 3 weeks and are now holding it late. ariddia is no more "dictator" than you or i - in fact he asked if i'd like to run the election this time... so anyone can start the election thread/process off at the end of a parliament's session - it doesn't have to be him (i said i'd rather he ran things this time again as he has more experience than i do (and i'd rather not cock up something which only happens 3 times a year...)I knew something about that, but couldn't find it in the threads to quote it...though I didn't reread them word-for-word.

edit: that said, i do think some of the parliamentary rules could be up for discussion again - such as what to do if parliament is ineffective (does it really matter anyway?), contingency plans, laying down who can run elections and how (and when) they should be started once more, and the issue of having a head of state or prime minister.Yes, exactly my point.

ariddia does not disband parliament. it was decided in cross-party discussions following the first election that an election is to be held every 4 months. it's in the rules. this not being a professional policial machine, we missed the last election by about 3 weeks and are now holding it late. ariddia is no more "dictator" than you or i - in fact he asked if i'd like to run the election this time... so anyone can start the election thread/process off at the end of a parliament's session - it doesn't have to be him (i said i'd rather he ran things this time again as he has more experience than i do (and i'd rather not cock up something which only happens 3 times a year...)
How many are you up to so far this year? :p

VOTE ESP, WE CAN'T MAKE THINGS WORSE!

It isn't your sole purpose to do jumping jacks, either, unlike a Parliament, whose sole purpose is to do something.

If it's so important to you that Parliament "do something," why didn't you make or discuss more proposals, more often?

There have been allegations of puppet voting, but no proof.

I have proof. I had my puppets vote for ESP. No one noticed or cared.

Now, maybe I'm totally unique - maybe NO ONE else created or used puppets in this voting. But Ockham's Razor suggests that I am not totally unique, and that there indeed has been puppet voting.

There's a forum for them, so as long as they stay in that forum, that's fine.
This forum deals with things related to nation states, and the idea of a Parliament is related to nation states.

Nonsense. This forum is "general." Why can't we have spam threads HERE eh? NS General Parliament is basically roleplay as far as I can tell. That goes in Nationstates, International Incidents. Not here.

And "this forum deals with things related to nation states" - hogwash. Oxwana's "Am I a lesbo?" thread shits all over that statement.


How could he have proposed something to a non-functioning body?

Who says it was non functioning? Oh yeah - he gets to decide it is.

If it's so important to you to have it proposed to the Parliament, why didn't you do so?

I guess I didn't think of proposing that an MP doesnt get to act as head of state just cuz he wants to. Can't think of everything beforehand, can I?

Well...I should say that not having a contingency plan means that you have to improvise once or twice...if there isn't a plan for what to do when Parliament fails to do something (either have a Head of State dissolve it or to disband Parliament entirely) then I would agree that it's a bad idea.

This isn't to say your concerns are without merit; on the contrary it is always important to make a fuss when somebody does something contrary to established procedure...it's just in this case, there is no established procedure.

So what would you say to having a NS General Revolution? We'll have secret meetings and organize chaos and anarchy. We'll oppose NS General Parliament's every corrupt move and prove that it has no power. That's my contingency plan!

If it's so important to you that Parliament "do something," why didn't you make or discuss more proposals, more often?I've never been an MP, it wouldn't really be up to me to do so.

I have proof. I had my puppets vote for ESP. No one noticed or cared.

Now, maybe I'm totally unique - maybe NO ONE else created or used puppets in this voting. But Ockham's Razor suggests that I am not totally unique, and that there indeed has been puppet voting.Ah, that explains why you were so sure about it.

Nonsense. This forum is "general." Why can't we have spam threads HERE eh? NS General Parliament is basically roleplay as far as I can tell. That goes in Nationstates, International Incidents. Not here.It has an element of roleplay, but roleplay is done in character, according to the rules.

And "this forum deals with things related to nation states" - hogwash. Oxwana's "Am I a lesbo?" thread shits all over that statement.That thread it and of itself doesn't deal with things related to nation states, however if Oxwana's questioning her sexuality could be used to make a more widespread and general statement, then it could be argued by pro-gays arguing that sexuality isn't as black-and-white as people like to think it is, and it could be used by anti-gays to argue that sexuality is a choice...and the nature of sexuality does matter when it comes to dealing with issues of gay marriage, which is very much a nation states issue.

Who says it was non functioning? Oh yeah - he gets to decide it is. Again, Parliament's function is to pass legislation, and didn't do so; ergo, it is non-functioning.

I guess I didn't think of proposing that an MP doesnt get to act as head of state just cuz he wants to. Can't think of everything beforehand, can I?No I meant why didn't you try to convene the Parliament and try to get it to fulfill its function?

So what would you say to having a NS General Revolution? We'll have secret meetings and organize chaos and anarchy. We'll oppose NS General Parliament's every corrupt move and prove that it has no power. That's my contingency plan!Well, I believe that democracy is a better way to create change; if I didn't believe so I'd join the MLP. :D However, if democracy proves itself to not being an option, then non-democratic means may be necessary...I am as yet unconvinced that democracy has shown itself to not work.

http://www.spunk.org/library/groups/iww/images/sp001348.gif

don't let it continue
VOTE UDCP

Join the world: vote DSP

or

Vote NSCP and join the puppets

http://www.spunk.org/library/groups/iww/images/sp001348.gif

don't let it continue
VOTE UDCPAwesome, you used an old IWW graphic.

Secularism: democracy's real friend.

If you agree, vote DSP.

Ah, that explains why you were so sure about it.

Well, only an idiot would think there is no puppet voting in this election.

It has an element of roleplay, but roleplay is done in character, according to the rules.

People are just basing their "Member of Parliament" characters on themselves. Commonly done in roleplay. It IS roleplay, because this Parliament isn't real and doesn't exist and is fictional.

That thread it and of itself doesn't deal with things related to nation states, however if Oxwana's questioning her sexuality could be used to make a more widespread and general statement,

It wasn't. It's her personal blog thread. What about the "Paradise Beach" thread? Come on, look on this forum, don't lie to yourself just to make the false definition fit. Things here are NOT solely concerned with nation states nor is that an enforced rule.


Again, Parliament's function is to pass legislation, and didn't do so; ergo, it is non-functioning.

It's not the job to pass legislation *just for the sake of passing legislation*.

That kind of idea is why we have taxpayers paying in real life for shit like House Concurrent Resolution No. 16 ("The members of the 116th General Assembly of Ohio wish to recognize the rock song "Hang On Sloopy" as the official rock song of the great State of Ohio")

Yeah. Great. At least they're "doing something."

No I meant why didn't you try to convene the Parliament and try to get it to fulfill its function?

Because I'm a minimal government kind of guy. That which governs least, governs best.

Well, I believe that democracy is a better way to create change; if I didn't believe so I'd join the MLP. :-D However, if democracy proves itself to not being an option, then non-democratic means may be necessary...I am as yet unconvinced that democracy has shown itself to not work.

Anarchy IS democracy! It's the purest form of democracy in a way.

But let's face it, the people of NS General rule themselves - with help from the mods - they are NOT ruled by NS General Parliament. The latter has no ruling power at all and it never will. Ergo, it is non-functioning, and should be permanently disbanded.

Join the world: vote DSP

or

Vote NSCP and join the puppets

Well, only an idiot would think there is no puppet voting in this election. Thinking something and having proof of it are two different things. Also, it would matter who is doing the puppet voting, and to which parties...are all parties benefitting equally from it?

People are just basing their "Member of Parliament" characters on themselves. Most likely.

Commonly done in roleplay. It IS roleplay, because this Parliament isn't real and doesn't exist and is fictional.Yes, it's roleplay in the same way that the nations of Jello Biafra and Santa Barbara don't exist and are fictional. (Yes, I know Santa Barbara is a city.)

It wasn't. It's her personal blog thread. What about the "Paradise Beach" thread? Come on, look on this forum, don't lie to yourself just to make the false definition fit. Things here are NOT solely concerned with nation states nor is that an enforced rule.Simply because the rule isn't enforced doesn't mean it isn't there. (I'm unfamiliar with the "Paradise Beach" threads, so I can't say anything about them.)

It's not the job to pass legislation *just for the sake of passing legislation*.

That kind of idea is why we have taxpayers paying in real life for shit like House Concurrent Resolution No. 16 ("The members of the 116th General Assembly of Ohio wish to recognize the rock song "Hang On Sloopy" as the official rock song of the great State of Ohio")

Yeah. Great. At least they're "doing something." I should have hoped that Ohio's State House would have had better things to do than that; sadly, I know they don't.
I don't view that contingency plans for what to do if Parliament isn't functioning or about creating the position of Head of State is passing legislation for its own sake.

Because I'm a minimal government kind of guy. That which governs least, governs best.Yes, but you were an MP in Parliament last time...why was this?

Anarchy IS democracy! It's the purest form of democracy in a way. My ideal ideology is direct democracy, so I'd agree with you, but I wanted to play this game and hopefully in the process learn about Parliamentary procedures.

But let's face it, the people of NS General rule themselves - with help from the mods - they are NOT ruled by NS General Parliament. True, it can be said that the NS General Parliament's passing something doesn't mean anything to NS, but I never viewed that as the point.

The latter has no ruling power at all and it never will. Ergo, it is non-functioning, and should be permanently disbanded.I don't view a lack of ruling power as its being non-functioning...I viewed one of the functions of parliament as a way for people who like to debate about political issues to convene in one place, with the specific aim of trying to convince other people that they're right. We all know many NSers who don't like to debate about political issues, and we all know many NSers who like to spout rhetoric with no intention of changing the other's mind; I felt that the goal of this would be an alternative to that.

I have proof. I had my puppets vote for ESP. No one noticed or cared.

Now, maybe I'm totally unique - maybe NO ONE else created or used puppets in this voting. But Ockham's Razor suggests that I am not totally unique, and that there indeed has been puppet voting.

how many puppets do you have? :confused:

i personally have refrained. i have been tempted to puppet vote, but its easy enough not to. i doubt its a rare thing (the conservatives have gained about 10 votes today while all other parties have stayed level... and they don't have the best track history in this matter...) but its still a shame that people do just because they can, or because they think 'everyone else will' :(

Thinking something and having proof of it are two different things. Also, it would matter who is doing the puppet voting, and to which parties...are all parties benefitting equally from it?

They aren't all benefitting equally from it, unless there's about 10 coincidences happening simultaneously.


Yes, it's roleplay in the same way that the nations of Jello Biafra and Santa Barbara don't exist and are fictional. (Yes, I know Santa Barbara is a city.)

No, cuz I'm not typing this right now as a "nation of Santa Barbara." I don't even HAVE a NS by that name anymore. It's just a forum handle. Not everything on this forum is roleplay - a fake parliament IS.


Simply because the rule isn't enforced doesn't mean it isn't there. (I'm unfamiliar with the "Paradise Beach" threads, so I can't say anything about them.)

Well, maybe you could point out to me the post in Moderation that states the rule.

Unless you can find the rule that states all threads and posts in NS General have to do with Nation-states, it doesn't exist.

I should have hoped that Ohio's State House would have had better things to do than that; sadly, I know they don't.

And the reason they do things like that is so that people like you, who go around saying "It's your job to do something" can't go "Aha! You're not doing something!"

It's not their job, nor the Parliament's, to do things just for the sake of looking busy.


Yes, but you were an MP in Parliament last time...why was this?

I was giving "respect" that the whole thing deserved by being part of it. Now I don't see that its earned my respect.

And at the time, someone had to fight the commies and other big-government types.

My ideal ideology is direct democracy, so I'd agree with you, but I wanted to play this game and hopefully in the process learn about Parliamentary procedures.

Parliamentary procedure is dull as fuck. That's why no one bothered with it. I said before, the election campaigning is the most entertaining bit of it. Once thats over with, everyone gets jaded and quits bothering and eventually someone goes "Hey! Parliament is defunct! New election required!"

And sure, in real life parliamentary procedure is necessary. But then in real life, parliaments have an actual, real function and purpose, so they can put up with the dullness.

In this case it's both dull AND pointless.


I don't view a lack of ruling power as its being non-functioning...

I do, if something (like a Parliament) is supposed to be a legislative body of government. A totally powerless government is non-functioning.

I viewed one of the functions of parliament as a way for people who like to debate about political issues to convene in one place, with the specific aim of trying to convince other people that they're right. We all know many NSers who don't like to debate about political issues, and we all know many NSers who like to spout rhetoric with no intention of changing the other's mind; I felt that the goal of this would be an alternative to that.

But it isn't! The only people who would be convinced by someone else that someone else is right, are those who already would be. Thus they don't need an NS General Parliament for this to happen. And there will be the other kinds of NSers as well in this Parliament, and you'll find them in or out, doesn't matter. NS General Parliament doesn't change anything, isn't an alternate to anything.

how many puppets do you have? :confused:

i personally have refrained. i have been tempted to puppet vote, but its easy enough not to. i doubt its a rare thing (the conservatives have gained about 10 votes today while all other parties have stayed level... and they don't have the best track history in this matter...) but its still a shame that people do just because they can, or because they think 'everyone else will' :(

I have like 3. Coulda made more, but don't care to.

Other people DO care to. And will, and are, and have. Rendering this whole "representative" nonsense just that - nonsense.

They aren't all benefitting equally from it, unless there's about 10 coincidences happening simultaneously.I wouldn't think so.

No, cuz I'm not typing this right now as a "nation of Santa Barbara." I don't even HAVE a NS by that name anymore. It's just a forum handle. Not everything on this forum is roleplay - a fake parliament IS.How so?

Well, maybe you could point out to me the post in Moderation that states the rule.Admittedly I don't pay attention to those sorts of things, but I saw Fass say it, and he does pay attention to those sorts of things. Do you think the mods just randomly decide when to move things to the Spam forum?

And the reason they do things like that is so that people like you, who go around saying "It's your job to do something" can't go "Aha! You're not doing something!"Are you saying that Ohio would be better off without a State House?

It's not their job, nor the Parliament's, to do things just for the sake of looking busy. No, but it is both their job and the Parliament's job to do something.

I was giving "respect" that the whole thing deserved by being part of it. Now I don't see that its earned my respect. Only because of the New Parliament being convened, or did something happen with the Second Parliament that led you to believe this?

(And what about the 4-month term limit rule that had already been established?)

And at the time, someone had to fight the commies and other big-government types.Were there not enough volunteers in your party to do so?

Parliamentary procedure is dull as fuck. That's why no one bothered with it. I said before, the election campaigning is the most entertaining bit of it. Once thats over with, everyone gets jaded and quits bothering and eventually someone goes "Hey! Parliament is defunct! New election required!"People bothered with it in the First Parliament.

And sure, in real life parliamentary procedure is necessary. But then in real life, parliaments have an actual, real function and purpose, so they can put up with the dullness.

In this case it's both dull AND pointless.Possibly, I've never been an MP, so I can't say.

I do, if something (like a Parliament) is supposed to be a legislative body of government. A totally powerless government is non-functioning.What does the Nation States UN do?

But it isn't! The only people who would be convinced by someone else that someone else is right, are those who already would be. Thus they don't need an NS General Parliament for this to happen. And there will be the other kinds of NSers as well in this Parliament, and you'll find them in or out, doesn't matter. NS General Parliament doesn't change anything, isn't an alternate to anything.True, but it's more likely to find someone who wants to debate something and who could be convinced in Parliament than outside of it.

How so?

How so what? You already agree that the NS General Parliament is basically roleplaying. I just disagree that having my account name be "Santa Barbara" is roleplaying. Everyone online has a handle, that doesn't mean everyone online is partaking in roleplay.

Admittedly I don't pay attention to those sorts of things, but I saw Fass say it, and he does pay attention to those sorts of things. Do you think the mods just randomly decide when to move things to the Spam forum?

They move spam to the spam forum, yes. But they don't move things that "don't have to do with nation states" away, because NS General is NOT limited to such things.

Are you saying that Ohio would be better off without a State House?

I think they would be better off either doing something useful, or sitting on their arses looking inactive. Better they be thought "non functional" than "dysfunctional." Give me apathy over misguided, wasteful enthusiasm anyday!

No, but it is both their job and the Parliament's job to do something.

*sigh*

Anything? It's their job to propose ANYTHING? As long as there's a proposal? What are you, head of the Bureacrat Party?

Only because of the New Parliament being convened, or did something happen with the Second Parliament that led you to believe this?

Yes.

(And what about the 4-month term limit rule that had already been established?)

What about it?

Were there not enough volunteers in your party to do so?

Oh, yeah. They were right alongside me. But thats neither here nor there.

People bothered with it in the First Parliament.

Not... really...


What does the Nation States UN do?

Well, first there's a big difference between a UN (an international organization) and a Parliament (a governing legislative body).

Second, they propose things which have in-game effects on nationstates in the UN. For example, it actually increases (or decreases) civil rights, political freedoms or the economic rating. Thus from the perspective of the NationStates involved, the UN fulfills a function.

NS General Parliament doesn't. Its rules only really apply to... well, nothing. Or itself. And if thats how we're doing things, we should all just play Nomic instead.

True, but it's more likely to find someone who wants to debate something and who could be convinced in Parliament than outside of it.

I don't see why that should necessarily be so. It's just as likely as finding people who want to propagandize, pimp their idealogy, convince others without being convinced in any way.

How so what? You already agree that the NS General Parliament is basically roleplaying. I just disagree that having my account name be "Santa Barbara" is roleplaying. Everyone online has a handle, that doesn't mean everyone online is partaking in roleplay.I said it's a form of roleplaying, but I wouldn't call it roleplaying in the sense that the Role Playing forum was created for.

They move spam to the spam forum, yes. But they don't move things that "don't have to do with nation states" away, because NS General is NOT limited to such things.It was my understanding that spam was moved there because it had nothing to do with nation states; perhaps there is a different definition of what spam is than that.

I think they would be better off either doing something useful, or sitting on their arses looking inactive. Better they be thought "non functional" than "dysfunctional." Give me apathy over misguided, wasteful enthusiasm anyday!If they sit on their asses, they still get paid, so it is equally wasteful. Better off dismantling them entirely if they'll do nothing if you're concerned about waste.

*sigh*

Anything? It's their job to propose ANYTHING? As long as there's a proposal? What are you, head of the Bureacrat Party?No, I said I would hope that they would have something better to do than "just anything", but the only way that this is going to happen is if they're convening.

Yes.What was that?

What about it? If the 4-month rule holds, then Ariddia, or someone else was entirely right in proposing new elections.

Oh, yeah. They were right alongside me. But thats neither here nor there.True, it was just one of many reasons that you joined the Parliament.

Not... really...<shrug> Perhaps they didn't hold to strict Parliamentary procedure, but nonetheless the First Parliament did pass things.

Well, first there's a big difference between a UN (an international organization) and a Parliament (a governing legislative body).Isn't the UN an organization that governs the affairs between different countries, sort of making it a legislature between countries?

Second, they propose things which have in-game effects on nationstates in the UN. For example, it actually increases (or decreases) civil rights, political freedoms or the economic rating. Thus from the perspective of the NationStates involved, the UN fulfills a function.

NS General Parliament doesn't. Its rules only really apply to... well, nothing. Or itself. And if thats how we're doing things, we should all just play Nomic instead. That's good to know that the UN did that, all I knew it did were those telegrams that it sent me. So then your reasons for opposing the Parliament are that there is no computer code that causes it to have in-game effects?

I don't see why that should necessarily be so. It's just as likely as finding people who want to propagandize, pimp their idealogy, convince others without being convinced in any way.You don't view the parliament as being more likely to attract people who like to debate political issues (that would be periodically bumped) than random political issues would?

This time...

http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/8409/dsp1b0bp.gif

A new voice in parliament

http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/263/dsp1blittle0rh.gifPlease visit the official DSP thread for our 2006 Manifesto.

I said it's a form of roleplaying, but I wouldn't call it roleplaying in the sense that the Role Playing forum was created for.


Why not? Political character roleplays happen there too. This is just political character roleplay.

It was my understanding that spam was moved there because it had nothing to do with nation states; perhaps there is a different definition of what spam is than that.

Well, spam is spam. It's not spam because it doesn't have to do with "nationstates." I know, because I once reported Oxwana's lesbo thread as being spam and they explicitly didn't agree.

If they sit on their asses, they still get paid, so it is equally wasteful. Better off dismantling them entirely if they'll do nothing if you're concerned about waste.

Good point. DOWN WITH NS GENERAL PARLIAMENT!

No, I said I would hope that they would have something better to do than "just anything", but the only way that this is going to happen is if they're convening.

Well, all it takes to "convene" is make a post. No one wanted to, because there was nothing to do.


If the 4-month rule holds, then Ariddia, or someone else was entirely right in proposing new elections.

If it held then he is LATE and therefore, clearly in the wrong. And dictatorial.


<shrug> Perhaps they didn't hold to strict Parliamentary procedure, but nonetheless the First Parliament did pass things.

Like what?

Isn't the UN an organization that governs the affairs between different countries, sort of making it a legislature between countries?

Sort of.

That's good to know that the UN did that, all I knew it did were those telegrams that it sent me. So then your reasons for opposing the Parliament are that there is no computer code that causes it to have in-game effects?

No. That it doesn't have any power at all. It's non-functional. The United Nations (in game) has a function of power over Nations in game. NS General Parliament has no such function over NS General.

You don't view the parliament as being more likely to attract people who like to debate political issues (that would be periodically bumped) than random political issues would?

People who like to debate political issues are not in any way necessarily people who are at all willing to be convinced of anything.

Wow, big post arguement.... :eek: :eek: :eek:

If it held then he is LATE and therefore, clearly in the wrong. And dictatorial.


hahahaha i love your logic :p:p

hahahaha i love your logic :p:p

Thanks, I try. :D

Why not? Political character roleplays happen there too. This is just political character roleplay.I don't view this type of roleplay as being any different than the roleplay that there is when you play as the leader of a nation on the main site.

Well, spam is spam. It's not spam because it doesn't have to do with "nationstates." I know, because I once reported Oxwana's lesbo thread as being spam and they explicitly didn't agree.Did they give you a specific reason why?

Good point. DOWN WITH NS GENERAL PARLIAMENT!Well, as I said, if they can't do anything after a couple more times, then I'd agree with you, but not yet.

Well, all it takes to "convene" is make a post. No one wanted to, because there was nothing to do.Or perhaps everyone was too busy, or forgot about it?

If it held then he is LATE and therefore, clearly in the wrong. And dictatorial.I fail to see how a delay in elections makes them in the wrong, or dictatorial.

Like what?Weren't you in the First Parliament?

No. That it doesn't have any power at all. It's non-functional. The United Nations (in game) has a function of power over Nations in game. NS General Parliament has no such function over NS General.Is the reason that the NS UN has power of Nations in game due entirely to computer programming, or is there some other reason?

People who like to debate political issues are not in any way necessarily people who are at all willing to be convinced of anything.As I see it, you'll have a certain amount of people who can be convinced, say X percent. I don't see why people who like to debate political issues should be any less or more able to be convinced, however the nature of Parliament is that it is likely to attract people who like to debate political issues, and because it is popular and likely to be bumped, thus making it so that more people will see it. If more people see an issue of Parliament, then X number of people would be more than X number of people seeing just some random political debate thread.

http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/143/revolutionaries5ni.jpg

Sod it, why not have a picture that makes the page wide and annoying? :D

I don't view this type of roleplay as being any different than the roleplay that there is when you play as the leader of a nation on the main site.


Okay. But both types of roleplay don't belong on this particular forum.

Did they give you a specific reason why?

I don't remember. Basically, it's not spam and its not roleplay, it's "General."

Well, as I said, if they can't do anything after a couple more times, then I'd agree with you, but not yet.

Fine, but I might not let you have a seat on the NS General Revolutionary Council if you dally too much.

Or perhaps everyone was too busy, or forgot about it?

Why not both? Everyone was too busy with things that were not as dull and pointless.

I fail to see how a delay in elections makes them in the wrong, or dictatorial.

Because if you're gonna pick and choose when to follow Parliamentary procedure or laws, why bother at all?

Weren't you in the First Parliament?

Yes I was, thus I speak from a position of experience.

Is the reason that the NS UN has power of Nations in game due entirely to computer programming, or is there some other reason?

I think we're getting off-subject here. Why you keep bringing the NS UN into it?

As I see it, you'll have a certain amount of people who can be convinced, say X percent. I don't see why people who like to debate political issues should be any less or more able to be convinced, however the nature of Parliament is that it is likely to attract people who like to debate political issues, and because it is popular and likely to be bumped, thus making it so that more people will see it. If more people see an issue of Parliament, then X number of people would be more than X number of people seeing just some random political debate thread.

The same could be true for any topical, relevant political thread. Those aren't "random" and those are certainly not unnoticed by those who enjoy debate. NS General Parliament in your view, is thus a crutch for someone who can walk fine.

Down with the system! :sniper: :sniper: :sniper:

Emphatically Silly Party! All the way.

I probably would have voted for the NS Conservative Party, except I couldn't get to their platform. So I had no idea what kind of "conservatism" I was voting for. So, I go with the party I recently "joined".

We're the republican type of conservatism, not the tory type.... We're just not as influenced by big business.

We're the republican type of conservatism, not the tory type.... We're just not as influenced by big business.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA AHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA...

Tories are influenced by Big Business MORE than Republicans?!

...HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH AHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAH AHHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAAHAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA

Okay. But both types of roleplay don't belong on this particular forum.Perhaps, but there's not much difference between being the head of a government and enacting a change, and starting a thread asking "should change X be enacted by heads of government?" The latter is simply the beginning process of the former.

I don't remember. Basically, it's not spam and its not roleplay, it's "General."Well, then I was wrong on the criteria that they used when making the decisions, but there is apparently criteria which states that this thread is okay; it's mod sanctioned.

Fine, but I might not let you have a seat on the NS General Revolutionary Council if you dally too much.Is this the same body that will require attractive women (in your view) to go around naked? ;)

Why not both? Everyone was too busy with things that were not as dull and pointless.Then perhaps Parliament can simply be a series of elections that takes place one after the other?

Because if you're gonna pick and choose when to follow Parliamentary procedure or laws, why bother at all?It wasn't done because somebody picked and chose to do it, it was done because nobody did it; think of nobody doing it as a snowstorm that delays the beginning of Congress or a terrorist attack that delays the elections (they were actually talking about delaying the 2004 elections for the possibility of that reason.)

Yes I was, thus I speak from a position of experience.You're gonna make me sort through all the threads, aren't you?

I think we're getting off-subject here. Why you keep bringing the NS UN into it?Because the only reason I can see that the UN has actual power but this doesn't is that the UN has computer programming that causes it to have effects on the Nation States. It seems silly to argue that the NS General Parliament is invalid because it doesn't have that programming, so I was wondering if there was some other reason why one was valid and the other wasn't.

The same could be true for any topical, relevant political thread. Those aren't "random" and those are certainly not unnoticed by those who enjoy debate. NS General Parliament in your view, is thus a crutch for someone who can walk fine.Something like that, yes.

Down with the system! :sniper: :sniper: :sniper:Now I see why you puppet voted for the ESP. :)

We're the republican type of conservatism, not the tory type.... We're just not as influenced by big business.

Well I consider myself more tory..


Any way! Conservatives are now only 11 votes down! we are catching up SLOWLY. But at least its happening

Conservatives are now only 11 votes down! we are catching up SLOWLY.
Puppets will do that.

Puppets will do that.

Your despreat to attack us. gee, God help you if your that paranoid.

While the American system has given me many fundamental freedoms; the right of free speech, free press, free religion, the right to a fair trial and so on, it also gives us the freedom to oppress, the freedom to steal at the corporate level, and the freedom to discriminate without fear of severe consequences. The latter freedoms should be nullified and replaced with socially progressive ones. If you don't like the system, change it. Please, help usher in economic freedom as well. Vote UDCP!

I think this continued attack against the conservatives is ridiculous. Now, I hate their beliefs as much as the next sane person but this continued accusation of puppet voting is unfounded and petty. It ends up making the DSP look bad as you come off as a group unable to make legitimate criticisms and instead fall back on what amounts to slander.

I think this continued attack against the conservatives is ridiculous. Now, I hate their beliefs as much as the next sane person but this continued accusation of puppet voting is unfounded and petty. It ends up making the DSP look bad as you come off as a group unable to make legitimate criticisms and instead fall back on what amounts to slander.


Thank you very much!

I think this continued attack against the conservatives is ridiculous. Now, I hate their beliefs as much as the next sane person but this continued accusation of puppet voting is unfounded and petty. It ends up making the DSP look bad as you come off as a group unable to make legitimate criticisms and instead fall back on what amounts to slander.Not to mention that there has been someone who's admitted to puppet voting for the ESP, and nobody else has mentioned that.

Not to mention that there has been someone who's admitted to puppet voting for the ESP, and nobody else has mentioned that.

That says the Democrat scocalist party is being bias against the only other party that at this stage in the election can really beat them!

DONT VOTE NSDSP!! VOTE CONSERVATIVE

That says the Democrat scocalist party is being bias against the only other party that at this stage in the election can really beat them!

DONT VOTE NSDSP!! VOTE CONSERVATIVE

Don't vote for either of these capitalist parties!
All power to the proletariat!

How are the DSP capitalist?

How are the DSP capitalist?

Because they're not interested in communist revolution?

Because they're not interested in communist revolution?
Nope. Because they're not even pushing for socialism. They're liberals at worst and social-democrats at best.

Nope. Because they're not even pushing for socialism. They're liberals at worst and social-democrats at best.

Even if they were, I doubt you'd like them much more.

Polls close tomorrow. Who wants to predict a huge overnight upset?

VOTE CONSERVATIVE!! TIME IS RUNING OUT!

Polls close tomorrow. Who wants to predict a huge overnight upset?

me :rolleyes: . what time do they close?

VOTE CONSERVATIVE!! TIME IS RUNING OUT!

so r speling lesonz!

Come on, surely the Emphatically Silly Party, New British Imperialist Party and Mole and Other Burrowing Rodents' Alliance have to form a coalition? The numbers now show that they would actually win the election if they did...

Vote for Silly British Moles!

Possible post-election coalitions

1. Communist Front
UDCP
MLP- 4 Seats Total, 16% Control

2.
DSP- 6 Seats, 24% Control

3. Free Market
CL
Tories- 6 Seats, 24% Control

4. Silly People
ESP
NBP
MOBAR- 6 Seats, 24% Control

5. (Other Parties, most likely will not align)
AACP
Technocrat- 3 Seats, 12% Control

Other Possibilities

3. Free Market
NBIP added- 8 Seats, 32% Control

4. Silly People
Minus NBIP- 4 Seats, 16% Control

aww.. but the nscp wanted the nbip...

Did you disagree with the idea that the "right" to senseless profit is more important than the right to healthcare, food, water, shelter, decent living conditions... and life?

Where do YOUR priorities lie?

Vote for a party which gets society's priorities right.
Vote for a party with real policies for a fairer tomorrow.
Vote UDCP!

Did you disagree with the idea that the "right" to senseless profit is more important than the right to healthcare, food, water, shelter, decent living conditions... and life?




But surely people that work harder should be rewarded more than slovenly parasites...

Plus the NSCP also support the right to life.

And I'm not saying the poor should be starving in a gutter... I'm just saying they should be encouraged to work and get off societys support ASAP. There's free eductaion, use it.

Employment: a right, not a privilege.

If you agree, vote DSP.

Changed the possible coalitions. Any other ones that may be possible?

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e283/Slippery__Jim/UnionJack.jpg

Vote NBIP!

Unlike the NSCP, we want to win legitimately!

Anarchy!
The alternative to ideology.

WHY WAS THE CONSERVATIVE PARTY THE ONLY PARTY TO BE ACTIVE LAST TERM? ARE YOU GOING TO VOTE FOR A PARTY THATS NOT ACTIVE? DONT VOTE FOR THE DEMOCRATIC SOCIALIST PARTY!
STAY HEARD!
VOTE
CONSERVATIVE

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/7351/mlpfist7qk.jpg

Anarchy!
Sick of Capitalism? Adore Capitalism?
Vote anarchy and see who wins.

Vote Technocrat. Look to the future. We support technology and the advancement of society. We are the cool party, vote Technocrat.

where did all those 20 NSCP votes come from in the last 2 hours? hmm....


http://www.hlj.me.uk/UDCP%20march%2006%202.jpg

where did all those 20 NSCP votes come from in the last 2 hours? hmm....
I'd noticed that too.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e283/Slippery__Jim/UnionJack.jpg

Vote NBIP!

where did all those 20 NSCP votes come from in the last 2 hours? hmm....
I think they actually have the audacity to claim that their "don't vote DSP, the Conservatives proposed legislation blah blah" works. Because, as we all know, Socialist voters go Conservative as soon as they hear that...

I would like to vote Technocratic, they appeal to my utilitarianism, but unfortunately they are too unpredictable and open to corruption. I vote DSP.

I bet loads of you were convinced by my "revolutionary communist" act!

I think they actually have the audacity to claim that their "don't vote DSP, the Conservatives proposed legislation blah blah" works. Because, as we all know, Socialist voters go Conservative as soon as they hear that...
owch... stop... the sarcasm is killing me :p

I would like to vote Technocratic, they appeal to my utilitarianism, but unfortunately they are too unpredictable and open to corruption. I vote DSP.

I bet loads of you were convinced by my "revolutionary communist" act!
DSP thanks you and all its voters.

Anarchy!
Conservative puppet voting burns us!
http://www.stobiepiel.com/LOTR/smeagol.jpg

My God dont let the conservies win!

My God dont let the conservies win!
*Watches percentage of vote plummet as conservatives puppet vote.*

When does this thing end?

Actualluy the Conservatives went up 13 votes in more like 4 hrs

*Watches percentage of vote plummet as conservatives puppet vote.*

When does this thing end?
I think the Conservatives aim it to end when they have 500 puppet votes - just to make sure.

Actualluy the Conservatives went up 13 votes in more like 4 hrs
While everyone else's stayed the same?

While everyone else's stayed the same?

DSP has gone up 6 in 4hrs
Not sure about every one eles.

So the Cons got 7 more. Just luck I quees. its not a big enough margin for puppets.

Actualluy the Conservatives went up 13 votes in more like 4 hrs
I went away at 1700, there had been 275 votes.

I came back at 2200, there had been 305 votes, about 20 of which had gone to the Conservatives.

hmm :rolleyes:

Sorry! DSP went up 7 in 4hrs. So Cons only got 6 more.

While everyone else's stayed the same?
Mine went up one.:D
Anarchy!
The party of low expectations.

I went away at 1700, there had been 275 votes.

I came back at 2200, there had been 305 votes, about 20 of which had gone to the Conservatives.

hmm :rolleyes:

Not possible sorry! You must be mistaken

Not possible sorry! You must be mistaken
You don't find it strange that in a poll that's been virtually static for days there has been a sudden surge in one party?

You don't find it strange that in a poll that's been virtually static for days there has been a sudden surge in one party?

No, not when th surge has taken apart 3 days. it wasent that big a surge.
Cons went up around 35 in 3 days. DSP went up about 22. not too different. Not a big enough difference for puppets.

I also did a lot of campaining in Conservative and other regions only yesterday and today. I say that prob also a cause

I also did a lot of campaining in Conservative and other regions only yesterday and today. I say that prob also a cause
ah i was thinking of doing that, but then i figured that the voters of this forum are the regular forum users - not the random people who inhabit the NS regions and don't deign the forums. hence enlisting them to vote would be tantamount to some strange kind of voter fraud in my head.
not that i'm saying you shouldn't have dont it, just that i decided against region scouting, myself.

Puppet voting... :rolleyes:

Vote Technocrat!

"Competent Leaders for a Better Tommorow."

Cons went up.
Interesting shortening.

after the first day, the percentages only varied around 1-2% for dsp/cp.

since yesterday, cp percentage has changed 8% for cp.

12%-20% == 3 seats to 5 seats

i prefer not to sling mud meself, but i am suspicious. that is a big difference for a few hours.

then again, what is an election without suspicion?

DSP or NSCP, there's really not that much difference

VOTE MLP

after the first day, the percentages only varied around 1-2% for dsp/cp.

since yesterday, cp percentage has changed 8% for cp.

12%-20% == 3 seats to 5 seats

i prefer not to sling mud meself, but i am suspicious. that is a big difference for a few hours.

then again, what is an election without suspicion?
i went for tea at 21:00 pretty much on the dot, and i'd checked this thread within the hour before and the NSCP were on 40-something votes (46 IIRC). when i got back about 2 or 2 1/2 hours later (i'm going by msn history here so its all timed), there was the discrepency in votes.
now i'm not mudslinging either, just raising suspicion... as i said before, the CP don't have a very good track record with regard to voterigging from the last election.

the only reason i'm not mudslinging or going all out on this is because i have no possible way to back up any claims. hence all i can do is voice suspicion...

Puppet voting... :rolleyes:
Yeah, I did notice unusual Conservative vote changes.

http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/586/a1zh1.jpg

http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/1841/b0ve.jpg

11 votes in 4 hours

That's 2.75 votes per hour.

I think the conservatives are desperate to win this election via puppet voting at the last minute.

i went for tea at 21:00 pretty much on the dot,
Anarchy!
It's okay to chuckle at the British.

Feel like the rest of the parties are bourgeoise puppets?

VOTE MLP

wtf?


STOP VOTING CONSERVATIVE!

END 6 MONTHS OF NEGLECT!
VOTE FOR A BETTER VOICE!
VOTE FOR CHANGE!



This time...
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/263/dsp1blittle0rh.gif

I would like to vote Technocratic, they appeal to my utilitarianism, but unfortunately they are too unpredictable and open to corruption. I vote DSP.

I bet loads of you were convinced by my "revolutionary communist" act!

HOW are we open to corruption? You have to serve the people to stay in office!

I unofficially declare this poll rigged.

Anarchy!
It's okay to chuckle at the British.
that's dinner, not http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/images/recipes/tea_300x193.jpg, for the record.


VOTE UDCP or MLP
you can eat tea when you like (ooooh!)

that's dinner, not http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/images/recipes/tea_300x193.jpg, for the record.


VOTE UDCP or MLP
you can eat tea when you like (ooooh!)

I so have the munchies right now.

wtf?


STOP VOTING CONSERVATIVE!

classic. just classic. :p

the only reason i'm not mudslinging or going all out on this is because i have no possible way to back up any claims. hence all i can do is voice suspicion...

same here. the only thing you can do is simply say, 'hey, i think that is funny. not clown funny, voterigging funny' :D (alright i'm sorry it was there)

having a history does give people predispositions. . .

VOTE TECHNOCRAT

You're NSers...You're Already Ruled by Computers!

I so have the munchies right now.
smoke a fat one for me dude!




same here. the only thing you can do is simply say, 'hey, i think that is funny. not clown funny, voterigging funny' :D (alright i'm sorry it was there)

lol! SO subtle! :p :p

that's dinner, not http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/images/recipes/tea_300x193.jpg, for the record.
But you said tea. British talk makes me chuckle.

I unofficially declare this poll rigged.

can we have proof? christ, i'm from your party. we can't just declare it rigged. the udcp expressed concern. maybe if another party said something. . . .

but i don't think we should fly off the handle/jump to conclusions (http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:QmzhXyW7U-DWSM:www.mattfrazier.net/pics/jump2conclusions.jpg)

As a member of the NSCP
IF ANY IDIOT IS PUPPET VOTING, PLEASE STOP!

To be fair, I sense some puppet voting on both sides.

To be fair, I sense some puppet voting on both sides.
I think it could be a scam to ruin us. Some one from another party is puppet voting to get us disqaulified.

As a member of the NSCP
IF ANY IDIOT IS PUPPET VOTING, PLEASE STOP!

is that an admission????

huh, huh, huh?!?!?!?!

well at least some of you aren't simply retaliating with 'ooh, you're dsp, you being bitchy, get over it, we suddenly came up with votes, so what, we're cool, we're probably going to win, we cool! you ain't! go cp, go cp, go cp!'

Tired of the NEGATIVE attacks?
Want to see an end to FALSE accusations?


Then VOTE
NSCONSERVATIVEPARTY
The only party to do anything last term

END 6 MONTHS OF NEGLECT!
VOTE FOR A BETTER VOICE!
VOTE FOR CHANGE!



This time...
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/263/dsp1blittle0rh.gif

hmmmm...maybe the polls are closed though?

its very close!

the CP don't have a very good track record with regard to voterigging from the last election.

The claims of fraud during the last election are just as unfounded as those of these elections. What those on NS General fail to realize, because the Generalites are primarily liberal, is that there is a large group of Conservatives on NationStates whose primary interests are the political aspects, rather then the social ones. There are regions such as the Elite Conservative Circuit, and there are defense pacts such as ACCEL, who have a large amount of support behind their ideals and in situations like this they make their voice heard.

Had the NSCP votes gone to the NSCL, then people from the DSP or other left-leaning parties would not have cried foul due to the NSCL's political beliefs, however, because people from the questioning parties don't agree with the NSCP's views they are taking time to trash the Conservative party.

This whole election is pointless if grown people are incapable of having fun with it, and it's even more pointless if 90% of our time is going to be spent mudslinging (or the "nicer" term, being suspicious). The Conservative backbone is stronger then people expected, however, I would expect better out of people who keep stating "Everyone Matters", or "People are not Illegal" since it seems you are only capable of attacking people. Rather then focusing on your own campaigns, and a positive message, it would seem every party but the Technocrats has made this an attack Conservatives campaign, and if that's all we plan on doing, then why hold elections at all. We may as well call this whole thing over, and never waste our time doing it again. Granted the Conservatives have responded like children to some of the attack campaigns, all of the mudslingers or "suspicious" are just as much to blame. We have taken something meant to be fun, and turned it into a thread full of distain and suspicion.

I find it funny how DSP votes are suddenly alive! Puppets? should I ask?:p

Yeah, the voting suddenly started to jump again.

Had the NSCP votes gone to the NSCL, then people from the DSP or other left-leaning parties would not have cried foul due to the NSCL's political beliefs,

That's interesting, considering how many people consider the NSCL a right-wing capitalist bastard party.

Perspective: trashing the idiot notions of "left" and "right" every day.


This whole election is pointless if grown people are incapable of having fun with it, and it's even more pointless if 90% of our time is going to be spent mudslinging (or the "nicer" term, being suspicious).

Mudslinging is not the same as being suspicious of puppet voting. Mudslinging is part of any election, whereas being suspicious of puppet voting is called taking account of reality.

The Conservative backbone is stronger then people expected,

Mainly due to puppets.

it would seem every party but the Technocrats has made this an attack Conservatives campaign,

A little defensive, aren't we? Come on, if you're not a puppet-voting terrorist you have nothing to fear.

END 6 MONTHS OF NEGLECT!
VOTE FOR A BETTER VOICE!
VOTE FOR CHANGE!



This time...
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/263/dsp1blittle0rh.gif

KILL CHILDREN!
COOK THEM, CARVE THEM UP AND EAT THEM!
THEY TASTE GOOD WITH FRIED ZUCCHINI!
VOTE DSP!



This time...
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/263/dsp1blittle0rh.gif

NS CONSERVATIVES: BECAUSE MORE AND MORE PUPPETS SEEM TO LOVE THEM [X]

Vote With Your Brain...

VOTE
NSCONSERVATIVEPARTY

A vote for the NSCP is a vote against chocolate covered babies.

Go conservatives!

wow! deadlock! 74 74

A vote for the NSCP is a vote against chocolate covered babies.
lol

Democratic Socalists are AGAINST Christmas! VOTE NSCP!

DRESS UP LIKE A SANTA CLAUS GIRL!
VOTE NSCP!

There has been so many adds for the Tech. party and they have only 3% f the vote. The least

DRESS UP LIKE A SANTA CLAUS GIRL!
VOTE NSCP! santa clause elf also fits good there!

:gundge: :gundge: :mp5: :mp5: :headbang: :sniper: :p :cool: :cool: :upyours:

Vote fer det awzome partie!?!!?!

any one know how many people voted in the last election?

Gut für den NBIP

VOTE TECHNOCRAT!

Competent Leaders for a Better Tomorrow!

DRESS UP LIKE A SANTA CLAUS GIRL!
VOTE NSCP!
THANK YOU!!!:D

Go New British Imperialist Party!!!

THANK YOU!!!:D

I'm nonpartisan at heart, is all...:)

I should have puppet-voted. Golly, gosh, gee.

Anarchy!
More than good. It's Great.

People who are not true to themselfs puppet vote. I dont think anyone here puppet voted. maybe a couple. But a couple for each party prob. The Con's increase was just to slow to be puppet voteing.

People who are not true to themselfs puppet vote. I dont think anyone here puppet voted. maybe a couple. But a couple for each party prob. The Con's increase was just to slow to be puppet voteing.
Or not slow enough? Pappa Smurf ate a baby UN

NS classic liberals did very good in the first election. second place with over 100 votes! what has happened to them here?

NS classic liberals did very good in the first election. second place with over 100 votes! what has happened to them here?

We lost our propaganda artist.

NS classic liberals did very good in the first election. second place with over 100 votes! what has happened to them here?
You happened.

NS classic liberals did very good in the first election. second place with over 100 votes! what has happened to them here?
The Party off-site forum died from lack of activity
Alien Born and most others left
They orginally had a region full of supporters, but it died
Not much campaigning this time around

I should have puppet-voted. Golly, gosh, gee.

No, don't. I don't think all parties except NSCP puppet voted. But I don't conclude they did it or not.

Away from this, eventhough NSCP got more votes than we do, both of us got 6 seats each. I predict a stalled parliament like the last one.

We lost our propaganda artist.
Texaspunditstan? I think I have some of his stuff around here somewhere.

Oh you were a classic liberal supporter/ Well a party can be at top and then just fall. A little sad.

Oh you were a classic liberal supporter/ Well a party can be at top and then just fall. A little sad.
Megh.

But a couple for each party prob.
Where are the Technocrat's puppet votes? I demand puppet votes for the Technocrats. Do not waste the votes of your puppets, vote Technocrat today!!

Texaspunditstan? I think I have some of his stuff around here somewhere.

If you find any, upload it to a site somewhere. (Or let me plunk it on photobucket)

It was great stuff. Texpunditstan really did a professional job.

If you find any, upload it to a site somewhere. (Or let me plunk it on photobucket)

It was great stuff. Texpunditstan really did a professional job.
I miss the ole' gang. The off-site forum was great until it died. :(
*searches for pictures*

Where are the Technocrat's puppet votes? I demand puppet votes for the Technocrats. Do not waste the votes of your puppets, vote Technocrat today!!
Back off.

Anarchy!
Puppets, vote AACP. You have nothing to lose but your strings!

Dps Is Puppet Voteing! Jumped 4votes In 5min!

Dps Is Puppet Voteing! Jumped 4votes In 5min!

who's the DPS?

Back off.

Anarchy!
Puppets, vote AACP. You have nothing to lose but your strings!
Hey, we need the votes more than you do so YOU BACK OFF!!!

Puppets, come and join your robotic kin, come and realize that some puppets are robots or some such of that nature. May robot and puppet hold hand in hand in unity under the Technocrats. Vote Technocratic!!

Hey, we need the votes more than you do so YOU BACK OFF!!!

Puppets, come and join your robotic kin, come and realize that some puppets are robots or some such of that nature. May robot and puppet hold hand in hand in unity under the Technocrats. Vote Technocratic!!
You win this time, robots!
Anarchy!
We know when to back off.
who's the DPS?
I think they delivered my furniture.

Dps Is Puppet Voteing! Jumped 4votes In 5min!That would be impossible with puppet voting since you have to log in and out constantly. Nice try.

You win this time, robots!
Anarchy!
We know when to back off.

Yeah, that's right. You know we would sic the terminator on you and the rest of our robot army.
http://www.extraterrestrio.com/pitchers/images/robo.jpg
So pretty, yet so dangerous.

That would be impossible with puppet voting since you have to log in and out constantly. Nice try.
I could pull off four log ins and votes in five minutes, easy.

That would be impossible with puppet voting since you have to log in and out constantly. Nice try.

I have been noticeing for about 10min every time NSCP gets a vote 40sec later DSP does.

I could pull off four log ins and votes in five minutes, easy.I need a faster internet..... :D

I have been noticeing for about 10min every time NSCP gets a vote 40sec later DSP does.and few seconds later, it was you who gets the vote next? Nice logic. Congrats on reaching 80.

In seat terms, DSP and NSCP are still tied.

and few seconds later, it was you who gets the vote next? Nice logic. Well NSCP would get them spaced out. But DSP get them right after NSCP. Its stoped happening. He must know i caught em

In seat terms, DSP and NSCP are still tied.

Whats seat terms?

Well NSCP would get them spaced out. But DSP get them right after NSCP. Its stoped happening. He must know i caught emdude, you got a vote. 80!!!

Whats seat terms?
Vote share % divided by 4 OR 0.25 multiply by vote share %. Do the math...

Well, the Anarchy at Any Cost Party is the one set to deliver direct democracy.

democracy? that's chaos....

UDCP indeed ^_^

Ok, what the hell, how do we get 80-81 so quick. Who's puppet voting? it wasn't me nor NSCP.

Can somebody check the feeder region?

Ok, what the hell, how do we get 80-81 so quick. Who's puppet voting? it wasn't me nor NSCP.

Can somebody check the feeder region?

well, I told you

I know what we need! Make votes public so we could see who was votein and get em! they need to do that next election

democracy? that's chaos....

UDCP indeed ^_^IDIOT, it was you who puppet voted. Who's your real master!

I admit the Cons prob have a puppet as well! well, they could

Puppets = Stalled parliament.

Yeah it's really odd that both parties are getting votes so quickly unless someone is doing some hardcore GOTV.

I admit the Cons prob have a puppet as well!Probably SB!

I know what we need! Make votes public so we could see who was votein and get em! they need to do that next election

You know, people have suggested that already. Matter of fact, they did so at the beginning of the election.

Probably SB!
sorry, sb?

sorry, sb?Santa Barbara.

Santa Barbara.

She said she wanted to.

Well, what you'd really need is a thread like a sticky, that consists of a title, a public poll, but no place to make posts. Make an analysis thread to talk out the results as they come in.

well, there really is NO way to stop puppets

I think we scared them away. No votes since we started our tantrum

Where's Melkor When We Need Him!!!

I think we scared them away. No votes since we started our tantrumProbably.

Probably.

Hopefully

Where's Melkor When We Need Him!!!

What would he be doing in this instance?

Im off. bye

Cant waite to see the final results!

What would he be doing in this instance?

Supporting the Classic Liberals, as I did, and still do.

Im off. bye

Cant waite to see the final results!

Same here. 'Night y'all.

Supporting the Classic Liberals, as I did, and still do.

And whose puppet might you be?

Joking, joking...

On a serious note, that doesn't explain why TCR was wanting him. Plus, he founded his own party last time.

And whose puppet might you be?

Joking, joking...

Nobody's puppet, just Alien Born back again after a long time away.

Yes he did form his own party but ended up working with and supporting the NSCL during their first term in office (I missed the second election so I don't know what happened there. If Ariddia could let me know I would appreciate it.)

Nobody's puppet, just Alien Born back again after a long time away.

Yes he did form his own party but ended up working with and supporting the NSCL during their first term in office (I missed the second election so I don't know what happened there. If Ariddia could let me know I would appreciate it.)

The NSCL apparently misses you. Oh, and blames you for the fact they're doing so badly this election.

The NSCL apparently misses you. Oh, and blames you for the fact they're doing so badly this election.

They need not feel bad about doing badly, but if they want to blame me, that is their perogative. VO and SB are great, but there is no Wegason, and I have not been available. Half a team will get thrashed every time. The basic ethos of Classic Liberalism should not have changed any, so it is probably that the voters have shifted in their political position.

Is swimmingpool and his chart of the Political Compass still around?

They need not feel bad about doing badly, but if they want to blame me, that is their perogative. VO and SB are great, but there is no Wegason, and I have not been available. Half a team will get thrashed every time. The basic ethos of Classic Liberalism should not have changed any, so it is probably that the voters have shifted in their political position.

Is swimmingpool and his chart of the Political Compass still around?

Not sure if swimmingpool is still around, but other Political Compass charts have been attempted.

I'm thinking the first act of the new government should be to call for a new election, with proper anti-fraud measures.

How is the conservatives getting the same number of votes as the social democrats? I thought NS was more left leaning...This is just wrong.

Back from college. :)

How is the conservatives getting the same number of votes as the social democrats? I thought NS was more left leaning...This is just wrong.Do you know why DSP and NSCP got the same votes? Because some random puppets screwed up the whole election. :headbang:

Oh well, we got no choice but to accept the results. :(

I'm thinking the first act of the new government should be to call for a new election, with proper anti-fraud measures.

We investigated the possibilities of this when we held the first NSGE. It turned out to be impossible to do without putting rediculous work loads on the mods.

Anarchy!
Official bumper of the Third NS General Election.

Dude....

There is something wrong with this poll...

:eek: :confused:

Is somebody trying to destroy my party?

EVIL PUPPETS!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:

How is the conservatives getting the same number of votes as the social democrats? I thought NS was more left leaning...This is just wrong.

Because the "Social Left" has split into several parties while we conservatives have remained unified, in actuality the votes for the "liberals" outnumber those for conservatives by 3 to 1 depending on how you classify some of these parties.

And what is this? The DSN got 22 votes while the Conservative party got only 11 votes over the same time period, I smell a rat! (Do I sound as rediculous as the others trying to claim fraud? I sure hope so.)

Holy mother f'ing shit, dude.

Dude, it's not the puppet voting from DSP or NSCP.

There used to be 81-81 for both of us now it appears some dirty puppet is getting after us.

Holy mother f'ing shit, dude.
I know...

Wtf!!! Who The Hell Are You!!!

Jesus... we need a new election...

...

oops, hopefully nobody knows me.

:rolleyes:

Democratic Socialist Party 101 16.21%
Emphatically Silly Party 55 8.83%
Mole and Other Burrowing Rodents Alliance 29 4.65%
New British Imperialist Party 57 9.15%
NS Classic Liberals 51 8.19%
NS Conservative Party 121 19.42%
Reason Party 119 19.10%
Revolutionary Trotskyist Party 36 5.78%
United Democratic Communist Party 54 8.67%

Those are the numbers from the last election, as you can see they are quite a bit higher than this time around, so why is everyone claiming that this election is a fraud and citing the number of votes as their key reason? Please tell me it is because this is all fake, you were bored and just wanted to spice things up a bit.

Hey there's a surprise. Puppet voting. Now why didn't anyone bring up that potential issue before?

I guess I assumed it happened and was acceptable, I voted with every SINGLE nation I have, which is only one because for some reason email verification doesn't like any of my email providers (hotmail.com, gmail.com or us.army.mil) so I dare not change this email address for fear of never getting to use the forums and whenever I tried to make a new nation (for the purpose of RPing an FT nation) the email verification thing never arrived.

Obviously not everyone as my same problems, judging by the way the votes are coming in, the whole 12 votes in a row for one party and a nation's only three posts coming in this thread and he also seemed to have insider information. Where is Sherlock Holmes when you need him?

I only use one e-mail account. Geez, why would anybody want to waste their friggin time creating accounts?

BTW, I'm getting suspicious about our votes.

Some dumbass is wasting their time because I've seen it go up by 1 every few minutes for a while now.

We don't have to throw out the entire election, just dock the DSP a few votes, last I saw, right before this puppet voting thing probably started, it was 76-74 DSP and NSCP respectively, just make sure that in the end the DSP and NSCP have the same number of seats, two votes is a statistical ties anyways.

I only have one account. I have a hard enough time voting for any of these parties once, let alone multiple times.

There's gotta be some sort of online poll service that could be used that prevents an IP from voting more than once. It wouldn't foolproof, but it would probably discourage most fraud.

Well... Looks like I'll have to try and find it for next time.

@ West Pacific: Keep in mind that the last election was probably fraudulent as well, so using it's statistics distorts facts.

Maybe it's just only "drunk commie united" with only one puppet vote.

I think I know why we got most of the votes, it's because I posted a last minute reminder on feeder regions' and left-wing oriented regions' RMB.

Maybe that's why there's a last minute stunt growth.

Well then why are people just now starting to worry if the previous elections have also been fraudulent? And on another note, who decided puppet voting was such a bad thing? I only have one nation but I assumed that every nation on NS got a vote if they wanted to, regardless of whether they were puppets or not.

And really, it wouldn't be that hard to seperate the puppet votes, the mods just need to go through all 340+ plus voters and check their IP, searching for any matches, should only take like nine hours.[/sarcasm]

Well then why are people just now starting to worry if the previous elections have also been fraudulent? And on another note, who decided puppet voting was such a bad thing? I only have one nation but I assumed that every nation on NS got a vote if they wanted to, regardless of whether they were puppets or not.

And really, it wouldn't be that hard to seperate the puppet votes, the mods just need to go through all 340+ plus voters and check their IP, searching for any matches, should only take like nine hours.[/sarcasm]IP search? Nah, why would they bother anyways.

Btw, it's not really a huge event set up by NS. And also most users lost interest in this election. I remember there used to be 600+ voters, now there's 300+ voters.

I don't know, I am just bored and trying to add a little excitement.

Btw, I don't think most of the votes were casted by puppets. Probably some last minute voters who just saw my election reminder.

I think I should apologize the NS Conservative Party for accusing them of puppet voting. This must be the bloodiest election battle in NS' history.

Shit, I've been gone longer than I thought. 100 votes?
Anarchy!
At this point, we'll take 5%

101 votes...

Last time I checked it was 98, what... the... heck?

101 votes...

Last time I checked it was 98, what... the... heck?
I assume these guys are last-minute voters, I remember I posted election reminders in some some feeder, liberal, and socialist regions. I hope they would vote but it appears they're not interested until now. So voters if I called you puppet by mistake, I apologize.

Yeah, it could very well be just last minute voters, who knows. :)

Yeah. And maybe lots of dead people really do vote in US elections. They just voted so much and so often in life, they didn't feel like stopping just because they died. Also, maybe all rape victims are liars, and rape doesn't happen at all. People are basically good, why would they rape?

Similarly, people are basically good, why would they try to swing a vote on an online forum fake parliament when they know they can do it, and get away with it, and it's easy, and no one will care if they do it?

Last minute voters. Sure. Keep telling yourself that, sparky.

And this puppet, Drunk commies united, hopefully don't comeback to destroy DSP again! :upyours:

Well, it seems some mindless jerk has decided to have fun messing up everyone else's fun... Over 100 votes cast overnight, and almost all for just two parties? Someone out there sounds like a very sad person indeed...

And on another note, who decided puppet voting was such a bad thing? I only have one nation but I assumed that every nation on NS got a vote if they wanted to, regardless of whether they were puppets or not.


That would pretty much defeat the whole purpose. This is the General forum, not an in-game NS forum. You're here as you, not roleplaying your nation(s). If people were allowed several votes, the notion of a democratic election would go out the window.

We investigated the possibilities of this when we held the first NSGE. It turned out to be impossible to do without putting rediculous work loads on the mods.

Welcome back, AB!

Indeed, it's been discussed at length already. People have been suggesting public votes. That might help a little, but I'm not sure how much...