NationStates Jolt Archive

Nuclear ones are, and if you're going to use them on defense, I see no reason for not using them on offense against military structures.



Tesla turbines aren't as good as regular ones.

Ok, im sorry im going to put my foot down on this one, I do not want what happend in The Expulsion thread to happen here, so Im going to kindly ask Civitas to leave the RP, My apologies but i will not allow what happend to Expulsion to happen here, and it will inevitably ruin the whole RP as IC/OOC differences leak into the RP, I do not want to make this decision but it seems this may be my only choice on the matter.

I've looked over the post, and found only 2 instances of Velkyan aircraft engaging at speeds above Mach 3.

1. The first strike, when the aircraft had SCRAM jets active and flew in a linear path through the formation, firing their guns.

2. When the bombers tried to escape, the 5 remaining fighters accelerated to Mach 4, but, again, in a straight line while they fired.

In both instances, the fighter deaccelerated afterwords to a more reasonable level.

But I respect your protests, and I'll try to trim the RADF's speed.

You can't ask C.A. to leave because he argues with Nova's technology and methods.

You yourself said no WMD's, yet Axis is going to use them as anti-misisle weapons. That should be grounds enough for him to leave. C.A. is just trying to make a point that Axis can't use nukes.

You can't ask C.A. to leave because he argues with Nova's technology and methods.

You yourself said no WMD's, yet Axis is going to use them as anti-misisle weapons. That should be grounds enough for him to leave. C.A. is just trying to make a point that Axis can't use nukes.

No its not on soley the basis of that, The Expulsion of Religion in Concremo thread was ruined by OOC bickering, I do not want this to happen, Its not a move i want to make but it seems like the only resonable choice i can make right now.

No its not on soley the basis of that, The Expulsion of Religion in Concremo thread was ruined by OOC bickering, I do not want this to happen, Its not a move i want to make but it seems like the only resonable choice i can make right now.

It was ruined when you decided to ignore IC stuff and magically put your fleet within visual range of mine. The bickering was my going "WTF" over that, until you finally agreed to have your fleet outside of the limit line when you fired.

STOP IT ALREADY!

The war's back on, let's be back to business, yes?

Guy's relax...
Its just an imaginary war floating around in our collective heads. CA should be alloud to stick around, as it has yet to ruin anything IC as of yet. Second, let Axis have his air fleet, they have so many weaknesses it is not even worth counting. I will name a few right here.

A: Altitude: At the cruising altitude of most commercial airplanes, 30k feet, if even minor depressurization occurs a human is knocked out in ten seconds max. So that means if any section of the ships are penetrated at any altitude near that or above it, bye bye crew. I know you “may” have areas of the ship sectioned off in case of depressurization, but do you or are you just thinking of now that I mentioned it?

B: Air wakes: It is a well known facts that large aircraft produce massive air wakes. Why do you think there is a time period between aircraft taking off? Smaller jets are maneuverable and stable enough to make it through these in ok shape, but large aircraft cant. Its as simple as that, if your fleet flies together, it will destroy itself. So either you can do our job for us, or put massive distance between your ships and make them easy targets.

C: Wings wing wings: Large aircrafts wings are massive. If these are as big as I think the wings will be HUGE. They will be very easy targets, and even s single missile hit to a wing will bring the whole thing down.

D: Slow and Cant Maneuver: These things are almost like sky fortresses, but much more advanced. They have plenty of guns and in theory can fair for themselves. Well when that strategy was put to test in WWII they were torn to shreds. As technology advanced at a parallel rates you have the same problem. Also being slow and turning at a pitiful rate they will make easy targets, allowing for hit and runs from high altitude, where if they travel they make themselves prone to decompression vulnerability.

There are more, including I don’t plan on mentioning until moving upon them, but even with these lets take a look at these airships.

Must travel in massive ragged formations, letting them be picked off. One or two missile hits to a massive wing will bring the whole thing down. Being slow they cant react to rapidly changing threats, and them being spread out over miles wont help either. Cant take to high altitude without becoming vulnerable to even a nick in the hull.

So guys, by all means, let him have his airships.

Also Axis, this is all OOC, so don’t even dare act on it IC. If you have things that you have already planned that counter any of these, feel free to tell me, but don’t start making stuff up because I decided to reveal my cards OOC.

Well... got a bit worked up there. heh... erhm... yea... lol

Velkya, our F-108s and F-21s are about 15 minutes behind you. Half the F-21s are armed with HARMs or other ground attack munitions, and a couple hundred of the F-21s are actually electronic warfare varients. Would you mind using them (as a three person air battle is going to be way too confusing and you'll have the knowledge of what ground support is needed?)

Guy's relax...
A: Altitude: At the cruising altitude of most commercial airplanes, 30k feet, if even minor depressurization occurs a human is knocked out in ten seconds max. So that means if any section of the ships are penetrated at any altitude near that or above it, bye bye crew. I know you “may” have areas of the ship sectioned off in case of depressurization, but do you or are you just thinking of now that I mentioned it?


Of course I do. I didn't mention it in the profiles cause I havn't done detailed writeups for them all and because I assumed it was obvious that anything flying at high altitudes would have measures to deal with that kinda thing.


B: Air wakes: It is a well known facts that large aircraft produce massive air wakes. Why do you think there is a time period between aircraft taking off? Smaller jets are maneuverable and stable enough to make it through these in ok shape, but large aircraft cant. Its as simple as that, if your fleet flies together, it will destroy itself. So either you can do our job for us, or put massive distance between your ships and make them easy targets.


I'll look this up, but it's safe to assume that the "formations" are miles wide and that the craft in them fly at different altitudes. A 3d formation is neccesarily harder to deal with than a 2d one, but I'll have to deal with it as a disadvantage. Fortunately not all of my airships are super gigantic.


C: Wings wing wings: Large aircrafts wings are massive. If these are as big as I think the wings will be HUGE. They will be very easy targets, and even s single missile hit to a wing will bring the whole thing down.


Which is exactly why the wings are also armored. I did think of this, after all :)


D: Slow and Cant Maneuver: These things are almost like sky fortresses, but much more advanced. They have plenty of guns and in theory can fair for themselves. Well when that strategy was put to test in WWII they were torn to shreds. As technology advanced at a parallel rates you have the same problem. Also being slow and turning at a pitiful rate they will make easy targets, allowing for hit and runs from high altitude, where if they travel they make themselves prone to decompression vulnerability.


Their max altitude is indeed not terribly great, and, as I stated, for the most part neither is their maneuverability. Also, the aircraft in WWII were torn to shreds because they weren't tough enough to withstand most enemy fire-- a disadvantage not matched by my airships. The entire point of armoring them, after all, is to render them more or less immune to the usual AA missiles.

Hopefully this should alleviate some of your concerns. :)

Thanks for the 411, AN.

On a side note, might want to check out the NS Terms Guide. thread and contirbute.

Help the newbs!

You know... I think this is the first war I've been in where the OOC thread is longer than the IC thread http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/7163/emotlaugh9bc.gif

You know... I think this is the first war I've been in where the OOC thread is longer than the IC thread http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/7163/emotlaugh9bc.gif

Yea, but for so much OOC, most of it is pretty civil... most...

Of course I do. I didn't mention it in the profiles cause I havn't done detailed writeups for them all and because I assumed it was obvious that anything flying at high altitudes would have measures to deal with that kinda thing.

Dont worry man, I trust you. I understand people dont go into detailed write ups, I sure dont. So I will take your word for it. The only disadvantage with sealing certain areas is that crew can't get there, unless they go in with air tanks and what not, but that would require air locks to prevent further de-pressurization. But you stated that you wont be flying high, so it wont be much of an issue.

Which is exactly why the wings are also armored. I did think of this, after all

Yea, but how much armor can a wing really have? I know you could pack on far more than a typical jet with these designs, but I dont think it would support naval class armor. About how much is on them?


Their max altitude is indeed not terribly great, and, as I stated, for the most part neither is their maneuverability. Also, the aircraft in WWII were torn to shreds because they weren't tough enough to withstand most enemy fire-- a disadvantage not matched by my airships. The entire point of armoring them, after all, is to render them more or less immune to the usual AA missiles.

I am expecting these things to take a lot more fire than the typical air force, but not as much as any sea based navy.

Hopefully this should alleviate some of your concerns

Thankyou, it did. I have one more question.

So what is the overall "look" or design of these things anyway? Are they just like really big planes, or something else? None of this will even be used until we make contact IC, or an ally makes contact, as I doubt my nation has much info on airships.

Ok, im sorry im going to put my foot down on this one, I do not want what happend in The Expulsion thread to happen here, so Im going to kindly ask Civitas to leave the RP, My apologies but i will not allow what happend to Expulsion to happen here, and it will inevitably ruin the whole RP as IC/OOC differences leak into the RP, I do not want to make this decision but it seems this may be my only choice on the matter.

To be fair I think he has a valid point regarding the flying dreadnaughts. They are pretty absurd. None of us have anything even vaguely comparable as far as I know.

Guys I think we can agree as long as none of the OOC anger slips into IC everyone can stay.

To be fair I think he has a valid point regarding the flying dreadnaughts. They are pretty absurd. None of us have anything even vaguely comparable as far as I know.
Kahanistan. Enough said.

So, how exactly does he compare with flying dreadnoughts?

Kahanistan. Enough said.

Kahanistan has flying battleships? That's news to me. I've only ever seen him use MiGs.

Kahanistan has flying battleships? That's news to me. I've only ever seen him use MiGs.
Clicky. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9742094&postcount=13)

Well, that solves the airship issue.

Velkya: I read the Arkbird's relatively meager profile. Its payload and speed are inferior to that of my Arbiter, but that's irrelevent:

It is well enough armored to withstand direct hits from surface-to-air missiles, such as this fellow: http://www.mikhalenko.ru/photos/Sbory-2003/kirill-s300.jpg

And it has an onboard laser system, which is not explained.

My A4 Partisan bipedal MBT, weighing over 560 tons, still uses a deuterium-fluoride laser on account of free-electron lasers are, and most likely will be, ridiculously large and heavy even in a PMT situation. Putting them on an aircraft, a traditional aircraft, with an RCS of zero is both disturbing and wrong at the same time.

I mean, if you can go that, why not just remove the bomb bays entirely, add extra generators, and blast things off the ground with the laser?!

Which shows a lot the nastyness inherent to the whole PMT system (and why my forces remain solidly MT). It's basically whatever you can dream up.

Very well, the lasers have been replaced by a CICW system. Happy?

And if the warhead is a frag warhead, it has a good chance it will cause only slight damage (it can still knock it out if hit in the right place), but if it is a HE warhead, then the Arkbird can be penetrated if the missile can get past the CICW system.

3 missiles have no chance.

Ok No Flying Dreadnoughts!!!!!!

Clicky. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9742094&postcount=13)

His are FT. Heck, they have disruptor cannons! ;.;


Dont worry man, I trust you. I understand people dont go into detailed write ups, I sure dont. So I will take your word for it. The only disadvantage with sealing certain areas is that crew can't get there, unless they go in with air tanks and what not, but that would require air locks to prevent further de-pressurization. But you stated that you wont be flying high, so it wont be much of an issue.

Basically think like those pressure doors they have all over ships and stuff, and regulations about opening and closing them and so forth.

[quote]
Yea, but how much armor can a wing really have? I know you could pack on far more than a typical jet with these designs, but I dont think it would support naval class armor. About how much is on them?


Yeah, it isn't really naval grade armor, that would obviously be impossible. It tends to be about like a main battle tank's front slope in most parts. An MT main battle tank, that is-- think the latest revision of the M1's armor except somewhat lighter (thanks to PMT materials tech).



I am expecting these things to take a lot more fire than the typical air force, but not as much as any sea based navy.


Yeah, if I insisted these could take hits from the gigantic ETC guns a lot of ships around here carry, you really would have reason to scream god mod. Fortunately those guns generally are useless for an antiaircraft role.



Thankyou, it did. I have one more question.

So what is the overall "look" or design of these things anyway? Are they just like really big planes, or something else? None of this will even be used until we make contact IC, or an ally makes contact, as I doubt my nation has much info on airships.

Well, pics for some of the more recent models are in my thread. They tend mostly towards flying wings, though the designs with VTOL capability (which are newer models) are less wing-looking.

The Lucifer class, which I probably won't ever be able to get a pic for, looks very vaguely like a ridiculously gigantic B-2, and probably could be used in some shooter as a boss =p

Very well, the lasers have been replaced by a CICW system. Happy?

And if the warhead is a frag warhead, it has a good chance it will cause only slight damage (it can still knock it out if hit in the right place), but if it is a HE warhead, then the Arkbird can be penetrated if the missile can get past the CICW system.

3 missiles have no chance.

Thank you, thank you, you've made my day.

Dweladelfia prime: How much longer are you going to beat around the bush here?

Kahanistan: T-birds inbound on your guys. I haven't finished statting them out yet, but they've always been a favorite of mine in MT/PMT. The troops in them are similar to the Capital Police, in fact their armor (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v652/blaesa/viridian_1_1024x768.jpg) was based off of the same thing (Jin Roh), and the picture was only changed when I found out Kraven used it. So, the same basic protective value, just a different look. M22-A2 (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9822817&postcount=3) Battle Rifles all around.

BTW, does anyone have any qualms about me using COMPLETELY NON-LETHAL chemical weapons (KO gas) to pacify the pilots on the ice? Wouldn't even be that effective, given that the pilots could still have their air supply.

EDIT: Fixed page-breaking pic.

Knockout gas is generally not defined as a WMD.

Knockout gas is generally not defined as a WMD.

Is (along with tear gas) according to Geneva Convention.

...uhh, Velkya, five 100,000 pound bombs? The Arkbird can only carry 265,000 pounds of ordnance. What the hell kinda engines did you put on those?

Civetas Americae: Huh.... I wasn't aware WMDs were used on a daily basis in many countries against their own citizens.

Don't you think this would make more news?

...uhh, Velkya, five 100,000 pound bombs? The Arkbird can only carry 265,000 pounds of ordnance. What the hell kinda engines did you put on those?

Civetas Americae: Huh.... I wasn't aware WMDs were used on a daily basis in many countries against their own citizens.

Don't you think this would make more news?

DAMN IT!

I thought the AB's capacity was 465,000 lbs.

Make that 2 bombs. :(

1 every...2 miles.

Man, these things are going to AWACs as soon as a find a better replacement.

*ahem*

After this conflict is over, the Arbiter will undergo an overhaul to upgrade a few components.

(1) More powerful engines, capable of moving the bomber even faster (Mach 4 projected) and higher (95,000+ feet).

(2) Addition of a second pair of coaxial CIWS guns.

It'll simply be called "Arbiter II"

Maybe you'd care to pick some up after these hostilities are over?

*ahem*

After this conflict is over, the Arbiter will undergo an overhaul to upgrade a few components.

(1) More powerful engines, capable of moving the bomber even faster (Mach 4 projected) and higher (95,000+ feet).

(2) Addition of a second pair of coaxial CIWS guns.

It'll simply be called "Arbiter II"

Maybe you'd care to pick some up after these hostilities are over?

Heck, sure, we could be buds. Looks like the only countries that will be truly devestated by this will be Concermo and TKC, so what the hay.

I'm still trying to figure out why a democracy like you is supporting Kraven.

...democracy? When did anyone say I'm a democracy?

...uhh, Velkya, five 100,000 pound bombs? The Arkbird can only carry 265,000 pounds of ordnance. What the hell kinda engines did you put on those?

Civetas Americae: Huh.... I wasn't aware WMDs were used on a daily basis in many countries against their own citizens.

Don't you think this would make more news?

I'm not the one who came up with the stupid definition, politicians did.

In particular, one stupid politician with a four letter last name.

Any guesses?

Bretton: Oops, wrong large multi-billion pro-Kraven state. I'm thinking of Otagia.

OK, look, these posts of "lol I zip to 20 miles of Kraven" need to stop. My radar is detecting your aircraft HUNDREDS of miles away, so you are just plain not going to be able to get that close without being detected.

OK, look, these posts of "lol I zip to 20 miles of Kraven" need to stop. My radar is detecting your aircraft HUNDREDS of miles away, so you are just plain not going to be able to get that close without being detected.

Good point guys. I would not send in many aircraft yet, lets rely on missile strikes until we thin his AA and SAM sites down to more reasonable numbers. When you do attack try to hit from two directions, possibly with another nation, to take advantage of the slow speeds of Axis's fleets. The force that Axis moves on should fall back once they are about be threatened. Make sure each force is big enough that it would too dangerous for him to split his forces.

Guys our mobility is so much better than theirs, lets make good use of it.

Alright guys two things.

First for Kraven: What exactly is the weather like in Concremo. What about the enviorment? Is it massive depths of ice, like where Otagia made his base, or forests, or a mixture of all of them?

Second for Allies: I must preface this with how secret this is IC so dont change IC plans on it enemies of the ACA. I propose a feint retreat accompanied with a chosen battlefield to defeat Brettons forces. Once you are aware his forces are on route being laying bombs over all the areas you have taken in small amount, but choose a place where you will engage them. Have a short battle than make like you are retreating. If they do not follow, strike again until you can get them to come. Make your retreat through an area incredibly thick ice, like where Otagia has made his base. This will destroy the mobility of the peacemakers, prevent any passage by the partisens, and do... well not much the stahlthorpes. Let me explain.

The thick ice will be easily cracked by the peacemakers. This would slow their speed to a crawl, and prevent them from jumping out of the way of missiles and such. The partisens would simply be unable to make it through the area. With ice over their heads and definetly above their legs, they will neither be able to walk on it or move through it. The stahlthorpes should be fine though. Make sure sections fot he ice are drilled out with explosives. Hopefully they will fall for it, and have the ground erupt around them dealing massive damage. Coupled with the immense confusion of the sudden eruption of the earth around them, a counter attack should score an easy victory. All that would remain to fight would be some "achilles tendon crippled" peacemakers and other scattered forces. That and air support.

Bretton, I have seen you as intelligent and responsible RP'er. Dont make me regret presenting this information in a post rather than TG.

Actually, I rarely use the flying battleships, I never had more than 60-70 of them and many of them were lost in battle, or too expensive to maintain, or got hit by *IGNORE* cannons... The disruptors weren't that powerful by FT standards anyway (biggest guns in the fleet were 2000 MJ). So don't worry about me throwing them at you. I don't think I used them since the Ottoman Alliance conflict.

Otagia: I have no objections to your troops attempting to use knockout gas, but if Kraven says they're WMD, I see no reason to risk them. Wait till he makes a ruling on them if he hasn't already.

A WMD is a large scale weapon, like a nuke or sarin gas arty. Tear and KO gas is not.

Oh yes, and to anyone wondering.

Phase three is the main invasion of the mainland. The 20 mile section of beach as well as any surrounding cannons will be taken out by Allied Air Power.

Oh, and adjust your LGBs to the laser from space. I think you should have figured about my plan by now. ;)

OK, look, these posts of "lol I zip to 20 miles of Kraven" need to stop. My radar is detecting your aircraft HUNDREDS of miles away, so you are just plain not going to be able to get that close without being detected.

Whose doing the "I zip to 20 miles of Kraven"? If you had read my post, you'd notice that we launched our missiles from 1,800 miles away.


OOC: Dont forget with each passing missile strike total anti missile defense drop. This means maybe 10-15% will get through this time rather than just 5%. Woops, forgot to specify targets. Anti missile systems, airfields, and those naval support guns. The ones targeted for the naval guns fly in at almost sea level to avoid anti missile fire.

Actually, at least 90% ought to get through given that they're coming in behind my anti-AAA wave of missiles. Even if Kraven does have sufficient reserves that he could replace all of those lost, he can't do it instantly.

So, I assume if you're launching these from 1800 miles away, they're cruise missiles?

http://img284.imageshack.us/img284/4554/emotclownballoon6ai.gif

So, I assume if you're launching these from 1800 miles away, they're cruise missiles?

http://img284.imageshack.us/img284/4554/emotclownballoon6ai.gif

Naaa man, they're PMT missiles of every sort. Well the ones targeted at the coastal anti naval guns are very close to cruise missiles, but a bit more advanced. I cant really speak for CA either.

Edit:
Velkya: I didn't want to point this out, for my own good, but I think I should. First you cant use that laser on the peacemakers. If we could use a laser I would have downed numerous of them, with my grid, but Kraven decided they were WMD's. Also man, Axis had a point about not being able to fly right up, he has airships defending the country. So you may want to RP confronting them, or better yet once they begin to approach, fall back, they wont catch up. Then strike somewhere else to draw them away. Then strike back in the same location, its like what I have done in lacrosse against some defenders. You just run up and down around the net, tiring them out.

So, I assume if you're launching these from 1800 miles away, they're cruise missiles?

http://img284.imageshack.us/img284/4554/emotclownballoon6ai.gif

Yes, Kh-555s with GPS turned off.

Dweladelfia prime: How much longer are you going to beat around the bush here?

What?

Naaa man, they're PMT missiles of every sort. Well the ones targeted at the coastal anti naval guns are very close to cruise missiles, but a bit more advanced. I cant really speak for CA either.

Edit:
Velkya: I didn't want to point this out, for my own good, but I think I should. First you cant use that laser on the peacemakers. If we could use a laser I would have downed numerous of them, with my grid, but Kraven decided they were WMD's. Also man, Axis had a point about not being able to fly right up, he has airships defending the country. So you may want to RP confronting them, or better yet once they begin to approach, fall back, they wont catch up. Then strike somewhere else to draw them away. Then strike back in the same location, its like what I have done in lacrosse against some defenders. You just run up and down around the net, tiring them out.

Ok, I'll spill it. I'm using my AML station as a big giant laser designator, not as a weapon of it's self. Even the most effective laser decoy can't match the power of a anti-missile laser, and the hundreds of cruise missiles I've launched are laser guided, so there you go. Happy?

What?

He's launched like 1,000 anti-ship missiles at your fleet.

Ok, I'll spill it. I'm using my AML station as a big giant laser designator, not as a weapon of it's self. Even the most effective laser decoy can't match the power of a anti-missile laser, and the hundreds of cruise missiles I've launched are laser guided, so there you go. Happy?

Brilliant!

Brilliant!

Indeed. I'm also developing unhackable cruise missiles and bombs.

Couple of things so far, just to clear it up

The Concremo Capital is called City 17
Concremo is similar to the KC only with a more temperate climate, winters are cold, but not as cold as the KC, but summers are warm and pleasant, at the moment it is autum moving into winter, for the KC its been winter for about 4 months, There are no trees in the KC they were removed long ago, in Concremo there are trees and forests and a large river running through part of it, imagine a much colder England.

Velkya: you can't have Air Superiority over Concremo, Concremo has an airforce that is capable of fighting back, remember Concremo military and air force was built and constructed by another person, Concremo simply changed hands, Although they are much slower to react than the KC, you can't simply state you have air superiority when i still maintain ability to launch air craft and fight back.

and Godrods are WMDs and are not permitted in the RP, Sorry but i have to outlaw them as well to keep the peace

If you're talking about the Tungsten Rods, they aren't nuclear, biological, or chemical, KC. Therefore, they don;t fall into the term of WMD.

If you're talking about the Tungsten Rods, they aren't nuclear, biological, or chemical, KC. Therefore, they don;t fall into the term of WMD.

Yes i am, and The cause mass destruction annihilating anything it hits, Ive outlawed other people using them so the Ruling still stands sorry, its one rule for all

Velkya: you can't have Air Superiority over Concremo, Concremo has an airforce that is capable of fighting back, remember Concremo military and air force was built and constructed by another person, Concremo simply changed hands, Although they are much slower to react than the KC, you can't simply state you have air superiority when i still maintain ability to launch air craft and fight back.

Except that you don't have that capability. Remember that over 1,400 missiles were launched earlier on Concremo's air defenses around there, and that I have over 1,200 fighters over the Concreman capitol, and that's solely my air contribution, not to mention what Velkya has.


Yes i am, and The cause mass destruction annihilating anything it hits, Ive outlawed other people using them so the Ruling still stands sorry, its one rule for all

Annihilating anything it hits is the point of most weapons.

Kraven, the anti-AAA strike was directed against Kraven proper, like the other large airstrikes.

Except that you don't have that capability. Remember that over 1,400 missiles were launched earlier on Concremo's air defenses around there, and that I have over 1,200 fighters over the Concreman capitol, and that's solely my air contribution, not to mention what Velkya has.



Annihilating anything it hits is the point of most weapons.

I still have that Capability, Air Defenses have been neutralised, but Air Fields have not, I can still get my airforce air bound,

Also im not too happy about you dumping 1000+ air craft on the Concremo capitol, where did they come from? I wouldn't be so bothered if they came from an air craft carrier, but im not sure if you'd deployed one, if so what post so i can confirm it, if they came from your nation or another nation then you will have to RP the time it takes for them to arrive.

If we can iron it out then everything will be super green.

Kraven, the anti-AAA strike was directed against Kraven proper, like the other large airstrikes.

Sorry but all these mass air strikes are difficult to keep up with, Please make your intentions clearer

Yes i am, and The cause mass destruction annihilating anything it hits, Ive outlawed other people using them so the Ruling still stands sorry, its one rule for all

Oh, I get it now...ok.

Edited, and also The God Rod problem, its outlawed, End of Argument

Edited, and also The God Rod problem, its outlawed, End of Argument

Yeah, he wouldn't let me use them either...

As per request, I've become the moderator of this war, and I'll keep an eye on this out of character thread, and I might get into the in character thread although certain politics forbid me from waging war against CA, and I don't want to wage war against KC. Therefore, I'm keeping neutral, except maybe for a few things I plan to do in character. Nevertheless, KC has asked me to moderate the thread and my rulings are final, although I will keep an open mind and I will listen to your arguments. Thanks for your cooperation.

Edited, and also The God Rod problem, its outlawed, End of Argument

Fine. I trust I'm still allowed to use my laser as a designator?

Also, having air superiority doesn't mean you can't launch aircraft against me. The Allies had basic air superiority over Germany in WWII, but the Germans still launched against them. It just means that you aren't relatively safe if you decide to launch, since my aircraft are already there and patrolling.

Fine. I trust I'm still allowed to use my laser as a designator?

Also, having air superiority doesn't mean you can't launch aircraft against me. The Allies had basic air superiority over Germany in WWII, but the Germans still launched against them. It just means that you aren't relatively safe if you decide to launch, since my aircraft are already there and patrolling.

Don't forget my Armada, it's gonna play hell with any attempt to control Kravens airspace.

Automated SAM missile system came online, Targeting the Velkyan Air craft that had now approached, Instantly they had target locks and the SA missiles were launched arcing up into the sky, locking onto their targets quickly, it would take some pretty impressive flying to avoid them...

The velkyians were overconfident about their own air craft, during the Dogfight the JSF X 44 managed to match their manovering toe to toe, they may looked stealthy but infact they were designed for maximum manovering these were Interceptors, the JSF X 33 was designed for stealth, the twin assault cannons opened up hammering bullets through the air towards the enemy craft...

As Velkyians Ground forces approached the city, Artillery opened fire, Multiple AMN 90, Long Range Concremo Firearms Produced artillery, designed to lob a 180mm shell across ranges of 50+ kms...

HE shells were lobbed across the city limits, the defening roar of over 150 of these brutes firing in staggered patterns to keep the Firing constant....

Spotters using long ranged visual equipment kept giving the Artillery sections information and co-ordinates based on the new location of the Formations movment, updating the Artillery section every so often, ensuring they had new information as soon as possible... where ever the convoy would move, the rain of HE shells would follow...

I guess the airstrikes on the SAM sites by Allied aircraft and missiles didn't cause any damage, even though you said yourself that the air defences around City 17 are gone. And the planes are approaching from a good 90,000 feet, which gives them time to react, if your non-existent SAMs can even reach that high.

Fine. I trust I'm still allowed to use my laser as a designator?

Also, having air superiority doesn't mean you can't launch aircraft against me. The Allies had basic air superiority over Germany in WWII, but the Germans still launched against them. It just means that you aren't relatively safe if you decide to launch, since my aircraft are already there and patrolling.

No what im stating is, You hadn't actualy RP'd the destruction of my air fields around concremo, the allies in WWII had made great impacts against Axis Factories detrementing their ability to produce planes, coupled with the loss of trained pilots during the battle of britian stopped them from maintaining their air superiority, so far you havn't done that

I guess the airstrikes on the SAM sites by Allied aircraft and missiles didn't cause any damage, even though you said yourself that the air defences around City 17 are gone. And the planes are approaching from a good 90,000 feet, which gives them time to react, if your non-existent SAMs can even reach that high.

No the targets were against the Kraven Homeland, not those of Concremo, i'd edited the post to fit in with the scheme of things

Otagia: The Capitol Police are already at the location your Helicopters are at, they are closing in on what they think may be his location

Bretton: Oops, wrong large multi-billion pro-Kraven state. I'm thinking of Otagia.
I'm a Corporate Monarchy, not a democracy. The CEO and Regent (haven't had a king for over a century) are both elected by PRA shareholders, and the current CEO (Daniel Quetzal) owns 30% of PRA. So, its only a democracy in the loosest sense of the word. If you got that from my Wiki entry, I apologize profusely, that's purely FT.

Otagia: The Capitol Police are already at the location your Helicopters are at, they are closing in on what they think may be his location

That's fine, but one little thing: They're not 'copters, they're Vectored Thrust Aircraft. Much faster and move maneuverable than a heli.

I'm a Corporate Monarchy, not a democracy. The CEO and Regent (haven't had a king for over a century) are both elected by PRA shareholders, and the current CEO (Daniel Quetzal) owns 30% of PRA. So, its only a democracy in the loosest sense of the word. If you got that from my Wiki entry, I apologize profusely, that's purely FT.



That's fine, but one little thing: They're not 'copters, they're Vectored Thrust Aircraft. Much faster and move maneuverable than a heli.


ok no problem, noted for future reference, as i didnt mention them ic

Sorry, I know that this is invite only, but can I please join, it does look like a really good thread.

Just to Clarify, actually the German's had air superiority over the British in WWII. That is why the German bombers were always over and bommbing London, while, for much of the war, Britain did not have enough of their own bombers reaching Berlin to make much difference.

Sorry, I know that this is invite only, but can I please join, it does look like a really good thread.

Just to Clarify, actually the German's had air superiority over the British in WWII. That is why the German bombers were always over and bommbing London, while, for much of the war, Britain did not have enough of their own bombers reaching Berlin to make much difference.

If the Germans had air superiority, why did the British win? There's a difference between having bombers, which died quite often, and having fighters to kill the bombers, which was what the British had.

True, the British had air superiority, but only nearer the end of the war. When the Battle fo Britain was going on, the British were struggling to stop all the German planes, and to kkeep their own in the air.

In the first month of the Battle of Britain, the British had lost a third of their AirForce, as oppose to a lot less from the German Luftwaffe.

True, the British had air superiority, but only nearer the end of the war. When the Battle fo Britain was going on, the British were struggling to stop all the German planes, and to kkeep their own in the air.

In the first month of the Battle of Britain, the British had lost a third of their AirForce, as oppose to a lot less from the German Luftwaffe.

Either way, who's side do you want to take?

The side that had war declared on them, not the side that started the war.

I am still reading through the IC thread at the moment though.

BUT, the Germans never had air superiority over Britain, otherwise they would have invaded. The British may have lost a ton of aircraft, but they managed to control the skies over their country. Germans never had AS, and once the Allied Bombing campaign started, the Allies had AS over western Europe as well.

Oh yes, and KC, I'm using a design thats about 40 years ahead of yours, and is designed purely as a fighter, not a multirole craft like the JSF, so don't expect your fighters to own mine, since mine are faster, better armed, and more manuerable. In a one on one fight, mine would win.

The side that had war declared on them, not the side that started the war.

I am still reading through the IC thread at the moment though.

Fighting with the KC?

Well, if no one else objects to it i don't see why not

Sorry but all these mass air strikes are difficult to keep up with, Please make your intentions clearer

Just to make my post simpler to understand, a bomber wing has launched 15,000 missiles at Kraven propers airbases, anti missiles defenses, and thos big coastal batteries. The ones targetting the batteries are coming in at sea level to avoid anti missile systems.

Edit: Ok guys a few things, deploy anti runway munitions against his airbases. For example, pentrating cluster bomers work quite well for making a runway useless. Second forget my whole fall back to ice idea in concremo, they have no ice. Still lay the explosives though.

Also, while I will not say no one should join, dont you think we have the odds stacked against us enough as it is? Whatever you want, though, Kraven.

Third, its good to have "mod" for this, it seems to becoming more volatile OOC with each passing day.

BUT, the Germans never had air superiority over Britain, otherwise they would have invaded. The British may have lost a ton of aircraft, but they managed to control the skies over their country. Germans never had AS, and once the Allied Bombing campaign started, the Allies had AS over western Europe as well.

Oh yes, and KC, I'm using a design thats about 40 years ahead of yours, and is designed purely as a fighter, not a multirole craft like the JSF, so don't expect your fighters to own mine, since mine are faster, better armed, and more manuerable. In a one on one fight, mine would win.

40 years ahead makes you 2091 which is generaly classed as FT, Maximum ceiling for PMT is 2060, The JSF X 44 is not a multirole, it is solely an Interceptor

X - 44 Interceptor
X - 33 Stealth fighter bomber
X - 22 Figher Bomber
X - 11 Fighter

Just to make my post simpler to understand, a bomber wing has launched 15,000 missiles at Kraven propers airbases, anti missiles defenses, and thos big coastal batteries. The ones targetting the batteries are coming in at sea level to avoid anti missile systems.

Ok, ill get on that tomorow, ensuring im not at work, they said i wasn't needed at my last work place, (i work for a Driving Agency so get moved around a lot, so unless they phone in with work ill have the day off and will be able to devote 100% of my attention to the thread and ensure that everything gets covered properly)

BUT, the Germans never had air superiority over Britain, otherwise they would have invaded. The British may have lost a ton of aircraft, but they managed to control the skies over their country. Germans never had AS, and once the Allied Bombing campaign started, the Allies had AS over western Europe as well.

Oh yes, and KC, I'm using a design thats about 40 years ahead of yours, and is designed purely as a fighter, not a multirole craft like the JSF, so don't expect your fighters to own mine, since mine are faster, better armed, and more manuerable. In a one on one fight, mine would win.

Yea dont go 40 years ahead, 10 at the most. Also lets drop WWII, it is just cluttering an already bloated thread.

40 years ahead makes you 2091 which is generaly classed as FT, Maximum ceiling for PMT is 2060, The JSF X 44 is not a multirole, it is solely an Interceptor

X - 44 Interceptor
X - 33 Stealth fighter bomber
X - 22 Figher Bomber
X - 11 Fighter

Well, I suggest not using a designation JSF (joint strike fighter, which denotes a multi-role aircraft). Your level may be 2041, but the Joint Strike Fighter is a 2010 design, and I'm about the ceiling of PMT.

So am I in?

Well, I suggest not using a designation JSF (joint strike fighter, which denotes a multi-role aircraft). Your level may be 2041, but the Joint Strike Fighter is a 2010 design, and I'm about the ceiling of PMT.

Yes it is a 2010 design, which has been modified since then, hence the different singular roles for it, as for the Ceiling PMT Ceiling is 2060, as defined in the NS Definition thread, also I am 2051

Actually, if I am in, then I would rather just go onto the side of qwhoever is doing worse at the moment

Ok, I'm now unofficially involved, although in a limited role, my nation and We Buy It Inc. are still officially netural and are taking no actions against KC, for now.

Kraven could I get a list of overseas territories you own, and any information that can be seen by satelltie, troop strength, position of forces, bases, static defeses, naval forces etc.

I still have that Capability, Air Defenses have been neutralised, but Air Fields have not, I can still get my airforce air bound,

Also im not too happy about you dumping 1000+ air craft on the Concremo capitol, where did they come from? I wouldn't be so bothered if they came from an air craft carrier, but im not sure if you'd deployed one, if so what post so i can confirm it, if they came from your nation or another nation then you will have to RP the time it takes for them to arrive.

If we can iron it out then everything will be super green.

They came from Velkya. I mentioned quite awhile ago that I was sending four divisions of aircraft to Velkyan fields for participation in an upcoming operation.


Sorry but all these mass air strikes are difficult to keep up with, Please make your intentions clearer


Exactly how much clearer can they get? Do you need all caps, in bright bolded neon, THIS AIRSTRIKE IS AT KRAVEN!


No the targets were against the Kraven Homeland, not those of Concremo, i'd edited the post to fit in with the scheme of things


Except that the 1,400 missiles that were launched at Concremo were targetted on air bases, and I mentioned that any air defense radar that turned on near the Concreman capitol got nailed with anti-radiation missiles.

Actually, if I am in, then I would rather just go onto the side of qwhoever is doing worse at the moment

It may be too early to tell, but if Silver is joining then feel free to join Kraven or whoever. Just trying to keep the scales reletively equal.

Edit: Also mini your airfleet is massive. Saying that they are 30 seconds away if pretty unfair. At least tell them it is moving on them, as they would detect it long before it was 30 seconds away. If I missed it though, forgive me.

Dont worry Velya, just climb altitude, consolidate your formation, and get the hell out of there. He must stay spread out, so the smaller the area your force takes up, the less he can engage it with. Also he cant go very high, well he can, but if he does it is a death wish.

Would it be ok if I started off with some aircraft where those of The Infinite Crucible are currently headed?

Would it be ok if I started off with some aircraft where those of The Infinite Crucible are currently headed?

To engage them, sure. The force consists of.

500 bombers
200 Attack aircraft
500 Air superiority Fighter
200 Fighter/Bombers

Edit: Scratch that, you have to deploy to Kraven first.

Ok

It may be too early to tell, but if Silver is joining then feel free to join Kraven or whoever. Just trying to keep the scales reletively equal.

Edit: Also mini your airfleet is massive. Saying that they are 30 seconds away if pretty unfair. At least tell them it is moving on them, as they would detect it long before it was 30 seconds away. If I missed it though, forgive me.

Dont worry Velya, just climb altitude, consolidate your formation, and get the hell out of there. He must stay spread out, so the smaller the area your force takes up, the less he can engage it with. Also he cant go very high, well he can, but if he does it is a death wish.


I told him it was moving on him, he detected me, andthen I was about thirty seconds away from being in range.

I told him it was moving on him, he detected me, andthen I was about thirty seconds away from being in range.

Cool, cool, his tactical mistake then.

Cool, cool, his tactical mistake then.

Exactly, thousands of small rockets, and a few hund much larger missiles are currently closing on his formation... It's fun.

Alright guys two things.

First for Kraven: What exactly is the weather like in Concremo. What about the enviorment? Is it massive depths of ice, like where Otagia made his base, or forests, or a mixture of all of them?

Second for Allies: I must preface this with how secret this is IC so dont change IC plans on it enemies of the ACA. I propose a feint retreat accompanied with a chosen battlefield to defeat Brettons forces. Once you are aware his forces are on route being laying bombs over all the areas you have taken in small amount, but choose a place where you will engage them. Have a short battle than make like you are retreating. If they do not follow, strike again until you can get them to come. Make your retreat through an area incredibly thick ice, like where Otagia has made his base. This will destroy the mobility of the peacemakers, prevent any passage by the partisens, and do... well not much the stahlthorpes. Let me explain.

The thick ice will be easily cracked by the peacemakers. This would slow their speed to a crawl, and prevent them from jumping out of the way of missiles and such. The partisens would simply be unable to make it through the area. With ice over their heads and definetly above their legs, they will neither be able to walk on it or move through it. The stahlthorpes should be fine though. Make sure sections fot he ice are drilled out with explosives. Hopefully they will fall for it, and have the ground erupt around them dealing massive damage. Coupled with the immense confusion of the sudden eruption of the earth around them, a counter attack should score an easy victory. All that would remain to fight would be some "achilles tendon crippled" peacemakers and other scattered forces. That and air support.

Bretton, I have seen you as intelligent and responsible RP'er. Dont make me regret presenting this information in a post rather than TG.


I gotta say, I don't really like how this post is worded. It implies that if he doesn't proceed exactly as you've outlined, you're gonna raise hell.

Night all

I gotta say, I don't really like how this post is worded. It implies that if he doesn't proceed exactly as you've outlined, you're gonna raise hell.

I know I got pretty firm at the end, but I felt that was the best way to make sure the message got through. I would give him the benefit of the doubt even if he used it to make better plans, as I can never truly know his intentions. So I was just being firm to make my opinion known, but I would not say what happened to his forces, I cant do that. Either way, it is a null issue, I recalled the plan as concremo is much warmer than Kraven.

Allright, you so-and-sos want to see some real firepower? Fine!

BTW, as a note, you couldn't really use a satellite laser as a laser designator. The beam would be too diffuse and on top of that it'd be the wrong frequency.

Whoa whoa whoa Axis! The fleet came out of no where. Merely stating we had seen them on radar for hours is not enough. So your saying even though we saw them coming for hours, we did nothing. Well you made two mistakes. A, We would do something, and B, You assumed my actions, almost dictating them. Ignored for the time being.

Whoa whoa whoa Axis! The fleet came out of no where. Merely stating we had seen them on radar for hours is not enough. So your saying even though we saw them coming for hours, we did nothing. Well you made two mistakes. A, We would do something, and B, You assumed my actions, almost dictating them. Ignored for the time being.

Except, you DIDN'T do anything. Nice try. You had plenty of time-- days-- to send something to attack them. Don't even try to pull this.

I didn't assume any actions, other than to redeploy some of my forces to better positions inside Kraven to hinder these constant air raids, launch some ASMs, and send some UAVs to go beat on those cruise missiles.

The entire point of the 8 hours out thread WAS to give you a chance to do something before they got closer. No one did a thing.

Don't get pissed at me due to your own inaction.

Several hundred more Peregrines head out to start potting the cruise missiles while they're still hundreds of miles out-- with just simple cruise missiles, it'd be like a shooting gallery.


Sorry, but Kraven already RPed them hitting.

Outside, a number of trucks began rolling off a freshly-arrived air transport. A flight of MiGs zipped overhead, ensuring air security. Each truck had something on its back. The objects were long, north of 80-meters, and very narrow; they were covered in tarpaulin. The trucks quickly tore across the airbase and into it's largest hangar, where they'd be free from prying eyes above.

Slight problem Bretton. We already destroyed all the Kraven air bases that might have landed at.

And since I'm now royally confused, can someone break down what's happening over in Concremo?

I really don't recall you stating that every last airbase on Kraven's entire continent was utterly destroyed.

I really don't recall you stating that every last airbase on Kraven's entire continent was utterly destroyed.

Heck, he said that he didn't even have any, and that the only ones there were the ones built by allies. Since a large number of missiles were targeted on airbases, those had to have been the ones targeted. And destroyed as it happens.

And given that Kraven is the one who would name his damage, its out of line for us to say it.

Kraven provided me with a landing zone, I assume it was his. Would you expect me to do otherwise?

Except, you DIDN'T do anything. Nice try. You had plenty of time-- days-- to send something to attack them. Don't even try to pull this.

I didn't assume any actions, other than to redeploy some of my forces to better positions inside Kraven to hinder these constant air raids, launch some ASMs, and send some UAVs to go beat on those cruise missiles.

The entire point of the 8 hours out thread WAS to give you a chance to do something before they got closer. No one did a thing.

Don't get pissed at me due to your own inaction.

The miles-wide 3-D formation of gigantic radar blips that has been on everyone's screen for the past few hours has slowly crawled closer... and now it is a stones throw away from Kraven.

So, you assume our fleets do nothing while these blips move towards them?

Are you saying this fleet is just arriving at Kraven, if you are, then I am sorry as I was wrong, but it is hard to figure out what someone is doing when they dont post a lot. I can believe this is what you meant, but it is hard to read someone's mind.

Kraven provided me with a landing zone, I assume it was his. Would you expect me to do otherwise?

Yea just a sort of "lost in translation" event. I think the landing zones were just places to drop guys off, but had no infrastructure to them. So I dont know how well launching anything from them would go.

Details on KoloBac (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9889531&postcount=68)

There's a link to Carfentanil there, too, incase you need details on it. If someone, for some insane reason, decides that this stuff equates to a nuke, I'll happily just shoot his limbs off and turn him into a basket case instead.

Details on KoloBac (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9889531&postcount=68)

There's a link to Carfentanil there, too, incase you need details on it. If someone, for some insane reason, decides that this stuff equates to a nuke, I'll happily just shoot his limbs off and turn him into a basket case instead.

I know this is not a WMD, and merely knocks the target out, but in battle that is the same as killing somoene, well almost. Seems even more effective than most chemical weapons as you need a full suit and being knocked out means someone is going to shoot you while you sleep, but it seems --ok--, albeit a bit cheap, with me, but I dont know about everyone else.

BTW, as a note, you couldn't really use a satellite laser as a laser designator. The beam would be too diffuse and on top of that it'd be the wrong frequency.


Actually, sattelites are one of the best modern submarine detection systems to date, capable of tracking submarines quite easily. So, they would make great laser designators; although they are rather easy to track and rather expensive [which I plan to make a point of very soon, when all of KCs enemies find themselves satteliteless].

Got no objections here. I don't normally use any kind of KO gas in my own forces, though, unless orders are to capture someone for intelligence gathering, and even then sometimes the SF's will go in disguise or other subterfuge.

Sorry, but Kraven already RPed them hitting.

I meant the next volley that someone had launched. If that hit already too, then O_o


So, you assume our fleets do nothing while these blips move towards them?


Well, you DIDN'T do anything.


Are you saying this fleet is just arriving at Kraven, if you are, then I am sorry as I was wrong, but it is hard to figure out what someone is doing when they dont post a lot. I can believe this is what you meant, but it is hard to read someone's mind.


The cargo portions will be landing in about 30 minutes (probably in the next 2-3 posts). The big guys will be beating on your fleets with UAVs and missiles for a little while, but they arn't in gun range yet. The ones that are already IN Kraven (from when I moved some stuff in at the beginning) will be sooner though.

Actually, sattelites are one of the best modern submarine detection systems to date, capable of tracking submarines quite easily. So, they would make great laser designators; although they are rather easy to track and rather expensive [which I plan to make a point of very soon, when all of KCs enemies find themselves satteliteless].

I wont be using it to paint targets... as any "painted" target would be gone long before the missile hits. Being as my network is that strong, though, it counts as a WMD.

Actually, sattelites are one of the best modern submarine detection systems to date, capable of tracking submarines quite easily. So, they would make great laser designators; although they are rather easy to track and rather expensive [which I plan to make a point of very soon, when all of KCs enemies find themselves satteliteless].

The first part of your statement does not square with the second :confused:

I can see how they could find the wake from a periscope easily, but I don't see how they'd find one underwater.

Well, you DIDN'T do anything.


Ok, ok, things are coming together. However, I still have one problem. It seems you posted no "in between" post. Merely launching the ships, then many pages later having them in missile range. This thread is hard enough to keep track of, without having to guess when your ships are in missile range. If you did post an "approach" post, kindly link it, and I will accept the ships.

The first part of your statement does not square with the second :confused:

I can see how they could find the wake from a periscope easily, but I don't see how they'd find one underwater.

What it does is that it detects the submarine by finding the wake of the submarine in general. The wake can't be seen from the surface, but the submarine's displacement does leave a small wake on the surface of the water which is detectable by the sattelite or it tracks heat changes since the movement of submarines does kill thousands of small organisms all the time. Then, it fires a huge blue-green laser, or a lidar beam if you wish, and it pinpoints the submarine and tracks it and relays coordinates below.

Ok, ok, things are coming together. However, I still have one problem. It seems you posted no "in between" post. Merely launching the ships, then many pages later having them in missile range. This thread is hard enough to keep track of, without having to guess when your ships are in missile range. If you did post an "approach" post, kindly link it, and I will accept the ships.

Reference the posts in the previous thread where me and Bretton made noises about sending big chunks of our military to help out. The current thread started after hostilities had commenced.

Reference the posts in the previous thread where me and Bretton made noises about sending big chunks of our military to help out. The current thread started after hostilities had commenced.

So... Let me get this straight... Your units came into radar range, or something along those lines... in another thread... Let me go check this out... Which thread, Axis Nova Launches Pre-Emptive strike?

So in a "dead" thread about this war, you posted your armada enterting radar range or coming close to that relative distance... then 11 pages into this thread they are in firing range. Even if the type of post I am looking for is not there this is still just bad form. I will go check to see if my questions can be answered in that thread. brb

Edit: Did not find anything in the pre-emptive strike thread, checking the initial genocide thread. If you know where this is, please tell me.

Edit2: Nothing there from the looks of it. So, I must ask WHERE have you RP'ed them coming into radar range. I am getting tired to this and you.

I said they were eight hours out as a ballpark figure. They were on radar at that time, figured it would be obvious-- guess I should have specifically said it. I mentioned the radar formation thing in my more recent post because of the little discussion a few pages ago about formations.

Look, will you lay off? It's not like I suddenly had the bloody things appear in gun range, and the AKA's collective carrier groups sure did appear a lot more instantaneously than my stuff, along with all these aircraft and cruise missiles that have more or less been teleporting in and out of Kraven's air defenses regardless of allied forces.

Having you nitpick every little thing is really starting to get annoying. Seriously, like half the posts in this thread are you trying to screw me or Bretton in some way over some tiny nitpick thing. I'm sorry I didn't RP my stuff flying every single bloody mile between my territory and Kraven, because that's obviously the level of detail you require here. :rolleyes:

Bottom line:

-I posted about sending a lot of stuff before, in the original thread where Kraven was attacked
-I gave you guys a chance to respond to the big fleet when it was on it's way
-You didn't
-It's here


While we're pointing fingers here, Dweladelfia Prime needs to deal with the freaking missiles Bretton launched at him pages and pages ago.

I said they were eight hours out as a ballpark figure. They were on radar at that time, figured it would be obvious-- guess I should have specifically said it. I mentioned the radar formation thing in my more recent post because of the little discussion a few pages ago about formations.

Look, will you lay off? It's not like I suddenly had the bloody things appear in gun range, and the AKA's collective carrier groups sure did appear a lot more instantaneously than my stuff, along with all these aircraft and cruise missiles that have more or less been teleporting in and out of Kraven's air defenses regardless of allied forces.

Having you nitpick every little thing is really starting to get annoying.

Bottom line:

-I posted about sending a lot of stuff before, in the original thread where Kraven was attacked
-I gave you guys a chance to respond to the big fleet when it was on it's way
-You didn't
-It's here


While we're pointing fingers here, Dweladelfia Prime needs to deal with the freaking missiles Bretton launched at him pages and pages ago.


While I still think the form is bad, and have not seen the 8 hour post recently, though I remember it, I am going to drop it, as to not cause problems for the RP. If the post is as long ago as I recall, wouldn't your guys already be in postion, and not just showing up? Either way time is dynamic so its not really a strong point to argue against you.

While I cant speak for the rest of the AKA, most of my stuff has been moving about pretty slowly. My navy is not even with the rest of the fleet yet, will most likely be there later tonight. My missile attacks were carried out from far away as to prevent any counter attack. My fighers/bombers are now going to be forced to fly above you airships on approach, and all. As you can see, I am pretty zealous about RP issues, so I try my best to be fair myself.

Also dont think I hate you, as much as it may sound like I do at times, I just get angry fast, then get chill fast.

Also good point about DP, DP should really take some losses.

Can I get a list of nations that are attacking KC?

Can I get a list of nations that are attacking KC?

Seconding this and also asking for a list of nations that are on Kraven's side. As far as I can tell, it's me and Bretton and Kraven against half of II o.@

Seconding this and also asking for a list of nations that are on Kraven's side. As far as I can tell, it's me and Bretton and Kraven against half of II o.@


Well, you, Bretton and KC and myself soon enough; although my help will be rather limited.

Seconding this and also asking for a list of nations that are on Kraven's side. As far as I can tell, it's me and Bretton and Kraven against half of II o.@
YO.

Of course, it doesn't really help that I don't maintain much of a navy, does it...

Well in case anyone is still wondering, I am attacking kraven.

So, CAs entire satellite net is made of two decommisioned satellites?

So, CAs entire satellite net is made of two decommisioned satellites?

There was the whole "Axis Nova and Bretton launch massive ASAT effort" thing earlier.

Speaking of which, Bretton, you've got a TG if you hadn't seen.

There was the whole "Axis Nova and Bretton launch massive ASAT effort" thing earlier.

Speaking of which, Bretton, you've got a TG if you hadn't seen.

Seen and replied.

OK, sack time. :p

As per the usual, Bretton's in charge of my stuff until I get back.

edit: One last thought before I hit the sack; it might be convenient in a war RP in the future to just establish a posting order for people, so that no one gets left behind and everyone gets a chance to have their say in something. There could also be some kind of time limit to prevent one person from holding up everything :p

(I don't want to do that in this, just someting for you guys to think about and comment on)

Kahanistan, you have completley disregarded the Unit of Capitol Police that are conveining on your pilots position.

Kahanistan, you have completley disregarded the Unit of Capitol Police that are conveining on your pilots position.

I think his downed pilots have already been captured. Though I may be thinking of something else.

I think his downed pilots have already been captured. Though I may be thinking of something else.

There was a specific pilot i was going after, the one who'd set up his radio to attract the Capitol Police

So, I seem to be hanging out on a limb, doing absolutely nothing with an entire corps... Where is all the ground forces, huh?

So, I seem to be hanging out on a limb, doing absolutely nothing with an entire corps... Where is all the ground forces, huh?

About to be sunk with the rest of the AKA fleet ;)

About to be sunk with the rest of the AKA fleet ;)

Tht's no fun.

There's also several hundred thousand troops (and their equipment) on the ground already, via drop pods. Mainly Velkyan.

There was a specific pilot i was going after, the one who'd set up his radio to attract the Capitol Police

Beat ya to him. He's stunned and KO'd and on his way back to an Otagian base in one of our T-birds. We'll be interrogating him soon enough.

Oh, and there's troops on the ground? I never saw them come in. I have several legions doing nothing atm.

There's also several hundred thousand troops (and their equipment) on the ground already, via drop pods. Mainly Velkyan.

Link me please, I never noticed that happening...

Beat ya to him. He's stunned and KO'd and on his way back to an Otagian base in one of our T-birds. We'll be interrogating him soon enough.

Oh, and there's troops on the ground? I never saw them come in. I have several legions doing nothing atm.

No i actualy beat you to him, there were Troops already on the ground when your t-birds flew over, you both ignored the fact that they were there

No i actualy beat you to him, there were Troops already on the ground when your t-birds flew over, you both ignored the fact that they were there

I believe the troopps he was referring to are ENEMY troops, the kind we kill, not the kind we work alongside... As in " There's enemies on the ground, when did that happen?!":eek:

No i actualy beat you to him, there were Troops already on the ground when your t-birds flew over, you both ignored the fact that they were there
Ah. Either way, does it really matter much? He's been captured and is being taken back for questioning. You can help, if you want. I have all sorts of techniques I want to try out.

I believe the troopps he was referring to are ENEMY troops, the kind we kill, not the kind we work alongside... As in " There's enemies on the ground, when did that happen?!":eek:


my my my what chaos this has caused, Kahanistans pilots were downed on the Ice, I deployed my Capitol Police, (the Troops on the ground i was refering to)

It doesn't realy matter no, but it looks a bit shit with posts all over and no responses, or recognition, As for the interogation, it would be properform for you to bring them to us for Interrogation and let our Secret police interogate them, you can have people present, but seeing as this is our land we should have jurisdiction and the threat of becoming a slave or one of the Cyberzombie sardaukar will be threat enough for them to spill their guts... :)

my my my what chaos this has caused, Kahanistans pilots were downed on the Ice, I deployed my Capitol Police, (the Troops on the ground i was refering to)

It doesn't realy matter no, but it looks a bit shit with posts all over and no responses, or recognition, As for the interogation, it would be properform for you to bring them to us for Interrogation and let our Secret police interogate them, you can have people present, but seeing as this is our land we should have jurisdiction and the threat of becoming a slave or one of the Cyberzombie sardaukar will be threat enough for them to spill their guts... :)

Oh well, whatever, moving on...

How about replying to me in the IC thread?

Oh well, whatever, moving on...

How about replying to me in the IC thread?

Done and Done, Have fun


Directed towards Velkya:

As Velkyians Ground forces approached the city, Artillery opened fire, Multiple AMN 90, Long Range Concremo Firearms Produced artillery, designed to lob a 180mm shell across ranges of 50+ kms...

HE shells were lobbed across the city limits, the defening roar of over 150 of these brutes firing in staggered patterns to keep the Firing constant....

Spotters using long ranged visual equipment kept giving the Artillery sections information and co-ordinates based on the new location of the Formations movment, updating the Artillery section every so often, ensuring they had new information as soon as possible... where ever the convoy would move, the rain of HE shells would follow...

Until you have responded to this and taken damage, I am Ignoring the damage taken by your Arkbirds that had targeted the Artillery

Kraven, what map are we using?

Kraven, what map are we using?

The one you made for the Broken Dawn thread,

Also, Infinate Crucible, you will have to take losses from the Flak cannons before i take losses from the Bombs, im not allowing you to simply fly over the City or The Nation itself without first having taken damage from the multiple Flak cannons all over the defense line, From the shore line to the City their are flak cannons all over, on top of buildings, built into bunkers, and on the Wall that surrounds the city,

Will people please stop making posts that are so, Dead ended, your planes turn up and drop the bombs in the same posts, giving me no chance to react to your planes arriving before i have to take damage.. Please Stop

Alright, I'm heading right up the middle then to your major city [the black area]. Can someone give me more or less exact numbers of aircraft overhead?

Uh... they are flying at about 55 thousand feet, so I dont know if flak can hit them up that high. You tell me.

They are striking at multiple targets inland, not to far in though, and beach defenses. They are also attacking from the southern part of the nation, so I dont know what defenses you have down there.

Uh... they are flying at about 55 thousand feet, so I dont know if flak can hit them up that high. You tell me.


Depends on the calibre. Some flak can get up to twenty-five thousand meters. Indeed, if a field gun can throw a shell one hundred kilometers horizontally [while at the same time hitting a huge altitude in the arc] they can get to what amounts to around 18 kilometers altitude - it's just a huge [155mm] gun.

Uh... they are flying at about 55 thousand feet, so I dont know if flak can hit them up that high. You tell me.

They are striking at multiple targets inland, not to far in though, and beach defenses. They are also attacking from the southern part of the nation, so I dont know what defenses you have down there.

Well, a 185mm ETC cannon can fire a shell up to 60kms

Im not sure, Macabees the Flak cannons are 120mm, firing your standard Flak shells, ill let you decide on this one

Well, a 185mm ETC cannon can fire a shell up to 60kms

Im not sure, Macabees the Flak cannons are 120mm, firing your standard Flak shells, ill let you decide on this one


Well, once I get back from class I'll put up on Kriegzimmer the description to CAPMES. If the 120mm are using either electromagnetic rifling or an ETC propellant I would say they would be able to reach the stated height, simply because a 155mm conventional, like what I use, can, and a 120mm ETC has the power of a 140mm conventional. I would say that 60% of the rounds are hitting the height required, while the rest are falling short.

Well, once I get back from class I'll put up on Kriegzimmer the description to CAPMES. If the 120mm are using either electromagnetic rifling or an ETC propellant I would say they would be able to reach the stated height, simply because a 155mm conventional, like what I use, can, and a 120mm ETC has the power of a 140mm conventional. I would say that 60% of the rounds are hitting the height required, while the rest are falling short.

The Ones lining the Wall around the city are, the others are standard riflied Flak cannons, relics of the Civil war

I say again...

Will people stop posting Final Actions, As Soon As I sent up my Vtols to deal with Primes Air Craft he dropped the bombs, PLEASE STOP THIS

I could have had the bombs land on the ice sheet, because you have done little RPing to indicate they were actualy over the targets.

I say once more, PLEASE STOP MAKING SUCH FINAL POSTS.

I say again...

Will people stop posting Final Actions, As Soon As I sent up my Vtols to deal with Primes Air Craft he dropped the bombs, PLEASE STOP THIS

I could have had the bombs land on the ice sheet, because you have done little RPing to indicate they were actualy over the targets.

I say once more, PLEASE STOP MAKING SUCH FINAL POSTS.

Hey i said were my bombs were going.

Otagia are you talkin about my planes?

Dweladelfia Prime, how many Blac Knights are there? I'm not posting losses without solid numbers on your units.

Hey i said were my bombs were going.

Exactly, as soon as i turned up you dropped the bombs before you had to take losses. meaning you got to drop a full salvo

EDIT: Further more, Damage taken from the VTOLS?

Its starting to get frustrating, you ignored the missiles fired at you from Bretton and your ignoring damage taken from my Vtol attacks

Exactly, as soon as i turned up you dropped the bombs before you had to take losses. meaning you got to drop a full salvo

Ouch, very well played Kraven!

Ouch, very well played Kraven!

*Bows* i thankyou

*Bows* i thankyou

De Nada. You deserved that one. It was almost as good as my Necron Bomb, or Ping-Pong missiles quotes.

De Nada. You deserved that one. It was almost as good as my Necron Bomb, or Ping-Pong missiles quotes.

hehe, Necron bomb, damn him...

Dweladelfia Prime, how many Blac Knights are there? I'm not posting losses without solid numbers on your units.
I believe he said there were 100 of them.

Dwel: Yes, I was referring to your air force. 40 of your planes have laser-guided AAMs coming at them.

Velyka:

Unfourtunatly for the Kravens, their own formation was hit hard as well, as friendly unguided rockets hit both friend and foe.

this could be classed as god mod, If freindly missiles are to hit my planes then i will decide it not you,

also, you double posted

Velyka:



this could be classed as god mod, If freindly missiles are to hit my planes then i will decide it not you,

also, you double posted

Well, he fired tons of UNGUIDED rockets at my formation, it's enavitable that some of your fighters would be caught in the blast.

Well, he fired tons of UNGUIDED rockets at my formation, it's enavitable that some of your fighters would be caught in the blast.

Merely note the fact OOC and bring it up. Dont say what happens to his guys though.

Well, he fired tons of UNGUIDED rockets at my formation, it's enavitable that some of your fighters would be caught in the blast.

Not really. If you fire rockets from only one arc, there's no chance at all of friendly fire.

My formation was is close combat with Kraven aircraft, not launching missiles from afar.

BTW, Kraven, I'm waiting on the results of the airstrikes on your arty by City 17 and the beach defences on the Concermo coast.

My formation was is close combat with Kraven aircraft, not launching missiles from afar.

BTW, Kraven, I'm waiting on the results of the airstrikes on your arty by City 17 and the beach defences on the Concermo coast.

Im waiting for you to take losses from my Artillery in City 17 firing at your approaching forces, unless i have missed it, if so then sorry...

Also

EVERYONE PLEASE CHECK THIS OUT

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=452914

Just a note Shaz, airspace around kraven is almost completely under out control, as it the sea. So RP getting through, if you were not planning, as it is patrolled and all that good stuff.

Velyka: Sorry, Just checked it out, you edited the post without telling me :P

Losses comming up

Velyka: Sorry, Just checked it out, you edited the post without telling me :P

Losses comming up

Thanks, I'm assuming that's for the all three incidents (including friendly fire).

Fun Fact: Vel-Ky-in (Velkyan) is the pronuciation of one who hails from Velkya (Vel-Ky-A) It's quite a pretty name :p .

Thanks, I'm assuming that's for the all three incidents (including friendly fire).

Fun Fact: Vel-Ky-in (Velkyan) is the pronuciation of one who hails from Velkya (Vel-Ky-A) It's quite a pretty name :p .

If your refering to Octagias Post about the 160 missiles, they were lazer guided and wouldn't hit my freind craft

Also, are there any of those big defense guns on the Concermo coast (the 2400mm ones)?

Also, are there any of those big defense guns on the Concermo coast (the 2400mm ones)?

no, and their 2500mm, Concremo's defenses are in the city

If your refering to Octagias Post about the 160 missiles, they were lazer guided and wouldn't hit my freind craft

I'm talking about MM, he fired a few hundred missiles also fired about 1,000 unguided rockets at the fighters over City 17.

Otagia wasn't engaging me.

He also fired about 1,000 unguided missiles.

Realy? I can't find that reference?

Edited: ^
||
||

Just posting to remind you guys about the metric crapload of antiship missiles me and Bretton have sent your way. :P

Well, depending on my little discussing wit KC over TG take me off the AKA side, I would have done it anyway due to Mac's involvment cause we're both in the IADF.

Realy? I can't find that reference?

5,600 unguided Air to Air rockets, they're much smaller and faster trhan missiles, bu more prone to missing.

Dweladelfia Prime, how many Blac Knights are there? I'm not posting losses without solid numbers on your units.

100 black knights

100 Red sky

50 B-52s

100 F-99

Exactly, as soon as i turned up you dropped the bombs before you had to take losses. meaning you got to drop a full salvo

EDIT: Further more, Damage taken from the VTOLS?

Its starting to get frustrating, you ignored the missiles fired at you from Bretton and your ignoring damage taken from my Vtol attacks

I never saw him post that.

I never saw him post that.

He did, dont know the page, but I think it was 1250 missiles or maybe 1750 fired at your fleet in the area.

And still waiting for the missile attacks from me.

Ok, what the hell is that, 100 fighters avoid not one but two waves of 141 missiles, and all of my cannon fire? They don't even have active anti-missile systems, so they have to depend on avoidance, which isn't likely to save them all, hell, it's garaunteed to take out at least one. You've been doing this all along, making attacks and ignoring responses, or refusing to take losses, IGNORED until this is rectified.

Dwel you have been a bit... erhm... lax in your responses. I know it isn't always fun to take losses, but try to make it epic and gory and cool and... and... all that good stuff. You get the picture.

Ok, what the hell is that, 100 fighters avoid not one but two waves of 141 missiles, and all of my cannon fire? They don't even have active anti-missile systems, so they have to depend on avoidance, which isn't likely to save them all, hell, it's garaunteed to take out at least one. You've been doing this all along, making attacks and ignoring responses, or refusing to take losses, IGNORED until this is rectified.
Agreed. F-22s just don't dodge advanced GAAMs, nor concentrated AA fire, no matter how good their pilots are.

Bretton is a little slow on the uptake... Heh. Although that was a pretty good line, Ignored like a Jehovahs Witness at my front door, I love it...

Hmm wish I had RP'ed my guys escaping earlier, but I waiting on a TG. Whatever, going to have to take some heavy losses from Brettons attack, what exactly are you throwing at me?

Edit: Lol at the jehovas witness joke

But I dont think you could attack me and Dwel, as we are opposite sides of the country. So you may have to pick one of us to hit.

Also, I dont know if any peacemakers were in the southern area, but if they were, they prob have some penetrator cluster bombs coming towards them. Will explain soon, but need to go.

I'm going to be using a bit of fluid time, so my transports and escort ships will be arriving inside Kraven waters as soon as he acknowledges my last post.

Hmm wish I had RP'ed my guys escaping earlier, but I waiting on a TG. Whatever, going to have to take some heavy losses from Brettons attack, what exactly are you throwing at me?

Edit: Lol at the jehovas witness joke

But I dont think you could attack me and Dwel, as we are opposite sides of the country. So you may have to pick one of us to hit.

Also, I dont know if any peacemakers were in the southern area, but if they were, they prob have some penetrator cluster bombs coming towards them. Will explain soon, but need to go.

S'like so:

Bombers drop their drones, which accelerate to Mach 10 and indepdently attack your air units.

Bombers themselves then change course and make for Dweladelfia's air fleet, where they will fire their own missiles at him.

Eh, yea, for my own supply convoys, if you guys don't plan to attack them assume they're making drops every three to five days, dropping things on the ice caps, while Kraven trucks and defensive networks pick them up and tow them to respective resistance centers.

I'm still waiting on Dwel to fix his post... And likely will be waiting till tomorrow... GRR!!!!!! MIEHM SMASH!!!

Eh, yea, for my own supply convoys, if you guys don't plan to attack them assume they're making drops every three to five days, dropping things on the ice caps, while Kraven trucks and defensive networks pick them up and tow them to respective resistance centers.

My fleet was coming up on them, they could probably make it to the ice, but leaving may be another story. Also my fleet is not actual going to pursue them into coastal gun range. Also Bretton give me time to respond to the launch of the drones, busy right now.

I'm still waiting on Dwel to fix his post... And likely will be waiting till tomorrow... GRR!!!!!! MIEHM SMASH!!!

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/7482/emothellnaw1ev.gif

My fleet was coming up on them, they could probably make it to the ice, but leaving may be another story. Also my fleet is not actual going to pursue them into coastal gun range. Also Bretton give me time to respond to the launch of the drones, busy right now.


Oh, alright, I'll reply to that soon.

Still waiting for Kraven to respond so we can have a lovely chat with our prisoners. I'm thinking group hugs are in order.

What the heck are you talkin about?

Allright.

You get ONE MORE FSCKING CHANCE to figure this out.

I sent ONE THOUSAND, FIVE HUNDRED AND THREE hypersonic top-attack antishipping missiles against your fleet on PAGE FOUR.

If this still isn't making sense to you, you've been Jehova's Witness'ed. Good day.

OOC:

-_______________-

I explained this pages... and pages.... and pages ago.

For your perusal:

Breakdown of attack (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9878528&postcount=188)

The actual IC attack (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9874199&postcount=51)

That was posted in the middle of PAGE 4. x_x Axis Nova and I have been whining about this for pages and pages; if you didn't see it the first time, maybe you should have gone looking through the backlogged posts...?

I apologize for the OOC post in the IC thread, but I'm not sure this guy will ever see it otherwise...


What the heck are you talkin about?

*cries*

Sorry guys just been gone for awhile didnt know who was shootin at who I said my fighters were shot down.

Alright, so two things. First kraven, I dont know if you have taken losses for my missile strike or my bombing runs yet, but if not please do. Let me explain my bombing run in more detail.

The bombers dropped multiple forms of munitions depending on their targets. A great deal of the bombs were, in fact bomblets though. This is for two reasons. A: It helps them get passed anti missiles systems and B: With the proper explosive even a bomblet can penetrate through a good deal of armor. Still their were some conventional bombs and missiles used, but let me explain the bomblets.

After the bombs are dropped, while still at very high altitude, the bombs break up into the bomblets. Normally this would cause a massive spread of munitions, but each bomb's bomblets are "tied" into a network of magnets. Magnets on each bomblet keep it in close proximity to other, but are not so strong tht they are pulled together. The magnets themselves are dynamic, changing force to ensure that a cluster does not collapse onto itself or fall to pieces. In the center of the cluster and at its perimeter there are small guided munitions, these contain no warheads, but make sure the cluster hits its target. There are three types of bomblets dropped, anti infantry, anti road and runway, and anti armor. The anti infantry ones are pretty self explanitory, and the runway ones are designed to penetrate through concrete and explode below its surface. Now the unique ones are the SEFOP rounds.

SEFOP is short for self forging projectiles. These work in similar ways to HEAT rounds, but are immune to regular anti HEAT armor, such as ERA or electro reactive armor. As a solid slug is formed on impact, and fired out at about 8 kilometers per hour. Its basically like getting hit with a KE rounds from an inch off your armor that is moving at several miles per second. Needless to say the damage and penetration is impressive. Most can penetrate about twenty feet of armor, but this is all reletive. It will be far less on a peacemaker, but far more on regular earth. So if you had anything around that area, please take some losses. They would have targeted anything that looked nice and tasty. This includes, roads, tanks, infantry, trenches, peacemakers or whatever. On a peacemaker, it may have had three or four waves of armor piercing bomblets coming towards it, where as a squad of CP would have a single anti infantry barrage.

Also targetting. The majority of the bombs and what not are targetted via laser or beam tracing technology. However, for more evasive targets, once again the peacemaker is a case in point (nothin personal but they can do so much that they are fit for a lot of examples) they would be targeted via radiation trackers. A number of support planes in the armada and a few bombers themselves could irradiate a tiny portion of eart, metal, whatever from multiple miles away via a devise similar to a laser, but it does not fire photons, but radioactive particles. The munitions would then home in on this instead of a laser if told to do so.

I assume that since I was out of the loop and trying to catch up reading the threads that I have not been attacked invaded and probably forgotten in this conflict as you nations are now in a peace talk? Tell me anything I need to know unless I dont need to know anything...

Normally this would cause a massive spread of munitions, but each bomb's bomblets are "tied" into a network of magnets. Magnets on each bomblet keep it in close proximity to other, but are not so strong tht they are pulled together. The magnets themselves are dynamic, changing force to ensure that a cluster does not collapse onto itself or fall to pieces.


How exactly does this work? I can't think of any way it would without just yanking all the bomblets into a solid cluster.


In the center of the cluster and at its perimeter there are small guided munitions, these contain no warheads, but make sure the cluster hits its target. There are three types of bomblets dropped, anti infantry, anti road and runway, and anti armor.


Note previous statement. Bomblets are not terribly aerodynamic and the system you described above would be even less so. How could you be guiding them?



SEFOP is short for self forging projectiles. These work in similar ways to HEAT rounds, but are immune to regular anti HEAT armor, such as ERA or electro reactive armor.


No, they arn't. Self-forging projectiles do the same type of damage as a HEAT round, they just come from above in this case. Since they can't penetrate faster than an electric circuit can be completed, they're still affected by it.

The reason they're more effective against tanks is because most tanks have thinner armor on top.

Note that the Peacemaker is heavily armored all over and thus does not share this disadvantage.


As a solid slug is formed on impact, and fired out at about 8 kilometers per hour.

um


Its basically like getting hit with a KE rounds from an inch off your armor that is moving at several miles per second. Needless to say the damage and penetration is impressive.


No, it's just like that of a normal HEAT round, just from above.


Most can penetrate about twenty feet of armor, but this is all reletive. It will be far less on a peacemaker, but far more on regular earth.


Twenty feet of what kind of armor? Paper? Steel? Chobham? Stats please.



Also targetting. The majority of the bombs and what not are targetted via laser or beam tracing technology. However, for more evasive targets, once again the peacemaker is a case in point (nothin personal but they can do so much that they are fit for a lot of examples) they would be targeted via radiation trackers. A number of support planes in the armada and a few bombers themselves could irradiate a tiny portion of eart, metal, whatever from multiple miles away via a devise similar to a laser, but it does not fire photons, but radioactive particles.


I'll want to see detailed explanation of how this is possible.


The munitions would then home in on this instead of a laser if told to do so.

You do realize that background radiation from such things as the ground, the Sun, and just the air they're passing through would tend to drown out a slightly radioactive chunk of metal, right?

Well, a HEAT warhead moving at 4-5 kilometers per second, not per hour, is not to be underestimated either, and there will some form of kinetic damage, although not as much as a kinetic penetrator would give; but when something hits something else there's always kinetic energy, and it's especially high at those velocities [although it's not as much as a kinetic penetrator].

How exactly does this work? I can't think of any way it would without just yanking all the bomblets into a solid cluster.

Electric magnets which can self limit their attractive power. The distance between the bomblets is monitered by small computers, or a calculation bomblet, and the adjustments are made so they stay apart. Not a few will undoubtedly collide or be expelled, but the vast majority are kept in formation.

Note previous statement. Bomblets are not terribly aerodynamic and the system you described above would be even less so. How could you be guiding them?

The guide bomblets, which are more akin to missiles, are linked intot he same magnetic web. They trace in on the target, and as they move they force the magnetic web over, guiding the rest of it in.

No, they arn't. Self-forging projectiles do the same type of damage as a HEAT round, they just come from above in this case. Since they can't penetrate faster than an electric circuit can be completed, they're still affected by it.

The reason they're more effective against tanks is because most tanks have thinner armor on top.

Note that the Peacemaker is heavily armored all over and thus does not share this disadvantage.


http://www.answers.com/topic/high-explosive-anti-tank

Go down to the bottom and read a bit on SEFOP, it clearly states it is immune to reactive armor.

No, it's just like that of a normal HEAT round, just from above.

See previous answer. They are very different beasts.

Twenty feet of what kind of armor? Paper? Steel? Chobham? Stats please.

Most HEAT or variations of that, weaponry of today has a 150% penetration capability, but some go as high as 700%. That means for every inch or foot the warhead is long, it penetrates that much more. Now in my designs, these bomblets are not round, rather more along the linges of spike to sort. They are about a foot long. So with current technology that would lead to seven feet of penetration for the best warheads. Now this is fifty years in the future and one can only assume the technology gets better so it achieves 2000% penetration. Now this is through decently reinforced armor. I dont need an exact metal and neither do you. If you know your tank has great armor bump it down to ten feet, or amazing armor down to five. Five for a peacemaker, maybe even less though, up to Bretton.

I'll want to see detailed explanation of how this is possible.

With current technology scientists can fire numerous forms of particles, photons being the most common, better known as a laser. Currently if they had a well equiped lab they could most likely fire any form of particle, even radioactive ones. It is safe to assume in fifty years that this will have advanced enough to make it a viable form of targetting, but it requires its own plane to target. I cant explain in depth how all this technology works, I dont think many top of the line scientists can. Can Brettons explain how machinery is able to make use of a spider brain, I dont think so, but it is cool and creative so it can stay around. Can you explain how something with armor superior to that of a MBT stays in the air?

You do realize that background radiation from such things as the ground, the Sun, and just the air they're passing through would tend to drown out a slightly radioactive chunk of metal, right?

Well its a good thing the dot is highly irradiated, and not slightly. For example a person hit with the beam would probably be burned and get cancer later in life, but its not economical as a weapon.

Can Brettons explain how machinery is able to make use of a spider brain, I dont think so, but it is cool and creative so it can stay around.

Actually, modern technology has done something similar with a rat brain, which flew an F-16 in a simulator. The spider bit wouldn't be far removed from that.

How exactly does this work? I can't think of any way it would without just yanking all the bomblets into a solid cluster.

Electric magnets which can self limit their attractive power. The distance between the bomblets is monitered by small computers, or a calculation bomblet, and the adjustments are made so they stay apart. Not a few will undoubtedly collide or be expelled, but the vast majority are kept in formation.


I still don't see how they could do this and still be strong enough to overcome air resistance.


The guide bomblets, which are more akin to missiles, are linked intot he same magnetic web. They trace in on the target, and as they move they force the magnetic web over, guiding the rest of it in.


How does this compensate for wind resistance sending it flying? Especially when fired out of a bomb, the trajectory's effect will be limited.


http://www.answers.com/topic/high-explosive-anti-tank

Go down to the bottom and read a bit on SEFOP, it clearly states it is immune to reactive armor.


Normal reactive armor that relies on explosive blocks exploding outwards, yes. But electric reactive armor is a completely different beast-- it works by having a set of metal plates in the armor with a lot of electricity running through them. When a conductive substance penetrates the outer armor, it completes a circuit in the plates and the offending intruder is instantly vaporized.

Given that the version tested by the Brits on an M113 stopped RPG-7 warheads and that the one used by Bretton is powered by the Peacemaker's fusion reactors, in this case it would be facing a tremendously more powerful charge.


Now this is fifty years in the future and one can only assume the technology gets better so it achieves 2000% penetration. Now this is through decently reinforced armor.


The armor on a Peacemaker is a bit more than decently reinforced...



With current technology scientists can fire numerous forms of particles, photons being the most common, better known as a laser. Currently if they had a well equiped lab they could most likely fire any form of particle, even radioactive ones.


Note that lasers, x-ray lasers, and gamma ray lasers share a common quality: all the particles used are the SAME. As not every form of particle can be generated easily this limites what you could use a bit, and note that the power requirements for X-ray lasers and gamma ray lasers are incredible.


Well its a good thing the dot is highly irradiated, and not slightly. For example a person hit with the beam would probably be burned and get cancer later in life, but its not economical as a weapon.

Doesn't work like that. Radiation is measured by amount, not intensity-- and the only amount high enough to cause intensities detectable miles away would be a nuclear meltdown. Most radiation is not particularly easy to detect unless you're very close.

Why not just use a laser targeter? I'd be willing to accept that and it's far more believable.

As for the spider-brains, Otagia answered that below. :)

(it would theoretically be EASIER with a spider, because they have simpler neurosystems...)

I still don't see how they could do this and still be strong enough to overcome air resistance.

If they calculate distances increasing between bomblets due to whatever reason, we will take air resistance as one, the magnets increase strength until they are drawn back into a cohesive states.

How does this compensate for wind resistance sending it flying? Especially when fired out of a bomb, the trajectory's effect will be limited.

The guide missiles have a small engine which allows them to move mis air, so as to steer the bomblets. Now a few will fall prey to wind resistance, but not all as the magnets increase strenght as wind resistance increases. As it has a ton of time in air, it can make a great deal of course corrections. Let me paint a picture. There is a cluster of bomblets, more akin to spikes. At the center and spread out among them there are numerous small missiles which are able to steer the rest of the bomblet horde due to the fact they are part of the magnetic web. They have airbrakes and all that good stuff so they dont fly out of the web and scatter the bomblets.

Normal reactive armor that relies on explosive blocks exploding outwards, yes. But electric reactive armor is a completely different beast-- it works by having a set of metal plates in the armor with a lot of electricity running through them. When a conductive substance penetrates the outer armor, it completes a circuit in the plates and the offending intruder is instantly vaporized.

Given that the version tested by the Brits on an M113 stopped RPG-7 warheads and that the one used by Bretton is powered by the Peacemaker's fusion reactors, in this case it would be facing a tremendously more powerful charge.

Yes, but no. For all intents and purposes the slug is like a KE projectile. It is solid, and not a liquid. The only difference is that it is "fired" from about a cm or whatever away from the armor. Bretton has stated that those systems do not work on KE projectiles, therefore do not work on SEFOP rounds.


The armor on a Peacemaker is a bit more than decently reinforced...

Yes, that is why I said instead of twenty feet, it will probably only penetrate five. Look man, do you even read my stuff? How do you have the audacity to question me, when in your questions your blaten ignorance to what I have said is displayed like a new puppy in a pet store?

Note that lasers, x-ray lasers, and gamma ray lasers share a common quality: all the particles used are the SAME. As not every form of particle can be generated easily this limites what you could use a bit, and note that the power requirements for X-ray lasers and gamma ray lasers are incredible.

Well that is why I have the targeters located on planes solely devoted to firing the beam of radiation. It was not super clear, but I did state it.

Doesn't work like that. Radiation is measured by amount, not intensity-- and the only amount high enough to cause intensities detectable miles away would be a nuclear meltdown. Most radiation is not particularly easy to detect unless you're very close.

Well due to the fact that the amount of radiation in the small dot is extremely high, it would stand out.

Why not just use a laser targeter? I'd be willing to accept that and it's far more believable.

I could always use beam following technology which uses a laser. Instead of following the dot, however, it follows the entire beam. So if you are dead set on ignoring PMT technology in a PMT RP I can just use that.

Actually, modern technology has done something similar with a rat brain, which flew an F-16 in a simulator. The spider bit wouldn't be far removed from that.

Really? Cool! Still there are numerous aspects of technology we cant explain in detail. So Axis can you tell me how your airships have armor thicker than that of a MBT, by a lot, and can still fly? Or how about how you built that station on the asteroid. Can you break down every system on that structure? If you cant, by your logic I am forced to ignore it.

Edit: And Axis, for someone who said they were tired of nit picking everything, which I respected, and have yet to bring up the issues I have had with you since then and had from before, you sure are making a big deal out of this. Ever hear of practicing what you preach?

Sheesh, whatever happened to roleplay? Arguing about technology isn't going to get anyone anywhere.

Sheesh, whatever happened to roleplay? Arguing about technology isn't going to get anyone anywhere.

Hmm... its probably my fault, as I was the first to bring it up. So I deserve this, but you are right.

Yes, but no. For all intents and purposes the slug is like a KE projectile. It is solid, and not a liquid. The only difference is that it is "fired" from about a cm or whatever away from the armor. Bretton has stated that those systems do not work on KE projectiles, therefore do not work on SEFOP rounds.



Let me correct some misconceptions here:

1. Self Forging rounds impact in a liquid state, and are then forced by pressure to become solid and penetrate the armort of whatever it is you're shooting at.

2. KEWs are nothing like a Self Forging round, KEWs are, for one, much larger, and for two, release their energy in an explosion, not in a single shell, bolt, slug, what have ye.

3. Electronic Reactive armors are designed with Self Forging rounds in mind, since they are immune to most other rective armors.

ARE WE CLEAR ON THIS?!

Sheesh, whatever happened to roleplay? Arguing about technology isn't going to get anyone anywhere.

I shot it and buried it in the backyard, along with etiquite, politeness, and the ignore cannon.

Sheesh, whatever happened to roleplay? Arguing about technology isn't going to get anyone anywhere.

Sorry. I guess arguing over a GUIDANCE system is a bit picky of me. :p

Infinite Crucible: Just state the munitions used are very heavy and expensive (since each one fires presumably multiple clusters of thingies and also has this computer and magnets and an engine in it) and I'll accept it, though I think the whole magnet thing is a bit iffy still :p

Sorry. I guess arguing over a GUIDANCE system is a bit picky of me. :p

Infinite Crucible: Just state the munitions used are very heavy and expensive (since each one fires presumably multiple clusters of thingies and also has this computer and magnets and an engine in it) and I'll accept it, though I think the whole magnet thing is a bit iffy still :p

I will not only assume they are heavy and expensive, but due to the extensive electronics they are less destructive than their typical counterparts.

Let me correct some misconceptions here:

1. Self Forging rounds impact in a liquid state, and are then forced by pressure to become solid and penetrate the armort of whatever it is you're shooting at.

2. KEWs are nothing like a Self Forging round, KEWs are, for one, much larger, and for two, release their energy in an explosion, not in a single shell, bolt, slug, what have ye.

3. Electronic Reactive armors are designed with Self Forging rounds in mind, since they are immune to most other rective armors.

ARE WE CLEAR ON THIS?!

I have nothing that proves this wrong, but nothing that proves it correct... so I will assume it is correct. I was not aware eletronic armor was designed with this in mind. Hmm... should have just used tandem HEAT weapons instead. Whatever, next bombing run.

I will not only assume they are heavy and expensive, but due to the extensive electronics they are less destructive than their typical counterparts.

Let me correct some misconceptions here:

1. Self Forging rounds impact in a liquid state, and are then forced by pressure to become solid and penetrate the armort of whatever it is you're shooting at.

2. KEWs are nothing like a Self Forging round, KEWs are, for one, much larger, and for two, release their energy in an explosion, not in a single shell, bolt, slug, what have ye.

3. Electronic Reactive armors are designed with Self Forging rounds in mind, since they are immune to most other rective armors.

ARE WE CLEAR ON THIS?!

I have nothing that proves this wrong, but nothing that proves it correct... so I will assume it is correct. I was not aware eletronic armor was designed with this in mind. Hmm... should have just used tandem HEAT weapons instead. Whatever, next bombing run.


You learn strange things when you study military hardware alot... I'm not sure exactly where I learned that one, but I remember seeing it, maybe on History Channel? Hmm, now I'm gonna be trying to figure out where I learned that for the rest of the day... Grr.

Actually, now that I think about it, some HEAT rounds are designed to defeat conventional reactive armors, they use a lance-like tip to set off the conventional explosives, then the main round hits, un-impaired by the reactivve armor.

Also Automagfreek, what Wyatt said was a shameless plug and attempt to maybe start a character RP with Azrael heading into the northlands, which are quite brutal. You dont always get to RP with on of the most respected RP'ers on NS, so I figured I would see if you were interested in anything else.

Actually, now that I think about it, some HEAT rounds are designed to defeat conventional reactive armors, they use a lance-like tip to set off the conventional explosives, then the main round hits, un-impaired by the reactivve armor.

Yea that is similar to a tandem HEAT weapon, or it may be another form of it. Tandem weapons fire a very small HEAT weapon right before firing a massive one. The effect is the defenses in that area are taken out with the first bit of molten copper and then the larger one can get through. They sound very similar, but would be very expensive due to the electronics involved.

Ummm, KE penetrators don't work based on explosions,not by the least bit. The KE slug, whether made out of DU or tungsten, is in a encasement which breaks apart in flight, this leaves a single rod to hit the tank. What it does it that it uses pure force to penetrate through the armor of a tank. Let's take the Silver Bullet for example. At 7.2kg, moving at what it the Abrams fires it at, which is ca. 1700 m/s, it would hit with the force of 12,240 Newtons. Now, with that force and the density of the material the slug can either penetrate, or just penetrade by a little. But there is no actual explosion.

Ummm, KE penetrators don't work based on explosions,not by the least bit. The KE slug, whether made out of DU or tungsten, is in a encasement which breaks apart in flight, this leaves a single rod to hit the tank. What it does it that it uses pure force to penetrate through the armor of a tank. Let's take the Silver Bullet for example. At 7.2kg, moving at what it the Abrams fires it at, which is ca. 1700 m/s, it would hit with the force of 12,240 Newtons. Now, with that force and the density of the material the slug can either penetrate, or just penetrade by a little. But there is no actual explosion.

That's different from a KEW, and, if you hit something with enough kinetic energy, you will get an explosion, no matter what you're shooting. That's the principle my Grav-Guns are based off in FT, 3mm darts, that hit at such great velocity that they create a Kinetic Eneregy release on impact, which propogates as an explosion. By your definition a .308 rifle bullet is a KE penetrator.

Remember, if you're going to use semi-FT lingo, know what you're talking about. The proper definition of a Kinetic Energy Weapon is a device that attains such great velocity(generally agreed to be around .3-.4c) that it releases all of its energy as an explosion on impact, all other weapons are just projectiles. We've had to make this distinction in FT, because KEWs get used alot more. The only true analogue to a KEW that exists in PMT is either a Sastelite drop, or a Rod of God.

That's different from a KEW, and, if you hit something with enough kinetic energy, you will get an explosion, no matter what you're shooting. That's the principle my Grav-Guns are based off in FT, 3mm darts, that hit at such great velocity that they create a Kinetic Eneregy release on impact, which propogates as an explosion. By your definition a .308 rifle bullet is a KE penetrator.


No, I'll quote the entire discussio I had with Otagia on the NS Draftroom; this is a misconceptio on what kinetic energy is. If a car hits another car there is no resulting explosion unless a piece of metal scrapes another piece of metal, sparking a fire in the gas chamber. If that doesn't happen there will be no explosion. The explosion and the kinetic energy are two seperate variables. The explosion in a tank is when that KE weapon hits the ammunition storage dump, or the autoloader, sparking a fire with one of the HE shells, which DOES have an explosive.

Now the quotes.


Immune? Hah! Did you consider sending waves of much cheaper tanks at it? Massed HEAPFSDS fire kills anything.



High Explosive Armor Piercing Fin Stabilized Discarding Sabot. Would adding mass reactive on there help? Or was the HE just unneccessary?



I just don't understand how you can have a high explosive sabot round, as it would go against the concept of the sabot. You can't put a high explosive within a tungsten/titanium/depleted uranium rod.



Well, can't is a bit of a strong word. You can core out a penetrator and fill it with explosives, it just reduces the mass some, thus reducing the penetrating power slightly. Still, if it DOES penetrate, you get the added advantage of a large explosion inside of the targets armor.



No, it probably won't penetrate. If you core it out to put high explosivs it'll lose most of the mass that gives it's strength. In fact, when you hit the armor of the tank this round would most likely shatter, the high explosive would do absolutely nothing to the tank, and you're left with a big waste of money. It is absolutely necessarry to have the full penetrator; that's its strength. We'll run the basic equation:

7.2kg [full penetration] x 1,500 meters per second = 10,800N

You take out the core you lose around 4 kilos, making this a 3.2kg penetrator that would render you a force of 4,800N. Understandably, you've lost a lot. You have the added problem that you've made the penetrator A LOT more brittle, so that force is offset by the fact that the penetrator would shatter.



Hrm... trying to think of a way around that... Maybe core it only half way down, and use a honeycomb structure to add strength? And I don't suppose there are any absurdly high density explosives around, are there...

Or it could just be a failed concept.



Well, regardless of what you do, by taking out an inner chunk of the penetrator you're going to make it more brittle, which will mean it'll shatter. Nonetheless, why do you want an HE warhead anyways? The reason they came out with HEAT is because HE tank warheads were rendered useless by the appearance of armor thicker than that introduced during the First World War. Well, now that I think of it it was the Germans who came out with the first shaped tank round, which I guess is a type of HEAT round, and that's what revolutionized their tank guns.

When it comes to KEW in space, the only two equations that apply are:

Δxa = a R^2 / v^2

(hit) = r^2 / (Δxa)^2


None of that deals with an explosive.

Also Automagfreek, what Wyatt said was a shameless plug and attempt to maybe start a character RP with Azrael heading into the northlands, which are quite brutal. You dont always get to RP with on of the most respected RP'ers on NS, so I figured I would see if you were interested in anything else.


Sure, I'm sure we can work something out.

No, I'll quote the entire discussio I had with Otagia on the NS Draftroom; this is a misconceptio on what kinetic energy is. If a car hits another car there is no resulting explosion unless a piece of metal scrapes another piece of metal, sparking a fire in the gas chamber. If that doesn't happen there will be no explosion. The explosion and the kinetic energy are two seperate variables. The explosion in a tank is when that KE weapon hits the ammunition storage dump, or the autoloader, sparking a fire with one of the HE shells, which DOES have an explosive.

Now the quotes.

That's because the velocities involved are insufficient for a Kinetic Energy Release, KEWs are like dropping extremely dense, fast moving chunks or rock on someones head. A DU Penetrator is not, in any way shape or form a KEW. It is only a penetrator, it is not based on Kinetic Energy Release, which is the entire reason for having KEWs. Ask almost any FT RPer and they will tell you the exact same thing I have.

Here, look at it this way, what happens when an unstoppable force hits an immovable object?

"Yeah, they won't be able to track this.

Yes they will. Counter-battery radar will pick it up, and can deduce the location of the gun firing it.

You fail "Railguns 101" or something? The projectile moves too quickly, makes a virtually negligible radar signature, and leaves no exhaust to trace. It's one of the tenements of the DD(X) project, y'know.

I think you're just being bitter now.

CA, I stated this on the other board, and I'm re-stating it here...

Even if Kraven hadn't booted you out (meaning anything you do in this RP is invisible as far as I'm concerned), deploying an entirely new missile you just designed now is godmodding.

You fail "Railguns 101" or something? The projectile moves too quickly, makes a virtually negligible radar signature, and leaves no exhaust to trace. It's one of the tenements of the DD(X) project, y'know.

I think you're just being bitter now.

Maybe in FT you could trace a railgun, but I dont see it happening in PMT. However, the gun does let off a big thermal spike, so if you have anything that would see that you could find it.

You fail "Railguns 101" or something? The projectile moves too quickly, makes a virtually negligible radar signature, and leaves no exhaust to trace. It's one of the tenements of the DD(X) project, y'know.

I think you're just being bitter now.

They don't offer Railguns 101 here. How does simply being a railgun round make it have a negligible radar signature? And it's going to have its speed limited by the need to come back down again, which will make it trackable.

Maybe in FT you could trace a railgun, but I dont see it happening in PMT. However, the gun does let off a big thermal spike, so if you have anything that would see that you could find it.

Even as FT me I can't trace the track of a railgun, I can pinpoint who fired it by the energy and thermal spike, but tracing it, other than by where it hit, is pretty difficult.

CA, I stated this on the other board, and I'm re-stating it here...

Even if Kraven hadn't booted you out (meaning anything you do in this RP is invisible as far as I'm concerned), deploying an entirely new missile you just designed now is godmodding.

It's not entirely new. It's based off modifying a Russian AAM, and we use the Imitoran manufacturing centers that we have access to to quickly make a ton of them.

They don't offer Railguns 101 here. How does simply being a railgun round make it have a negligible radar signature? And it's going to have its speed limited by the need to come back down again, which will make it trackable.

Simple, it moves so fast that it outruns the processing capacity of whatever is detecting the RADAR returns.

Second, if it's a railgun, it really shouldn't be coming back down at all.

Side Note for AN: My armors and most of my Shields are up in my tech thread.

It is my opinion that a railgun round is TRACKABLE, but due to the extremely short time it takes to reach the target, it's unlikely anything can be done about it while it's in flight unless you're lucky to have a fully powered up laser aimed in the exact right direction that's AI directed.

Simple, it moves so fast that it outruns the processing capacity of whatever is detecting the RADAR returns.

Second, if it's a railgun, it really shouldn't be coming back down at all.

It is coming back down. He's using the big giant railgun that whacked satellites earlier as a giant artillery piece.

They don't offer Railguns 101 here. How does simply being a railgun round make it have a negligible radar signature? And it's going to have its speed limited by the need to come back down again, which will make it trackable.

Lemme explain. The slugs from this supergun I've built are moving at an excess of 14,000 meters-per-second. Instead of using this speed to perforate satellites, I'm using it to fire a slug over the horizon.

The only reason why the slug needs to curve at all is to match the curvature of the Earth. It's not like I'm firing this on a mortar-like trajectory into the high atmosphere or anything.

As for it being difficult to intercept on radar, because it has no propellant and because it carries no warhead, the slug itself is a very narrow, very skinny object. Tracing an 88cm railway gun shell would be cake for modern radar, due to its size and (comparitively) slow speed, but for a smaller, infinitely faster slug from a railgun, you'll have... maybe a second of it on radar before you're struck.

Lemme explain. The slugs from this supergun I've built are moving at an excess of 14,000 meters-per-second. Instead of using this speed to perforate satellites, I'm using it to fire a slug over the horizon.

The only reason why the slug needs to curve at all is to match the curvature of the Earth. It's not like I'm firing this on a mortar-like trajectory into the high atmosphere or anything.

Wouldn't that still put it on escape velocity and hence not hit Concremo?


As for it being difficult to intercept on radar, because it has no propellant and because it carries no warhead, the slug itself is a very narrow, very skinny object. Tracing an 88cm railway gun shell would be cake for modern radar, due to its size and (comparitively) slow speed, but for a smaller, infinitely faster slug from a railgun, you'll have... maybe a second of it on radar before you're struck.

But that should be enough time to determine later the path, and hence the origin, of the object. I'm not saying anything about intercepting the round, but rather determining where it came from (and a possible airstrike later).

Allright, I give up. I can only attempt to get through so much of a tech-barrier.

Its a shame, now that I think about it. I am equally to blame as everyone else in this RP. So many cool elements have been dropped because of tech issues. In the future I am going to work to use my tech not as a military advantage, but as a spice for the story, and to not question tech that makes the RP more interesting. It will take me a while, as I have to come to terms with "losing" more than I have as of yet, but I hope one day tech will be part of the story, and not so much the game plan.

Its a shame, now that I think about it. I am equally to blame as everyone else in this RP. So many cool elements have been dropped because of tech issues. In the future I am going to work to use my tech not as a military advantage, but as a spice for the story, and to not question tech that makes the RP more interesting. It will take me a while, as I have to come to terms with "losing" more than I have as of yet, but I hope one day tech will be part of the story, and not so much the game plan.

I'm FT, I can't help it... Although we get to keep most of our cool stuff, since it's FT.

Kraven is pretty much the only PMT I do anymore to be honest.

Allright, I give up. I can only attempt to get through so much of a tech-barrier.

I really am simply curious as to how it works while going at escape velocity.

I really am simply curious as to how it works while going at escape velocity.

Well, if the cannon were capable of curvature you could theoretically launch a railgun shell on a balistic path, if you want to call it that.

Holy Paradise, if you play your cards right, you should be able to bag that destroyer skyship. :)

Just as a note, people-- presumably the battle has been ongoing for some time now, so anything that's still there should be almost out of missiles and so forth. (I'll be RPing my stuff as using their missiles a lot less; presumably most of them have been expended for various purposes.)

Holy Paradise, if you play your cards right, you should be able to bag that destroyer skyship. :)

Just as a note, people-- presumably the battle has been ongoing for some time now, so anything that's still there should be almost out of missiles and so forth. (I'll be RPing my stuff as using their missiles a lot less; presumably most of them have been expended for various purposes.)

I'm down to 3 vollies (9 missiles each) on the surviving Ragnaroks from the Dwel encounter, and I'm at 5 vollies for the rest.

Otagia: About the scene where my downed pilot wakes up on the T-Bird, expecting to be interrogated, have I been Jehovah's Witness'ed or something? I haven't gotten a response in the thread...

Otagia: About the scene where my downed pilot wakes up on the T-Bird, expecting to be interrogated, have I been Jehovah's Witness'ed or something? I haven't gotten a response in the thread...

You got one, the captured man is being put back to sleep and turned into a sleeper agent.

That's because the velocities involved are insufficient for a Kinetic Energy Release, KEWs are like dropping extremely dense, fast moving chunks or rock on someones head. A DU Penetrator is not, in any way shape or form a KEW. It is only a penetrator, it is not based on Kinetic Energy Release, which is the entire reason for having KEWs. Ask almost any FT RPer and they will tell you the exact same thing I have.

Here, look at it this way, what happens when an unstoppable force hits an immovable object?


Wow, that is a massive misunderstanding of physics and relations. Perhaps most FT RPers get their information off people that don't know what they're talking about, but what you're saying is complete bullshit. What's an unstoppable force? That doesn't exist in physics. All matter can be stopped by an outside force if it is strong enough, there is no such thing as an unstoppable force.

However, within the context if one object is moving with a force of 100,000 Newtons [which is a lot] and another is moving at no newtons, that doesn't mean that what it hits has no force - it has the force of electro-magnetic resistance, which is a force within itself. Nonetheless, it wouldn't equate to what's hitting it. But that doesn't mean there will be a explosion unless something sparks. Kinetic energy does not cause explosions within itself. It never has, never will.

Wow, that is a massive misunderstanding of physics and relations. Perhaps most FT RPers get their information off people that don't know what they're talking about, but what you're saying is complete bullshit. What's an unstoppable force? That doesn't exist in physics. All matter can be stopped by an outside force if it is strong enough, there is no such thing as an unstoppable force.

However, within the context if one object is moving with a force of 100,000 Newtons [which is a lot] and another is moving at no newtons, that doesn't mean that what it hits has no force - it has the force of electro-magnetic resistance, which is a force within itself. Nonetheless, it wouldn't equate to what's hitting it. But that doesn't mean there will be a explosion unless something sparks. Kinetic energy does not cause explosions within itself. It never has, never will.

Actually that last was more philosophy than physics...

It was a philosophical question that is often involved inm High energy physics.

You got one, the captured man is being put back to sleep and turned into a sleeper agent.
Attempted at least. And of course, sleeper agents don't do anything if we don't have another slugfest some time. Just planning for every possible contingency, and possibly setting up another RP.

Just planning for every possible contingency, and possibly setting up another RP.

And that is why you're with the Consortium.

Its a shame, now that I think about it. I am equally to blame as everyone else in this RP. So many cool elements have been dropped because of tech issues.

Yeah. Thats why i stopped following the RP and moved on to other ones - i got so sick of all the tech wanking and arguments about why noone else was taking casualties.
Hell, i'm not even a PMT nation either so it annoyed me even more.

I am keeping my involvement in this thread to avoid clutter and confusion.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=453308

Yeah. Thats why i stopped following the RP and moved on to other ones - i got so sick of all the tech wanking and arguments about why noone else was taking casualties.
Hell, i'm not even a PMT nation either so it annoyed me even more.

Hey, I'm FT. As I've said before Kraven is the only PMT nation I still involve myself with, for this very reason.

then the answer to my last statment on this thread is a resounding 'no'

And that is why you're with the Consortium.
Well, I'd really like an invasion eventually (waiting on one by someone now, in fact), preferably one that DOESN'T center around air combat. Ground combat can be much more dramatic, and usually doesn't revolve around missile spam.