NationStates Jolt Archive

Why dont Ireland and Britain reunite?
It just seems a bit childish.
The economy would go uber again and the Britannian-Irish would look like a proper country on the map instead of a cookie thats bin split down the middle... your thoughts please.

I personally think Britain and Ireland should reunite

i mean... apart from bloody sunday, we brits havnt done that much and i think we were damn entitled to make one mistake.

Yes, this different countries thing is a bit silly isn't it.

I do not think either side would want Northern Ireland, the British Government would happily hand it over to the Republic if it thought it would be possible to do it cleanly.

I don't think many Irish people whould want to come under English rule again.

I think Ireland and Britain should reuunite purely because being seperate is pointless. There are worse enemies to be concerned about.

i mean... apart from bloody sunday, we brits havnt done that much and i think we were damn entitled to make one mistake.

Didnt you guys starve the Irish, keep them in extreame poverty, and send boat loads of their lifeless bodies to American shores?

Or is that all part of your "one mistake".

Anyway I think Ireland should get back Northern Ireland, Its like if America just claimed all of Mexico, finally decided to give it back, but kept Baja California...the whole world would be like WTF?

You clearly know very little about Northern Ireland and its history. Run along home and come back when you've read enough to play with the big boys.

I suspect the 'one mistake' statement was humour.

As for keeping Northern Ireland, I can assure you that Britain does not actually want it.

Anyway I think Ireland should get back Northern Ireland, Its like if America just claimed all of Mexico, finally decided to give it back, but kept Baja California...the whole world would be like WTF?
Lo and behold, I actually agree with Atlantian islands. o.O

i hope this is kiddin...

Lo and behold, I actually agree with Atlantian islands. o.O

There is a God.:D No, but seriously, this is the most ignorant thread I have ever seen, exluding Kieven-Prussia's :p .

This guy is simply a bolshevik British nationalist who has no insight to the people hes talking about.

Unite England and Ireland, pfft...I'm sure the Irish would just LOVE that that.

*Uses sponge to soak up all the sarcasm on the last line*

"this is the most ignorant thread I have ever seen"

Yes, it is quite breath taking.

"this is the most ignorant thread I have ever seen"

Yes, it is quite breath taking.

Eh...is that English slang?

What the hell does "quite breath taking" mean, in that context?

bolshevik British nationalist

That's like saying "a white black man." Bolsheviks aren't nationalists - actually their ideology is famous for its internationalist tendencies. Were you just using Bolshevik as a label without having a clue as to what it means?

Anyway I think Ireland should get back Northern Ireland, Its like if America just claimed all of Mexico, finally decided to give it back, but kept Baja California...the whole world would be like WTF?

Except it's nothing like that. The people of Northern Ireland want to be British. So really, the republic wouldn't have a leg to stand on if it made such a claim that it deserves northern ireland. Another reason. Before the British, the "republic" of ireland didn't exist, and the people in that territory didn't possess Northern Ireland. So they don't even have historical claim to it. They never existed to have it.

Best leave things as they are for the time being. The majority of the Irish Republic would definitely not wish to reunite with Britain. Most of them are indifferent as to what happens to Northern Ireland. I say hold regular referenda in NI, and when a majority favour unifying with Ireland, then we should do it (this is a black-and-white version of what I mean, but you get the jist).

I don't think we'll ever completely lose ties with the UK, but I suspect that sooner or later we'll be predominantly ruled by Dublin. If that's what people here want, and if those in the Republic do not object, then that is the way it should be. On the other hand, if referenda consistently show a majority to remain in favour of being with the UK and the UK does not object, then that is the way it should be.

That's like saying "a white black man." Bolsheviks aren't nationalists - actually their ideology is famous for its internationalist tendencies. Were you just using Bolshevik as a label without having a clue as to what it means?

We have those -- Michael Jackson comes to mind. :D

That's like saying "a white black man." Bolsheviks aren't nationalists - actually their ideology is famous for its internationalist tendencies. Were you just using Bolshevik as a label without having a clue as to what it means?

No, not really. This poster, Europa Alpha, is a pronounced Bolshevik, yet he displays extreame nationalism. Thefore, he is a Nationalist Bolshevik.

Thats the way he posts, I just put a name to it.

Didnt you guys starve the Irish, keep them in extreame poverty, and send boat loads of their lifeless bodies to American shores?

Or is that all part of your "one mistake".

Anyway I think Ireland should get back Northern Ireland, Its like if America just claimed all of Mexico, finally decided to give it back, but kept Baja California...the whole world would be like WTF?

ooh so a similar sort of thing to what you did to the native americans then:rolleyes:

this view is all pretty high and mighty you clearly know nothing about the whole ireland thing:headbang:

the reason why we still have northern ireland is because most of it is protestant not catholic, the protestants are the descendants of the brirtsh settlers

most of these people still want to be linked with britain and so britain has said it will keep this area untill most of the people want to rejoin ireland and leave the uk

this has not happened yet and is likely not to.
the whole splittting of ireland was meant to be a temporary measure untill ww2 was over to stop a civil war, however the people of norhtern ireland refuse to cut links with britain and the irish insist they do

this is not really an argument, it is more trying to explain the situation for you less knowledged



imo it is best as it is. if we link ireland with the uk we will have the ira coming back again which will mean we are fighting two sets of terrorists, which could combine to become the super terrorists al quIRA (ooh go me i made that name on the spot :D ). if we give ulster back to the irish then we will have mass riots and civil unrest in northern ireland

<SNIP!>
Anyway I think Ireland should get back Northern Ireland, Its like if America just claimed all of Mexico, finally decided to give it back, but kept Baja California...the whole world would be like WTF?

Um... that actually happened. The US won the Mexican-American War and occupied Mexico City. For peace, the US kept California, Arizona, New Mexico, Texas, Nevada and parts of Colorado.

In some ways Britian still has a say in the Republic of Ireland as those Born in the Republic can still join the UK armed Forces even thought they havent lived here three years and another example that Britian would rather deal with the Republic of Ireland than most of Europe.

i like watching peoples Veins burst... hehe.

Um... that actually happened. The US won the Mexican-American War and occupied Mexico City. For peace, the US kept California, Arizona, New Mexico, Texas, Nevada and parts of Colorado.

That was a war. We were the victors and I would never say we should just have America and Mexico unite because we once went to war. Its just like when the Arabs attacked Israel and Israel took Jerusalem, its all legit, its war.

i like watching peoples Veins burst... hehe.

How old are you?

That was a war. We were the victors and I would never say we should just have America and Mexico unite because we once went to war. Its just like when the Arabs attacked Israel and Israel took Jerusalem, its all legit, its war.

How do you reckon the English took Ireland in the first place? (Hint: W_r.)

That was a war. We were the victors and I would never say we should just have America and Mexico unite because we once went to war. Its just like when the Arabs attacked Israel and Israel took Jerusalem, its all legit, its war.

Wow thats retarded....
So Ireland just said "I know we'll surrender our lands!"
No dumbass we conquered them too.

How do you reckon the English took Ireland in the first place? (Hint: W_r.)

Colonisation in the north and alliances with Tribes in the South in the late 1200's I think.

an excellent point we did win a war there and we ruled it for like 500 years

Wow thats retarded....
So Ireland just said "I know we'll surrender our lands!"
No dumbass we conquered them too.

Yes, but unlike what we did to the south west states, you didnt adopt them into England, but rather used the Irish as slaves, starved them, let them die, kept them in poverty, and basically regarded them as something other than human.

For the America way of doing things, see California, New Mexico, Arizona and Texas.

eh, dumbass.

How do you reckon the English took Ireland in the first place? (Hint: W_r.)

See my post 30.

Yes, but unlike what we did to the south west states, you didnt adopt them into England, but rather used the Irish as slaves, starved them, let them die, kept them in poverty, and basically regarded them as something other than human.

For the America way of doing things, see California, New Mexico, Arizona and Texas.

eh, dumbass.

You did MUCH MUCH worse than slavery to those poor mexicans... you turned them american! (Sobs)

You did MUCH MUCH worse than slavery to those poor mexicans... you turned them american! (Sobs)

Exibit A of not having a good response and instead turning to flaming anti-American comments.

Whatever, what do you expect from a "national bolshevik"..lol.

Colonisation in the north and alliances with Tribes in the South in the late 1200's I think.

I think you might want to read up on that Henry VIII guy, Queen Elisabeth I, and the Nine Years war...

And stop calling me a Bolshevik British Nationalist!
RUUULE BRITANNIA!!!!!!!!!
BRITANNIA RULES THE WAVEEs....

the fact im a Commie doesnt mean iim a bolshevik

Yes, but unlike what we did to the south west states, you didnt adopt them into England, but rather used the Irish as slaves, starved them, let them die, kept them in poverty, and basically regarded them as something other than human.

For the America way of doing things, see California, New Mexico, Arizona and Texas.

eh, dumbass.

ooh so kinda like what you did to the mexicans and native americans, at a much later time to when we treated people like this

And stop calling me a Bolshevik British Nationalist!
RUUULE BRITANNIA!!!!!!!!!
BRITANNIA RULES THE WAVEEs....

the fact im a Commie doesnt mean iim a bolshevik

Still ignoring my reply....alright, your just proving my point, keep it up.

You did MUCH MUCH worse than slavery to those poor mexicans... you turned them american! (Sobs)

Funny... a population of Ireland comes over the border illegally every five years from Mexico. It must be terrible! :p

Exibit A of not having a good response and instead turning to flaming anti-American comments.

Whatever, what do you expect from a "national bolshevik"..lol.

Dude, its how it was done in those days. You invade, you enslave.
The irish would've done the same to us.
But they didnt leave THEN did they? They left in 1920 when they were our equals and were being idiotic and refused to fight in WW2, an act which i think the Americans, Spanish, Irish are JUST AS BAD AS NAZI'S cos by not fighting, they endorse the behaviour.
Not spain actually, they had a decent reason.

Yes, but unlike what we did to the south west states, you didnt adopt them into England, but rather used the Irish as slaves, starved them, let them die, kept them in poverty, and basically regarded them as something other than human.

For the America way of doing things, see California, New Mexico, Arizona and Texas.

eh, dumbass.

Last time I looked, Northern Ireland was a part of the British crown...
So what's the diff?

ooh so kinda like what you did to the mexicans and native americans, at a much later time to when we treated people like this

Um..no, actually we adopted them into our country, and made them into the great states they are today. Where as you guys used the Irish as your little inhuman slaves, who for some reason, the British thought didnt have to be fed.

Also, we didnt have slavery in the South West and we never used Mexicans or Native Americans for slaves.

Dude, its how it was done in those days. You invade, you enslave.
The irish would've done the same to us.
But they didnt leave THEN did they? They left in 1920 when they were our equals and were being idiotic and refused to fight in WW2, an act which i think the Americans, Spanish, Irish are JUST AS BAD AS NAZI'S cos by not fighting, they endorse the behaviour.
Not spain actually, they had a decent reason.

Yeah. Franco wasn't sure who would win. :rolleyes:

Um..no, actually we adopted them into our country, and made them into the great states they are today. Where as you guys used the Irish as your little inhuman slaves, who for some reason, the British thought didnt have to be fed.

Also, we didnt have slavery in the South West and we never used Mexicans or Native Americans for slaves.

... i see... tell me, do you own a white hood and cloak?
Dude... "We didnt have slavery in the southwest." ... i really dont like you anymore. WE DIDNT ENSLAVE THE IRISH during 1900's did we! but they left.
Soooo goooo awayyy.

Dude, its how it was done in those days. You invade, you enslave.
The irish would've done the same to us.
But they didnt leave THEN did they? They left in 1920 when they were our equals and were being idiotic and refused to fight in WW2, an act which i think the Americans, Spanish, Irish are JUST AS BAD AS NAZI'S cos by not fighting, they endorse the behaviour.
Not spain actually, they had a decent reason.

Um...the Irish left long before that.

Think the potatoe famine...you know when you guys refused to give them food. :headbang:

Actually it wasnt really a world war then, it was only England and France against Germany invading Poland...and that wasnt in the 1920s.....

Oh and what was Spains excuse...didnt they have a fascist leader?

Yeah. Franco wasn't sure who would win. :rolleyes:

Ah yes...Franco was the one I was looking for...I knew they had a fascist.

I doubt Ireland will ever be united but I do think the U.K and EIRE could/do/should have a very close relationship since though we have never had a happy relationship we are neighbours and have more to gain working together than as enemies

what I'm hoping for is some kind of membership to the commonwealth (of course without the Queen as the head of state) this would make it official that we (U.K) and the nations Ireland played a vital part in building are there for each other as we always have been (this would also be beneficial for Ireland as it gives it more of a say in the world which it never really has had) I also hope that a few years down the line EIRE can become separate from all U.K control as it only causes trouble

... i see... tell me, do you own a white hood and cloak?
Dude... "We didnt have slavery in the southwest." ... i really dont like you anymore. WE DIDNT ENSLAVE THE IRISH during 1900's did we! but they left.
Soooo goooo awayyy.

What are you talking about....you dont even reply to posts...you just flame...seriously how old are you?

You disgrace your country. I happen to like England, but you give a terrible name to your country.

Um...the Irish left long before that.

Think the potatoe famine...you know when you guys refused to give them food. :headbang:

Actually it wasnt really a world war then, it was only England and France against Germany invading Poland...and that wasnt in the 1920s.....

Oh and what was Spains excuse...didnt they have a fascist leader?

Ireland left us in the 1920's, and spent the next 50 years bitching about northern ireland, refusing to fight in wars other than ones over N.I so... sucks to be them

... i see... tell me, do you own a white hood and cloak?
Dude... "We didnt have slavery in the southwest." ... i really dont like you anymore. WE DIDNT ENSLAVE THE IRISH during 1900's did we! but they left.
Soooo goooo awayyy.

Thats because they were all dying and fleeing to America long before the 1900s....Jesus how ignorant are you?

What are you talking about....you dont even reply to posts...you just flame...seriously how old are you?

You disgrace your country. I happen to like England, but you give a terrible name to your country.

Dude, give me some time at least.
My age doesnt really matter does it? (17)
Im welsh.

Ireland left us in the 1920's, and spent the next 50 years bitching about northern ireland, refusing to fight in wars other than ones over N.I so... sucks to be them

How...Old....Are....You?

Your an idiot.

Your worse than Kieven-Prussia.

Thats because they were all dying and fleeing to America long before the 1900s....Jesus how ignorant are you?

What does that have to do with it?
wow, you really love your country huh.
Americans look like fools to the rest of the world you know.
At least the British have a REASON to be nationalist, we dont contradict ourselves.

"WE HATE IMPERIALISM...lets invade Hawaii."

Both of you, please tone it down.

Dude, give me some time at least.
My age doesnt really matter does it? (17)
Im welsh.

Yes it does....Your acting like a give year old.

Well, as a Welshman, your painting a terrible picture of an otherwise good Great Britian.

Um...the Irish left long before that.

Think the potatoe famine...you know when you guys refused to give them food.

Brits were also Reliant on Potato's that Famine also affected people Brits!

How...Old....Are....You?

Your an idiot.

Your worse than Kieven-Prussia.

I dont mind insults, but at least try to have 1 solid bit of reasoning.
Your retarded.
Your probobly ugly.
Loner.
See? its ok to say this stuff if you mask it in the middle of your arguement, you lack subtlety.

What does that have to do with it?
wow, you really love your country huh.
Americans look like fools to the rest of the world you know.
At least the British have a REASON to be nationalist, we dont contradict ourselves.

"WE HATE IMPERIALISM...lets invade Hawaii."

What the hell are you talking about?

See, this is more of your ignorance coming out....

Americans were imperialist, also.

We didnt contradict anything.

We have tons of pacific islands and, last time I checked, sort of Puerto Rico.

Um..no, actually we adopted them into our country, and made them into the great states they are today. Where as you guys used the Irish as your little inhuman slaves, who for some reason, the British thought didnt have to be fed

adopted them wow i know more about youre history than you.are we forgetting how the native american culture was destroyed.
first we ( british ) took the east but left them the middle and west, then you took the west, destryoed some in the process, then as you took the middle you shoved them on little camps led by corrupt officials who removed their human rights and starved them, and to the children you forced them to join white culture where they would never be accepted because of their skin colour, but wait they couldnt go back to live with their parents because they lived like white people

and as for the whole starvation thing it wasnt the british fault fool,

if you know anything you would no we didnt starve them
they had terrible luck.
their potatoes got diseased, we did try to help we opened soup kitchens and gave out free food. but you need to remember this was a long time before intensive agriculture was invented so it didnt help that much.

it not taht we forgot to feed them its that we couldnt

Brits were also Reliant on Potato's that Famine also affected people Brits!

Not anywhere near the way it affected the Irish. To say differently is to be an apoligist for a genocide.

What the hell are you talking about?

See, this is more of your ignorance coming out....

Americans were imperialist, also.

We didnt contradict anything.

We have tons of pacific islands and, last time I checked, sort of Puerto Rico.

Americans core ideology at the time was Anti-Imperialism and Freedom of speech.
Haha... american freedom of speech :p funny.
Anyway, your constitution means bugger all anymore your politicians probobly PURPOSELY go against it to annoy people.

You disgrace your country. I happen to like England, but you give a terrible name to your country.

England is a country?

adopted them wow i know more about youre history than you.are we forgetting how the native american culture was destroyed.
first we ( british ) took the east but left them the middle and west, then you took the west, destryoed some in the process, then as you took the middle you shoved them on little camps led by corrupt officials who removed their human rights and starved them, and to the children you forced them to join white culture where they would never be accepted because of their skin colour, but wait they couldnt go back to live with their parents because they lived like white people

and as for the whole starvation thing it wasnt the british fault fool,

if you know anything you would no we didnt starve them
they had terrible luck.
their potatoes got diseased, we did try to help we opened soup kitchens and gave out free food. but you need to remember this was a long time before intensive agriculture was invented so it didnt help that much.

it not taht we forgot to feed them its that we couldnt


I'm going to ignore all your Indian crap because it has NOTHING to do with what were talking about.

As for your denying that you starved the Irish, there were a LONG time before the patotoe famine that they were starving. I suggest you read "A modest proposal", by Swift.

Not anywhere near the way it affected the Irish. To say differently is to be an apoligist for a genocide.

Oooh...
Yeh it affected the Irish a lot more. But, at the time it was ok to treat foreigners like dirt, so why the hell does it matter?
The irish would've done the same.
Besides, one of the main reasons for the potato famine being so bad is that the Irish govorners refused to have backup food supplies.

We have those -- Michael Jackson comes to mind. :D

Michael Jackson is not a white black man. He is a white woman.

Americans core ideology at the time was Anti-Imperialism and Freedom of speech.
Haha... american freedom of speech :p funny.
Anyway, your constitution means bugger all anymore your politicians probobly PURPOSELY go against it to annoy people.

Righttttt......:rolleyes:

This is like trying to argue with a 3 year old.

Stop flaming.

i suggest you learn more about youre own history and our history before you start commenting on it


you clearly dont know all that much about either

England is a country?

No not really, its a common misconception held by all truly idiotic americans.

No, not really. This poster, Europa Alpha, is a pronounced Bolshevik, yet he displays extreame nationalism. Thefore, he is a Nationalist Bolshevik.

Thats the way he posts, I just put a name to it.

You cannot be a Bolshevik and be a nationalist. The two are mutually exclusive.

Oooh...
Yeh it affected the Irish a lot more. But, at the time it was ok to treat foreigners like dirt, so why the hell does it matter?
The irish would've done the same.
Besides, one of the main reasons for the potato famine being so bad is that the Irish govorners refused to have backup food supplies.

*Dies*

Your are so ignorant about history that you simply refuse to see the English in a negative light.

You are no better than the slavery apologist here.

Righttttt......:rolleyes:

This is like trying to argue with a 3 year old.

Stop flaming.

...:rolleyes: can you at least do anything apart from say "Nope, he's wrong andd a child." seriously can i have some backup on this?

Ireland really doesnt know what's best for herself.

Reunification under the union jack and HM is the best solution.

Michael Jackson is not a white black man. He is a white woman.

He's a white black wo/man? That's an even better example!! ;)

You cannot be a Bolshevik and be a nationalist. The two are mutually exclusive.

Fass, enough.

He can be whatever he wants to be, and since he is a British nationalist, and a communist bolshevik, he is a Nationalist Bolshevik.

This is a dead issue and has been deceased for like half an hour, join the current debate.

*Dies*

Your are so ignorant about history that you simply refuse to see the English in a negative light.

You are no better than the slavery apologist here.

Please at least use evidence in something if your going to insult me.
i wouldnt mind if you called my mother a whore as long as you hid it amongst reasoning, you lack subtlety and intelligence by simply STATING things.

...:rolleyes: can you at least do anything apart from say "Nope, he's wrong andd a child." seriously can i have some backup on this?

I have been trying to!

But all you reply to my posts with is Anti-American bullshit.

*Dies*

Your are so ignorant about history that you simply refuse to see the English in a negative light.

You are no better than the slavery apologist here.
Hmmm... sounds familiar.

Please at least use evidence in something if your going to insult me.
i wouldnt mind if you called my mother a whore as long as you hid it amongst reasoning, you lack subtlety and intelligence by simply STATING things.

I have been but you dont reply to my posts with anything other than Anti-American crap.

Ireland really doesnt know what's best for herself.

Reunification under the union jack and HM is the best solution.

Where are you from?

I'm going to ignore all your Indian crap because it has NOTHING to do with what were talking about.

As for your denying that you starved the Irish, there were a LONG time before the patotoe famine that they were starving. I suggest you read "A modest proposal", by Swift


the indian stuff had a lot to do with it you i was comparing our treatment of the irish to youre treatment of the native american, however Your are so ignorant about history that you simply refuse to see the americans in a negative light

Oooh...
Yeh it affected the Irish a lot more. But, at the time it was ok to treat foreigners like dirt, so why the hell does it matter?
The irish would've done the same.

Yeah, slavery affected the blacks alot more. But, at that time, it was ok to treat Blacks like dirt, so why the hell does it matter?
The blacks would have done the same to us Americans.

Tell, very simply, do you agree with this post or not?

the indian stuff had a lot to do with it you i was comparing our treatment of the irish to youre treatment of the native american, however americans

HURrAY! Pwned ;p

Fass, enough.

He can be whatever he wants to be, and since he is a British nationalist, and a communist bolshevik, he is a Nationalist Bolshevik.

He's not a communist Bolshevik. He may or may not be a communist, but he cannot be a nationalist and be a Bolshevik at the same time.

This is a dead issue and has been deceased for like half an hour, join the current debate.

I'll debate this because I feel like it. Your label makes no sense.

the indian stuff had a lot to do with it you i was comparing our treatment of the irish to youre treatment of the native american, however americans


Not true...I am just not commenting on it because this is not a thread about America and its treatment of native Americans, this is about the English and the Irish, so drop it, or go make your own thread.

Yeah, slavery affected the blacks alot more. But, at that time, it was ok to treat Blacks like dirt, so why the hell does it matter?
The blacks would have done the same to us Americans.

Tell, very simply, do you agree with this post or not?

They WOULD have done the same to us. It doesnt make it right, but its a reason.
If you dont think they would have done the same you have issues.
If they'd invaded us, we'd be slaves.

i suggest you learn more about youre own history and our history before you start commenting on it


you clearly dont know all that much about either

But American history is irrelevant to this debate, as it does not involve the United States. The "you guys did it too" argument doesn't absolve you of responsibility for what you did. Otherwise, it would be okay what the United States did to the Native Americans.

He's not a communist Bolshevik. He may or may not be a communist, but he cannot be a nationalist and be a Bolshevik at the same time.



I'll debate this because I feel like it. Your label makes no sense.

He IS a nationalist bolshevik.....you can call it whatever you want, but his posts make it very clear.

But American history is irrelevant to this debate, as it does not involve the United States. The "you guys did it too" argument doesn't absolve you of responsibility for what you did. Otherwise, it would be okay what the United States did to the Native Americans.

Finally, someone else with some fucking common sense.

Yeah, slavery affected the blacks alot more. But, at that time, it was ok to treat Blacks like dirt, so why the hell does it matter?
The blacks would have done the same to us Americans.

Tell, very simply, do you agree with this post or not

wtf we have said it was okay to treat irish like this back then

and now you come back with that very same point, thats ridiculous

and you seem to be forgetting when we did this to the irish it was about 100 years before you started to treat blacks like this, we had got past this stage

But American history is irrelevant to this debate, as it does not involve the United States. The "you guys did it too" argument doesn't absolve you of responsibility for what you did. Otherwise, it would be okay what the United States did to the Native Americans.
But does a thread here ever stay on-topic?

They WOULD have done the same to us. It doesnt make it right, but its a reason.
If you dont think they would have done the same you have issues.
If they'd invaded us, we'd be slaves.

But you said...so why the hell does it matter that the English starved the Irish...and I said, in comparison, so why the hell does it matter that the Americans enslaved the blacks.

And you ignored that.

YOu ARE A NAZI. nothing anyone says makes it different! Laalalalal im not listening. >___< dude. i AINT A BOLSHEVIK. im a Communist. I am a Nationalist too! im also Anti-American and im more Nationalist about Europe than Britain. there, thats that sorted.

But does a thread here ever stay on-topic?

They're not hijacking the thread. Fass is hijacking the thread. They are just using diversionary tactics in their arguments.

wtf we have said it was okay to treat irish like this back then

and now you come back with that very same point, thats ridiculous

and you seem to be forgetting when we did this to the irish it was about 100 years before you started to treat blacks like this, we had got past this stage

Ohhh...so now that you said its ok to treat the Irish this way that makes everything ok.

Hear that Ireland....ShuHan said it was ok, so that must clear everything up!!

And by the way, how do you think Americans got their slaves?

But American history is irrelevant to this debate, as it does not involve the United States

it involves the us a large amount , the irish went to your country, and you tried to involve yourself in the ira thing back in the eighties and nineties

But you said...so why the hell does it matter that the English starved the Irish...and I said, in comparison, so why the hell does it matter that the Americans enslaved the blacks.

And you ignored that.

Whats done is done, i dont think it does matter. So long as we are moving towards equal rights we done need grudges.

YOu ARE A NAZI. nothing anyone says makes it different! Laalalalal im not listening. >___< dude. i AINT A BOLSHEVIK. im a Communist. I am a Nationalist too! im also Anti-American and im more Nationalist about Europe than Britain. there, thats that sorted.

aka...your a nightmarish idiot who paints a bad picture of Britain gives Europeans a bad name.

Ohhh...so now that you said its ok to treat the Irish this way that makes everything ok.

Hear that Ireland....ShuHan said it was ok, so that must clear everything up!!

And by the way, how do you think Americans got their slaves?

... Im going to quote you at an Anti-American Rally, hopefully by the end of the year people like you will be locked up.

it involves the us a large amount , the irish went to your country, and you tried to involve yourself in the ira thing back in the eighties and nineties

The United States, and particularly the US treatment of native populations, is wholly irrelevant to a debate about the treatment of the Irish at the hands of the British. If you want to talk about all the horrible things the US has done, fine, but in another thread. Here, it's irrelevant and shows you're unable to admit a wrongdoing about Britain.

aka...your a nightmarish idiot who paints a bad picture of Britain gives Europeans a bad name.

... please can people tell him to stop doing that sort of thing.
I wouldnt mind insults if he made an attempt to mask them.
IM flaming huh? nice. great logic.

... Im going to quote you at an Anti-American Rally, hopefully by the end of the year people like you will be locked up.

Oh, I'm sorry...it must be un natioanlistic to say where Americans got their slaves.....your just as bad a a holocaust denier...your simply denying the negative things about your history.

What is wrong with you, seriously?

As for your denying that you starved the Irish, there were a LONG time before the patotoe famine that they were starving. I suggest you read "A modest proposal", by Swift.

lords taxing heavily was common practice in the past were an army would take an area then tax it beyond belief. Extreme poverty was also true in all of the United Kingdom and both areas suffered from

1) the rich holding all power which led to the government being more concerned with property protection than raising taxes to pay for aid

2) inability for companies to provide fair wages

... please can people tell him to stop doing that sort of thing.
I wouldnt mind insults if he made an attempt to mask them.
IM flaming huh? nice. great logic.

Ahh yes...because this ... Im going to quote you at an Anti-American Rally, hopefully by the end of the year people like you will be locked up. is really attemting to mask your stupidity.

Whats done is done, i dont think it does matter. So long as we are moving towards equal rights we done need grudges.

Thank you I can agree with that!

Oh, I'm sorry...it must be un natioanlistic to say where Americans got their slaves.....your just as bad a a holocaust denier...your simply denying the negative things about your history.

What is wrong with you, seriously?

... California... right... when i invade america, im assuming your a republican...
grr... (makes a list.)

The United States, and particularly the US treatment of native populations, is wholly irrelevant to a debate about the treatment of the Irish at the hands of the British. If you want to talk about all the horrible things the US has done, fine, but in another thread. Here, it's irrelevant and shows you're unable to admit a wrongdoing about Britain.

Right...nobody is denying our mistakes and crimes...but it seems him and that Bolshevik Nationalist are very much so denying theirs.

Ohhh...so now that you said its ok to treat the Irish this way that makes everything ok.

Hear that Ireland....ShuHan said it was ok, so that must clear everything up!!

And by the way, how do you think Americans got their slaves?

no im simply pointing out that it was a terrible reply because you had gone on for so long denying that as a reply, but then to use it... well

you got youre slaves by sailing to africa loading up a ship and then sailing back to america

Oh, I'm sorry...it must be un natioanlistic to say where Americans got their slaves.....your just as bad a a holocaust denier...your simply denying the negative things about your history

what the hell this is ridiculous .. oh yeah well you are.. fat.. and ugly umm and you... are a rapist.. who umm steal .... food from the poor. sound familiar.

Ok. lets try it this way. First one to insult either one of us is an idiot by both our standards... ok.
Ireland should rejoin UK because it would serve them to do so/

PS i am not a Bolshevik nationalist. k?

Right...nobody is denying our mistakes and crimes...but it seems him and that Bolshevik Nationalist are very much so denying theirs.

It's the same neo-Nazi "Stalin was worse!" argument.

... California... right... when i invade america, im assuming your a republican...
grr... (makes a list.)

Grow up :rolleyes:

It's the same neo-Nazi "Stalin was worse!" argument.

I agree. "Duuuh...i hate communism cos my pappy dun said it was baad."
:rolleyes:

whew yeah i need to calm down this guy is getting on my wick

It's the same neo-Nazi "Stalin was worse!" argument.

Right...there are not so much worried about who really was worse, rather than trying to shed the light of the Nazis because of their apologetic views.

Sort of like what these two are doing right here.

I gotta go. Goodbye all.

Dude, its how it was done in those days. You invade, you enslave.
The irish would've done the same to us.
But they didnt leave THEN did they? They left in 1920 when they were our equals and were being idiotic and refused to fight in WW2, an act which i think the Americans, Spanish, Irish are JUST AS BAD AS NAZI'S cos by not fighting, they endorse the behaviour.
Not spain actually, they had a decent reason.

What, you don't consider the fact that the IRA and much of the Irish population didn't support the English a good reason? If they had joined the allies they would have crumbled from the inside from rioting and IRA attacks.

I agree. "Duuuh...i hate communism cos my pappy dun said it was baad."
:rolleyes:

No, your argument is the same as the one neo-Nazis attempt to use to justify the Holocaust. "Yeah, Hitler killed a lot of people, but look over there! Stalin was worse!" "Yeah, the British subjugated and oppressed the Irish, but look at what the Americans are doing! Quick!" Diversionary tactics because you're unable to criticize your own past.

Guys, guys guys! You're both way out of your league here talking about Ireland and England. This war (yes it is a war, but evolved) has been raging for over 500 years now.
And I'm sorry, but neither of you have any clout to say what is right and what is wrong about it.
It's people like you (the igonorant, "i'm gonna join a fight for the hell of it") that keeps the status quo of the situation.
Ireland has gone beyond protestants/catholics or "you stole my potato" fight. The majority of Irish that are fighting on the streets right now are neds hiding behind the mask of civil war.
Don't glorify the whole saga. They aren't even terrorists, they're neds, the lowest common denominator in society today.
NI doesn't want to become part of Britain, England doesn't particularly want them cause they don't offer any economy and at the moment, Scotland and Wales don't want to part of the UK either, basically no one wants to be associated with England. But then again, no one wants to be associated with the US. You're both as bad as each other, deal with it.

It is fairly obvious that there is no simple solution to the issues between Ireland (the North and the Republic) and the UK, or, indeed, between any imperialist country/nation/kingdom and its annexed peoples.

Creating a poll and discussing such a topic without prior understanding of the complexities involved in the conflict is arrogant and in bad taste. Furthermore, it can serve only to heighten tensions between unionists/republicans (Protestants/Catholics), were any paying attention to this discussion. Instead of passing judgement as outsiders, especially as many of my fellow American citizens have chosen to do, it is especially important to listen to the thoughts and opinions of those directly affected by the situation. It is most unhelpful to belittle and disrespect those involved by offering one-step solutions. More important than discussing land rights is work toward reconciliation and understanding.

Please consider this as you continue this dialogue.

Guys, guys guys! You're both way out of your league here talking about Ireland and England. This war (yes it is a war, but evolved) has been raging for over 500 years now.
And I'm sorry, but neither of you have any clout to say what is right and what is wrong about it.
It's people like you (the igonorant, "i'm gonna join a fight for the hell of it") that keeps the status quo of the situation.
Ireland has gone beyond protestants/catholics or "you stole my potato" fight. The majority of Irish that are fighting on the streets right now are neds hiding behind the mask of civil war.
Don't glorify the whole saga. They aren't even terrorists, they're neds, the lowest common denominator in society today.
NI doesn't want to become part of Britain, England doesn't particularly want them cause they don't offer any economy and at the moment, Scotland and Wales don't want to part of the UK either, basically no one wants to be associated with England. But then again, no one wants to be associated with the US. You're both as bad as each other, deal with it.


Where are you from?

While I oppose the very idea of the state, I will say this.

It is not the United Kingdom's business what Ireland does. I believe in returning Northern Ireland to the Republic of Ireland because I view the whole island as one, rather than viewing Northern Ireland as a seperate nation. Also, the Protestant majority is by no means comparable to the Catholic majority in the republic (upwards of 90%), I belive it's around 55/45 in the North and the Catholic population is growing.

If you want to talk about this, you should really talk to Irish people (in the Republic) about it and read about it. You'll find out how horribly the civil rights of the Catholics in the North were violated. It's comparable to the racism of the US (all of it, not just the south) in the 20th century (not that racism is by any means gone over here).

Catholic families voted by household, while Protestants voted as individuals. Systematic oppression in the form of intentional unemployment and inequality in housing were the norm in Catholic communities, such as in Derry, the site of Bloody Sunday.

I say that the UK's claim to N. Ireland is similar to this hypothetical scenario. Let's say the German Empire took all of Poland and flooded the North east corner with Germans, giving the German population a slight majority, and then held on it after the Poles took their land back by guerilla warfare, leaving a large Polish population in that territory under the rule of an unfriendly foreign government with an unfriendly majority population in their home. Would that be right? Absolutely not.

I've said before that the true solution is class war uniting Catholics and Protestants, but practically speaking, uniting Ireland in an attempt to make amends for 700 years of oppression is the best thing that can be done. Doing the right thing isn't always easy, but it's still better to do right than take the easier way out.

Another thing to mention is that if you support Palestine or Tibet, you really have no business not supporting Irish Republicanism.

[QUOTE=ShuHan]you got youre slaves by sailing to africa loading up a ship and then sailing back to america[QUOTE]

No...we got our slaves from the British....just shows how ignorant you are of your nations history.

Creating a poll and discussing such a topic without prior understanding of the complexities involved in the conflict is arrogant and in bad taste. Furthermore, it can serve only to heighten tensions between unionists/republicans (Protestants/Catholics), were any paying attention to this discussion. Instead of passing judgement as outsiders, especially as many of my fellow American citizens have chosen to do, it is especially important to listen to the thoughts and opinions of those directly affected by the situation. It is most unhelpful to belittle and disrespect those involved by offering one-step solutions. More important than discussing land rights is work toward reconciliation and understanding

although this was probably aimed partially at me i have to agree.

No...we got our slaves from the British....just shows how ignorant you are of your nations history
for god sake i thought we had got past the whole insulting thing and i dont wanna bring it back by saying 'no you are wrong you are the one that knows nothing' even if it is correct , but that is the only thing that can be said to such a blunt post

No, your argument is the same as the one neo-Nazis attempt to use to justify the Holocaust. "Yeah, Hitler killed a lot of people, but look over there! Stalin was worse!" "Yeah, the British subjugated and oppressed the Irish, but look at what the Americans are doing! Quick!" Diversionary tactics because you're unable to criticize your own past.

Eh...sometimes you just cant argue with idiots.

As the saying goes, dont argue with a fool, because from a distance, people cant tell who is who.

Wow. Just...........wow. Britain and Ireland should not reunite. Frankly Ireland's doing well by itself. The economy is prospering and it seems to be on the incline. Not to mention what non-retarded group of people would give up their own rule to be ruled by others who probably wouldn't rule them as well as they rule themselves?

While I oppose the very idea of the state, I will say this.

It is not the United Kingdom's business what Ireland does. I believe in returning Northern Ireland to the Republic of Ireland because I view the whole island as one, rather than viewing Northern Ireland as a seperate nation. Also, the Protestant majority is by no means comparable to the Catholic majority in the republic (upwards of 90%), I belive it's around 55/45 in the North and the Catholic population is growing.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b1/Irland_protestants_1861-1991.gif

It would seem that even parts of Northern Ireland have a Catholic majority.

Marchin' down O'Connell Street with the Starry Plough on high
There goes the Citizen Army with their fists raised in the sky
Leading them is a mighty man with a mad rage in his eye
"My name is James Connolly - I didn't come here to die

But to fight for the rights of the working man
And the small farmer too
Protect the proletariat from the bosses and their screws
So hold on to your rifles, boys, and don't give up your dream
Of a Republic for the workin' class, economic liberty"

Then Jem yelled out "Oh Citizens, this system is a curse
An English boss is a monster, an Irish one even worse
They'll never lock us out again and here's the reason why
My name is James Connolly, I didn't come here to die....."

And now we're in the GPO with the bullets whizzin' by
With Pearse and Sean McDermott biddin' each other goodbye
Up steps our citizen leader and roars out to the sky
"My name is James Connolly, I didn't come here to die...

Oh Lily, I don't want to die, we've got so much to live for
And I know we're all goin' out to get slaughtered, but I just can't take any more
Just the sight of one more child screamin' from hunger in a Dublin slum
Or his mother slavin' 14 hours a day for the scum
Who exploit her and take her youth and throw it on a factory floor
Oh Lily, I just can't take any more

They've locked us out, they've banned our unions, they even treat their animals better than us
No! It's far better to die like a man on your feet than to live forever like some slave on your knees, Lilly

But don't let them wrap any green flag around me
And for God's sake, don't let them bury me in some field full of harps and shamrocks
And whatever you do, don't let them make a martyr out of me
No! Rather raise the Starry Plough on high, sing a song of freedom
Here's to you, Lily, the rights of man and international revolution"

We fought them to a standstill while the flames lit up the sky
'Til a bullet pierced our leader and we gave up the fight
They shot him in Kilmainham jail but they'll never stop his cry
"My name is James Connolly, I didn't come here to die...."
-James Connolly by Black 47




NEVER forget that Irish people died to get what they have today (not even their whole country). You have to be shitting me to think that they would give that up. Do you think Kenya and India would ever go back to British rule?

Get over yourselves and your damned homelands. This thread sickens me, just like most of you do. You reek of blind love of your homelands or dislike for others', which is almost as bad.

While I oppose the very idea of the state, I will say this.

It is not the United Kingdom's business what Ireland does. I believe in returning Northern Ireland to the Republic of Ireland because I view the whole island as one, rather than viewing Northern Ireland as a seperate nation.



Which is exactly why you have nothing to say on this subject. I'm from Scotland, but because we're on the same island as england, you'd judge me as english? That's like saying all mexicans are therefore americans because you're all part of the same island? We all have our identities, and we are proud of them. New Yorkers are the same as Californians? Everyone's different, everyone likes where they come from, maybe you should open your eyes once in a while.

Why dont Ireland and Britain reunite?
It just seems a bit childish.
The economy would go uber again and the Britannian-Irish would look like a proper country on the map instead of a cookie thats bin split down the middle... your thoughts please.

Don't be foolish. A bit childish? Yes, it might look very trivial, but the rifts torn between the protestant/catholic communities cannot be healed so quickly. It will take a long time, and hopefully when the catholics have outbred the protestants we can be rid of Northern Ireland for good. I'm sorry to sound cold, but then it won't be our problem.

At least they're not trying to blow us up anymore (terrorism just isn't so fashionable in a post 9/11 world). But the sooner we get rid of it the better. And Im' not saying this out of some altruistic do-goodery for the people of Ireland. I'm just fed up of being painted as the bad guy because I'm a Brit.

And I'm sorry Europa, this might not be the best way for a newbie member to make his entry, but if you could please just crawl under a rock and be quiet for the next 80 years that would be just splendid. I just had to sit and read through this thread in the vain hope that there would be some sort of reasoned argument SOMEWHERE within it. I found lean pickings and a lot of immature blither.

NEVER forget that Irish people died to get what they have today (not even their whole country).

although an excellent point it can be said about almost anybody e.g. mexicans or the scots ( the scottish ooh that a gonna explode like this topic has .... by expolde i mean explosion of posts not an actual explosion... thats sadistic)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b1/Irland_protestants_1861-1991.gif

It would seem that even parts of Northern Ireland have a Catholic majority.

oddly enough though religion is an issue in the divide of Ireland it has more to do with NI not wanting to join EIRE so even if the whole of Ireland was catholic you would still have a NI simply because people want to be in the U.K

Do some of you feel that your nationality is what country you are born in or where your parents and grandparents came from?

Europe alpha, have you never heard of the following concepts:

State soverignty

National self determination

Economic independence

There are many reasons why states are seperate and the whole world isnt just one big state.

Do some of you feel that your nationality is what country you are born in or where your parents and grandparents came from?

Coming from the US, I have a strong regional identity, then I have an identity with the nation of my family's origin, then a national (US) identity.

Do some of you feel that your nationality is what country you are born in or where your parents and grandparents came from?

The country I was born in. Though it's a fairly simple answer as both my parents were born in England, as were my grandparents. Save my Gran on my Dad's side who was originally from NI.

Do some of you feel that your nationality is what country you are born in or where your parents and grandparents came from?
Yes

Which is exactly why you have nothing to say on this subject. I'm from Scotland, but because we're on the same island as england, you'd judge me as english? That's like saying all mexicans are therefore americans because you're all part of the same island? We all have our identities, and we are proud of them. New Yorkers are the same as Californians? Everyone's different, everyone likes where they come from, maybe you should open your eyes once in a while.

I don't think of Scots as English... actually, I after talking with a number of Scottish people and reading about it, I like the idea of an independent Scottish republic. But Northern Ireland has a large amount of people who identify themselves as Irish. Ireland was one country (well, one colony) until London decided it should be two countries so they could hang onto the scraps of a fallen empire.

Yes, it might look very trivial, but the rifts torn between the protestant/catholic communities cannot be healed so quickly. It will take a long time, and hopefully when the catholics have outbred the protestants we can be rid of Northern Ireland for good. I'm sorry to sound cold, but then it won't be our problem.

Catholics out breeding protestants is a very racist fear that become outdated a long time ago though they generally don't use contraceptives it doesn’t mean that they breed like rabbits and have a few 100 kids

also many Catholics are happy in NI

Didnt you guys starve the Irish, keep them in extreame poverty, and send boat loads of their lifeless bodies to American shores?


Yes, but we did that out of concern for the environment.

Had we not done so, the whole of ireland would be like glasgow today, and NY wouldn't have any cops.

Humanitarians is what the brits are.

How do you reckon the English took Ireland in the first place? (Hint: W_r.)

Teh pope gave it to the british crown. Before catholocism bemcame apostate and seperated from the church of england.

Teh pope gave it to the british crown. Before catholocism bemcame apostate and seperated from the church of england.

I thought that Settlers Colonised the North of Ireland?

and could we please stop posting sectarian songs on the thread. We have a lot of sectarianism in scotland because of the whole catholic/british thing in football with Rangers and Celtic. We have an average of 11 stabbings within the space of a football game due to idiots singing songs they don't even understand. (for all americans 1 football game lasts 90mins)

and could we please stop posting sectarian songs on the thread. We have a lot of sectarianism in scotland because of the whole catholic/british thing in football with Rangers and Celtic. We have an average of 11 stabbings within the space of a football game due to idiots singing songs they don't even understand. (for all americans 1 football game lasts 90mins)

I once saw a Documentry about those two clubs where the kids had to cover there shirts so they would not get beaten up or worse.

I thought that Settlers Colonised the North of Ireland?

After the pope gave it to england. And who are the irish to argue with the pope?

I'd hate to think their commitment to catholocism was a sham.

No, please, no whole of Ireland in the UK...the currency thing would make everything more messed up than we already are.

I once saw a Documentry about those two clubs where the kids had to cover there shirts so they would not get beaten up or worse.

That's the two clubs! My sis in law was walking down the street in glasgow with her 9 month old baby in a green pushchair and was set upon by Rangers fans because celtic wear green tops and rangers wear blue. She doesn't support either team

After the pope gave it to england. And who are the irish to argue with the pope?

I'd hate to think their commitment to catholocism was a sham.

Here's a good Question why do the Irish drink on St. Patricks day, when Saint Patrick brought catholocism to Ireland a bit ironic don't you think?

Ireland was one country (well, one colony) until London decided it should be two countries so they could hang onto the scraps of a fallen empire.

1) oddly Ireland was never a colony which is why the empire was called the British empire (British means British isles)

2) your mad if you think were keeping NI because we want an empire infact NI is only in the U.K because the people want it to be we would be more than happy to give it back since it really is a pain in the arse

and could we please stop posting sectarian songs on the thread. We have a lot of sectarianism in scotland because of the whole catholic/british thing in football with Rangers and Celtic. We have an average of 11 stabbings within the space of a football game due to idiots singing songs they don't even understand. (for all americans 1 football game lasts 90mins)

Yes. But the catholics in glasgow are irish.

Here's a good Question why do the Irish drink on St. Patricks day, when Saint Patrick brought catholocism to Ireland a bit ironic don't you think?

Ireland was catholic a long time before Cromwell invaded

which is kind of odd that the pope gave it too us considering at the time Britain was puritan

Here's a good Question why do the Irish drink on St. Patricks day, when Saint Patrick brought catholocism to Ireland a bit ironic don't you think?

Not to mention that St. Patrick was English.

I love the St. Patrick's day in the US, when people hold signs saying 'England out of Ireland'. I assume that they are druids or something.

Of course the real reason for the drinking is that they are irish. Not that it is St. Patrick's day.

That's the two clubs! My sis in law was walking down the street in glasgow with her 9 month old baby in a green pushchair and was set upon by Rangers fans because celtic wear green tops and rangers wear blue. She doesn't support either team

Was she alright? Usualy its club Logos here south of the boarder.

Yes. But the catholics in glasgow are irish.

They are Irish decent, but how far back can you go before u call them irish? They are scottish, just like the rangers fans are scottish, yet they sing rule britannia and want to be english? It's a v.f**ked up world when it comes to those two teams and not one that anyone would understand until you see and hear them.

Not to mention that St. Patrick was English.

I love the St. Patrick's day in the US, when people hold signs saying 'England out of Ireland'. I assume that they are druids or something.

Of course the real reason for the drinking is that they are irish. Not that it is St. Patrick's day.

That would explain all the Irish bars in the Spainish Domain.
:D

Catholics out breeding protestants is a very racist fear that become outdated a long time ago though they generally don't use contraceptives it doesn’t mean that they breed like rabbits and have a few 100 kids

also many Catholics are happy in NI

Apologies. It was not my intent to sound racist. I don't think they breed like rabbits and my choice of words was poor. But I have been led to understand that NI is gradually becoming more and more Catholic and eventually they will outnumber the protestants? If this is incorrect I apologise again. :)

Not to mention that St. Patrick was English.

Nope. England didn't exist at the time, and I believe he was Roman.

They are Irish decent, but how far back can you go before u call them irish? They are scottish, just like the rangers fans are scottish, yet they sing rule britannia and want to be english? It's a v.f**ked up world when it comes to those two teams and not one that anyone would understand until you see and hear them.

I know. I've been to Celtic Park. Way back when Gordon Strachan was playing.

Not my fondest memory.

which is kind of odd that the pope gave it too us considering at the time Britain was puritan
When did the pope "give" it to the British and why was it his to give away?

When did the pope "give" it to the British and why was it his to give away?

excellent point

Nope. England didn't exist at the time, and I believe he was Roman.

He was born in somerset, after the fall of the roman empire. :rolleyes:

He's english, just like bede. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

I think they should join the Commonwealth simply to encourage communication. Irish republic shouldn’t get NI back at the moment because it would cause more harm than good, wait 25-50 years and have another referenda and decide on that (that’s if America/Europe/someone else hasn’t taken over the world by then, the British isles still exist and we're not all under 50 meters of water hehe).

I know. I've been to Celtic Park. Way back when Gordon Strachan was playing.

Not my fondest memory.

I said that you don't understand until you see or hear them, but even when you do, you don't actually understand them. My sis in law has realised she doesn't leave the house when rangers and celtic are playing. But scotland rings the same as ireland. There are those who want an independent country (me being one, then when we are, we enter the EU) and then there are those who hold true to the magnificent british empire. Only diff is, scotland don't use bombs, we use football and knives.
Wot a discussion to have just as the england/scotland rugby match is on!

When did the pope "give" it to the British and why was it his to give away?

presumably after we had finished the invasion and it was his too give away because that’s the way the church was set up back then e.g. The pope says that France is no longer an independent nation so the Kings say “ooh I can score some points with the church” and invade.

strange world back then (though as far as I know the pope can still do this)

He was born in somerset, after the fall of the roman empire. :rolleyes:

He's english, just like bede. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

WRONG. He died around 490, before the establishment of England. In fact, in 495 the Britons dealt a massive blow to the Anglo-Saxons at the Battle of Mount Badon.

There was no such thing as "England" until the Anglo-Saxons established their kingdoms in southern Britain which was ruled by the Romanized Britons (a Celtic people) who are the ancestors of the Welsh, Cornish, and Lowland Scots. This did not happen until after St. Patrick's birth.

Why dont Ireland and Britain reunite? ??? who are you people , i am Irish ( living in Co Dublin ) and i can tell you not one person in the Republic would be in favour of this , for about 1,000s reasons , like the history between the 2 countrys , the culture and so on , and the fact the they are our rivals , i mean if i started a thread '' why dont America and Britain reunite '' or something like that i would be laugh at , simple fact Irish dont like English ( not that i dont have english friends ) but just look at what happen in dublin today , or last time Ireland played England in a football match ( we scored they rioted so on.......) ...............so yea Ireland and Britain reuniting , never going to happen and to be fair why the hell should we it was only when we became a free country ( well the south anyway ) that things start going well for Ireland and now its One of the best places to live in the world


http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6529893
http://www.rte.ie/business/2004/1117/ireland.html

presumably after we had finished the invasion and it was his too give away because that’s the way the church was set up back then e.g. The pope says that France is no longer an independent nation so the Kings say “ooh I can score some points with the church” and invade.

strange world back then (though as far as I know the pope can still do this)
The pope probably recognised (key word: he did not "give") the Pale in the dominion of Henry the Whomever, certainly not Mr. Cromwell. If that is the case, you had about four centuries left until becoming Protestant, let alone "Puritan" (which you were to be a full century later than that, and only for a couple of years).

And what does France have to do with this?

The pope probably recognised (key word: he did not "give") the Pale in the dominion of Henry the Whomever, certainly not Mr. Cromwell. If that is the case, you had about four centuries left until becoming Protestant, let alone "Puritan" (which you were to be a full century later than that, and only for a couple of years).

And what does France have to do with this?

1) same thing really if he had not recognised the rule there would be a disastrous occupation

2) Cromwell was the one who invaded Ireland and believe it or not he was puritan (why do you think the Irish hate Cromwell?)

3) France was a good example since it was a catholic nation surrounded by other catholic nations and most of all because its well known

When did the pope "give" it to the British and why was it his to give away?

Right, this refers far back in time to when England was Catholic. The Pope wanted to bring Ireland more firmly under his control. The 'English' in question were Norman, which is to say modern day North West France of Scandinavian origin. This was a very long time ago, not too long after the Norman invasion.

Cromwell was puritan, but that was some three hundred years later.

This thread's ridiculous.

You're all falling into the old trap of Catholic vs. Protestant, when the political landscape simply doesn't reflect that division.

The Northern Ireland Life and Times Survey suggests that (http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2004/Political_Attitudes/NIRELAND.html) in 2004:

59% of the population wants to remain in the UK
22% want to unify with the Republic
11% want an independent state
9% say something different


This is with 39% of the population being Catholic, and 46 being Protestant (of the various denominations)

The same survey then shows that 24% of Catholics want to remain in the UK, and about 5% of Protestants want to join the Republic.

edit: oh yea, I'm relatively surprised that 15% of Catholics, but only 6% of Protestants want an independent state; independence has usually been something associated with right wing loyalist extremism...

Ah, yes. The extreme poverty the Irish were forced to live under, the starvation, and the overall harsh treatment from the English.

They deserve to get Northern Ireland back.

Ah, yes. The extreme poverty the Irish were forced to live under, the starvation, and the overall harsh treatment from the English.

They deserve to get Northern Ireland back.
Get it back?

I wasn't aware that it was taken from a sovereign Irish state.

Get it back?

I wasn't aware that it was taken from a sovereign Irish state.

It wasn't?

It wasn't?
Nope.

There never was a sovereign unified Irish state before 1921.

Ah, yes. The extreme poverty the Irish were forced to live under, the starvation, and the overall harsh treatment from the English.

They deserve to get Northern Ireland back.

What for?
Would you regard that as some form of compensation?

Free Ireland!

I was depressed to hear about the IRA disbanding when it did; it was Irelands last hope for becoming a unified nation. Then again, as an American, it's my duty to be uninformed of all happenings outside our borders, and not care about anybody but ourselves.

Suddenly I don't care. :confused:

I was depressed to hear about the IRA disbanding when it did;
You're dissapointed that a viscious, murdering, stealing, bombing, terrorist paramilitary organisation, with a body count in the thousands, has given up fighting?

Nope.

There never was a sovereign unified Irish state before 1921.

Well, that makes the situation entirely different!

Hey just as a personal opinion agree with me or disagree with me, I feel Ireland should get all the lands of the Celtic back, this includes Scotland,Northern Ireland, Wales, and the Isle of Man. They should unite and be under the name of something like the United Celtic Republic, or something like that.

Hey just as a personal opinion agree with me or disagree with me, I feel Ireland should get all the lands of the Celtic back, this includes Scotland,Northern Ireland, Wales, and the Isle of Man. They should unite and be under the name of something like the United Celtic Republic, or something like that.
What, no Brittany? No Cornwall?

My apologies, I did not mean to forget them.

Except it's nothing like that. The people of Northern Ireland want to be British. So really, the republic wouldn't have a leg to stand on if it made such a claim that it deserves northern ireland. Another reason. Before the British, the "republic" of ireland didn't exist, and the people in that territory didn't possess Northern Ireland. So they don't even have historical claim to it. They never existed to have it.
Agreed. It's more like if the US fought a war against Mexico and took Texas. Then 150 years later, most Texans would think the idea of "reuniting" with Mexico would be a stupid idea simply because they would have been US citizens their whole life and their families would have been US citizens for several generations. Not that something like that would actually happen. ;)

Um..no, actually we adopted them into our country, and made them into the great states they are today. Where as you guys used the Irish as your little inhuman slaves, who for some reason, the British thought didnt have to be fed.

Also, we didnt have slavery in the South West and we never used Mexicans or Native Americans for slaves.

I think the chinese labor could be constituted as near slavery and that was almost all out west.

Hey just as a personal opinion agree with me or disagree with me, I feel Ireland should get all the lands of the Celtic back, this includes Scotland,Northern Ireland, Wales, and the Isle of Man. They should unite and be under the name of something like the United Celtic Republic, or something like that.

why not include england? and it wouldnt really be "back" since they didnt have them to start with.

why not include england? and it wouldnt really be "back" since they didnt have them to start with.
It would make sense. If Man is in there, considering how many speakers of Manx are around...
And then France, Switzerland, Canada, Belgium, the USA, Spanish Galicia, Montserrat...

'' why dont America and Britain reunite ''
I wouldn't be opposed to this as long as bolth sides could aggree on a form of government acceptable to bolth. The whole revolutionary war was about getting fair representation in parliament. As long as americans were given equal voice I don't think a lot of them would mind falling under the crown again.

I wouldn't be opposed to this as long as bolth sides could aggree on a form of government acceptable to bolth. The whole revolutionary war was about getting fair representation in parliament. As long as americans were given equal voice I don't think a lot of them would mind falling under the crown again.
Yes, I'm sure that was the point made.

Coming from the US, I have a strong regional identity, then I have an identity with the nation of my family's origin, then a national (US) identity.

hmm I think you have that mixed up. If you are an american that should be your primary identity followed by region then nation your family came from. IF your loyalty and identity derive more from a place outside of the US then you should go back there.

First I am an American...then an Alaskan...then a descendant of a Scottish/German mix..plus a few others thrown in for spice:P

Yes, I'm sure that was the point made.

Actually his point was that Ireland and UK uniting was as contentious as a UK and US uniting. I have no problem with a UK/US fusion. It isn't a point in a democratic society I think. As long as each person's voice is heard who cares if you add more voices to it. I would like to keep my bill of rights though.

Why would Britain want us - we suck 3bn from your economy every year, distract your troops from carrying out their proper duties and generally are a pain in the metaphorical arse.

The whole of Ireland is becoming one solid unit again - more and more businesses operate on both sides of the border. Energy resources are shared etc.

Tiocfaidh ár lá!

I would like to keep my bill of rights though.
Nah, don't worry, you could always have ours (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_of_Rights_1689).

Nah, don't worry, you could always have ours (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_of_Rights_1689).
I like my right to have a gun in case the US government needs to be replaced.

2) Cromwell was the one who invaded Ireland and believe it or not he was puritan (why do you think the Irish hate Cromwell?)



Because he was a bastard and tried to make Connacht a massive ghetto were the Irish would starve etc. He was genuinely evil and he also tried to get Christmas banned in Britain!

Why would be want the Republic of Ireland back? It's hard enough holding the Union together as it is without a whole new load of Home Rulers.

Then again, their economy is pretty good.

Why would be want the Republic of Ireland back? It's hard enough holding the Union together as it is without a whole new load of Home Rulers.

Then again, their economy is pretty good.

why would you want to hold the union together?

Why dont Ireland and Britain reunite?
It just seems a bit childish.
.

Really? Hmmmm. This reminds me a bit of Gordon Browns speech in Africa where he said they shoulfd be grateful for the legacy that british colonialism had left for them. Had he bothered his ass to look up from his notes to see the looks he was getting, he would have crapped himself. In short, there is nothing "childish" about self determinaton for any people, be they Indian or African or Irish. The sad thing is, you're just trolling, while he was serious.


i mean... apart from bloody sunday, we brits havnt done that much and i think we were damn entitled to make one mistake..

O...the Plantation...the systematic disinheritance of the entire population...the planned and controlled destruction of both language and culture....the Elizabethan wars...Cromwell...the countless massacres....


Irish are JUST AS BAD AS NAZI'S cos by not fighting, they endorse the behaviour...

30,000 Irish from the south fought against the Nazis in the British army. Nobody is sure how many first generation immigrants fought for the Australians, New Zealanders and Americans.


My age doesnt really matter does it? (17)
...


Well no, in the sense that whatever age you are, you're yapping on like a 12 year old thats had too much sugar. And I find your constant "Dude...." style yammer somewhat odd, for somebody is supposed to be Welsh.


Brits were also Reliant on Potato's that Famine also affected people Brits...

I presume thats meant to mean that the British were affected by the famine. Their populatrion wasn't halved nor did more than 1 in every 8 of them die, so whatever it did, I doubt theres a comparison.


their potatoes got diseased, we did try to help we opened soup kitchens and gave out free food. but you need to remember this was a long time before intensive agriculture was invented so it didnt help that much.

it not taht we forgot to feed them its that we couldnt...

The Irish were reduced to small tenant farmers, who worked on large english owned estates for a living. Crops such as wheat were grown for export, and the potatoe, as it grew on the worst ground in large quantities, became the staple diet of the ordinary man, in the small patches set aside for it. While hundreds of thousands were starving, food was still being exported from the country, and rent was still being demanded. "couldn't" is untrue. "couldnt be too pushed" is fairly accurate. Headlines and commentary hailed the famine as a good thing which would free up large areas for more "provident" folk than the natives.


I gotta go. Goodbye all....

Yes, perhaps you'll be better after your nap.


Another thing to mention is that if you support Palestine or Tibet, you really have no business not supporting Irish Republicanism.....

Go raibh maith agat.


You're dissapointed that a viscious, murdering, stealing, bombing, terrorist paramilitary organisation, with a body count in the thousands, has given up fighting?.....

Well, now that the Orange mobs, b-specials and their friends in the "unionist community" have been stopped from running a sectarian statelet that occassionally murdered stole and drove out catholics without any hindrance from London for 50 years, I suppose "their job here is done", is the phrase you could use.


He was genuinely evil and he also tried to get Christmas banned in Britain!

No "tried", he did ban it.

why would you want to hold the union together?

Because an independent England would never have the same amount of influence that the UK currently has, and it would spell economic disaster for Wales and Scotland.

Well, now that the Orange mobs, b-specials and their friends in the "unionist community" have been stopped from running a sectarian statelet that occassionally murdered stole and drove out catholics without any hindrance from London for 50 years, I suppose "their job here is done", is the phrase you could use.

Which is of no relevance to his dissapointment.

Not to mention that St. Patrick was English.

I love the St. Patrick's day in the US, when people hold signs saying 'England out of Ireland'. I assume that they are druids or something.

Of course the real reason for the drinking is that they are irish. Not that it is St. Patrick's day.

St. Patrick was welsh.

Go raibh maith agat as an cheartúcháin a Nodinia.

Go raibh maith agat as an cheartúcháin a Nodinia.

Well done, you can speak a dying language ;)

Well done, you can speak a dying language ;)

Thanx for that. I hope your not trying to provoke me because that would be quite immature now wouldn't it?
It's not dying - more people speak the language now than there has been in the past century and the trend is continuing with Irish being taught as far off as Australia. However, everybody has the right to have an input, as misinformed, childish and meaningless as it might seem.

Tiocfaidh ár lá.

I like my right to have a gun in case the US government needs to be replaced.

Do you seriously think that a few handguns and hunting rifles are going to be enough to overturn the might of the American army? Please.

Anyway, as for this entire discussion, it profoundly depresses me. Why would we want to join Great Britain? What would the average person get, appart from a vastly decreased political voice and a non-elected head of state? Nothing that we don't already have.

As for north, the peace process is a highly complex thing. To merely say "Let the people of Northern Ireland vote on it" is cute, but foolish. If, say, Kent or Cornwall wanted to leave Great Britain would you be satisfied if the majority of them wanted leave? Of course not. You'd demand the entire country votes on it. So shouldn't the entire of Britain vote be counted in this? How about the votes of the southern Irish?

See? It's not as simple as just letting them vote on it. Besides, the entire purpose of the peace process was to get the majority (unionists) to co-operate with the minority (republicans). But people suggest that the minute that the majority is in favor of re-joining the republic it's suggested that we should throw co-operation with the minority out the window and say "Fuck you Unionists, Republicans are in charge now."

Personally, I think everyone should just chill the fuck out. I couldn't get concert tickets today because some retards couldn't ignore some wankers walking down a fucking street. That's how stupid it is. Everyone needs to stop dividing themselves into groups. It's not about whether you're Irish or British or whether you're Unionist or Republican or whether you're Protestant or Catholic because it's too late for all that. We're all Europeans now. Deal with it.

..

I wanna learn, just aint got time and effort and anywhere to do it


We're all Europeans now.

Not if i can help it

Where did you hear, once the demographic balance tips in favour of nationalists, that the nationalists are going to treat unionists as the unionists treated the catholics?

Well done, you can speak a dying language ;)

Considering that everyone in Ireland is taught Irish in school from the age of about five, I hardly think it's dying. It's also a officially recognised European language. Irish is only really useful, however, in the prescence of those who dont speak it.

Thanx for that. I hope your not trying to provoke me because that would be quite immature now wouldn't it?
It's not dying - more people speak the language now than there has been in the past century and the trend is continuing with Irish being taught as far off as Australia. However, everybody has the right to have an input, as misinformed, childish and meaningless as it might seem.

Tiocfaidh ár lá.

It was only a dig-your statement about more people speaking Irish however is factually wrong. Irish has been in decline since the creation of the Free State in 1922, and probably before then. Only 80,000 people in Ireland still use Irish as their preferred language, a derisory amount in a country of 4 million. This has happened despite compulsory Irish education, and pro-Irish government programmes.

St. Patrick was welsh.
If I remember correctly he was born in what is know Wales and was kidnaped by Irish pirates and spent part of his early life as a slave in Ireland. He eventually escaped, I cant remember were to if it was to Britain or the continent, I keep thinking that he recieved some education in either France or Rome, but I think a roman settlement in Britain sounds more reasonable. After his escape he eventualy became a Catholic missionary and returned to Ireland were he worked as a pest exterminator and shamrock interperter;)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verdigroth
I wouldn't be opposed to this as long as bolth sides could aggree on a form of government acceptable to bolth. The whole revolutionary war was about getting fair representation in parliament. As long as americans were given equal voice I don't think a lot of them would mind falling under the crown again.

This really made me laugh, Verdigroth if your American you really don't know your countryman that well, any effort like what you sugest would be fought tooth and nail by the public, we are for good or for ill a pretty nationalistic patriotic group of people and I really doubt you would be able to get most people to except any such unification unless it is making the UK a part of the US, which would still get resistance from those that would think that UKers( what do you call people from the UK their kingdom nationality or is their a unified name) should be allowed/stuck with ruling themselves.

Considering that everyone in Ireland is taught Irish in school from the age of about five, I hardly think it's dying. It's also a officially recognised European language. Irish is only really useful, however, in the prescence of those who dont speak it.

Hence you name your nation-state "hell". I like your style a chara!

Not if i can help it

You can't.

You can't.

fair enough lol

Considering that everyone in Ireland is taught Irish in school from the age of about five, I hardly think it's dying. It's also a officially recognised European language. Irish is only really useful, however, in the prescence of those who dont speak it.
Heh,heh

I wish I knew a language I could do that with:( Actualy I wish I could just pull of learning another language man I suck at that type of stuff:(

Hence you name your nation-state "hell". I like your style a chara!

An a mhaith ar fad, gan dabht

the conquest of Ireland stemmed form the Invasion of Strongbow and Henry II , I think around that time that pope gave Ireland to the King of England as his personal Fief or something like that. the English then where kept to a smal region around the pale for a long time til about 16/17 centuaries up to Act of Union with Ireland it was kept amlost independant , then comes the potato blight that casues the Irish Famine whcih was mixture of bad agircultral practises and mangiment, rest of the 19 centurary is Home rule for Ireland being debated neary every year in parliment then comes the uprising while many Irish are losing their lives during the great war, which leaves me the question what where the fallen Irish that lay in france that would of come form the Republic what was their scarafice for . Wuld only want ot see Ireland reunited if it was their will to be and most british folk have Irish blood in them anway

It was only a dig-your statement about more people speaking Irish however is factually wrong. Irish has been in decline since the creation of the Free State in 1922, and probably before then. Only 80,000 people in Ireland still use Irish as their preferred language, a derisory amount in a country of 4 million. This has happened despite compulsory Irish education, and pro-Irish government programmes.

Go to:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_language

Go to:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_language

Been there. Where is the evidence that Irish is growing in strength? The Gaeltacht (the only place where Irish can be considered the first language) is declining, as Irish speakers move out and English-speakers move in.

Welsh is the only Celtic language that is anything like secure for the foreseeable future. Irish and Scots Gaelic seem to have been reduced to playthings of Celtic nationalists.

Well done, you can speak a dying language ;)

Would you say that to somebody who used a latin phrase or (thought its quite rare these days) used some Greek allusion? No, I think not.


Irish has been in decline since the creation of the Free State in 1922, and probably before then;)

Long before then, and why? Because Irish was barred from the classroom for generations, and speaking it alone would bar a person from the civil service, teaching, or any job or proffession above that of manual labourer, due to our wonderful "benefactors" the english. That, the famine, and the subsequent emmigration decimated the Irish speaking areas.

If you don't like seeing the "cupla focal" trotted out now and again go off to some BNP board.


the conquest of Ireland stemmed form the Invasion of Strongbow and Henry II ,(...) . Wuld only want ot see Ireland reunited if it was their will to be and most british folk have Irish blood in them anway;)

"Permission" was given by the pope before the norman invasion, due to the split between the celtic church and rome. English control extended after the Elizabethan and Cromewllian wars. The act of union was later. The potato famine was caused by the deliberate reduction to poverty of an entire population, to the extent that they were made dependent on one crop.

the conquest of Ireland stemmed form the Invasion of Strongbow and Henry II , I think around that time that pope gave Ireland to the King of England as his personal Fief or something like that. the English then where kept to a smal region around the pale for a long time til about 16/17 centuaries up to Act of Union with Ireland it was kept amlost independant , then comes the potato blight that casues the Irish Famine whcih was mixture of bad agircultral practises and mangiment, rest of the 19 centurary is Home rule for Ireland being debated neary every year in parliment then comes the uprising while many Irish are losing their lives during the great war, which leaves me the question what where the fallen Irish that lay in france that would of come form the Republic what was their scarafice for . Wuld only want ot see Ireland reunited if it was their will to be and most british folk have Irish blood in them anway

Redmond, leader of the Irish Nationalists wanted his followers (ie most of the Irish population) to fight for the British to make sure that Home Rule actually materialised. The Home Rule bill went onto the statute book towards the end of 1914, but with a suspension act saying that it would not come into effect until after the "great war". The issue over whether or not Ulster (1 of the 4 irish provinces) was excluded and/or for how long was never agreed, however, negotiations would take place after the war. Both sides - the Unionists and Nationalists wanted to make sure the British govt. supported them. The Nationalists wanted all counties in Ulster with a Nationalist majority to be ruled by a Dublin Parliament, the Unionist wanted the "plantation counties" irrespective of their population.
Pointless I know, given the amount of nationalists and unionists died fighting for the British army.

Would you say that to somebody who used a latin phrase or (thought its quite rare these days) used some Greek allusion? No, I think not.

You're quite wrong, people using Latin phrases in order to seem well-informed and educated annoy me even more!


Long before then, and why? Because Irish was barred from the classroom for generations, and speaking it alone would bar a person from the civil service, teaching, or any job or proffession above that of manual labourer, due to our wonderful "benefactors" the english. That, the famine, and the subsequent emmigration decimated the Irish speaking areas.

Wales has been "under the English boot" for far longer than Ireland, and has suffered a much greater deal of assimilation. Why is it then that Welsh has endured as a majority language of large parts of the North and West while Irish has nearly gone?


If you don't like seeing the "cupla focal" trotted out now and again go off to some BNP board.

There's no need for that, I just don't like being addressed in a lanugage I have no hope of understanding.

Why dont Ireland and Britain reunite?
It just seems a bit childish.
The economy would go uber again and the Britannian-Irish would look like a proper country on the map instead of a cookie thats bin split down the middle... your thoughts please.
How about no. I like national independence. Britain's population is so ridiculously larger than Irelands' - we would have no say. Ireland is better with its own government.

Wales has been "under the English boot" for far longer than Ireland, and has suffered a much greater deal of assimilation. Why is it then that Welsh has endured as a majority language of large parts of the North and West while Irish has nearly gone?

There was the chap called Cromwell....

How about no. I like national independence. Britain's population is so ridiculously larger than Irelands' - we would have no say. Ireland is better with its own government.

What about a United Ireland?

There's no need for that, I just don't like being addressed in a lanugage I have no hope of understanding.
Pog mo thoin!

How do you reckon the English took Ireland in the first place? (Hint: W_r.)
Well Dermot McMurrough the King of Leinster invited them over (the Norman Brits under Strongbow) in 1171 in his own self-interest. They ruled Dublin entirely for the next 400 years, when there was an all-out invasion of Ireland launched by Henry VIII. By about 1610 the British hold on Ireland was complete. It stayed that way for the next three hundred years.

Pog mo thoin!

Póg mo thóin

What about a United Ireland?
I would personally like that. But it doesn't matter what I think. Leave it to a majority vote of the people of NI.

Pog mo thoin!

Meaning?

Wales has been "under the English boot" for far longer than Ireland, and has suffered a much greater deal of assimilation. Why is it then that Welsh has endured as a majority language of large parts of the North and West while Irish has nearly gone?

Was there an organized effort to suppres Welsh culture? If not I supose that could play a part in it since by my understanding their was such an effort in Ireland. Also how were the welsh treated, were they considered they considered racialy inferior to Anglosaxon peoples during the 19th century. I know that the celtic Irish in America faced a lot of persecution since earlier colonists of such stalk considered them to be of an inferior non-white race. If similar persecution took place in Ireland, but not in Wales than it could also posibly explain it.

Whilst I would personally advocate a union, or, failing that, the appropriation of Northern Ireland by Eire, I envisage considerable discord and mutual antipathy, whilst the intricacies of the administration of Eire in the UK would be contentious, since Eire would want to remain autonomous.

Meaning?

Póg mo thóin
kiss my ass (affectionately of course)

Was there an organized effort to suppres Welsh culture? If not I supose that could play a part in it since by my understanding their was such an effort in Ireland. Also how were the welsh treated, were they considered they considered racialy inferior to Anglosaxon peoples during the 19th century. I know that the celtic Irish in America faced a lot of persecution since earlier colonists of such stalk considered them to be of an inferior non-white race. If similar persecution took place in Ireland, but not in Wales than it could also posibly explain it.

The teaching of Welsh was banned, and in order to become part of the administration or get a decent job you had to speak English.

I don't think eugenics had a great following in the Middle Ages, but the fact that plenty of English people still refer to the Welsh as "sheepshaggers" shows that most people still think in blinkered terms.

Why dont Ireland and Britain reunite?
It just seems a bit childish.
The economy would go uber again and the Britannian-Irish would look like a proper country on the map instead of a cookie thats bin split down the middle... your thoughts please.

ireland should pay us compensation for the damage caused by the IRA like it or not. And they can either, in my opinion, pay it in billions or succumb to our superior might, give up self recognition and adopt britishness.

A few Irish Jokes...

Where did they find the Irish woodworm?
Dead in a brick!

Why did god invent alchohol?
To prevent the Irish from ruling the world!

How did the Irish goldfish die?
It drowned!

And when I googled it... (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=Irish+jokes&btnG=Google+Search&meta=)

There's no need for that, I just don't like being addressed in a lanugage I have no hope of understanding.

I've seen german, yiddish/hebrew and Dutch on this board. Are you fluent in all four?

Póg mo thóin

I'm far to lazy to copy and paste vowels with fadas.

ireland should pay us compensation for the damage caused by the IRA like it or not. And they can either, in my opinion, pay it in billions or succumb to our superior might, give up self recognition and adopt britishness.

URL]

Snowballs in hell.....

ireland should pay us compensation for the damage caused by the IRA like it or not. And they can either, in my opinion, pay it in billions or succumb to our superior might, give up self recognition and adopt britishness.

And when I googled it... (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=Irish+jokes&btnG=Google+Search&meta=)

What about the compensation the British govt. should pay us for the massacres that they have sanctioned on our soil? British soldiers have shot dead women, children and even priests. The British stole our land, then made us rent it as they sold our produce. What about the compensation for that?
The IRA made the British public wake up to what was going on in the North, the IRA for the most part protected the Nationalist community from loyalist mobs (including the authorities-RUC) and provided an outlet for the intense feeling of the Nationalist community. You can only beat down people for so long until it blows up in your face - hopefully aided by a coulpe of kilos in your face.

I've seen german, yiddish/hebrew and Dutch on this board. Are you fluent in all four?

No, perhaps you'd like to explain how that's relevant?

No, perhaps you'd like to explain how that's relevant?

You stated that just don't like being addressed in a lanugage I have no hope of understanding.

Do I have to use bigger more brightly coloured fonts?

I'm far to lazy to copy and paste vowels with fadas.

fair enough, i hope hell's good to ya

What about the compensation the British govt. should pay us for the massacres that they have sanctioned on our soil? British soldiers have shot dead women, children and even priests. The British stole our land, then made us rent it as they sold our produce. What about the compensation for that?
The IRA made the British public wake up to what was going on in the North, the IRA for the most part protected the Nationalist community from loyalist mobs (including the authorities-RUC) and provided an outlet for the intense feeling of the Nationalist community. You can only beat down people for so long until it blows up in your face - hopefully aided by a coulpe of kilos in your face.

The IRA are spineless murdererd who could have had the full extent of the British Army on them if we hadn't been so lax through their ruthless slaughtering campaigns. Northern Ireland remains where it is because the people there are loyal to us and don't feel like surrendering to the moronic murderers of the Irish Republican Army.

Even now they cannot keep their promises and have an underground movement working with weapons pretty much commisioned. When we were making peace we've kept to our promises, and we've fed the IRA's lazy ministers through the freexe in the peace process. Your ministers should pay that money back and even more as compensation for being part of a murderous, mindless slaughtering machine that is the Irish Republican Army.

The IRA are spineless murdererd who could have had the full extent of the British Army on them if we hadn't been so lax through their ruthless slaughtering campaigns. Northern Ireland remains where it is because the people there are loyal to us and don't feel like surrendering to the moronic murderers of the Irish Republican Army..

A bit rich coming from a country thats off in Iraq with the Americans slaughtering natives as in the days of yore.....could've, should've, would've

The IRA are spineless murdererd who could have had the full extent of the British Army on them if we hadn't been so lax through their ruthless slaughtering campaigns. Northern Ireland remains where it is because the people there are loyal to us and don't feel like surrendering to the moronic murderers of the Irish Republican Army.

Even now they cannot keep their promises and have an underground movement working with weapons pretty much commisioned. When we were making peace we've kept to our promises, and we've fed the IRA's lazy ministers through the freexe in the peace process. Your ministers should pay that money back and even more as compensation for being part of a murderous, mindless slaughtering machine that is the Irish Republican Army.

I happen to know dozens of IRA men - they are not spineless, murderers. They are men that could only take so much. They are men who watched their homes get wrecked, their fathers dragged out of their beds in the middle of the night and beaten, and then thrown in a camp indefinitely at the hands of the British army. They are men who were treated as second class citizens and refused to take it. They are men who were brutalised themselves and created this "mindless slaughtering machine" to fight back for what they believed in. You provoked them. You had to learn somehow - paramilitary tactics were a last resort for these men, but your ignorance put their backs against the wall.

You stated that

Do I have to use bigger more brightly coloured fonts?

Those people aren't addressing me directly in those languages, so it doesn't matter.

I happen to know dozens of IRA men - they are not spineless, murderers. They are men that could only take so much. They are men who watched their homes get wrecked, their fathers dragged out of their beds in the middle of the night and beaten, and then thrown in a camp indefinitely at the hands of the British army. They are men who were treated as second class citizens and refused to take it. They are men who were brutalised themselves and created this "mindless slaughtering machine" to fight back for what they believed in. You provoked them. You had to learn somehow - paramilitary tactics were a last resort for these men, but your ignorance put their backs against the wall.

And what was the title of that IRA propaganda video? Or are you perverting history to make Ireland the greater loser?

And what was the title of that IRA propaganda video? Or are you perverting history to make Ireland the greater loser?

It was called "Sectarian rule from stormont" and is fact, not fiction. Its alongside "Imperial arrogance" on the shelf.

Those people aren't addressing me directly in those languages, so it doesn't matter.

I believe you....Billions no, but I do.

And what was the title of that IRA propaganda video? Or are you perverting history to make Ireland the greater loser?

I don't have a clue what you're getting at, but the IRA did recruit for the sake of it. People saw the double standards - you can even see it nowadays.
At a nationalist riot the PSNI moved in with watercanons etc after 40 seconds (this was all on TV), yet at a loyalist riot it took them 24 hours.
Yesterday, the appeal court overturned the decision to allow 3 loyalists to serve only a suspended sentence, only at the behest of the attorney general. These men had AK-47s and pointed them at police officers, yet had just got off with slap on the wrists.

And no I am not trying to make Ireland a "greater loser", as you have f*cked a lot of countries over the years. How about paying compensation to them?

A silly thread to have seeming how many people where hurt or killed in the riots today,I think the irish have shown today there opinion on the Brits and the north in general even if it was done in a violent way.Maybe Britian will become part of ireland.I would think many Irish would take major offence being compaired to the English and being associated with them:mp5:

A silly thread to have seeming how many people where hurt or killed in the riots today,I think the irish have shown today there opinion on the Brits and the north in general even if it was done in a violent way.Maybe Britian will become part of ireland.I would think many Irish would take major offence being compaired to the English and being associated with them:mp5:

After our appalling performance at Murrayfield today, that's reasonable :(

I don't have a clue what you're getting at, but the IRA did recruit for the sake of it. People saw the double standards - you can even see it nowadays.
At a nationalist riot the PSNI moved in with watercanons etc after 40 seconds (this was all on TV), yet at a loyalist riot it took them 24 hours.
Yesterday, the appeal court overturned the decision to allow 3 loyalists to serve only a suspended sentence, only at the behest of the attorney general. These men had AK-47s and pointed them at police officers, yet had just got off with slap on the wrists.

And no I am not trying to make Ireland a "greater loser", as you have f*cked a lot of countries over the years. How about paying compensation to them?

Of course. Because we once had an empire that spanned a quarter of the globe's land we are to blame. Try imagining the world without the British Empire ever becoming.

Without us (http://www.esa.int/images/asteoride1,4.jpg) the industrial revolution probably wouldn't have happened. Maybe the Nazi's would have won and life would've been worse. Maybe the world would have been a lot better, doubtful, extremely, but still.

I think maybe we have helped develop a lot of countries over the years. And Ireland f*cked up itself.

Just because your country didn't have as big an empire as mine is no reason to start going off on one...

as you have f*cked a lot of countries over the years. How about paying compensation to them?

This would be a great idea seeming the English have ruinned so many places,maybe they should pay for it!! Good thinking!!

I think maybe we have helped develop a lot of countries over the years. And Ireland f*cked up itself.

Just because your country didn't have as big an empire as mine is no reason to start going off on one...

He,s abit of a joker eh? Have you seen the figures for last year? Ireland is doing better than England in ever way,Ireland is booming right now even compaired to France! You are continuing to help countries as well like in Iraq?Is this the sort of help you think your country provides? :confused: