NationStates Jolt Archive

Oh and the invasion is just against TLA, Tarlaq is not a target to my knowledge, just clearing this up now, as my stance on this is sinking Neutral shipping not far from my territory is unacceptable, which is a viewpoint which would be shared if say a Merchant ship owned by a neutral nation that favoured say Xeraph was sunk near your waters you would be up in arms as well.
A little late, Clandonia declared war on both of us.

The reason why I declared war on Tarlaq is because has taken my people, I don't know IC'ly what's even happened to them as we haven't been told anything.

They are presumed dead or missing in action, also TLA:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=530815

Me and Nova's posts for your attention.

Actually Kraven is NOT a big cloner, he's went on record as saying their expensive time consuming with a very high fatality rate, and thats his Sardukar, his Capitol Police arn't clones as they are actually not genetically alike, instead being created by mixing sperm with lobotomised femlaes as birthing vectors.

Like Tarlag said above, when my fleets entered the fray there was no response to aerial assualts by waves of fighter-bombers sent (while MP was still available) and a continual bombardment by SDs (while MP was still available). Neither of which were responded too, and I understand he is swamped, I was too at the end of the term. However, I won't sustain 50% damage because it seems like a good rate to you. Regardless of where my fleet is located, because there was no ic responses.

I will take realistic losses (like with my paratroopers in Barcelona), that is fair, however asking 50% of a fleet when nothing is rped is crazy.

Just my opinion.

The reason why I declared war on Tarlaq is because has taken my people, I don't know IC'ly what's even happened to them as we haven't been told anything.

They are presumed dead or missing in action, also TLA:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=530815

Me and Nova's posts for your attention.
Perhaps you all should RP ENTERING my nation's Airspace before you RP bombing it? Plzthx.

My nation did not spend several trillion on airdefense just to have you float right over it.

TLA I'll point out I made mention of them taking off from carriers and accelerating in your direction, I advise actually reading things before deciding whats comming from where.

For Clarification I will break that down, Bombers + Escort Take off from Carriers > Head in the direction of you with full spectrum raidar and detection jamming > Bomb while continuing jamming > 3/4's head home 1/4 stays.

For you to use as many subs as you appear to you will need to use a fair few subpens, and the attacks arn't confined to just there, but Naval bases and their acossiated support facilities.

and as for the losses, I think Clan mean a generalisation, not saying every one on the other side must take xyz amount of losses

TLA do you have technical specs and a write up for the lasers and railguns?

I also find it rather hard to believe a mach 3 bomber could be tracked optically by satellites and then used to fire weapons.

I accept MP's decision to leave the war, school is MUCH more important than NS, so I wish him the best of luck on getting that done.

As far as my fleet is concerned, they were in masse somewhere out of the battlezone, and I was cycling them in and out as waves. A lot of damage has been dealt to me of course, as I am the primary aggressor. I'm not going to go as high as 80%, but I'd say closer to 55-65% of the First Fleet, the Second Fleet will be arriving soon, so not a big deal. As far as supplies and repair, I own Portugal, so thats not a problem for me or any of the Allied Liberation Forces, as I have granted them access to the drydocks and ports for shipping in goods. The straight is too deep for blockage...so please...don't pull your little 'you can't attack Doom, so haha' stunt on me. Granted their could be some stackage making it a bit narrower, I doubt its something to be concerned about.

I do not accept Tyrandis as coming in and taking over MP's forces. In my mind that is illegitimate and silly. I won't accept it for them, just as I would not accept it for my own allies. You can't RP, then you can't RP and thats that. I hate when other nations allow others to RP for them, unknowingly it changes the entire political climate of situations. Thats my ruling on that, and there will be no exceptions. Doom can move forces toward Gib if he wants, but I doubt he will have time since we'll all be moving through soon, and his allies are too far behind to catch up.

Who owns Morocco, Western Sahara, Mauritania, Algeria, Tunisia et cetera? Where are ViZion's and Doomingsland's African claims? I know ViZion's in Italy, but who's in France? (In short, do we have a map?)

Not every allied force will take too long, technically I could have a fleet there due to my homeland being in the mid atlantic, even given NS considerations of size and scale it'd only be a few hours away not the days and weeks figures I've heard bandied about.

Of course I would wait for my allies so the point is moot, just putting out there some food for thought, and this was something that hasn't been clarified, is this calssed as NS Gibraltar or RL Gibraltar, as if it were RL Gibraltar it would most certainly be blocked, after the sinking of the wall and the fleet, while if it's NS Gibraltar than perhaps only SD's and Battleships would have trouble getting through the rest would still have to get through quick as common sense dictates that all the leaking nuclear reactors plus sour grapes from the MassPwnage forces would make it dangerous for anything to stay in their too long before Radiation wrecked the ships and their crews, and even then forces exiting the straits would be easy fodder for long range bombardment being confined to narrow exit routes where there WILL be ships.

It won't be impossible to get through, however the point is that yes Gibraltar has fallen, but that doesn't mean it's easy or safe to pass through, basic common sense dictates that much at least.

I'd like to take MP's place, with my own forces, of course, should that work for everyone else here.

Who owns Morocco, Western Sahara, Mauritania, Algeria, Tunisia et cetera? Where are ViZion's and Doomingsland's African claims? I know ViZion's in Italy, but who's in France? (In short, do we have a map?)
I own all of North Africa pretty much...

I think its fair if Tyrandis comes in with his own forces though.

"What kind of range do they get? If they're so small I highly doubt my fleet will be in range of them."

Just because something is small doesn't mean it can't go as far...

When it comes to rockets it does. Rocket needs to be big in order to hold the necessary fuel to reach its target.

Perhaps you all should RP ENTERING my nation's Airspace before you RP bombing it? Plzthx.

My nation did not spend several trillion on airdefense just to have you float right over it.

One of my aircraft is completely stealth, the other will have a very small signature and the space plane is in space and Novacom RP'ed doing that.

Fair enough, but know I maintain a fairly significant base in cyprus.

"What kind of range do they get? If they're so small I highly doubt my fleet will be in range of them."

Just because something is small doesn't mean it can't go as far...


Yeah...I heard women saying that about you......;)

Fair enough, but know I maintain a fairly significant base in cyprus.


As do I, from back in the day. It was actually Burnsian Desert's base/territory, but she got her ass in a situation so she gave Xeraph about 1/4 of the island for a naval/armor/air compound.

TLA do you have technical specs and a write up for the lasers and railguns? You ever play Ace Combat 4? Like that execpt with 6 instead of 8 guns.
I'll explain more by TG once I gather all the info.

I also find it rather hard to believe a mach 3 bomber could be tracked optically by satellites and then used to fire weapons.[/QUOTE]
Mach 3 or not they STILL aren't invisible. I have around 275 spy sattelites over my half of the planet.
Besides TLA uses Mach3 bombers also.

The satelites aren't firing weapons.

Unlike 90% of NS I don't use Sattelites for my God rod like systems. They are all free floating. Makes them much harder to disable... Unless your willing to set off a a few hundred nukes.

With all due respect, Ace Combat is not particularly realistic when it comes to its superweapons. You're proposing to engage relatively tiny aircraft from hundreds of miles away with unguided, hideously inaccurate munitions. More importantly... how the hell are you supposed to track the inbound targets with sufficient resolution to calculate a suitable firing solution? And satellites will not work as a copout, those do not provide real-time coverage, unless they're in geosynch orbit - in which case your resolution will be terribly shoddy at any given moment.

You can not track a Sariel its next to impossible and just because it featured in a game does not make a railgun that shoot stealth, supersonic aircraft down. I have shown fully detailed specifications of all my attack weaponry, you have showed nothing of these magical lasers which could be ranging from a CD player to a deathstar in power output.

And do you not even know how satellites work? You can't have them floating around your 'section' of the planet, they go around in orbits. You've ignored Novacoms attack which was fair and planned out, how are you supposed to drop free floating god rods?

You can not track a Sariel its next to impossible and just because it featured in a game does not make a railgun that shoot stealth, supersonic aircraft down. Like I said
stealth=Jack shit.
Lasers and Railguns are extremely fast. And there is such thing as "Leading the target" Or have you heard of that?


I have shown fully detailed specifications of all my attack weaponry, you have showed nothing of these magical lasers which could be ranging from a CD player to a deathstar in power output. The Lasers and Railguns are each seperately powered by 5 Nuclear Reactors, which I would have told you if you can let me get all the ****ing information. My computer is a mess of files.

So for the strength of the 3 lasers its= 5 Nuclear reactors Does that give you a strength ratio?


And do you not even know how satellites work? You can't have them floating around your 'section' of the planet, they go around in orbits. Geosynchronous orbit (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geosynchronous_Orbit) Does that answer your question?

You've ignored Novacoms attack which was fair and planned out, how are you supposed to drop free floating god rods?

Munitions hailed down upon the unsuspecting foe Pfft. Novacoms post is bullshit. He waltzed past ANY sort of defenses and made me be "Unsuspecting" God ****ing moding.

Reasons why it's bullshit.

1. My AA defenses are ALWAYS active.
2. People have eyes.
3. Satellites
4. I have a coast guard patrol
5. I have an air control.
6. It's wartime so people are naturally more alert.
7. I don't have a lot of Sub pens in TLA, (TLA is some where on the Alantic part of the planet) The sub pens are in Alaska.


With all due respect, Ace Combat is not particularly realistic when it comes to its superweapons. True

You're proposing to engage relatively tiny aircraft from hundreds of miles away with unguided, hideously inaccurate munitions Tell that to the hundreds of other NS nations with them. But I'm not trying to hit them on target, I'm aiming at the General area of the targets. Don't need be exact at the aim anymore. After a test I did with Animinia where he launched 1000 missiles above the sky against these defenses and the shells failed to take enough down with HE and FAE weaponry I've simply switched to a better explosive.


Low yield Nuclear bombs.
If it's a nearby a miss will work just as well as a direct hit. Even if you miss the overpressure and the fireball, the shockwave will get you.
After all
"Almost only counts in Horseshoes, handgrenades, and thermonuclear weapons."

More importantly... how the hell are you supposed to track the inbound targets with sufficient resolution to calculate a suitable firing solution? And satellites will not work as a copout, those do not provide real-time coverage, unless they're in geosynch orbit - in which case your resolution will be terribly shoddy at any given moment.
The resolution is good enough to know what something is usually.

I meant that smaller missiles can go just as far as their larger counterparts :\.

Also, WTF are you guys talking about?

I meant that smaller missiles can go just as far as their larger counterparts :\.

Also, WTF are you guys talking about?

...No they cannot, did you not read what Doom said? Smaller missiles have less range than larger ones because they don't have the volume for fuel. It's pretty simple.

And TLA - even if you're using low yield nukes, you still run into massive problems. What altitude are you shooting them at? How are you supposed to move the cannons fast enough to track the planes? How are do you track the planes anyways, since you have terribly grainy footage to begin with? And just because many people use a given technology doesn't mean its reasonable - look at the clods of idiots who used SCRAMjet tank rounds back in the day. If your satellites are in geosynch orbit, there is going to be a very long delay in the feed to ground control, which translates to even more inaccuracy as is. What are you going to do with the data? The image is going to be choppy and distorted as is.

Consider your system ignored.

Yes, I read his post. But those missiles have a lot of space that is taken up by control computers and various other equipment. An unguided missile with only fuel and the actual warhead (should be) lighter than a guided missile, shouldn't it? I can devote the same amount of fuel as his missiles have, but my "mini" missiles don't have the added bulk of on board computers, so they're smaller. Pretty simple.

And TLA - even if you're using low yield nukes, you still run into massive problems. What altitude are you shooting them at? Anywhere within a 2000 feet of the target is what counts... That narrows it down some.


How are you supposed to move the cannons fast enough to track the planes? I have 3 cannon deployments, I'm sure out of all that at least 3 can manage to aim to lead the target.

How are do you track the planes anyways, since you have terribly grainy footage to begin with? By using an image clean up to isolate the planes from the background. In fact their speed only helps me track them, since it'll be seen as a large streak on the combined images, caculating the streak I can get their their direction (and speed as well by how many miles the streak stretched per second), and by using a satelite that's angled at the curvature I can get their alititude. Simple.


And just because many people use a given technology doesn't mean its reasonable - look at the clods of idiots who used SCRAMjet tank rounds back in the day. True.

If your satellites are in geosynch orbit, there is going to be a very long delay in the feed to ground control, which translates to even more inaccuracy as is. See above

What are you going to do with the data? The image is going to be choppy and distorted as is. See above

Consider your system ignored.
Then I consider Novacom's attacks Ignored as well. Good day.

Yes, I read his post. But those missiles have a lot of space that is taken up by control computers and various other equipment. An unguided missile with only fuel and the actual warhead (should be) lighter than a guided missile, shouldn't it? I can devote the same amount of fuel as his missiles have, but my "mini" missiles don't have the added bulk of on board computers, so they're smaller. Pretty simple.
So they have the same amount of fuel as a large missile... Just the huge amount of space for guidance has been cut off. Hurt's it's accuracy but it would shrink it.
"I" accept it.

Yes, I read his post. But those missiles have a lot of space that is taken up by control computers and various other equipment. An unguided missile with only fuel and the actual warhead (should be) lighter than a guided missile, shouldn't it? I can devote the same amount of fuel as his missiles have, but my "mini" missiles don't have the added bulk of on board computers, so they're smaller. Pretty simple.
The guidance packages on those missiles aren't big enough that they'd make a major difference in that aspect...few miles, maybe, no major difference, certainly not enough to get a tiny missile to fly hundreds of miles. I mean, how big are these missiles exactly? Concrete numbers would help greatly...

Concrete numbers? Ok.

Length of the Missile: 14 ft 1 in
Diameter 17 in
Range: 235 miles

They're not much smaller than "regular" missiles. I just say "mini" missiles because they're smaller than most missiles.

Well, the M26 rocket (which is unguided) used by the M-270 MLRS is 13 feet long...and has a range of 32 kilometers...you're claiming something like a 1000% increase in range from an extra foot in length...

Ah, I see your point. I was downgrading the missile from a Tomahawk. Just forget that they were there. Again, sorry.

You ever play Ace Combat 4? Like that execpt with 6 instead of 8 guns.
I'll explain more by TG once I gather all the info.

I also find it rather hard to believe a mach 3 bomber could be tracked optically by satellites and then used to fire weapons.

Mach 3 or not they STILL aren't invisible. I have around 275 spy sattelites over my half of the planet.
Besides TLA uses Mach3 bombers also.

The satelites aren't firing weapons.

Unlike 90% of NS I don't use Sattelites for my God rod like systems. They are all free floating. Makes them much harder to disable... Unless your willing to set off a a few hundred nukes.

Last time I checked, Ace Combat wasn't a benchmark for weapons that would work it the real world.

Giant flying fortress, lasers with ranges of thousands of miles, submarine super carriers, anyone?

A rail gun (like Stonehenge) is a pathetic surface to air weapon for anything that has the ability to chance course rapidly, like, say, an...airplane? And don't say, WELL IT PRODUCES A SHOCK WAVE. If you're playing a modern technology base, rail guns themselves at that scale are a dubious proposition, let alone putting an effective warhead in a rail-slug.

Secondly, it's literally impossible to track an aircraft moving a Mach 3 with an optical spy satellite. It's hard enough tracking entire naval task forces with that sort of implement, thinking that you'll be able to somehow locate and identify an aircraft solely by searching for it visually is ludicrous.

*snip* For your first part, neither is CNC but I can count many nations having an Ion Cannon of some type.

Unless Clandonia has some sort of new flight idea most bombers work in formation.

I have around 18 guns with half that I can nearly fill around 10 square miles of sky with nuclear explosions, . And if they're going Mach 3 they can't exactly stop. Do the math.


I have 200+ satellites for my skies.

Plus even if you somehow refuse to believe that, I have thousands upon thousands of Flak, AA and Sam sites in my nation.

When I said I made the skies over my nation a deathtrap...
I ****ing meant it.

Lastly, for any other questions, see my above post.

TLA consider yourself ignored, I should of listened to other people about how you've done this sort of crap before. This system is a god mod, you have not backed it up with any factual information and reverting to 'well it just does' and 'see above' is not good enough. This is a MT conflict, these ideas are heavy PMT stuff as railguns and lasers of which you haven't even given an output, it doesn't matter if its power by a nuclear reactor I could power my laptop by a nuclear reactor it doesn't make it any faster.

I've asked Doom to remove you from the conflict thread because of your low quality, appalling spelling and grammar, poorly constructed posts and god modding.

TLA consider yourself ignored, I should of listened to other people about how you've done this sort of crap before. This system is a god mod, you have not backed it up with any factual information and reverting to 'well it just does' and 'see above' is not good enough. This is a MT conflict, these ideas are heavy PMT stuff as railguns and lasers of which you haven't even given an output, it doesn't matter if its power by a nuclear reactor I could power my laptop by a nuclear reactor it doesn't make it any faster.

I've asked Doom to remove you from the conflict thread because of your low quality, appalling spelling and grammar, poorly constructed posts and god modding.


It's not Doom's thread, it's Jarridia's. Nobody's removing anyone w/o his OK. And is it just me, or does it seem that the stick MassPwnage had up his ass has been transferred to Clandonia?

THIS IS A FUCKING GAME! If you children want to discuss ad nauseum the finer points of stuff most nations don't care about, fine. But don't apply your focus on everybody. Who the hell do you think you are telling someone that they can't play the game because their spelling and grammar sucks? If that were a real rule, 80% of the nations in NS would be neutralized.

Ignore him if you want. Be prepared to be treated the same way.

It's not Doom's thread, it's Jarridia's. Nobody's removing anyone w/o his OK. And is it just me, or does it seem that the stick MassPwnage had up his ass has been transferred to Clandonia?

THIS IS A FUCKING GAME! If you children want to discuss ad nauseum the finer points of stuff most nations don't care about, fine. But don't apply your focus on everybody. Who the hell do you think you are telling someone that they can't play the game because their spelling and grammar sucks? If that were a real rule, 80% of the nations in NS would be neutralized.

Ignore him if you want. Be prepared to be treated the same way.

Doom is the defender he has exactly the same rights as Jarridia, TLA has ignored my allies attack in what was harked on about being a Modern Tech conflict. Rail guns and lasers that can shoot down aircraft travelling at super sonic speeds is just impossible and a god mod. When no evidence or statistics have been provided then I'm sorry but I will not accept such a fallacy.

Guys we are starting to go down a very bad road. Been there with Axis Nova do not want to go there again. This first started out with the stealth attack on TAL. lets look at that first. Stealth is not a magic carpet into someones airspace in nation states. I can think of two systems that can detect a stealth aircraft off the top of my head that are used in the real world. so if you are going to attack him please RP it out.
As for the Lasers, rail guns and all that happy stuff. I thought we were keeping this relatively MT. Modern lasers still have recycling problems, after a few shots the reliability goes way down. In PTM lasers are fine in MT they are not a magic bullet.
As for banning people from the thread, you can't suck up and deal. From what I understand only the Mods. can and he has done nothing to get banned.
I suggest we all pull back a little bit and decide what we want to do before it gets worse and the whole thread gets shut down.

( I hope I made some sense here I only had two hours of sleep.)

Doom is the defender he has exactly the same rights as Jarridia, TLA has ignored my allies attack in what was harked on about being a Modern Tech conflict. Rail guns and lasers that can shoot down aircraft travelling at super sonic speeds is just impossible and a god mod. When no evidence or statistics have been provided then I'm sorry but I will not accept such a fallacy.

Ok I have already discussed the lasers now on to supersonic aircraft and rail guns. Super sonic is not a magic carpet the U.S. military in the 50's developed targeting systems to shoot down such aircraft. In more modern terms ever hear of the ZU series of flak tanks. They have advanced radar and 37mm cannon and can shoot jets down.
To give a nation states example AMF has a system called smart flak, from what I understand not only is the cannon computer controlled but the shell has a small targeting computer also. I have a smiler system called Accukack
( a monkey copy of smart flak).
I still have big problems with rail guns in MT. in the real world they still have not worked out all the issues to make them a viable system and from everything I have read they are about 25 years out from a workable system. Right now they are only in the prototype stage.

It was made clear that this was MT, I could of brought in the flying aircraft carriers and my space ships if I wanted to. I'm prepared to delete my attack post and forget if it happened to ensure that the RP continues peacefully as long as no obscene technology that doesn't fit the era is used.

It was made clear that this was MT, I could of brought in the flying aircraft carriers and my space ships if I wanted to. I'm prepared to delete my attack post and forget if it happened to ensure that the RP continues peacefully as long as no obscene technology that doesn't fit the era is used.

This is probably a good idea. If you want to rework the attack with conventional weapons go for it, as long as TAL will do the same.
(Quick note the ZU series is the ZSU and is 23mm not 37mm. I just looked it up.

This is probably a good idea. If you want to rework the attack with conventional weapons go for it, as long as TAL will do the same.
(Quick note the ZU series is the ZSU and is 23mm not 37mm. I just looked it up.

I used conventional weapons, I never used any nuclear or chemical sorts.

Sorry miss statement by me. I meant more real world weapons. as long as TAL will do the same. I would be great if the technically playing field was level. Unfortunately this thread started going down hill when MP brought in all those rail guns and Nova cannon. Jarridia can you and Doom have a meeting of the minds and hand down some cans and can'ts for the tech. this would clear up a lot of occ bickering and we could get back to killing each other.
If they can agree, I could live with what ever they hand down.

I believe Doom and I agreed on 2020 as the max year. Everything Doom has used is legitimate in my opinion. MP is gone, so his stuff is no longer important. If you feel 100% confident that whatever you are using fits before 2020, then you're good.

I don't know exactly what ya'll are doing, but if this isn't pertaining to Me and Doomingsland in the Med, I'm going to ask that ya'll switch to another thread if you haven't already. Not trying to be rude or pushy, but I want to keep this as organized as possible (not like it has been already, ugh). I know that CP came over to aid Doom and now ya'll are at war with Tarlag and TLA. If ya'll could either move, or give me a rundown on what all you're pertaining to, we can move forward.

I believe Doom and I agreed on 2020 as the max year. Everything Doom has used is legitimate in my opinion. MP is gone, so his stuff is no longer important. If you feel 100% confident that whatever you are using fits before 2020, then you're good.

I don't know exactly what ya'll are doing, but if this isn't pertaining to Me and Doomingsland in the Med, I'm going to ask that ya'll switch to another thread if you haven't already. Not trying to be rude or pushy, but I want to keep this as organized as possible (not like it has been already, ugh). I know that CP came over to aid Doom and now ya'll are at war with Tarlag and TLA. If ya'll could either move, or give me a rundown on what all you're pertaining to, we can move forward.

Well for the sake of the RP and relations I think I will retcon my attack and just keep it to the Med with the war. But I can give assurances that all my technology is MT. As long as no one brings out the uber lasers, railguns and flying aircraft carriers then I'm happy.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12808069&postcount=11

I'll not comment on post quality, since that's irrelevant, but... this is just plain ridiculous. Velkie said it best, tracking a naval fleet is an iffy proposition already with geosynch due to the terribly blurry image. Faster, smaller aircraft? I think not.

I do not plan to join in on the TLA and Caladonia war because between the ViZion liberation and the Generic Empire Vs. Doom I will not have time to give it justice. Sorry Cal. I know you declared war and all but I only have so much computer time (My Wife likes to hog the computer). If you want to negotiate getting your men back I would be more then willing but I do not have time for three war threads. UnLess one of the other threads is put on hold for a while.
Jarridia when is Vizion Freedom getting back on the road?

Well for the sake of the RP and relations I think I will retcon my attack and just keep it to the Med with the war. But I can give assurances that all my technology is MT. As long as no one brings out the uber lasers, railguns and flying aircraft carriers then I'm happy.

Cal. if your are going to that I can live with it. If you wanted to negotiate I would be more then willing. Seeing both TLA and I have populations of more then three times yours you may want to consider that option at least with me.

Cal. if your are going to that I can live with it. If you wanted to negotiate I would be more then willing. Seeing both TLA and I have populations of more then three times yours you may want to consider that option at least with me.

I've deleted my post in that thread and I'm working on a new post now for the Med thread.

The thread is now back on play. I claimed a post OOCly on there because I want to post my naval movement through Gib and into the Med before everyone else has that shot, I would like all ALF members to follow my lead as Gib and Suez are now open with the withdrawal of MP. I'm not sure how I'll RP MP leaving, but I am not considering it a victory of course. Doom has stated that he wishes to use nuclear weapons against me, I thought we had decided against them earlier, but apparently not. I don't know how the rest of you feel, but I'd rather not have this degrade to nuclear weapons, otherwise everyone could nuke everyone and nothing else would happen.

I do not like using Nukes. MAD is no fun to RP. Chemical, Biological even limited orbital bombardment I could live with.

The thread is now back on play. I claimed a post OOCly on there because I want to post my naval movement through Gib and into the Med before everyone else has that shot, I would like all ALF members to follow my lead as Gib and Suez are now open with the withdrawal of MP. I'm not sure how I'll RP MP leaving, but I am not considering it a victory of course. Doom has stated that he wishes to use nuclear weapons against me, I thought we had decided against them earlier, but apparently not. I don't know how the rest of you feel, but I'd rather not have this degrade to nuclear weapons, otherwise everyone could nuke everyone and nothing else would happen.

I don't think he wants to use nuclear weapons on you, I think he wants to use a Nuclear Pulse Gun which a device which uses a nuclear charge to fire a projectile several hundred miles which is conventional.

If this is different then I dunno.

Well, I'm using conventional weapons now after I agreed that I wouldn't use my mini missiles (due to their range). In the Strait, I'm just firing cruise missiles at Doom and in Barcelona, my fleet is attacking his.

No, this is different than the Unity Gun. Talking to him on AIM he intends to use nukes because he 'has no other option.' I don't really like nukes, but the JVNDS will probably knock out most of them anyways. I just wanted to get you opinions on the use of nuclear weapons before we continue.

I was under the impression Suez was owned by Whyatica and Doom.

I was under the impression Suez was owned by Whyatica and Doom.

Technically in ViZion's world I own Suez and Sinai (including Port Said).

this will get very confusing very quickly, it's the one part where free form RP falls down big time.

There'll be arguments over who gets through Suez I gurantee it. A pity

I believe it had already been settled. MP and I decided that no one was in charge of Gib, or Suez...since there were conflicts. Instead both would be blockaded by MP, who has now left and both areas are open. MP told me that he owned Suez...but I know I own it too (gifted/entrusted to me by Lower Egypt after I helped defend him from Daylam. I'd link you, but the jolt monster ate that a looooong time ago. For a full list of my 'controlled lands' you can see my factbook in the sig)

Technically in ViZion's world I own Suez and Sinai (including Port Said).
Well if we want to be consistent this is also the Mediterranean that Kahanistan RPed in (seeing as he was involved in the original war), and in that particular conflict Kstan ceded the Suez to MassPwnage, and I went on to occupy Egypt itself and the rest of North Africa and the Levant...so yeah.

Well for the sake of the RP and relations I think I will retcon my attack and just keep it to the Med with the war. But I can give assurances that all my technology is MT. As long as no one brings out the uber lasers, railguns and flying aircraft carriers then I'm happy.


I agree 100%....and mucho apologies if I went over the line.

No, this is different than the Unity Gun. Talking to him on AIM he intends to use nukes because he 'has no other option.' I don't really like nukes, but the JVNDS will probably knock out most of them anyways. I just wanted to get you opinions on the use of nuclear weapons before we continue.


No Nukes.

TLA has ignored my allies attack in what was harked on about being a Modern Tech conflict. BECAUSE YOUR ALLIES ATTACK HAD HIM OVER MY NATION ALREADY! That's the part of the post I refuse to agree wiith. If he is already within missile and bombing range then guess what??? He's within range of MY weapons as well!

Ok I have already discussed the lasers now on to supersonic aircraft and rail guns. Super sonic is not a magic carpet the U.S. military in the 50's developed targeting systems to shoot down such aircraft. In more modern terms ever hear of the ZU series of flak tanks. They have advanced radar and 37mm cannon and can shoot jets down. Which with the large amount of Flak systems I use, those would be included.

I still have big problems with rail guns in MT. in the real world they still have not worked out all the issues to make them a viable system and from everything I have read they are about 25 years out from a workable system. Right now they are only in the prototype stage. The biggest modern issue is their power requirements, a modern USEFUL railgun requires a immence supply of power. Hence multiple nuclear reactors.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12808069&postcount=11

I'll not comment on post quality, since that's irrelevant,
Whatever, try posting with 3 hours of sleep.

but... this is just plain ridiculous. Velkie said it best, tracking a naval fleet is an iffy proposition already with geosynch due to the terribly blurry image. Faster, smaller aircraft? I think not. +200 Satellites at multiple. Using all of that I do believe I can narrow down where they are, blurriness or no blurriness.

But you know what I don't much care anymore.

OK, so let's get this show back on the road. I need to know who's where, with what forces (abbreviated) and who's on my side (the good guys) and who's on Doom's side (bad guys). Also, who's on first......:p

What is on second. Anyway I have a fleet south of Suez, Task force 15 which I will move north to take the southern cost of the canal tonight unless anyone has an objection.

Well, they kinda need to get into the Red Sea first...and there's no way I'm letting you through unopposed :)

Well if we want to be consistent this is also the Mediterranean that Kahanistan RPed in (seeing as he was involved in the original war), and in that particular conflict Kstan ceded the Suez to MassPwnage, and I went on to occupy Egypt itself and the rest of North Africa and the Levant...so yeah.
Actually, I never claimed the Suez. I might have sunk a few ships there to bottle up the Pwnagians, but I never claimed it as my own territory. I didn't claim anything west of the Sinai.[/nitpick]

Whether or not MP claimed it after the conflict, I don't know, this is the first I've heard of it, unless I remembered something wrong.

I don't know if you guys care,
But I've always found the idea of OOC banning some weapon to be ridiculous. If Doom wants to IC use nukes, nothing but the emperor should be stopping him.

If someone wanted to host a worldwide "Ban the nukez" conference and have nations sign and agree not to use nukes, well that'd be some IC way to control them. Nations could still break it and use it, but I'm sure they'd face some form of consequences.

I don't particularly like nukes since they have the potential to end the RP, whether it be with "OMG, **** you; you...blah, blah" or "Wow...we won...", however, the fact is that with the size of NS there going to be used sometimes. Personally, most of my nation's experience with nuclear weapons have ended in really good threads. ViZion nuked Generia, and The Lightning Star nuked myself and others, and those were two good threads.

But, so yeah...whatever!

Theoroshia, where exactly is your fleet anyway? I was under the impression my fleet was between you and Barcelona...and you never posted losses from that big strike I launched against it.

Yes I did. I'm directly outside of Barcelona. Well, technically I'm heading "towards" you. And no, I'm on the "side" of the continent.

My fleet -> v |
| <- Mainland
Your fleet -> ^ |

And I did post losses, didn't I? Can you show me to your post? I didn't see it.

Also, is there a map?

Wait...so you're shooting over Spain at me?

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12784209&postcount=188

And there's the post. You replied to my fighters shooting at your's but you didn't reply to the attack on the ships.

The biggest modern issue is their power requirements, a modern USEFUL railgun requires a immence supply of power. Hence multiple nuclear reactors.

The main problem for railguns [besides powerpack size] is that we don't have superconductors [things that can conduct electricity without heating up] of sufficient quality and won't for 15-20 years for a multi-shot railgun to be viable. At this point in time a railgun will either destroy itself via heating up to fast and deforming. Electrical arching if the sabot for the penetrator is suspended in the barrel will also destroy the rails. Lastly if you have the sabot touching the rails, friction will destroy the whole thing.

@1st Post:

I don't know. It's hard to figure it out without a map :\

@2nd Post:

Ah, sorry. I didn't see the last part. My number of ships is something like three carriers and ten anti-air frigates, with five Dunkerque light guided missile cruisers and ten Tiger submarines. I'll take away one carrier, four frigates, two Dunkerques, and no submarines. Is that good?

I can try to put together a map if ya'll really need it. I know I own Portugal, and Barcelona (not my main nation, just territories). ViZion used to be two sections of Italy, I don't know who it was so, we'll just say all of Italy and Sicily are ViZion. Much of North Africa is Doom, but this is the first I've ever seen/heard of that. I don't know who France is....I think Spain is Macabees...but again...I'm not sure. I know he is in my world.

EDIT: I also generally RP as Suez, Port Said, and Sinai.....and I think it was mine long before Kahanistan laid claim to any of those. But it really doesn't matter to me in this thread, as I'm more interested west. So if Doom wants to have his claim on these territories used, I assume thats fine with me. We're probably on different worlds anyways.

The main problem for railguns [besides powerpack size] is that we don't have superconductors [things that can conduct electricity without heating up] of sufficient quality and won't for 15-20 years for a multi-shot railgun to be viable. At this point in time a railgun will either destroy itself via heating up to fast and deforming. Electrical arching if the sabot for the penetrator is suspended in the barrel will also destroy the rails. Lastly if you have the sabot touching the rails, friction will destroy the whole thing. Basicly either you're saying that

A: A railgun can only be used once.
or
B: A railgun needs a heck of a long cool down time.
or
C: Something in between the two.

Thing is is that this is nation states, if there is something to make superconductors out of I'm pretty sure everyone has enough of it.

I mean isn't Uranium supposed to be relatively rare? In NS everyone has the stuff.

Either way I'm going to explain the other disadvantages now.

Railguns
1. The land it's located on cannot have any habitation within 100 miles, unless having one's organs or ears liquifying from shockwaves is healthy.
2. Power hogging.
3. Not cost effective.
4. Will mostly likely eventually blow up.

Disadvantage of the lasers
1. Wiring eventually melting
2. Overheating also.
3. Again must isolate around 100 miles, just in case the thing goes haywire and zaps a circle around 20 feet high for a radius of 100 miles.
4. Power requirements.

Disadvantage for both
1. Will hit whatever else is in the air.
2. May break
3. Tons of radioactive waste from the reactors.
4. Lowers National Moral.
5. Cost hurt the economy (The reason I purposely lowered the economy from "Frightening" to "Strong".)

I think it's more of a "Are you frickin insane" then "Godmode."

Clandonia....where are you coming from? I fail to see how you are in the Med since last I heard you were mobilizing outside of the Med...

Yeah, a map would really help.

What TSS stated is broadly true for a set type of railgun, a large slug large KE with an open bore and non cryo refrigerated and with no ability to quench is effectivly a one shot death trap. One can indeed deploy quite real superconductors if one is willing to pay the price in LN2 and one can indeed rapidly redeploy and fire a rail weapon if one can effectivly quench. On and this is quite important a small scale. Arcing is caused by bad conductor placement and design a flaw such as an open bore that can be exploited by say an air burst deployed aerosol of "fine" style copper or the like.

Small bore rapid fire anti aerospace or A/P LOS rail guns are a far far more feasible use of rail guns in the short term than large bore intercontinental strategic bombardment weapons or the USN style slow recycle room temperature just over the horizon shore bombardment being worked on presently in the real world. Given the rise of the vectored thrust short range very fast counter munition I dont see them being on the real world battlefield any time soon and there frankly just not even thinking about developing counter aerospace rial guns at the moment in any serious fashion given the easy to store and deploy nature of the new counter munitions systems.

Strategic scale Rail gun fire overpressure would be (A) negligibly no more than any large bore artillery piece of similar joule rating and (B) would as with all shockwaves decrease exponentially and quite frankly to claim it can generate more overpressure than a large thermonuclear device is pure nonsense. If one could build a rail gun with that sort of output we are talking an FT ground to orbit anti starship gun.

Rail guns hit ONE and SOLEY one target. That is in fact the disadvantage, given there small bore and extreme KE they suck at destroying LARGE armoured targets or the common infantry deployment. On impact with any major mass the bolt will at larger velocities simply volatise on impact. Disabling large targets in the rail guns bigger scales of operation yes this they are most suited to, but quite frankly there like trying to kill an elephant with a 15 foot long needle.

Lasers if designed properly just like anything else ..do not melt. Like any sane heat generating device ..install refrigeration. Ground or naval based lasers are a reality in the megawatt range since the late nineties, ABL will become operational and solid state is banging on the door removing most problems associated with small scale battle field deployment and larger scale chem system arrays sheer bloody complexity. Oh and a laser would have to be on a kilometre tall mast overlooking a flat desert to have the sort of range to endanger 100 kilometres, and quite frankly even the most powerful will have issue operating through one hundred kilometres of air.

Neither systems require nuclear reactors as power sources unless your dealing with tactical or strategic grade weapons. Even then why go nuclear? Well mobility, ease of use, and energy density.

Everything may brake and all reactors generate waste but honestly its worth it. Destroying the enemy (even if you only manage to hit an odd Parisian taxi) with a major national pride / terror project has always increased national moral even if the weapon in question is a white elephant of truly leviathan scale.

I will hopefully have time to post tomorrow. I intend to use large scale air deployment of active nuclear battery powered arrayed sonic thumpers in the straights to illuminate eeeverybodies subsurface assets given I have no naval assets in the area of scale to worry about and then use cruise torpedoes or my rhapsody drone mini SSKs to assist in eliminating any further or remaining naval threats. MASA is just as the real world blackwater mercs are NOT associated officially with the government of ZMI and as far as ZMI is concerned for them at least it is a limited corporate war not involving the state. Feel free if you wish to involve the state by engaging assets out of theatre but escalation shall follow.

What TSS stated is broadly true for a set type of railgun, a large slug large KE with an open bore and non cryo refrigerated and with no ability to quench is effectivly a one shot death trap. One can indeed deploy quite real superconductors if one is willing to pay the price in LN2 and one can indeed rapidly redeploy and fire a rail weapon if one can effectivly quench. On and this is quite important a small scale. Arcing is caused by bad conductor placement and design a flaw such as an open bore that can be exploited by say an air burst deployed aerosol of "fine" style copper or the like. Thank you for clearing that up.

Small bore rapid fire anti aerospace or A/P LOS rail guns are a far far more feasible use of rail guns in the short term I've already deployed those sorts in PMT battles,

than large bore intercontinental strategic bombardment weapons or the USN style slow recycle room temperature just over the horizon shore bombardment being worked on presently in the real world. Though that's more likely what I'm using.

Strategic scale Rail gun fire overpressure would be (A) negligibly no more than any large bore artillery piece of similar joule rating and (B) would as with all shockwaves decrease exponentially and quite frankly to claim it can generate more overpressure than a large thermonuclear device is pure nonsense. If one could build a rail gun with that sort of output we are talking an FT ground to orbit anti starship gun. Actually I orginally planned it to be a sort of anti-satellite gun, but like you said the feasablity is doubtful. But even then I eggagrated it the shockwave to make them feel better.

Rail guns hit ONE and SOLEY one target. That is in fact the disadvantage, given there small bore and extreme KE they suck at destroying LARGE armoured targets or the common infantry deployment. On impact with any major mass the bolt will at larger velocities simply volatise on impact. Disabling large targets in the rail guns bigger scales of operation yes this they are most suited to, but quite frankly there like trying to kill an elephant with a 15 foot long needle. Unless you're simply using the immense mass to get something else into the correct location... such as a nuclear bomb.


Lasers if designed properly just like anything else ..do not melt. I'm talking about the wiring, etc.

Like any sane heat generating device ..install refrigeration. Cooling systems fail. See Chenobyl.(Though that was more an accident)


Ground or naval based lasers are a reality in the megawatt range since the late nineties, Thank you.


Oh and a laser would have to be on a kilometre tall mast overlooking a flat desert to have the sort of range to endanger 100 kilometres, and quite frankly even the most powerful will have issue operating through one hundred kilometres of air. Half a mile high tower above a nearly completely flat valley. I orginally thought 25 miles but I decided people would whine godmode some more.

Neither systems require nuclear reactors as power sources unless your dealing with tactical or strategic grade weapons. they are strategic grade.

Even then why go nuclear? Well mobility, ease of use, and energy density. That and my nation loves nuclear power.

Everything may brake and all reactors generate waste but honestly its worth it. Destroying the enemy (even if you only manage to hit an odd Parisian taxi) with a major national pride / terror project has always increased national moral even if the weapon in question is a white elephant of truly leviathan scale. Thanks, this made my day.

I will hopefully have time to post tomorrow. I intend to use large scale air deployment of active nuclear battery powered arrayed sonic thumpers in the straights to illuminate eeeverybodies subsurface assets given I have no naval assets in the area of scale to worry about and then use cruise torpedoes or my rhapsody drone mini SSKs to assist in eliminating any further or remaining naval threats. MASA is just as the real world blackwater mercs are NOT associated officially with the government of ZMI and as far as ZMI is concerned for them at least it is a limited corporate war not involving the state. Feel free if you wish to involve the state by engaging assets out of theatre but escalation shall follow.

Clandonia....where are you coming from? I fail to see how you are in the Med since last I heard you were mobilizing outside of the Med...


My naval expeditionary fleet is in the Atlantic, I have a small ground deployment in Italia setting up defences that I have been using to shell Barcelona and basically bringing in supplies to help Doom fight.

Hmm. Well, I might pull out. With no map and confusion about lasers, etc, this topic is getting way too confusing.

Hmm. Well, I might pull out. With no map and confusion about lasers, etc, this topic is getting way too confusing.

The lasers thing is only about my homeland not the actual Doomingland war.

Though you're right this IS a little hard without a map.

And I can't find one that's blank enough to label it myself.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/99/Europe_blank_map.png/655px-Europe_blank_map.png

I would do it but I have just finished my exams and thus school for ever before I continue into university education so I'm off on a jolly tonight.

I got done with high school a year ago. Have fun, mate :D

Newtdom, you didn't post any losses to my gigantic attack I just launched at Gibraltar...

That was meant to occur before your attack, I'll get to the next one in a few seconds

Well, Jarridia surrendered and is sueing for peace...

Huzzah, quickest war ever.

Huzzah, quickest war ever.
No, I once fought a war that lasted about 20 RL minutes...

"Quick, use the spears against that tank!'

Well, Jarridia surrendered and is sueing for peace...

Crap.... can I invade him anyway? Please? ;_;

Yeah, I fought Ruhr two or three years ago for about ten minutes...I think it was a total of three posts until we realized we weren't really fighting about anything important.

I think BL surrended in a grand total of less then 5 IC minutes the first time we got to him.

What about all the Noob wars that get locked within 30 seconds? Do those count as wars?

You know the:

Noob:I DECLARZS WARZ ON ALL OF U!!

RPer: Nukes Noob nation

Mod: Locked.

Those are pretty fast.
Well considering that I might still be at war, my fleet would have ran like all get out as soon as the surrender was announced.


Hmm, and Clandonia I'm willing to redo the whole thing. I'll drop the cannons since it's too complicated to sit and argue about it.
----

It seems the real reason this is over is because everyone else has bailed or forgotten about it, that and MP has disappeared.

Dude, calm down. It's just a game.

And besides, it was a strategic move: no reinforcements were getting into the Med anytime soon, and countless more Allied soldiers would have to be ... well, literally sacrificed to break through both Gibraltar AND Morocco, as well as dealing with the new Naval forces at our rear, which outnumbered and outgunned whatever remained of the ALF outside of Gibraltar. I myself was considering that the only choice my fleet had, besides to run the gauntlet (which would have resulted in the death of thousands of men and the loss of hundreds of ships) would be to retreat back some and engage the Velkyan navy, at least to the point where Allied forces could break through their encirclement. Never got the chance to though ...

Well, Live to Fight another Day, right?

And GG to all.

One last thing, congrats to Clandonia for graduating! I too just finished up High School last Friday.

Jarridia What the PC says in game is what they think not necessarily what the player is thinking, so chill out. The only thing you could of done different is let the Allies know you were considering a cease fire. Personally I would not have disagreed. A nagoiated settlement is usually better then a massive war (however massive wars are fun to).
Hey good job and good luck on your Graduation Cal. I hope you have something good planned to celebrate.

Yeah I went out on Tuesday in the evening with my politics set, minus teacher as his wife didn't let him go out. We got least to say rather intoxicated and I spent half my weeks wages on one night out.

Yeah I went out on Tuesday in the evening with my politics set, minus teacher as his wife didn't let him go out. We got least to say rather intoxicated and I spent half my weeks wages on one night out.

Dude that is what being young is all about. Blowing your money on boze and girls. Soon, much to soon you will have wife, house, 2.4 childern and be in debt up to your eyeballs. God I sound old and bitter.

Dude that is what being young is all about. Blowing your money on boze and girls. Soon, much to soon you will have wife, house, 2.4 childern and be in debt up to your eyeballs. God I sound old and bitter.


Don't be bitter, man...stick it out. I have a wife, house paid for, kids grown and gone, and 96% out of debt. It does get better.......:p

Don't be bitter, man...stick it out. I have a wife, house paid for, kids grown and gone, and 96% out of debt. It does get better.......:p


I reality I hate to say this but I have no kids, the house is paided for and I have little debt. I was just showing Cal. what he had to look forword to.

The time between these two is pretty great. I've got about a year left before I graduate from the University of Texas with an Urban Planning degree. I'm kept pretty busy with a social life, school, and my job. I'm also in the midst of buying my own place in one of the skyscrapers my company is building. Life gets crazy, fast....but I'm enjoying every second of it because you're only here once.

The time between these two is pretty great. I've got about a year left before I graduate from the University of Texas with an Urban Planning degree. I'm kept pretty busy with a social life, school, and my job. I'm also in the midst of buying my own place in one of the skyscrapers my company is building. Life gets crazy, fast....but I'm enjoying every second of it because you're only here once.


Good for you. I got my BS 17 years ago, when I was 35. I'll be done with my MA next spring. I'm currently looking at second homes in Aruba and/or Montana. Things take time.

I reality I hate to say this but I have no kids, the house is paided for and I have little debt. I was just showing Cal. what he had to look forword to.


gotcha.....I remember what Jeff Foxworthy says: "One morning you wake up w/ a wife, a mortgage, a couple of kids and a mini-van and you say to yourself, 'How the hell did this happen? I was just trying to get laid!' Well....THAT'S how it happened!"

Good for you. I got my BS 17 years ago, when I was 35. I'll be done with my MA next spring. I'm currently looking at second homes in Aruba and/or Montana. Things take time.


God Xeraph I did not think you were older then me(Well not by much). Go with some place warm. Montana is great country but if I get a second home it will be someplace warm. I do howerver plan to move from North Upstate New York in about 5 to 10 years. The winters are getting to be a bitch and Global warming is not comming fast enough.

Jarridai good to hear about your degree. Next year you get to go ot and plan Urbans.

Off for three years to university should show me the way to go, saddled with a nice bit of debt I will probably end up selling my soul to the RAF and enjoy life as an officer.

I don't plan on staying too long in the UK, its too wet and its flooding every day. Aruba was where I went this year at Easter and that was rather nice, it needs a touch of Britain putting in it, perhaps open a pub!

Off for three years to university should show me the way to go, saddled with a nice bit of debt I will probably end up selling my soul to the RAF and enjoy life as an officer.

I don't plan on staying too long in the UK, its too wet and its flooding every day. Aruba was where I went this year at Easter and that was rather nice, it needs a touch of Britain putting in it, perhaps open a pub!


Before you decide on Aruba check out Bermuda. I was their in March and I found it to be a great place. It is very British and they need a good Engish Pub.

Before you decide on Aruba check out Bermuda. I was their in March and I found it to be a great place. It is very British and they need a good Engish Pub.

Well Bermuda is British you know.

I never would of guessed with all the British flags and the like. However they use mainly U.S. money and get most of their supplies from North America.

Off for three years to university should show me the way to go, saddled with a nice bit of debt I will probably end up selling my soul to the RAF and enjoy life as an officer.

I don't plan on staying too long in the UK, its too wet and its flooding every day. Aruba was where I went this year at Easter and that was rather nice, it needs a touch of Britain putting in it, perhaps open a pub!

Yea, I've got about 7 years of college ahead of me. I'm getting a degree in political science with a minor in international affairs, probably going to join up with the USAF through ROTC to pay for it all, and then after my B.A. I'm going off to law school.

Hopefully I won't end up in a gutter by the end ...

Yea, I've got about 7 years of college ahead of me. I'm getting a degree in political science with a minor in international affairs, probably going to join up with the USAF through ROTC to pay for it all, and then after my B.A. I'm going off to law school.

Hopefully I won't end up in a gutter by the end ...

I'm doing BA in International Politics and Strategical Studies, its meant to be a valued one for the military and officers courses and the subject matter rather interests me.

I'm doing BA in International Politics and Strategical Studies, its meant to be a valued one for the military and officers courses and the subject matter rather interests me.

Strategical Studies does sound interesting. They offer those kind of courses in the Military Academies here (one of my friends is going to one in South Carolina). No real need for them in the other universities, although ROTC will add stuff like that to your studies too.

Can I still Join?

Can I still Join?

The war has ended on a cease fire.

Strategical Studies does sound interesting. They offer those kind of courses in the Military Academies here (one of my friends is going to one in South Carolina). No real need for them in the other universities, although ROTC will add stuff like that to your studies too.
Ya, one of my uncles was 2nd from the top in command of the US National Guard for all of Alaska, and was among the top strategists for the US military back when he was in the military.

The war has ended on a cease fire.

ngee

ngee

Huh?

Ya, one of my uncles was 2nd from the top in command of the US National Guard for all of Alaska, and was among the top strategists for the US military back when he was in the military.

Impressive, tell him well done. Oh, by the way, this is a little late but I'm glad your plane-sans-door got you home safely!

Impressive, tell him well done. Oh, by the way, this is a little late but I'm glad your plane-sans-door got you home safely!
Ya, he misses it. He had to retire though due to my aunts health problems. There was no way he could be away from her.

And thanks. :)

TLA, how far away are those subs of your's from the Moroccan coast?

About 150+ miles. And they're closer to the Gilbraltar straits instead of Morocco.

If you remember there are fleets retreating all over the place under a cease-fire, a few subs mean nothing... Even if you could locate them, which isn't easy of course, any any attack under the cease-fire will simply give me reason for the subs to defend themselves. And since some of these subs are in fact nuclear capable.

(Victor class Subs contained a Soviet ripoff of a sub launched Tomahawk clone that was capable of a nuclear warhead.)

So any opinions? comments? I thought I planned pretty well, especially the last one.

TLA, want me to RP a transport heading towards Gibraltar so your terrorists can do whatever?

TLA, want me to RP a transport heading towards Gibraltar so your terrorists can do whatever?
I'll make a new thread later and you can post it there. There's house painting tomorrow and tuesday so I'm not going to be able to do much for awhile.