NationStates Jolt Archive

Noting that this thread has been overflowed with OOC posts, I figure I needed to start one of these

Aggressors:
The Blub Colony*
Clandonia Prime
Dephire
The Silver Sky
(Leafanistan)
(Questers)
(Demon 666)
(Franberry)
No Endorse
Kolvokia

Defenders:
Hataria
Dominion Commonwealth (alliance)
UFAN (alliance)
Hegemony (alliance)
British Londinim
Pan Arab Barronia
Kahanistan
Aagarnieu

(Nations with less than 100 mill marked with **, with less than 500 mill with *, supporters denoted with () )

Related Threads:

Operation Octopus (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527917)
The Wrath of Blub (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527586)
Negotiating a Truce (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527956)

Perhaps if you IC'ly tried to talk to us instead of this OOC pleading, your impending destruction however is unlikely to be stopped. Blub and others have offered the chance, Blub outlined his points to Hataria who has refused them.

He will now have to pay the price along with the rest by the mighty Blubs.

Whoops, posted OOC in the IC thread before I saw this.

Last time.

Pasted over:

OOC: Uh, with respect, you're the ones who have ignored/not responded to/refused Blub peace terms. Which I still think are pretty reasonable.

Tagged.

And, yup. The Blubs've basicly asked Hataria to accept responsibility, make some reparations and reduce their military somewhat. Hataria outright refuses, and just makes accusations instead.

Your demands are ridiculous and you have no authority to make them.

The thing about their military is that it is less than 1% of their population. I hardly think that is unreasonable. And I need to back Hataria. If i back out, my credibility would be shot to ruin, esp in UFAN and the DC where my 2 best allies are.

You could just leave the DC...

Can understand that... though still, having your credibility shot to ruin might be better than having your military shot to ruin :p

Obviously if Hataria continues to refuse peace terms and DC/UFAN continue to back him, then you'll have to go to war. But perhaps being a member of those alliances you could try to persuade them to accept the peace terms? Maybe if they used some of the massive amount of money they must be spending getting a bunch of fleets out there to help rebuild Blub cities and pay Hatarian war reparations, nobody would have to go to war?

Whoops, posted OOC in the IC thread before I saw this.

Last time.

Pasted over:

OOC: Uh, with respect, you're the ones who have ignored/not responded to/refused Blub peace terms. Which I still think are pretty reasonable.

I believe Hataria mentioned when Blub signed a treaty...Kamp has addressed Blub's demands... which are insane seeing as Hataria was already occupied put under a new regieme and the like...why start a war with him now..its like the modern African Americans demanding reperations from the US government now for being enslaved..Revenge is not a decent pretext for war...

Basically you guys have no legitamate reason for starting this war. I mena really, if my great great great great great grandfather killed your ancestor would you kill me.

Your demands are ridiculous and you have no authority to make them.

Excuse me?

Basically you guys have no legitamate reason for starting this war. I mena really, if my great great great great great grandfather killed your ancestor would you kill me.

We have a reason, Blub is a regional friend and quite a few people hate Hataria. Put two and two together and you get a reason for a war.

We have a reason, Blub is a regional friend and quite a few people hate Hataria. Put two and two together and you get a reason for a war.

:D

its like the modern African Americans demanding reperations from the US government now for being enslaved...

Clearly you haven't been watching the Supreme Court these last years. Native Americans have won a number of compensations from the US Gov't for broken treaties, etc, which the US has been legally obligated to pay. Haven't followed the slavery side as closely but I imagine the issue has come up.

So yes, it would be kind of like that, except it's not demanding reparations for great-great-great grandfather 200 year old stuff, but rather for fairly recent stuff.

Tell me people, is the world attacking the New Iraqui government for soemthign the old government did?

Actually, it would be more like the French demanding reperations from Weimar for their war. Oh, wait...

list of attackers and defenders up. Tell me if I left you out.

and I support British Londinium..who until for some reason he was ejected from the region was one of my good allies..and Native Americans have a right to sue the government who blatantly lied to them and stole their lands..African Americans don't...they were slaves before they got here enslaved by Africans..anyways...they're sueing over past stuff..Hataria was defeated...Blub is beating a dead horse...

Tell me people, is the world attacking the New Iraqui government for soemthign the old government did?

Tell me, has Japan been allowed to have a non-self defensive military ever since World War II?

Franberry is giving all the logistical aid the Blubs and their allies want, so put me under support or something. No combat units will parkate in this conflict though.

Tell me, has Japan been allowed to have a non-self defensive military ever since World War II?
yes

Tagged.

And, yup. The Blubs've basicly asked Hataria to accept responsibility, make some reparations and reduce their military somewhat. Hataria outright refuses, and just makes accusations instead.

Really where have you been? 60 million soilders. In the NS world I see that as a very small number with all the numbers we throw around. a 60 million man army is not gonna cause much trouble. And I believe the Hatarian goverment already apologized.

I wish they would let Japan have a non defensive Military then they could set the North Korean's straight......and Hataria's Military is huge compared to the likes of say mine but so is the overall population so it equals out..plus if Hataria did attack anywhere..he'd be destroyed entirely with no hopes of recovering ever...thus the Hatarian threat is contained as long as its watched which im sure it would be.

yes

Um, no? Japans military has built up to scale according to China and North Koreas.

Really where have you been? 60 million soilders. In the NS world I see that as a very small number with all the numbers we throw around. a 60 million man army is not gonna cause much trouble. And I believe the Hatarian goverment already apologized.

thats what i said. Its less than 1% of his population

Basically you guys have no legitamate reason for starting this war. I mena really, if my great great great great great grandfather killed your ancestor would you kill me.

Except in this case, the great great great great grandfather also killed my ancestor, as well as the great great great grandfather, the great great grandfather, the great grandfather, the grandfather, and the father.
Oh, and the whole reason it started was because my ancestor said, "I like the neighbor's dog more."

yes

Actually, no. Japan is to this day not allowed more than a self-defensive military, under the terms of the post-WWII constitution.

I'm a bit so-so about where I stand in this war Kamp. I'm not big enough yet to be making nasty enemies out of powerful nations that I have nothing against for a cause I don't really care about, however I suppose I signed up to having to protect Hataria after joining alliances he was in - and I must help him in some way I suppose, to honour my alliances and all...I'm not sure whether COMECON dragging its members in is fair however, and what happened with Dephire?

I don't see why Hat doesn't just do what Blub asks him too, and maybe work on the army thing - however, if I'm honest, I'd prefer to read and post in a big war than a peace conference. ;)

Kampfers, a TG to you.

Yes, but 60 million men doesn't specify anything. 60 million men could be 5,000 ships, or it could be 20,000,000 soldiers. A large offensive navy is whta kept Hataria's wars running. It can rebuild that if you don't put limits on it.

I tried to limit it a long time ago with the Treaty of Singapore, but he broke that when he saw it fit to. This is why I don't trust Hataria to keep any treaties.

Actually, no. Japan is to this day not allowed more than a self-defensive military, under the terms of the post-WWII constitution.
Oh, right, how did I miss article 9, and those Japanese troops running around in Iraq are obviously there to defend the emperor.

Is it really that hard for Hataria to appologize for a warcrime they comitted? If Hataria really wants to turn his back on his beligerant past, then there would be no reason for this. Furthermore, Hataria could lower their military by a mere 10 million, yet still have all these allies ready to pounce, should anyone try to invade. Lastly: Blub hasn't given a set amount for reparations, but again, if Hataria truely wants to turn their back on a war waged less than a generation ago, why not pay a token sum?

I think the real issue here is laziness+poor reading comprehnesion on Blub's part. Didn't Hataria already apologize IC and also sign a whole bunch of treaties that basically prevent him from doing any kind of aggressive war anytime soon, as well as have his military already restricted? I seem to recall something about an oath sworn by his leader...

I find it hilarious that people are castigating Hataria for not doing things he's already done, and especially hilarious that Blub of all people would be doing so given his history with Hataria.

Yes, but 60 million men doesn't specify anything. 60 million men could be 5,000 ships, or it could be 20,000,000 soldiers. A large offensive navy is whta kept Hataria's wars running. It can rebuild that if you don't put limits on it.

I tried to limit it a long time ago with the Treaty of Singapore, but he broke that when he saw it fit to. This is why I don't trust Hataria to keep any treaties.

And that is why Trans keeps an iron grip on him. If he did something like that again, he would get attacked by almost everyone.

IIRC, Hataria broke the treaty of singapore since you were using it as a club to prevent him from doing any RP at all, Hogsweat...

Also, I find it interesting that you are so 'concerned' about such a small Hatarian army. Though size is not a good way to restrict someone-- a far better way is to instead limit means of force projection.

Hataria already apoligized, unless I am mistaken.

Also, I am setting up a peace conference thread. Even if you boycott, drop by and say thats what you are doing.

There won't be a peace conference. Period. He won't accept the terms, and thus the war is on. I'd appreciate it if you'd stop trying to hijack the RP. You aren't even a main party to these proceedings, so stop.

I'll also point out something which basically destroys any form of moral high ground Blub has in this: in the past, he had attacked Hataria first, without provocation, and only afterwards had Hataria struck back. I should know as I was involved.

Ironically enough, the Blub government is acting like the old Hatarian government did: pulling out a trumped-up pretext for a war of conquest.

And that is why Trans keeps an iron grip on him. If he did something like that again, he would get attacked by almost everyone.

Really. Iron grip.
I asked Trans to put what he said in writing, and he refused and insulted me at the same time. Not exactly a good sign if he has this so-called iron grip on Hataria.
I asked in the IC thread, why don't you guys supporting Hataria sign a treaty like that? After all, if Hataria turns belligerent again, it is your guys' fault, not ours.

I'll also point out something which basically destroys any form of moral high ground Blub has in this: in the past, he had attacked Hataria first, without provocation, and only afterwards had Hataria struck back. I should know as I was involved.

Ironically enough, the Blub government is acting like the old Hatarian government did: pulling out a trumped-up pretext for a war of conquest.

That's retardedly wrong. My city was hit with godrods indescriminately in the middle of a conference. If you're just going to lie, then please stop posting here. Otherwise I'll ask a mod to forcably remove your posts.

This isn't your thread, so I'll post in it as much as I like.

One must wonder why you havn't bothered to act on this before-- you could have joined the previous war against Hataria and even now had a hand in shaping his current government and limiting his military and so forth.

Instead, you chose to wait outside and then pull up a months-old incident as a pretext to try to extort Hataria. I'm not suprised he refused you.

Demon 666 seeing as My nation isn't tied into a major alliance I agreed to most of your proposed treaty..and would be willing to negotiate something between myself and the Haven forces if they desire to talk that is..

1st Blub, there will always be other nations that want peace. (HELLOOO FRANCE). I can post about a peace conference if I want too, but I shut that down because of respect for other RPers.

2nd, I'm pretty sure Hataria would listen if you gave him terms he hadn't already agreed to. He already apologzed and his military is very much limited.

1st Blub, there will always be other nations that want peace. (HELLOOO FRANCE). I can post about a peace conference if I want too, but I shut that down because of respect for other RPers.

2nd, I'm pretty sure Hataria would listen if you gave him terms he hadn't already agreed to. He already apologzed and his military is very much limited.

I don't want peace, I'm pretty sure the others don't as the pro-Hatarians provoked us into this. You didn't have an obligation to defend Hataria, if you read some of the past things he has done then I suspect you wouldn't even think of helping him

Nations around your size were invaded by him every week.

list of attackers and defenders up. Tell me if I left you out.

All nations within the Hegemony should be listed under the Defenders, and i now have more than 100 million.

Hegemony memberlist:

Lord Sumguy
Calizorinstan
People of Sumguy (seperate person from me)
WeeScotsLad
Maxgreens Allies
UberGeezeR
Shredderstan
Incestua
Classiopea
Jeeps Wranglers
The Mandalor
Big big sasquatch
Marxnia
Tocausa
Wootination
Maizy
Sumplace
Murdercat

if you dont wish to add all of them, you can just list The Hegemony as a defender.

All nations within the Hegemony should be listed under the Defenders, and i now have more than 100 million.

Hegemony memberlist:

Lord Sumguy
Calizorinstan
People of Sumguy (seperate person from me)
WeeScotsLad
Maxgreens Allies
UberGeezeR
Shredderstan
Incestua
Classiopea
Jeeps Wranglers
The Mandalor
Big big sasquatch
Marxnia
Tocausa
Wootination
Maizy
Sumplace
Murdercat

if you dont wish to add all of them, you can just list The Hegemony as a defender.

Thats called puppet wanking, its frowned upon greatly and many people will ignore that.

Lord Sumguy, thats puppet wanking, you'll be ignored.

Just ask GMC to fish out which nations are his and which arn't. Mods do puppet scans upon request :)

....? The Hegemony is an international federation, and we agreed to send an international fleet....

if they were my puppets, why would they all be UN members, and why would i talk to myself in regional chat?

by all means, request a scan, and you shall find that only one of the listed nations is mine: Lord Sumguy.

....? The Hegemony is an international federation, and we agreed to send an international fleet....

Are those nations all owned by different people then or not?

Are those nations all owned by different people then or not?

If they're all UN members, they must be O_o

If they're all UN members, they must be O_o

You've obviously never heard of the UEO........



Anyways, mark me as an aggressor. Hell, it's about time to flex some Junta might.

yes they are. I thought it would clutter the thread if they all posted individually, so we sent an international fleet...

again, if theu werent, why would i talk to myself in regional chat?

yes they are. I thought it would clutter the thread if they all posted individually, so we sent an international fleet...

again, if theu werent, why would i talk to myself in regional chat?

My two nations send each other Telegrams when I'm bored.


... just saying.

lol...i think you have issues... servere bordom issues...

You didn't have an obligation to defend Hataria

Actually, I do. Read here, excerpted from the UFAN Charter:

Article 1:

Further to the Prime Directive UFAN member states agree to form a Collective Security Military Treaty to protect any member states sovereignty from active external aggression. As such should an Armed Attack occur either internally or externally anywhere on the planet on one or more UFAN states, that attack shall be considered an Attack upon them all. As such all UFAN members will respond with a centrally coordinated military, economic and diplomatic response.

And as Hataria is a member, there lies my obligation. And I think we already discussed why I won't withdraw.

My two nations send each other Telegrams when I'm bored.


... just saying.

yes, but multiple pages of regional chat between more than ten nations?

and how on earth would i have so many UN natons without alerting mods?

yes, but multiple pages of regional chat between more than ten nations?

and how on earth would i have so many UN natons without alerting mods?

I wasn't seriously accusing you. I'll stop spamming now. ;)

Ask someone who's been here a while about Seaquest.



We've seen EVERYTHING.

I assume your talking about that series that lasted a grand 13 episodes into the 3rd season?

Just a notice to everyine. At this time ICly my nation has nothing to say. But I will be watching this whole event unfold so i'm adding subscriptions for the IC and OOC threads.


Although, I haven't read all relivant posts/threads/whatnot on this topic, so if I could get links to it, I would very much appreciate it.


Thanks.

I assume your talking about that series that lasted a grand 13 episodes..?

Seaquest lasted roughly 4 seasons. A lot more than 13 episodes...

Seaquest lasted roughly 4 seasons. A lot more than 13 episodes...

um, what?

I edited my post..I thought they canceled it after 13 eps in the 3rd season..where it got 2032 in the name..I think thats the right number..

seaquest..its an old series sci-fi kinda series thing...was around in the early-mid 90's..

I believe, and this makes rather more sense in the context, that SeaQuest was also the name of an NS player at some point.

I believe, and this makes rather more sense in the context, that SeaQuest was also the name of an NS player at some point.

Yeah, probably. Hey guys, can we keep this thread on target?

Shaz, here are a few links for you.

Operation Octopus (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527917)
The Wrath of Blub (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527586)
Negotiating a Truce (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527956)

Thats about all i know that has gone on.

In my defense, SeaQuest the NS player is more on topic than SeaQuest the show.

But anyways, I'd like to point out that I have (unofficially) one thousand troops that will serve as paratroopers for the Blubs once things get that far.

Noting that this thread has been overflowed with OOC posts, I figure I needed to start one of these

Aggressors:
The Blub Colony*
Clandonia Prime
Dephire
The Silver Sky
(Leafanistan)
(Questers)
(Demon 666)
(Franberry)
No Endorse

Defenders:
Hataria
Dominion Commonwealth (alliance)
UFAN (alliance)
Hegemony (alliance)
British Londinim
Pan Arab Barronia
Kahanistan

(Nations with less than 100 mill marked with **, with less than 500 mill with *, supporters denoted with () )

Related Threads:

Operation Octopus (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527917)
The Wrath of Blub (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527586)
Negotiating a Truce (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=527956)

1st post updated. Tell me if you see something wrong, or wish to be added.

Do we have a map of the Hatarian coast so the defenders can sort out who is where?

OOC: About the firebombing threat - nobody but the Blubs actually got that. And to Whyatica and Clandonia Prime: don't be jackasses and hold those damn bases over me like that. At this point, I'm going to refuse their existence because they're little more than moding, and a unfair way to manipulate me.

OOC: About the firebombing threat - nobody but the Blubs actually got that. And to Whyatica and Clandonia Prime: don't be jackasses and hold those damn bases over me like that. At this point, I'm going to refuse their existence because they're little more than moding, and a unfair way to manipulate me.

OOO: Fine guess we have to plate glass you then...

OOC: So you're just retconning whyatica and clandonia having bases in your nation? Are you that... daft? Are you seriously gonna ignore someover over a sensible IC action that you would probably take yourself if you were in that position?

OOC: It's shitty RP and you know it.

OOC: About the firebombing threat - nobody but the Blubs actually got that. And to Whyatica and Clandonia Prime: don't be jackasses and hold those damn bases over me like that. At this point, I'm going to refuse their existence because they're little more than moding, and a unfair way to manipulate me.

They're not godmodding at all. You just refuse to accept that you made a mistake and now you're paying for it. Its not shitty RP at all, its exactly what their government would do ICly in this situation.

Fine, I'll RP the bloody bases.

They're not godmodding at all. You just refuse to accept that you made a mistake and now you're paying for it. Its not shitty RP at all, its exactly what their government would do ICly in this situation.

If the message really was only sent to Blub, then how would you know about it IC?

Also, BL, I have to say, if you let people set up military bases in your country, don't be too suprised when they start using them as a springboard for occupation.

I know that much...I never let them, nor was it a voluntary thing.

If the message really was only sent to Blub, then how would you know about it IC?

Also, BL, I have to say, if you let people set up military bases in your country, don't be too suprised when they start using them as a springboard for occupation.

Blub tolds us that the messages were sent to our governments ICly, I didn't react, cause why cause two wars.

Also, we kinda invaded him during the winter months.

Also, we kinda invaded him during the winter months.

OoC: I know it's off topic, but how long have the bases been there? [RL Time]

OoC: I know it's off topic, but how long have the bases been there? [RL Time]

I believe it was either febuary or january, too late to find out now, so 3-4 months.

I believe it was either febuary or january, too late to find out now, so 3-4 months.

Was over Christmas I think...

Sorry to continue the off-topic thing, but whenever I see a situation similar to that of BL's, it makes me glad I kept a low profile while I was weak >.>

Don't want to interrupt, Clandonia, but we will need some maps of Hataria and the surrounding area for the IC thread. If anyone has some, that would be great (I'd ask Hataria, but they're not too big on responding to TGs)/

Don't want to interrupt, Clandonia, but we will need some maps of Hataria and the surrounding area for the IC thread. If anyone has some, that would be great (I'd ask Hataria, but they're not too big on responding to TGs)/

I have no idea where Hataria's homeland even is, there's a map of Haven if you are brave...

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y32/Freebo/Kashmire/HavenMap3.png

wrong map clan IIRC.

It's this one.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y32/Freebo/Kashmire/HavenMap2.png

I just think its ridiculous for you to prevent me from ever having a fair war against your nations because of those bases.

I just think its ridiculous for you to prevent me from ever having a fair war against your nations because of those bases.

We aren't preventing you from having a war, we are just letting you know the consequences if you do.

Operative word was fair. Because, in my opinion, it isn't fair to have thousands of troops march on my capital minutes after I declare war or side with an opponent of yours.

I have no idea where Hataria's homeland even is, there's a map of Haven if you are brave...

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y32/Freebo/Kashmire/HavenMap3.png

Oh God, I'm not going in there. We'll be ripped to shreds before we get to the border...

Operative word was fair. Because, in my opinion, it isn't fair to have thousands of troops march on my capital minutes after I declare war or side with an opponent of yours.

Life's not fair and we don't really have that many troops, if you tried anything it could hit us quite badly there.

Operative word was fair. Because, in my opinion, it isn't fair to have thousands of troops march on my capital minutes after I declare war or side with an opponent of yours.
The bases were established fairly, so yes it is fair that their owners get to wield the advantages they confer.

Life's not fair and we don't really have that many troops, if you tried anything it could hit us quite badly there.

just hit them pre-emptively before they can use the bases to there full advantage; napalm is your friend.

Okay, I haven’t even started reading the IC thread, but I hope y’all didn’t attack as I wasn’t near a computer. I got to make money for school. It would be fair, if y’all did what was asked as I’m like the biggest defender as I had Hat sign my treaty, which could have had stuff added to it by the Count.

I have saw what Demon said. Sir Daniels did that because what you said could have meant anything Hat did, be it protecting himself or sending soldiers to an allied nation to train and so on.

Anyways, this war makes Blub look like the old rulers then as honorable defenders of the free world. There reason reminds of a few reason that Hat has used.

CP, don’t act like an honorable person. Who in the Hell had to save your ass in the past after you started shit with Nova Europa? It was me. I got tired of it, so you were kicked out and those Havenites gave you what I should have done.

BL, that is why I don’t have foreign bases in my nation. There are only two foreign naval bases within the United Dominion. One is in Italy ands the other is in Germany. The only allies I trust our close ones.

I’ll point this out again OOCly like I have done in IC. I don’t think anybody will invade Haven, we are only defending him from the warmongers. I’m not going to invade Haven as I don’t need to

Now, off to read the thread.

OoC: Would any of the Anti-Hatarians mind if I created a neutral zone in Hataria [Far from the fighting] where I could set up refugee camps and deploy forces purely to defend non-combatants?

and it should beat any fighter out there

lol.

can you give some more (OOC) information on why this fighter would beat all the other air superiority fighters made by the established leading aeronautical NS nations?

you will have to ask Hataria, im already planning a rescue op if the war goes south.

OOC: What I meant was, it may not beat every fighter out there, but it will sure beat some fighter's out there. And no, for secrecy reason's I cannot disclose it, for I am worried that you might obtain it and use it against us :D Sorry, I wasn't quite clear on that, I have no hard feelings towards you, OOCly of course ;-)

Okay, I haven’t even started reading the IC thread, but I hope y’all didn’t attack as I wasn’t near a computer. I got to make money for school. It would be fair, if y’all did what was asked as I’m like the biggest defender as I had Hat sign my treaty, which could have had stuff added to it by the Count.

I have saw what Demon said. Sir Daniels did that because what you said could have meant anything Hat did, be it protecting himself or sending soldiers to an allied nation to train and so on.

Anyways, this war makes Blub look like the old rulers then as honorable defenders of the free world. There reason reminds of a few reason that Hat has used.

CP, don’t act like an honorable person. Who in the Hell had to save your ass in the past after you started shit with Nova Europa? It was me. I got tired of it, so you were kicked out and those Havenites gave you what I should have done.

BL, that is why I don’t have foreign bases in my nation. There are only two foreign naval bases within the United Dominion. One is in Italy ands the other is in Germany. The only allies I trust our close ones.

I’ll point this out again OOCly like I have done in IC. I don’t think anybody will invade Haven, we are only defending him from the warmongers. I’m not going to invade Haven as I don’t need to

Now, off to read the thread.

Can you see the problems here? You say that Hataria shouldn't be judged for past actions since his government has changed since then, but...

CP, don’t act like an honorable person. Who in the Hell had to save your ass in the past after you started shit with Nova Europa? It was me. I got tired of it, so you were kicked out and those Havenites gave you what I should have done.

CP, don’t act like an honorable person. Who in the Hell had to save your ass in the past after you started shit with Nova Europa? It was me. I got tired of it, so you were kicked out and those Havenites gave you what I should have done.

Nova Europa was only formed because they were so scarred of me, I was dealing with them fine before I was in the DC.

case in point the Nakil MBT and the 9k115 Metis AT weapon which can penetrate 800mm behind ERA and I believe its around 900mm for RHA..A few hits from one or one good shot and the king of the NS MBT is a smoldering hunk of expensive metal.

[OOC: The entire argument is stupid because of course a missile will be able to defeat a tank. That doesn't undermine the worth of the tank, and that doesn't mean that a NS tank won't be superior to a real-life tank, because they are. ]

just hit them pre-emptively before they can use the bases to there full advantage; napalm is your friend.

Which is pretty much what we're saying. In the short term he can hurt the bases there, but in the inevitable longer-term war afterwards, he'd be boned.

Nova Europa was only formed because they were so scarred of me, I was dealing with them fine before I was in the DC.

You almost started nuclear war have many times? Dealing with them fine, would be being nice to them.

(Encrypted)

TO: ALLIES OF HATARIA
FROM: THE ALLIED STATES OF GREEN HAWK

***START MESSAGE***
CAN NOT SUPPLY FORCE TO AID IN DEFNSE, BUT WE HAVE A PLAN IN PLACE CALLED COLD FOG. COLD FOG IS A CODE NAME FOR A TASK FORCE. THE TASK FORCE IS MADE UP OF TWO AIRCRAFT CARRIERS, SUPPORT SHIPS AND THEIR ESCORTS. THEIR INTEL MISSION IS MEDEVAC. IF WAR BREAKS OUT AND YOU HAVE WOUNDED, HELICOPTERS WILL COME AND PICK UP THE WOUNDED. THEY WILL THEN BE BROUGHT BACK TO THE SMALL FLEET TO RECIVE TREATMENTS FOR THEIR WOUNDS. THEY WILL ALSO BE BROUGHT BACK TO THIER HOME COUNTRY AFTER BEING FULLY HEALED. THE TASK FORCE WILL NOT, REPEAT, NOT TAKE PART IN ANY AND ALL BATTLES THAT MIGHT TAKE PLACE NEAR THEM. THEY WILL HAVE THE RED CROSS PAINTED ON THEM TO SHOW THAT THEY ARE THERE TO HEAL, NOT FIGHT. REQUEST TO KNOW WHAT ALLIES THINK OF THIS.

***END MESSAGE***

OOC: In other words I won't stand by and do nothing, but my size will make me a problem on the battlefield. I will do better in getting the injured off the battlefield then putting people in there who will just get in the way. I might enter the war (if there is one, hopefully we can make peace :D) later with troops.

Why has no one answered? Also, in the NS world, is there international law for war? You know like, you cannot attack medical ships 'n stuff like that.

I should be listed on the "Aggressor" list* (as should Mekugi). MekWealtth needs to show the colours and all...

*Intra-Havenic support anyway. Mek can't post for a few days so he gave me two expeditionary fleets of his to go and protect Blubland. Yes, we need something to do.


Oh God, I'm not going in there. We'll be ripped to shreds before we get to the border...

HAVEN PREVAILS.

Why has no one answered? Also, in the NS world, is there international law for war? You know like, you cannot attack medical ships 'n stuff like that.

its fine with me.

There is a post and I have to take a shower. I wanted to get a IC post in before the thread gained more pages.

And I would like you to not post anything, but messages about doing what the Count asked or not doing. The reason is I’m being working again and it’s farm works, so I will not be a computers. Thank you for doing what I asked early.

Later!

Hey everyone,
I kindly asked the ADAN to help aid. Here is the catch, they do not want this assault to be more than a loose friendship to defeat a common enemy. They will not touch Hataria with a ten-foot-long pole. So instead of striking Hataria, they may just as well strike at the DC members trying to save his ass.

You want to know why I switched sides? My IC and OOC anger towards Transylvania is why. Hataria was an enemy of Dephire, for life, and when Transylvania admitted Hataria into the Dominion Commonwealth, then Scythis began losing respect for the Count. All Scythis asked was for the DC to eject Hataria, simple as that. Instead, The Count of Transylvania came at Scythis with an "Angry" and "Commanding" voice. Now, I don't want the slaughter of thousands of innocent people. This may sound rather odd, but I want the nation of Hataria to be a much better place. I wanted to completely erase their government and institute a different government that would be more of a constitutional monarchy or flatout Capitalistic Democracy. There is no liberty with an absolute monarch.

I've also not shown any military aggressions other than just having my fleet float three hundred miles off the Hatarian shore.

If you think I'm wrong in my ideas, then tell me. I will actually listen to reason.

OOC dislike toward someone isn't a good reason for war with them...like I said to NC, just not cricket. On a further note, that's why me and Wagdog are there. We'll be guiding, with the help of nations like Vetalia, to get Hat into a less...gung-ho state of mind.

are you sure that 300 miles off of Hataria's shore is outside of their territory?

My Anger Towards Hataria Is Strictly Ic, What The Hell Do You People Not Understand? Do You Not Read?

I assume your talking about that series that lasted a grand 13 episodes into the 3rd season?

No, one of the great puppetwankers of NS lore. One of these days we'll prolly nswiki him for having 60+ puppets that all talked to each other.

Oh well I didn't know...and Mac I believe I cleared up my point on the Nakil thing..hope its clear now..

Could someone please provide us with a map of Hataria? It's pretty hard to plan defenses if you don't have the slightest idea what the country looks like.

Dephire, I wonder how you'd be able to move them towards a more democratic society by bombing the hell out of them again; all that would do, at least from my perspective, is radicalize them even more and push them further towards autocracy. I don't think you're going to be able to force a condition on them they don't want; the best you can do is take the framework in place and gradually move towards the desired goal.

At this point I really want to settle this peacefully. There was a treaty thread with negotiations goign on and I think we really need to continue this.

No, one of the great puppetwankers of NS lore. One of these days we'll prolly nswiki him for having 60+ puppets that all talked to each other.

0_0 whoa...that'd take a ton of time....

Im pretty sure Peace is out of the question..Haven with the exception of Demon 666 won't even acknowledge the talks, and I understand your point of view Dephire, I'm supporting Hataria independently since I don't see vengeance as a legit pretext for a war that already ended with Hataria being defeated...and if its because the treaties or whatever weren't specific enough then thats the conquerers fault from the previous war and still not legit grounds for war.

Which is pretty much what we're saying. In the short term he can hurt the bases there, but in the inevitable longer-term war afterwards, he'd be boned.

*nods* well it depends on how well he Rped it; after smiting the bases and taking away your foot hold in his country he could make you bleed for every inch so it depends on how much you guys are willing to lose to bring down the smack I guess.

By the way, I'm not sure if I've mentioned this before, but I have a tiny little fleet sitting outside of Hatarian waters for security (I mean with the ball, in case something went wrong), and one fancy Nimitz class carrier sitting near-ish to the Hatarian coast. We won't be attacking anyone, we're just there to protect the palace because the Prince is there. However, if he leaves, Hataria's fair game.

Can we please keep the OOC in here and out of the IC thread!

Blub in my proposed treaty I called for a 60 million manpower limit total plus other more specific restrictions...

My apologies. I hadn't seen this thread when I posted OOC, so I'll post the posts here.

The Colony of the People of Sumguy will send 500 of its Spetznas soldiers to help Sumguy in his defense of the oil fields

OOC: Puppetwanking? Let's try to avoid this here. After all, there's a lot of really powerful puppets out there...

A televised Response by Fuhrer Richtoff to The Blub Colonies message:

First, you said it exactly right. It is the past. The ones who reigned death upon you are no more. They are under different leadership now. Put it behind you. Why you refuse to see this, I don't know.

Also, many nations of the world have armies of 2% or more of their total population. Hataria, with an army of 60 million soldiers, has less than 1% of it's population in the armed forces. Larger nations need larger armies to defend their larger borders. But once agian, you look through the facts.

No, instead of focusing on the facts, instead of delving for the truth, you rely on your inner passion, your hate for the Hataria of old, to feul on your current rampage. You ignore the new Hataria, one where all the nation is consumed by rebuilding. All one needs to do is survey the scene, and it becomes clear that Hataira's army is in fact defensive, that you are the aggressor, and that Hataria is in fact different than it used to be. And through it all, your army presses on. Why? I do not know. All I know is that thousands, maybe even millions of men will die because of this rashness. I beg you, nations involved, come to Kampfers Stadt and negotiate this peacefully.


OOC: Actually, I hate to be a pest, but that's not including logistics. Logistics usually account for 5/6 of an army, So either Hataria has a really high rate of people in the army (6%) or he has just 10 million soldiers and 50 million in logistics.

So someone, (That's you, Blub or Hataria) need to fix their demands/numbers. After al Hataria, a 6% rate is quite high, even without taking into account how you aren't exactly in the best shape right now. On the other hand Blubs, if they only have 10 million in their army, then I'm positive that you can just scratch that demand off of the list.

Blub in my proposed treaty I called for a 60 million manpower limit total plus other more specific restrictions...

See, I like those conditions and I think I can speak for the Blubs by saying that that looks like a good deal.

this was my work in progress:

1. Military personell for all branches will not exceed 60 million

2. No WMD's of any kind (this includes the Excalibur weapon system)

3. Only 2 aircraft carriers allowed in the new Hatarian fleet

4. No Ballistic missle subs, or any other systems capable of delivering Ballistic missles or like weapons includes Missile silos

5. No long range bombers or strike craft

6. No more than 1 million tanks allowed in the Hatarian army

7. No orbital weapons systems, Survey satellites would be allowed with no weapons capabilities

8. No Superdeadnaughts allowed in the Hatarian Navy, the Hatarian navy would not be allowed to have any vessels except for those needed for coastal defense purposes. in other words no amphibious assault ships etc etc..

9. The allowance of International inspectors to ensure that all previous measures are agreed to in a satisfactory manner

10. Hataria can not produce a surplus of any type of weapon or Military equipment and may only put weapons into production to replace old equipment. Only allowed to produce arms after International inspectors confirmed the old equipment has been destroyed.

See, I like those conditions and I think I can speak for the Blubs by saying that that looks like a good deal.

You don't speak for the Blubs.

Alright. Hataria has a history of breaking treaties when he wants to (see Treaty of Singapore). I have no idea what makes you all think that he will suddenly decide to play nice now.

Ok glad you agree on the Humanitarian bit as well..

6. No more than 1 million tanks allowed in the Hatarian army


Um. Nobody has more than a million tanks that I know of. This requirement is stupid.

You don't speak for the Blubs.


I know I don't actually, it was a figure of speech, meaning that I think that the Blubs will find that more concrete and agreeable than the last proposition.

thats why i put in the stipulation that there will be international inspectors to monitor what he does..and if he doesn't comply then he will be occupied possibly indefinitely by several nations and Hataria would be carved up and divided much like Germany after ww2

well i know several people with more than a million tanks...anyways cut that number to 50,000 then? since tanks are used mostly for offensive purposes..

well i know several people with more than a million tanks...anyways cut that number to 50,000 then? since tanks are used mostly for offensive purposes..

Well in Hat's latest and greatest war, he used

23 TR-1 Walking Tanks, one TR-2 tripod walker and 30 T-90 Main Battle Tanks

to try and invade Demon 666. I don't really think we'll have to worry about tanks.

well i know several people with more than a million tanks...anyways cut that number to 50,000 then? since tanks are used mostly for offensive purposes..

Then they're wanking. Only insane people like Allanea that have MASSIVE economies can really afford over a million tanks. I'm not sure why you guys are even bothering with the treaty, as Hataria is inevitably going to ignore it.

well i know several people with more than a million tanks...anyways cut that number to 50,000 then? since tanks are used mostly for offensive purposes..

Even The Macabees, Scand States, Doom and Allanea have around 500k tanks, prolly 700k tops. And with the exception of Scand who is just really big, most of them have smaller navies.

Oh, and by the way, the last time Hataria had a 60 million-man army, he had a draft going and he was in the middle of war with Demon 666.

I have 60,000,000 Troops in My Army (It was 40,000,000 till That Moroccan War then it Jumped up thanks to Drafting)

I already cut the number to 50,000 so why are you two still carrying on about the previous one? and under my proposal Hataria couldn't have a 60 million man army unless he chooses to have no navy or air force...

I already cut the number to 50,000 so why are you two still carrying on about the previous one?

We still don't really need it. As you can see, Hataria's not much of a tank person.

and under my proposal Hataria couldn't have a 60 million man army unless he chooses to have no navy or air force...

Or food, or weapons, or ammunition, etc.

and again with the inferior technology bit...NS tech isn't invincible and in fact is easily dealt with using RL equipment..anyways then we can just remove the armor limitations on his army entirely then. easy enough

How about limiting Hataria to like .5% or .75% of their pop in the military, which is reasonable sane. And make it so only half of those combatants can be on duty during peace time. That way his military can grow with his nation, but it will alot smaller then offensive oriented militaries.

this was my work in progress:

1. Military personell for all branches will not exceed 60 million

2. No WMD's of any kind (this includes the Excalibur weapon system)

3. Only 2 aircraft carriers allowed in the new Hatarian fleet

4. No Ballistic missle subs, or any other systems capable of delivering Ballistic missles or like weapons includes Missile silos

5. No long range bombers or strike craft

6. No more than 1 million tanks allowed in the Hatarian army

7. No orbital weapons systems, Survey satellites would be allowed with no weapons capabilities

8. No Superdeadnaughts allowed in the Hatarian Navy, the Hatarian navy would not be allowed to have any vessels except for those needed for coastal defense purposes. in other words no amphibious assault ships etc etc..

9. The allowance of International inspectors to ensure that all previous measures are agreed to in a satisfactory manner

10. Hataria can not produce a surplus of any type of weapon or Military equipment and may only put weapons into production to replace old equipment. Only allowed to produce arms after International inspectors confirmed the old equipment has been destroyed.

I would fully agree with this.

How about limiting Hataria to like .5% or .75% of their pop in the military, which is reasonable sane. And make it so only half of those combatants can be on duty during peace time. That way his military can grow with his nation, but it will alot smaller then offensive oriented militaries.

That sounds good. We should probably rewrite the agreement.

thats a more lenient view than i had but sounds reasonable..and if Hataria doesn't accept terms which i know he wont then we can form the treaty for when Hataria is defeated again this time it can be a concrete one..as Myself and Siriusa are withdrawing to be neutral and only hold the interests of saving civilian lives so this is the Updated Treaty:

Treaty of Kafita

1. The Military of Hataria shall not exceed .5% of the total population this is inclusive of all military branches

2. No WMD's of any kind (this includes the Excalibur weapon system)

3. Only 2 aircraft carriers allowed in the new Hatarian fleet

4. No Ballistic missle subs, or any other systems capable of delivering Ballistic missles or like weapons includes Missile silos

5. No long range bombers or strike craft

6. No orbital weapons systems, Survey satellites would be allowed with no weapons capabilities

7. No Superdeadnaughts allowed in the Hatarian Navy, the Hatarian navy would not be allowed to have any vessels except for those needed for coastal defense purposes. in other words no amphibious assault ships etc etc..

8. The allowance of International inspectors to ensure that all previous measures are agreed to in a satisfactory manner

9. Hataria can not produce a surplus of any type of weapon or Military equipment and may only put weapons into production to replace old equipment. Only allowed to produce arms after International inspectors confirmed the old equipment has been destroyed.

10. Should Hataria fail to comply with any of the above stipulations Hataria will render itself subject to invasion and occupation by the ratifying members of this treaty

1. The Military of Hataria shall not exceed .015% of the total population

Ohhhh he (and Transylvania) won't be happy about that. Edit it to .5% or something like that, and be sure to include the "All branches" bit.

thats a more lenient view than i had but sounds reasonable..and if Hataria doesn't accept terms which i know he wont then we can form the treaty for when Hataria is defeated again this time it can be a concrete one..as Myself and Siriusa are withdrawing to be neutral and only hold the interests of saving civilian lives so this is the Updated Treaty:

Treaty of Kafita

1. The Military of Hataria shall not exceed .5% of the total population

2. No WMD's of any kind (this includes the Excalibur weapon system)

3. Only 2 aircraft carriers allowed in the new Hatarian fleet

4. No Ballistic missle subs, or any other systems capable of delivering Ballistic missles or like weapons includes Missile silos

5. No long range bombers or strike craft

6. No orbital weapons systems, Survey satellites would be allowed with no weapons capabilities

7. No Superdeadnaughts allowed in the Hatarian Navy, the Hatarian navy would not be allowed to have any vessels except for those needed for coastal defense purposes. in other words no amphibious assault ships etc etc..

8. The allowance of International inspectors to ensure that all previous measures are agreed to in a satisfactory manner

9. Hataria can not produce a surplus of any type of weapon or Military equipment and may only put weapons into production to replace old equipment. Only allowed to produce arms after International inspectors confirmed the old equipment has been destroyed.

10. Should Hataria fail to comply with any of the above stipulations Hataria will render itself subject to invasion and occupation by the ratifying members of this treaty

I would back this is if I saw action to actually inforce it as Hataria will break those points anyway.

that was a typo..

well like I said this treaty can be used after Hataria is beaten this time...which i am pretty sure is going to happen..I am glad to see that some Haven members find this treaty acceptable...

Oh ok :p

And we should probably add something in there that if Hataria breaks the agreement, all the nations that sign will go to war with him or something like that.

And I'm not sure Hataria will be beaten, he's got a lot more support this time.

why not before? i dont want my miltary to be destroyed...

The Hegemony would be willing to sign this treaty.

Thats what the last stipulation is...if he breaks it then he is subject to a justified invasion by the ratifying members of this treaty..

Now all we need is for the rest of Haven to accept this treaty..any other suggestions Clandonia?

Whoops didn't see that. Alrighty, sounds good, I'll sign it IC when the time comes.

Now all we need is for the rest of Haven to accept this treaty..any other suggestions Clandonia?

Monetary compensation for Blub and all other nations affected by Hatarian military action, reparations over a set amount of time. Don't expect me to back down from supporting Blub though.

Treaty of Kafita

1. The Military of Hataria shall not exceed .5% of the total population this is inclusive of all military branches

2. No WMD's of any kind (this includes the Excalibur weapon system)

3. Only 2 aircraft carriers allowed in the new Hatarian fleet

4. No Ballistic missle subs, or any other systems capable of delivering Ballistic missles or like weapons includes Missile silos

5. No long range bombers or strike craft

6. No orbital weapons systems, Survey satellites would be allowed with no weapons capabilities

7. No Superdeadnaughts allowed in the Hatarian Navy, the Hatarian navy would not be allowed to have any vessels except for those needed for coastal defense purposes. in other words no amphibious assault ships etc etc..

8. The allowance of International inspectors to ensure that all previous measures are agreed to in a satisfactory manner

9. Hataria can not produce a surplus of any type of weapon or Military equipment and may only put weapons into production to replace old equipment. Only allowed to produce arms after International inspectors confirmed the old equipment has been destroyed.

10. Hataria must repay all nations affected by its previous aggressive actions reparations to family members of those who were killed as a direct result of Hatarian belligerence, reparations for the reconstruction of cities destroyed by Hatarian forces, Reparation for equipment lost while putting an end to Hatarian aggression, Reparations would be payed out over a period of 60 years, If direct family members to those killed by Hatarian forces can not be found then payment will go to the respective government

11. Should Hataria fail to comply with any of the above stipulations Hataria will render itself subject to invasion and occupation by the ratifying members of this treaty

I can adjust the Time period etc etc as needed.

Even The Macabees, Scand States, Doom and Allanea have around 500k tanks, prolly 700k tops. And with the exception of Scand who is just really big, most of them have smaller navies.

I believe Mac and Scan have no more then 200,000 each. Or so it is what they have told me. And 200,000 is a huge ammount in itself, with 500,000 being insane. As I understand it, the Nakil sales page, which lists such huge numbers, lists purchases, and many of those have apparently been sold off again, or given away, or have just plain old been used for parts, reserve, and targets.
Hell, 50k is huge, and terain should be more a factor then anything in limiting his tanks.

ICly I have no stance on this invasion. I'm just bored and wanted to pipe in on that.

We agree to sign the treaty of Kafita, believing that we can still avert war with Blub and Haven, and thus this treaty will stop the war in it's tracks. We hope other's sign this too, for it will benefit us all, plus if Hataria break's it, we can attack him if he does that, so I don't see a problem with this treaty.

Wouldn't it be a better idea to limit Hataria's military technology as well as numbers?

It wouldn't matter if he had a million tanks if they were all Soviet-era junk, for example.

problem is there is no way in hell Hataria or Trans will agree to this treaty..thus the war will continue. and this treaty will most likely be what Hataria has to comply with when he gives his surrender speech...My forces are now Neutral and are only there to save Civilian lives..

Treaty of Kafita

1. The Military of Hataria shall not exceed .5% of the total population this is inclusive of all military branches

2. No WMD's of any kind (this includes the Excalibur weapon system)

3. Only 2 aircraft carriers allowed in the new Hatarian fleet

4. No Ballistic missle subs, or any other systems capable of delivering Ballistic missles or like weapons includes Missile silos

5. No long range bombers or strike craft

6. No orbital weapons systems, Survey satellites would be allowed with no weapons capabilities

7. No Superdeadnaughts allowed in the Hatarian Navy, the Hatarian navy would not be allowed to have any vessels except for those needed for coastal defense purposes. in other words no amphibious assault ships etc etc..

8. The allowance of International inspectors to ensure that all previous measures are agreed to in a satisfactory manner

9. Hataria can not produce a surplus of any type of weapon or Military equipment and may only put weapons into production to replace old equipment. Only allowed to produce arms after International inspectors confirmed the old equipment has been destroyed. Also Hataria can not develop any new weapon technologies unless approved by the Ratifying members of this treaty.

10. Hataria must repay all nations affected by its previous aggressive actions reparations to family members of those who were killed as a direct result of Hatarian belligerence, reparations for the reconstruction of cities destroyed by Hatarian forces, Reparation for equipment lost while putting an end to Hatarian aggression, Reparations would be payed out over a period of 60 years, If direct family members to those killed by Hatarian forces can not be found then payment will go to the respective government

11. Should Hataria fail to comply with any of the above stipulations Hataria will render itself subject to invasion and occupation by the ratifying members of this treaty

Anything else...?

problem is there is no way in hell Hataria or Trans will agree to this treaty..thus the war will continue. and this treaty will most likely be what Hataria has to comply with when he gives his surrender speech...My forces are now Neutral and are only there to save Civilian lives..

Treaty of Kafita

1. The Military of Hataria shall not exceed .5% of the total population this is inclusive of all military branches

2. No WMD's of any kind (this includes the Excalibur weapon system)

3. Only 2 aircraft carriers allowed in the new Hatarian fleet

4. No Ballistic missle subs, or any other systems capable of delivering Ballistic missles or like weapons includes Missile silos

5. No long range bombers or strike craft

6. No orbital weapons systems, Survey satellites would be allowed with no weapons capabilities

7. No Superdeadnaughts allowed in the Hatarian Navy, the Hatarian navy would not be allowed to have any vessels except for those needed for coastal defense purposes. in other words no amphibious assault ships etc etc..

8. The allowance of International inspectors to ensure that all previous measures are agreed to in a satisfactory manner

9. Hataria can not produce a surplus of any type of weapon or Military equipment and may only put weapons into production to replace old equipment. Only allowed to produce arms after International inspectors confirmed the old equipment has been destroyed. Also Hataria can not develop any new weapon technologies unless approved by the Ratifying members of this treaty.

10. Hataria must repay all nations affected by its previous aggressive actions reparations to family members of those who were killed as a direct result of Hatarian belligerence, reparations for the reconstruction of cities destroyed by Hatarian forces, Reparation for equipment lost while putting an end to Hatarian aggression, Reparations would be payed out over a period of 60 years, If direct family members to those killed by Hatarian forces can not be found then payment will go to the respective government

11. Should Hataria fail to comply with any of the above stipulations Hataria will render itself subject to invasion and occupation by the ratifying members of this treaty

Anything else...?

these will be lifted eventually right? if not, then it is basically an RP death-sentence for Hataria...

Could someone please provide us with a map of Hataria? It's pretty hard to plan defenses if you don't have the slightest idea what the country looks like.

Dephire, I wonder how you'd be able to move them towards a more democratic society by bombing the hell out of them again; all that would do, at least from my perspective, is radicalize them even more and push them further towards autocracy. I don't think you're going to be able to force a condition on them they don't want; the best you can do is take the framework in place and gradually move towards the desired goal.

Unless I'm mistaken and I got up in the middle of the night to post that I blew Hataria all to hell, then I have NOT even pushed towards striking Hataria. I am not wanting to kill innocent people. All I want is for the DC to leave Hataria so that other people can have their say in how the government of Hataria be run. I'd like Hataria to be more democratic, and you can't have a democracy with absolute monarchy. My forces would only be near/in Hataria to push out the DC, because it is pointless blasting away at already ruined cities. Do not put words in my mouth, for you do not know what my intentions are. In case you haven't noticed, I have not done any attacks.

Now then, we are working on a treaty?

these will be lifted eventually right? if not, then it is basically an RP death-sentence for Hataria...

Not every RP has to be war you know...

Not every RP has to be war you know...

from what ive seen, the vast majority are.

Actually, you'd be surprised. If you count OOC threads as war, then yeah, because otherwise your thread gets spammed to hell and back through what people are needing, doing, etc.

I'd say that the majority are war threads, but not a vast majority, by any means.

These will be lifted, yes, after Hataria has proven that he doesn't need them.

So, never?

Hm, I would suggest clarifying what counts as WMDs under the treaty (since there isn't even agreement amongst some people in this thread about them), as well as also setting up a timetable or a yearly payment or something for the reparations.

Also, as far as reparations go, there should be a requirement that to recieve reparations, a nation must sign a non-agression pact with Hataria-- that way people can't just siphon off cash and then kick Hataria while he's down.

Term #10 is ridiculous and won't happen.

Term #10 is ridiculous and won't happen.

If it does happen, it needs to be written out extremely well to prevent just crippling the Hatarian economy entirely.

Forces update from me, since I'll be posting the IC arrival start of Fifth Army group after this. In here, naturally, so as not to spam up the main thread with endless ORBATs. Still behind the treaty myself including AN's points, but nonetheless IC preparations are needed if able to be made...

In Place (Slight corrections applied to the artillery numbers, to match my actual organization)...
Army/Air Force
2 Army Group HQ's
Third and Fourth Armies

~280,000 Personnel
7,000 MBT-30B Tanks, 3,000 T-17B Tankettes
3600 BKCh-1 APCs
1200 BKCh-T CFVs
1500 BKCh-SU SP & 750 2A18M towed Infantry Guns
1440 2S7A SPH, 900 Smerch MLRS, 900 SS-23 SRBM, 900 SSC-4 GLCM
4500 SA-21 Growler SAMs, 1500 TS-M1 SPAA
800 UT-7B CEVs
~14000 DOZOR-BHMMWVs
~9000 Trucks (Variously MAZ-543M or Ural-4320)

Third and Fourth Air Forces

258,000 Personnel
500 Fighters (500 MiG-39/1.44)
500 VTOL Attack Aircraft (500 Yak-41M)
500 Strike & Bomber Aircraft (400 Su-34 100 Tu-160M; bombers proper to remain in Wagdog for sake of security and diplomacy...)
500 Transports (200 An-72, 100 Il-76MF, 100 An-124, 100 An-225)
200 AWACS (200 A-50M)
200 Tankers (200 Il-78M)
200 EW Aircraft (200 Il-76PP)
700 Helicopters (400 Ka-29, 200 AH-1RO, 100 Mi-26
240 BKCh-1 APCs
2400 DOZOR-B HMMWV's
~10,000 Trucks (Variously MAZ-543M or Ural-4320)

Navy/Marine Corps
Third and Fourth Fleets

10 Tri Svyatitelya Supercarriers (~7,000 a/c, 22,000 marines carried total)
10 Peter the Great Heavy Battleships
80 Danechka-Mod Destroyers
40 Vladimir Submarines
200 Yuri Patrol Craft (docked in Carriers' well decks)
100 Aleksandrova LCAC (docked in Carriers' well decks)
20 The People's Class Replenishment Ships
20 Vol'nitsa Hospital Ships

3rd and 4th Marine Divisions

~22,000 Personnel
280 MBT-25S Tanks, 120 T-17B Tankettes
480 BKCh-1 APCs
96 BKCh-T CFVs
150 BKCh-SU SP & 30 2A18M towed Infantry Guns
144 2S7A SPH, 180 Smerch MLRS, 180 SS-23 SRBM, 180 SSC-4 GLCM
180 SA-21 Growler SAMs, 60 TS-M1 SPAAs
80 UT-7B CEVs
~1200 DOZOR-BHMMWVs
~1200 Trucks (Variously MAZ-543M or Ural-4320


Arriving...
Fifth Army Group
Fifth Army

~140,000 Personnel
3500 MBT-30B Tanks, 1,500 T-17B Tankettes
1800 BKCh-1 APCs
600 BKCh-T CFVs
750 BKCh-SU SP & 375 2A18M towed Infantry Guns
720 2S7A SPH, 450 Smerch MLRS, 450 SS-23 SRBM, 450 SSC-4 GLCM
2250 SA-21 Growler SAMs, 750 TS-M1 SPAA
400 UT-7B CEVs
~7000 DOZOR-BHMMWVs
~4500 Trucks (Variously MAZ-543M or Ural-4320)

Fifth Air Force

129,000 Personnel
250 Fighters (250 MiG-39/1.44)
250 VTOL Attack Aircraft (250 Yak-41M)
250 Strike & Bomber Aircraft (200 Su-34, 50 Tu-160M; bombers proper to remain in Wagdog for sake of security and diplomacy, as before...)
250 Transports (100 An-72, 50 Il-76MF, 50 An-124, 50 An-225)
100 AWACS (100 A-50M)
100 Tankers (100 Il-78M)
100 EW Aircraft (100 Il-76PP)
350 Helicopters (200 Ka-29, 100 AH-1RO, 50 Mi-26
120 BKCh-1 APCs
1200 DOZOR-B HMMWV's
~5,000 Trucks (Variously MAZ-543M or Ural-4320)


Total Pending Full Deployment...
Three Army Groups
Three Armies

~520,000 Personnel
10500 MBT-30B Tanks, 4,500 T-17B Tankettes
5400 BKCh-1 APCs
1800 BKCh-T CFVs
2250 BKCh-SU SP & 1,125 2A18M towed Infantry Guns
2,160 2S7A SPH, 1350 Smerch MLRS, 1350 SS-23 SRBM, 1350 SSC-4 GLCM
6750 SA-21 Growler SAMs, 2250 TS-M1 SPAA
1200 UT-7B CEVs
~21000 DOZOR-BHMMWVs
~13500 Trucks (Variously MAZ-543M or Ural-4320)

Three Air Forces

387,000 Personnel
750 Fighters (750 MiG-39/1.44)
750 VTOL Attack Aircraft (750 Yak-41M)
750 Strike & Bomber Aircraft (600 Su-34, 150 Tu-160M; bombers proper to remain in Wagdog for sake of security and diplomacy, as before...)
750 Transports (300 An-72, 150 Il-76MF, 150 An-124, 150 An-225)
300 AWACS (300 A-50M)
300 Tankers (300 Il-78M)
300 EW Aircraft (300 Il-76PP)
1050 Helicopters (600 Ka-29, 300 AH-1RO, 150 Mi-26
360 BKCh-1 APCs
3600 DOZOR-B HMMWV's
~15,000 Trucks (Variously MAZ-543M or Ural-4320)
Two Fleets (as listed above)
Two Marine Divisions (as listed above)
Two Marine Air Wings (as listed above in Carrier a/c, since MAWs are responsible for carrier aviaition in USSW forces...)

Term #10 is ridiculous and won't happen.

Never heard of the Treaty of Versailles then? The reparations would have to be a figure like ten times Hatarias GDP paid over a long time period. If it isn't going to happen then I guess I will have to strip mine the place.

Never heard of the Treaty of Versailles then? The reparations would have to be a figure like ten times Hatarias GDP paid over a long time period. If it isn't going to happen then I guess I will have to strip mine the place.

the Treaty of Versailles completely ruined germany and made the people desperate enough to let Hitler come to power...

the Treaty of Versailles completely ruined germany and made the people desperate enough to let Hitler come to power...

The Treaty didn't ruin Germany nor did it directly lead to the rise of power. But anyway, Hataria is going to pay his weight or else.

the Treaty of Versailles completely ruined germany and made the people desperate enough to let Hitler come to power...

and he only got in a postion for all out war because Britain and France never enforced the arms limitations after his rise to power..swings and round abouts.

Can we get back to the point at hand and drop the history lession stuff?

Shaz which side are you actually supporting?

Shaz which side are you actually supporting?

I've just been reading and posted my neutrality in the thread. But this thread was going off-topic with information not relivant to what is actually going on.

I find it funny that there are alot of people supporting the Blubs, a lot of people supporting changes in Hataria (not necessarily for the DC), some people supporting DC, and then there are a helluvah lot of people supporting neutrality.

I've just been reading and posted my neutrality in the thread. But this thread was going off-topic with information not relivant to what is actually going on.

sure; sorry.

giving some objective imput; I think Point 10 needs to be explained more; like what the agressors and Hataria consider a reasonable amount of conpensation? and I think you guys need more expicit rules on his arms limitations so that he can defend himself without being able to actually project power which is the important bit.

sure; sorry.

giving some objective imput; I think Point 10 needs to be explained more; like what the agressors and Hataria consider a reasonable amount of conpensation? and I think you guys need more expicit rules on his arms limitations so that he can defend himself without being able to actually project power which is the important bit.

Preventing force projection is easy; just ban the construction of amphibious assault ships and limit the number of long range heavy lift military aircraft of any type, where aircraft includes both fixed-wing craft and devices such as gigantic zeppelins or airships such as those I use.

Yes the treaty would be temporary..and as for the treaty being unfair It is clear Hataria's Military has to be limited severely especially with the record of aggression and of breaking treaties..But we could add things in that help keep the Hatarian economy alive etc etc..that way the people don't become resentful

I'm glad you listened to my reasoning, Getaway.

Well Hataria must be dealt with and contained but it must be done in such a manner that we do not create a bigger monster that we will have to deal with in the future, the other parties must realize this and look through the hatred and dislike that clouds their judgment

The reparations are ridiculous. Is Britain going to give us money because they blew up buildings and killed our soldiers in the Revolutionary War?

Term #10 is ridiculous and won't happen.

Seconded on that as Hat doesn’t even had the money to keep his nation up right now. Foreign aid is the only thing helping him. I haven’t even started reading the IC thread, but I did give you all the option to modified the Treaty of the Second Age.

And to answered Why's question about Hat breaking this treaty. Like what I did with CP, Hat lost a big ally in a time of need and got his ass kicked. He learned his bloody lesson and if he screws me, I’ll make Hat will be nothing but a rumor because nobody betrays the Count and lives that long.

well #10 could be cut out. and we could add things to help aid the reconstruction of Hataria's economy etc etc again so the people are not resentful and a economically stronger Hataria with limited military could be good for a lot of people.

True, but it looks like everybody ignored the Count and looks like they only want war. And the Negotiating a Truce thread has too much OOC nonsense in it, so I would like everybody to come to the talks as I don’t war, but I will defend an ally.

OOC: Yup. That's part of the reason the Blubs know this whole "60 million limit" thing is pure bullcrap.

It's supposed to be 60 million TOTAL. That means airforce, navy, coast guard, army and logistics. Hataria is treating it like a 60 million man army, while still having a navy and airforce and logistics. In reality, if he has 60 million in his army fighting force.. he'd need like 400 million total, plus navy and air force.

Funny how no one else is mentioning that Hataria has ALREADY broken this big restrictive treaty that everyone is defending him because he signed. ^.^

And that is the player’s fault. Are you going to do IC actions for an OOC mistake. I hope not. Everybody makes mistakes, people!

No, if Hataria chooses to ignore it and create a 60 million man army as well as having a sizable air force and navy, he's broken the treaty ICly and we have every right to kick the crap out of him. It's an IC mistake and an IC response.

Learn the difference between OOC and IC, Trans, as you tend to blend the two indiscriminately to protect yourself.

Perhaps because none of us trust you in the slightest and would rather directly deal with Hataria.

And you really have no right to say what we can do ICly. If I feel like kicking the crap out of him because he exceeds the treaty limit, I can.

Man I love how we all talk about peace.

Transylvania, you need to allow other nations into the agreements. You need to allow others to bring justice and uphold the laws. Always enforcing everything by yourself taxes you too greatly. I'm not saying this to tick you off, I'm saying this as a friend.

Perhaps because none of us trust you in the slightest and would rather directly deal with Hataria.

And you really have no right to say what we can do ICly. If I feel like kicking the crap out of him because he exceeds the treaty limit, I can.

And you can be ignored, too. I’m feeling about doing that right now as you’re messing up my buzz.

Man I love how we all talk about peace.

Transylvania, you need to allow other nations into the agreements. You need to allow others to bring justice and uphold the laws. Always enforcing everything by yourself taxes you too greatly. I'm not saying this to tick you off, I'm saying this as a friend.

I fucking tired to do that, D, but it looked like everybody ignored me be cause they only want war.

Simple solution, lets amend the treaty of the Second Age and get this over with. That military thing sounds like an intentional loophole............

Simple solution, lets amend the treaty of the Second Age and get this over with. That military thing sounds like an intentional loophole............

We have a new treaty in production from No Endorse, its nearly ready hold onto your milk bottles now children.

We have a new treaty in production from No Endorse, its nearly ready hold onto your milk bottles now children.

In which will be one side and I'm working on something right now.

I fucking tired to do that, D, but it looked like everybody ignored me be cause they only want war.

Hm. Well, as you obviously can see, I do not want war, I want to push diplomacy. Even though I haven't posted it, my fleet was there incase something should arise in which I needed to enact upon myself as a ref. I'm loyal to my Haven brothers, but I'm also loyal to my friends. Why else would I push to resolve this issue? If given a chance, I too would like to post my thoughts for a treaty.

Hm. Well, as you obviously can see, I do not want war, I want to push diplomacy. If given a chance, I too would like to post my thoughts for a treaty.

I’m trying to push it diplomacy, but everybody ignored the Count. And Vega shouldn't say anything as he is traitor in the eye of the Count.

Everybody, wait until I post my IC post that in is working.

We have a good and fair treaty, its much less harsh than the other ones on Hatarias military.

We have a good and fair treaty, its much less harsh than the other ones on Hatarias military.

Everybody, wait until I post my IC post that in is working.

I have posted one of my many ideas. Note how I stated "In times of peace" on several occasions. I do feel that a nation can do anything it wants to when trying to defend itself from a foreign aggressor.

Okay I posted my post. http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=528088

I have used some of the thing that you guys have said. Even in the original Treaty, there was the option to add things to it. But nobody asked to add anything, even after I posted for the whole worked to see. The modified Treaty of the Second Age is the only treaty that will official be signed by the Count or any of his people.

I still give the option to add things as long as they are fair.

However, the recent treaties proposed by myself, Vetka (sp?), and Getaway are being made for all parties involved, not just of Hataria.

D, did you read the new Treaty of the Second Age? If not, then do it. The only one that will be signed by the Count will be the new Treaty of the Second Age.

That's not all quite fair because it forces everyone else to sign it, and we are not just talking about Hataria, we are talking about everyone involved in this mess.

No, we are only talking about Hataria. Nothing else should be within a damn treaty. By forcing the DC to limit forces within the Second Empire goes against what the DC was formed to do. Right now, the Hatarians don’t have the training to defend their nation and the DC had taking that position to do so. I have them focusing on rebuilding over anything, but the threats of Blub and its allies forced them to defend their nation.

I stated in my proposal that the limitations of military forces be strictly during times of peace. There is no reason to have that large of a military entity during times of peace.

Erm, Spiz's treaty is good and he isn't in the Haven...

Erm, Spiz's treaty is good and he isn't in the Haven...

No, it isn’t fair and mostly Haven nations signed it.

No, it isn’t fair and mostly Haven nations signed it.

Its a lot more detailed than yours, its fairer. The instant dismissal on the grounds that it was signed by Haven members is moronic.

Its a lot more detailed than yours, its fairer. The instant dismissal on the grounds that it was signed by Haven members is moronic.

Here are the bullshit nonsense in that damn treaty.

‘2) Surrender of Sovereignty:
Hataria surrenders all sovereignty and the hallmarks thereof to an Occupational Government. The foreign nations participating in this government will be allowed to keep as many military personnel in Hataria as they deem fit, with any one member's complement not outweighing the total of all other member’s forces combined, and the total not to exceed the total size of the Hatarian military, reserves included.’

Bullshit and I’m not going to go in on the unfairness of it. Just read it and you can see it.

‘4) War Indemnities
The total cost of the war shall be paid in full by Hataria. It shall be indexed for global inflation. The timetable for paying this is limited to one hundred years. This article may not be altered by the Upper House.’

They don’t have the fucking money to pay anybody for some bullshit. They have to use that money to rebuild the damage caused by the royal civil war.

So…fuck that unfair treaty and throw it in the fires of Hell.

I'm willing to sign anything if it will just shut up everybody so that we can move along.

So…fuck that unfair treaty and throw it in the fires of Hell.

Best idea anyones had all day.

Best idea anyones had all day.

No we are producing a revised one made by an independent, neutral, non-Haven person.

Exactly why are we dragging this shit out when we have a perfect treaty? It seems you and the rest of the bullies in Haven will never be happy unless Hataria is either destroyed or ruled by you.

No we are producing a revised one made by an independent, neutral, non-Haven person.

wich, incidentaly, makes it so that any noob with a 30 million population can completely overwhelm all of Hataria's armed forces......

Exactly why are we dragging this shit out when we have a perfect treaty? It seems you and the rest of the bullies in Haven will never be happy unless Hataria is either destroyed or ruled by you.

I'm of Haven as well...

I'm of Haven as well...

And that's why your treaty is so good. It's made by a Haven nation but fair to Hataria and its allies. I honestly don't see what the big deal is; I think we can all agree that if Hataria breaks its agreement and attacks somebody we're going to collectively turn them in to plate glass, alliances be damned. I'm not trying to screw anyone over; all I want is for this mess to be settled and be able to withdraw my troops without bloodshed.

I know, not all of the Havenic nations are bullies. I was specifically referring to the specific bullies of Haven.

I'm of Haven as well...

Well, it looks like most of them do. The only treaty that has anything do with this is the Treaty of the Second Age as it only deals with Hataria. And you know the reasons why the Count isn't going to sign your treaty.

And FYI, y’all pissed me off and fucked up my buzz. Thanks a lot!

Why not have both treaties in place? That would cut down this senseless arguing!:p

And my nation won't sign this treaty, we will sign the revised one that is nearing completion.

Looks like this will come to war...

Great...Haven vs. DC and affiliates. Just freaking great.

BTW, Trans, check your TG.

No, it will not happen as you know that reasons. Mine is the only goddamn one that is fair to all sides. I even allowing people to add things to it.



Hush up, CP. That treaty is the most unfair goddamn nonsense that I have ever seen. Each one of our nation are controlled by our OOC actions ,which means your OOC hatred is controlling your IC actions.

...not I... *sniffles*
Mine is fair to all sides because it distributes some of the burden to all sides.

...not I... *sniffles*
Mine is fair to all sides because it distributes some of the burden to all sides.

Nope, not fair to all sides. You know my damn reason, too.

I have been at a wedding all day. Can someone TG me an update from last night at 12 EST to now?

Isn't Praetonia fighting alongside Blub? If so, I'll probably have to declare actual war. Would the Silver Sky and/or Praetonia (or any warmongering party) mind coming to my Senate to persuade those damn peaceniks that war is necessary?

The surrender of sov thing is obviously right out. That's a transparent attempt to just keep Hataria from RPing ever again.

No, it will not happen as you know that reasons. Mine is the only goddamn one that is fair to all sides. I even allowing people to add things to it.



Hush up, CP. That treaty is the most unfair goddamn nonsense that I have ever seen. Each one of our nation are controlled by our OOC actions ,which means your OOC hatred is controlling your IC actions.

Yes, which means that whatever you're doing is also OOC driven, which completely destroys your argument.

The surrender of sov thing is obviously right out. That's a transparent attempt to just keep Hataria from RPing ever again.

Thank you. Another person whom see it how I see it. What about the Treaty of the Second Age? http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=528088

What the - wait a second. You were drunk/mentally "gone fishing" a second ago.... :confused:

The surrender of sov thing is obviously right out. That's a transparent attempt to just keep Hataria from RPing ever again.

it's not intended in that way, and we can change it if it comes across like that. It's intended to force him to NOT wage endless aggressive wars and instead participate in peacekeeping and in some character RPs. It's intended to be that they'd surrender sovereignty to the new government.


No, it will not happen as you know that reasons. Mine is the only goddamn one that is fair to all sides. I even allowing people to add things to it.

Hush up, CP. That treaty is the most unfair goddamn nonsense that I have ever seen. Each one of our nation are controlled by our OOC actions ,which means your OOC hatred is controlling your IC actions.Consider that if I was controlled by OOC thoughts, you wound no longer exist as an IC entity. Many others here share that feeling, so if you're going to go off complaining about OOC hatreds, keep in mind it is by the grace of our separation of OOC and IC that you keep from getting invaded every few days.

I have been at a wedding all day. Can someone TG me an update?

Please?

Yes, which means that whatever you're doing is also OOC driven, which completely destroys your argument.

My OOC side is trying to try Hat into something like what TFU turned out to be. I don’t hate him, but I feel sorry for him.

I'm rather entitled into revealing Hataria's plot for the DC right here and now, but I'm not sure if I should.

Please?

No-ones done it? Gimme 5, I'll see what I can do.

God Damnit quit taunting us and making me chase you across threads, and tell us!

I'm rather entitled into revealing Hataria's plot for the DC right here and now, but I'm not sure if I should.

I know what it is and I think you should.

it's not intended in that way, and we can change it if it comes across like that. It's intended to force him to NOT wage endless aggressive wars and instead participate in peacekeeping and in some character RPs. It's intended to be that they'd surrender sovereignty to the new government.

The current treaties already do that, though. The only reason to have some sort of silly surrender of sov provision is so anyone who feels like it can just stick their hands into any RP Hataria tries to do and mess with it.

That and since under the treaty terms, ANYONE could have troops in Hataria, there's nothing stopping anyone from just turning the place into a battleground or just trying to annex whatever portion their troops happen to be sitting on.

I, frankly, am wondering why the 60 mil thing is even in there. I get by with a military a sixth that size despite being larger than most of you-- cause I generally am not too aggressive when it comes to gunboat diplomacy, thus I don't have a need to be in a zillion wars all the time.

Hataria's not going to need a gigantic military (and certainly not any kind of super dreadnoughts, those are purely offensive in nature) to defend himself, especially since under current treaties, he has allies anyways.

You know something, I don’t fuck about what you do. I’m trying to be a grow up and act friendly with everybody on this board. I see this nonsense more OOC then IC. Y’all hate him more OOCly then IC at this time as he hasn’t started an aggressive wars after the last one. He got fucking pwned in that last war. His nation is broken one.

Now, Dephire, Matt, it doesn’t fucking matter that the said OOCly that he wanted to take over the DC peacefully as it was OOC talk. Here will go again with the whole OOC and IC stuff. If he did ICly, then it would be an issue. It isn’t a issue as it is OOC talk.

I think your the one who is mixing IC and OOC very dangerously.

Now, Dephire, Matt, it doesn’t fucking matter that the said OOCly that he wanted to take over the DC peacefully as it was OOC talk. Here will go again with the whole OOC and IC stuff. If he did ICly, then it would be an issue. It isn’t a issue as it is OOC talk.

I garuntee you that if he tried to ICly take over the DC, He would be raped by the biggest fucking army you've ever seen.

I garuntee you that if he tried to ICly take over the DC, He would be raped by the biggest fucking army you've ever seen.

Not even that, the Count would get a large supply of blood. *Evil smile*

CP, I’m not mixing shit. Dephire tried to take support from Hat because something he said OOCly. That's mixing and a big no-no.

I garuntee you that if he tried to ICly take over the DC, He would be raped by the biggest fucking army you've ever seen.

Actually no...

You know something, I don’t fuck about what you do. I’m trying to be a grow up and act friendly with everybody on this board. I see this nonsense more OOC then IC. Y’all hate him more OOCly then IC at this time as he hasn’t started an aggressive wars after the last one. He got fucking pwned in that last war. His nation is broken one.

Now, Dephire, Matt, it doesn’t fucking matter that the said OOCly that he wanted to take over the DC peacefully as it was OOC talk. Here will go again with the whole OOC and IC stuff. If he did ICly, then it would be an issue. It isn’t a issue as it is OOC talk.

Oh, hey, Clandonia, I'm gonna pearl harbour Trans's navy. Then I'm gonna invade him.

Sorry that was OOC it doesn't matter. Obviously.

OOC:
This was the big 'joke' that Hataria IM'd me. Now, for Transylvania's sake, don't mix this with IC at all. This is strictly OOC. However, I'd like to show you who you support either way.

Sometimes even I could not move mountains. says:
Would you sign the treaty I have proposed?

Clint Ebil Incarnte (Hataria)Mew Mew Style, Mew Mew Grace, Mew Mew Power in your face! says:
no

Clint Ebil Incarnte (Hataria)Mew Mew Style, Mew Mew Grace, Mew Mew Power in your face! says:
Oh and the Reason why I joined The DC is to do like I was planning for Blackhelm

Sometimes even I could not move mountains. says:
Stab it in the back? Mooch off it so that you could stab it in the back? Or what?

Clint Ebil Incarnte (Hataria)Mew Mew Style, Mew Mew Grace, Mew Mew Power in your face! says:
take it over peacefuly

Sometimes even I could not move mountains. says:
hm

But like I said, this is strictly OOC and should not be interpreted in any way into your IC actions. Hataria calls this a joke, well I'm not laughing.

OOC: Dephire, you know my opinion on this "joke" from my TG. Let's just say things will be quite different if it turns out Hat is just using us and it is confirmed ICly.

I'd like to see the XML file used to store the archive, or a screendump at least. We none of us can be sure you're not shittin' us on that.

I'd like to see the XML file used to store the archive, or a screendump at least. We none of us can be sure you're not shittin' us on that.

He is telling the truth, Hataria told this to person on IRC.

OOC:
Hm. I'm guessing that would have been useful. :headbang:
My computer doesn't save the messages and I already closed the window. So I'm sorry for not getting you the good evidence. I wish I could though.

Oh, hey, Clandonia, I'm gonna pearl harbour Trans's navy. Then I'm gonna invade him.

Sorry that was OOC it doesn't matter. Obviously.

In which that would be dumb. You can say whatever you want OOCly, but when it happens ICly, then it can be role-play. And it would still be dumb as my nation is ready for war because of this hostile behavior from Blub and his allies.

Like I have told you, 'If you don't like Hat, ignore him.'

He is telling the truth, Hataria told this to person on IRC.

Who gives a damn? It was OOC nonsense from Hat. When or if he tried ICly, it would be his death wish.

Riiiight... because what we say OOC never impacts on what we say IC... but even though you just said that it did.

Well, that's 2 people now...so it's a benefit of the doubt thing now. And as for evidence...meh. It's cool. If there's more than one of you saying it, and to be fair, Hat admitted to saying it, then I'll take it.

Won't affect me ICly though...seeing as unless he makes that move IC, I'm not supposed to know.