NationStates Jolt Archive

Well we have excessively filled the old one so, here is our new one, ready to be plastered with another 113 pages of arguments, requests, comments and all the other random stuff that goes in these places. You know how it works!

Squirrels are overrated!

Excellent Yallak. Now, I can wonder whether the conflict will be finally taken to one of the military participants' homelands....

Excellent Yallak. Now, I can wonder whether the conflict will be finally taken to one of the military participants' homelands....

You are so passive aggressive and it is quite clear you take pleasure in anticipating the misfortunes of others…

Well it may just happen if anyone attacks the transports i have leant to Saint Fedski to ferry supplies.

Now, I can wonder whether the conflict will be finally taken to one of the military participants' homelands....
I believe it already has. Kahanistan's capital is practically a warzone.

Well it may just happen if anyone attacks the transports i have leant to Saint Fedski to ferry supplies.

Amestria will not attack your transports...

You are so passive aggressive and it is quite clear you take pleasure in anticipating the misfortunes of others…

Especially when hes talking about Xirnium

You are so passive aggressive and it is quite clear you take pleasure in anticipating the misfortunes of others…
And you sir are so snide you fail to even realize it. I'm currently wondering whether the tensions between Amestria-and-Saint Fedski are finally going to result in the war reaching their own soil.

And you sir are so snide you fail to even realize it.

I am snide and proud of it...no secret.

I'm currently wondering whether the tensions between Amestria-and-Saint Fedski are finally going to result in the war reaching their own soil.

This is not the first time you have pondered another nations destruction in a way that seemed almost gleeful.... Just pointing that out for you...

Well, what I meant by that was that I'm reading the tensions going about and enjoying the story. And on another note Amestria, how has the Amestrian public approved of the Torontian conflict (chronology of percentages please!)?

Complete support, of course. Even Amestria's journalists can't help but make crazed outbursts to completely legitimate questions in press conferences. :rolleyes:

Complete support, of course. Even his journalists can't help but make crazed outbursts to completely legitimate questions in press conferences. :rolleyes:

No... The Communist Party and the Conservative Party are opposed and the Socialist Party split on the issue... The Social Democrats (the Party whose President sent troops to Torontia) supports the Amestrian pressence in Torontia, as does the Centralist Party.

Keep in mind it is not at present a war, no fighting in the Amestrian zone or with any power... Saint Fedski is threatening war, but as Amestria is trying to avoid war while preparing for its defense (tell me of a defensive war which has not had popular support?)

Right now the threat of war with Saint Fedski, the war in Italy, and the riots in Kahanistan have the publics attention, being closer to home...

What does Amestria look like on a map? Did you claim land from RL countries that have ceased to exist in your timeline? Or did you do what Halberdgardia do: make up a fictional continent and place it somewhere in the middle of a great ocean? I assume by Italy, you mean the ViZion Presidential Forces and the ViZion Congressional Forces?

tell me of a defensive war which has not had popular support?
All wars have some level of support and some level of opposition.

Complete support, of course. Even Amestria's journalists can't help but make crazed outbursts to completely legitimate questions in press conferences. :rolleyes:

She lives there, probably knows people, and has family there... But being of Middle Eastern descent she would have been able to escape the mobs notice... Your reporters soft-ball anti-Amestrian questions have just driven her over the edge...

What does Amestria look like on a map? Did you claim land from RL countries that have ceased to exist in your timeline? Or did you do what Halberdgardia do: make up a fictional continent and place it somewhere in the middle of a great ocean? I assume by Italy, you mean the ViZion Presidential Forces and the ViZion Congressional Forces?
You forgot this question Amestria.

You forgot this question Amestria.

Somewhere in Western/Central Europe...

What RL countries did Amestria's lands used to be part of?

She lives there, probably knows people, and has family there... But being of Middle Eastern descent she would have been able to escape the mobs notice... Your reporters soft-ball anti-Amestrian questions have just driven her over the edge...

He has made no anti-Amestrian questions, he is just asking the General's opinions. The crazy Amestria reporter is highly unprofessional and will likely lead many people to consider her antics to be foolish.

What RL countries did Amestria's lands used to be part of?

NS Europe is far larger then RL Europe...

He has made no anti-Amestrian questions, he is just asking the General's opinions. Your crazy "reporter" is highly unprofessional and has made a full of herself in front of the entire world.

No, her outrage has shown your reporter to be a hack who is using the situation...

Emotive nonesense Amestria, my reporter is not a hack. You should show some maturity.

Do you have a map of your country Amestria? And Xirnium, how clever of using words. Has the High Ecclessiarchy paid the correspondent to ask those vague questions that can be interpreted in any way, including negatively? Not saying that I'm supporting Amestria on this, I agree with you that the reporter should have been more restrained instead of releasing her emotions out like that.

Has the High Ecclessiarchy paid the correspondent to ask those vague questions that can be interpreted in any way, including negatively?
No, of course not. There would be an absolute outcry if such a thing occured. The Xirniumite reporter is doing nothing more then canvasing the views of the General, that's all. There was nothing biased in his questions.

Emotive nonesense Amestria, my reporter is not a hack. You should show some maturity.

You are saying I am immature for the actions of one of my characters in an IC post...

You are saying I am immature for the actions of one of my characters in an IC post...
No... I am saying that your opinion that my journalist is a hack shows immaturity.

No... I am saying that your opinion that my journalist is a hack shows immaturity.

How, that is how I perceive him... His bizarre fixation with Amestria…

How, that is how I perceive him... His bizarre fixation with Amestria…
The problem is you are mixing your IC prejudices with OOC opinions, but whatever. In the end it doesn't really matter if you think he is a hack, it's your opinion after all and I will respect it. He has, however, conducted himself professionally and with journalistic integrity.

Also, Amestria is at the core of these latest issues, the war in Torontia and the riots, so his "fixation" is not bizarre.

Nova, is that the same General from Project Alpia?

Yes his command has been placed in chagre of the Novacom contrinution to the reconstruction, however I never got round to actually RPing my contribution to the reconstruction, I intend to correct that now however if possible.

Just a TAG for later posting. If the war came to my homeland, the nations attacking will have some nasty surprises.

Why would either of us go to your homeland, unless you plan on attacking one of our's?

Just a TAG for later posting. If the war came to my homeland, the nations attacking will have some nasty surprises.
Same here of course.

TLA, TG goodness!

tag

tag.

Seeing as we've moved threads, I'll re-post my last comment from the old OOC thread.

Kahanistan, I've been reading your closed diplomacy thread with Amestria, and I must say al-Ghazi's anti-Amestria propaganda efforts would look rather attractive to the HCIA. Perhaps, if he is fired or is forced to flee the nation, he could come to exile in Halberdgardia? The HCIA would love to get their hands on him. If not, it's cool; I just didn't want to pass up a possible opportunity.

I'm also considering sending al-Ghazi an encrypted message from the HCIA about the possibility of cooperating with us on some sort of propaganda activity.

Well right now i'm bored because everyone is fucking yelling about how they're going to bring on the "demise" of so and so but in reality the most hostile move I've seen is someone bought a truck.

It's the cold war all over again, everyone's waiting for the other side to shoot first.

Well right now i'm bored because everyone is fucking yelling about how they're going to bring on the "demise" of so and so but in reality the most hostile move I've seen is someone bought a truck.
If its a dodge...I'm attacking!

If its a dodge...I'm attacking!

Dodge...?

I see the SF "delegates" have not responded to the Amestrian Minister at the peace conference...

Dodge...they make trucks. It was a joke.

Hal, you have TG goodies from, me, SEA!

Mckagan...TG...

Sf...tg

Hal, you have TG goodies from, me, SEA!

TG goodness reciprocated. :p

Just to let everyone know: Because of problems closer to home Amestria intends to declare victory in Torontia and leave. So for the next few days I will be RPing the beginnings of the withdrawal... It would take a little while NS time...

Although I will still be RPing the Amestria's Torontian supporters...

Kahanistan will be pulling out, too. They have citizens rioting in the streets about Amestrian atrocities, and they have a crazy General who's going to start another war with AMF if he's elected.

They'll leave about 15,000 military instructors and aid workers to train and arm the Torontian soldiers, supply the civilians with aid, etc. They don't want combat troops there after it got out that they were shooting insurgents without trial, and the Defense Minister's promised an investigation that will probably lead to some Kahanistan officers being court-martialed.

I am thinking about pulling out of Torontia because frankly I am tired of dealing with you and I have other things I want to get to...(like RPs I am enjoying or which need to be resolved).

piss me off by attacking before I can RP the complex posts of a pullout and I will just nuke your nation/alliance/whatever with everything.
This is what I got when I got home from work. You are mixing IC and OOC. Because of that, the nukes, will be ignored if I happen to attack.

And with those words starts another argument.

Amestria, do that, and you will end your own nation's fate. Remember Saharistan? The international community will go against you should you nuke Saint Fedski, and there is no way the combined warheads from Saint Fedski's allies will allow Amestria to survive. Your nation will remind Kenix Kil of the former People's Republic of Saharistan, I swear to that Amestria.

OOC: Yes Attacking St Fedski with Nukes will also attract attention from the Corporation, considering we have quite some interest in them. The Amount of Nuclear Ordanace i could bring to bear is Ungodly :D

And of course that would darg Xirnium in since he's part of the Adamantine pact and since I'm an ally of Xirnium (and forging a seperate alliance pact with him and others) it would be Kraven war 2 all over, and of course once Nukes are being slung around Damocles will strike down on the heads of the hapless.

And of course that would darg Xirnium in since he's part of the Adamantine pact and since I'm an ally of Xirnium (and forging a seperate alliance pact with him and others) it would be Kraven war 2 all over, and of course once Nukes are being slung around Damocles will strike down on the heads of the hapless.

OOC: Kraven War 3, I have the ability to Launch nukes from:

Kraven Mainland
Concremo
Numonica
Axis Nova
and theres another Slave Nation, but i forget its name

at the rate things are going you may end up with Amestria as an ally simply because he and SF seem to be opposed to each other.

Wasn't Imperial Raven the other?

A third War looks interesting there are some particularly interesting things being brought into existance by all sides heh, though you sure we're up to three now? I would have though the AMF attacking Karvonika bit a continuation of the second since you were the one who called him down on Kahanistan

Amestria: McKagan will be happy to take over your control of Torontia.

Here's the deal (for the other SWC nations.) McKagan was the primary SWC nation in this conflict. Therefore, I'd like to do like Halberdgardia did in Algeristan and have MCKAGAN have "official" control of the territory and hold most of the land. What we'll do though, is integrate the SWC military into various positions. Anyone who wants it can grab up a port town somewhere, and land as many troops as you want to hold the territory.

Would that mean you'd be nuking me too Kraven?

Would that mean you'd be nuking me too Kraven?
That would invite nuclear retaliation from others. More likely, in my opinion, would be that everyone would simply nuke Amestria into oblivion, so that no one could live there ever again.

TG, Saint Fedski

This is what I got when I got home from work. You are mixing IC and OOC. Because of that, the nukes, will be ignored if I happen to attack.

The reason I am pulling out is that I am sick of argueing with you over your puppets and your threats of ignoring my actions. I consider your Commonwealth alliance and its "unified action" to be some glorified godmod you have managed to sneak under the radar, but I am just tired of dealing with it. So yes, I am pulling out because of OOC reasons, but I am doing it in a manner completely compatable with the IC reality so as not to disrupt the story.

And if you attack you cannot ignore any of my defensive measures as long as they are not a godmod (which is a moot point since I will be gone from Torontia by the begining of next week).

I also do not appreciate you airing my TGs.

Amestria, do that, and you will end your own nation's fate. Remember Saharistan? The international community will go against you should you nuke Saint Fedski, and there is no way the combined warheads from Saint Fedski's allies will allow Amestria to survive. Your nation will remind Kenix Kil of the former People's Republic of Saharistan, I swear to that Amestria.

More advice which I did not ask for...

Perhaps the entier thing in Torontia needs a new thread? What I suggest is that Amestria make a new one (closed, btw) and have it start out with his troops beginning to pull out.

Now, we'll see how well The Commonwealth works its diplomacy with the SWC...

Perhaps the entier thing in Torontia needs a new thread? What I suggest is that Amestria make a new one (closed, btw) and have it start out with his troops beginning to pull out.

Now, we'll see how well The Commonwealth works its diplomacy with the SWC...

Yes, lets finish the Amestrian pullout by the end of this weekend...

Well the Commonwealth won't allow any more Amestrian ships or aircraft into the area so they'll have to make due with what they've got. It'll be crazy to see what happens to the CAP (Council of Air Powers) if Hal decides to join McKagan...I'm assuming McKagan just made a veiled threat, thats the way I took it anyways, which means I could have some fighting to do.

Well the Commonwealth won't allow any more Amestrian ships or aircraft into the area so they'll have to make due with what they've got. It'll be crazy to see what happens to the CAP (Council of Air Powers) if Hal decides to join McKagan...I'm assuming McKagan just made a veiled threat, thats the way I took it anyways, which means I could have some fighting to do.

Just let Amestria leave. Yes, attack Amestria as it leaves Torontia, that makes perfect sense.

Well the Commonwealth won't allow any more Amestrian ships or aircraft into the area so they'll have to make due with what they've got. It'll be crazy to see what happens to the CAP (Council of Air Powers) if Hal decides to join McKagan...I'm assuming McKagan just made a veiled threat, thats the way I took it anyways, which means I could have some fighting to do.

Where did I make a threat? For starters, I'm ignoring you outright if you try ANY of the bullshit you started with Amestria. No puppets. I'm ignoring you trying to get an excuse to have bad relations with McKagan because of some sort of "threat." As you like to say, "this isn't negotiable." :)

I hold the Torontia account.

Remember that.

no no no I was talking about your earlier OOC comment "Now, we'll see how well The Commonwealth works its diplomacy with the SWC"

no no no I was talking about your earlier OOC comment "Now, we'll see how well The Commonwealth works its diplomacy with the SWC"

Me too.

1) You won't even let Amestria use a slight OOC excuse to pull his troops out. Why should I let you do that to start a war or drive a wedge? I am NOT giving you the room to start doing things like that. It will be outright ignored.

2) To start, my OOC comment wasn't hostile. It shows that SF has treated Amestria like shit diplomatically because "The Commonwealth" holds numerical superiority. If your dipomats are smart asses to the SWC, bad things will happen. Take that as you wish, but it isn't meant to be overtly hostile.

3) The Commonwealth: I've decided that I am placing a partial ignore on the use of this "alliance." Frankly, I've sided with Amestria on this organization, somewhat. I don't have a problem with people who are in it helping you, AS LONG as they are well established nations who have did OTHER RP's other than just showing up to support other members. Otherwise the member who shows up with 10 posts is just a puppet. Also, the matter of the Commonwealth joint commanding all of its forces is slightly messed up. I consider it puppet modding, and if you're going to do that, it would work basically the same for me to register a bunch of small nations, put them in an alliance together, and have them put all their militarys into one to support McKagan. If you want to play that way we can, but frankly I do not want to ruin this RP with slowing down time for generic allies to respond. Look at the SWC. We are all capable of defending ourselves and pushing for the SWC's goal WITHOUT immediate help from the others. The Commonwealth needs to do that too or it won't be effective.

4) The relations between SF and what will be called TOCOM (Torontian Command, aint I creative!) isn't in the hands of SF. TOCOM isn't going to start strategically destroying SF things until SF gives us a reason. But, as a promise, if you give us that reason, you WILL lose your holdings in Torontia. Personally, I'd rather not comit to a large conflict at this time. But if you want it, we'll have a nice RP out of it.

I am assuming that Amestria IS NOT going to nuke Saint Fedeski? If they arnt... I wonder who I will throw my back behind next. Maybe the SWC... hmmm.

I am assuming that Amestria IS NOT going to nuke Saint Fedeski? If they arnt... I wonder who I will throw my back behind next. Maybe the SWC... hmmm.

Amestria still has some uses for Red Tide...

Check your TGs...

1) Amestria doesn't have a very good excuse. He has been equally annoying with all his bloody TGs and his lack of detail in his posts, not to mention going back and changing old posts 3 pages later.

2) Yes the Commonwealth treated the Amestrians like shit. However, that is better than how they should be treated. The government considers the Amestrians to be lower than shit. Depending on who my diplomats are and the importance of the talks, will decide on how much 'smartassnees' there is. As for the numerical superiority, when I had first planned on attacking, Amestria alone had a much larger numerical superiority when compared to all of the Commonwealth.

3) The Commonwealth is working towards individuality, while remaining a close knit group. It was originally designed to protect the nations while they were all much smaller.

4) The Commonwealth doesn't want a conflict either, unless its with Amestria, and Amestria alone. That's why I've been pushing for no nukes. I don't use them because I believe they ruin RPs. Instead of engaging in dogfights, why not just send 4,000 nuclear ICBMs to do the work for you. Isn't that fun. But yes, McKagan, we could have a nice little RP if it came down to it.

I see Red Tide is like Amestria. Amestria attacked only after Yallak attacked. Red Tide would attack only if Amestria attacked. I see how it works.

OOC:Actually, the Red Tidean Goverment is HIGHLY Corrupt. They would do alot for money, now the following is OOC information... ANYT MENTIONING ABOUT THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION ICLY WILL BE IGNORED!

Amestria is paying me ;) .

Besides, if Amestria starts lobbing nukes, his money can be considered as good as wasted(for him, for me, it will be put to... better uses).

Well personally I believe in having nukes around as a both OOC and IC strategic deterrant. You risk losing your entier nation if you engage someone with nukes. You've got to be a creative RP'er to deal with that sort of threat. I don't respect the RP'er who complains about people having nukes and tries to use OOC means to eliminate them from an RP as much as I do someone who ICly makes them of less use. What you (SF) should do is put up your own strategic deterrant. Perhaps put out a policy statement like alot of people do where if any nuclear ordnance, regardless of size, is used against SF assets, it will result in a full scale retaliation. It balances out. You've got to ICLY counteract things, not complain OOCly. The only way I do that is when someone ONLY uses missile spam, or uses a nuclear weapon everytime they get a chance. But hey, its NS, it's freeform. Hit it.

Futhermore, if Amestria pulls out, that will become a separate RP that has nothing to do with Torontia. I suggest you make your own OOC thread for that RP and remove it from this.

1) Amestria doesn't have a very good excuse.

IC reasons for Amestrian withdrawal:

1. Torontia is just not worth the current cost of another war, at one point it was worth it, but its value has been reassessed.

2. There are allot of problems closer to home that need to be dealt with, such as Kahanistans riots and ViZions civil war.

3. The Amestrian Political and Military Leadership wish to avoid a public backlash over a conflict, which is taking more and more resources but is not directly benefiting Amestria economically or strategically. So, declare victory and pullout.


OOC reasons: 1) Tired of argueing SF over the Commonwealth Alliance/puppets.

2) Want some time to finish other things.


[QUOTE=Saint Fedski]
3) The Commonwealth is working towards individuality, while remaining a close knit group. It was originally designed to protect the nations while they were all much smaller.

Your "Commonwealth" is a bunch of puppets cleverly disquised.


4) The Commonwealth doesn't want a conflict either, unless its with Amestria, and Amestria alone. That's why I've been pushing for no nukes. I don't use them because I believe they ruin RPs. Instead of engaging in dogfights, why not just send 4,000 nuclear ICBMs to do the work for you. Isn't that fun. But yes, McKagan, we could have a nice little RP if it came down to it.

The only person who can decide to RP Amestria's nuclear arsenal is ME, and I can use it if attacked!

And since Amestria is pulling out there will be no war period, so talking about nukes is a moot point!

Your "Commonwealth" is a bunch of puppets cleverly disquised.

I've got the same feelings here and i've made it very clear. SF has two choices. This is in regards to TORONTIA. You two can go kill each other in ANOTHER RP now for all I care. Fuck it.

But for Torontia:

1) NO "COMMONWEALTH" nations are to aid SF in this. They are all just puppets SF is using. If not, he wouldn't make such a big deal about sticking them around. This is non negotiable when it comes to most major things.

2) Failure to comply with rule one leads to me just ignoring SF 100% and writing the rest of Torontian history, which leads it being a FULL SWC province.

I own the account. I can do that.

Is a policy like that really needed? Wouldn't it just be common sense to fully retaliate if nuclear weapons were used? And I do have numerous nuclear weapons, thanks to Torontia. I just don't want to use them because I don't think it would make for a good RP.

And I do have numerous nuclear weapons, thanks to Torontia.
Torontia never had numerous nuclear weapons, in fact I do believe it never had any nuclear weapons.

Is a policy like that really needed? Wouldn't it just be common sense to fully retaliate if nuclear weapons were used? And I do have numerous nuclear weapons, thanks to Torontia. I just don't want to use them because I don't think it would make for a good RP.

No, it wouldn't be common sense. Amestria is talking about using them for defensive purposes. You're trying to take that away from him to make your conquest easier. Listen: If you're going to invade someone, you have to be ready to face their FULL defensive capabilitise. DEAL WITH IT. You shouldn't be on NS if you want to just strip everyone OOCly of everything that stands in your way.

Is a policy like that really needed? Wouldn't it just be common sense to fully retaliate if nuclear weapons were used? And I do have numerous nuclear weapons, thanks to Torontia. I just don't want to use them because I don't think it would make for a good RP.

Well, since Amestria is pulling out all talk of nuclear weapons is moot...

Torontia never had numerous nuclear weapons, in fact I do believe it never had any nuclear weapons.

Yeah, Torontia never had any nuclear weapons, if they did the country would be a wasteland right now...

Torontia never had numerous nuclear weapons, in fact I do believe it never had any nuclear weapons.

You are correct.

The original Torontian player made numerous posts talking about how Torontia had no nuclear weapons but stockpiles of chemical and biological agents.

Early in the first thread however, Saint Fedski made off with the weapongrade Uranium Stockpile in Torontia.

Oh and

To: General of the Armies Basque Gran
From: Vice Admiral Kim Avery
Re: Airlift

REQUEST DENIED! Amestrian aircraft will not follow, shadow, hunt, stalk, escort, watch or approach any of the transport aircraft.

So everyone in the Amestrian controlled Airfields will have to look at the dirt when they fly over?

Early in the first thread however, Saint Fedski made off with the entire Uranium Stockpile in Torontia.

And that helps him HOW? Many RL nations have uranium, but not nukes. If we even accept Torontia having uranium in the FIRST place, that is. The original player made it very clear he didn't have nukes.

So everyone in the Amestrian controlled Airfields will have to look at the dirt when they fly over?
lol

Well if Amestria pulls out that leaves the entire Western Coast under the control of the Yallakian forces stationed there.

Well if Amestria pulls out that leaves the entire Western Coast under the control of the Yallakian forces stationed there.

No it leaves it under the control of the TPG... and whomever Amestria hands control over to...

No it really isn't Amestria, because as soon as I can, I'll be landing soldiers on Vancouver Island, and expanding my area around Bremerton and I believe the Yallak forces will pretty much be left as the sole occupiers of the area as they already have a million or so troops there.

No it really isn't Amestria, because as soon as I can, I'll be landing soldiers on Vancouver Island, and expanding my area around Bremerton and I believe the Yallak forces will pretty much be left as the sole occupiers of the area as they already have a million or so troops there.

They will be mowed down by the 400,000 entrenced TPG soldiers protecting the Torontian coasts...

The pullout will take a little time, one million troops and all their equipment is being moved.

Amestria's handing the area over to the SWC, who will be moving in Troops as Amestria leaves...

Will you be rping the TPG with Western Torontia's stats Amestria? What calculator do you use?

They will be mowed down by the 400,000 entrenced TPG soldiers protecting the Torontian coasts...

The pullout will take a little time, one million troops and all their equipment is being moved.

Amestria's handing the area over to the SWC, who will be moving in Troops as Amestria leaves...
Isn't most of your area also occupied by Yallak troops?

No it really isn't Amestria, because as soon as I can, I'll be landing soldiers on Vancouver Island, and expanding my area around Bremerton and I believe the Yallak forces will pretty much be left as the sole occupiers of the area as they already have a million or so troops there.

You do realize the SWC is taking over Amestria's current Torontian claims and you're not, right?

You do realise that Yallak has over 1 million troops stationed throughout Amestria's claim, do you not? So therefore, if Yallak does not give you permission to land, you'll be invading. You do realise that as soon as the Amestrian troops leave, the Commonwealth forces will follow their withdrawl.

You do realise that Yallak has over 1 million troops stationed throughout Amestria's claim, do you not? So therefore, if Yallak does not give you permission to land, you'll be invading. You do realise that as soon as the Amestrian troops leave, the Commonwealth forces will follow their withdrawl.

And you do realize the TPG forces will remain and are fortified. You further realize that SWC forces will come in as Amestrian forces leave. Also all the coasts and airports are controled by Amestria/TPG, not Yallak...

I don't particularly like the sound of that, Saint Fedski. Are you trying to scare the SWC into leaving Torontia? I don't think you can push around the SWC as easily as you think you can.

Actually I do believe that a good chunk of the coast is controlled by Yallak and a couple airports are also controlled by him. Otherwise you just allowed 50,000 enemy soldiers to land and a good chunk of aircraft to establish temporary bases in four airports.

Actually I do believe that a good chunk of the coast is controlled by Yallak and a couple airports are also controlled by him. Otherwise you just allowed 50,000 enemy soldiers to land and a good chunk of aircraft to establish temporary bases in four airports.

Nope, all airports controlled by Amestria (Yallak's aircraft were launched from his carriers). I know what Yallak controls, which is nothing. He has troops in Western Torontia, but he controls nothing. All control rested with the TPG and Amestria.

Wait, you're trying to tell a multinational war council that we can only bring in a set number of troops into a country you don't even control, or am I reading this wrong?

sorry...he occupies. Because I landed at Hoquiam and Aberdeen to no opposition and aircraft will be landing at the airports around Gray's harbour once I feel like posting it.

sorry...he occupies. Because I landed at Hoquiam and Aberdeen to no opposition and aircraft will be landing at the airports around Gray's harbour once I feel like posting it.

Those areas are controled by Amestria/TPG and I am ignoring those forces if you land them and so is Mckagan (who control the Torontian account). There is to be no more movement until Amestria pulls out and I am sick of your godmoding!

They've already been landed. Read the posts!

They've already been landed. Read the posts!

You made an error because they could not land, they did not have premission to and the harbors were controled by Amestria/TPG. You made a mistake and it is hereby ignored. PERIOD!

I had permission from Yallak who occupied those harbours, for Thorns to land, so your loss.

I had permission from Yallak who occupied those harbours, so your loss.

No, Amestria controled those harbors, so you could not land anything there. Your troops are ignored, PERIOD. I will not recognize their existence and niether will Mckagan. Those troops do not exist, your loss.

You want be a little bitch and ignore a proper post. Fine. I shall return the honor.

You want be a little bitch and ignore a proper post. Fine. I shall return the honor.

It was not a proper post, Yallak did not control those ports. Thus SF could not land troops. Thus no SF troops could land at those ports. Those troops are ignored, PERIOD!

(This is why I am reducing my involvement in this RP, I am sick of dealing with this *&^%!)

You did not object after the post was made, you did not even make a reply to the SF fleet that was 200km off the coast. You didn't do a response to the ships entering the harbour, you didn't do a response to anything.

You did not object after the post was made, you did not even make a reply to the SF fleet that was 200km off the coast. You didn't do a response to the ships entering the harbour, you didn't do a response to anything.

I scaned them but I did not notice that little bit, it does not matter. You ruined this RP for me by threatening me with those god damn puppets which you claimed to be legitamate player nations (which they are not!)... You have also lied to me OOC on several occasions...

And when an error is made, it does not need to be immediatly corrected to be corrected! If you insist there are SF troops in Western Torontia you will be alone in insisting that.

How can you miss it? It was two large posts (458 and 460). If you really felt it was necessary, you would've responded, which you did not so the soldiers are there. And of course I didn't have permission from the TPG or the AOA. They mean nothing to me. Infact, in the eyes of my government, they don't even exist. So there wouldn't be any persmission even asked for. Yallak, as the major power in that area (with 1400 ships and over a million troops in Torontia, quite a few concentrated in that area) gave permission for Thornian troops to land. Which they did. My troops are being flown in which I'm sure you can find a way to ignore. If you ignore them you must ignore the Kahanistanian troops, the Yallak troops, my troops, the Lone Alliance Forces up there in alaska, Leafanistan over there in Montana and Idaho and the ships taking part in the Xirmium war games or exercises. It's that simple. They are there. You missed your chance to object.

You are being childish, I am objecting now that I am aware of it. And as far as I am concerned your troops do not exist in Western Torontia!

And that is all I am going to say on this matter, I am going to ignore that post on those troops or any further post made on those troops. End of story.

End of story it is.

End of story it is.

Yes, those troops do not exist.

Don't get me started. I'm having a good night. I do not want to waste it reading your bitching.

Don't get me started. I'm having a good night. I do not want to waste it reading your bitching.

I don't want to waste this night reading anything you write either. I have grown tired of having to deal with you after all the lies you have told me!

I should ignore everything you have posted since the ceasefire when you first mentioned those puppets.

What lies?

What lies?

You said that those nations that were part of your "Commonwealth" were legitamate player nations. In reality they were not, they were cleverly disguised puppets.

You promised OOC a ceasefire and a conference to move Torontia forward, but you immediatly began to OOC threaten war after the ceasefire, using those puppets. You walked around all cocky until I realized that those "allies" were controled by you because their players are too uninterested to show up and post regularly. By then the story had been adversly effected (which is why I am pulling out).

Ever since the ceasefire you have also OOC treated me badly.

I had permission from Yallak who occupied those harbours, for Thorns to land, so your loss.

Concerning Thorns... Since Thorns is a puppet those troops are being ignored anyway...


1) NO "COMMONWEALTH" nations are to aid SF in this. They are all just puppets SF is using. If not, he wouldn't make such a big deal about sticking them around. This is non negotiable when it comes to most major things.

2) Failure to comply with rule one leads to me just ignoring SF 100% and writing the rest of Torontian history, which leads it being a FULL SWC province.

I own the account. I can do that.

Alright, if Thornz is a puppet, prove it. You can't because Thornz is not a puppet and is not controlled by me directly. It's as controlled by me as Kahanistan is when I say attack Point A.

Alright, if Thornz is a puppet, prove it. You can't because Thornz is not a puppet and is not controlled by me directly. It's as controlled by me as Kahanistan is when I say attack Point A.

You have already admited that they are disinterested in the game and only show up to help you (and you have attempted to RP their military forces yourselves). They are puppets, cleverly disguised puppets, but puppets none the less. They do not contribute to the RP, they just help you out.

And I am not the only one upset by your use of them!

Do you speak the truth and then turn around and realise that what you just said completely contradicts what you said prior to editing?

Do you speak the truth and then turn around and realise that what you just said completely contradicts what you said prior to editing?

It does not controdict anything. Thorns is an indirect puppet, as are all the members of the "Commonwealth." You, the SF player, control everything they do through "unified action" (all the while claiming to be simply the Nation of New McFarland, an account which does not exist). They are cleverly disguised puppets, and all they do is allow your country, whatever it is, to massivly increase its military forces. They contribute nothing to the diplomatic, political, or character elements. They just send you troops and ships, for your exclusive benefit!

There is also the fact that they do not operate like allies. Allies are individuals who RP and can change their minds, as can enemies (for example, Xirnium was able to get Yallak to drop me using a treaty clause, former enemies Mckagan and Amestria are experiencing a warming of relations, and Kahanistan and Amestria have issues to workout because of the human rights abuses in BC and the riots). With your "Commonwealth allies" (puppets) there is no chance to talk, RP, or discuss. They have already made up their minds to do what you tell them. They simply are used to improve your nation’s power in a military RP... They do not do anthing on their own.

I have not seen one of your so-called allies post anything of an independent nature!

Let's not reignite this issue again, people, as to my knowledge it was settled. It would be better if you both came to a mutal understanding on the latest problem instead.

Yallak, TG

Saint Fedski's "Commonwealth" is made up of a bunch of cleverly disguised puppets and I refuse to recognize their existence.

The Saint Fedski player has also been very rude to me and OOC I can no longer stand him. I feel that any future RPing with him is impossible because of various differences.

Cool, but that isn't the issue at hand.

Cool, but that isn't the issue at hand.

What is the issue at hand?

Your ignoring of the landing of Saint Fedski's troops in Western Torontia.

Your ignoring of the landing of Saint Fedski's troops in Western Torontia.

And I am ignoring those troops because they are from one of SF's puppets. There are several reasons why I am ignoring them.

Why can't Saint Fedski just land their own troops?

Yallak, TG

Got it. Just writing a reply now.

Why can't Saint Fedski just land theire own troops?

1) The West Torontian coast is controled by Amestria so they could not land.

2) Those troops are from an indirect puppet.

If Amestria controlled it, they would've responded when the transports moved into Gray's Harbour and would've responded when they pulled up to the docks, would have responded when the platforms came down. I'm sure a large aircraft carrier like the Quickbreaker Class, couldn't have slipped by unnoticed. The landing took place because Yallak gave permission and there was no opposition.

What landed
32,500 moderately trained soldiers
4300 Leopard 1s
3100 M113s
680 pieces of towed and outdated self-propelled artillery

What could have landed
30,000 well trained regulars
8,000 Challenger 2 main battle tanks
4,000 Infantry Fighting Vehicles
800 pieces of almost brand new self-propelled artillery.

If Amestria controlled it, they would've responded when the transports moved into Gray's Harbour and would've responded when they pulled up to the docks, would have responded when the platforms came down. I'm sure a large aircraft carrier like the Quickbreaker Class, couldn't have slipped by unnoticed. The landing took place because Yallak gave permission and there was no opposition.

What landed
32,500 moderately trained soldiers
4300 Leopard 1s
3100 M113s
680 pieces of towed and outdated self-propelled artillery

What could have landed
30,000 well trained regulars
8,000 Challenger 2 main battle tanks
4,000 Infantry Fighting Vehicles
800 pieces of almost brand new self-propelled artillery.

I was distracted at the time because I was working on withdrawing from Torontia (and I still am). I scanned the post and thought those ships were landing in Seattle. I made an error in reading them. Those troops did not land as Yallak did not control the harbors. Those troops are also from one of SFs puppets, which I refuse to recognize. So I am ignoring them PERIOD, no debate.

(No one asked me about it, no one mentioned it to me.)

It was mentioned in the RP when he posted them heading in. And i could let them land because 200,000 of my soldiers are stationed in that town and could easily have arranged it/forced it to happen (do actually have soldiers in that port?)

It was mentioned in the RP when he posted them heading in. And i could let them land because 200,000 of my soldiers are stationed in that town and could easily have arranged it/forced it to happen.

No one talked to me about it, it did not happen. And those troops are from a puppet I refuse to recognize.

If the troops were made to be Saint Fedskian, would that resolve the dispute?

If the troops were made to be McFarlandish, (Saint Fedskian refers to the Commonwealth, not my nation, even though I RP with the nation Saint Fedski) Amestria would be facing a small assault at the moment, but the troops have landed, whether they remain Thornian or McFarlandish, its entirely up to Amestria. 'Neither' is not an option.

I also want to have nothing more to do with the Saint Fedski player, who ruined this RP for me with his puppets and (what I perceive to be) dishonesty. I just want to withdraw and hand over Western Torontia to the SWC so I can keep some semblance of a story line and not disrupt my other RPs...

If the troops were made to be McFarlandish, (Saint Fedskian refers to the Commonwealth, not my nation, even though I RP with the nation Saint Fedski) Amestria would be facing a small assault at the moment, but the troops have landed, whether they remain Thornian or McFarlandish, its entirely up to Amestria. 'Neither' is not an option.

Neither is all you will get from me.

I also want to have nothing more to do with the Saint Fedski player, who ruined this RP for me with his puppets and (what I perceive to be) dishonesty. I just want to withdraw and hand over Western Torontia to the SWC so I can keep some semblance of a story line and not disrupt my other RPs...
Well just handing it over won't work. There is the issue of the Yallak troops stationed throughout and the 1400 ships just off the coast.

You don't have the choice. A corps was transported in either way. I belive there are something like 2000 soldiers and 200 tanks already landed. You only option is are they my troops or my buddy's. Take your pick.

Well just handing it over won't work. There is the issue of the Yallak troops stationed throughout and the 1400 ships just off the coast.

I see you are not letting me leave amicably. We have been over this issue before.

You don't have the choice. A corps was transported in either way. I belive there are something like 2000 soldiers and 200 tanks already landed. You only option is are they my troops or my buddy's. Take your pick.

I refuse to recognize the existence of those troops.

I also want to have nothing more to do with the Saint Fedski player, who ruined this RP for me with his puppets and (what I perceive to be) dishonesty. I just want to withdraw and hand over Western Torontia to the SWC so I can keep some semblance of a story line and not disrupt my other RPs...

Your ships and planes can leave but how the SWC will get in when the blockade is still in place against any but yours and Saint Fedskian forces is unknown to me.

Your ships and planes can leave but how the SWC will get in when the blockade is still in place against any but yours and Saint Fedskian forces is unknown to me.

Amestria will give them premission to enter and they will come in at the same time Amestria leaves.

At this rate of things both Saint Fedski and Amestria will get a taste of the I.G.N.O.R.E cannon fired from McKagan....

Amestria will give them premission to enter and they will come in at the same time Amestria leaves.
It doesn't matter if you give them permission. Those are Yallak and Saint Fedskian ships there. And I'm sure if Yallak is anything like me and suspects anything funny from Amestria, he might just sink a couple of your transports. I know I sure would.

It doesn't matter if you give them permission. Those are Yallak and Saint Fedskian ships there. And I'm sure if Yallak is anything like me and suspects anything funny from Amestria, he might just sink a couple of your transports. I know I sure would.

If you are going to make this difficult why don't I just nuke Torontia and all the fleets off it!

Do it. See what happens.

What I really want to do is resume the character RP I had with Kahanistan, I really enjoyed that RP, perhaps because it was nothing like this RP.

Because that will get you nuked back, possibly ignored and nukes are very easy to shoot down anyway so it would likely fail.

Or I just could decide to ignore this RP, give Mckagan premission to write out Torontia's history (he can do it as he controls the account).

Or you could just quit bitching, whining, moaning, complaining, crying etc and get writing IC posts that forward the story instead of all this OOC nonsense you seem to prefer.

Or you could just quit bitching, whining, moaning, complaining, crying etc and get writing IC posts that forward the story instead of all this OOC nonsense you seem to prefer.

I have written more IC posts in this RP then you! I have written more IC posts in the spinoff RPs then you!

Good for you. I make my posts count though. I use something called "detail" (detail - 1. To report or relate minutely or in particulars) (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=detail). I try to knock of multiple birds with one stone as opposed to 3 stones and a couple rocks for each bird. The spinoffs mean nothing to me. So I won't even comment on those.

For the sake off ending this what about this SF,

Your forces haven't landed yet
Amestria can make his retreat
The SWC can try and get in and fail
You can land when Amestria has gone
Happy ending

That or .... hang on .... you have Imperial transports that could land entire armies or armoured divisions with their cargo space.... you could just use them and get into Torontia like that (or capture the landing zone by suprise when you spring out of my transports)

That or .... hang on .... you have Imperial transports that could land entire armies or armoured divisions with their cargo space.... you could just use them and get into Torontia like that (or capture the landing zone by suprise when you spring out of my transports)

I am withdrawing, remember!

well if you won't let him in as your going - nothing can stop him attacking you by suprise as (before) you leave.

Sure Yallak. As long as Amestria is gone and doesn't bother me anymore I couldn't care less. Once Amestria has retreated, he is no longer inolved in this in anyway shape or form and cannot come back in.

Once Amestria has retreated, he is no longer inolved in this in anyway shape or form and cannot come back in.

Just to point out, that is not for you to decide!

err I will do the surprise thing. Instead of supplies your twelve ships are going to get, they are bringing an entire corps. Then as Amestrian vessels hit the open ocean...they will hit the bottom of the ocean shortly after.

err I will do the surprise thing. Instead of supplies your twelve ships are going to get, they are bringing an entire corps. Then as Amestrian vessels hit the open ocean...they will hit the bottom of the ocean shortly after.

I will ignore that as well!

Just to point out, that is not for you to decide!
Sure it is. You refuse to recognize perfectly RP'd and proper landings so I will ignore any further Amestrian involvement once you leave. Simple as that. Two can play your game, although I'd rather not, but you're not leaving me with much choice as you are the other major RPer in the RP.

I will ignore that as well!
What reason do you have to ignore that?

Mckagan, feel free to RP Torontian History from the point of the cease-fire up to the present.

thats just real mature

thats just real mature

It was after the cease fire that SF ruined this RP (from my perspective) by bringing in his puppets, breaking his OOC promises, and insulting me. I have tried to be reasonable... I am washing my hands of this whole mess...

My so called "puppets" have been involved since the early day. You knew that. You knew full well what was going on. In one telegram you even said in such direct terms "you can RP North Saint Clair from your account, I won't mind and I'm sure no one else will". Amestria said that after the buddy who does North Saint Clair disappeared. Only know, is it becoming a problem when Amestria might actually have to RP losing a war or argument. What OOC lies Amestria?


I am currently drafting a response to the "Post-cease-fire history" idea proposed by Amestria.

Saint Fedski, respond to my TG.

I'm looking at it now. I sent you one too by the way.

My so called "puppets" have been involved since the early day. You knew that. You knew full well what was going on. In one telegram you even said in such direct terms "you can RP North Saint Clair from your account, I won't mind and I'm sure no one else will". Amestria said that after the buddy who does North Saint Clair disappeared. Only know, is it becoming a problem when Amestria might actually have to RP losing a war or argument. What OOC lies Amestria?


I did not know what was fully going on, and concerning North Saint Clair I was just being nice (I was trying to keep the RP enjoyable for everyone)! You then threw it back in my face, saying you controled five or six nations through "unified action" and going on OOC how you were going to invade me! If I had any idea what your Commonwealth was in the begining I would have ignored it from the begining!

I'm looking at it now. I sent you one too by the way.
I know. But I didn't receive it detailing the responses of how you liked it...

The only soldiers that would have been landing would have been from New McFarland or North Saint Clair. The others would've just been providing supplies, transport and some defence. Pretty much all the vessels in the Commonwealth are owned and operated by New McFarland (this account). It would have been no different than anything else, but you and McKagan just looked at the populations and the amount of nations. Didn't bother getting into what each would contribute, if anything. The announcement of the other nations was how did McKagan put it...a deterrant. Now if you had gone nuclear, we would have had a problem.

Mckagan, feel free to RP Torontian History from the point of the cease-fire up to the present.
Alright then. Consider any action by "Torontia" ignored. Any action regarding Torontia, the Torontian RP, and any Torontian RP Spinoff (created post cease-fire) participated in by Amestria is invalid (has not taken place). I hate to sink to Amestria's level, but that's the way he wants it so if McKagan does just that, it will be ignored and anything regarding Torontian/Amestrian relations is also ignored.

You know I wanted to withdraw and move in the SWC in so that I could:

1) Avoid any further fights with you

2) Maintain the story line in a satisfactory way (we were going to hammer it out this weekend and then I would be on my marry way, everybody happy).

But you could not even let me do that...

Did you not just send me that in a telegram?

Did you not just send me that in a telegram?

I sent it, then I just decided it was better to post it in the forum... I am half awake...

Would that mean you'd be nuking me too Kraven?

No, If Amestria attacked you with Nukes, then The Corporation would retaliate by Attacking Amestria, The Corporation has its eyes on your Nation ;)

and I have to say, The ammount of OOC abuse makes the First Kraven War thread look like a Picnic, Both sides need to Grow up, Because all either of you are achieving is looking like Arses OOC.

Kraven, you haven't been paying attention.

Kraven, you haven't been paying attention.

All I see are OOC arguements, what is there i've missed?

Wow, go to sleep 130AM EST, and wake up with 7 more pages of arguments.

Kraven is right, this has turned in to a flame fiesta, and an OOC argument. I think the best thing would either be to re-do everything since the ceasefire, with both sides agreeing to what can and cannot be done/used. If the arguing continues we should just let McKaga write the history, because that way we would get a shitload done. If no one wants that option we get a mod to settle this.

THe past 7 pages were complete and utter OOC Flaming rubbish, nothing of any use to man nor beast whatsoever, I thought this was the old Torontia thread since last time I checked yesterday this was at page 4/5 not 13.

GO ahead and have your little nuclear war, turn each other into glass since basically if your both going to be slinging nukes around it WILL be MAD, ICly I have been watching this situation very closely, and indeed have diverted part of my budget to bringing another Bondal Constellation online, I have yet to find an ICly way to express this displeasure, since condemnations are not IC Novacom Style.

Ironically this could very well end up as an alliance against Amestria with Kraven the Adamantine Alliance and myself, linked together with a set if highly impropable under any other circumstance string of alliances. Such an event would be very entertaining, and the alliance would promptly turn on itself once the conflict is over, more than likely halfway through with a massive battle between the forces in the Amestrain capitol.

This RP is officially OVER.

It started out with great potential. It was epic. Then people started getting bitchy, crying, and power hungry. It ruined the RP. Basically, I'm taking the point where everyone stop fighting, having Amestria still pull out, and then writing it as if SF eventually just held elections or something and then pulled out 100%. He can either agree to that or I'll write it as if he was never involved to start with. In the end, the SWC gets called back in because of disputes between various factions left over from all the conflicts going on.

End of discussion.

I just thought i'd let you know what i'm planning for Torontia.

In the months set after the current RP, both Saint Fedski and Amestria hold elections in their respective zones and pull out. The nation then combines and holds a national election, dealing away with the former fragmented governments. After this Torontia has an economic boom. This forces various factions to fight over Torontia. (Remember that.) Around this time, the Torontian government decides to build a massive border wall that surrounds the nation to keep out the New Order rebels in the east.

Regardless, things go ugly. One faction uses a chemical weapon against a safehouse used by another of these factions. That somehow mixes with another bio weapon, and turns into a zombie virus.

A few days later the nation is a hell invested with zombies.

At this point the SWC becomes involved. A few vessels are sent to areas off the coast to complete a few various objectives with SMALL, SPECIAL FORCES TEAMS. This will be a character RP. A very GOOD RP. I'm thinking of allowing the past members of the Torontian Series to become active in it, under circumstances that state that they cannot:

A) Look to grab ANY land or ANY influence in Torontia.
B) RP POORLY! This will be a CHARCTER RP. Make it interesting. No boxes upon boxes of ammo.

That's assuming anyone decides to join. I have an idea i'll be able to gather enough support to do something, but i'm not sure WHO is going to be involved right now.

Basically, if anyone wants to do a character-zombie RP and have their country gain some experience in dealing with the dead, this is your chance. Anyone formerlly involved with this RP can get into it. I'd just like to point out there no one will be allowed to use more than 6-12 characters as their primary forces, and no one will have troops already stationed in or around Torontia.

This RP is officially OVER.

It started out with great potential. It was epic. Then people started getting bitchy, crying, and power hungry. It ruined the RP. Basically, I'm taking the point where everyone stop fighting, having Amestria still pull out, and then writing it as if SF eventually just held elections or something and then pulled out 100%. He can either agree to that or I'll write it as if he was never involved to start with. In the end, the SWC gets called back in because of disputes between various factions left over from all the conflicts going on.

End of discussion.

Oh yeah let the TSU become the controllers of BC when you do it. They would have won the elections anyway.

Edit: Saw the Zombie thing, bah, I'm already playing Urbandead.com don't want to bother with this. I'll just take everyone who I had control over and make a new Nation in Alaska.

Sounds like a plan. I'll send in a fireteam of TannenIntel agents in once word gets back to Saharistan (which shouldn't be hard, just contact a TannenIntel agency in Saharistan and it'll go from there) and we'll see how it unfolds from that point.

Sounds like a plan. I'll send in a fireteam of TannenIntel agents in once word gets back to Saharistan (which shouldn't be hard, just contact a TannenIntel agency in Saharistan and it'll go from there) and we'll see how it unfolds from that point.

Do you have any suggestions for what the "objectives" should be? That's what kills alot of zombie RP's, people are just stuck to run around shooting stuff. I'd like to have it very clearly outlined. Oh, and we should make transportation a real bitch in this RP too. After I drop my people off i'm going to have some issue come up that makes it almost impossible for them to talk to the IMA again.

Bah, zombie rps are not my taste. And outta curiousity McKagan, what MBTs do you use?

Do you have any suggestions for what the "objectives" should be? That's what kills alot of zombie RP's, people are just stuck to run around shooting stuff. I'd like to have it very clearly outlined. Oh, and we should make transportation a real bitch in this RP too. After I drop my people off i'm going to have some issue come up that makes it almost impossible for them to talk to the IMA again.

I'm thinking maybe having the shuttle that drops off the TannenIntel agents get overwhelmed by the zombies as it tries to fly off, and then all of the agents get infected with the virus and thus are not allowed to return to Tannenmille, even though they won't be turned into zombies.

Maybe the objectives should just be to scout the area, try to find out what caused it and put a stop to whatever caused it so we can clean up Torontia and bring it back to at least a second-world country again?

Well it's open for discussion, but I was going for a (remake) "Dawn of the Dead" style zombie. One that is FAST. I also don't like the idea of having the infected, but not turning into zombies. It's open for discussion, but personally I like the idea of the size of the wound determines how fast you turn into one. A bite... a few minutes, maybe an hour. A scratch.... maybe a day... if you get your arm chopped off, 30 seconds... :p

What I might do is drop a team of Snipers in and give them the order of finding an area where they can get zombies to come to them, but still pick them off easily. Maybe the roof of a small building or something? I don't want everyone on this RP to be together though. Everyone should be working for something different. What would be nice is if Amestria or someone got involved as a splinter group and were working against our forces.

Bah, zombie rps are not my taste. And outta curiousity McKagan, what MBTs do you use?

A mix of my own, the new ones sold by the Macabees, and the older ones not availalble by the Macabees.

I've also got about 250,000 of some sort of Leafanistani tank in strategic reserve. This means they're sitting in bunkers somewhere in Saharistan...

Y'know... I need to upgrade the IMA forces. I think I'm going to replace my strategic reserve.

I use RL tanks (read: M1A2 Abrams, Challenger 2, Leopard 2A6), but I'm starting to retire them and replace them with more NS standards.

I use RL tanks (read: M1A2 Abrams, Challenger 2, Leopard 2A6), but I'm starting to retire them and replace them with more NS standards.

I'm personally a fan of the Macabee tanks, even though I hold a fairly small number of the newer ones. Lame Bums also has a very good line of tanks.

Alot of good tanks are out, it's good to have a domestic one around that you can easily upgrade to fit the mission you need it to. If you do that, you keep your army open enough to fight almost anyone, and leave yourself adaptable.

Well it's open for discussion, but I was going for a (remake) "Dawn of the Dead" style zombie. One that is FAST. I also don't like the idea of having the infected, but not turning into zombies. It's open for discussion, but personally I like the idea of the size of the wound determines how fast you turn into one. A bite... a few minutes, maybe an hour. A scratch.... maybe a day... if you get your arm chopped off, 30 seconds... :p

What I might do is drop a team of Snipers in and give them the order of finding an area where they can get zombies to come to them, but still pick them off easily. Maybe the roof of a small building or something? I don't want everyone on this RP to be together though. Everyone should be working for something different. What would be nice is if Amestria or someone got involved as a splinter group and were working against our forces.

Maybe they all get infected, but only the squad leader survives a la Sergeant Johnson in the Halo novels? He was infected with the Flood virus, but lived because he had some side effects from a Covenant plasma shot which made him effectively immune to the Flood. Perhaps that way, all of them are infected, the fireteam members all get zombified, and the leader kills them all and tries to make it back safely?

Um, as you can tell from my nation's name, my state is a Union of Southeast Asian Nations. It's consisted of (mostly) mud-water nations, so how am I supposed to design a good one fit for my homeland?

Maybe they all get infected, but only the squad leader survives a la Sergeant Johnson in the Halo novels? He was infected with the Flood virus, but lived because he had some side effects from a Covenant plasma shot which made him effectively immune to the Flood. Perhaps that way, all of them are infected, the fireteam members all get zombified, and the leader kills them all and tries to make it back safely?

Well, it'll be an RP. You can want that to happen, but we'd still have other things happening. You could do that at the end, I guess.

Um, as you can tell from my nation's name, my state is a Union of Southeast Asian Nations. It's consisted of (mostly) mud-water nations, so how am I supposed to design a good one fit for my homeland?

In the McKagan Northeast, which is sort of like you described (not really, it's muddy, but kinda forest and stuff too,) I keep divisions of Light APC's and IFV's around. What you do is hope that any potential invader will make the mistake of landing heavy tanks and sinking up. While they field 80 ton MBT's, you field small, light, heavily armed IFV's that can move over/through the mud and kill units that are stuck.

As I see it we have several options.

1) Rewrite everything that occurred after the ceasefire and go from there (after the ceasefire is when things started to go to hell and the bad feelings began to develop).

2) Everyone declares victory in Torontia and pulls out. Torontia becomes a peaceful democracy for a little while and Mckagan or a third party can use it for future RPs.

3) A character RP against Rebels or terrorists (zombies and zombie viruses seem cliché).

4) A character dawn of the dead clone (I do not think it is a very original idea and I in all honest can’t stand stories about zombies, but I am just expressing my opinion and if Mckagan wants to go through with it who am I to complain).

As I see it we have several options.

1) Rewrite everything that occurred after the ceasefire and go from there (after the ceasefire is when things started to go to hell and the bad feelings to develop).

2) Everyone declares victory in Torontia and pulls out. Torontia becomes a peaceful democracy for a little while and Mckagan or a third party can use it for future RPs.


Agreed, I think. Basically. I want Torontia to be a economically powerful, peaceful nation, until whatever happens next.


3) A character RP against Rebels or terrorists (zombies and zombie viruses seem cliché).

4) A character dawn of the dead clone (I do not think it is a very original idea and I in all honest can’t stand stories about zombies, but I am just expressing my opinion and if Mckagan wants to go through with it who am I to complain).

I don't think it's very cliche, myself. I mean, it wraps the nation up well. It gives the SWC (which, in any case, is going to have the nation in the end) something to work with in the future. It wouldn't be a Dawn of the Dead clone, because it would be like Marines vs. Zombies, not random people with a shotgun vs. zombies. The only reason I mentioned DotD is because I like that style of zombie, in reality it would have very little to do with the plot of the actual movie.

That way it destroys Torontia so no one really wants it or gets much out of it, and gives it a bit of... epic-icity for the future.

I'm still open for suggestions, I'm just airing what I THINK should be done with it. I really don't know, i'm just throwing ideas out.

This RP is officially OVER.

It started out with great potential. It was epic. Then people started getting bitchy, crying, and power hungry. It ruined the RP. Basically, I'm taking the point where everyone stop fighting, having Amestria still pull out, and then writing it as if SF eventually just held elections or something and then pulled out 100%. He can either agree to that or I'll write it as if he was never involved to start with. In the end, the SWC gets called back in because of disputes between various factions left over from all the conflicts going on.

End of discussion.

From my perspective this RP has been on the rocks since the beginning of last week, its just no one noticed at the time.

We could just rewrite the Kurora Conference as a success and have the governments reunite. Everyone pulls out so no one “gains” anything. Torontia can be of use for the future.

Meanwhile, certain elements of the story have to be preserved as they have been carried into other RPs. I speak primarily of the discovery of the mass graves and 307 corpses in BC and the resulting public scandle/coverup/Kahanistanian riots.

From my perspective this RP has been on the rocks since the beginning of last week, its just no one noticed at the time.

I thought it was crap a long time ago, after the SWC had to leave and then everyone else started carving it up.

It's over now though, it's created more spinoff RP's than any other RP i've been in besides the original invasion of Saharistan.

I thought it was crap a long time ago, after the SWC had to leave and then everyone else started carving it up.

It's over now though, it's created more spinoff RP's than any other RP i've been in besides the original invasion of Saharistan.

Remember Pine Orchard? Such an obscure spinoff from Saharistan that a few of us got involved in. We were so green back then, and now we've come as far as we have.. man, it's so weird looking back.

And this reminds me I need to download all of the Saharistan War pages for posterity sometime.

Remember Pine Orchard? Such an obscure spinoff from Saharistan that a few of us got involved in. We were so green back then, and now we've come as far as we have.. man, it's so weird looking back.

And this reminds me I need to download all of the Saharistan War pages for posterity sometime.

Ugh, that place was hell. It was one of the few times I ever got an obvious godmod called on me, too. When I had like 300 Bradleys suddenly appear out of nowhere.

Other than that, it was fun. Insurgents take hold of a city, I blanket it with paratroopers and then forget about it...

Whoa... I've not used paratroopers in FOREVER...

I know what you mean; when I reread the first posts, I wrote on the Torontian occupation I feel a little embarrassed for how basic they are.

In the meantime lets just concentrate on tying up all this RP's lose ends and amicably ending it so we can move on to other things.

In the meantime lets just concentrate on tying up all this RP's lose ends and amicably ending it so we can move on to other things.

It's been ended, I just don't want Torontia to be wasted since we've had this whole RP. It has GREAT potential for future RP's, we just need to set them up.

Yes.. lets concentrate on removing Amestria from Torontia and sinking their retreating ships.

Yes.. lets concentrate on removing Amestria from Torontia and sinking their retreating ships.

That kind of reasoning is the reason this RP is over and Torontian history is being written by me instead of RP'd.

It's been ended, I just don't want Torontia to be wasted since we've had this whole RP. It has GREAT potential for future RP's, we just need to set them up.
It doesn't have potential anymore. Its pretty much dead. Like I said, anything involving Torontia, if you dothe history, will be ignored. All the spinoffs created psot cease fire are ignored. So we can either wrap it up properly, or just let it fade away.

Yes.. lets concentrate on removing Amestria from Torontia and sinking their retreating ships.

SF the RP has been ended.

In the meantime lets just concentrate on tying up all this RP's lose ends and amicably ending it so we can move on to other things.
Amestria, the RP has been ended.

OOC: Kraven War 3, I have the ability to Launch nukes from:

Kraven Mainland
Concremo
Numonica
Axis Nova
and theres another Slave Nation, but i forget its name

FYI Axis Nova has no strategic nukes, Kraven :p

FYI Axis Nova has no strategic nukes, Kraven :p

Forget anyone ever mentioned nukes!

It doesn't have potential anymore. Its pretty much dead. Like I said, anything involving Torontia, if you dothe history, will be ignored. All the spinoffs created psot cease fire are ignored. So we can either wrap it up properly, or just let it fade away.

No. You're one of the people who wouldn't let it happen. You're arrogant and don't want to RP if everything doesn't go your way. I'm pretty sure I can get people to agree with me on that. YOU'RE not in the position to decide what is ignored. Considering Torontia is MY nation, that means I have the final, overall say in what happens. Besides, I believe most people here are more willing to actually WORK with me to decide what the history is. You've got to get over your "my way or the highway" attitude or you're never going to have an RP where it is finished without two OOC threads filled with arguing.

I've also got about 250,000 of some sort of Leafanistani tank in strategic reserve. This means they're sitting in bunkers somewhere in Saharistan...

Y'know... I need to upgrade the IMA forces. I think I'm going to replace my strategic reserve.
Looking to replace your old Leafanistani tanks eh? Then perhaps you should check out Praetonia's IPO Hoplite II Phalanx (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=423500) (I think your old friend Halberdgardia also uses it, and it's designated as the M-150 "Hammerblow" in his armed forces). And have you registered at the NS Draftroom (http://s13.invisionfree.com/The_NS_Draftroom/index.php) McKagan? Because I would like to see your planes' stats and whether they would work on NS.

That is a good tank. Right now I don't know what i'll do. I may just scrap those tanks and use the free'd up funds to build more of my domestic tanks, since we're moving towards more urban combat anyway.

And no, I'm not on the Draftroom, I keep meaning to, but I never have.

Speaking of looking back on this RP, this has been, without a doubt, the most up-and-down RP I've ever participated in.

And I'll be damned if that's what made it fun, too. :p

No. You're one of the people who wouldn't let it happen. You're arrogant and don't want to RP if everything doesn't go your way. I'm pretty sure I can get people to agree with me on that. YOU'RE not in the position to decide what is ignored. Considering Torontia is MY nation, that means I have the final, overall say in what happens. Besides, I believe most people here are more willing to actually WORK with me to decide what the history is. You've got to get over your "my way or the highway" attitude or you're never going to have an RP where it is finished without two OOC threads filled with arguing.
You sir have no clue what you are talking about. A lot of things didn't go my way. If most things had gone my way, I would be in a lot better a position then I am now. Things only went my way because Yallak withdrew from the fight, and Amestria ran into strong resistance, and instead of fighting, pulled back and called a ceasefire before I could do my counter attack, which I told him I wanted to do before he called a ceasefire. There is no way the 25,000 soldiers in that area could have withstood an attack from 500,000 Amestrian troops and about the same from Yallak. If they had even RP'd another couple NS hours, the line would've broke and I wouldn't have been in Torontia.

So you cannot say I don't RP when things don't go my way. I just wasn't given the chance to. And the reason I brought in the ignore on nukes was because I read in one of the stickies that it was frowned upon to use nukes if the involved parties did not agree to it. I did not agree to it.

Speaking of looking back on this RP, this has been, without a doubt, the most up-and-down RP I've ever participated in.

And I'll be damned if that's what made it fun, too. :p

That's why I'm writing the history so that it'll be epic, too. There were times when I thought were had hit a dead end, actually. Just getting the TPLA to a point where I could control the RP through media was hard, but after the bio-weapon got out things started working better.

You sir have no clue what you are talking about. A lot of things didn't go my way. If most things had gone my way, I would be in a lot better a position then I am now. Things only went my way because Yallak withdrew from the fight, and Amestria ran into strong resistance, and instead of fighting, pulled back and called a ceasefire before I could do my counter attack, which I told him I wanted to do before he called a ceasefire. There is no way the 25,000 soldiers in that area could have withstood an attack from 500,000 Amestrian troops and about the same from Yallak. If they had even RP'd another couple NS hours, the line would've broke and I wouldn't have been in Torontia.

So you cannot say I don't RP when things don't go my way. I just wasn't given the chance to. And the reason I brought in the ignore on nukes was because I read in one of the stickies that it was frowned upon to use nukes if the involved parties did not agree to it. I did not agree to it.

I did not say you DON'T RP when things don't go your way. I said you don't WANT TO RP when things don't go your way. There is a difference. Personally, I've never seen an RP that has more OOC fighting than IC fighting; but that's just me.

Why don't you agree to nukes? See, I can see ignoring it if there's NO REASON to have them and it would be bad for both people to use them. But you're just trying to make it hard for Amestria to defend himself.

Hal, which Idiot Godmoder Noncontinuity Omni-Repellant Eradicator version (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=294969) do you want to use? Deluxe? Saturn IGNORE? And what about the trial involving JC?

Speaking of looking back on this RP, this has been, without a doubt, the most up-and-down RP I've ever participated in.

And I'll be damned if that's what made it fun, too. :p

Yeah... It was great lemonade before it turned sour.

I did not say you DON'T RP when things don't go your way. I said you don't WANT TO RP when things don't go your way. There is a difference. Personally, I've never seen an RP that has more OOC fighting than IC fighting; but that's just me.

Why don't you agree to nukes? See, I can see ignoring it if there's NO REASON to have them and it would be bad for both people to use them. But you're just trying to make it hard for Amestria to defend himself.
No I'm really not making it hard. Amestria claims a large army, something my entire military doesn't even field. If I was to invade, I would be going up against 10 Amestrians fighting on home soil, in fortified, well prepared positions for every 1 Saint Fedskian fighting an offensive battle, from the beaches with little cover and nothing but ocean to their backs. The only thing that may help me is my superior training and weaponry. Amestria and I have equal defence budgets, or did last time I checked. If anything, ignoring nukes would give it a bit more level.

Seems I've missed quiet a bit of the OOC argument, and I'm not particualrly in the mood to go read over the half a dozen pages so could someone please give me an overview?

Why has the RP been closed, what is being re-writen from the IC storyline and what specific OOC issues have led to such a drastic action occuring?

If anything, ignoring nukes would give it a bit more level.
There's no need to ignore nukes, Amestria would never use them. If they did, it would spell their doom. It's best to keep ignores to a minimum, so I don't see why you would need to create this one which seems pointless.

Hal, which Idiot Godmoder Noncontinuity Omni-Repellant Eradicator version (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=294969) do you want to use? Deluxe? Saturn IGNORE? And what about the trial involving JC?
Xirnium, which I.G.N.O.R.E cannon would you use to solve this situation?

what specific OOC issues have led to such a drastic action occuring?

Innumerable differences…


Why has the RP been closed, what is being re-writen from the IC storyline

We are hammering that out at present.

Seems I've missed quiet a bit of the OOC argument, and I'm not particualrly in the mood to go read over the half a dozen pages so could someone please give me an overview?

Why has the RP been closed, what is being re-writen from the IC storyline and what specific OOC issues have led to such a drastic action occuring?

No one was willing to give anyone else room OOCly and people started getting to the point where the RP wasn't fun anymore. The storyline isn't being "re-written," but instead, "finished."

Xirnium, which I.G.N.O.R.E cannon would you use to solve this situation?
I despise ignores. In the Xirnium-Kraven War not one single issue was ever ignored, indeed not one single OOC argument ever even occurred, and my nation was being invaded by a genocidal army intent on razing everything to the ground.

Thanks for the link though, I'll have a look. :D

There's no need to ignore nukes, Amestria would never use them. If they did, it would spell their doom. It's best to keep ignores to a minimum, so I don't see why you would need to create this one which seems pointless.
Amestria told me that if I invaded, or even ICly threatened to, I would be nuked.

I despise ignores. In the Xirnium-Kraven War not one single issue was ever ignored, indeed not one single OOC argument ever even occurred, and my nation was being invaded by a genocide army intent on razing everything to the ground.

Thank's for the link though, I'll have a look. :D
It's from the earliest days of NS, and you can find several NS legends (Automagfreek, Russian Forces, etc) have posts in the Archives. It's a huge wealth of information.

The storyline isn't being "re-written," but instead, "finished."
To finish the RP without re-writing story or godmoding you need the consent of several other RPers, including me, who are all still present in it. Saint Fedski and Yallak, for example, both have troops in Torontia.

Amestria told me that if I invaded, or even ICly threatened to, I would be nuked.

You were threatening me with puppets, but enough, no more arguing.

To finish the RP without re-writing story or godmoding you need the consent of several other RPers, including me, who are all still present in it. Saint Fedski and Yallak, for example, both have troops in Torontia.

False. I own the Torontian account. So, in the end, I have the final say in what happens to the nation.

I own the Torontian account. So, in the end, I have the final say in what happens to the nation.
Regardless, if you simply ignore everyone else in the RP and declare your own ending it will mean that you are godmoding.

No you really don't. Torontia is your puppet and therefore you cannot use it. You will not allow my allies to RP so I will not allow your admitted puppet.

Xirnium, sorry to go off topic, but did you like the IGNORE super-cannon history article?

No you really don't. Torontia is your puppet and therefore you cannot use it. You will not allow my allies to RP so I will not allow your admitted puppet.

Well technically he is not using/wanking it. Since it is now his rightful country he can write the history of it as he sees fit. Since he now owns the country he could ignore everything since the ceasefire, or ignore it all together because it is his country, and his history. If your going to make a stink about it, solve it with a mod or ICly do something militarily instead of arguing until everyone is blue in the face.

No you really don't. Torontia is your puppet and therefore you cannot use it. You will not allow my allies to RP so I will not allow your admitted puppet.

He is using it as the account owner, not as a puppet.

Then what's to stop me from using the other commonwealth nations as the owner, not as a puppet?

Then what's to stop me from using the other commonwealth nations as the owner, not as a puppet?

You are perfectly free to write the histories of them, you just cannot RP with them in an unapproved manner (which is what you tried to do).

At this point the RP is over and we are trying to write an amicable ending so that the labor of the last [insert number of months] was not wasted building a monument to futility.

A monument to futility? I think that's the best description of this entire fiasco thus far.

Excellent job, gentlemen!

A monument to futility? I think that's the best description of this entire fiasco thus far.

Excellent job, gentlemen!

Who may I ask are you?

Who may I ask are you?

Someone with a flag that has absolutely terrible JPEG compression. Use .gif if you have duotone flag.

Maybe he's someone who has been reading the thread? There's no need to be so rude Amestria.

Maybe he's someone who has been reading the thread? There's no need to be so rude Amestria.

And there is no need for you to be intractable Saint Fedski.