NationStates Jolt Archive

That's all you seem to say.

I call shenanigans on you...




Or scifag.

I call shenanigans on you...




Or scifag.

I should have seen that coming........

I should have seen that coming........

You really should have. What, like I'm going to respond with a rational, well-thought-out argument? Me? Bah.

I've been opposed to Scientology since I was 12. Dad explained to me what they were and what they stood for, and ever since, every time I see a Scilon, I get them into religious debates, and then troll them for as long as I can manage.

Now, I'm almost 20, and I'm still protesting against such a silly relgion. I'd sooner believe that the Chaos Gods Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle, and Slaanesh were real before I believe the bullcrap that Scientology puts out. Scientology is nothing more than a Cult, and if they're allowed to become more powerful than they already are, they'll destroy everything that we, as humanity, stand for. Thereby, I support Anonymous in their crusade to rid the world of this benign cyst we call the Church of Scientology.

I've been opposed to Scientology since I was 12. Dad explained to me what they were and what they stood for, and ever since, every time I see a Scilon, I get them into religious debates, and then troll them for as long as I can manage.

Now, I'm almost 20, and I'm still protesting against such a silly relgion. I'd sooner believe that the Chaos Gods Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle, and Slaanesh were real before I believe the bullcrap that Scientology puts out. Scientology is nothing more than a Cult, and if they're allowed to become more powerful than they already are, they'll destroy everything that we, as humanity, stand for. Thereby, I support Anonymous in their crusade to rid the world of this benign cyst we call the Church of Scientology.

Benign cyst?

I'd hardly call a "cult" that murders people, infiltrates governments and performs criminal acts benign.

HA-HAA! Intestinal Fluids, get in here! [/sebben]

But no, seriously, my roommate found this in the bookstore and consequently bought it:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v450/RhynoD/LastScan2.jpg


Which could mean absolutely nothing (as I'm sure IF will say...incidentally, I'm actually curious as to your opinion, IF), or it could mean MOAR recognition from the masses.


Details on the article to follow once I've actually read it.

Back on topic...
It's a similar argument to cigarettes connection to lung cancer. It's not definitively proven, but STRONGLY SUGGESTED. I highly doubt anyone would even be thinking about $cientology now if it weren't for Anonymous. You cannot deny that they have allowed reporters to come out of hiding, ex-members as well. The media is starting to report it more and more. Before Anon, I don't think that many people really knew what Co$ was up to, myself included. They just thought it was a wacko cult like that Sun Myung Moon Unification Church thing...

Back on topic...
It's a similar argument to cigarettes connection to lung cancer. It's not definitively proven, but STRONGLY SUGGESTED. I highly doubt anyone would even be thinking about $cientology now if it weren't for Anonymous. You cannot deny that they have allowed reporters to come out of hiding, ex-members as well. The media is starting to report it more and more. Before Anon, I don't think that many people really knew what Co$ was up to, myself included. They just thought it was a wacko cult like that Sun Myung Moon Unification Church thing...

The problem here is your young and lack perspective. People knew about Scientology LONG before Anon came around and frankly long before you came around. Your like one of those young people who take a semester of college then assume you know everything. Scientology has been around for long before computers were even invented and unfortunatly will be around long after Anons short attention span theater has come and gone. Anon as far as i know has made a small dent in awareness. Yay. Its basically accomplished pushing several plastic buckets of water back against the incoming tide. Grats and all but its going to take far more then what Anon is capable of doing to break down a billion dollar multinational corperation.

They just thought it was a wacko cult like that Sun Myung Moon Unification Church thing...
Now people see it as a Johnstown type group run by a guy who thinks he's Dr.Evil.

Anon as far as i know has made a small dent in awareness. Yay. Its basically accomplished pushing several plastic buckets of water back against the incoming tide.
The group was already going downhill before Anon even noticed them, the internet itself and it's past crimes had lowered membership greatly.

That and too many people have already 'paid up' most of their stuff so now the church is making up things to try and make them pay more.

The fact that their current leader David Miscavige is jackbooting everything and destroying anyone he doesn't like isn't helping either.

Basicly all Anon is doing is speeding up the demise.

Now will the CO$ remain afterwards? Of course, will they be this world wide supergroup?

Doubt it.

[Quote]Grats and all but its going to take far more then what Anon is capable of doing to break down a billion dollar multinational corperation.
Well everyone quit calling him a $cifag. A scifag plant would never go as far to tell the truth about the group being a Corporation.

I'd sooner believe that the Chaos Gods Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle, and Slaanesh were real before I believe the bullcrap that Scientology puts out.

Well, sure. Who wouldn't? Just ask Chronosia; he'll tell you.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v450/RhynoD/LastScan2.jpg
I gotta get a copy of that...

The problem here is your young and lack perspective. People knew about Scientology LONG before Anon came around and frankly long before you came around. Your like one of those young people who take a semester of college then assume you know everything.
I am not the one making arrogant statements and cahllenging the credentials of others. You also do not know my age. Lisa McPherson was killed after I was born. Yes, some people knew, but in all reality, not that many knew and still don't.

Scientology has been around for long before computers were even invented
That is utter crap. The computer was invented in 1947. $cientology was invented in 1952/3. Unless you go by the 75 million year thing, which would prove you are $cifag.

and unfortunatly will be around long after Anons short attention span theater has come and gone.
We don't have a short attention span. Even Habbo raids still go on 2 years after the first one. Anonymous will not cease until the cult is eliminated or severely disabled.

Anon as far as i know has made a small dent in awareness.
Then you don't know much.

Yay. Its basically accomplished pushing several plastic buckets of water back against the incoming tide.
Bad analogy is bad.

Grats and all but its going to take far more then what Anon is capable of doing to break down a billion dollar multinational corperation.
Anonymous is raising awareness, which puts pressure on them from the four estates, namely the latter three.

The problem here is your young and lack perspective. People knew about Scientology LONG before Anon came around and frankly long before you came around. Your like one of those young people who take a semester of college then assume you know everything. Scientology has been around for long before computers were even invented and unfortunatly will be around long after Anons short attention span theater has come and gone. Anon as far as i know has made a small dent in awareness. Yay. Its basically accomplished pushing several plastic buckets of water back against the incoming tide. Grats and all but its going to take far more then what Anon is capable of doing to break down a billion dollar multinational corperation.

Actually...
Scientology was founded in December 1953, and "Vacuum tube-based computers were in use throughout the 1950s" (Wiki). So no, Scientology has not been around that long. Stop trying to act like you're old. Old is Glenn Miller live. I won't believe you're that old unless you're using AOL.
And if you ARE that old, the hell are you doing on NSG!? Old people don't know how to use the interblags! Get off the blagosphere, old guy! The blogoblag is for young people!

Scientology has already remained in Anon's attention far longer than anything else ever has, save LOLcats (and LOLcats are too adorable to go away any time soon). That alone should be cause for a closer look. If this was an example of typical Anon shenanigans it would have been over a long time ago: the fact that Anon still cares is nothing less than miraculous, and should not be dismissed lightly. The Anon protest in Clearwater in February was the single largest protest against COS in history. That could never have happened if Anon wasn't paying attention.

Anon does not have to do everything by themselves. What Anon is doing is creating an environment that encourages dissent against COS. Former COS members that, until now, had remained silent are speaking out. Members are leaving faster. They know that they have support now, that the media is watching, and that if anything dodgy happens to anyone, Anon will make sure the media is all over it. Anon is a catalyst. It doesn't matter if the protest themselves actually accomplish something independently: they are allowing others to accomplish what they need to.

To that end: Miscavige's own niece has left the church and is speaking out against him, as have other high-level former Scientologists (Radar magazine (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v450/RhynoD/LastScan.jpg)). COS is losing members like water in a sieve, as higher members realize that they can't actually read people's minds when they get to OTVI, despite the church's promises. More importantly perhaps, COS is having a very difficult time recruiting new members, because COS is in the news so much now.

Which is the difference between what people knew then and what people know now. Old people like IF knew about them, knew they were dodgy maybe, knew they were a cult, maybe, but didn't know what Scientology really meant. Now, though, all of the church's information is publicly available for anyone, and you don't have to actually search for it. The news is bringing it to the general public's attention, and where before it would be dismissed because people wouldn't be able to find out more without a lot of effort, now they can go to Wiki and read everything, or watch South Park, or spend any time on any serious discussion forum. Before, when someone said they were going to join COS, it may have been odd, but no one thought much more about it than any other religion. Now, though, the information is so well available that when someone suggests joining COS, the immediate question is "You want to believe in Xenu and superpowers?" Which, understandably, is not too encouraging to someone thinking to join (Radar).

COS is actually targeting South America now, and African Americans, because they are statistically less likely to own computers (Radar). As well, much of the information on COS' practices and beliefs has not yet been translated into Spanish, so potential members are not discouraged with foreknowledge of their less-than-orthodox beliefs.

The reason for this change in tactics is directly linked to the efforts of Anon to make the general public aware of COS' practices. Anon is, arguably, the voice of the internet. The internet is the single greatest source of information and communication in existence today, and it is because of Anon's complete integration with the internet that information about COS has spread as fast as it has.

Anon may not be the direct end of COS, but it is the beginning of it. It is the cause of the avalanche of negative public opinion of COS and the continuing denunciations of former members.

For the love of Xenu, if you still cannot admit the slightest chance for Anon to at least precipitate the eventual end of COS in the face of every bit of evidence placed before you, I cannot accept any explanation other than you are a troll getting kicks from pissing off NS Anons (which I can't imagine is a good idea) or you are a scifag trying to demoralize anyone you perceive as not completely committed to Anon's goal.

RhynoD, factual inaccuracies from IF aside, I'd put his opinion down to pessimism and a healthy dose of skepticism. Yes, Anon is raising awareness, but compared to how long CoS has been entrenched, it becomes a matter of attrition. As your magazine has pointed out, CoS is redirecting work towards South America and African Americans simply because they are less likely to have been informed about the mess.

It's a siege right now, and what matters is whether this awareness raised by Anon will self perpetuate and outlast CoS or whether it will die down in the end with CoS still left in the running.

In fact, siege really isn't the right word. I'd call it an endemic. Think of CoS as a disease, with its members each as an infected plague carrier. Infection can only occur if certain conditions are fulfilled, a gullible or uninformed mind in this case. Anon is the awareness group that's trying to prevent the spread. Right now, few governments are taking preventive measures against its spread. This may or may not change.

If Anon successfully raises sufficient critical mass of CoS activities that such knowledge becomes literally "common sense", then it is possible to isolate and contain it until it dies a natural death.

However, this is not as simple a task as it seems. Take AIDs for example. It took what, 20-30 years before people realized it wasn't a "gay's and prostitutes only" disease. And even after this point, there are ignorant numskulls in countries that will remain unnamed that believe having sex with virgins will cure them of it, or that some lemon concoction will do the trick. And of course, one cannot deny that there are certain missionary groups who go about preaching preventive measures which don't really prevent AIDs transmission at all.

CoS is similar in this aspect. All it would take is for a small group of hardcore members, carriers, to survive as CoS, and for attention to die down. Then it will grow again. Make no mistake, finishing CoS off for good is possible, but it is work that will take years.

You've actually got your analogy backwards. It would be more appropriate to call Anon the disease.

Entrenched though it is, COS cannot function against Anon. COS tactics are isolation and intimidation, and complete control of the flow of information. Anon is completely immune to all of these attacks (It doesn't seem to affect Anon!). On the other hand, Anon is completely amorphous, with no leader to intimidate or silence. They don't have to attack COS directly, they only have to spread COS' information (It's super effective!). Information is the disease, because every person who knows COS' (socially considered to be) silly beliefs is a person who will never join COS, and Anon is better suited to spreading information that perhaps any other entity in existence.

Information is the disease, because every person who knows COS' (socially considered to be) silly beliefs is a person who will never join COS, and Anon is better suited to spreading information that perhaps any other entity in existence.

So long as those people who get that information have computers you mean.

So long as those people who get that information have computers you mean.

COS actually has to make it out of the more industrialized countries intact, first.

And COS is about making money. How long do think such an organization will last in countries where they lack the individual wealth to purchase a computer?

Sea Org (http://www.jasonbarbacovi.com/images/tonlesap/ts25.JPG), when funded by El Salvador.

So long as those people who get that information have computers you mean.
That's where IRL comes in handy. They disseminate information at protests, on subways, etc. People have been flyering NYC subways recently with stuff like youfoundthecard.com.

COS actually has to make it out of the more industrialized countries intact, first.

And COS is about making money. How long do think such an organization will last in countries where they lack the individual wealth to purchase a computer?

Sea Org (http://www.jasonbarbacovi.com/images/tonlesap/ts25.JPG), when funded by El Salvador.

One could also ask how long the Soviet Union could last when people individually were generally poverty level poor.

The answer, when you have a brainwashed slave labor force, is apparently quite a bit.

Spreading information is one thing, but it only works if you have the dedication to stick it out to the end, which could be years.

One could also ask how long the Soviet Union could last when people individually were generally poverty level poor.

The answer, when you have a brainwashed slave labor force, is apparently quite a bit.

Poor choice of examples: The Soviet Union didn't last.

Spreading information is one thing, but it only works if you have the dedication to stick it out to the end, which could be years.

You're talking about the group of people that invented LOLcats. Like they have anything better to do?

Poor choice of examples: The Soviet Union didn't last.


For about 80 odd years it did. Nothing's forever, but for a regime that took it's citizens for all they worth, they sure did a heck of a job of it. We're talking about a country that went from largely agrarian to trans-atmospheric superpower in the space of 50 years, even if they did get advanced rocket technology as a booster pack from Germany.


You're talking about the group of people that invented LOLcats. Like they have anything better to do?

Individually? Probably. Even Anon has to eat you know. Like I said, it's a matter of attrition, see who can outlast the other. Anon wins once it reaches a critical point of information spread where it becomes a self perpetuating story. CoS wins if that critical point is never reached.

While it's true Anon has to eat, helping the cause doesn't need to be a huge investment of time. Sure, some are doubtlessly putting many, many hours and considerable amounts of their own money into the cause, attending all the protests, and so on. On the other hand, how much time or money does it take to keep a pocket full of Youfoundthecard.com cards handy to drop as a person goes through their daily routine?

Doesn't seem likely to break the bank to me.

Who knows? Even if it's only a marginal cost, it's still a cost, and if it's kept running for a long time, with no end in sight, it might not be seen as something worth the upkeep. Still, the internet and mass media today makes it easier for that critical mass to be reached

RhynoD - official warning for spamming. I believe that you are intelligent enough not to commit this offence, and that you so consistently choose to do so is very disappointing.

Intestinal Fluids - I'm seeing a lot of ad hominem going on here from you. Remember to attack the argument and not the poster, please.

~ Tsar the Mod.

I have to admit, when I first heard all the ruckus about the COS I was skeptical, but since reading up on the Zenu.net website it really changed my ideas on it. It's truly a disgusting cult that needs to be destroyed.

Intestinal Fluids - I'm seeing a lot of ad hominem going on here from you. Remember to attack the argument and not the poster, please.

~ Tsar the Mod.

Attack the argument not the poster. Got it.


Just so i understand clearly, did you mean things like.....

Sel Appa- "Everyone ignore IF. He's either trolling or is a $cientologist. Neither is able to accept reason."
Sel Appa-"It's highly unusual for a non-partisan person to debate this as much as you are. Therefore, it is reasonable to infer that you are either trolling or are a $cientologist."
Sel Appa-"You're delusional if you think that. *flags IF as a potential $cientologist*"

The only difference between CoS and Christianity, or any of the major old dogmas is we can trace CoS back to the original fibber. It's just new enough.

Glad to see this cult is getting some grief. Time to break the gullible from the stupor. Reality is awesome. They should try it.

OK bring on the attacks! I'm ready!

P.S.
Q. How do you know your religion is B.S?
A. Your God hates the same people you do!
:D

The only difference between CoS and Christianity, or any of the major old dogmas is we can trace CoS back to the original fibber. It's just new enough.

Glad to see this cult is getting some grief. Time to break the gullible from the stupor. Reality is awesome. They should try it.

OK bring on the attacks! I'm ready!

P.S.
Q. How do you know your religion is B.S?
A. Your God hates the same people you do!
:D

CoS costs money. You can read the bible, should you want to, for free. You can read the Koran for free. Same with the Torah.

You can read any holy texts of pretty much any religion without spending a penny.

CoS "holy texts" will only be revealed to you after you give them thousands of dollars.

And my god does not hate anyone, so I guess your asinine little Q&A crap doesn't apply.

CoS costs money. You can read the bible, should you want to, for free. You can read the Koran for free. Same with the Torah.

You can read any holy texts of pretty much any religion without spending a penny.

CoS "holy texts" will only be revealed to you after you give them thousands of dollars.

And my god does not hate anyone, so I guess your asinine little Q&A crap doesn't apply.

OK That's true to a point.
In general you can read a bible for free. No doubt there. I agree CoS is a complete joke that sucks money from the stupid. Kind of like a drug pusher. "The first one is free"

The modern church uses things like "Onward Christian Soldiers"
A war on non christians? That is thinly veiled hate. Convert or be banished to hell.

My favorite going around. In the the drive to have more white christian babies. 'More arrows in God's quiver' Yeah just what to tell your kid, "I brought you into this world to be a projectile weapon for god"
Um thanks Dad!

The evangellical movement is the same as CoS when it comes to sucking money from people. Look at Benny Hinn, and the others ripping off the poor and stupid and living like kings. All tax free!

And these people have the ears of people in power. Frightening!

Look at the church in the U.S. and the attacks on science. It's making people dumb.

A sad state of affairs.
I say again, Try reality.

I think Scientology will own them with their LASER EYES!!!!! And they can get Xenu on them. Yeah.

RhynoD, I think I won our duel. Check out who didn't get warned ;) Runs and hides!

The only difference between CoS and Christianity, or any of the major old dogmas is we can trace CoS back to the original fibber. It's just new enough.

Glad to see this cult is getting some grief. Time to break the gullible from the stupor. Reality is awesome. They should try it.

OK bring on the attacks! I'm ready!

P.S.
Q. How do you know your religion is B.S?
A. Your God hates the same people you do!


This is the sort of misinformation we (I don't speak as an anon, because I am not one, rather I speak as a human being) need to fix. There are horrible christian cults, but few of them are as pervasive as Co$. Christian, muslim and any other sort of fundamentalism and extortion has a hard time establishing itself in regular society, but Co$ has managed by pretending to not extort people and the like. For example, Freezone (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Zone_%28Scientology%29) are acceptable, even if their beliefs are strange.

Again, it's not the beliefs that are being attacked, it's the fact that Co$ hurts, intimidates, threatens and murders people who are critical of the Co$. It's the same reason you should be opposed to muslim terrorists, or jesus camp. They're horrible places. The difference is, Anon can actually do something about Co$ because it can reveal its practices and it can expose the church for the scifag that it is.

RhynoD, I think I won our duel. Check out who didn't get warned ;) [color=notwhite]Runs and hides![/ color]

Alas, I concede defeat.

Someday, though, when you're not looking, you're going to end up with a halibut sticking out of your back.

For about 80 odd years it did. Nothing's forever, but for a regime that took it's citizens for all they worth, they sure did a heck of a job of it. We're talking about a country that went from largely agrarian to trans-atmospheric superpower in the space of 50 years, even if they did get advanced rocket technology as a booster pack from Germany.

COS already has 60ish years under its belt. And times are changing faster and faster these days, so I think it's fair to say that COS won't necessarily get the remaining 20 years that the SU got. And the SU was a collective of nations. COS is a collection of people. COS is being attacked within every nation they are in. The multiple fronts are causing a lot of problems with COS because there's no one place they can come down on.

And here's the kicker: the soviet union still didn't last. COS, likewise, won't last. I never said it would be gone tomorrow. I said it would be gone. That will be gone sometime in the near future is wishful thinking, sure. There's a lot of good reasoning behind that wishful thinking, though.

Individually? Probably. Even Anon has to eat you know.

Individually is good enough when there are OVVEERR NINE THOUUUUSSSAAAANNND! individuals. People sleep, people eat, people get disinterested, but there are still thousands of people working against COS. And those thousands get the disinterested people back interested, and then some of them leave and come back. The point is that there is always someone putting pressure on COS.

Like I said, it's a matter of attrition, see who can outlast the other. Anon wins once it reaches a critical point of information spread where it becomes a self perpetuating story. CoS wins if that critical point is never reached.

See, the thing is, Anon doesn't have to win. They just have to make COS lose. If Anon loses, big deal, nothing happens. COS cannot lose, and that is a significantly harder battle to fight. Now, normally I would put my bet on COS, because history shows that the side that can't lose has more interest in winning than the other side. But Anon is really getting committed to their side because of all the horrible things COS is doing to people. That's really what's at stake for Anon, which is, I think, more significant than COS' reason for trying to win.

But basically, all Anon, or anyone, has to do to beat COS is say something to someone else. COS wins by shutting everyone up. It's a hell of a lot easier for you to say something than to stop someone else from talking.

I know alot has already been said, but in reading through (most of) the posts I can help but feel that it's become a bit too cool to hate the CoS. It's become apparent that people need an outlet to express hate and anger and they find an easy target in the CoS because they have made mistakes in the past or seem different or out of the mainstream.

It's never good when hate is a fad and anger is fashionable. If Scientology makes peoples lives better then let them find out for themselves. I can't blame the CoS for some of it's tactics, since it's inception people have scrutinized it and attacked it in order to line thier own pockets.

I see the recent story about the kid who died because who prayed over her instead of seeking medical help as probably far worse then the "victims" of Scientology. http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=16886

Anonymous seems like a group of people that have lots of time on thier hands and have alot of pent up anger and negativity. They've caused damage to three dozen people's personal property (laptops) through cyber terrorism. As a libertarian I could think of little else as abhorrent as destroying something that's not yours out of boredom or simply becasue you can. I support individual property rights and I'm left wondering why no one calls these bullies out for this crimes they have committed.

On July 26, 2007, KTTV Fox 11 News based in Los Angeles, California aired a report on Anonymous, calling them a group of "hackers on steroids", "domestic terrorists", and collectively an "Internet hate machine". The report covered an attack on a MySpace user, who claimed to have had his MySpace account "hacked" into by Anonymous, and plastered with images of gay pornography. The MySpace user also claimed a virus written by Anonymous hackers was sent to him and to ninety friends on his MySpace contact list, crashing thirty-two of his friends' computers. The report featured an unnamed former "hacker" who had fallen out with Anonymous and explained his view of the Anonymous culture. In addition, the report also mentioned "raids" on Habbo Hotel, a "national campaign to spoil the new Harry Potter book ending", and threats to "bomb sports stadiums". Ironically, the news report became a meme on most of the chan boards, inspiring mass mockery, notably the footage of an exploding van and the suggestion that buying a dog could protect victims from Anonymous. [8]

^ Phil Shuman (investigative reporter). "FOX 11 Investigates: 'Anonymous'", MyFOX Los Angeles, KTTV (FOX), 2007-07-26. Retrieved on 2007-08-11.
^ Ryan Singel. "Investigative Report Reveals Hackers Terrorize the Internet for LULZ", Wired News, CondéNet, Inc., 2007-07-27. Retrieved on 2008-02-23

http://www.myfoxla.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail;jsessionid=CF44E4F9F31A9317662FC5877BD64477?contentId=3894628&version=7&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=VSTY&pageId=1.1.1&sflg=1

It seems to me that they exist to make the lives of thers miserable. Not much better then the claims you make about the 'pyramid scheme' that is Scientology. If you support or are a member of this group always remember theat when you lie with dogs you always get fleas.

I am not a Scientologist. I am a Theravada Buddhist. I have seen and heard claims made by L Ron Hubbard and Scientology about the Buddha-saying he left no real map for us to reach enlightenment with. Not exactly true.
http://www.theravada.ca/Pages/4noble_truths.html
http://dharma.ncf.ca/introduction/truths/NobleTruth-4.html
I am offended when claims in books are made that they have the key to self realization and the Dhamma (teachings of the Buddha) do not. Despite that, I support thier freedom to pracitice religion if that's what they consider to be a religion. I also support people's rights to be stupid. If you make the mistake of throwing money into the CoS, then that's your choice. I make a similar choice when I choose to support the monks at the local monastary. The monks are essentially living off of the laity. I have no problem with this and I support because it's my duty as a layman to support the Sangha(monks) in return for thier guidance, help, and support on my individual spiritual path. There are also religious services the monks provide to the larger community.

Scientology apparently has this system:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctrine_of_Exchange

Until I see the thousands of mindless zombies that Scientology is supposedly creating through the E-Meter and auditing, I refuse to believe that it is something or some one that warrants destruction. Buddhists are not unfamiliar with persecution, there was a period in time when mulsims invaded Buddhist territories and defaced temples, destroyed suttas (sacred holy texts), and pillaged about generally. Many atheists also are paranoid about being a persecuted minority in the US. How do you think Scientologists feel?

...

Scifag.

...

Scifag.

...

XenuFish!

...

Scifag.

Did you not read the Mod warning against you or do you just not care?

...

Scifag.
learn2attack arguments, not posters.
I know alot has already been said, but in reading through (most of) the posts I can help but feel that it's become a bit too cool to hate the CoS. It's become apparent that people need an outlet to express hate and anger and they find an easy target in the CoS because they have made mistakes in the past or seem different or out of the mainstream.
I imagine this is true of some people. But it's not like there aren't people who have every reason to want the CoS gone.

It's never good when hate is a fad and anger is fashionable. If Scientology makes peoples lives better then let them find out for themselves.
Provided they can afford it and don't want to leave. Or they can find some Freezoners.
I can't blame the CoS for some of it's tactics, since it's inception people have scrutinized it and attacked it in order to line thier own pockets.
Since its inception its owners and operators have been lining their pockets with the money of believers. And its tactics are never justifiable. What did Lisa Mc Pherson do to deserve death?

I see the recent story about the kid who died because who prayed over her instead of seeking medical help as probably far worse then the "victims" of Scientology. http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=16886
It's always tragic when someone dies as the result of someone else's stupidity, but the two really aren't comparable. The CoS is huge and has influence over millions(total estimate on my part). That family does not.

Anonymous seems like a group of people that have lots of time on thier hands and have alot of pent up anger and negativity.
Anonymous aren't a homogenous group. There's very little one can say about them as a whole.
They've caused damage to three dozen people's personal property (laptops) through cyber terrorism.
Source.
As a libertarian I could think of little else as abhorrent as destroying something that's not yours out of boredom or simply becasue you can. I support individual property rights and I'm left wondering why no one calls these bullies out for this crimes they have committed.
When they commit crimes they usually are punished. See Jake Brahm (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_Brahm).

Of course, I see you fail to mention the several child pornographs that Anonymous has reported to the FBI, and the school shootings they've stopped, and Hal Turner, the man they outed as a white supremacist.





http://www.myfoxla.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail;jsessionid=CF44E4F9F31A9317662FC5877BD64477?contentId=3894628&version=7&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=VSTY&pageId=1.1.1&sflg=1
So they're not called out for their crimes, but FOX News has made some reports on how they're allegedly a cyber terrorist group of hackers on steroids?

It seems to me that they exist to make the lives of thers miserable.
Not all of them. Certainly not the ones that are trying to take down the CoS.
Not much better then the claims you make about the 'pyramid scheme' that is Scientology.
Better indeed. Messing with people for your own amusement isn't a good thing, of course, but it's mainly a result of immaturity than some kind of grand conspiracy. The CoS on the other hand is a grand conspiracy to get rich of its members. Or at least, it seems that way.
If you support or are a member of this group always remember theat when you lie with dogs you always get fleas.
Duly noted.

I am not a Scientologist. I am a Theravada Buddhist. I have seen and heard claims made by L Ron Hubbard and Scientology about the Buddha-saying he left no real map for us to reach enlightenment with. Not exactly true.
http://www.theravada.ca/Pages/4noble_truths.html
http://dharma.ncf.ca/introduction/truths/NobleTruth-4.html
I am offended when claims in books are made that they have the key to self realization and the Dhamma (teachings of the Buddha) do not.
Standard business practice. You want your product to appear the best, to do things no other product does. Except for most people, their religious beliefs aren't something they feel they have to buy.
Despite that, I support thier freedom to pracitice religion if that's what they consider to be a religion. I also support people's rights to be stupid. If you make the mistake of throwing money into the CoS, then that's your choice.
So does Anonymous. Scientologist beliefs seem pretty stupid, but I don't care if people want to believe stupid things or not. The problem is the way they abuse their member's trust, and their Fair Game policy on all critics.
I make a similar choice when I choose to support the monks at the local monastary. The monks are essentially living off of the laity. I have no problem with this and I support because it's my duty as a layman to support the Sangha(monks) in return for thier guidance, help, and support on my individual spiritual path. There are also religious services the monks provide to the larger community.

Scientology apparently has this system:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctrine_of_Exchange
There's nothing wrong with donating to your religion. But you cannot be a Scientologist if you don't pay the Church. If you wanted you could practice buddhism on your own, independant of any temple. Try that with Scientology and they'll sue you into bankruptcy and do everything they can to ruin your life.

Until I see the thousands of mindless zombies that Scientology is supposedly creating through the E-Meter and auditing, I refuse to believe that it is something or some one that warrants destruction. Buddhists are not unfamiliar with persecution, there was a period in time when mulsims invaded Buddhist territories and defaced temples, destroyed suttas (sacred holy texts), and pillaged about generally. Many atheists also are paranoid about being a persecuted minority in the US. How do you think Scientologists feel?
http://youfoundthecard.com/scientology-fact-sheet.php

Did you not read the Mod warning against you or do you just not care?

I got warned for spamming. Calling him a scifag isn't spam.
You got warned for ad hominem.

Now, I was going to say more, but my battery died.

So.

Scifag.

As much as I don't actually have anything against Fox news on the national level, on the local level, yeah, they're crazy. And again, that's old news. And Anon has released any number of videos and statements in response, which all say basically that Fox missed the point entirely. They're not cyberterrorists, they're a bunch of immature nerd getting kicks from messing with people.

Also, that exploding van? I've actually know where that footage comes from: Saw it on Futureweapons, I did (which would be a cooler show with a different host). It was a test for a new kind of shaped charges.

Now, it should be noted that Anon has absolutely no problem with people believing in Scientology. They have a problem with the practices of the Church of Scientology, which are dodgy and not entirely legal.

I got warned for spamming. Calling him a scifag isn't spam.
You got warned for ad hominem.

Now, I was going to say more, but my battery died.

So.

Scifag.


I see, so your interpretation of what the moderator said is that its not ok for me to use ad hominem attacks but for you its perfectly fine?

I see, so your interpretation of what the moderator said is that its not ok for me to use ad hominem attacks but for you its perfectly ok?

Maybe the mod likes me better?

Maybe the mod likes me better?

I suppose we'll find out.
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=13577370#post13577370

Now we play the waiting game. Lets just not play the derail-the-thread-to-argue-about-who-is-or-isn't-breaking-the-rules game.

Holy crap, Batman! Its the Mod-Alert signal!

Wait, what?

http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/9530/modnm4.jpg

I got warned for spamming. Calling him a scifag isn't spam.
You got warned for ad hominem.

Now, I was going to say more, but my battery died.

So.

Scifag.



And now you're both being warned to stop the off-topic nonense and stay on track.

Or, RhynoD, you could score a warnings trifecta and win a lovely holiday in balmy Forumban, 'sup to you.

This is a thread that a lot of posters are interested in and have managed to discuss reasonably despite opposing views. Forcing them to trudge through strings of irrelevant nonsense/mod intervention/irrelevant nonsense about mod intervention is unfair. Cut it out.

In all fairness, there are periods of inactivity in Anon's assaults on the CoS. I think it's better to have one thread rather than the occasional thread popping up. For that reason, I would personally support a very mild amount of spammage as opposed to mindless bumping.

Bumping < Mild Spamming.

But spamming < everything :p

I still find it amazing that some people believe Scientology is in any way harmless... They're pretty much like the catholic church before the reformation.

'Anonymous' doesn't care about free speach. It's a bunch of 4chan users with nothing to do. If you read their imageboard, they think its hilarious people are taking them serious. Their other attack on the Epilepsy foundation websites prove their just a bunch of a-holes with no lives.

While I don't endores the CoS, please stop taking these 4chan users, the bastards of the internet, seriously.

'Anonymous' doesn't care about free speach. It's a bunch of 4chan users with nothing to do. If you read their imageboard, they think its hilarious people are taking them serious

It is hilarious that people are taking them seriously. It's Anonymous. You're not normally supposed to take them seriously. The irony is not lost on them, I'm sure.

It is hilarious that people are taking them seriously. It's Anonymous. You're not normally supposed to take them seriously. The irony is not lost on them, I'm sure.

I think they're semi-serious about this. They're in this to destroy an organization they oppose, AND for epic lulz.

Wath this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-063clxiB8I) for proof. It is their code of conduct for public demonstrations. Not only is it amusing at points, but I would recommend it to anyone who is new to public demonstrations. Particularly someone who is used to posting on the internet.

I think they're semi-serious about this. They're in this to destroy an organization they oppose, AND for epic lulz.

Wath this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-063clxiB8I) for proof. It is their code of conduct for public demonstrations. Not only is it amusing at points, but I would recommend it to anyone who is new to public demonstrations. Particularly someone who is used to posting on the internet.

Well, yeah, they are being serious. Which is why it's ironic.

Their other attack on the Epilepsy foundation websites prove their just a bunch of a-holes with no lives.


There is no evidence to date that puts this attack on Anon's door other than rumors. Some speculation puts the attack on CoS's door, who has been noted to perform illegal activities to frame their detractors.

There is no evidence to date that puts this attack on Anon's door other than rumors. Some speculation puts the attack on CoS's door, who has been noted to perform illegal activities to frame their detractors.

Indeed, this is a very common CoS tactic. I guess they can't put signs on the houses of all anons declaring that they're child molesters, so they resort to this instead.

One could also ask how long the Soviet Union could last when people individually were generally poverty level poor.

The answer, when you have a brainwashed slave labor force, is apparently quite a bit.
Inadequate analogy is inadequate. The people supported the Soviet Union. It also happened to be a government and not an organization.

Spreading information is one thing, but it only works if you have the dedication to stick it out to the end, which could be years.
We are ready.

~ Tsar the Mod.
Sweet! No warning! Not that I did anything, but it's good to know I'm doing it right.

...

Scifag.
You're not helping...

and Hal Turner, the man they outed as a white supremacist.
5 Minutes to go!!!

'Anonymous' doesn't care about free speach. It's a bunch of 4chan users with nothing to do. If you read their imageboard, they think its hilarious people are taking them serious. Their other attack on the Epilepsy foundation websites prove their just a bunch of a-holes with no lives.

While I don't endores the CoS, please stop taking these 4chan users, the bastards of the internet, seriously.
Anonymous =/= 4chan. 4chan =/= Anonymous

They do care about free speech. Without it, they can't exist.

The epilepsy attack has not been proven to be from anyone. It could be Co$, it could be some Anons. I read that it was eBaum's or one of the other chans, NOT 4chan. I'm skeptical that many Anon would go that far and cause real harm.

There is no evidence to date that puts this attack on Anon's door other than rumors. Some speculation puts the attack on CoS's door, who has been noted to perform illegal activities to frame their detractors.
Exactly.


I'll get back to the libertarian in a few moments. Gotta get Hal Turner show up and running.

Inadequate analogy is inadequate. The people supported the Soviet Union. It also happened to be a government and not an organization.

Not really. CoS people definitely support CoS, and the low level CoS members can be the equivalent of their free labor force. The rest of the world could be Anon and non-CoS people.

CoS attempts to destroy it's detractors. The Soviet Union did the same. CoS tolerates no dissent in its ranks. CoS does the same. The Soviet Union exploited their people for all they were worth. CoS exploits its members for all their worth.

A deeper look provides a surprising number of matches really.

Not really. CoS people definitely support CoS, and the low level CoS members can be the equivalent of their free labor force. The rest of the world could be Anon and non-CoS people.

CoS attempts to destroy it's detractors. The Soviet Union did the same. CoS tolerates no dissent in its ranks. CoS does the same. The Soviet Union exploited their people for all they were worth. CoS exploits its members for all their worth.

A deeper look provides a surprising number of matches really.

The SU had several whole economies and populations backing it. COS has bits and pieces of countries backing it.

I know alot has already been said, but in reading through (most of) the posts I can help but feel that it's become a bit too cool to hate the CoS. It's become apparent that people need an outlet to express hate and anger and they find an easy target in the CoS because they have made mistakes in the past or seem different or out of the mainstream.
No, it's because they routinely suppress free speech and free religion, as well as commit violent crimes and harass critics.

It's never good when hate is a fad and anger is fashionable. If Scientology makes peoples lives better then let them find out for themselves. I can't blame the CoS for some of it's tactics, since it's inception people have scrutinized it and attacked it in order to line thier own pockets.
We have no problem with people believing in it. But when you have to pay enormous sums or you can't leave without fear of retribution, that is unacceptable. There is no excuse for their behavior. They could take the high road and ignore it, but no, they suppressed criticism. And also, they weren't criticized until relatively recently.

I see the recent story about the kid who died because who prayed over her instead of seeking medical help as probably far worse then the "victims" of Scientology.
One death caused by two parents is nothing compared to multiple deaths, injuries, and suppressions caused by an entire organization.

Anonymous seems like a group of people that have lots of time on thier hands and have alot of pent up anger and negativity. They've caused damage to three dozen people's personal property (laptops) through cyber terrorism.
Unproven, collateral damage, or accidental. Take your pick.

As a libertarian
Libertarians have such a distorted view of reality. They make too many assumptions of human behavior that are clearly absurd.

I could think of little else as abhorrent as destroying something that's not yours out of boredom or simply becasue you can. I support individual property rights and I'm left wondering why no one calls these bullies out for this crimes they have committed.
Co$ has destroyed far more. Anyway, Anon has not and can not be connected to any loss of property. I don't know where you get this laptop destruction from. Anonymous is not a unified group. Each person can do what they want and not be supported by the rest of the group. It's more claiming anonymity than being a group member.

Fox 11 News
That video is nothing but sensationalism and misinterpretation. Several of those incidents were perpetrated by individuals or not even perpetrated at all.

It seems to me that they exist to make the lives of thers miserable. Not much better then the claims you make about the 'pyramid scheme' that is Scientology. If you support or are a member of this group always remember theat when you lie with dogs you always get fleas.
No, they are trolls. All they want is to piss people off.

Despite that, I support thier freedom to pracitice religion if that's what they consider to be a religion.
No one is against that. We are against Co$ tactics of suppression.

I also support people's rights to be stupid.
See this is where libertarians often fall out of touch with reality. People get pressured into things like cults and drugs and then are caught in a trap of addiction. They are simply unable to get out without help for the most part. It is highly unreasonable to expect everyone to be able to make an informed choice about drugs or cults. They are almost always pressured into it at the moment and are stuck from then on.

If you make the mistake of throwing money into the CoS, then that's your choice.
The thing is, they are brainwashed into thinking it is the only way. They do not have the ability to make a free choice.

I make a similar choice when I choose to support the monks at the local monastary. The monks are essentially living off of the laity. I have no problem with this and I support because it's my duty as a layman to support the Sangha(monks) in return for thier guidance, help, and support on my individual spiritual path. There are also religious services the monks provide to the larger community.
But, it is not required. That is one of the key problems with $cientology. They also don't ask for thousands per individual.

Until I see the thousands of mindless zombies that Scientology is supposedly creating through the E-Meter and auditing, I refuse to believe that it is something or some one that warrants destruction.
Where do you live? A cave? Check this site (http://www.whyaretheydead.net) out for a few examples.

Many atheists also are paranoid about being a persecuted minority in the US.
They don't go suppressing criticism and committing crimes as part of their suppression.

How do you think Scientologists feel?
The average one is starting to realize what the reality is. They're masters are telling them they are being persecuted.

Boy, is it wonderful to see a documented case of a libertarian with a distorted view of reality. :)



Not really. CoS people definitely support CoS, and the low level CoS members can be the equivalent of their free labor force. The rest of the world could be Anon and non-CoS people.

CoS attempts to destroy it's detractors. The Soviet Union did the same. CoS tolerates no dissent in its ranks. CoS does the same. The Soviet Union exploited their people for all they were worth. CoS exploits its members for all their worth.

A deeper look provides a surprising number of matches really.
The USSR exploited everyone FOR everyone. The Co$ exploited everyone for the upper ranks. Everyone exploits someone else for something, to be honest. Capitalism is loaded with exploitation. The lottery and gambling,...

'Anonymous' doesn't care about free speach. It's a bunch of 4chan users with nothing to do. If you read their imageboard, they think its hilarious people are taking them serious. Their other attack on the Epilepsy foundation websites prove their just a bunch of a-holes with no lives.

While I don't endores the CoS, please stop taking these 4chan users, the bastards of the internet, seriously.

Anon is traditionally associated with /b/. Which is correct, for the most part. Anon doth sprung from them, it is true. However, Anon grew beyond this for the war, and now exists as an entity that recognizes its troll and meme heritage, but strives to exist as an entity on its own that does care and will strive to its goal.

The USSR exploited everyone FOR everyone. The Co$ exploited everyone for the upper ranks. Everyone exploits someone else for something, to be honest. Capitalism is loaded with exploitation. The lottery and gambling,...

Oh come now. Surely you don't believe that particular tripe about the Soviet Union being everyone for everyone. Publicly, they might claim it so, but we certainly know where all those import cars, wines, and high class luxury goods went.

The SU had several whole economies and populations backing it. COS has bits and pieces of countries backing it.

The SU was also a great deal larger than CoS. Scale down the SU, change it's rhetoric a bit, and it could pass for CoS.

The SU was also a great deal larger than CoS. Scale down the SU, change it's rhetoric a bit, and it could pass for CoS.

That is somewhat true. But the SU didn't last, and while yes, it lasted a while, things change more quickly today than they used to.

'Anonymous' doesn't care about free speach. It's a bunch of 4chan users with nothing to do.

Exactly. It's also quite notable that 4chan launches "raids" on random sites for no reason. I think SOME /b/ users care about the Scientology issue, but come on, most people saw the protests as massive 4chan gatherings. Hell, the "protesters" carried "LONGCAT IS LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG" signs along with their serious material...

If you read their imageboard, they think its hilarious people are taking them serious. xD. I know some people who went to the Dublin protest who said exactly that. Front-page of the Irish Independent newspaper next day.

Their other attack on the Epilepsy foundation websites prove their just a bunch of a-holes with no lives.Once again, this is just another random raid. I actually followed them on a raid to Habbo Hotel a few days ago. Habbo Hotel isn't "injustice against humanity". They just do it, for (to use their term) "epic lulz".


While I don't endores the CoS, please stop taking these 4chan users, the bastards of the internet, seriously...bastards of reality or bastards of the internet? CoS or /b/? YOU DECIDE

And now you're both being warned to stop the off-topic nonense and stay on track.

Or, RhynoD, you could score a warnings trifecta and win a lovely holiday in balmy Forumban, 'sup to you.

This is a thread that a lot of posters are interested in and have managed to discuss reasonably despite opposing views. Forcing them to trudge through strings of irrelevant nonsense/mod intervention/irrelevant nonsense about mod intervention is unfair. Cut it out.
Actually, I find RhynoD's style of being annoying to be rather informative about what "Anon" type people are really like.

Anon is traditionally associated with /b/. Which is correct, for the most part. Anon doth sprung from them, it is true. However, Anon grew beyond this for the war, and now exists as an entity that recognizes its troll and meme heritage, but strives to exist as an entity on its own that does care and will strive to its goal.
Anon is not /b/. /b/ is not Anon. Actually /b/ is kind of pissed at the anti-Co$ activists that are bringing it up on /b/.

Oh come now. Surely you don't believe that particular tripe about the Soviet Union being everyone for everyone. Publicly, they might claim it so, but we certainly know where all those import cars, wines, and high class luxury goods went.
There were a few minor inconsistencies that anti-Communists like to trump up as important.

The SU was also a great deal larger than CoS. Scale down the SU, change it's rhetoric a bit, and it could pass for CoS.
Not at all. The Co$ is a silly corporation, the USSR was a legitimate attempt to help people.

Actually, I find RhynoD's style of being annoying to be rather informative about what "Anon" type people are really like.

I'm actually not a btard or an Anon.

Fail flame is fail.

There were a few minor inconsistencies that anti-Communists like to trump up as important.

Not at all. The Co$ is a silly corporation, the USSR was a legitimate attempt to help people.

Andaras is that you? I mean, seriously, what's up with this? The USSR may have been publicly all about helping the common man, but ever since Stalin took over, it's been downhill, with an up or two, and then downhill again.

'Anonymous' doesn't care about free speach. It's a bunch of 4chan users with nothing to do. If you read their imageboard, they think its hilarious people are taking them serious. Their other attack on the Epilepsy foundation websites prove their just a bunch of a-holes with no lives.

While I don't endores the CoS, please stop taking these 4chan users, the bastards of the internet, seriously.

It started off as /b/tards just looking for lulz, but people who actually give a crap have gotten involved under the banner of Anon. The Anon that protests the Co$ is not the same Anon that raids camgirls and Habbo. Well, mostly.

'Anonymous' doesn't care about free speach. It's a bunch of 4chan users with nothing to do. If you read their imageboard, they think its hilarious people are taking them serious. Their other attack on the Epilepsy foundation websites prove their just a bunch of a-holes with no lives.

While I don't endores the CoS, please stop taking these 4chan users, the bastards of the internet, seriously.

Shut up, troll.

Andaras is that you? I mean, seriously, what's up with this? The USSR may have been publicly all about helping the common man, but ever since Stalin took over, it's been downhill, with an up or two, and then downhill again.

Well, the USSR may have been an attempt to help the common people at the beginning, back when Trotsky and Lenin ran the show. And frankly, I imagine the average commoner was better off under the Soviet Union than under the tzars.

Also, that kind of post is exactly what I would expect from Sel Appa. He IS a Communist, after all. It also makes sense that he would oppose Scientology, a religion that requires you to pay money to learn their beliefs, restricting enlightenment to the wealthy. That sounds like the pure antithesis of communism.

Shut up, troll.

He's probably just POed cuz his myspace password got stolen or summat by Anon.

Andaras is that you? I mean, seriously, what's up with this? The USSR may have been publicly all about helping the common man, but ever since Stalin took over, it's been downhill, with an up or two, and then downhill again.
No, I differ with him on several things such as Zimbabwe. He thinks the economic issues are overblown and Western bias, I think they are real problems.

Stalin was a good leader. He got things done. People highlight many bad things about him that aren't even really connected to him. He was indirectly and directly responsible for only 1 million deaths at the most, about average for an "evil dictator". He wasn't perfect and he was insane and paranoid, but he did get the USSR up and running fast. Without him, World War 2 could never be won. Then again, none of the three could have won WW2 without each other.

It started off as /b/tards just looking for lulz, but people who actually give a crap have gotten involved under the banner of Anon. The Anon that protests the Co$ is not the same Anon that raids camgirls and Habbo. Well, mostly.
No part of Anon is responsible for any other part. They aren't all involved in everything. Some do some things, others do others, others do all or most.

He was indirectly and directly responsible for only 1 million deaths at the most, about average for an "evil dictator".

That's the low estimate, actually.

Historians actually don't have any fucking clue where it was. 1.7 million is the "low" estimate with about 60 million being the high estimate. 20 million or so seems to be the generally accepted figure what with recent documents.

That's the low estimate, actually.

Historians actually don't have any fucking clue where it was. 1.7 million is the "low" estimate with about 60 million being the high estimate. 20 million or so seems to be the generally accepted figure what with recent documents.
Absolutely incorrect. The only reasonable high end estimate is about 1 million. You can't attribute famine deaths to him. It's like attributing car accident deaths to Bush because he didn't make them safer.

Absolutely incorrect. The only reasonable high end estimate is about 1 million. You can't attribute famine deaths to him. It's like attributing car accident deaths to Bush because he didn't make them safer.

Really? Because 1 million is lower than any figure attributed to him.

Stalin was a good leader. He got things done. People highlight many bad things about him that aren't even really connected to him. He was indirectly and directly responsible for only 1 million deaths at the most, about average for an "evil dictator". He wasn't perfect and he was insane and paranoid, but he did get the USSR up and running fast. Without him, World War 2 could never be won. Then again, none of the three could have won WW2 without each other.


Stalin got things done, yes. This can't be denied. But the purges, a precedent he set, for reasons both real and imagined, created a huge cost in human lives. The holodomor was certainly his doing.

Absolutely incorrect. The only reasonable high end estimate is about 1 million. You can't attribute famine deaths to him. It's like attributing car accident deaths to Bush because he didn't make them safer.

Why not? It seems to be that it was his instruction that resulted in harvested Ukrainian grain being stored in silos to ship to who knows where while the Ukrainians staved.

Was Stalin a Scientologist? If not, wtf are you guys talking about.

Nope, he just had too many body thetans.

But Marx was OT VIII

Really? Because 1 million is lower than any figure attributed to him.
All those figures misattribute or even go as far as making up false deaths. Quite honestly, anti-communist propaganda in the West made up some figures to portray Stalin as pure evil. It was published in one place, then another, and another, and eventually it was accepted as truth and people don't realize it has no basis in fact. One day, I will devote the time to tracing the origin of these falsely inflated numbers and shed light on the true number that will be somewhere under 1 million. It's just very convenient to inflate a death count when it qualifies your argument that Stalin was bad.

Stalin got things done, yes. This can't be denied. But the purges, a precedent he set, for reasons both real and imagined, created a huge cost in human lives. The holodomor was certainly his doing.
The purges are overemphasized and inflated to much beyond what they actually were.

Why not? It seems to be that it was his instruction that resulted in harvested Ukrainian grain being stored in silos to ship to who knows where while the Ukrainians staved.
First off, there were natural declines in the capabilities due to weather and climate changes. Second, the kulaks destroyed all the food, so of course they'd starve.


I'd also like to point out that regular operational deaths are also unfairly attributed to him. These would include things such as capital punishment and deaths while police are enforcing the law. Certainly Sean Bell (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Bell)'s death is not Bush's fault.

All in all, he's attacked in a compounding or circular way like most Communist leaders.

im in a Chanologist group in Second Life. if any1 here has a second life account, the group was started by a guy named Codizzo Hawker (I think thats how u spell it... I haven been on SL in awhile) in the Teen Grid

& some of u ppl are dipshits apparently... Scientology was an american, capitalist movement started in the 50s. OF COURSE STALIN WASNT A SCIENTOLOGIST.

I see there are Scientology supporters in this thread. Wonderful, a whole new kind of moron to plague NSG.:rolleyes:

The purges are overemphasized and inflated to much beyond what they actually were.


And proof of this is where? I mean, there must be some record of the actual number of deaths, if you're so sure that they were vastly inflated.


First off, there were natural declines in the capabilities due to weather and climate changes.

Which certainly didn't help when Stalin had what grain there was locked up in silos while the people starved.


Second, the kulaks destroyed all the food, so of course they'd starve.


And the proof of this is...?

Please, don't give me those Stalinist sites that Andaras used to beat his drum to. We both know how thoroughly discredited they are.


Certainly Sean Bell (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sean_Bell)'s death is not Bush's fault.

Maybe not, but I can attribute him as indirectly (as in, he didn't pull the trigger), responsible for some 30,000 to 120,000 (total numbers are disputed), civilian deaths.

Can we stop talking about communeisim please? This thread is regarding the war on scientology.

I see there are Scientology supporters in this thread. Wonderful, a whole new kind of moron to plague NSG.:rolleyes:

Odd. Ive been following this thread for the last few weeks and havnt seen a single poster support Scientology.

Odd. Ive been following this thread for the last few weeks and havnt seen a single poster support Scientology.

Exept you.

IF may be pessimistic, but his points are too rational to have come from any form of CoS person. Any CoS person by now would have been ranting about how Anon is made out of terrorists and what not.

Exept you.

I find Moses parting the Red Sea, Elija coming for dinner and mass extinction at the hands of space 747s and volcanoes to be equally silly. Thats not to say i have not educated myself on their belief systems.

IF may be pessimistic, but his points are too rational to have come from any form of CoS person. Any CoS person by now would have been ranting about how Anon is made out of terrorists and what not.

That might be the case, but he is annoying and should stop posting in this thread in future.

That might be the case, but he is annoying and should stop posting in this thread in future.

Why? admitedly I have mainly skimmed, and when I went back to read the last few pages it has apparently turned into a communist debate, but it seems IF does not support scientology, he just is not letting anon take credit for something it has no business taking credit for.

That might be the case, but he is annoying and should stop posting in this thread in future.

No, he shouldn't.

Here's why! (http://youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0)

IF may be pessimistic, but his points are too rational to have come from any form of CoS person. Any CoS person by now would have been ranting about how Anon is made out of terrorists and what not.
He's being careful and trying to hide his identity on a hostile board.
No, he shouldn't.

RICKROLL (http://youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0)
DAMN! That's almost the third time this week on NSG...

He's being careful and trying to hide his identity on a hostile board.

You caught me, im really Tom Cruise. Nothing gets past you. :rolleyes:

All those figures misattribute or even go as far as making up false deaths. Quite honestly, anti-communist propaganda in the West made up some figures to portray Stalin as pure evil. It was published in one place, then another, and another, and eventually it was accepted as truth and people don't realize it has no basis in fact. One day, I will devote the time to tracing the origin of these falsely inflated numbers and shed light on the true number that will be somewhere under 1 million. It's just very convenient to inflate a death count when it qualifies your argument that Stalin was bad.

So even the commonly accepted low estimate is inflated by anti-commie propaganda? This is NSG remember, you don't need your tinfoil hat here.

The purges are overemphasized and inflated to much beyond what they actually were.

Historians can't even agree on what they were.

So even the commonly accepted low estimate is inflated by anti-commie propaganda? This is NSG remember, you don't need your tinfoil hat here.
No, those are the only even remotely accurate estimates.

Historians can't even agree on what they were.
Exactly.

He's being careful and trying to hide his identity on a hostile board.

Speaking as someone who was around when we had scientologists on the board, he's not a damn scientologist. Stop making yourself look foolish.

<snip>
<snip>
Did I click the wrong thread? I thought this was Anonymous vs. Scientology?

It is? Ah, so it's you kids who think they're in a communism thread.
Speaking as someone who was around when we had scientologists on the board, he's not a damn scientologist. Stop making yourself look foolish.

Seconded. It's like McCarthyism, except everyone who disagrees with Sel and RD is a CoS plant instead of a commie.

Speaking as someone who was around when we had scientologists on the board, he's not a damn scientologist. Stop making yourself look foolish.
Ah whatever.

We need some news to bring this thread back.

I, unfortunately, am unable to attend the next protest (which is a week away!) despite really wanting to and almost getting a group together.

No, those are the only even remotely accurate estimates.

Really? Because the "low" estimate is 1.7 million, almost twice as much as your "accurate" version.

Exactly.

That doesn't prove your point at all.

It is? Ah, so it's you kids who think they're in a communism thread.

Nice. Except of course, that I didn't start this discussion on communism but only jumped in after incorrect statements about Stalin were made.

Really? Because the "low" estimate is 1.7 million, almost twice as much as your "accurate" version.
There has never really been any investigation into it all. The numbers are mostly just guesses and VERY LIBERAL extrapolations. Honestly, where the hell can you pull 100 million from? The population of Russia isn't even 150 million. That much would be devastating to the country, which clearly did not happen.

That doesn't prove your point at all.
Yes it does. It shows that there really is no agreement over what deaths can be counted and what can't.

That might be the case, but he is annoying and should stop posting in this thread in future.

If annoyance was grounds for stopping on posting, you would have been silenced some 100 posts ago. And NSG would probably be a ghost town.

He's being careful and trying to hide his identity on a hostile board.


Oh please, now that's just stupid. I suppose you're what, Bin Laden then? And Kat over there is probably Micheal Jackson, while Reploid is actually Ron L Hubbard raised from the grave.

They're just being careful and trying to hide their identities.

Please, just stop with the silliness. Either bring conclusive proof, or stop flinging accusations.

Yes it does. It shows that there really is no agreement over what deaths can be counted and what can't.

Then why should your estimate be accurate and not be grossly understated hmm?

Apparently none of you have ever heard of being facetious. Probably because you're all scientologists in disguise.

Apparently none of you have ever heard of being facetious. Probably because you're all scientologists in disguise.

No, I'm a robot in disguise.

No, I'm a robot in disguise.

Wow, the Decepticons are already here.

No, I'm a robot in disguise.

Do robots get body thetans?

Do robots get body thetans?

Of course they do.

http://tn1-1.pv.deviantart.com/fs8/150/i/2005/314/9/f/Starscream__s_Ghost_by_Nemesis84.jpg

Wow, the Decepticons are already here.

Those are 1st generation systems. Badly outdated. Nearly obsolete.

Do robots get body thetans?

Robots don't get non-existent mental diseases, no.

I think that's your body thetans talking...I bet they get body thetans...they're just robotic body thetans: that's actually the source of AOL.

I think that's your body thetans talking...I bet they get body thetans...they're just robotic body thetans: that's actually the source of AOL.

AOL? The ancient pattern from which the first generation of AI gestalt's were formulated? That brings back data sectors.

Then why should your estimate be accurate and not be grossly understated hmm?
Because it's a reasonable estimate and not some random extrapolation that was applied liberally. The numbers range from around 500,000 to 100 million. Anything above 10-15 million is just too impractically high. If there is a "legitimate" number that high, it is counting deaths that cannot be counted acceptably. That would include famine deaths, prison deaths, and war deaths. These simply cannot be attributed to a regime let alone a single person. Generally, the 10-15 million numbers DO include famine deaths and such. Anything above that is quite absurd and without a doubt made up to qualify an anti-Stalin/anti-Communist argument. The only deaths you can really accept are from purges, which numbers at most a million. Even that is just impractically high. No other ideology or strongman has had such treatment as Communism and Stalin in attributing deaths or "victims". You never really hear "Hitler killed 6 million Jews" or "Fascism killed 6 million Jews and 5 million others". All you ever hear is "6 million jews died in the holocaust" or "were killed by the Nazis"

As I said, one day I will work to uncover the true number, which I believe will be around 500 thousand - 1 million tops.

/communism offtopic

There has never really been any investigation into it all. The numbers are mostly just guesses and VERY LIBERAL extrapolations. Honestly, where the hell can you pull 100 million from? The population of Russia isn't even 150 million. That much would be devastating to the country, which clearly did not happen.


Yes it does. It shows that there really is no agreement over what deaths can be counted and what can't.

Because it's a reasonable estimate and not some random extrapolation that was applied liberally. The numbers range from around 500,000 to 100 million. Anything above 10-15 million is just too impractically high. If there is a "legitimate" number that high, it is counting deaths that cannot be counted acceptably. That would include famine deaths, prison deaths, and war deaths. These simply cannot be attributed to a regime let alone a single person. Generally, the 10-15 million numbers DO include famine deaths and such. Anything above that is quite absurd and without a doubt made up to qualify an anti-Stalin/anti-Communist argument. The only deaths you can really accept are from purges, which numbers at most a million. Even that is just impractically high. No other ideology or strongman has had such treatment as Communism and Stalin in attributing deaths or "victims". You never really hear "Hitler killed 6 million Jews" or "Fascism killed 6 million Jews and 5 million others". All you ever hear is "6 million jews died in the holocaust" or "were killed by the Nazis"

As I said, one day I will work to uncover the true number, which I believe will be around 500 thousand - 1 million tops.

/communism offtopic

The only one pulling out 100 million is you. Even the highest estimates based on anecdotal evidence only went up to about 60 million. And it's not to say that historians have no idea. The range is from 1.7 million to about 40 million, with popular theory putting it at about 20 million. Minus the famine deaths, which I believe are attributable, Stalin still racks up about 9 million victims.

The only one pulling out 100 million is you. Even the highest estimates based on anecdotal evidence only went up to about 60 million. And it's not to say that historians have no idea. The range is from 1.7 million to about 40 million, with popular theory putting it at about 20 million. Minus the famine deaths, which I believe are attributable, Stalin still racks up about 9 million victims.
I'm fairly certain I've seen 100 million mentioned somewhere, not necessarily here. What popular theory? Even Wiki suggests 10 million including famine deaths. This 9 million number is quite absurd and misattributes deaths. You cannot attribute deaths for a natural famine or a famine caused by people burning their crops to Stalin or even the regime. You cannot attribute deaths caused in normal criminal proceedings. Where do these numbers come from? 10 million. 20 million.

I'm done with this. Take it how you want. But neither of us will se the other side, so there's no point really in continuing.

I'm fairly certain I've seen 100 million mentioned somewhere, not necessarily here. What popular theory? Even Wiki suggests 10 million including famine deaths. This 9 million number is quite absurd and misattributes deaths. You cannot attribute deaths for a natural famine or a famine caused by people burning their crops to Stalin or even the regime. You cannot attribute deaths caused in normal criminal proceedings. Where do these numbers come from? 10 million. 20 million.

I'm done with this. Take it how you want. But neither of us will se the other side, so there's no point really in continuing.

Ignoring Vadim Erlikman, are we?

STOP

Do we need another Mod to come in and cut off the page of posts about Communism?

(It's just a Red Herring after all.)

STOP

Do we need another Mod to come in and cut off the page of posts about Communism?

(It's just a Red Herring after all.)
I said I would stop and did not respond to his post. :)

I haven't checked PartyVan in awhile...:rolleyes:

Because it's a reasonable estimate and not some random extrapolation that was applied liberally.


I still see no evidence that this estimate of yours is by any stretch, keeping in mind the numbers of dead that have been attributed to dictators and warlords in past history, any more reasonable than say, 15 million dead.


Anything above 10-15 million is just too impractically high.


The holocaust took roughly about 11 years, of which at least 4 of those years were under increasingly scarce resources to locate and kill victims. About 11 million people died. And this was highly specific killings.

The Holodomor took just one year, 1932-1933, is widely attributed to have been done specifically by the Soviet authorities, who confiscated grain and barred villagers from leaving, condemning them to starvation. This was under Stalin's command. An estimated 3 to 3.5 million people died.

I do not see why that in the many years Stalin ruled, his indiscriminate killings could not exceed your "reasonable" claims.


That would include famine deaths


The famine deaths were directly caused by Stalin's command, something that historians seem to agree on. People were deliberately starved, not by the Kulaks, who you fail to show any evidence of their alleged "destruction of grain"


Generally, the 10-15 million numbers DO include famine deaths and such. Anything above that is quite absurd and without a doubt made up to qualify an anti-Stalin/anti-Communist argument.


Any evidence that doesn't agree with me is false. It's a lie by the neo-fascists la la la la.

You really sound like Andaras right now. Less trollish, but the exact same tactits.


You never really hear "Hitler killed 6 million Jews" or "Fascism killed 6 million Jews and 5 million others". All you ever hear is "6 million jews died in the holocaust" or "were killed by the Nazis"

I have no idea who you've been listening to, but the Holocaust took 11 million lives. Roma gypsies, Russians, gays, Jews, political dissidents, people who looked at the SS funny. Jewish people were just one of the victims, that's all.

And of course, nobody ever makes noise about the millions killed during Japan's bloody rampage through South East Asia except South East Asians. Oh no, we're all un-people. Clearly, we're a lower level life form. Not really human. We're not worth consideration.


As I said, one day I will work to uncover the true number, which I believe will be around 500 thousand - 1 million tops.


I'm not going to hold my breath. This could be an HSH Elric esque tactic of claiming "My reality deprived allegations are common fact! I need no proof!"

Yeah, let's quit the Stalin discussion or port it over to another topic before a mod gets pissed.

How the fuck did he get in this conversation anyway?

Oh thank God. I was afraid I'd have to ask you guys to LURK MOAR. :p

Oh thank God. I was afraid I'd have to ask you guys to LURK MOAR. :p

*lurks behind Scotia*

AOL? The ancient pattern from which the first generation of AI gestalt's were formulated? That brings back data sectors.

Something tells me that is a quote, the source of which I should know.

Who's winning?

Who's winning?

I think it's a seige right now. Neither side has a clear advantage.

The CO$ however has been making tons of footbullets by making up stuff about Anonymous that is easily disproven.

Next weekend will be a good indication of how things are going, as there is another protest. This one will be aimed at reconnected families that COS has [purposefully] tried to break up.

I think it's a seige right now. Neither side has a clear advantage.

The CO$ however has been making tons of footbullets by making up stuff about Anonymous that is easily disproven.

Yeah, but is is being easily disproven?

Yeah, but is is being easily disproven?

The hardcore hackers amongst Anon could probably track down the Epilepsy Foundation attacks and discover that some Psilon tools were responsible for it.

The hardcore hackers amongst Anon could probably track down the Epilepsy Foundation attacks and discover that some Psilon tools were responsible for it.

lol no.

Co$ has been banned in Belgium and I think is losing its tax-exempt status in some state soon. So it would appear that Anon is very very slowly advancing.

lol no.

So you find it perfectly acceptable to believe that Anon would suddenly break trend from aggravating and inconvenient yet non life-threatening pranks and move up to something that could have potentially hospitalized or even killed people "for epic lulz"? Especially when shit like this is what the Co$ would love to bring up as an indictment against Project Chanology?

So you find it perfectly acceptable to believe that Anon would suddenly break trend from aggravating and inconvenient yet non life-threatening pranks and move up to something that could have potentially hospitalized or even killed people "for epic lulz"? Especially when shit like this is what the Co$ would love to bring up as an indictment against Project Chanology?

I think it was likely a Co$ tactic, similar to their usual sludging of their enemies, but it is conceivable that some anons would do something like that. One must keep in mind, that Anon is not really an organization, simply a collection of people on the internet, some of whom do good and some of whom do evil.

So you find it perfectly acceptable to believe that Anon would suddenly break trend from aggravating and inconvenient yet non life-threatening pranks and move up to something that could have potentially hospitalized or even killed people "for epic lulz"? Especially when shit like this is what the Co$ would love to bring up as an indictment against Project Chanology?

What trend? Firstly, most of the raids performed by anonymous raiders were harassing people not for any moral reason, merely bullying for the sake of lulz. Anonymous was never a group setup to oppose moral injustice.

Secondly, anonymous really isn't an organised group in anyway. Anyone can set up a thread on any of the /i/ boards and start raids under the name of anonymous which the majority of people who identify themselves as such may or may not actually endorse. There is no central command which only permits certain raids.

It's also rather far fetched to claim that Scientology would deliberately raid an epilepsy website in an elaborate ploy to frame anon. I doubt any Scientology has the know how to be able to set up an anonymous raid like that anyway, especially with all the memes that appeared in that raid.

It's also rather far fetched to claim that Scientology would deliberately raid an epilepsy website in an elaborate ploy to frame anon. I doubt any Scientology has the know how to be able to set up an anonymous raid like that anyway, especially with all the memes that appeared in that raid.

Saying that anything is too far fetched for a group that attempted Operation Freakout is naivete.

Saying that anything is too far fetched for a group that attempted Operation Freakout is naivete.

Also, Scientology was responsible for one of the largest infiltrations of the Federal Government, getting loads of classified documents. L. Ron Hubbard's wife actually went to prison for it.

I'm just saying that yes, it could have been Anonymous, but that it also could have been Co$. Co$ isn't that big, but there has to be someone in it who knows how to hack. Hell, they're all rich, they could just pay someone to hack for them.

Saying that anything is too far fetched for a group that attempted Operation Freakout is naivete.

It's not as if Operation Freakout was particularly sophisticated plot. And it was a totally different kind of ploy with a much more dangerous threat to them. Scientologists are idiots, they don't know anything about the inner workings of anonymous as clearly demonstrated by their videos, there is no way they are smart enough to set up an /i/nvasion like that. Why would they need to do it anyway, there are plenty of raids already done by anonymous which would just as easily cause moral outrage and media sensationalism.

It's not as if Operation Freakout was particularly sophisticated plot. And it was a totally different kind of ploy with a much more dangerous threat to them. Scientologists are idiots, they don't know anything about the inner workings of anonymous as clearly demonstrated by their videos, there is no way they are smart enough to set up an /i/nvasion like that. Why would they need to do it anyway, there are plenty of raids already done by anonymous which would just as easily cause moral outrage and media sensationalism.

Because Scientology is known for going over the top in what they see as "defending the faith."
While most Scientologists are morons, I bet there is at least one who knows how to hack. And there are plenty rich enough to hire someone else to do the hacking for them.

Yes, Anonymous aren't saints, rather some shady characters in that collection of individuals, but it could just as easily have been Scientologists, and I'm leaning that way. Just because Anon made fun of our little forum doesn't mean that they're the most evil people on the internet, though some of them are up there. Nor does it mean that it couldn't have been the Co$, especially knowing Scientology's history of trying to discredit critics in any way possible.

Co$ has been banned in Belgium and I think is losing its tax-exempt status in some state soon. So it would appear that Anon is very very slowly advancing.

accept anon probably had less than zero to do with that.

Next weekend will be a good indication of how things are going, as there is another protest. This one will be aimed at reconnected families that COS has [purposefully] tried to break up.
I really wanted to go with some friends, but there was no way to make an excuse to my parents and they'd be all scared if I told the truth.

I'm gonna flier the local area with info about Co$ and what everyday people can do to help.

I really wanted to go with some friends, but there was no way to make an excuse to my parents and they'd be all scared if I told the truth.

I'm gonna flier the local area with info about Co$ and what everyday people can do to help.

Telling them that you're going out with your friends won't work I take it?

Let's see... latest news I saw last time I checked Enturbulation:

1) Sean, the Los Angeles event organizer who was arrested for "death threats" 3/15 has had all charges against him dropped, even before his arraignment. LAPD is investigating for a false police report, and Sean is in a good position now to sue the guy that filed the report for damages, and possibly CoS itself.

2) Israeli's big news organization recently aired a very damning 20 minute thing about Scientology, exposing perhaps millions of people in that part of the world to the subject.

3) IDed Anons who haven't done anything that could be turned into a police report are receiving ultimately toothless but threatening-sounding legal letters from a law firm CoS is paying. Anon in return is reporting the firm to the relevant bar associations for malicious ethics violations or somesuch, and there's a lawyer collecting letters for a potential class-action suit against CoS.

4) CoS is wasting more and more money on ultimately ineffective "security" measures. (The legal letters, the PIs, more cameras and crap.)

I am direly curious to see how the April 12 stuff goes. CoS was caught blindsided by Feb 10, clearly underestimated the momentum the movement would carry through March 15.... will Anon make another massive showing on the 12, or has the collective lost interest?

Just giving an update here.

The bulk of Anonymous doesn't support Project Chanology. Chanology, which now exists primarily on the Partyvan network and Enturbulation and all those other places, is mostly autonomous, and the vast majority of people there who call themselves Anonymous are really newfags or moralfags who had no idea what we were before Janu. The crusty oldtimers that make up who Anonymous really is no longer support it. All of he *chans have separated themselves, and even 711chan is phasing out its /xenu/ board.Anonymous and Chanology are splitting ways. That being said, I am part of the core of Anon, but I also support Chanology and wish them the best of luck. However, if the two continue to try and work together, there's going to be a lot of infighting and drama which won't be good for anybody.

Just giving an update here.

The bulk of Anonymous doesn't support Project Chanology.

Why? Is it that they don't do so anymore, or have not done so from the beginning?

Why has this thread been invaded by pro-scientolgy n00bs?

The USSR exploited everyone FOR everyone. The Co$ exploited everyone for the upper ranks. Everyone exploits someone else for something, to be honest. Capitalism is loaded with exploitation. The lottery and gambling,...

NO, they did the opposite of what their ideals were and exploited everyone for the ruling elite.

Why has this thread been invaded by pro-scientolgy n00bs?

I'd like you to find one, just One, post that actually supports Co$.

I'd like you to find one, just One, post that actually supports Co$.

Melphi.

I'd like you to find one, just One, post that actually supports Co$.

Dontletmedown

Regardless, since when does most of Anon not support Project Chanology? I mean, I know there are some people on 4chan that are POed that all the protest threads are taking up space, but meh...

Melphi.

O RLY?

Not supporting Anon =/= Supporting Co$, so phail...

Dontletmedown

I seem to remember him and his posts. You might win, if it is indeed the correct poster you're referring to ^^ I, however, cannot be whaled to fish through this thread to worm myself to the post that he blubbed.

I'm sure I can get more fish references in there

I seem to remember him and his posts. You might win, if it is indeed the correct poster you're referring to ^^ I, however, cannot be whaled to fish through this thread to worm myself to the post that he blubbed.

I'm sure I can get more fish references in there

Snip

Not entirely pro COS, but definitely not against them.

O RLY?

Not supporting Anon =/= Supporting Co$, so phail...

Maybe in your little world. If you cant see that Melphi is a Sciplant then lats your look out not mine. Maybe you and Melphi are one and the same.

Maybe in your little world. If you cant see that Melphi is a Sciplant then lats your look out not mine. Maybe you and Melphi are one and the same.
Do you have any idea how paranoid you are sounding?
Melphi does not like the COS. Melphi does not think Anon is very effective. That is all that anyone but you sees.

Maybe in your little world. If you cant see that Melphi is a Sciplant then lats your look out not mine. Maybe you and Melphi are one and the same.

So, what size tinfoil hat do you wear?....you know what it doesn't matter, you should obviously consider getting one that isn't so tight it cuts off blood flow...

But you have to have the foil hats to keep the OT6s from reading your mind.

Let's just remember that Scientologists have every bit as much of a right to their opinion as the rest of us, guys. Don't be so eager to go calling people Sciplants just because they don't agree 100% with you on the subject. Some people think Anon is making a giant dent in CoS, some thing it's a good idea but they aren't actually doing much. Others still think it's just more stupid Anon crap, or that they should go after all religion or whatnot. And if a Scientologist supporter wishes to debate the subject, they're welcome to so long as they stay within the NS rules.

I really don't want to have to get one of the other mods to come back in here to smack people upside the head again, kay?

Yes Ms. Reppy :(

What trend? Firstly, most of the raids performed by anonymous raiders were harassing people not for any moral reason, merely bullying for the sake of lulz. Anonymous was never a group setup to oppose moral injustice.

Secondly, anonymous really isn't an organised group in anyway. Anyone can set up a thread on any of the /i/ boards and start raids under the name of anonymous which the majority of people who identify themselves as such may or may not actually endorse. There is no central command which only permits certain raids.

It's also rather far fetched to claim that Scientology would deliberately raid an epilepsy website in an elaborate ploy to frame anon. I doubt any Scientology has the know how to be able to set up an anonymous raid like that anyway, especially with all the memes that appeared in that raid.
I honestly think IRL physical hurt may be just over Anon's line. However, it certainly could get LULZ. I must admit, I do find it a bit funny. I wouldn't do it though. Co$ hires hackers. It's not that hard to try and emulate Anon.

Telling them that you're going out with your friends won't work I take it?
To NYC? Hell no. My parents are Nazis. They wouldn't let me bike 2 streets down until I was like 12.

I am direly curious to see how the April 12 stuff goes. CoS was caught blindsided by Feb 10, clearly underestimated the momentum the movement would carry through March 15.... will Anon make another massive showing on the 12, or has the collective lost interest?
Picnic in CP!!!...er Central Park!!! Anon NYC will be having a picnic in "CP" with guest speakers and stuff supposedly. They want to outdo everyone, especially London.

Just giving an update here.

The bulk of Anonymous doesn't support Project Chanology. Chanology, which now exists primarily on the Partyvan network and Enturbulation and all those other places, is mostly autonomous, and the vast majority of people there who call themselves Anonymous are really newfags or moralfags who had no idea what we were before Janu. The crusty oldtimers that make up who Anonymous really is no longer support it. All of he *chans have separated themselves, and even 711chan is phasing out its /xenu/ board.Anonymous and Chanology are splitting ways. That being said, I am part of the core of Anon, but I also support Chanology and wish them the best of luck. However, if the two continue to try and work together, there's going to be a lot of infighting and drama which won't be good for anybody.
Eh, Anon is no coherent group. Some do some shit. Others do other shit. I do most raids I can if I can: Habbo and GameStop I've done. I planned to do Co$play, but as I stated it fell through.

The oldfags should be happy a successful internet movement is successful. It shows they can have power for more devious IRL activities...and if Net Neutrality ever comes up, I guarantee every Anon will be out in full force.

The oldfags should be happy a successful internet movement is successful. It shows they can have power for more devious IRL activities...and if Net Neutrality ever comes up, I guarantee every Anon will be out in full force.

Hasn't NN already come and gone?

accept anon probably had less than zero to do with that.

It's not like anybody else has been making much of a fuss over Scifags recently.

To NYC? Hell no. My parents are Nazis. They wouldn't let me bike 2 streets down until I was like 12.



Just go anyway. Your parents will be mad, yes, but they'll get over it.

Because Scientology is known for going over the top in what they see as "defending the faith."
While most Scientologists are morons, I bet there is at least one who knows how to hack. And there are plenty rich enough to hire someone else to do the hacking for them.


But this is so not like them, in the least bit. Shit to do with epilepsy has been a long running joke for many anons anyway, such as flash's with adverts containing seizure inducing strobe lighting advertising epilepsy pills etc... This is very typical anonymous behaviour, except for the fact that it actually caused some people to have seizures. It clearly was anonymous, I mean they were even doing their typical pretending to be from ebaumsworld during the raid (what interest would Scientology have with vindicating ebaumsworld).


because Anon made fun of our little forum

Why do people keep thinking I give a shit about this?


doesn't mean that they're the most evil people on the internet, though some of them are up there. Nor does it mean that it couldn't have been the Co$, especially knowing Scientology's history of trying to discredit critics in any way possible.

But there is no evidence whatsoever that Scientology had any involvement in this at all, and I'm pretty sure the burden of proof is on you.

But this is so not like them, in the least bit. Shit to do with epilepsy has been a long running joke for many anons anyway, such as flash's with adverts containing seizure inducing strobe lighting advertising epilepsy pills etc... This is very typical anonymous behaviour, except for the fact that it actually caused some people to have seizures. It clearly was anonymous, I mean they were even doing their typical pretending to be from ebaumsworld during the raid (what interest would Scientology have with vindicating ebaumsworld).

Their interest in vindicating ebaums is that it is exactly what Anon would do. Too perfect? Eh? EH!? Really, though, it could go either way.

But there is no evidence whatsoever that Scientology had any involvement in this at all, and I'm pretty sure the burden of proof is on you.

There's also no evidence that this was done by Anon, or at least, is sanctioned by Anon. The thing about Anon is that if you say you're part of Anon, you are. Which means anyone can do anything in the name of Anon and give them a bad rep.

I think it was probably some jack-ass calling himself anon, but not related to the rest of Anon whatsoever.

Their interest in vindicating ebaums is that it is exactly what Anon would do. Too perfect? Eh? EH!? Really, though, it could go either way.


Too perfect for them.


There's also no evidence that this was done by Anon, or at least, is sanctioned by Anon.

Nothing is 'sanctioned by anon', as I said before, anon has no central command. It was an anonymous attack started from a thread on an anonymous chan, that counts as a raid by anonymous. Whether scientology were secretly shadowing this raid is a different matter, but I find it extremely unlikely. Since that idea is the far more complex and elaborate one, whats wrong with going with the more simple explanation, i.e. the best explanation is always the simplest.


The thing about Anon is that if you say you're part of Anon, you are. Which means anyone can do anything in the name of Anon and give them a bad rep.


Thats what I said earlier.


I think it was probably some jack-ass calling himself anon, but not related to the rest of Anon whatsoever.

Anyone can be related to anon, there is no initiation or anything.

But this is so not like them, in the least bit. Shit to do with epilepsy has been a long running joke for many anons anyway, such as flash's with adverts containing seizure inducing strobe lighting advertising epilepsy pills etc... This is very typical anonymous behaviour, except for the fact that it actually caused some people to have seizures. It clearly was anonymous, I mean they were even doing their typical pretending to be from ebaumsworld during the raid (what interest would Scientology have with vindicating ebaumsworld).
To look like Anon. Most Scientologists are stupid, but not all of them are. And they are ruthless, and experts at character assassination (not that I'm saying that Anon's character can really be assassinated, but still).

This is like when they put up signs outside the yards of their critics saying that the resident is a child molester.

Why do people keep thinking I give a shit about this?
I dunno, maybe because you made a thread to bitch about it and the page on ED shows an edit by you or someone with the same screen name? I have no idea, myself. Surely it couldn't be that. ;)



But there is no evidence whatsoever that Scientology had any involvement in this at all, and I'm pretty sure the burden of proof is on you.

But there is no evidence whatsoever that Anonymous had any involvement in this at all, and I'm pretty sure the burden of proof is on you.

And that's what I've been saying. It could have been either one. There's no way to know for sure. It's entirely plausible for either party to have done it. It's definitely believable for Anon to have done, as the chans are full of characters that aren't very pleasant. However, Scientology has pulled similar dirty tricks in the past, so it's really impossible to tell.

The rest of what you said is adressed in other posts but:


I dunno, maybe because you made a thread to bitch about it and the page on ED shows an edit by you or someone with the same screen name? I have no idea, myself. Surely it couldn't be that. ;)


But I actually found the article quite funny, I think people got the wrong impression from that thread, I didn't intend it to be a bitching thread, I wasn't planning to get angry at the person once I found out who it was.

Are you serious about the edit thing? I honestly did not edit anything, I don't use this screen name for anything other than NSG.

Are you serious about the edit thing? I honestly did not edit anything, I don't use this screen name for anything other than NSG.

lol found this:

Hydesland is an NSG dyke who got her feelings hurt by ED's article on the faggotry that is nationstates. Due to such a traumatizing experience, and being a shut-in, it followed that she simply had to post a thread on the aforementioned lame-ass site, so that she and the hugbox that is their general forum could all bitch about it together. However, it soon degenerated into one of NSG's many tame, soap opera-esque tiffs, this time between Amor Pulchritudo and RhynoD. The Blessed Chris, being his usual entertainingly assholish self, piped in, making it more interesting. Apparently Amor Pulchritudo was upset that she was mentioned in the context of 'easily excitable posters,' thus proving that she was one. Thus go the typical crap diggings of NSG.

He thinks I'm a woman lol.

The rest of what you said is adressed in other posts but:

But I actually found the article quite funny, I think people got the wrong impression from that thread, I didn't intend it to be a bitching thread, I wasn't planning to get angry at the person once I found out who it was.

Are you serious about the edit thing? I honestly did not edit anything, I don't use this screen name for anything other than NSG.

I looked on the history tab. All edits show up on that, even minor ones.

I see that I am one of the people who got the wrong impression from the thread, I thought it was a thread to complain. Lol, sorry.

My apologies for the tone in my reply, too. I've been having a phenomenally shitty day.

I looked on the history tab. All edits show up on that, even minor ones.


Someones pretending to be me then.

I thought it was a thread to complain.
YOU want to complain? Look at this pair of shoes! I've only had them for three weeks and the soles are already worn through....

YOU want to complain? Look at this pair of shoes! I've only had them for three weeks and the soles are already worn through....

Read more, noob. I was talking to Hydesland, and thought that he had made the thread about the ED article on nationstates to complain about it. Not this thread. And no, I don't want to complain. Except about people not having the sense to read posts in context.

*snip*
I was making a Monty Python joke, which went straight over your head.

I was making a Monty Python joke, which went straight over your head.

Ah. Is that from any of the movies or is it from the show?

Ah. Is that from any of the movies or is it from the show?

From the show, at the end of the "Debate Clinic" thread, when he tries to complain but goes to the wrong place and gets "Abuse" instead, finally finds the "Complaints" department...

*snip*.

LOL. That person clearly has a lot of time on their hands.

lol found this:

Hey, cool! I got mentioned! Right on!

Where was this? TG me if you don't want to link to it.

Hey, cool! I got mentioned! Right on!

Where was this? TG me if you don't want to link to it.

You've been TG'd.

You've been TG'd.

Indeed I have. My thetans thank you.

Hasn't NN already come and gone?
It's died down for now, but'll come back when you least expect it. ie, it's not dead yet.

Just go anyway. Your parents will be mad, yes, but they'll get over it.
They have to drive me to the train station. I can't just sneak out. My dad's a psychonazi. I'm doing something else anyway.

But this is so not like them, in the least bit. Shit to do with epilepsy has been a long running joke for many anons anyway, such as flash's with adverts containing seizure inducing strobe lighting advertising epilepsy pills etc... This is very typical anonymous behaviour, except for the fact that it actually caused some people to have seizures. It clearly was anonymous, I mean they were even doing their typical pretending to be from ebaumsworld during the raid (what interest would Scientology have with vindicating ebaumsworld).
It is every bit like them to frame an enemy. Vindicating means "to clear the name" more or less. Which is not the correct word for what you are saying.

But there is no evidence whatsoever that Scientology had any involvement in this at all, and I'm pretty sure the burden of proof is on you.
No proof it's Anon either.

It was an anonymous attack started from a thread on an anonymous chan, that counts as a raid by anonymous. Have you proof of this allegation?

They have to drive me to the train station. I can't just sneak out. My dad's a psychonazi. I'm doing something else anyway.


Walk to the train station. Or get a cab. Or take the bus. Or have a friend drive you.

What are you doing instead?

Have you proof of this allegation?
ED article.
-----
It was seemly a "flash raid" that came out of nowhere.

OP: Hey lets raid these Forums. Here're how:

Handful of Raiders: Sure.

OP: *Vanishes*

...
Was OP $cibatour ? That's the big question.

PS: Mods shutdown thread as soon as they found out about it and condemned it sharply.

Dammit, the Chanology wiki is down. Can anyone point me to detailed information on the April 12 raids?

www.enturbulation.org is the other big organizing site with all the info, too. I imagine the Australia reports will be starting to show up in a few more hours.

ED article.
-----
It was seemly a "flash raid" that came out of nowhere.

OP: Hey lets raid these Forums. Here're how:

Handful of Raiders: Sure.

OP: *Vanishes*

...
Was OP $cibatour ? That's the big question.

PS: Mods shutdown thread as soon as they found out about it and condemned it sharply.
Again, do you have proof of the allegation?

www.enturbulation.org is the other big organizing site with all the info, too. I imagine the Australia reports will be starting to show up in a few more hours.
Oh yeah...what's it like 1830 over there now?

Wish i could go to the protests but I'm busy...

Sadness.

I'll be sure to keep up with the news, though.

Walk to the train station. Or get a cab. Or take the bus. Or have a friend drive you.

What are you doing instead?
It's just not that easy. Train station's in the next town. Point is moot now: I made no plans with anyone.

A coin show in NY unless I can find a friend to come over or something. I used to like going, but now it's just not really worth going anymore. But, it's better than sitting here like a lump.

Again, do you have proof of the allegation?
ED. you know the the Wiki ED. I don't think you are allowed to link it here.

Oh yeah...what's it like 1830 over there now?
They just started not too long ago. Still have to wait for it to end before people report back of course.

Read more, noob. I was talking to Hydesland, and thought that he had made the thread about the ED article on nationstates to complain about it. Not this thread. And no, I don't want to complain. Except about people not having the sense to read posts in context.

Callisdrun FTFail

I haven't read through the whole thread, so maybe these were already posted. But the links are relevent, interesting, and extremely creepy. Check 'em out. Oh, and also check out Waco's Tom Cruise Scientology parody on youtube. Funny stuff if you've seen the Cruise video itself.

http://www.onlineathens.com/stories/012908/news_20080129045.shtml
(Article about a Scientologist hacking. Yes, Anon aren't the only ones with skillz.)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=t0HgTDQxHLY&feature=user
(Scientologist phone threat. Related to the above article)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=pPol_m8wm8Y
(Some crazy Scientologists.)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=qLZJBdvqAv8
(Weird Scientologist security guy)

All are pretty entertaining.

ED. you know the the Wiki ED. I don't think you are allowed to link it here.
It still has not been proven that true Anon did it. $cientology could have infiltrated. Even ED isn't really sure if it was a real raid. I'm not really convinced. I just don't think they'd go that far.

It still has not been proven that true Anon did it. $cientology could have infiltrated. Even ED isn't really sure if it was a real raid. I'm not really convinced. I just don't think they'd go that far.

Most Anon raids went only far as humiliation, grave inconvenience and the occasional destruction of fax machines as well. Something that could hospitalize or kill people seems to be verboten to the accepted Anon isn't it?

Callisdrun FTFail
It was just a misunderstanding. I was making a Python reference that I expected him to get, but he doesn't have the "argument" skit memorized as compulsively as I do; all ruffled feathers have been plucked.

Most Anon raids went only far as humiliation, grave inconvenience and the occasional destruction of fax machines as well. Something that could hospitalize or kill people seems to be verboten to the accepted Anon isn't it?
Yeah, I just think they do have a conscience. It may seem weak, but it's there. I admit, it was somewhat funny. And I'm sure many /b/tards and whatnot find it funny, but I just don't think they would do that. Co$ is ruthless and has a history of pulling shit like this. It's not really that hard to copy Anon. I went got acquainted with everything in just a week or two. You can learn all the ling and memes easily. Especially if you are devoted enough like Co$ would be.

Yeah, I just think they do have a conscience. It may seem weak, but it's there. I admit, it was somewhat funny. And I'm sure many /b/tards and whatnot find it funny, but I just don't think they would do that. Co$ is ruthless and has a history of pulling shit like this. It's not really that hard to copy Anon. I went got acquainted with everything in just a week or two. You can learn all the ling and memes easily. Especially if you are devoted enough like Co$ would be.

Given that anon before has gone out of its way to ID and inform the authorities regarding a pedophile and someone threatening to kill others IIRC, it seems that Anon does draw the line at physical harm at the least.

Goddammit. Now that I look at the details, for the third protest in a row, it's not looking like it'll be remotely practical for me to make this.

It still has not been proven that true Anon did it. $cientology could have infiltrated. Even ED isn't really sure if it was a real raid. I'm not really convinced. I just don't think they'd go that far.
I agree, I think there was an Inflitration as well.

Well, the April 12 protests are well underway by now. General tenor of many reports I've seen is numbers have been a little down in some locations, but that there was more "epic win" going around.

Might get off my lazy arse and drive past this time to see how things are in LA.... then again, I do SO despise driving over the hill where the streets are all laid out like somebody gave a 5 year old a crayon and said "draw a map!".

I think we have Epic Wins all around.

Slightly Lower numbers... (Some are blaming loss of *chan support).

But better media coverage. LA got CNN I heard.

The Atlanta protest DIDN'T have Riot Cops this time. It seems someone managed to completely clear things up with the police so that the police had no problem.

Slightly Lower numbers... (Some are blaming loss of *chan support).


So much for growing support and a lifelong commitment to the cause. People are already starting to get bored. As it turns out, long term protests that will take years and years to be effective if ever at all, aint all that good for Lulz.

So much for growing support and a lifelong commitment to the cause. People are already starting to get bored. As it turns out, long term protests that will take years and years to be effective if ever at all, aint all that good for Lulz.

Once again, you are entirely missing the point.

It's not about the numbers, it's about the attention. Numbers got the attention before, now it's grown to non-english speaking countries. Fewer numbers, more places, more news about it.

Once again, you are entirely missing the point.

It's not about the numbers, it's about the attention. Numbers got the attention before, now it's grown to non-english speaking countries. Fewer numbers, more places, more news about it.

Yea and when on the 4th month in a row when its old news to Joe Schmoe local TV news reporter AND the protests have fewer and fewer members, then what?

Yea and when on the 4th month in a row when its old news to Joe Schmoe local TV news reporter AND the protests have fewer and fewer members, then what?

Then everyone will know how dodgy scientology is because it will have been on the news for 4 months in a row, and then no one will want to join. And then there won't be a need for protesters.

Then everyone will know how dodgy scientology is because it will have been on the news for 4 months in a row, and then no one will want to join. And then there won't be a need for protesters.

LoL. Gratz on your incredible powers of self deception but it wont work that way. Not even close. If you think awareness and getting on TV will prevent idiots from believing absolutley anything and everything then how do you explain John Edward? Your cute in your own innocent way though.

LoL. Gratz on your incredible powers of self deception but it wont work that way. Not even close. If you think awareness and getting on TV will prevent idiots from believing absolutley anything and everything then how do you explain John Edward? Your cute in your own innocent way though.

Hyperbole. "No one" should be as "very few."

The reason Scientology works is because people generally don't know how silly it is until after they've paid enough. In which case Scientology doesn't care if they leave so long as they don't say anything. When people already know how silly it is and that you will not in fact gain superpowers when you reach OT8, fewer people will be inclined to shell out the money. Some will, but far fewer. And when they do it they will do it of their own free will, instead of being coerced and tricked into it.

Also, I am totally adorable. Like Ponuppy or something.

Also also: You're/your.

So much for growing support and a lifelong commitment to the cause. People are already starting to get bored. As it turns out, long term protests that will take years and years to be effective if ever at all, aint all that good for Lulz.
Ever thought people maybe weren't able to attend this day and that's why? Also, we don't have full totals yet. So keep yer fingers stiff until we have numbers.

Hyperbole. "No one" should be as "very few."

The reason Scientology works is because people generally don't know how silly it is until after they've paid enough. In which case Scientology doesn't care if they leave so long as they don't say anything. When people already know how silly it is and that you will not in fact gain superpowers when you reach OT8, fewer people will be inclined to shell out the money. Some will, but far fewer. And when they do it they will do it of their own free will, instead of being coerced and tricked into it.

Also, I am totally adorable. Like Ponuppy or something.

Also also: You're/your.

I think there may be a pile of corpses that disagree.

Ever thought people maybe weren't able to attend this day and that's why? Also, we don't have full totals yet. So keep yer fingers stiff until we have numbers.

No! If a single protest fails, the whole thing fails! That's how this works!

So much for growing support and a lifelong commitment to the cause. People are already starting to get bored. As it turns out, long term protests that will take years and years to be effective if ever at all, aint all that good for Lulz.

Got you!

The above was a myth.

Only 1 of the chans have gone anti, and it was the same one that orginally bailed back in early Feb.

Got you!

The above was a myth.

Only 1 of the chans have gone anti, and it was the same one that orginally bailed back in early Feb.

It was 12chan, wasn't it? That place is worthless...

I think there may be a pile of corpses that disagree.

In which case Scientology doesn't care if they leave so long as they don't say anything.

That would be the important part of that.

There are actually many blown scientologists. They got up to OT8 and realized that they could not in fact lift cars or leave their physical body behind.

But they keep their mouths shut, for good reason.

That said, with the protests, many of them have started talking. Now, I'm pulling this information from the magazine article that I posted about a while back. They're out there, they just know that they need to keep quiet and stay on COS' good side, so they don't say anything. The corpses said something.

No! If a single protest fails, the whole thing fails! That's how this works!

Oh my actual dog, nooessesss!!!1!!1!! If we're short by a single protester COS will win and take over teh world!!!1!

(They're in league with the Dutch)

I still think the south park episodes had more effect than anon's protests.



and since the south park episode probably had less than none....

That would be the important part of that.

There are actually many blown scientologists. They got up to OT8 and realized that they could not in fact lift cars or leave their physical body behind.

But they keep their mouths shut, for good reason.

That said, with the protests, many of them have started talking. Now, I'm pulling this information from the magazine article that I posted about a while back. They're out there, they just know that they need to keep quiet and stay on COS' good side, so they don't say anything. The corpses said something.

I may be misremembering, seeing as I haven't looked into this for years, but IIRC the only thing Lisa ever said was "I want out".

Oh my actual dog, nooessesss!!!1!!1!! If we're short by a single protester COS will win and take over teh world!!!1!

(They're in league with the Dutch)

Worse. They are the Dutch.

I still think the south park episodes had more effect than anon's protests.



and since the south park episode probably had less than none....

So both Anon's protests and the South Park episode had a positive impact on the Co$?

What the hell? Is this still on topic?

What the hell? Is this still on topic?

I think we actually had that rare phenomenon where we go so far off-topic that we find ourselves back on course. I know we were talking about Stalin just a short time ago.

It was 12chan, wasn't it? That place is worthless...

ALL chans are worthless, as is this board.

I think there may be a pile of corpses that disagree.

One of their defining features is their tendency not to disagree. This is why people that disagree with criminal organizations find themselves turned into corpses so often.

One of their defining features is their tendency not to disagree. This is why people that disagree with criminal organizations find themselves turned into corpses so often.

Touche.

It was 12chan, wasn't it? That place is worthless... 420 actually. They also attacked the Protester sites, but someone changed the DOS program to make them DOS their own servers instead... They crashed their own website.

Somebody changed their DOS program and the idiots crashed their own site when they were trying to target the protesters' site(s)? Oh geez, THAT is 'lulzy' right there XD

General consensus from the April 12 reports I've skimmed indicate smaller numbers, but better crowd response. Factors blamed for the slight drop in numbers was the not-as-lulzy protest theme (Reconnection), and the craptastic weather in many, many locations. Rain in some, snow in some, and a record-breaking heat wave in others.

(For the record, the LA anons that were out there for hours on Saturday in this weather have my respect- I felt nasty just walking half a block from my car to my sister's apartment in this heat! It should not be close to 100F in April!!)

420 actually. They also attacked the Protester sites, but someone changed the DOS program to make them DOS their own servers instead... They crashed their own website.

Speaking of protester sites, PartyVan seems to have been down for a couple of days.

I still think the south park episodes had more effect than anon's protests.
We all know that the South Park episodes were on the news. Can you people stop being in denial that the internets might actually be able to accomplish something?

Speaking of protester sites, PartyVan seems to have been down for a couple of days.
Unfortunately.

It should not be close to 100F in April!!)
Shouldn't snow in April, either!

Somebody changed their DOS program and the idiots crashed their own site when they were trying to target the protesters' site(s)? Oh geez, THAT is 'lulzy' right there XD
Yeah, then when they found out that the person suggesting the attack was simply a guy doing a "Personal Army" demand. (An ex-protester who was kicked out for lying about hacking the CO$) they got pissed with him.


General consensus from the April 12 reports I've skimmed indicate smaller numbers, but better crowd response. Factors blamed for the slight drop in numbers was the not-as-lulzy protest theme (Reconnection), and the craptastic weather in many, many locations. Rain in some, snow in some, and a record-breaking heat wave in others. That about sums it up.

May is supposed to be 'fair game' so it seems there will be plenty more lulz from that topic.

I think the most unique protest was the New York city one. Huge event in central park. Food, games, balloons, kite wars, and a stage. (They even gave the leftover food to all the local homeless, Some of them have become great allies for the protesters.)

Andreas Heldal-Lund has gotten former Scientology member and celebrity Jason Beghe (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07m-IvvpK2E) to agree to an interview, soon to be published...

Shouldn't snow in April, either!
IMO, it should. :)
I think the most unique protest was the New York city one. Huge event in central park. Food, games, balloons, kite wars, and a stage. (They even gave the leftover food to all the local homeless, Some of them have become great allies for the protesters.)
:) :fluffle: It's so upsetting I couldn't go. :(

Any data on numbers anywhere?

Attention!

May 10 will be a protest of Lulz.

May 10 is the date of the next protest Known as

Battletoad Earth
Operation: Fair GameStop
http://may10protest.ytmnd.com/

Also: It's the launch date of the newest Battletoads game for the Wii.*

http://www.battletoadspreorder.com/**
(*LIE but lulzy.)

(**Warning: Funny site but the contact number is the LA CO$ center.)

Silly deluded people fighting silly deluded people. What else is new?

Silly deluded people fighting silly deluded people. What else is new?

If you'd just go through and read the slightest bit of real information about Scientology, you'd see that Anonymous is nowhere near as deluded as Scientology -- Anonymous fighting a good fight, but they're having fun with it. It's great to watch, and it seems like they're doing an awesome job of really pissing the Scientologists off, and the Scientologists totally deserve the ridicule and enturbulation they're getting.

Silly lulzy people fighting dangerous deluded people. What else is new?
Fix'd. :D

No argument that Anon is silly, but they seem (for once) anything but deluded. The fact that Anon seems to hold nothing sacred is probably their greatest strength- it's hard for CoS to make the "OMG TERRORISTS!!!111shift+one!" charges stick to a group of people that can't even take themselves seriously.

We all know that the South Park episodes were on the news.

I think it was, if not the info was at least spread big time. The guy who did Chef's voice is a scientologist and made a big stink about south park being immautre and hateful of religions....a lot of people pointed out how south park made fun of all religions, even mormons, and it was just scientologies turn, but he quit anyway.

Its why chef isn't in the episodes anymore.



Edit: actually it was in the news: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trapped_in_the_Closet_%28South_Park%29#.22Closetgate.22

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kSS178Q-4eo

Anon and Scientology on CNN...

Fix'd. :D

No argument that Anon is silly, but they seem (for once) anything but deluded. The fact that Anon seems to hold nothing sacred is probably their greatest strength- it's hard for CoS to make the "OMG TERRORISTS!!!111shift+one!" charges stick to a group of people that can't even take themselves seriously.

It's why Anonymous is the perfect group to fight Scientology. Their character can't be assassinated.

If Anon fights Scientology more power to them.
But to be honest we need more then hackers to take down this evil empire.
Lawyers, and legislatures are needed as well as Hollywood actors to stand against them and make their evil public.



wooh how sad is the world when you must turn to actors to get public policy messages supported

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kSS178Q-4eo

Anon and Scientology on CNN...

Two days before the next planned protest march. Is Scientology just begging for Anon to crush them entirely or something?

Ow.... my poor bullshit meter just broke again. I notice the guy keeps talking over the interviewer. He stammers an awful lot, especially when the interview tries to put the screws to 'im. Pre-prepped standard-issue statement from his higher ups, and he's not equipped to modify his answers.

And more of the "OMG TEH DEATH THREATS!" BS.

Ow.... my poor bullshit meter just broke again. I notice the guy keeps talking over the interviewer. He stammers an awful lot, especially when the interview tries to put the screws to 'im. Pre-prepped standard-issue statement from his higher ups, and he's not equipped to modify his answers.

And more of the "OMG TEH DEATH THREATS!" BS.

I thought the interviewer was terrible and did a very poor job of asking questions. First of all the interviewer should have asked what OT level he was and to explain that a little bit.
The interviewer asked an off the cuff ill prepared summary of Scientology believe being dead aliens hanging on you. He made it easy for the Sci guy to deny these claims. The interviewer should have ben prepared with actual quotes from actual Scientology lessons with page numbers and a cite as reference. Then let the spokeman try and deny and pretend thats crazy media talk etc. This is CNN , they are a multinational multibillion dollar company, they can dig up a few Scientology lesson plans for christ sakes. The CNN guy was very poor in using the opportunity he had to challenge the guy using real facts real dates real people real time and real events. Instead it was all puffy bullshit. /fail

I wouldn't be surprised if CNN's legal team softened the subject matter up- mainstream media is, I suspect, still wary of CoS's penchant for lawsuits against any remotely derogatory stories. Still, it's nice that the thing GOT airtime on CNN, even if it was overall BS.

I thought the interviewer was terrible and did a very poor job of asking questions. First of all the interviewer should have asked what OT level he was and to explain that a little bit.
The interviewer asked an off the cuff ill prepared summary of Scientology believe being dead aliens hanging on you. He made it easy for the Sci guy to deny these claims. The interviewer should have ben prepared with actual quotes from actual Scientology lessons with page numbers and a cite as reference. Then let the spokeman try and deny and pretend thats crazy media talk etc. This is CNN , they are a multinational multibillion dollar company, they can dig up a few Scientology lesson plans for christ sakes. The CNN guy was very poor in using the opportunity he had to challenge the guy using real facts real dates real people real time and real events. Instead it was all puffy bullshit. /fail

your not going to get that sort of reporting out of CNN. as many issues there are with Fox news , Fox does a better aggressive interview style news cast.

It's why Anonymous is the perfect group to fight Scientology. Their character can't be assassinated.

They also can't be disbanded, declared an terrorist organization, sued, bought out, genocided, or anything else for that matter.



-----
You know noticing how Anonymous functions. Always acting for the greater Lulz and ignoring personal egos and the normal ass kissing that most decision making processes go through.

I think Congress should do all further meetings on imageboards with forced Anonymous posting.

If you don't know which person is who, it would ruin alot of corruption.


In that case, Anonymous for President and every seat in Congress.

If you don't know which person is who, it would ruin alot of corruption.

That's sort of the opposite of the idea behind accountability and transparency in government, isn't it? :)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kSS178Q-4eo

Anon and Scientology on CNN...

Interesting. He's basically saying that Scientology isn't a religion. "It's a tool, not a belief."

It's nice of him to admit that...

If you don't know which person is who, it would ruin alot of corruption.

You also wouldn't be able to find out who actually ran off with the state funds and similar. Of if the senator is actually a senator.

Interesting. He's basically saying that Scientology isn't a religion. "It's a tool, not a belief."

It's nice of him to admit that...

I wonder if he'd be so kind as to put it in writing...

I thought the interviewer was terrible and did a very poor job of asking questions. First of all the interviewer should have asked what OT level he was and to explain that a little bit.
The interviewer asked an off the cuff ill prepared summary of Scientology believe being dead aliens hanging on you. He made it easy for the Sci guy to deny these claims. The interviewer should have ben prepared with actual quotes from actual Scientology lessons with page numbers and a cite as reference. Then let the spokeman try and deny and pretend thats crazy media talk etc. This is CNN , they are a multinational multibillion dollar company, they can dig up a few Scientology lesson plans for christ sakes. The CNN guy was very poor in using the opportunity he had to challenge the guy using real facts real dates real people real time and real events. Instead it was all puffy bullshit. /fail

Eh, i actually respect the CNN bit for being so...not aggressive. It makes the scilon look even more stupid. Horribly simple interview and he was still repetitive and vague.

Anonymous isn't really an organization - it's a movement. It is effectively invincible. Scientology is hopeless against them.

Assuming the movement doesn't dissipate of its own accord, Scientology WILL break, mark my words.

Anonymous isn't really an organization - it's a movement. It is effectively invincible. Scientology is hopeless against them.

Assuming the movement doesn't dissipate of its own accord, Scientology WILL break, mark my words.

well with the Tibet stuff they might get bored and go back to hacking Chinese goverment websites.

well with the Tibet stuff they might get bored and go back to hacking Chinese goverment websites.
China isn't lulzy though. They simply hack you back.

Operation: Sea AAAARGH is already slated for June 14. Scientology just keeps providing the lulz, which I think is a big part of what's kept so many people on board. Despite the *chans losing interest. (Whatever happened to "Anonymous delivers", huh? The so-called moralfags and protestfags are the ones getting all the lulz, not the /b/tards.)

In that case, Anonymous for President and every seat in Congress.I have considered that to write-in for fun.