NationStates Jolt Archive

Whatever! Your Canadian so I know where your coming from.

Thank you. And yeah, I can say stuff like that, because my parents are in one of the top income tax brackets (150k+). I probably couldn't if I was poor, though...

Really! Half the black males in New York City dont have jobs! There has to be a lot of poor people on the streets then.

Not one from Rhode Island?

The question wasn't about the supreme court, it was about abortion.

NO! It was about Overturning Roe V Wade which can only be done by the Courts, The supreme court that is.

We've put overwhelming burdens on schools and then provided not enough money dumbass

rofl "a liberal senator from massahcusetts"

ahh sthut the fuck up

and with bush's bullshit about "not enough", i think I know more about the no child left behind back than the president does

It was about appointing judges to deal with abortion, I'll give that one to Bush.

Bush answered it right! No Litmus test on judges! He'll appoint those that will uphold the Constitution.

Bush made a good point on that.

I dunno about the moderator, but I'd be afraid Bush would try to hurt me after that last debate. Bush seems to be getting a little steamed again.

Thank you. And yeah, I can say stuff like that, because my parents are in one of the top income tax brackets (150k+). I probably couldn't if I was poor, though...

My dad is in the military! At one point we were on Paycheck to Paycheck. Thank God for Payraises under Bush and Bush

Here come the allies

Fifth or sixth time that he's said liberal tonight.

Bush made a good point on that.
uphold teh constitution

translation

will uphold my belief system in light of fact and social changes


the so called activist judges are doing their job, its the COSNERVATIVE judges making laws. clarence thomas's the states can have an official religion any one?

Fifth or sixth time that he's said liberal tonight.

They said on the news earlier (NBC Nightly News) that part of Bush's strategy tonight is to paint Kerry as a Liberal.

Since when is liberal a bad word?

Oh great, Kerry wants to create 2 new army divisions... Where are the men going to come from?

rofl "a liberal senator from massahcusetts"

ahh sthut the fuck up

and with bush's bullshit about "not enough", i think I know more about the no child left behind back than the president does

And a conservative president from Texas. Which is worse?

uphold teh constitution

translation

will uphold my belief system in light of fact and social changes


the so called activist judges are doing their job, its the COSNERVATIVE judges making laws. clarence thomas's the states can have an official religion any one?

And yet the 9th Circuit Court is the most liberal of all Appealant Courts. They are also the most overturned court in the land. Why is that? They're definitely NOT conservative.

And a conservative president from Texas. Which is worse?
the dumbass that doesnt even know what his own policies involve, aka bush.

Oh great, Kerry wants to create 2 new army divisions... Where are the men going to come from?

I like to know how he's going to pay for it!

They said on the news earlier (NBC Nightly News) that part of Bush's strategy tonight is to paint Kerry as a Liberal.

Since when is liberal a bad word?
Since Republicans said so

Damn, Kerry-was that whiskey in that glass?

Shut up with the "Global Test"!

We Should Join Alliances With More Of The World!!! Thats What Got Europe Into WW1!!!

They said on the news earlier (NBC Nightly News) that part of Bush's strategy tonight is to paint Kerry as a Liberal.

Since when is liberal a bad word?

Since uneducated Americans (eg, ones who don't know anything) associate "liberal" with "Communist".

There's that global test twist again. Bush saying that it means that we need permission of other countries to defend ourselves. How many times has this been corrected?

Oh great, Kerry wants to create 2 new army divisions... Where are the men going to come from?

People like me who would be volunteering if there wasn't a right-wing nutjob running it.

We Should Join Alliances With More Of The World!!! Thats What Got Europe Into Ww1!!!

And the lack of them is what got the U.S. FUBAR in Iraq.

was kerry just channeling clinton


and bush somehow relates the gulf war

Rupublicans are going to run that 'truth' thing into the ground.

Go figure, Kerry flip-flops again. "No nation will ever have a veto over us." Well, the last debate you said we had to go through the UN.... The UN has veto power over the US....

WTF was that Bush?

1990 vs. today.... HUH? :confused:

Since uneducated Americans (eg, ones who don't know anything) associate "liberal" with "Communist".

Aye, thank you for making that distinction. I'm sick of being called liberal.

"He did it!"

Go figure, Kerry flip-flops again. "No nation will ever have a veto over us." Well, the last debate you said we had to go through the UN.... The UN has veto power over the US....

Exactly right Artic Tundra.

Same bloody difference. You're missing the point. The rich aren't paying anywhere near as much taxes as they should, because of Bush's Tax Cut.

Define "should". The first tax cut was actually one of the most even ways Bush could have given a tax cut. The dividend one (the second) I'll give you was a little iffy, although it actually helps the upper middle class the most rather than the rich, at least in a direct basis (ie, you can say it "helped the top 2% mostly" or whatever, but if you had a conservative version of factcheck.org, it would tell you that is as misleading as the 98 votes). The first tax cut was pretty even handed, in that it pretty much gave everyone a similar percentage of their taxes, back. The dividend one helped people with IRA-like packages but not sheltered from taxes the most; dividend earning stocks are the exception rather than the rule now, and mutual funds and retirement plans are major groups that invest in them.

What I can't stand is people taking both sides of the coin. If Bush's tax cut affected mostly the rich, it was only because they pay such a high percent of the taxes in the first place. You can't argue that the rich don't pay taxes, but yet argue that the cut was in their favor -- they only can get the cut on what they pay.

In the end, Bush paid a higher percentage of his income in taxes than me (in "effective tax burden", i don't recall the number but at the time i figured it was about 2.3 times what my effecive tax burden was, as a lower-middle-class wageearner). Most of the "rich" pay a similar number, albeit cheaters (Like Kerry, who paid a much lower "effective tax" percentage than bush, even though he earned quite a lot more, along with his very well off wife) occasionally skirt a lot of the tax. Next time Kerry tells you how the rich don't pay enough in taxes, ask him to start paying first.

(I'm a conservative Economist who does not support Bush, but does support some-but-not-all of his economic policies, and disagrees on his near-police state domestic security policies. Just so you know, before you bash me too thoroughly.)

Go figure, Kerry flip-flops again. "No nation will ever have a veto over us." Well, the last debate you said we had to go through the UN.... The UN has veto power over the US....

So then, if everybody in the world is free and equal, then why should the U.S. have veto power over anybody else, either? Kerry is spouting right-wing ideas... not good.

Go figure, Kerry flip-flops again. "No nation will ever have a veto over us." Well, the last debate you said we had to go through the UN.... The UN has veto power over the US....
shove it pinoccio

Go figure, Kerry flip-flops again. "No nation will ever have a veto over us." Well, the last debate you said we had to go through the UN.... The UN has veto power over the US....
In the first debate he said the exact same thing.

Go figure, Kerry flip-flops again. "No nation will ever have a veto over us." Well, the last debate you said we had to go through the UN.... The UN has veto power over the US....

And if the entire world thinks we're wrong.... maybe we just MIGHT be wrong

The UN is not a nation. It's a coalition of MANY nations.

In the first debate he said the exact same thing.

Yea Kerry did say that didn't he and now he saying something else. Go Figure.

They said on the news earlier (NBC Nightly News) that part of Bush's strategy tonight is to paint Kerry as a Liberal.

Since when is liberal a bad word?

Since Kerry wants to paint himself as a moderate, and bush as an extremist. Which is not far from the truth; Edwards is the extreme liberal (who scares me, honestly, whereas Kerry I see as being pretty much business-as-usual, four-years-of-nothing)

Didn't Bush just say they would run a background check? Listen to what someone says Kerry.

economic affirmative action!

At this angle Bush kinda looks like his dad.

Kerry just lied about the assault weapon ban. He stated it related to fully auto weapons.

Define "should". The first tax cut was actually one of the most even ways Bush could have given a tax cut. The dividend one (the second) I'll give you was a little iffy, although it actually helps the upper middle class the most rather than the rich, at least in a direct basis (ie, you can say it "helped the top 2% mostly" or whatever, but if you had a conservative version of factcheck.org, it would tell you that is as misleading as the 98 votes). The first tax cut was pretty even handed, in that it pretty much gave everyone a similar percentage of their taxes, back. The dividend one helped people with IRA-like packages but not sheltered from taxes the most; dividend earning stocks are the exception rather than the rule now, and mutual funds and retirement plans are major groups that invest in them.

What I can't stand is people taking both sides of the coin. If Bush's tax cut affected mostly the rich, it was only because they pay such a high percent of the taxes in the first place. You can't argue that the rich don't pay taxes, but yet argue that the cut was in their favor -- they only can get the cut on what they pay.

In the end, Bush paid a higher percentage of his income in taxes than me (in "effective tax burden", i don't recall the number but at the time i figured it was about 2.3 times what my effecive tax burden was, as a lower-middle-class wageearner). Most of the "rich" pay a similar number, albeit cheaters (Like Kerry, who paid a much lower "effective tax" percentage than bush, even though he earned quite a lot more, along with his very well off wife) occasionally skirt a lot of the tax. Next time Kerry tells you how the rich don't pay enough in taxes, ask him to start paying first.

(I'm a conservative Economist who does not support Bush, but does support some-but-not-all of his economic policies, and disagrees on his near-police state domestic security policies. Just so you know, before you bash me too thoroughly.)

American taxes are pittances compared with the rest of the world. And you have a higher proportion of billionaires and millionaires than anybody else. Taxes should be raised, if only to make sure that the rich can't lord it over anybody else by buying luxury items when the poor can't afford jack shit.

Kerry just lied about the assault weapon ban. He stated it related to fully auto weapons.

I didn't pick up on that. Good Job Kecibukia

Do you want to know why the majority of conservative states vote for lower taxes (or not too high) while the majority of the liberal states vote for higher (or not too low) taxes?

WIthout giving any specifications or data, but a general idea, states like Texas actually pay more taxes than liberal states, while states like Mass. pay lower taxes. No wonder each state votes for either higher or lower taxes. Lol.. :D.. oh yeah i ain't no conservative case' yall was wonderin'...

Yea Kerry did say that didn't he and now he saying something else. Go Figure.
No, he said that he would never put the security of america in another nations hands and he said it again.

And yet somehow, all that got through was "Global test"....

bush is trying to pass off the black congressional caucus as the NAACP

And yet the 9th Circuit Court is the most liberal of all Appealant Courts. They are also the most overturned court in the land. Why is that? They're definitely NOT conservative.

They're only activist judges when they're not appointing the president.. please..

Kerry is making a lot of sense, sadly he could of body slammed Bush on several points and hasn't... Kerry is not to me on his game as much as the last two debates...

But there is still time to get that knock out punch!

American taxes are pittances compared with the rest of the world. And you have a higher proportion of billionaires and millionaires than anybody else. Taxes should be raised, if only to make sure that the rich can't lord it over anybody else by buying luxury items when the poor can't afford jack shit.

Tax the rich and watch their businesses go overseas and the prices in this country GO UP!! No Thanks! That would also kill the stock market too.

Keep Taxes LOW!

affirmative action to business loans!

GET BACK ON TOPIC

They're only activist judges when they're not appointing the president.. please..

Kerry is making a lot of sense, sadly he could of body slammed Bush on several points and hasn't... Kerry is not to me on his game as much as the last two debates...

But there is still time to get that knock out punch!

Your Canadian too and a staunch Kerry supporter. You'll say anything bad about Bush!

They're only activist judges when they're not appointing the president.. please..

Kerry is making a lot of sense, sadly he could of body slammed Bush on several points and hasn't... Kerry is not to me on his game as much as the last two debates...

But there is still time to get that knock out punch!
Hey, Stephs here-it's like having a celebrity!

Kerry just lied about the assault weapon ban. He stated it related to fully auto weapons.

Nobody on either side can argue the ban honestly. It was a worthless piece of legislation that required a few minor changes to guns and magazines. The Dems want to claim credit for it and bash the Republicans for killing it, the Republicans want to claim credit for killing it. It was worthless, did NOTHING to protect ANYONE nor did it harm ANYONE's rights to keep and bear arms. Nothing at all.

I don't understand why they even discuss it. Do the Dems really not see how useless the ban was? Ask any gun shop owner or worker if they care about the ban. They'll say no, either way - instate or not reinstate, it's the same to them. (At least the ones i know, including my brother, back home, in the West, where most of the gun owners live.)

bush: god tells me to invade things.

Don't pond on the podium Bush. You might break it. Expespecially when talking about something uninteresting.

Bush is hitting the right button on the religions.

calmness in the storms of the presidency.

LOL. right...

people pray for me... and against me...

They said on the news earlier (NBC Nightly News) that part of Bush's strategy tonight is to paint Kerry as a Liberal.

Since when is liberal a bad word?
Ever since liberalism became synonymous with cowardice, scumminess, and obstructionism.

Your Canadian too and a staunch Kerry supporter. You'll say anything bad about Bush!

Yes, of course, that's why I said I didn't think Kerry was on his game thus far... sort of negates your thinking now doesn't it.. duh! :rolleyes:

he says his faith is very personal yet he wants to legislate (even ammend the constitution) his christian faith. he just said he never wants to impose his religion on anyone else. aboriton, gay marriage etc...

God: Running our foriegn policy.

freedom is on the march! Conquer the world! :rolleyes:

Yes, of course, that's why I said I didn't think Kerry was on his game thus far... sort of negates your thinking now doesn't it.. duh! :rolleyes:

He isn't on his game. I think this Debate is a draw if not a small and I means small Bush victory so far!

bush: i dont want to oppose my religion on anyone else, unless they disagree with my religion, then we force it on them

Do you want to know why the majority of conservative states vote for lower taxes (or not too high) while the majority of the liberal states vote for higher (or not too low) taxes?

WIthout giving any specifications or data, but a general idea, states like Texas actually pay more taxes than liberal states, while states like Mass. pay lower taxes. No wonder each state votes for either higher or lower taxes. Lol.. :D.. oh yeah i ain't no conservative case' yall was wonderin'...


Um, texas has no state income tax, from what i recall... and if you mean federal taxes, it is true that on average, the upper middle class and up tend to be more conservative and vote Republican, whereas the middle class on down tend to vote democrat ... so hence the correlation you see, the RICH who pay more taxes vote to lower them. :)

A lot more loving of our neighbors! Yay! *waves peace sign*

Kerry now tries to get the religions to fight each other now. What a dumbass.

Kerry now tries to get the religions to fight each other now. What a dumbass.

I wouldn't call him a dumbass actually

Ever since liberalism became synonymous with cowardice, scumminess, and obstructionism.
Translation=

Hehehe I'm a tool.

Its time for a crusade!

Kerry sucks.

Bush sucks.

Know what the difference is? Bush sucks worse.

And states like Massachusetts have higher taxes than some Canadian provinces (EG Alberta). Get your facts straight, man.

Sure ya would Kerry. Like when you bad-mouthed your buddies back in 'nam when you got back to the states.

they're both so weaseally. all this rhetoric in place of actual discussion.

Maybe it's just my tv, but do kerry's eyes seem sort of red? Like he's tired or something?

Maybe it's just my tv, but do kerry's eyes seem sort of red? Like he's tired or something?
He sounds sick.

is bush in love with ted kennedy?

I love this last question!

American taxes are pittances compared with the rest of the world. And you have a higher proportion of billionaires and millionaires than anybody else. Taxes should be raised, if only to make sure that the rich can't lord it over anybody else by buying luxury items when the poor can't afford jack shit.

Um, that's because many other nations run socialist to semi-socialist regimes, hence higher taxes because it's how they run their economy. A capitalist economy, particularly the sort of free-market capitalist economy, demands lower taxes, mostly because the government does not provide the same services as a socialist economy.

See it as this. The French believe you pay them $50 US a month and they'll give you health insurance. The US believes you pay $50 to Aetna for health insurance. Either way you pay $50, but each country believes their way gives you better health insurance. The French think it's better because you get the same health insurance as Donald Trump, whereas the US because we think that you get better health care when you have several doctors and insurance plans and whatnot competing for your $50, and possibly you'd pay $38 instead.

BTW, on kerry's health plan. If we paid an additional $200billion in taxes, that means essentially $900 a year more per person in the US. Take out the 20% or so that pay no taxes at all, and the what, 15% who'd not pay any additional tax, and that's like $1200 a year ($100 a month) extra for the rest of the folk.

How many of you, PER PERSON, pay $100 a month for health insurance? Hmm? And that's if Kerry's plan is his dollar amounts not Bush's $500b (that's over $200 a month PER PERSON, so for 5 people in the family $1000), and that's not considering that Competition is the lifeblood of the US economy - socializing health care would take out the main reason we have stronger health care advances than any other country BY FAR ... unless we continued to run drug companies the way we do - which would bankrupt the socialized health care system. It costs money to develop new drugs, plain and simple, and if we're not willing to pay it, we won't get the new advances no matter how hard the Gov't tries to legislate them into being...

Story time!

'Classic' Backyard B-B-Q.

Someone get a giger counter on Kerry's teeth...what the heck is that about...


Oh, man-Kerry is going to get slammed for that....good he has a sense of humour about it....

So much for paying attention to his mother's advice

Maybe it's just my tv, but do kerry's eyes seem sort of red? Like he's tired or something?

Damn, your right. Must be going into killer robot canidate. :cool:

Idear? did he say that?

idea'r? That's the first hint of his accent I've heard in a while.

Idear! Ahahah, the accent came through!

IDEARS!!! WHATS AN IDEAR?!?

Idear? did he say that?
You out drew me.....varmit.....:)

IDEARS!!! WHATS AN IDEAR?!?
Move north. You'll hear it quite a bit.

IDEARS!!! WHATS AN IDEAR?!?

I thought I heard Idears but was not sure

aah... the idyllic mountain scene

oh so important to america. what we all see every day.

It's unanamous, idea'r was heard.

Move north. You'll hear it quite a bit.

I live in PA and that is the first Time I heard it! My grandparents never said it! Never did any of my relatives and most on my dad's side was born and raised and lives in the State of NY

Good stratigy(sp?) using optimism.

IDEARS!!! WHATS AN IDEAR?!?
a dear that comes after h

Bush wins easily!

Wait, we can win the war again? Man he's hard to keep up with....

I live in PA and that is the first Time I heard it! My grandparents never said it! Never did any of my relatives and most on my dad's side was born and raised and lives in the State of NY
I've heard it a lot...

Kerry has made a couple of jokes tonight. He's trying to be appealing. At least he's not trying to take over the world.
Ideer??? Kerry is speaking in dialect. How rural :)
By playing on the I'm Not Bush theme Kerry is doing well.
Bush is using the "Please baby, don't leave me" theme. I'm scared of his armies of compassion.

Bush wins easily!

I do think Bush won but I can tell you that ABC and CBS will have Kerry winning it.

this was pretty tame. :(

Move north. You'll hear it quite a bit.

I LIVE IN ILLINOIS!!! Scheißekopf!!!

Kerry came off as a slick talker, just like always. Bush seemed the calm, average person who had the better substance.

Well, I think this was Bush's best debate. I'm calling this one as a tie. Fairly good debate I think.

A very good debate I think!

I will have to go Bush here.

I've heard it a lot...
You can hear it all the time on American Chopper

Bush obviously won the debate.

Bush obviously won the debate.
Tie.

I thought this was a good debate, I thought Kerry won.

This was definitely Bush's best debate.

More a tie than anything. Kerry didn't get anything really good in.

Kerry won the first two and Bush this one.

Bush seemed off the rails most of the debate, I don't see how you're calling it for Bush. Ah well, we'll be arguing that for days...

Time for a pundit free half hour of The Simpsons

woo hoo, flaming moe! they never play this anymore...

Sorry, I gotta stick up for my boy even if he is kinda lame. I call it a draw. Bush lied a lot. You have to take off points for obvious lies.
Let me review the transcripts and I'll list a couple.

Kerry won the first two and Bush this one.

Have to agree there.

Handicapping Bush for crappy performance in previous debates doesn't seem like the best way to go about things...

Yeah, today was certainly Bush's best debate. I still only think it was a tie. Maybe a slight win for Bush, but it'll be really slight.

Debate 1: Kerry
Debate 2: Tie
Debate 3: Bush

Good debate...

And into the record books....I wonder whats going on in the rest of general....

That my friends, is called a good old Woodshed Whippin'. Kerry would have been better served by not showing up.

Bush seemed off the rails most of the debate, I don't see how you're calling it for Bush. Ah well, we'll be arguing that for days...

Time for a pundit free half hour of The Simpsons

woo hoo, flaming moe! they never play this anymore...

Sweet, i love that episode :)

That my friends, is called a good old Woodshed Whippin'. Kerry would have been better served by not showing up.
How so? Bush lied his ass off.

Holy moly, that lady on the phone on C-Span was PISSED! Did anyone else hear her??

Holy moly, that lady on the phone on C-Span was PISSED! Did anyone else hear her??
Flaming Moes, man! What did she say?

Nope. I was watching it on PBS. What did she say?

Fox News Internet Poll, which went Kerry in the first debate, and tie in the second debate:

Has Bush Winning 55 to 41

How so? Bush lied his ass off.

They both did. They both said things that were technically true, from one point of view (their own), yet could easily be interpreted different ways. Don't blind yourself to your candidate's falsehoods. Just know the TRUE facts, on both sides, for your self, and then figure out whose policy makes more sense (and who's more likely to get their policy done, of course -- 0% chance of a health care system coming into being in the next 8 years, just like Clinton couldn't do it, since the Pres isn't the dictator. ;)

As I said in the analysis of the second (or was it the first?) debate, you're going to see in this debate what you wanted to see going in to it. Kerry supporters will favor him as the winner, and Bush supporters will favor him.

As a moderate and a previously (as in prior to this debate) undecided voter, I'm going to have to say that I'm now pretty securely locked in with Bush. They were both fluid and well-spoken, but I feel that Bush held his ground and made several convincing arguments and effective counter-punches in defending himself against Kerry's claims. I tend to shy away from the statistic spouting of both sides, so I watched it from a more "big picture" level. As such, I think Bush presents us with the possibility for a stronger America than we might have with Kerry. But that's just my opinion, so don't make it all personal and everything.

They both did. They both said things that were technically true, from one point of view (their own), yet could easily be interpreted different ways. Don't blind yourself to your candidate's falsehoods. Just know the TRUE facts, on both sides, for your self, and then figure out whose policy makes more sense (and who's more likely to get their policy done, of course -- 0% chance of a health care system coming into being in the next 8 years, just like Clinton couldn't do it, since the Pres isn't the dictator. ;)

And that, my friends, is why American politics simply do not work.

She went on for a few minutes just ranting about how Kerry can't remember what he said 5 minutes ago, and how the liberal media covers up for all his flip-flops in Mass. She was practically yelling, did yell a few times, and the person taking calls couldn't even say a word to get her to stop talking.

And that, my friends, is why American politics simply do not work.

And yet, it has survived for over 200 years. Go Figure

Fox News Internet Poll, which went Kerry in the first debate, and tie in the second debate:

Has Bush Winning 55 to 41
It's fox.


FOX.


:)


Besides, Kos hasn't called up the calvary yet.

Well ok .... gotta throw in my 6 1/3 cents on the matter ...

1] What was that white bumpy object in the corner of Bush's mouth? Did he have another snack related accident?

2] Kerry actually mentioned the Native Americans when discussing religion in the US! THANK YOU KERRY!! People always seem to mention "Christian, Jew, or Muslim" ... but they always forget that there are more Pagans in the US than there are Jews ... why aren't Pagans mentioned?

3] Bush flat out lied on at least 4 separate occasions. If you lie in a debate, you automatically lose the debate.

Kerry is now 3 for 3. Kudos.

Now, I am going to watch a movie.

It's fox.


FOX.


:)


Besides, Kos hasn't called up the calvary yet.

But You did not know that this Poll went to Kerry the first TWO TIMES!!!!

This time its Bush!

But You did not know that this Poll went to Kerry the first TWO TIMES!!!!

This time its Bush!
I told you, it's because the liberal bloggers haven't rallied the troops yet. That's less then 2,000 people voting, and normally they get over 100k+ voting.

Can we get this thread locked and archived again? Just so it doesnt get filled with off topic arguments?

I told you, it's because the liberal bloggers haven't rallied the troops yet. That's less then 2,000 people voting, and normally they get over 100k+ voting.

and we won't be able to trust the liberal bloggers!

and we won't be able to trust the liberal bloggers!
Of course not. That's half the fun, see who rallies the troops more. The cons or the libs.

But You did not know that this Poll went to Kerry the first TWO TIMES!!!!
Kerry and his campaign went in saying they were going to win this, and domestic issues have been his strong point. (except for taxes)
Bush didn't have to make a strong showing to show well when the expectations for him were so low.

And yet, Kerry did not do his best! He didn't do as well as people thought he would.

This debate goes Bush!

So, both sides end the debate season at 1-1-1

*bush notes*

"kerry is a stupid doo doo head"

I thought he was drawing him with Garfield.

He isn't on his game. I think this Debate is a draw if not a small and I means small Bush victory so far!

By the end of the day (debate) .. I think Kerry still was able to pull it off. While more in the fashion of his win in the second debate then the first. So, I think Bush is looking at three losses.. which has to make one wonder where the soft Bush people will go , Bush had already given up on the undecided's given they looked by polls in favour of Kerry.. I could have it wrong, but we will know in the next 72 hours.

By the end of the day (debate) .. I think Kerry still was able to pull it off. While more in the fashion of his win in the second debate then the first. So, I think Bush is looking at three losses.. which has to make one wonder where the soft Bush people will go , Bush had already given up on the undecided's given they looked by polls in favour of Kerry.. I could have it wrong, but we will know in the next 72 hours.

Sorry! Bush won this debate! I have to say Bush won because Kerry was on the defensive for most of this debate.

Sorry! Bush won this debate! I have to say Bush won because Kerry was on the defensive for most of this debate.

These are our opinions, we won't really know for 48 to 72 hours..

These are our opinions, we won't really know for 48 to 72 hours..

And I did say my opinion that Bush won

Well ok .... gotta throw in my 6 1/3 cents on the matter ...

3] Bush flat out lied on at least 4 separate occasions. If you lie in a debate, you automatically lose the debate.

Kerry is now 3 for 3. Kudos.

Now, I am going to watch a movie.

Um ... as above, they both lied, from one point of view. From their own points of view, they didn't. As a former state-champion debater, i can tell you that lying in no way causes you to 'lose' a debate; heck, if you can get away with it, it's a lot better than telling the truth, sadly.

And that's what this comes down to : Which candidate can get away with their lies? :)

These are our opinions, we won't really know for 48 to 72 hours..

As one of my work colleagues elegantly put it, we won't know until a certain Wednesday after a certain Tuesday in November, who won. Since that's what counts.

;)

And I did say my opinion that Bush won

Given you and your sisters normal lack of knowledge on the issues, I say we all race over to "factcheck.org" to see who really was being honest.. ;)

Given you and your sisters normal lack of knowledge on the issues, I say we all race over to "factcheck.org" to see who really was being honest.. ;)

And it will show that both sides lied!

Now that I got that out of the way. I do know alot about certain issues. In this debate, Kerry was on the defense for most of this debate. It was obvious. He totally dodged the Flue Shot Question and yes Bush dodged questions too. They both dodged it.

But here, Bush won this debate.

Edit: you forgot the apostrophy between the r and the s in Sister's! LOL :-p

Given you and your sisters normal lack of knowledge on the issues, I say we all race over to "factcheck.org" to see who really was being honest.. ;)
yeah, maybe they will fix bush's random number generator

Was the world they grew up in oh so safe?

What about the Cold War?
Actually that world was far worse. Always half expected the Ruskies to drop the big one. Now? They missed twice so far.

Why was Bush smiling all the time? Jeez he just stood there and grin like an idiot.

And it will show that both sides lied!

Now that I got that out of the way. I do know alot about certain issues. In this debate, Kerry was on the defense for most of this debate. It was obvious. He totally dodged the Flue Shot Question and yes Bush dodged questions too. They both dodged it.

But here, Bush won this debate.

Edit: you forgot the apostrophy between the r and the s in Sister's! LOL :-p
The quick polls show another Kerry win. So that is 3 for 3 against Bush.

I liked the way Kerry complimented Bush for his actions right after 9/11 and how America was united behind him and then turned the tables on him by suggesting that today, Bush is NOT a "uniter" and that America is more divided than since WW2.

The quick polls show another Kerry win. So that is 3 for 3 against Bush.

I liked the way Kerry complimented Bush for his actions right after 9/11 and how America was united behind him and then turned the tables on him by suggesting that today, Bush is NOT a "uniter" and that America is more divided than since WW2.

*yawns* Look who did the poll CH!

Edit: ABCNEWS has the final debate as a tie!

so, the media says:
* ABC says tie
* CBS 80/20

any more?

FOX doesn't really matter, we already knew their opinion. Same as with asking a commie. We already knew their opinion too.

This thing is still around? Cool, it's my longest thread (though I didn't really drive the topic, but I'll take it...)

*yawns* Look who did the poll CH!

Edit: ABCNEWS has the final debate as a tie!
I noted in the other debate thread that the ABC poll, while indeed a tie, sampled Republicans at 38% while sampling Democrats at 30%. Seems the poll was a bit weighted unfairly.

71% Kerry.

29% Bush.

Another defeat for Bush.

Heres to One More!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/?GT1=5472

Bush: He voted 98 times for tax raises.

Kerry: Well, your math is wrong, and I've voted for tax reductions 600 times.

Bush: But you voted to raise taxes 98 times, waaaaaaaaaaaa!

Anyone who thought Bush won is hoplessly partisan or has difficulty hearing.

I love Bush's answer to better employment: Education!

Well great, Mr President, but that really only helps my children, which is nice, but what about jobs in the near future?

Oh, and Mr President? Busted on that Osama quote of yours. I reacted to him saying that like it was a Jordan three-pointer at the buzzer to win the championship.

Lying about Osama is a bad thing, Mr President. Flip-Flop-Fabricate.

Bush definitely wins the award for "Looks most like an unmitigated jackass". The "I don't think it's reliable to quote leading news organizations...never mind." is the winner.

Bush definitely wins the award for "Looks most like an unmitigated jackass". The "I don't think it's reliable to quote leading news organizations...never mind." is the winner.

Even though CBS AND ABC have had their Credibility Hammered? Yea, I don't think its reliable to quote them either.

Even though CBS AND ABC have had their Credibility Hammered? Yea, I don't think its reliable to quote them either.

Yet, CNN/Gallup says Kerry won and even your beloved Fox news now has Kerry as the winner..

Kerry pwned Bush, all 3 debates.. deal with it! :cool:

so, the media says:
* ABC says tie
* CBS 80/20

any more?

FOX doesn't really matter, we already knew their opinion. Same as with asking a commie. We already knew their opinion too.
According to the vox populi poll on the FOX News website, John Kerry is, as I write this, slightly ahead of Bush
Bush: 242,115 votes
Kerry: 242,576 votes
Hardly scientific I know, but when Fox watchers think Kerry won (abeit slightly) then he must have won hands down!