NationStates Jolt Archive

BE HONEST. Don't be ashamed of either choice. Also, it's an anonymous poll.

Definition of losing virginity: Having had sexual intercourse.

Yup.
+1

well, I mean a lot of us on here are still like 13-18.

but then again theres a lot of adults too I think.

I'm 22 and still a virgin.

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.

BE HONEST. Don't be ashamed of either choice. Also, it's an anonymous poll.

Definition of losing virginity: Having had sexual intercourse.

Why would I be ashamed?

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.

uhh huh...

Defenition of Virgin:
1. Of, relating to, or being a virgin; chaste.
2. Being in a pure or natural state; unsullied: virgin snow.
3. Unused, uncultivated, or unexplored: virgin territory.
4. Existing in native or raw form; not processed or refined.
5. Happening for the first time; initial.
6. Obtained directly from the first pressing: virgin olive oil.
7. Zoology. Producing fertile eggs without copulating.


You sound a little bitter in that post Fass.

the poll should be like compared to your age, because no I'm not a virgin, but I mean...of cource I'm not a virgin! I'm a freshman in high school...I bet like 90% of high school freshman are still virgins.

Definition of losing virginity: Having had sexual intercourse.
So using your own hands or toys doesn't count? Count me in. ;)

For reference, I'm 18, turn 19 in December.

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.
And it promotes terrorism.

You sound a little bitter in that post Fass.

Now, I sound disgusted by the heterosexual orthodoxy that like to depict "virginity" as something, whatever.

It doesn't apply to homosexual people one bit, and thus I couldn't give a crap about it at all.

I'm 18 and a virgin.

Now, I sound disgusted by the heterosexual orthodoxy that like to depict "virginity" as something, whatever.

It doesn't apply to homosexual people one bit, and thus I couldn't give a crap about it at all.

But if a gay guy never had sex, wouldn't he be considered a virgin?

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.
Em, no. Virgin is what you are pre-sex. The idea that being a virgin is a good/holy/whatever thing has been somewhat abused however.

Still a virgin. But only for another 2 weeks to 2 months. :P

BE HONEST. Don't be ashamed of either choice. Also, it's an anonymous poll.

Definition of losing virginity: Having had sexual intercourse.
Son, ah ain't been a virgin since about 12! :D

I'm 19 and still a virgin. It's not that I haven't had the chance (I was in a relationship for over a year and a half) I just haven't. Religious reasons I guess...besides I'd rather be sure that I'm not pregnant. :cool:

what's the relevance of this topic?

Never understood why this can be such an issue or even a coolness-factor.

Now, I sound disgusted by the heterosexual orthodoxy that like to depict "virginity" as something, whatever.

It doesn't apply to homosexual people one bit, and thus I couldn't give a crap about it at all.

If you haven't had sex, you're a virgin. The attempt to somehow use it in a rant against heterosexuality is the most pathetic thing I've seen in the internet in a long time (read: about 20 minutes).

Son, ah ain't been a virgin since about 12! :D
Am I the only one who thinks that's too young? But different times I guess(no offense Eut)

what's the relevance of this topic?

Never understood why this can be such an issue or even a coolness-factor.
This is why it's relevant
+1

Am I the only one who thinks that's too young? But different times I guess(no offense Eut)

It was still too young then.

I am a father of a nine year old, so guess whether I am a virgin or not.

16. Lost my virginity somewhere on my girlfriends bed about three months again. Haven't been able to find it ever since.

<what fass said>


not that i belong in this thread. im a 48 year old mother.

much is made of virginity but its as meaningless as the question "have you ever driven a car?"

there is an age at which is is unreasonable to drive a car. there is an age at which if you have never driven a car, people can be excused for wondering why not. once you have driven a car, you can never answer
"NO" to the question again even if you have only driven once in an emergency when you were 12. having driven a car doesnt make you particularly different from the teenager who hasnt-- it doesnt mean you are good at it, it doesnt mean you will ever get the chance to do it again, it doesnt mean that you are now more sophisticated that the non driver, it doesnt make the nondriver a more moral person than you are.

all it means is that you have driven a car.

But if a gay guy never had sex, wouldn't he be considered a virgin?

If you haven't had sex, you're a virgin. The attempt to somehow use it in a rant against heterosexuality is the most pathetic thing I've seen in the internet in a long time (read: about 20 minutes).

And what is "sex?" Is he a virgin if he never fucks, but is always fucked? Or always fucks, and never fucked? Only does oral? How many rimjobs before you've "had sex?" And what about lesbians - how do they "lose" "virginity?"

It is clear "virginity" is nothing but something that applies to heterosexual intercourse where the woman "loses" it by being penetrated, and the man by penetrating. It is also something "of value," and thus used to diminish the sexuality of mostly women.

<what fass said>


not that i belong in this thread. im a 48 year old mother.

much is made of virginity but its as meaningless as the question "have you ever driven a car?"

there is an age at which is is unreasonable to drive a car. there is an age at which if you have never driven a car, people can be excused for wondering why not. once you have driven a car, you can never answer
"NO" to the question again even if you have only driven once in an emergency when you were 12. having driven a car doesnt make you particularly different from the teenager who hasnt-- it doesnt mean you are good at it, it doesnt mean you will ever get the chance to do it again, it doesnt mean that you are now more sophisticated that the non driver, it doesnt make the nondriver a more moral person than you are.

all it means is that you have driven a car.

It's ok! I don't judge people on their driving ability! Unless the b*****d cuts me up!!!!!!!

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.
even if no one else understands, I got it.

There are many shades of gay virginity. I lost all of mine one fine day when I was 14.

Sure, why not.

...you can never answer
"NO" to the question again even if you have only driven once in an emergency when you were 12...

I have yet to hear of anyone needing to have sex as a result of an emergency...

even if no one else understands, I got it.

I'll settle for that.

16 and no for ooh, all of a few weeks now, heh. Though it is legal here in the UK at 16, glory be; though only recently for what I was doing.

I have yet to hear of anyone needing to have sex as a result of an emergency...
you have a terrible lack of imagination.

there are situations where a person had no desire to have sex but it was forced on them. they are no longer virgins no matter how pure at heart they might be.

an emergency might force you to drive even when you would otherwise never consent to do so.

Am I the only one who thinks that's too young? But different times I guess(no offense Eut)
Of course it's "too young," but what would you prefer, that I go back and change it, or that I lie?? :p

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.

Labels are value-neutral, Fass.

The main problem with the question is that it doesn't define sexual intercourse.

And what is "sex?" Is he a virgin if he never fucks, but is always fucked? Or always fucks, and never fucked? Only does oral? How many rimjobs before you've "had sex?" And what about lesbians - how do they "lose" "virginity?"

It is clear "virginity" is nothing but something that applies to heterosexual intercourse where the woman "loses" it by being penetrated, and the man by penetrating. It is also something "of value," and thus used to diminish the sexuality of mostly women.

So you're in essence choosing a definition to attack something you don't like. I consider virginity lost with intimate sexual contact - penetration/oral/etc. And I don't much care if you're pitching or catching.

you have a terrible lack of imagination.

there are situations where a person had no desire to have sex but it was forced on them. they are no longer virgins no matter how pure at heart they might be.

an emergency might force you to drive even when you would otherwise never consent to do so.

That's weird! are you comparing rape to having to drive in an emergency? I don't know where to start with what's wrong with that.

Surely it's a biological fact that, in a heterosexual couple, it is the woman who is penetrated by the man. This does not intrinsically mean that female sexuality is based on being diminished (in your terms!).

It is diminished through the concept of virginity. That it is something she should keep. Something that she "loses." She doesn't gain a sex life, she loses "purity." It's a very misogynistically applied idea, not to mention religiously co-opted.

I would argue that this is an idea based on a very immature notion of heterosexual masculinity that most straight men grow out fairly young! I can't comment on this from a homosexual perspective, but I guess the same applies with what you say about being penetrated/ penetrating

It doesn't apply outside of heterosexism at all, as I showed and said. It's silly within heterosexuality, and untenable outside it.

Surely it's a biological fact that, in a heterosexual couple, it is the woman who is penetrated by the man. This does not intrinsically mean that female sexuality is based on being diminished (in your terms!). I would argue that this is an idea based on a very immature notion of heterosexual masculinity that most straight men grow out fairly young! I can't comment on this from a homosexual perspective, but I guess the same applies with what you say about being penetrated/ penetrating

hmmmm and yet it is adults who teach young people that a woman "loses" her virginity and promote the notion that a non virgin is less desirable or less moral than a virgin. we only learn that its an absurd lie by having sexual relationships.

are you suggesting that you think that gay men have a concept of loss of virginity that might be comparable to virginity in women?

So you're in essence choosing a definition to attack something you don't like. I consider virginity lost with intimate sexual contact - penetration/oral/etc. And I don't much care if you're pitching or catching.

Why even cling to the concept if it needs you to have a personal "consideration" of it to apply in this day and age. It is an anachronism. Let go.

Two kids. Both way prettier than me. 'Nuff said.

Why even cling to the concept if it needs you to have a personal "consideration" of it to apply in this day and age. It is an anachronism. Let go.
Few, if any, are going to change their minds just because you go around claiming that virginity is moot. Why don't you let it go, and let others maintain their status quo? It's not as though their believing in virginity will harm you. Practice what you preach, for once.

Why even cling to the concept if it needs you to have a personal "consideration" of it to apply in this day and age. It is an anachronism. Let go.

Would you still object to the question if it hadn't mentioned virginity at all, but instead asked if we'd experienced intimate sexual contact?

Would you still object to the question if it hadn't mentioned virginity at all, but instead asked if we'd experienced intimate sexual contact?

I am not objecting to the question. I am objecting to the concept.

Few, if any, are going to change their minds

Welcome to NS General. That hasn't stopped anyone here, yet.

I am not objecting to the question. I am objecting to the concept.
Who you tryin' ta kid? You just like to object ... period! :p

I think that it shouldn't be considered "losing" virginity. Because losing something implys that you wish you had it back, and that it is good to have it. It should only be said that: "that person has had sex" not that "that person has lost their virginity". A person might be much happier having sex, so saying that they have lost something doesn't make sence, they have gained experience.

Also I don't think there is a difference between Straight and Gay in this matter. If they have sex, they are not a virgin, no matter what kind.

Welcome to NS General. That hasn't stopped anyone here, yet.
I know it hasn't stopped anyone, but it should in many cases. Why bother, when you're A) obviously not going to get any intelligent debate about the subject unless you count "No, YOU'RE wrong!", and B) obviously intelligent enough to realize that it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, as long as you stay true to yourself?

That's weird! are you comparing rape to having to drive in an emergency? I don't know where to start with what's wrong with that.
why dont you go back and look at my original post and comment on it.

actually rape and molestation is a huge factor in the cult of virginity. young people, especially religious young people are indoctrinated in the notion that purity is incredibly important. when someone buys into that lie, what does it do to them when they are made impure by someone else's act? its a horrible burden on them that they now feel (and are supported by the cult of virginity in their belief) that they are "less" than what they were before being raped or molested. they will NEVER be virgins again. a woman can NEVER bring her virginity to her bridal bed. she can never stand before the altar in her big white dress as the virgin that god wants her to be on her wedding day.

and what about the 12 year old who is being indoctrinated into this notion who has already been being raped by grandpa since he was 6? you are teaching an already hurt child that he is soiled in the eyes of god. not an entirely useful position to take in this instance.

hmmmm and yet it is adults who teach young people that a woman "loses" her virginity and promote the notion that a non virgin is less desirable or less moral than a virgin. we only learn that its an absurd lie by having sexual relationships.

are you suggesting that you think that gay men have a concept of loss of virginity that might be comparable to virginity in women?

erm not really (gay men/women) actually it was a pointless attempt to make my comments applicable to homosexuality, and kinda failed!

Other than that I think I was agreeing with you (Although I didn't realise it at the time)

I am not objecting to the question. I am objecting to the concept.

How can you object to a concept? You don't think it should exist? You don't think people should refer to it?

This is insane.

Oh, and it does apply to men, too. Men also lose their virginity. So, using your reasoning, it's really an anti-sex concept, not an anti-woman concept. If you'd like to object on those grounds, go ahead.

I'm a virgin ... and so's my mum

why dont you go back and look at my original post and comment on it.

actually rape and molestation is a huge factor in the cult of virginity. young people, especially religious young people are indoctrinated in the notion that purity is incredibly important. when someone buys into that lie, what does it do to them when they are made impure by someone else's act? its a horrible burden on them that they now feel (and are supported by the cult of virginity in their belief) that they are "less" than what they were before being raped or molested. they will NEVER be virgins again. a woman can NEVER bring her virginity to her bridal bed. she can never stand before the altar in her big white dress as the virgin that god wants her to be on her wedding day.

and what about the 12 year old who is being indoctrinated into this notion who has already been being raped by grandpa since he was 6? you are teaching an already hurt child that he is soiled in the eyes of god. not an entirely useful position to take in this instance.

You are right! I was really only commenting on the extension of the driving analogy to the case of emergency, in which you seemed to be implying that driving a vehicle when you didn't want to was analogous to being involved in sexual contact that was not desired! It was facetious and not really meant to contain any depth of meaning.

Having strived so hard to put my religious upbringing behind me, I often forget how messed up (christian) religions take on sexuality is. but I still maintain that such a view on virginity, as with the mysogynist view point is based on a minority perspective which does not define virginity or sexuality.

Why even cling to the concept if it needs you to have a personal "consideration" of it to apply in this day and age. It is an anachronism. Let go.

It's a name for a state of existence. Shall we let of go of old-fangled ideas like being "alive" and "dead", too, eh? Let's abolish all nouns :rolleyes:

Seriously - shall we discard all concepts that are open to interpretation. Whoo, there goes politics.

Showed? obviously a means something different to you?

And obviously phrasal cohesion means nothing to you, which explains why you missed what I showed.

Anyway: men are said to have lost their virginity after first having sex too, how is this mysogonistic?

Not men. Straight men. Again with the heteronormativity·

And only through "active" penetration, which is the only normatively defined sex for them. Penetration is an insult to them. Taking the "role of the woman" is degrading, so much so that "feminine" is an invective when used about men - apparently being a woman is degrading.

I guess the perception of mysogyny in respect of female virginity really depends on whether you are yourself a mysogonist, after all it is not intrinsically hateful of a man to have sex with a woman, be it her first time or not, and so any hate in such an act is a subjective thing on the part of the man involved (excepting rape, which is a seperate issue which I don't wish to draw on here). Again the question is which religion, personally I take very little to do with religion, so I can't really comment.

It is misogynistic in that it is applied, as I said, mysoginistically. Women's virginity is "valued" much, much higher than that of men, so much so, that an entire religion is based on the premise of human parthenogenesis so as not to have the mother of the deity be a "whore," which a non-virgin woman is often seen as in the patriarchal system the concept of virginity comes from.

As you said, it is not applicable in the case of homosexuality, I find arguments that boil down to semantics very dull so I won't be drawn. but why are hetrosexuality only concepts so offensive to you, I have no problem with homosexuality only concepts (although of the top of my head I can't name any)

They're offensive in that they are in the overwhelming majority normative concepts.

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.
Many additional connotations hold such designs, but virginity in itself simply means not having had sexual intercourse.

Many additional connotations hold such designs, but virginity in itself simply means not having had sexual intercourse.

And the "sexual intercourse" is defined in a heterosexual and patriarchal sphere.

You are right! I was really only commenting on the extension of the driving analogy to the case of emergency, in which you seemed to be implying that driving a vehicle when you didn't want to was analogous to being involved in sexual contact that was not desired! It was facetious and not really meant to contain any depth of meaning.

Having strived so hard to put my religious upbringing behind me, I often forget how messed up (christian) religions take on sexuality is. but I still maintain that such a view on virginity, as with the mysogynist view point is based on a minority perspective which does not define virginity or sexuality.
oh im so glad you said that. i was ranting in my head since i posted my response.

you were correct in the limited context of the one quote from my post. it would have been outrageous of me to suggest such a thing if that had been my real point.

these days it seems that there are 2 perspectives on virginity. one where a person is PURE until the day they sully themselves with unauthorized sexual activity and one where a person is OUT OF IT until they join the "ive had sex" club.

in truth virginity isnt important at all. there is only wise and unwise sex no matter what level of sexual activity you have had in the past. i pity both those people who think that virginity equals purity so that after they are no longer virgins they have no standards for who to have sex with-- they are miserable sluts now and for those people who feel that virginity is something to be cast off at the earliest opportunity so they can fit in with the crowd. i knew girls in college who had sex with the first boy who would have sex with them just so they could get their virginity over with.

It is diminished through the concept of virginity. That it is something she should keep. Something that she "loses." She doesn't gain a sex life, she loses "purity." It's a very misogynistically applied idea, not to mention religiously co-opted.
I'm sure most people here would agree with you. However, that "concept" of virginity is separable from virginity itself.

And the "sexual intercourse" is defined in a heterosexual and patriarchal sphere.
By who? Not me. Gay people can be virgins too.

How can you object to a concept? You don't think it should exist? You don't think people should refer to it?

Easily, by arguing against it, its premises and its use.

This is insane.

And that comment is risible.

Oh, and it does apply to men, too. Men also lose their virginity. So, using your reasoning, it's really an anti-sex concept, not an anti-woman concept. If you'd like to object on those grounds, go ahead.

Men aren't seen as having lost anything by "losing it." In fact, they are to strive towards "losing" it. It is an anti-woman concept in that it is much, much, much more lenient towards men. So lenient that its hypocrisy and double-standard is apparent, in it being tacked on to give a semblance of "fairness," so that those less critical, less perceptive, such as yourself, will be weeded out in objecting to it. An easy way to have a show for the galleries when such ignorance was more wide-spread than today.

Now, I sound disgusted by the heterosexual orthodoxy that like to depict "virginity" as something, whatever.

It doesn't apply to homosexual people one bit, and thus I couldn't give a crap about it at all.

You know, if your parents weren't heterosexual, you wouldn't exist to make these comments... Just a thought. :)

I am..no need to be anonymous about that kinda thing. Im sorta proiud of myself..19yrs holding back the urge

And obviously phrasal cohesion means nothing to you, which explains why you missed what I showed.



Not men. Straight men. Again with the heteronormativity·

And only through "active" penetration, which is the only normatively defined sex for them. Penetration is an insult to them. Taking the "role of the woman" is degrading, so much so that "feminine" is an invective when used about men - apparently being a woman is degrading.



It is misogynistic in that it is applied, as I said, mysoginistically. Women's virginity is "valued" much, much higher than that of men, so much so, that an entire religion is based on the premise of human parthenogenesis so as not to have the mother of the deity be a "whore," which a non-virgin woman is often seen as in the patriarchal system the concept of virginity comes from.



They're offensive in that they are in the overwhelming majority normative concepts.


You are clearly either a bigot or not communicating effectively your views, you seem to suggest that all heterosexual men regard female sexuality and being female as a state of degredation, I do not take the "role of the woman" (sic) because I am not physically capable because of biology (this does not refer to penetration, heterosexual men are often digitally penetrated by women).

There are many many many problems with christianity, you are correct in highlighting one of them.

You are offended by expressions of the majority biological orientation? this is very bigoted.

By who? Not me. Gay people can be virgins too.

Well, then, how do we lose it? I was fucked before I fucked. Was I virgin? I was sucked off before I sucked, was I a virgin? When did I stop being it? When I penetrated myself? Because, apparently, that's the way men "lose" virginity. And what about gay women, who aren't penetrated. Are they virgins? Are they less virgins if they've only done cunnilingus? Must they be penetrated by a man, as women apparently have to be, to lose virginity?

But apparently people like you buy so much into this notion of virginity, that I've even heard claimed that I as a gay man had all of three virginities. Such a preposterous attempt to apply a heterosexual norm on someone gay.

You know, if your parents weren't heterosexual, you wouldn't exist to make these comments... Just a thought. :)

Say that to my gay couple friends who have children. Heterosexuality is in no way a requirement for procreation. Do they not teach you about the birds and the bees in schools where you live?

oh im so glad you said that. i was ranting in my head since i posted my response.

you were correct in the limited context of the one quote from my post. it would have been outrageous of me to suggest such a thing if that had been my real point.

these days it seems that there are 2 perspectives on virginity. one where a person is PURE until the day they sully themselves with unauthorized sexual activity and one where a person is OUT OF IT until they join the "ive had sex" club.

in truth virginity isnt important at all. there is only wise and unwise sex no matter what level of sexual activity you have had in the past. i pity both those people who think that virginity equals purity so that after they are no longer virgins they have no standards for who to have sex with-- they are miserable sluts now and for those people who feel that virginity is something to be cast off at the earliest opportunity so they can fit in with the crowd. i knew girls in college who had sex with the first boy who would have sex with them just so they could get their virginity over with.

Yep and both views are the result of teen angst being exploited to sell lifestyle magazines and other similar products, personally I agree with neither view!

(obviously there's more to it than that, but it's late!)

Well, then, how do we lose it? I was fucked before I fucked. Was I virgin? I was sucked off before I sucked, was I a virgin? When did I stop being it? When I penetrated myself? Because, apparently, that's the way men "lose" virginity. And what about gay women, who aren't penetrated. Are they virgins? Are they less virgins if they've only done cunnilingus? Must they be penetrated by a man, as women apparently have to be, to lose virginity?

But apparently people like you buy so much into this notion of virginity, that I've even heard claimed that I as a gay man had all of three virginities. Such a preposterous attempt to apply a heterosexual norm on someone gay.


I think personally you lose virginity when you do the act of sex, what ever you take that too mean. For me being straight, its inserting my penis into a woman. For you it might be sucking a cock or having anal or preforming anal For a lesbian, it might be when she first eats another woman out, or uses a dildo on her partner. Thats IMO though

It must be a very dark place inside your head.

And a very vacuous one in yours if you think your attempt at ad hominem is successful.

Nothing you have said in any way reflects how I, as a straight man feel.

Such luck then that my concern for your sentiments is so low that I did not even attempt to comment on them.

You are clearly either a bigot or not communicating effectively your views, you seem to suggest that all heterosexual men regard female sexuality and being female as a state of degredation, I do not take the "role of the woman" (sic) because I am not physically capable by virtue of biology (this does not refer to penetration, heterosexual men are often digitally penetrated by women).

Then why don't men wear women's clothing like women wear men's clothing? Why are men who are feminine laughed at? Why is it OK for a girl to be a tomboy, but not OK for a boy to be a "sissy?" The answer is apparent: Being like a man is neutral, if not advantageous. Being like a woman is degrading.

You are offended by expressions of the majority biological orientation? this is very bigoted.

What part of "normative concept" was it you missed?

Say that to my gay couple friends who have children. Heterosexuality is in no way a requirement for procreation. Do they not teach you about the birds and the bees in schools where you live?

Well, I think he was saying was that two homosexual people,( man on man, or girl with a girl) cannot have sex with each other to produce a child. they can donate cells or adopt or what not, but not through sex.

Fass, you don't have to answer this, but have you been harrassed or anything for being a gay man? Because you have a lot of resentment to straight people it seems.

If you see a vampire, and he/she bites you, you know you're a virgin.
:p
(heehee)

Well, I think he was saying was that two homosexual people,( man on man, or girl with a girl) cannot have sex with each other to produce a child.

So? Sex has many uses - procreation is something heterosexuals seem to value about it, even if in most cases nowadays, only perhaps two or three of the thousands of times they have it result in it. IMHO, a very flimsy foundation to use as justification for one's sexuality, and attempted diminution of someone else's.

they can donate cells or adopt or what not, but not through sex.

Again, so? A baby is the result anyway. Sex has other uses and other justifications.

Fass, you don't have to answer this, but have you been harrassed or anything for being a gay man? Because you have a lot of resentment to straight people it seems.

I couldn't care less about "straight people." I resent their normativeness - their supposition that everyone else is like them, and that they are better, that they are "how it should be." It seems to be very annoying to them when someone doesn't buy their supremacy.

Ok ok ok ok ok children!

*pulls Fass aside*

Now don't you go starting an argument over a word. I'm quite sure it's past your bed time. Get to bed!

*spanks Fass on the behind and sends er' off to bed*

*walks over to the rest of you children*

Losing virginity is when a penis pokes you. Not when it goes in your mouth, or you lick it. You lose virginity when you insert the sun into your equator.

Now all of you, finish your homework.

So? Sex has many uses - procreation is something heterosexuals seem to value about it, even if in most cases nowadays, only perhaps two or three of the thousands of times they have it result in it. IMHO, a very flimsy foundation to use as justification for one's sexuality, and attempted diminution of someone else's.



Again, so? A baby is the result anyway. Sex has other uses and other justifications.


Well procreation outside of heterosexuals has only been available for like what...since the 70s or so. So before then, it was really necessary, and thats why i said it was normal I guess. But yes I can see the point about being a flimsy foundation for heterosexuality.

I couldn't care less about "straight people." I resent their normativeness - their supposition that everyone else is like them, and that they are better, that they are "how it should be." It seems to be very annoying to them when someone doesn't buy their supremacy.


But right there you are making a rash generalization about heterosexuals, Ill refrain from "straight" from now on, as it could possibly imply that straight is better than gay. But anywho, we are not all out to make fun of you or say that you are abnormal. Most of us could care less about what you prefer, since we are all to busy with our own lives and problems and such. I will agree that there are straight people that beleive they are supreme, and that gays are just stoopid and confused and what not, but I am sure there are homosexuals that feel the same about straight people. So, blah blah blah, lets all get along ;)

Well procreation outside of heterosexuals has only been available for like what...since the 70s or so.

You really this ignorant of how easy it is to introduce sperm into a vagina? Oh, wait, you did say you were a virgin, so I guess that may just be the case...

So before then, it was really necessary, and thats why i said it was normal I guess.

I don't need even a rudiment of heterosexuality or science to render a woman pregnant.

But yes I can see the point about being a flimsy foundation for heterosexuality.

How does it feel, to have to defend a sexuality?

BTW...why I am suprised that there are more virgins on here? It seems odd..well i guess it could be that we are all nerds and suchs :D

You really this ignorant of how easy it is to introduce sperm into a vagina? Oh, wait, you did say you were a virgin, so I guess that may just be the case...
Low blow.



I don't need even a rudiment of heterosexuality or science to render a woman pregnant.
Fine by me.


How does it feel, to have to defend a sexuality?


Honestly, I don't feel like I have to defend sexuality, or anything else. Its what I choose to do, and it Joe Blow doesn't like it, he can fuck himself. You should learn that mentality, and not let the assholes get to you.

Well procreation outside of heterosexuals has only been available for like what...since the 70s or so. So before then, it was really necessary, and thats why i said it was normal I guess. But yes I can see the point about being a flimsy foundation for heterosexuality.
gay people have had children throughout the millennia. all it takes is forcing yourself to have sex with a member of the opposite sex for the purposes of procreation. this happened way before there was sperm donation or surrogate mothers.

I lost it when I was 19 during a tornado.

I lost it when I was 19 during a tornado.


interesting :)...but i guess you gotta get some before you die :p

Unfortunately not.

I had sex because I felt I had to, not because I wanted to.

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.
COOOOLLL!!!
:rolleyes:

interesting :)...but i guess you gotta get some before you die :p

Eh, it was just a small tornado. It happened to be the day that my boyfriend got his STD test results back, and he just HAD to celebrate by doing it with me for the first time. There happened to be a tornado going on. Just goes to show that a guy will go through hell or high water for sex.

Eh, it was just a small tornado. It happened to be the day that my boyfriend got his STD test results back, and he just HAD to celebrate by doing it with me for the first time. There happened to be a tornado going on. Just goes to show that a guy will go through hell or high water for sex.


Well its not our fault that the "Penis mightier!"

Well its not our fault that the "Penis mightier!"

Haha!

Well, then, how do we lose it? I was fucked before I fucked. Was I virgin? I was sucked off before I sucked, was I a virgin? When did I stop being it? When I penetrated myself? Because, apparently, that's the way men "lose" virginity. And what about gay women, who aren't penetrated. Are they virgins? Are they less virgins if they've only done cunnilingus? Must they be penetrated by a man, as women apparently have to be, to lose virginity?


You stopped being a virgin either when your dick went in someone elses ass, or when someones dick went in your ass. whichever happened first. As for lesbians, I couldnt really say at which point they lose their virginity. I cant be bothered with the Chasing Amy debate again so Im going to bed.

People used to get uppity about this question because you were point-blank asking them about their sex life, which was their own business. Now, we've got people volunteering their sex lives for review, and being offended because the question doesn't ask specific enough questions about them.

Guns 'n Roses

Some men you just can't reach.

I knew it! You guys are all fat, zit-faced nerds livin in yer mom's basement! And/or attic... ROTFLMAO.

I may be one too, but only because sex under 18 is punishable by 1,000 years of electroshock torture. Ain't worth it.

"Virginity" is a heterosexist construct designed to perpetuate female subservience and religious dogma.

I hope this idiot is joking.

***reads the remainder of the thread***

Apparently not.

Now, I sound disgusted by the heterosexual orthodoxy that like to depict "virginity" as something, whatever.

It doesn't apply to homosexual people one bit, and thus I couldn't give a crap about it at all.

it applies to all people. sexual identity has nothing to do with it. You are not a virgin once you have been penetrated. For heterosexuals it penis in the vagina, for lesbians I guess its tounge in the vagina, and for gay guys its penis in butt. Anyway you dont have to be homophobic.

I hope this idiot is joking.


:eek:

yep i still am :)


fass, i have a quick question... if you and and your partner, had a child (adoption or how ever you would go about that) and he or she grew up to be "straight", how would you feel?

I hope this idiot is joking.
:D

I hope this idiot is joking.

Oh no you didn't! Fass is going to chew you alive.

Oh no you didn't! Fass is going to chew you alive.

Tell Fass I don't swing that way--maybe he'll chew someone else.

I hope this idiot is joking.

Prepare to have your hopes dashed, like you, no doubt, have had to so many times before. *pats the pauper on its head*

yep i still am :)


fass, i have a quick question... if you and and your partner, had a child (adoption or how ever you would go about that) and he or she grew up to be "straight", how would you feel?

That the 90%+ probability event occurred (gay parents do not have gay offspring more or less often than straight parents do) and I'd guess luck was not on our side. Nevertheless, I doubt I'd feel very much of anything, apart from "oh, well, nice of you to tell me."

I'm a virgin...and I'm 16.

I think I'm more of a virgin my choice so far than by lack of opportunity, because God knows I have had the chance.

I'm just not really sure why I havnt done it yet.

You stopped being a virgin either when your dick went in someone elses ass, or when someones dick went in your ass. whichever happened first.

Oh? Gee, nice of you dictate that for me. I'll be sure to not give it further notice.

As for lesbians, I couldnt really say at which point they lose their virginity. I cant be bothered with the Chasing Amy debate again so Im going to bed.

Ah, when the ever-so-crucial penetration is absent, heterosexism crumbles. It crumbles in the case of gay men, too, of course, seeing as the heterosexist gender roles are absent, but I know how much people like to cling to this obsession with insertion.

At 22, no I'm not.

My girlfriend of nearly three years will testify to that ;)

Losing your virginity (as a guy) is surprisingly boring.

I'm suprised by the results of the poll. I though there would have been roughly even numbers...
Anyhow, the answer is no :D

That the 90%+ probability event occurred (gay parents do not have gay offspring more or less often than straight parents do) and I'd guess luck was not on our side. Nevertheless, I doubt I'd feel very much of anything, apart from "oh, well, nice of you to tell me."

hmm...ok

Losing your virginity (as a guy) is surprisingly boring.

Losing your virginity as a girl is surprisingly boring too, sometimes with the added benefit of pain. Talk about overrated!

Losing your virginity (as a guy) is surprisingly boring.

Oh? I had great fun the first time I had sex.

i thought there'd be more voting no. i lost my virginity last halloween. (aged 21 and still in fancy dress, the most i can say for it was that it wasn't unpleasant, pretty underwhelming tho)

Losing your virginity (as a guy) is surprisingly boring.

Speak for yourself. As much as I hate agreeing with That Gay Swede, my first sexual experience was a, er, blast.

You stopped being a virgin either when your dick went in someone elses ass, or when someones dick went in your ass. whichever happened first.

Do heterosexuals engaging in anal sex count as eligible for having lost their virginity?

sex is evil. sex only leads to corruption of the mental state. sex is the drive of evil

Yes, I'm a virgin.

Ignore those DNA tests that say I've fathered five children. And all those other women... wasn't me.

It's all lies and a massive conspiracy against me...

... but I know how much people like to cling to this obsession with insertion.
Yeah. It's a shame: they seem to forget the goodness that is fellation, as well :p

sex is evil. . . .

Only when done properly. :D

Losing your virginity (as a guy) is surprisingly boring.
Yeah, I was rather disappointed at my first time, too. It wasn't as fun as my usual masturbation, because I was stressed as hell, and didn't know what the fuck I was doing.

Thank God I got the hang of it fast. And it just kept getting better and better every time after that. I guess we just have to learn a little bit about sharing the pleasure before it turns into the greatest thing since sliced bread.

(Yes, I do know sex existed before sliced bread, thank you very much)

sex is evil. sex only leads to corruption of the mental state. sex is the drive of evil
Dude, you so need to get laid. I mean, really.

Well, either that, or stop being so stiff.

Dude, you so need to get laid. I mean, really.

Well, either that, or stop being so stiff.

how can you get laid if you cant get stiff?:confused: :D

Yeah. It's a shame: they seem to forget the goodness that is fellation, as well :p

Fellatio is not nearly as overlooked as analingus. And don't get me started on other places where tongues and fingers and teeth and fists and dildos and vibrators and balls go...

Am I the only one who thinks that's too young? But different times I guess(no offense Eut)
No, I think it's too young. But, yeah, that was back when twelve-year-old daughters were political bargaining chips.

And what is "sex?" Is he a virgin if he never fucks, but is always fucked? Or always fucks, and never fucked? Only does oral? How many rimjobs before you've "had sex?" And what about lesbians - how do they "lose" "virginity?"

It is clear "virginity" is nothing but something that applies to heterosexual intercourse where the woman "loses" it by being penetrated, and the man by penetrating. It is also something "of value," and thus used to diminish the sexuality of mostly women.
I don't think it has any inherent value. In fact, I think it's so insignificant, there shouldn't be a thread on it. And it is used more commonly to insult and ostracize teenage males for not having "lost it."

Fellatio is not nearly as overlooked as analingus. And don't get me started on other places where tongues and fingers and teeth and fists and dildos and vibrators and balls go...


:eek: are you seriously suggesting licking an asshole? Because that is just fucking sick...

I don't think it has any inherent value. In fact, I think it's so insignificant, there shouldn't be a thread on it. And it is used more commonly to insult and ostracize teenage males for not having "lost it."
Pfht... looks like someone hasn't lost it.:rolleyes:

how can you get laid if you cant get stiff?:confused: :D
*rolls*

Fellatio is not nearly as overlooked as analingus. And don't get me started on other places where tongues and fingers and teeth and fists and dildos and vibrators and balls go...
Yeah, well, I never tried analingus myself, so I wouldn't know. I do agree on the fingers part... but I don't really agree with the teeth :p

:eek: are you seriously suggesting licking an asshole? Because that is just fucking sick...
Dude, you need to get out more. Watch some gay porn, or something :p

Dude, you need to get out more. Watch some gay porn, or something :p
Whoa, there is a big difference between "getting out" and watching gay porn.

Dude, you need to get out more. Watch some gay porn, or something :p


i had a somewhat gay experience before..and i didn't like it...so no thanks you mister :P

:eek: are you seriously suggesting licking an asshole? Because that is just fucking sick...

As opposed to licking a vagina from which comes vaginal discharge, menstrual blood and babies?

Anyway, analingus ("salad tossing" as straight kids call it, "rimming" as gay kids call it), is mind-blowing. Don't knock it 'til you've tried it, you're not in a position of knocking anything, IMHO.

Yeah, well, I never tried analingus myself, so I wouldn't know.

I highly recommend it.

I do agree on the fingers part... but I don't really agree with the teeth :p

Oh, come on! Someone gently nibbling your ears, your neck, your nipples, your foreskin, your balls... you don't agree with that?

As opposed to licking a vagina from which comes vaginal discharge, menstrual blood and babies?

Anyway, analingus ("salad tossing" as straight kids call it, "rimming" as gay kids call it), is mind-blowing. Don't knock it 'til you've tried it, you're not in a position of knocking anything, IMHO.

i only ate a girl once..it was ok..but really won't try it again, simply cuz of the fact of the nastiness that oozes of there..so what do you do if your guy farts as you are giving him a rimmy?:D

As opposed to licking a vagina from which comes vaginal discharge, menstrual blood and babies?

Anyway, analingus ("salad tossing" as straight kids call it, "rimming" as gay kids call it), is mind-blowing. Don't knock it 'til you've tried it, you're not in a position of knocking anything, IMHO.

at least all of that is sanitary

As opposed to licking a vagina from which comes vaginal discharge, menstrual blood and babies?

Anyway, analingus ("salad tossing" as straight kids call it, "rimming" as gay kids call it), is mind-blowing. Don't knock it 'til you've tried it, you're not in a position of knocking anything, IMHO.
Riiiiighhttttt...big difference between blood, babies (which really aren't that disgusting), vaginal discharge, and shit. Sorry, there just is, and there always will be.

i had a somewhat gay experience before..and i didn't like it...so no thanks you mister :P
Well, it's not for everyone *shrugs*

But even gay men sometimes don't like certain things. I know plenty of guys who think anal penetration is painful and not worth it... Others, for some reason, dislike oral. I guess it all comes down to what sexual practices one appreciates.

Oh, come on! Someone gently nibbling your ears, your neck, your nipples, your foreskin, your balls... you don't agree with that?
Testicles.. Hmm.. Licking feels amazing but I don't think nibbling would be very nice at all.

Anyway, I'm not a virgin.

i only ate a girl once..it was ok..but really won't try it again, simply cuz of the fact of the nastiness that oozes of there...

You'll never try it again? Poor woman that ends up with you, then.

so what do you do if your guy farts as you are giving him a rimmy?:D

What do you do if your woman pees in your mouth as you're eating her? :rolleyes:

It doesn't happen, unless one wants it to happen. And I am not into scat or water sports.

at least all of that is sanitary

You call vaginal discharge sanitary? It's filled with bacteria and yeast. Analingus is very sanitary if your partner is not some slob. Same as all forms of oral sex.

I highly recommend it.



Oh, come on! Someone gently nibbling your ears, your neck, your nipples, your foreskin, your balls... you don't agree with that?
Ah, well, nibbling is fine, as long as it's done above the belt. I thought you were talking of something much more S&M, like biting and and nail scratching, which isn't my cup of tea.

Now you're making me depressed because I haven't nibbled on an earlobe in what seems like forever :(

i only ate a girl once..it was ok..but really won't try it again, simply cuz of the fact of the nastiness that oozes of there..
Most women absolutely love it.. So if you don't do it, I don't know what you can expect in return.
Personally I don't mind it. Quite enjoy it actually.

lol 153 of us have never had sex. o well, we'll get ther someday.... even if it will cost us a couple hundred dollars.

You'll never try it again? Poor woman that ends up with you, then.
I know a few women that don't like the idea of it either..so i am sure it will be ok.


What do you do if your woman pees in your mouth as you're eating her? :rolleyes:

It doesn't happen, unless one wants it to happen. And I am not into scat or water sports.


That made me chuckle. Good job. :)

You call vaginal discharge sanitary? It's filled with bacteria and yeast. Analingus is very sanitary if your partner is not some slob. Same as all forms of oral sex.

well it sure is a heck of a lot cleaner that anything that comes out of some ones anus

You'll never try it again? Poor woman that ends up with you, then.



What do you do if your woman pees in your mouth as you're eating her? :rolleyes:

It doesn't happen, unless one wants it to happen. And I am not into scat or water sports.
Normally during sexual arousal, there is a sphincter that closes off the bladder, making urination impossible. There is no such mechanism in the anus. I wouldn't berate other people for their choices, even if you are kidding around, so far no one has ridiculed you, even though it wouldn't be that hard for them to start. Just ease up.

i only ate a girl once..it was ok..but really won't try it again, simply cuz of the fact of the nastiness that oozes of there..so what do you do if your guy farts as you are giving him a rimmy?:D
You slap him a good one in the face for being such a moron, leave him hanging and go masturbate until you find a partner that doesn't try to gross you out while you're busy giving him sexual pleasure.

At least that's what I'd do.

Then again, this is pretty much as stupid a question as : What do you do if the woman you're eating out pisses in your face without warning?

Riiiiighhttttt...big difference between babies blood,

Menstrual discharge is sloughed off uterine mucosa + blood + cervical discharge. Has nothing to do with babies.

babies (which really aren't that disgusting), vaginal discharge,

Vaginal discharge changes texture and constituency throughout the menstrual cycle. In some it can be chunky and reek of rotten fish. Not to mention what vaginas usually smell as...

and shit. Sorry, there just is, and there always will be.

There is no shit involved in analingus, for you see, this new invention called "soap" magically removes it.

I know a few women that don't like the idea of it either..so i am sure it will be ok.

That's like saying "I know a few guys who don't like the idea of blowjobs." Good luck finding them!

Most women absolutely love it.. So if you don't do it, I don't know what you can expect in return.
Personally I don't mind it. Quite enjoy it actually.
I'd say an (heterosexual)man not considerate enough to give his woman pleasure by cunnilingus doesn't deserve, and should absolutely not feel entitled to, blowjobs.

Menstrual discharge is sloughed off uterine mucosa + blood + cervical discharge. Has nothing to do with babies.



Vaginal discharge changes texture and constituency throughout the menstrual cycle. In some it can be chunky and reek of rotten fish. Not to mention what vaginas usually smell as...


There is no shit involved in analingus, for you see, this new invention called "soap" magically removes it.

I just threw up in my mouth.

There is no shit involved in analingus, for you see, this new invention called "soap" magically removes it.
But sir, what is this incredible so-ap thing you speak of? :rolleyes:

That's like saying "I know a few guys who don't like the idea of blowjobs." Good luck finding them!


I don't like the idea of getting head either..Do i want to kiss a girl after she has had my penis in her mouth, or possibly my semen? uh no..

Testicles.. Hmm.. Licking feels amazing but I don't think nibbling would be very nice at all.

It all depends on where and when and by whom it is done. Just slightly to the side of the root of the penis, on the depression of skin going from the root to the testes is a nice place to try.

I'd say an (heterosexual)man not considerate enough to give his woman pleasure by cunnilingus doesn't deserve, and should absolutely not feel entitled to, blowjobs.
Indeed, good call.
Maybe it's just my gf but I've never experienced a really nasty smell or texture or anything. Maybe I've been lucky.

I just threw up in my mouth.
Heh, don't mind him. I support women's right to pleasure, so just think of something nice and for the love of god, get rid of that mental image!

Menstrual discharge is sloughed off uterine mucosa + blood + cervical discharge. Has nothing to do with babies.



Vaginal discharge changes texture and constituency throughout the menstrual cycle. In some it can be chunky and reek of rotten fish. Not to mention what vaginas usually smell as...



There is no shit involved in analingus, for you see, this new invention called "soap" magically removes it.
K, I first want to point out a typo, I said "babies blood", when I meant blood.
Obviously you wouldn't be giving a woman fellato if she was menstrating, had a baby, or had vaginal discharge, but you really don't have the option of waiting until a person stops crapping to partake in this activity. I don't care how much you wash the area, it will still have, if not the actual smell, but association with feces.

It all depends on where and when and by whom it is done. Just slightly to the side of the root of the penis, on the depression of skin going from the root to the testes is a nice place to try.
Hmm perhaps. Don't think I'll be asking/expecting it anytime soon though.

That's like saying "I know a few guys who don't like the idea of blowjobs." Good luck finding them!
Dude, seriously, stop. There is a big difference, and you know it. There's no reason to spread this idea, it will only influence those who should not be influenced, the young and stupid. To influence the young in this way is immoral, and in the end, what does having the stupid in your camp accomplish?

It all depends on where and when and by whom it is done. Just slightly to the side of the root of the penis, on the depression of skin going from the root to the testes is a nice place to try.


I think we are now entering the rated R zone.

Indeed, good call.
Maybe it's just my gf but I've never experienced a really nasty smell or texture or anything. Maybe I've been lucky.
No, it's called higyene.

A woman that's mindful of her hygiene will most likely never be disgusting for a partner to perform cunnilingus on. Likewise, a male that washes thoroughly should be nice and clean for a potential blowjob. And both males and females who take good care of their hygiene can easily be clean enough to receive an analingus.

Of course, if you partner has sloppy washing habits, be it a male or a female, any oral fun can quickly turn to nightmare.

Personally, I recommend showering together just before you do any of it. It ensures you're both clean, and it's pretty nice foreplay to wash each other out, as a bonus.

Normally during sexual arousal, there is a sphincter that closes off the bladder, making urination impossible.

That's actually false. Human males can pee with erections - I've done it myself many times in the morning. This "sphincter that closes," that so many people think make urination impossible, simply doesn't make it impossible.

There is no such mechanism in the anus.

There is an even better mechanism there - controlled actively by the brain! It involves simply not taking a dump.

I wouldn't berate other people for their choices, even if you are kidding around, so far no one has ridiculed you, even though it wouldn't be that hard for them to start. Just ease up.

I've berated people for their choices?

I think we are now entering the rated R zone.
I think we did some time ago.

I think we are now entering the rated R zone.
This whole thread started out PG-13, it could only go up from there.

Dude, seriously, stop. There is a big difference, and you know it. There's no reason to spread this idea, it will only influence those who should not be influenced, the young and stupid. To influence the young in this way is immoral, and in the end, what does having the stupid in your camp accomplish?
Okay... so let me get this straight... broadcasting to the world the information that an overwhelming majority of females like oral stimulation is bad and/or immoral... why again?

No, it's called higyene.

A woman that's mindful of her hygiene will most likely never be disgusting for a partner to perform cunnilingus on. Likewise, a male that washes thoroughly should be nice and clean for a potential blowjob. And both males and females who take good care of their hygiene can easily be clean enough to receive an analingus.

Of course, if you partner has sloppy washing habits, be it a male or a female, any oral fun can quickly turn to nightmare.

Personally, I recommend showering together just before you do any of it. It ensures you're both clean, and it's pretty nice foreplay to wash each other out, as a bonus.
Yea.. I'm lucky that she cleans heh.

I've heard plenty of disgusting stories so that's why I brought luck into it. I've only been with 2 sexual partners and both were great.

Ohh the ol' shower beforehand huh? Nice.

[QUOTE=Fass]That's actually false. Human males can pee with erections - I've done it myself many times in the morning. This "sphincter that closes," that so many people think make urination impossible, simply doesn't make it impossible.[QUOTE]
Not with erections, with sexual arousal, there is a mental component to it also. Have you ever peed during a sexual act? I don't think so.
Finding people who have isn't good evidence either, the sphincter could always be having problems on its own as well.

Okay... so let me get this straight... broadcasting to the world the information that an overwhelming majority of females like oral stimulation is bad and/or immoral... why again?
When did you get here? Go read the posts starting on page 7 or 8

K, I first want to point out a typo, I said "babies blood", when I meant blood.
Obviously you wouldn't be giving a woman fellato if she was menstrating, had a baby, or had vaginal discharge

Women have discharge continuously. Really, it's quite ironic that I as a gay man seem to know more about the female sexual organs than a straight man.

but you really don't have the option of waiting until a person stops crapping to partake in this activity.

What? That makes no sense. You don't crap when getting analingus (unless one likes scat, which I don't.) In fact, it's customary to void, and to thoroughly clean (the cleaning can be incorporated in the foreplay) the area before engaging in analingus.

I don't care how much you wash the area, it will still have, if not the actual smell, but association with feces.

You mean like the penis has an "association" with urine? The hand has an association with booger-picking? You're clasping at straws.

Whatever Fass, you aren't going to listen to what I say, and I'm not going to convince you with my arguments. Thanks for the conversation guys.

That's actually false. Human males can pee with erections - I've done it myself many times in the morning. This "sphincter that closes," that so many people think make urination impossible, simply doesn't make it impossible.
Ditto. Always in the mornin' heh.

As for 'sexual arousal' I don't know.. I must admit I've never felt the urge during sex.

Women have discharge continuously. Really, it's quite ironic that I as a gay man seem to know more about the female sexual organs than a straight man.

snip



it probly also has some thing to do with the fact that your studying to become a doctor.:p

Not with erections, with sexual arousal, there is a mental component to it also.

Wait, so you're saying there a mental component to not pissing in your partner's mouth, but that people who have their asses serviced cannot control themselves in a similar fashion?

Have you ever peed during a sexual act? I don't think so.

I have, on a few occasions. One is ready to do a lot for people one digs...

Have you ever shit during a sexual act? I don't think so. Doesn't mean that other people haven't. But, that happens on purpose, just like peeing does.

Finding people who have isn't good evidence either, the sphincter could always be having problems on its own as well.

The sphincter does not make urination impossible. Brush up on your anatomy - the urethra is never detached from the bladder, and the "sphincter" is actually a very pitiful structure - some even dispute its existence.

Whatever Fass, you aren't going to listen to what I say, and I'm not going to convince you with my arguments. Thanks for the conversation guys.

You have no arguments. All you've come with is "yucky" and untruths about how our sexual organs work.

. . . And I am not into scat or water sports.

Because, you know, *that* would be disgusting. :rolleyes:

[QUOTE=Fass]That's actually false. Human males can pee with erections - I've done it myself many times in the morning. This "sphincter that closes," that so many people think make urination impossible, simply doesn't make it impossible.[QUOTE]
Not with erections, with sexual arousal, there is a mental component to it also. Have you ever peed during a sexual act? I don't think so.
Finding people who have isn't good evidence either, the sphincter could always be having problems on its own as well.
Yet, I've never taken a dump during sexual acts either. Neither do I seem to have taken the habit of farting during intercourse. Whatever I may be doing.

Have you?

So...uh...how about those virgins-trying to get back on subject- :D

When did you get here? Go read the posts starting on page 7 or 8
All I can see is a huge argument about heteronormativity. Nothing relevant about most womens enjoying oral pleasure just as much as men enjoy blowjobs.

Care to point me more precisely towards what I should read?

Ditto. Always in the mornin' heh.

As for 'sexual arousal' I don't know.. I must admit I've never felt the urge during sex.
But, then again, I'd be surprised to hear you ever had the urge to fart or take a dump during intercourse, either. :rolleyes:

But, then again, I'd be surprised to hear you ever had the urge to fart or take a dump during intercourse, either. :rolleyes:
This is true. Surely never have.

Dude, seriously, stop. There is a big difference, and you know it.

No, there isn't. Oral sex is oral sex. A woman doing it to a man is no different from a man doing it on a woman.

There's no reason to spread this idea, it will only influence those who should not be influenced, the young and stupid.

You are right, there is no reason to spread the idea of oral sex because, you know, everyone already knows about, and most people enjoy it very much.

To influence the young in this way is immoral, and in the end, what does having the stupid in your camp accomplish?

What? They're gonna go have sex because I talk about it? Good on them, even though I would prefer they do it because, you know, they themselves want to, and wow, such an influence I have! I wonder if they would buy me ice cream if I talked about it, too. Oh, the possibilities...

Because, you know, *that* would be disgusting. :rolleyes:
Heh, whatever two consenting adults do in the privacy of their bedroom... *shrugs*

Because, you know, *that* would be disgusting. :rolleyes:

I don't like urine or faeces. So, I would not enjoy it, no. Not that any of the two have anything to do with oral sex.

Heh, whatever two consenting adults do in the privacy of their bedroom... *shrugs*

exactly..in the privacy of there room...that means he doesn't want to know about it.

So...uh...how about those virgins-trying to get back on subject- :D
Right. I seem to have forgotten to answer the original post.

From my earlier comments, I'm guessing everyone deduced that I'm not a virgin anymore. In fact, I lose my virginity just a couple of weeks before my nineteenth birthday. And I'm pretty glad I waited until I was mature enough, and until I was with a guy whom I loved and who loved me back. 'Nuff said.

it probly also has some thing to do with the fact that your studying to become a doctor.:p

Alas, I am cursed with finding ob/gyn interesting. It is however quite disconcerting to see men know so little about female bodies.

exactly..in the privacy of there room...that means he doesn't want to know about it.

It must be so hard for him, having that man pointing that gun to his head, forcing him to read this thread.

I find it funny that the first thing Fass did was assume that whoever made the topic was automatically leaving gays out. I know jumping to conclusions gives you the chance to argue sooner, but it also makes your argument lose credibility.

exactly..in the privacy of there room...that means he doesn't want to know about it.
No, that means that they just can't do it on the front lawn, or in the bus, or in the kindergarten's backyard. In other words, where someone might see them.

There's nothing stopping them from talking about it. It's certainly viewed as icky and a turn by most(myself included), but then again so are most fetishes. I certainly am not even remotely turned on by the idea of S&M and violence during sex, but that doesn't mean S&M enthusiasts should be censored because I find it icky.

We all have a choise not to read the posts we don't like, you know. Unless you are being tied down to your chair, with toothpicks under your eyelids or someone reading you aloud the contents of said unsavory posts.

I find it funny that the first thing Fass did was assume that whoever made the topic was automatically leaving gays out. I know jumping to conclusions gives you the chance to argue sooner, but it also makes your argument lose credibility.

The term "virginity" itself leaves gays out, why I is why I said "it has nothing to do with gay people," which you would have gotten, had you actually read what I wrote.

Do run along, now, if you aren't prepared to read before you post.

61%....

should we be worried?

Alas, I am cursed with finding ob/gyn interesting. It is however quite disconcerting to see men know so little about female bodies.

lol.
i know its a bit off topic but why out of all the scientific feilds did you pick ob/gyn?
meh, it happens, most have eather forgotten what ever they learned in anatomy and phys or they never learned it to start with. but the opposit can be said for the majority of woman about the specifics of the male system.

I find it funny that the first thing Fass did was assume that whoever made the topic was automatically leaving gays out. I know jumping to conclusions gives you the chance to argue sooner, but it also makes your argument lose credibility.
Well, I don't know about him, but I'm gay as well and didn't take it that way.

And, let's not forget virginity is a rather subjective subject. For some it's until any sexual acts are performed... while other think that a woman who has given blowjobs and been anally penetrated, by never vaginally, is still a virgin.

The term "virginity" itself leaves gays out, why I is why I said "it has nothing to do with gay people," which you would have gotten, had you actually read what I wrote.

What kind of inane statement is that? Perhaps you could make a legitimate claim that lesbians cannot lose their virginity, but certainly that does not apply to men.

The term "virginity" itself leaves gays out, why I is why I said "it has nothing to do with gay people," which you would have gotten, had you actually read what I wrote.

Do run along, now, if you aren't prepared to read before you post.
I don't agree with you on this one. See my previous post about the subjectivity of virginity.

It does leave a gray area if you abide by the "penis enters hole" definition, but like I said, not everyone defines virginity the same way.

61%....

should we be worried?
No. Not at all.

lol. i know its a bit off topic but why out of all the scientific feilds did you pick ob/gyn?

I didn't, and haven't. Doing rotation in different specialties, it was one of those that I could imagine myself doing, just like I like infectious diseases. I don't have to pick a specific speciality for a few more years.

meh, it happens, most have eather forgotten what ever they learned in anatomy and phys or they never learned it to start with. but the opposit can be said for the majority of woman about the specifics of the male system.

I think most women know what comes out of a penis. Knowing what comes out of a vagina shouldn't be too hard to remember.

It must be so hard for him, having that man pointing that gun to his head, forcing him to read this thread.
most definantly

snip..
...once again my lame sarcaum/humor, is misunder stood. it kinda makes you miss how much you can imply but tone of voice :(

The term "virginity" itself leaves gays out, why I is why I said "it has nothing to do with gay people," which you would have gotten, had you actually read what I wrote.

Do run along, now, if you aren't prepared to read before you post.

Don't be an elitist. You're pretty naive if you think that definitions can't change with the times. Virginity, traditionally, has to do with a man in a woman. However, the majority of people I know would consider any sex, heterosexual or not, (so long as it's you first time) to be losing one's virginity. That should be the end of your argument there as I'm here telling you that virginity is NOT limited to heterosexuals.

...once again my lame sarcaum/humor, is misunder stood. it kinda makes you miss how much you can imply but tone of voice :(
Oops. :eek:


Sorry.But hey, sometimes you hear things that make so little sense on these forums, that you have to be prepared to answer any comment, no matter how weird or inconsistant :p It's nothing personnal.

hmmm

What kind of inane statement is that? Perhaps you could make a legitimate claim that lesbians cannot lose their virginity, but certainly that does not apply to men.

Yes, it does. The heteronormativity of the term supposes that "men" lose their virginity penetrating someone. A man who has not done that, but has, say, performed fellatio and been sodomised, is a virgin if one follows the "rules" of heterosexism, which defines intercourse as penis + vagina, the man always penetrating, and then in a silly way tries to apply that mould onto gay people, in a ridiculous belief that gay sex is something attempting to mimic straight sex. A chauvinist view that all gay people are doing is performing "failed" attempts at replicating that which is deemed "true;" the heterosexual intercourse. In its mildest form, for the man to lose this "virginity" when penetrated, he must be reduced to playing the role of the woman, to be seen as a woman (and thus inferior and worth less in the eyes of the patriarchal society), and that is in itself something insulting to gay men, but mostly to women.

I think most women know what comes out of a penis. Knowing what comes out of a vagina shouldn't be too hard to remember.

your giving most of the male population way to much credit if you think they will remeber that...there mosre concirned baout what can go in as aposed to what comes out.
Oops.
Sorry.But hey, sometimes you hear things that make so little sense on these forums, that you have to be prepared to answer any comment, no matter how weird or inconsistant It's nothing personnal.
i know, i have done the same thing :) no worries

Don't be an elitist. You're pretty naive if you think that definitions can't change with the times. Virginity, traditionally, has to do with a man in a woman. However, the majority of people I know would consider any sex, heterosexual or not, (so long as it's you first time) to be losing one's virginity. That should be the end of your argument there as I'm here telling you that virginity is NOT limited to heterosexuals.

How do these "most people" define "sex?" They do it in a heterocentrist fashion. Which makes it even more inapplicable to gay people.

No, what you're telling me is that you want to force a heterosexual template onto gay people, and I am objecting to that.

Well my virgin ass is going to bed, hopefully to have wet dreams and such..:p

your giving most of the male population way to much credit if you think they will remeber that...there mosre concirned baout what can go in as aposed to what comes out.

I like to think you're underestimating men.

I like to think you're underestimating men.
you are more than welcome to think what ever you want...as long as it does not ruin my fun being cynical :p

Yes, it does. The heteronormativity of the term supposes that "men" lose their virginity penetrating someone. A man who has not done that, but has, say, performed fellatio and been sodomised, is a virgin if one follows the "rules" of heterosexism, which defines intercourse as penis + vagina, the man always penetrating, and then in a silly way tries to apply that mould onto gay people, in a ridiculous belief that gay sex is something attempting to mimic straight sex. A chauvinist view that all gay people are doing is performing "failed" attempts at replicating that which is deemed "true;" the heterosexual intercourse. In its mildest form, for the man to lose this "virginity" when penetrated, he must be reduced to playing the role of the woman, to be seen as a woman (and thus inferior and worth less in the eyes of the patriarchal society), and that is in itself something insulting to gay men, but mostly to women.
I think you're chasing a windmill here. Virginity is defined in a great variety of manner. And while it may be true that some heterosexuals hold the definition you just presented here, I don't think anyone on this thread has taken a stand and said gays and lesbians are trying, and failing to, lose their virginity because they can't mimick straight sex "correctly".

Neither do I think the original poster's intent was to inferiorize gays and/or women.

How do these "most people" define "sex?" They do it in a heterocentrist fashion. Which makes it even more inapplicable to gay people.

No, what you're telling me is that you want to force a heterosexual template onto gay people, and I am objecting to that.

Again, you're assuming way too much. You jump to conclusions and assumptions more than anyone I've ever talked to. When did I ever say I'm forcing a heterosexual template onto gay people? Can you point that out? The definition of "sex," which was even defined back in high school for everyone in my general age group, as including any oral sex or any penetration (giving or receiving). And penetration was defined as any entering of the mouth, anus or vagina by a penis, finger, or tongue.

Ok first off, this isnt the "sex advice" topic.

now onto the topic, how can you consider "virginity" as a title degrading to women? Virginity in a whole means different things to everyone, its so god damned opionated it would take weeks for us to even argue what it means for eachother, its like arguing religion, its your own opinion. you seem so hard pressed to say that straight men as a whole dont value the idea of virginity. it looks like half the guys here value it enough to not have sex by choice. theyre not rushing to lose it as you say. and who are you as a man with a penis to decide whats right and wrong for a girl to do with her body? if a girl wants to have sex because she chooses to, then power to her.

youre saying that if a girl chooses to lose her viginity, soceity values her as used or impure. which in an entierty is true, the term "virginity" doesnt just apply to sex exclusively. such as "my virgin ears" is untouched by anything. if a girl or guy is a virgin, then he/she is pure, free of disease and impurities. someone who isnt a virgin is tainted, who knows what he/she could have done in their past. erego impure, tainted, used and abused.

onto the piont of "taking the roll of a woman is degrading" yes... in todays soceity, yes. acting like a woman or "taking it like a bitch" makes you unequal and not a man.

"And the "sexual intercourse" is defined in a heterosexual and patriarchal sphere" what the shit? do you even know what "intercourse" is defined as? look it up. its penetration of the mouth, anus, or vagina, with the fingers, tounge, or penis. plain and simple. how thats heterosexual youve got me.

"But apparently people like you buy so much into this notion of virginity, that I've even heard claimed that I as a gay man had all of three virginities. Such a preposterous attempt to apply a heterosexual norm on someone gay."

noone said that "virginity" has a norm. it doesnt, clearly. for me to lose my virginity i need to have sex with a womans vagina. for you you have two virginities in the sense that you take on both sexual roles. your anus becomes your vagina, kind of a fucked up concept dont ya think. so i guess it all depends on what kind of faggot you are, if youre the doughnut puncher, then youre virginity is the same as mine, if youre a wide reciever, then your virginity takes on that role of the female. ive never heard of there being an oral virgin, but then whatever, powere to you, when we all have that one.

"Say that to my gay couple friends who have children. Heterosexuality is in no way a requirement for procreation. Do they not teach you about the birds and the bees in schools where you live?"
are you kidding me? either you cant explain yourself very well, or you didnt pay attention in health class. because last time i checked, "the birds and the bees" involved procreation, which requires the whole science thing with the eggs and the sperm. im not saying homos cant raise kids, by all means they can, but that is not procreation. thats raising a family. inorder to procreate, you need to infact... create. and dont tell me that because dykes can implant that its creating, because its not, that unnatural. natural procreation can only be done one way. unless of course you can discover another way, then id vote for you for the nobel prize.

"Then why don't men wear women's clothing like women wear men's clothing? Why are men who are feminine laughed at? Why is it OK for a girl to be a tomboy, but not OK for a boy to be a "sissy?" The answer is apparent: Being like a man is neutral, if not advantageous. Being like a woman is degrading."
again... yes. being like a woman makes you abnormal. men act like men, women act like women, anything else is abnormal.

"I couldn't care less about "straight people." I resent their normativeness - their supposition that everyone else is like them, and that they are better, that they are "how it should be." It seems to be very annoying to them when someone doesn't buy their supremacy."
very good, now youre catching up with soceity.

all in all you need to realise that soceity isnt ready to accept a group of people when theyre gonna parade around in purple thongs and scream "accept me". soceity is the norm, if you dont want to be part of the norm, then just like back in school, be prepared to be riddiculed because youre different.

so stop getting so uppity just because everyone else doesnt think like you. youre acting like a straight man for christs sake...

Men aren't seen as having lost anything by "losing it." In fact, they are to strive towards "losing" it. It is an anti-woman concept in that it is much, much, much more lenient towards men. So lenient that its hypocrisy and double-standard is apparent, in it being tacked on to give a semblance of "fairness," so that those less critical, less perceptive, such as yourself, will be weeded out in objecting to it. An easy way to have a show for the galleries when such ignorance was more wide-spread than today.

I'm sorry for coming into this conversation before I finished reading the thread. I applogize to everyone if I am posting something that has already been said. I believe that the entire concept of "Losing" one's virginity is a Misnomer. I feel that in order to lose something you have to be able to physically hold it. Instead of considering virginity a physical thing I think of it as a gift because I have always been tought that a gift can take on any form, this includes a social, mental, and physical form. I am a straight male of the age of 22 I find the fact that I am lumped in with all males, who seek to "nail" the first virgin they come across, offensive and down right insulting. I feel that each person is given thier virginity to give to someone as a gift so pure that it can only begiven but once. I believe that my view of virginity does in fact apply to homosexual relationships. I guess what I am saying is that I don't see the act of giving one's virginity to someone an act of degrading women but an act of love. *waits patiently for the flames*:cool:

*snip*

I have to say this rant is certainly very hard to understand...

And that once I reread it twice and got the gist of what you wanted to say, I found myself in disagreement with pretty much everything you've said. 'nuff said.

I guess what I am saying is that I don't see the act of giving one's virginity to someone an act of degrading women but an act of love. *waits patiently for the flames*:cool:

Perfect.

I'm sorry for coming into this conversation before I finished reading the thread. I applogize to everyone if I am posting something that has already been said. I believe that the entire concept of "Losing" one's virginity is a Misnomer. I feel that in order to lose something you have to be able to physically hold it. Instead of considering virginity a physical thing I think of it as a gift because I have always been tought that a gift can take on any form, this includes a social, mental, and physical form. I am a straight male of the age of 22 I find the fact that I am lumped in with all males, who seek to "nail" the first virgin they come across, offensive and down right insulting. I feel that each person is given thier virginity to give to someone as a gift so pure that it can only begiven but once. I believe that my view of virginity does in fact apply to homosexual relationships. I guess what I am saying is that I don't see the act of giving one's virginity to someone an act of degrading women but an act of love. *waits patiently for the flames*:cool:
Hey, I actually think pretty much like you. I'm not a "no sex before marriage" proponent, but I do think giving someone the benefit of being your first sexual partner is actually quite a big deal.

Heck, I encourage kids not to have their first time with a stupid jerk or because they're drunk and/or because their friends tell them to. Much better to wait until you're in love, and that the other person loves you back. Then you can share the pleasure during sex for the first time, and have it mean something.

Personally, I did it. Waited till I was almost 19, found the right guy, did it, and felt I was sharing something extroardinary with him.

...Of course, the bastard ended up leaving me, but hey, shit happens.

sorry, i got way to into him, and not the debate. i got carried away. well, perhaps hard to understand because i suck at quoting and i have shitty grammar and spelling. but im a straight man, so it happens. and im not a nerd who spends all of his time arguing on useless message boards

sorry, i got way to into him, and not the debate. i got carried away.
Not only that, but you seem to have strong, unhealthy opinion about heterosexuality's superiority over homosexuality. Most people call that homophobia.

No offense, but heterosexuality isn't superior. Neither is homosexuality.

well while you all argue over weather or not you have had sex and participated in the nasty...and weather or not sex is degrading to woman, and why that is all the suden a really bad thing,( woman have always been degraded...its cuz guys are afrad of us,[ but thats my own personaly opinion]), and all sorts of things along that line that in reality have no true imprtance( think arguing what came first the hen or the egg). iam going to withdraw my obivosly better and cooler self and opinions. good night to you all:p

Not only that, but you seem to have strong, unhealthy opinion about heterosexuality's superiority over homosexuality. Most people call that homophobia.

No offense, but heterosexuality isn't superior. Neither is homosexuality.

im not a homophobe, i just think the idea of homosexuality is unnatural. men have sex with women, thats just the way it is. but again, its jut my opinion.

im not a homophobe, i just think the idea of homosexuality is unnatural. men have sex with women, thats just the way it is. but again, its jut my opinion.
No, that's not your opinion, that's homophobia.

Edit: besides, your knowledge of what is natural seems very limited. Look up animal sexual behavious studies. Heck, visit Manhattan's zoo and it's gay penguins, for the love of [insert random deity]

No, that's not your opinion, that's homophobia.

no homophobia is the fear of homosexuality.

...im not afraid of gay people, i just hate them.

no homophobia is the fear of homosexuality.

...im not afraid of gay people, i just hate them.
Homophobia is either fear of homosexuality, OR hatred/prejudice/despise towards homosexual persons.

And we all know hatred and prejudice most often comes from the fear of the unknown.

im not a homophobe, i just think the idea of homosexuality is unnatural. men have sex with women, thats just the way it is. but again, its jut my opinion.
And you are allowed to your opinion but the fact that you used the word "unnatural" means that you are in fact in some way repulsed by the idea that same sex relationships exist. Therefore even though it may be slight you do in fact suffer from homophobia. But that is my opinion. :D

Edit: I retract the statement about it being slight if you "Hate" Homosexuals then you have sever homophobia but as long as you don't comit hate crimes then you are still entitled to your views.

Edit: besides, your knowledge of what is natural seems very limited. Look up animal sexual behavious studies. Heck, visit Manhattan's zoo and it's gay penguins, for the love of [insert random deity]

normal penguins are not gay, like i said. the normal is to procreate with a male and female. two male penguins cant procreate. unless the manhattan zoo has a penguin addoption agency i dont know about?

and not to spike another debate, but were not animals, were human beings.

And you are allowed to your opinion but the fact that you used the word "unnatural" means that you are in fact in some way repulsed by the idea that same sex relationships exist. Therefore even though it may be slight you do in fact suffer from homophobia. But that is my opinion. :D

Edit: I retract the statement about it being slight if you "Hate" Homosexuals then you have sever homophobia but as long as you don't comit hate crimes then you are still entitled to your views.

i dont, and i would never, humans are entitled to their rights, it doesnt mean i have to agree with them. if thats your defination of a homophobe, then hell, i guess im a homophobe then, it doesnt change my opinion lol

Howls of derision to That Gay Swede for taking a pleasant, lightweight topic about virginity and turning it into a debate on the merits of his straight-hating screed.

To reply to the topic, I'm not a virgin. I lost it when I was 16 (and whichever definition you want to use, it happened when I was 16).

and not to spike another debate, but were not animals, were human beings.

Make up your mind. Either you claim that homosexuality is not natural; which means you should demonstrate it does not happen in nature, or you claim that humans are something entirely seperate from nature and other animals - that we are in fact all "unnatural".

Once you have decided which to pick you should follow it up with explaining why it "not being natural" would be a bad thing.

Oh yeah I guess I should state if I am a virgin or not. I am a virgin and I am proud of that fact.

normal penguins are not gay, like i said. the normal is to procreate with a male and female. two male penguins cant procreate. unless the manhattan zoo has a penguin addoption agency i dont know about?

and not to spike another debate, but were not animals, were human beings.
No, you don't have a clue about what you're talking about. A post earlier, you used the word "unnatural", which means "not present in nature", which is obviously false.

Now, you switch to using the word "normal", which means "inside the norm". Well, I've got news for you... majority doesn't make the norm.

A majority of human beings are heterosexuals. The NORM for human being's sexuality is roughly 90% hetero and 10% homo. It always have been this way, and it always will be.

As for the "adoption agency", I'm quite pleased to tell you that scientific researchers have actually tried the experiment of giving a fertilized egg to a couple of male penguins. They have both taken turns in warming the egg until it hatched, and proceeded to raise the chick as if it was their own. There are also several reports of lesbian dolphin couples "adopting" a young whose parents died.

And now, you finish off with "we're not animals", which is a typical shift from homophobic people trying to belittle homosexuals. You start off by saying we're unnatural... then after we prove we are, indeed, natural, you suddenly change your mind and decided being "natural", as in, "like it is found in nature" isn't good anymore.

Stop flip-flopping, please. You seem to suffer from hatred towards a minority, and that hate is obviously not based on anything remotely objective.

Thank you, come again.

Once you have decided which to pick you should follow it up with explaining why it "not being natural" would be a bad thing.


Very good point Alma.

Make up your mind. Either you claim that homosexuality is not natural; which means you should demonstrate it does not happen in nature, or you claim that humans are something entirely seperate from nature and other animals - that we are in fact all "unnatural".

Once you have decided which to pick you should follow it up with explaining why it "not being natural" would be a bad thing.
>< Beat me to it.

Then again, I might have overdone it in my post. It seems quite a waste of energy to answer such a statement in an internet forum, as no amount of logic usually can destroy deep-rooted prejudice and irration beliefs so easily. Then again, it's late and his comments were so outrageous I just had to destroy his argumentative thouroughly.

its not hatred towards a minorety, its hatred of the idea of homosexuality, im sure youre a nice person, i dont doubt that, but i think your ideas in sexuality are fucked up. thats my opinion.

and im not flip flopping, stop getting to technical over what i said, you seem to feel the need to make me look like an idiot but turning my words against me because you dont agree with me. i said my opinion was that its not natural, as in not a natural act for people to do. also, not the norm, its one and the same, if you want to nit-pick my words then fine, i wont say its "not found in nature" as you like to put it, ill just say that its just plain abnormal, wich you already agreed that it wasnt, so theres no further need for debate. we agree to dissagree. i think your lifestyle is fucked up and abnormal, and you agree that most people think its abnormal. you obviously dont, but we agree that i do.

and as far as the "animal adoption agency" ill believe it when i see it. and if so, then whatever, power to them. it proves that animals can act abnormal too.

To quote Eddie Murphy... "This is the time I fuck, I do alot of fucking right now" and no, I'm not a virgin.

>< Beat me to it.

Then again, I might have overdone it in my post. It seems quite a waste of energy to answer such a statement in an internet forum, as no amount of logic usually can destroy deep-rooted prejudice and irration beliefs so easily. Then again, it's late and his comments were so outrageous I just had to destroy his argumentative thouroughly.

ok if my opinion is outrageous to you, then fine. its still my opinion. i didnt say that you being gay was outrageous, i said i didnt agree with it, and think its abnormal. im not attacking you in anyway. as far as deep rooted prejudice? if you wanna take that road and try to put a label on me because you dont understand the way i think. or like my opinion, then fine, whatever helps you sleep at night.

its not hatred towards a minorety, its hatred of the idea of homosexuality, im sure youre a nice person, i dont doubt that, but i think your ideas in sexuality are fucked up. thats my opinion.

Well, I don't specifically hate the minority of homophobes, more like the idea of homophobia itself. I'm certain you must be someone decent yourself, but I think your ideas on what sexuality is are fucked up. It's nothing personnal, but anyone who thinks he hold the only thruth, and who thinks what's right for him should be what's right for everyone, is an arrogant fool. Your saying that you know better than me what my sexual life should look like is like someone who's into S&M or any random fetish telling people who aren't into that fetish that they're abnormal for not engaging into said fetish.

I don't ask of you to like what I like. I certainly have never tried to convince anyone that they should share the same tastes and have the same sexual practices as mine. What I do ask of you is that you accept my difference without judging me as inferior, because I sure as hell am not. What I want is for you to return the favor and not try to impose your sexual preferences on me either. Anything less is arrogance, self-sufficience, elitism and leads to inferiorization.

Just think, for a second. Your favorite color is red. Your friend's favorite color is green. Do you go around dissing your friend because he likes green, and that you're obviously better than him and know better because 90% of the rest of the world likes red better? No, you don't. You shrug, tell him you like red better, and don't give a damn about the fact that HE prefers green.


and im not flip flopping, stop getting to technical over what i said, you seem to feel the need to make me look like an idiot but turning my words against me because you dont agree with me. i said my opinion was that its not natural, as in not a natural act for people to do. also, not the norm, its one and the same, if you want to nit-pick my words then fine, i wont say its "not found in nature" as you like to put it, ill just say that its just plain abnormal, wich you already agreed that it wasnt, so theres no further need for debate. we agree to dissagree. i think your lifestyle is fucked up and abnormal, and you agree that most people think its abnormal. you obviously dont, but we agree that i do.

and as far as the "animal adoption agency" ill believe it when i see it. and if so, then whatever, power to them. it proves that animals can act abnormal too.
And, yes, you were flip-flopping. You argued something, I destroyed your argument thoroughly, and tried to side-step my debunking of your reasons for yourt hatred by changing your argument. That's flip-flopping.

And, again, homosexuality is neither unnatural nor abnormal. I NEVER agreed that most people think it is abnormal. I stated that most people WEREN'T. Most people aren't left handed, they're right-handed. Yet, being left-handed is neither unnatural, because it happens in nature, nor abnormal, because the norm is that a certain minority of human beings use their left hand as the preferred hand. Homosexuality and heterosexuality are to be viewed in a similar light.

There is no such thing as an homosexual lifestyle. I do not have a lifestyle that is any different from my heterosexual friends. I would not live my life differently if I was falling in love with women instead of men. In fact, I make a point of honor of not behaving differently because I'm with a guy on issues like public displays of affection. All you think you know about homosexual lifestyle is unfounded prejudice. The so-called promiscuity of homosexuals is a myth. I have had a single boyfriend and sexual partner in my life. Our relationship lasted for 3 years. I would have gladly passed the rest of my life at his side had he not chosen for our paths to separate. Other homosexuals are indeed promiscuous, but no more so than many heterosexuals are. To imply that my sexual preference makes me adopt a different, deviant lifestyle is an insult to my intelligence. Please do not insult my intelligence further, as I have been careful not insulting yours.

As for the reaserch, I suggest you simply do a quick google search, or watch some Discovery channel documentary on animal sexuality.

That being said, it is nearing 2h30 AM here, and I believe I have expended enough energy debating with you. I know you probably will not change your opinion in the least. If I have at least made yourself question a few of your preconstructed ideas, I will consider myself satisfied. Good night.

BE HONEST. Don't be ashamed of either choice. Also, it's an anonymous poll.

Definition of losing virginity: Having had sexual intercourse.
More yes than no?
http://www.websmileys.com/sm/aliens/7.gif

Besides, in what sense do you mean a virgin? Every orifice?

ok if my opinion is outrageous to you, then fine. its still my opinion. i didnt say that you being gay was outrageous, i said i didnt agree with it(homosexuality), and think its abnormal. im not attacking you in anyway. as far as deep rooted prejudice? if you wanna take that road and try to put a label on me because you dont understand the way i think. or like my opinion, then fine, whatever helps you sleep at night.
*sigh* I know I said I was stopping at my last post but...

I am homosexual. You say homosexuality is abnormal. That means you think I am abnormal. I consider this an attack. Worse, it is uncalled for, and on a basis of something over which I have no control.

How is telling me my sexual orientation, which, while being only a facet of my being among others, is an extremely important part of my life, is abnormal NOT a personnal attack against me?

You don't get to say something racist, and then apologize to the black guy sitting right besides you because you didn't "target him specifically" and get off the hook that easily. Racism, sexism, and homophobia target EVERYONE of the minority to whom they pertain. They are inexcusable.

Your general comments about the inforiority, abnormality, or unnatural(ness?ity?) of homosexuality are an attack on my being. I do not endure such attacks without pointing out the fact that they are, indeed, insulting to me.

And now good night, for real this time.

You're only just finishing now? Shit.

Quite the popular thread.

Losing your virginity (as a guy) is surprisingly boring.
i disagree!
depends who you're with i suppose...

Depends.

I'm a virgin with a tailhole that isn't. Ergo, I'm not a virgin.

no homophobia is the fear of homosexuality.

...im not afraid of gay people, i just hate them.The hydrophobic parts of your cell membrane don't feel fear...

ok if my opinion is outrageous to you, then fine. its still my opinion. i didnt say that you being gay was outrageous, i said i didnt agree with it, and think its abnormal. im not attacking you in anyway. as far as deep rooted prejudice? if you wanna take that road and try to put a label on me because you dont understand the way i think. or like my opinion, then fine, whatever helps you sleep at night.I suppose you hate the abnormal left-handed people too then. Why can't they just use their right hands like everyone else?

Yeah, i'm a loser :p

Well I do not normally speak about this, but as you are all complete strangers whom I have no trust in whatsoever, I suppose I can. I seem to have a significant fear of physical contact with other people. I first realised that my chances of physical intimacy with another person were quite low when a woman I cared quite a great deal about tried to hug me and I instinctively pushed her away and jumped aside. Though I have experienced this for quite a long time -- my mother hasn't even been able to hug me since I was very young -- this was the first true realisation of the problem. Even shaking hands with somebody at a job interview or a meeting is quite distressing for me. It's quite depressing actually, as it pretty much means that I'll be devoid of intimacy, but I am used to it by now. And with that I am indeed a virgin, and I do not really bother making any effort to change that.

Well I do not normally speak about this, but as you are all complete strangers whom I have no trust in whatsoever, I suppose I can. I seem to have a significant fear of physical contact with other people. I first realised that my chances of physical intimacy with another person were quite low when a woman I cared quite a great deal about tried to hug me and I instinctively pushed her away and jumped aside. Though I have experienced this for quite a long time -- my mother hasn't even been able to hug me since I was very young -- this was the first true realisation of the problem. Even shaking hands with somebody at a job interview or a meeting is quite distressing for me. It's quite depressing actually, as it pretty much means that I'll be devoid of intimacy, but I am used to it by now. And with that I am indeed a virgin, and I do not really bother making any effort to change that.

Well, you could see a psychologist. They might be able to help you with it to some degree, because that certainly sounds terrible. :(

Nope, no virgin here.

I lost it my virginity very late indeed, but when I did I lost it thouroughly :D

Yeah, i'm a loser :pOh, come on. Eut was 22 when he lost his virginity if I remember correctly and look at him now. :D

Oh, come on. Eut was 22 when he lost his virginity if I remember correctly and look at him now. :D

Yeah, that's what i'm afraid of.

:D

First had sex at the age of 18. Since then, I've only ever had sex with one other person, and he's my long-term boyfriend.

I was thoroughly unimpressed with my first time - I couldn't believe that this frankly dull act was what everyone in the world raved about. After I'd split up with my ex and met my current partner, though, I realised what all the fuss was about ;)

Oh, come on. Eut was 22 when he lost his virginity if I remember correctly and look at him now. :D
ROFLMFAO!!! There are several versions of that story. Which one would you prefer? :p

Yeah, that's what i'm afraid of.

:D
HA! You should BE so lucky! :D :p

ROFLMFAO!!! There are several versions of that story. Which one would you prefer? :pThe one that has you at an older age than me where being bereft of virginity is concerned ;)

(Aaaaah! Why did it have to be the :( that they got rid of this time?!)

Well I do not normally speak about this, but as you are all complete strangers whom I have no trust in whatsoever, I suppose I can. I seem to have a significant fear of physical contact with other people. I first realised that my chances of physical intimacy with another person were quite low when a woman I cared quite a great deal about tried to hug me and I instinctively pushed her away and jumped aside. Though I have experienced this for quite a long time -- my mother hasn't even been able to hug me since I was very young -- this was the first true realisation of the problem. Even shaking hands with somebody at a job interview or a meeting is quite distressing for me. It's quite depressing actually, as it pretty much means that I'll be devoid of intimacy, but I am used to it by now. And with that I am indeed a virgin, and I do not really bother making any effort to change that.
ever got therapy for it? it does sound pretty bad :-S

me, i love physical... stuff :) but only with some people - my gf (a lot! always be stroking her or touching her somehow - love it! and her! woo! :p) and to an extent my parents (hugs and can sit close and things)... with other people like friends i hate it and tend to avoid physical contact as much as i possibly can. probably some deep trust issues there, heh :P