NationStates Jolt Archive

Perhaps an attempt to feel less shitty about himself.
If this "feeling shitty about yourself" has drove you to attempt suicide and having large amount of depression bouts, I think you would look for every excuse to try and feel less shitty about yourself.

Compare my tastes in women and what I like seeing in women to the average 13 year old male.

This tells us little: I prefer well built partners and have a thing for dreadlocks. What does this tell you about me?

Compare my tastes in women and what I like seeing in women to the average 13 year old male.

I don't know if anyone else has said this yet, but I'm going to:

You're 13. You have no fucking clue what you like yet, nor do you know what the average 13 year old likes because no 13 year old knows shit about any of this. Grow up a bit before you start making stupid generalizations.

If this "feeling shitty about yourself" has drove you to attempt suicide and having large amount of depression bouts, I think you would look for every excuse to try and feel less shitty about yourself.

Possibly, but lashing out at the world around you and thus further deepening the impression that everything is worthless is hardly likely to help. If anything it will just strengthen your own negative opinions of yourself and the world.

This tells us little: I prefer well built partners and have a thing for dreadlocks. What does this tell you about me?
It means you want a partner who can protect you.

If this "feeling shitty about yourself" has drove you to attempt suicide and having large amount of depression bouts, I think you would look for every excuse to try and feel less shitty about yourself.
You could try feeling less shitty about yourself by building yourself up, rather than tearing other people down. Btw, nice attempt to get pity. It's a shame I won't be giving you any because of the nasty things you've been saying this entire thread.

It means you want a partner who can protect you.

Well, yeah, points for not saying something completely off beam there, but the same can be said for everyone, I would have thought. Protection is a two-way street.

Compare my tastes in women and what I like seeing in women to the average 13 year old male. *snip*
13 year olds are immature, but you're no more mature than they are...

Me: Intelligent, Independent, Completely honest.

Average: Stupid (So they can be taken advantage of), Submissive (Same as before), and lies to them so that they don't have to face the fact of themselves.
lol. Again, I call bullshit. You admitted to liking girls who feel like shit about themselves too, they're going to be taken advantage of more than anything unfortunately.

You could try feeling less shitty about yourself by building yourself up, rather than tearing other people down.
With this body? Impossible.

Me: Intelligent, Independent, Completely honest.

Average: Stupid (So they can be taken advantage of), Submissive (Same as before), and lies to them so that they don't have to face the fact of themselves.

So far, I'm not seeing a great deal of that intelligence. Much of your argument is that because some women/girls wear short skirts, they must be whores and little else. I would argue that in this case, it is stubbornness.

Furthermore, you say that you have been written off, thereby you write everybody else off. That indicates to me that because you have been hurt once, you have decided to close yourself to the rest of the world. I do not know what your behaviour is like in school, given that wide allowances should be made for variations on internet behaviour when comparing, but it seems to me that in this particular case, you are choosing not to look at what is used to actually 'write' you off.

Perhaps it is because you are unwilling to do so, or do not wish to do so, I do not know. But what I do know is that based on the evidence presented so far, I would have to say you are being somewhat petulant.

With this body? Impossible.

Realizing that the vast majority of sexual attraction is not determined purely by the shape of your body is one of the keys to adulthood. 90% of sex happens in the head, not between the legs.

With this body? Impossible.
:rolleyes:

If you think you're fat, how about you do something like take a long bike ride a couple times a week. For one thing, the fact that you're doing something other than sitting on your ass all day will make you feel better.

So far, I'm not seeing a great deal of that intelligence. Much of your argument is that because some women/girls wear short skirts, they must be whores and little else. I would argue that in this case, it is stubbornness.

Furthermore, you say that you have been written off, thereby you write everybody else off. That indicates to me that because you have been hurt once, you have decided to close yourself to the rest of the world. I do not know what your behaviour is like in school, given that wide allowances should be made for variations on internet behaviour when comparing, but it seems to me that in this particular case, you are choosing not to look at what is used to actually 'write' you off.

Perhaps it is because you are unwilling to do so, or do not wish to do so, I do not know. But what I do know is that based on the evidence presented so far, I would have to say you are being somewhat petulant.
*slap slap slap* I said that's what I perfered in a WOMAN, not what I am.

Well if everyone writes me off, which they have done, why not write everyone off?

Do you know what an "internal censor" is?

:rolleyes:

If you think you're fat, how about you do something like take a long bike ride a couple times a week. For one thing, the fact that you're doing something other than sitting on your ass all day will make you feel better.
My medical conditions:

Femur Approxia. Prevents me from doing a large variety of physical activity with my legs and feet

Motor Skill Approxia. Prevents me from doing a large variety of physical activity with my hands and arms.

(I have mentioned the above to as refrence to the fact that the majority of girls at my school will only talk to a guy if he is physically adept)

Lateral Lisp. Gives me an incredibly annoying speech impediment.

Oh, and how can we forget this? (http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e377/Ritlina/?action=view&current=Alex006.jpg)

My medical conditions:

Femur Approxia. Prevents me from doing a large variety of physical activity with my legs and feet

Motor Skill Approxia. Prevents me from doing a large variety of physical activity with my hands and arms.

(I have mentioned the above to as refrence to the fact that the majority of girls at my school will only talk to a guy if he is physically adept)

Lateral Lisp. Gives me an incredibly annoying speech impediment.

Oh, and how can we forget this? (http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e377/Ritlina/?action=view&current=Alex006.jpg)
Uh huh. Well, I guess you're just destined to be a fat sack of crap for the rest of your life then.

If your weight is unhealthy, your doctor should be able to suggest some ways you can exercise.

*slap slap slap* I said that's what I perfered in a WOMAN, not what I am.

I do not see where I have said anywhere that you are a woman. I shall reiterate. You say, due to dress behaviour, certain women/girls are sluts. But you do not expound beyond that. You stick to that singular point without raising any additional evidence to back it. Your argument is much like a survey with a sample size of 5 but intended to represent 50,000,000 people. It is simply flawed and illogical.

By sticking to that point without further evidence despite counter-arguments, you display not the traits of intelligence, but rather, stubborness.

However, I will award you a small sum of points for attempting to derail the statement.


Well if everyone writes me off, which they have done, why not write everyone off?

Have you ever wondered why that is the case? If you ever wish to actually partake of society, one must expect to give something back, whether it be an actual contribution or a change within one's behaviour (constantly flinging live inciendary devices for a rather extreme example, is NOT socially acceptable under any circumstances).

If you give nothing, but expect something, that is rather selfish is it not?

Uh huh. Well, I guess you're just destined to be a fat sack of crap for the rest of your life then.

If your weight is unhealthy, your doctor should be able to suggest some ways you can exercise.
My weight is not unhealthy. I may have only one or two inches excess around the belly. Not that much.

Have you ever wondered why that is the case? If you ever wish to actually partake of society, one must expect to give something back, whether it be an actual contribution or a change within one's behaviour (constantly flinging live inciendary devices for a rather extreme example, is NOT socially acceptable under any circumstances).

If you give nothing, but expect something, that is rather selfish is it not?
I've given myself plenty of times in early Elementry school in hopes of gaining friends. For some reason, no matter how compassionate, kind and caring I am, not one seemed to give a shit about me. So I just decided "Fuck it. Why should I care what they think about me?" And then decided to leave social interaction to everyone else.

My weight is not unhealthy. I may have only one or two inches excess around the belly. Not that much.
Then quit bitching about your body.

Then quit bitching about your body.
Being fat isn't the only problem affecting the bodies of people around the world, you know. My lateral lisp is part of my body, and without a doubt affects my social interaction. My femur approxia and motor skill approxia without a doubt affect my social interaction by making me lesser in the eys of athletic persons and girls who enjoy athletic persons.

I've given myself plenty of times in early Elementry school in hopes of gaining friends. For some reason, no matter how compassionate, kind and caring I am, not one seemed to give a shit about me. So I just decided "Fuck it. Why should I care what they think about me?" And then decided to leave social interaction to everyone else.

Assuming that all these events are 100% true, the human memory is imperfect after all, and we tend to edit them, then it would seem that your attempts at gaining friends was forced. Such things almost never work out. Nevertheless, choosing the opposite spectrum of action will net you the same result.

My medical conditions:

Femur Approxia. Prevents me from doing a large variety of physical activity with my legs and feet

Motor Skill Approxia. Prevents me from doing a large variety of physical activity with my hands and arms.

(I have mentioned the above to as refrence to the fact that the majority of girls at my school will only talk to a guy if he is physically adept)

Lateral Lisp. Gives me an incredibly annoying speech impediment.

Oh, and how can we forget this? (http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e377/Ritlina/?action=view&current=Alex006.jpg)

Just out of curiosity, could you post a link with some information on those conditions - I hadn't heard of them and couldn't find anything online....

Just out of curiosity, could you post a link with some information on those conditions - I hadn't heard of them and couldn't find anything online....
Meh. Let me google or wiki it.

Meh. Let me google or wiki it.

I already did w/o result, which is why I asked.

http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&safe=off&q=%22femur+Approxia&btnG=Search
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&safe=off&q=%22Motor+Skill+Approxia.+&btnG=Search

Just out of curiosity, could you post a link with some information on those conditions - I hadn't heard of them and couldn't find anything online....
Son of a bitch... Well either the doctor's lied to me about my conditions or the information about those conditions hasn't reached the web yet. But both conditions affect the joint movement of the said areas they affect. When I run, my legs tend to go out to the sides. I can also bend my legs to where one is directly on top of the other. When I write, I hold my writing utensil in a way everyone else seems to have an incredibly hard time doing. But with motor skill approxia, I am able to type incredibly fast as the way my joints bend allow me to reach the keys incredibly faster than usual. The only way to fix these conditions would be to break the affected bone areas until they are set into a normal fixation. I don't want to do that.

Oh, and I am not mistaking Approxia for Apraxia either. Apraxia is a condition in which the affected joints tend to not work, or have neurological spasms.

With this body? Impossible.

Dakini is right on the money with her suggestion. Girls will find your extremely negative attitude towards yourself and others more of a turn off than your body. If you showed some confidence (make eye contact, stand up straight, chin up, dress nicely, fix up your hair, work out, be friendly [but not desperate kind of friendly] and talkative) I have no doubt your luck with girls, and your perception of them, will start to change. I had your exact same attitude about myself at your age. Now at only 17, I'm extremely happy with my life and my GF and I have been together for about 14.5 months.

Wasn't there an international ass grabbing day a few days ago too? Nobody grabbed my ass :(

Wasn't there an international ass grabbing day a few days ago too? Nobody grabbed my ass :(

:D

Oh nothing, just putting an evil grin on my face, that's all.

:D

Oh nothing, just putting an evil grin on my face, that's all.
So you're part of the huge conspiracy against me too eh? *adds name to a very long list*

Dakini is right on the money with her suggestion. Girls will find your extremely negative attitude towards yourself and others more of a turn off than your body. If you showed some confidence (make eye contact, stand up straight, chin up, dress nicely, fix up your hair, work out, be friendly [but not desperate kind of friendly] and talkative) I have no doubt your luck with girls, and your perception of them, will start to change. I had your exact same attitude about myself at your age. Now at only 17, I'm extremely happy with my life and my GF and I have been together for about 14.5 months.
Why should I have a good self-image? Aren't girls supposed to be compassionate/kind/caring towards those who can't possibly fix their physical/mental situation anyways? Meh. Reality sucks.

So you're part of the huge conspiracy against me too eh? *adds name to a very long list*

No, its a small conspiracy. So small, so small. It's microscopic compared to your immense kawowzas. No need to worry. :D

Why should I have a good self-image? Aren't girls supposed to be compassionate/kind/caring towards those who can't possibly fix their physical/mental situation anyways? Meh. Reality sucks.

Girls like cute guys. Boys like boobs.

Ah well...

Boys like boobs.
!!! Generalization alert! (Should I even be saying that with what I've been saying in this thread?) Personally, I am more comfortable with a woman having A/B cups than having huge breasts.

!!! Generalization alert! (Should I even be saying that with what I've been saying in this thread?) Personally, I am more comfortable with a woman having A/B cups than having huge breasts.

Down at an English fair,
One evening I was there,
When I heard a showman shouting
Underneath the flare:

Hoi've got a luvverly bunch o' coconuts.
There they are a-standin' in row.
Big ones, small ones, some as big as yer 'ead!
Give 'em a twist, a flick o' the wrist,
That's what the showman said.

Hoi've got a luvverly bunch o' coconuts.
Hevery ball yer throw will make me rich.
There stands me wife, the idol of me life,
Singin' "roll a-bowl a ball, a penny a pitch!"

Roll a-bowl a ball, a penny a pitch!
Roll a-bowl a ball, a penny a pitch!
There stands me wife, the idol of me life,
Singin' "roll a-bowl a ball, a penny a pitch!"

Sorry I couldn't resist. :D

!!! Generalization alert! (Should I even be saying that with what I've been saying in this thread?) Personally, I am more comfortable with a woman having A/B cups than having huge breasts.
I think you'll find that A/B cups are still boobs. You are the one generalising by assuming he meant big boobs.

Why should I have a good self-image? Aren't girls supposed to be compassionate/kind/caring towards those who can't possibly fix their physical/mental situation anyways? Meh. Reality sucks.

You should have a positive self-image because it is in your own best interest to do so. You have total control over your "mental situation," don't convince yourself otherwise like I used to. I sincerely doubt your physical ailments are what causes girls to "write you off." And don't try and tell me you are physically incapable of dressing nicely and making eye contact.

Being fat isn't the only problem affecting the bodies of people around the world, you know. My lateral lisp is part of my body, and without a doubt affects my social interaction. My femur approxia and motor skill approxia without a doubt affect my social interaction by making me lesser in the eys of athletic persons and girls who enjoy athletic persons.

It's APRAXIA. Verbal/physical apraxia and I believe you might mean femur ataxia. Femur ataxia can possibly be cause by a slipped capital femoral epiphysis, and causes a limp or "spastic gait". Ataxia shouldn't completely stop you from physical activity and there are treatment options (which I'm sure you and your parents have looked into).

Also, the "average" guy doesn't look for a stupid girl or a girl who wears lots of make up. I don't know of any guy who says "Oops, well she's not wearing enough make up so I could never date her." Most of the men I know look for intelligent women (red heads, brunettes, or blondes included).

And the fact that you're only 13, doesn't really give you much say on sex. Unless you've had sex you can't know whats good or bad, nor can you judge whether sex with someone you don't love is like "lemonade without sugar".

You should have a positive self-image because it is in your own best interest to do so. You have total control over your "mental situation," don't convince yourself otherwise like I used to. I sincerely doubt your physical ailments are what causes girls to "write you off." And don't try and tell me you are physically incapable of dressing nicely and making eye contact.
Listen, most of the girls at my school will not even look at guys who aren't physically adept. So techincally, it will cause them to write me off. Well, if my family didn't have a 30k debt, I probably could dress nicely. And if I make eye contact, they usually either get thier boyfriends to "beat the crap out of that wierd stalker kid", or are simply more repulsed.

And Aerou, I'm trusting my doctors over you.

Listen, most of the girls at my school will not even look at guys who aren't physically adept. So techincally, it will cause them to write me off. Well, if my family didn't have a 30k debt, I probably could dress nicely. And if I make eye contact, they usually either get thier boyfriends to "beat the crap out of that wierd stalker kid", or are simply more repulsed.

And Aerou, I'm trusting my doctors over you.
Dear god. Reading that over made me start thinking up a song about how it's hard to be a freak...

Her calf?
I'm going to assume he meant hamstrings. If he meant calf than he needs to go back to the 50's

What's going on here?

Listen, most of the girls at my school will not even look at guys who aren't physically adept. So techincally, it will cause them to write me off. Well, if my family didn't have a 30k debt, I probably could dress nicely. And if I make eye contact, they usually either get thier boyfriends to "beat the crap out of that wierd stalker kid", or are simply more repulsed.

And Aerou, I'm trusting my doctors over you.
Then what about the minority of girls that will look at guys who aren't physically adept?
And bugger to dressing nice.
And don't quote yourself, that's what the edit button is for. And don't write a song. Remember kids, the name emo is a blatant lie, there are a wide range of emotions, split about 50:50 in terms of positive and negative. Try writing songs about how happy you are about whatever you're happy about, as opposed to hard your life is. Loads of people have done that.

What's going on here?
Nothing that concerns you, move along sir.

Nothing that concerns you, move along sir.
Mmmk, just stopped by to see if you had cake.. see ya good sir.

EDIT: Did you see this http://www.xtremeservers.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/nooo.gif and this http://www.xtremeservers.co.uk/forum/images/smilies/shake.gif from my post in the riddle thread?

Mmmk, just stopped by to see if you had cake.. see ya good sir.
*hides cake*
*mutters into lapel mike*
Subject leaving the area, call off the bombers. No rush.

Seriously. If you see a girl who's shorts are up at the end of her thigh, what is the first thought that comes to mind? "Slut", of course.

If that is the first thing that comes to your mind then you are a pervert.
Or a teenager:eek:

*walks back in*

Roy Mustang now must be Fuhrer :D

Listen, most of the girls at my school will not even look at guys who aren't physically adept. So techincally, it will cause them to write me off. Well, if my family didn't have a 30k debt, I probably could dress nicely. And if I make eye contact, they usually either get thier boyfriends to "beat the crap out of that wierd stalker kid", or are simply more repulsed.

And Aerou, I'm trusting my doctors over you.

Making eye contact =| staring them down. I suppose I should specify that you should make eye contact while talking. No one will request an ass kicking. I doubt the majority of them write off everyone who isn't athletic. I find it more likely that you use this as an excuse to let yourself wallow in more self-pity. But even if it is true, as Ifreann pointed out, there are still some that don't. Dressing nicely doesn't have to be expensive, but if you're really hard up for $, just avoid looking like a slob.

Seriously. If you see a girl who's shorts are up at the end of her thigh, what is the first thought that comes to mind? "Slut", of course.

No, I think, "oh, it's Aaron's lucky day." ^.^

If that is the first thing that comes to your mind then you are a pervert.
Or a teenager:eek:
The latter. I am no where NEAR a pervert.

Then what about the minority of girls that will look at guys who aren't physically adept?
They're either glancing at me, glaring at me, or staring at me because they think I'm an oddity.

Making eye contact =| staring them down. I suppose I should specify that you should make eye contact while talking.

*Starts talking to a girl* *girl says in prep accent* "Why do you talk so funny?" *girl walks away*

No one will request an ass kicking.

May I show you some bruises, my good man?

I doubt the majority of them write off everyone who isn't athletic.
They do, they do.

when I was in junior high, high school I was the girl who looked at the Male "oddities" because I thought they were hot...

You never know *grins*

Making eye contact =| staring them down.
I stare down everyone, not just girls. I rather enjoy staring people down, actually. I love the fear in their eyes as they are scared shitless by me. You think they wouldn't be afraid of me, but when I do something as evil-esc as staring someone down, they run for the hills.

when I was in junior high, high school I was the girl who looked at the Male "oddities" because I thought they were hot...

You never know *grins*
So you looked at guys whos legs/hands/arms/feet bent in an akward way, who had a speech impediment, and had uncontrollable acne? You must've been desperate...

when I was in junior high, high school I was the girl who looked at the Male "oddities" because I thought they were hot...

You never know *grins*

Speaking as a doctor*I prescribe a course of John Hughes movies to Naliitr to be taken nightly after homework.


* I am not a doctor.

So you looked at guys whos legs/hands/arms/feet bent in an akward way, who had a speech impediment, and had uncontrollable acne? You must've been desperate...

Never desperate and you know what I meant, the geeky, awkward, unsure of themselves, not quite swimming with the rest of the crowd... those "oddities" and mercy me if a female would rather measure someone by their intelligence rather then their jock strap...

Speaking as a doctor*I prescribe a course of John Hughes movies to Naliitr to be taken nightly after homework.


* I am not a doctor.
John Hughes? Who's John Hughes?

Never desperate and you know what I meant, the geeky, awkward, unsure of themselves, not quite swimming with the rest of the crowd... those "oddities" and mercy me if a female would rather measure someone by their intelligence rather then their jock strap...
Well, if you did that then you obviously didn't fit in like the ones you were staring at. Because if you did "fit in", then you could've had a much better boyfriend, like a jock or a prep.

John Hughes? Who's John Hughes?

Take your pick (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes)

Take your pick (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes)
*Slaps self* BREAKFAST CLUB! I'm such a moron. I can't believe I actually forgot who John Hughes is! I mean, the Breakfast Club is one of my favorite movies! The only problem I ever had with it was when Allison was turned into a prep...

Who says she couldn't have had a jock or a prep anyway? The people she was attracted to says nothing about who was attracted to her.

I have always preferred artists of all types to jocks. What i find sexy is intelligence and kindness, not brute strength. It was like that in high school too. There were only two athletes in my life i ever had crushes on, and one was a straight A student, that impressed me far more than the fact that he was on the basketball team. I'll admit i wasn't the most popular person in school, but i wasn't an outsider either.

In one breath you seem to criticise these girls for not noticing you, then in the next breath you say if they did want to go out with you they'd be desperate. You seem to care an awful lot what a bunch of desperate girls think of you.

John Hughes was a director in the 80's who made movies like The Breakfast Club, Pretty in Pink and 16 Candles. Movies about high school and teenage angst. I love them.

The other poster beat me to the John Hughes info..lol.

Well, if you did that then you obviously didn't fit in like the ones you were staring at. Because if you did "fit in", then you could've had a much better boyfriend, like a jock or a prep.

Now that is hillarious!

How sad that one would measure sucess by someone more concerned with sports and prom rather then someone who they can talk to about the world in general? You dont think a popular girl might want to talk about more then fashion week and who is going where with whom? Wait, never mind you are still a kid.. and with that attitude always will be...

In one breath you seem to criticise these girls for not noticing you, then in the next breath you say if they did want to go out with you they'd be desperate. You seem to care an awful lot what a bunch of desperate girls think of you.
I've seen all of his movies like, 25 times. I just lapsed there. I never criticized them for not noticing me, I simply said they don't notice me for retarded reasons. And good job on the quick edit. They would have to be desperate as according to many a prep/cheerleader/etc., I am "That wierd, ugly kid who'll probably end up the 80 Year Old Virgin."

Now that is hillarious!

How sad that one would measure sucess by someone more concerned with sports and prom rather then someone who they can talk to about the world in general? You dont think a popular girl might want to talk about more then fashion week and who is going where with whom? Wait, never mind you are still a kid.. and with that attitude always will be...
Did you note the cyncism mixed with sarcasm in my voice? By saying that, I meant that I find that a large majority of girls who can have jock/preps will take the jocks/preps without second thought.

I usually notice my typos and other mistakes pretty quickly, usually before other people have to point them out to me.

Yeah, i read your post about John Hughes, i was still typing when you responded to it.

Well, Naliitr, all I can do is tell you my personal philosophy on life. This got me through 18 years under an abusive stepfather, a year in Iraq, and 2 years (2 down, 4 to go) of college.

When you have a problem ask yourself "Can I do anything to fix this problem?"

If the answer is yes, then do it. If the answer is no, then just roll with the punches. Being angry and frustrated over shit that you have no control over is completely pointless. If there is nothing you can do, being angry certainly won't help things.

Anyway, one really big thing that will help dramatically is just to be cool to people. The whole staring down thing really isn't going too help much. If someone doesn't like you, don't worry about it. In a few years you'll never see these people again, and in the grand scheme of things they're not worth bothering over.

If the answer is no, then just roll with the punches. Being angry and frustrated over shit that you have no control over is completely pointless. If there is nothing you can do, being angry certainly won't help things. Well, since I can't do anything to help it, why not have fun with it?

Anyway, one really big thing that will help dramatically is just to be cool to people. The whole staring down thing really isn't going too help much. If someone doesn't like you, don't worry about it.
They be cool to me, I be cool to them. And I only stare them down if they insult me, pick on me, or try to talk to me about something that I either hate or really don't care about. Oh, and did I mention I just had major deja-vu while reading your post. And I mean MAJOR deja-vu.

Yeah, i read your post about John Hughes, i was still typing when you responded to it.
You have to agree with me, John Hughes is the greatest director of all time.

Well, since I can't do anything to help it, why not have fun with it?


They be cool to me, I be cool to them. And I only stare them down if they insult me, pick on me, or try to talk to me about something that I either hate or really don't care about. Oh, and did I mention I just had major deja-vu while reading your post. And I mean MAJOR deja-vu.



I've been busy today, so I haven't had time to get back to you with the follow-up to the question I asked earlier. If you recall, I asked if you knew what an "internal censor" is. It's that little voice inside your head that says "Hey, you know, If I say that all girls that wear short skirts are sluts, or if I contemplate using overheard information for blackmail, or say that I "stare down" people who talk about topics that don't interest me, people are liable to think I'm an arrogant ass. Maybe I shouldn't say stuff like that."

lol...i like his movies, but my favorite directors are Steven Spielberg and Tim Burton.

Angst, angst, angst.

That about sums it up. Not that I don't have empathy for you - I'm a teenager myself, and I've felt what you're feeling to a certain degree. But it's pretty clear that, because of your low self-esteem and frustration from feeling ostracized, you are beginning to simplify and stereotype people who seem to be the cause of your anguish. Get this into your head: tight and revealing clothing does not mean that the wearer wants to have sex, let alone is "whoring herself out." As has been stated many times in this thread, choice of clothing is very often unrelated to sexuality or libido. Don't be so rigidly judgmental; you aren't doing anyone a favor.

The root of the problem, though, is most likely that you feel you must scorn and shun "popular" types in order to feel good about yourself. Not healthy. You need to realize what's good about yourself, not what's bad, real or imagined, about others, in order to be happy - otherwise, you'll never truly be happy. Luckily, you have most of your teenage years left to realize this.

And Aerou, I'm trusting my doctors over you.

Which is fine.

But its not approxia, it's apraxia. So either you're hearing it wrong....or you know what it is and typing it wrong.

You dont think a popular girl might want to talk about more then fashion week and who is going where with whom? Wait, never mind you are still a kid.. and with that attitude always will be...
That's what most of the girls at my school talk about all the time.

The root of the problem, though, is most likely that you feel you must scorn and shun "popular" types in order to feel good about yourself. Not healthy. You need to realize what's good about yourself, not what's bad, real or imagined, about others, in order to be happy - otherwise, you'll never truly be happy. Luckily, you have most of your teenage years left to realize this.
Looking for something good in myself... Looking... Looking... Looking some more... Looking even more... Nope. Can't find anything. I shun "popular" types because the shun me.

People are liable to think I'm an arrogant ass. Maybe I shouldn't say stuff like that."
And? Does it look like I care what those nimrods think about me?

How about:

We don't judge people negatively at first glance? Maybe we should all try to be forgiving of each other's faults, and realize that people have a wide variety of personal differences and preferences? Several of the cheerleaders/jocks/"popular" kids I knew in high school and easily classed away as 'muscle - bound jackasses' or 'mindless bimbos' turned out to have complex and interesting personalities. Others turned out to be very obnoxious. People are people, and really are very complex. The reasons for their clothing choices are seldom rational (especially in high school/jr. high) and range from a desire to fit in with people they admire to an honest love of the aesthetic they choose to (in some cases, yes, it is true) a desire to attract the opposite sex to a simple desire for comfort.

What's wrong with any of these reasons for something so silly as which fabrics you choose to gird yourself with? Isn't it nice to be friends with those you like? Well, yes, it is, and if choosing a certain style can smooth over their unconscious reactions to you (which are unconscious and therefore difficult to control or force into a certain specific rational channel, and yet can have a dramatic effect on behavior), then it makes sense to dress like that.

Similarly, if one thinks that a certain way of dressing is very beautiful, is very aesthetically pleasing, and it also happens to look nice on one's self, then isn't it rational to try and increase the amount of beauty in this world by dressing so? I mean, beautiful things are beautiful.

Also, if a person is lonely and wants to attract somebody of the opposite (or same) sex, one of the best ways to do it is to change their unconscious thoughts about you. And how one dresses does change that. So it can, once again, help smooth the way so that something beautiful can emerge.

Finally, different people have hugely different ideas of "comfort". I, for one, have never understood how anyone could ever have found a toga comfortable, but perhaps Socrates thought different. Fuck if I know! So if they do find short skirts especially comfortable to wear, then it would be highly rational of them to wear them.

So, in short, while our unconscious thoughts may be difficult to control, our conscious ones are much less so, and a little forgiveness goes a long way.

Besides, if you are suffering from self-esteem issues (for which I sympathize with you heartily), forgiveness is a great ego trip. "Lo, you have sinned," forgiveness says through your mind, "but despite the grievousness of your actions, still I deign to forgive you and treat you worthily, as a human being." Like I said, it can give one a great feeling of power, forgiving someone.

So, yah. In short, "Human" = intrinsically worthy of respect. (not that there's anything that exists that isn't intrinsically worthy of respect, but humans are certainly especially so.)

And? Does it look like I care what those nimrods think about me?

Yes, actually :p

How about:

We don't judge people negatively at first glance?
If they do so, I will do so.



Besides, if you are suffering from self-esteem issues (for which I sympathize with you heartily), forgiveness is a great ego trip. "Lo, you have sinned," forgiveness says through your mind, "but despite the grievousness of your actions, still I deign to forgive you and treat you worthily, as a human being." Like I said, it can give one a great feeling of power, forgiving someone.

So you mean I have to forgive people for shunning me at first glance to have my self-esteem raised? Or people have to forgive me for shunning me at first glance to have my self-esteem raised?

When we get older we realize that most of the things we worried about as teenagers were not important at all in the grand scheme of things. That's not to belittle what you or any teenager goes through, but i remember what it was like to be that age. When we are young we take everything so seriously, and most of the things are really not worth worrying about at all.

People grow up, some of the most shallow people in school grow up to be the kindest. I had a crush on a guy from grade 5-7. In grade 8 he became a complete jerk and i no longer liked him. A few years later, in grade 11 and 12, he went back to being the nice guy he was when i liked him. It's so important to people in junior high and high school to fit in, and sometimes they go about it the wrong way. Most people realize it was the wrong way once they've had the chance to mature.

Yes, actually :p
Then you are mis-reading my posts.

Looking for something good in myself... Looking... Looking... Looking some more... Looking even more... Nope. Can't find anything. I shun "popular" types because the shun me.

*has a heart attack* For once I actually am on Naliitr's side here on this entire topic! What IS this world coming to?

There's nothing good in him. Oh wait, that's not really what I agreed with. ;) I don't tend to go in for "popular" types either. If I had to guess, not too many people here do, largely because intelligent, thoughtful people tend to be less "popular". My husband had a group of friend in high school who nicknamed themselves "The Losers". They were the top 10 ranked in their class, and the entire student government, among other things. To my mind, that's the better sort of "popular" to be anyway.

I don't think most girls who wear short skirts (I don't, although I could and still look good) are whores. I DO think, however, that they are attention whores. Only the most niave girls aren't aware of the inevitable reaction it causes with guys' eyes. And before you say it's all about being cool and comfortable, you can be equally cool and comfortable in a long lightweight skirt as a short one. Probably more so. Plus, then you aren't putting yourself on window display without (or with) the intention of selling.

If they do so, I will do so.


So you mean I have to forgive people for shunning me at first glance to have my self-esteem raised? Or people have to forgive me for shunning me at first glance to have my self-esteem raised?

Er, the idea was that you forgive them, therefore realizing that you hold the power of forgiveness over them, thus boosting your self-esteem. This might not seem like much, but, speaking from experience, it actually is an impressive power.

And, besides, somebody has to start stopping sometime. (does that make sense? what I mean is: there has to be someone who first stops judging people at first glance, else if the law "i'll do it when they do it!" is strictly followed, it will never happen.) So you might as well take the moral high ground (another easy excuse to feel good about yourself!) and be the one to start.

Although, to be fair, you might be judging them correctly. From what I remember of middle school, most everyone really is a dick at that point in time. Hell, I know I was.

But, yeah, sorry for the stupid boring pointless lecture of morals! I will go back to being a crabby old man now, and wait for more kids whom I can trick into listening to me. :p Anyway: *runs into corner and lurks*

I would never wear anything shorter than knee-length in public willingly. The only skirt I own is knee-length and I've only worn it once, when I was required to for a chorus concert.
We do have gym uniforms at my school,(although only about half of the people wear them, but that's their grade) and the shorts only come to about a few inches above the knee. I hate the shorts and feel demeaned by having to wear them, but I try to compensate for it by getting a large shirt so that it pretty much covers most of the shorts. I can't get a large pair of shorts because it would fall off of my waist, and that would be far worse.
My chorus dress is also too short for my tastes. It comes to maybe an inch above my knee, although its much shorter on the other girls. Probably because I got an adult small when a child size possibly would have fit me better. But I went with the adult size so that it wouldn't be excessively short (in my opinion, more than an inch above the knee.)
Usually, I wear long black pants and a black or red t-shirt, usually in a large size.
However, I don't judge girls who wear short skirts based on what they wear. I just would personally never wear a skirt of a length above the knee if I had any choice in the matter.

When we get older we realize that most of the things we worried about as teenagers were not important at all in the grand scheme of things. That's not to belittle what you or any teenager goes through, but i remember what it was like to be that age. When we are young we take everything so seriously, and most of the things are really not worth worrying about at all.

People grow up, some of the most shallow people in school grow up to be the kindest. I had a crush on a guy from grade 5-7. In grade 8 he became a complete jerk and i no longer liked him. A few years later, in grade 11 and 12, he went back to being the nice guy he was when i liked him. It's so important to people in junior high and high school to fit in, and sometimes they go about it the wrong way. Most people realize it was the wrong way once they've had the chance to mature.
Good post! I like it. :)

Going through the teenage years is an ... interesting experience. Not only are you trying to decide who you are, but you're trying on different behaviors and varying ideologies/theologies/paradigms. The surprising thing is that any of us actually make it through to the other side! I can remember my father thretening me with total annialation several times. Heh!

I swear, 50% more girls than usual at my school wore short, VERY short skirts today. Those that didn't were either preppy or loners like me. Personally, I don't find wearing skimpy clothing to be a turn-on. I find it to be a major turn-off, as I do not appreciate sluts very much. So I ask you, was today the annual "Wear a short skirt day!"?

Better known as "THE SWEETEST DAY EVER"...... Some girls look terrific in skirts, you have to admit that......

The surprising thing is that any of us actually make it through to the other side! I can remember my father thretening me with total annialation several times. Heh!

I think those that don't make it and come from families with some means tend to end up in re-education camps. Remember Tranquility bay?

I would never wear anything shorter than knee-length in public willingly. The only skirt I own is knee-length and I've only worn it once, when I was required to for a chorus concert.
We do have gym uniforms at my school,(although only about half of the people wear them, but that's their grade) and the shorts only come to about a few inches above the knee. I hate the shorts and feel demeaned by having to wear them, but I try to compensate for it by getting a large shirt so that it pretty much covers most of the shorts. I can't get a large pair of shorts because it would fall off of my waist, and that would be far worse.
My chorus dress is also too short for my tastes. It comes to maybe an inch above my knee, although its much shorter on the other girls. Probably because I got an adult small when a child size possibly would have fit me better. But I went with the adult size so that it wouldn't be excessively short (in my opinion, more than an inch above the knee.)
Usually, I wear long black pants and a black or red t-shirt, usually in a large size.
However, I don't judge girls who wear short skirts based on what they wear. I just would personally never wear a skirt of a length above the knee if I had any choice in the matter.
*claps* Finally, a girl in this thread who actually isn't demeaning my statements, and dresses how I would like a girl to dress! *Gives cookie*

Remember Tranquility bay?
Not really. Remind me please.

*claps* Finally, a girl in this thread who actually isn't demeaning my statements, and dresses how I would like a girl to dress! *Gives cookie*

We're not demeaning you for your taste in women's clothing, we're demeaning you for your judgement of all women who do not meet your expectations.

I am. I'm just classical in my ideas of love and relationships.
Evolve. Please.

Looking for something good in myself... Looking... Looking... Looking some more... Looking even more... Nope. Can't find anything. I shun "popular" types because the shun me.

I have a sneaking suspicion that you are being blinded by your anger and frustration. Do you mean to say that you are a poor student, aren't good at any sports or games, have no talent, have never made anyone happy??

Even if that were somehow true - at the very least, virtually everyone has the potential to do great things, and there's nothing I've read about you that suggests to me otherwise.

As for shunning - you'll find that if you are friendly, open, and helpful to your peers, they'll begin to show you respect and reciprocate your good will. Appearance may be more of a factor at your age than later in life, but if your attitude is likeable enough, it will still hardly matter.

I think those that don't make it and come from families with some means tend to end up in re-education camps. Remember Tranquility bay?
Yes, unfortunately. :(

I have a sneaking suspicion that you are being blinded by your anger and frustration. Do you mean to say that you are a poor student, aren't good at any sports or games, have no talent, have never made anyone happy??

Even if that were somehow true - at the very least, virtually everyone has the potential to do great things, and there's nothing I've read about you that suggests to me otherwise.

As for shunning - you'll find that if you are friendly, open, and helpful to your peers, they'll begin to show you respect and reciprocate your good will. Appearance may be more of a factor at your age than later in life, but if your attitude is likeable enough, it will still hardly matter.
I am better than average in school, but everyone thinks that I am such a better student than I really am. I suck at sports. Completely. Ooo! I can type really fast! What a talent! :rolleyes: Thinking of times when I have made people happy. Thinking... Thinking... Thinking some more... Thinking EVEN more... Nope. Nothing. I was friendly, open, and helpful to my peers from K-3rd grade in an attempt to gain friends. Never happened.

Tight-fitting, low-riding jeans is more my cup of tea for the girls.

*claps* Finally, a girl in this thread who actually isn't demeaning my statements, and dresses how I would like a girl to dress! *Gives cookie*

I don't think that everyone else has been "demeaning your statements." It does seem terribly prejudiced to assume that girls who wear short skirts are impure.
Although it is an instinct to make snap judgments about people, you can practically never make an accurate judgment about people based upon what they wear or how they look.
And it's definitely not fun to be judged. I don't like it when people assume that I'm gothic just because I wear black most of the time and I have fair skin. Basically, I wear black because the T-shirts for my favorite show primarily only come in black. It's no fun to have people pester me about it.
It's definitely no fun to be called a "ghost" because of my skin tone. However, those people are easily repelled simply by mentioning UV radiation.
They actually answered, "Well, I'm not a science freak, so I don't know what radiation means." They never bothered me again.
This is also strange. Someone actually asked me if I was mute once, just because I'm quiet.
My point is that it's not a good idea to judge people based on how they look.

I don't think that everyone else has been "demeaning your statements." It does seem terribly prejudiced to assume that girls who wear short skirts are impure.
Although it is an instinct to make snap judgments about people, you can practically never make an accurate judgment about people based upon what they wear or how they look.
And it's definitely not fun to be judged. I don't like it when people assume that I'm gothic just because I wear black most of the time and I have fair skin. Basically, I wear black because the T-shirts for my favorite show primarily only come in black. It's no fun to have people pester me about it.
It's definitely no fun to be called a "ghost" because of my skin tone. However, those people are easily repelled simply by mentioning UV radiation.
They actually answered, "Well, I'm not a science freak, so I don't know what radiation means." They never bothered me again.
This is also strange. Someone actually asked me if I was mute once, just because I'm quiet.
My point is that it's not a good idea to judge people based on how they look.


Dressing would be how they act. Good enough for me.

Tight-fitting, low-riding jeans is more my cup of tea for the girls.
bare naked is my cup of clothes for girls.

Seriously, boys don't know what they're missing with the inability to wear skirts.
What inability?

True. If only every man knew how great it felt to have your legs unencumbered by pants all the time.
Shorts!

I thought people don't want to see our hairy legs. :D
They totally do. :cool:

2. Well, most girls upper legs in my school I estimate to be 12 inches. And I usually see 8 inches of that.
They're 13. People grow taller when they get older.

You seem to think that girls are a species in an ivory tower or something. Not really, they're just like you and at 13 they are probably very insecure about their bodies. Anyway, there's no need to bother about girlfriends or sex at the age of 13. Just let all that stuff happen later rather than forcing it now.

What inability?


Shorts!


They totally do. :cool:


They're 13. People grow taller when they get older.

You seem to think that girls are a species in an ivory tower or something. Not really, they're just like you and at 13 they are probably very insecure about their bodies. Anyway, there's no need to bother about girlfriends or sex at the age of 13. Just let all that stuff happen later rather than forcing it now.
Who are you? I've seen that signature before... I just don't know where...

Why should I have a good self-image? Aren't girls supposed to be compassionate/kind/caring towards those who can't possibly fix their physical/mental situation anyways? Meh. Reality sucks.
Why exactly are we supposed to fix your negative attitude?
I was in a relationship with a guy with shitty self esteem and it was hell because every compliment was refuted flat out, he kept suspecting that I would cheat on him because if I would date him, I must have no standards and want to fuck anything that moves, he would constantly put himself down, he would constantly put me down and I had enough of that shit. No girl should have to suffer through dating a guy with such a negative attitude.

Who are you? I've seen that signature before... I just don't know where...
I agree, I'm sure I've seen that exact sig before. Damn it I just don't remember who had it.

I agree, I'm sure I've seen that exact sig before. Damn it I just don't remember who had it.

That would be our good friend Swimmingpool (or possibly someone pretending to be him).


EDIT: I still think his sig needs make mention of the reverse cowgirl.

Why exactly are we supposed to fix your negative attitude?
I was in a relationship with a guy with shitty self esteem and it was hell because every compliment was refuted flat out, he kept suspecting that I would cheat on him because if I would date him, I must have no standards and want to fuck anything that moves, he would constantly put himself down, he would constantly put me down and I had enough of that shit. No girl should have to suffer through dating a guy with such a negative attitude.

I'm glad to hear you're out of that relationship.

I'm just classical in my ideas of love and relationships.

Meaning what exactly? You approve of old men taking young boys as their lovers?

That would be our good friend Swimmingpool (or possibly someone pretending to be him).
I make this the third version of Swimmingpool. Welcome back Swimminpool V3.0

Meaning what exactly? You approve of old men taking young boys as their lovers?
NO! DEAR GOD NO! What I mean by that is I perfer a 50's kind of relationship. Where it's all about the love, not the sex.

NO! DEAR GOD NO! What I mean by that is I perfer a 50's kind of relationship. Where it's all about the love, not the sex.
The 50's were all about sex, the kids then were just better at hiding it from their parents than kids in the 60's.

NO! DEAR GOD NO! What I mean by that is I perfer a 50's kind of relationship. Where it's all about the love, not the sex.

Since when was the 1950's the classical era? I know you are a tad on the young side, but come on now.

NO! DEAR GOD NO! What I mean by that is I perfer a 50's kind of relationship. Where it's all about the love, not the sex.

Hmm. My image of a 50s kind of relationship is one where the wife stays home cooking and cleaning all day until the husband comes home from his job and beats her for talking out of turn.

Hmm. My image of a 50s kind of relationship is one where the wife stays home cooking and cleaning all day until the husband comes home from his job and beats her for talking out of turn.
Bang, zoom, straight to the moon!

I make this the third version of Swimmingpool. Welcome back Swimminpool V3.0

Personally I'm holding off until they release v3.11 - Swimmingpool For Workgroups.

I swear, 50% more girls than usual at my school wore short, VERY short skirts today. Those that didn't were either preppy or loners like me. Personally, I don't find wearing skimpy clothing to be a turn-on. I find it to be a major turn-off, as I do not appreciate sluts very much. So I ask you, was today the annual "Wear a short skirt day!"?

My GF is not a slut but wears somewhat skimpy clothing; but that's because she has a body to show off. Some girls raise their self confidence by showing off their bod and getting attention for it. You just might be one of the unlucky ones, or you're insecure.

I'm glad to hear you're out of that relationship.
Yep. And I have been seeing a different guy who treats me much better.

That would be our good friend Swimmingpool (or possibly someone pretending to be him).

EDIT: I still think his sig needs make mention of the reverse cowgirl.
Yes, it's me again, but this is actually version 5 or 6!

I'll get working on that cowgirl. :cool:

Yep. And I have been seeing a different guy who treats me much better.

Good. It would have been hard for you to have found a guy who wouldn't treat you better.

Yep. And I have been seeing a different guy who treats me much better.
Wow, cool that you found a new fella so quickly. Congrats indeed.

Good. It would have been hard for you to have found a guy who wouldn't treat you better.
That's true.

My GF is not a slut but wears somewhat skimpy clothing; but that's because she has a body to show off. Some girls raise their self confidence by showing off their bod and getting attention for it. You just might be one of the unlucky ones, or you're insecure.
The latter.

The latter.
Once again
http://blogs.warwick.ac.uk/images/lblackwell/2005/03/01/thread_necromancer.png
Put down the shovel and step away from the grave.

Once again
http://blogs.warwick.ac.uk/images/lblackwell/2005/03/01/thread_necromancer.png
Put down the shovel and step away from the grave.
It's my thread so can't I?

It's my thread so can't I?
Exactly.

Seriously. If you see a girl who's shorts are up at the end of her thigh, what is the first thought that comes to mind? "Slut", of course.

um...no?

Miniskirts and short shorts make the hot look hotter and the nasty look worse. Methinks that perhaps you or your significant other fall into the second catagory and you're bitter.

You know Naliitr, for a such a morally concerned individual, your knowledge of the dressing habits of <cough> street-walkers surprises me. How would you know what they wore and be able to make a comparison to the girls at your school? Don't you think it's rather demeaning to your fellow students to do so?

What the hell does he mean by a street walker? I walk the streets every day.

I swear, 50% more girls than usual at my school wore short, VERY short skirts today. Those that didn't were either preppy or loners like me. Personally, I don't find wearing skimpy clothing to be a turn-on. I find it to be a major turn-off, as I do not appreciate sluts very much. So I ask you, was today the annual "Wear a short skirt day!"?
Personaly I find people that catagorize people as 'sluts' (a very negitive conotation on their sexual behavior) because of clothing choice a turnoff

Hmm. My image of a 50s kind of relationship is one where the wife stays home cooking and cleaning all day until the husband comes home from his job and beats her for talking out of turn.
Of course everyone forgets the bad parts ... people always think the past was so much better

What the hell does he mean by a street walker? I walk the streets every day.

that's what he means.... what else could street walker mean/

What the hell does he mean by a street walker? I walk the streets every day.

...are you 11 years old?

...are you 11 years old?


Not every place uses that description for those people

You know Naliitr, for a such a morally concerned individual, your knowledge of the dressing habits of <cough> street-walkers surprises me. How would you know what they wore and be able to make a comparison to the girls at your school? Don't you think it's rather demeaning to your fellow students to do so?
I live near Oakland. 'Nuff said.

If the weather patterns in Fairfield have been anything like those in Sacramento, then the girls in your school were probably just enjoying the first few days of nice weather in a long time. Combine that with a temperature hike of about ten or fifteen degrees as compared to the past few weeks, and you get... *gasp* people wearing lighter, cooler clothing. Wearing a short skirt does not make any girl a slut.

Oh, and if you live in the same Fairfield, CA that I'm thinking of, then you're not really all that close to Los Angeles.

If the weather patterns in Fairfield have been anything like those in Sacramento, then the girls in your school were probably just enjoying the first few days of nice weather in a long time. Combine that with a temperature hike of about ten or fifteen degrees as compared to the past few weeks, and you get... *gasp* people wearing lighter, cooler clothing. Wearing a short skirt does not make any girl a slut.

Oh, and if you live in the same Fairfield, CA that I'm thinking of, then you're not really all that close to Los Angeles.
I live in a crime ridden area none-the-less.

I live near Los Angeles. Nuff said.

About 400 miles*, or have I found the wrong Fairfield, CA (CA 94533)?

* In other words similar to someone living in Glasgow making the statement 'I live near London. Nuff said.' (London -> Glasgow = 410 miles)

About 400 miles*, or have I found the wrong Fairfield, CA (CA 94533)?

* In other words similar to someone living in Glasgow making the statement 'I live near London. Nuff said.' (London -> Glasgow = 410 miles)
No you haven't. Let me edit that post.

About 400 miles*, or have I found the wrong Fairfield, CA (CA 94533)?

* In other words similar to someone living in Glasgow making the statement 'I live near London. Nuff said.' (London -> Glasgow = 410 miles)
No, you found the right one. Fairfield is maybe an hour away from where I live. From either place, it's a good six to eight hour drive to LA, depending on traffic.

I live near Oakland. 'Nuff said.

All Oakland, CA, says to me is west coast hardcore (the music, not the pR0n). Is it particularly renowned for the size of its sex industry?

I am. I'm just classical in my ideas of love and relationships.
No offence but this seriously screams PUSSY!

I will not have sex till I am married but I definately enjoy seeing a girls skin...


BLO ME GRL! lol <---- J/K

All Oakland, CA, says to me is west coast hardcore (the music, not the pR0n). Is it particularly renowned for the size of its sex industry?
You'd be suprised. I have to drive through there sometimes when my mom picks me up from school and we have to go back to her work.

No offence but this seriously screams PUSSY!

I will not have sex till I am married but I definately enjoy seeing a girls skin...


BLO ME GRL! lol <---- J/K
Not marriage. Marriage is only signifigant in the federal government eyes. I'm more for no sex without love.

Not marriage. Marriage is only signifigant in the federal government eyes. I'm more for no sex without love.
Ok then I agree with you about the love part... Even though marriage for me is less about the government and more about love and godlieness but still I enjoy seeing skin and doing other stuff becides straight out sex... I will go oral and my gf and I tease each other if you know what I mean.

All Oakland, CA, says to me is west coast hardcore (the music, not the pR0n). Is it particularly renowned for the size of its sex industry?
Oakland is known for having high crime rates, supposedly well above national averages. I haven't looked any of this up for myself though, so don't take my word for it.

In the words of a driving instructor that I know who happens to be from Oakland - "Always keep your hands at 10 and 2 on the steering wheel. Unless you're driivng in Oakland, in which case you damn well better have just one hand on the wheel, at 12, if you don't want to get shot."