NationStates Jolt Archive

how did you stop communism? and also, have you ever heard of the patriot act?

Chances are, IT hasn't heard of the Patriot Act. Stupid people should be deprived of so many things, computers being one of them. I'm tired of a few idiot Americans posting stupid thoughtless things on forums. There seriously needs to be some sort of intelligence test.

No, there's a reason that other people in other nations "hate" us.
We can skip the "we saved this" and "we saved that" because with few exceptions, there were other people helping.

But in today's world...

There is no nation on earth that can contend with the United States on a military level. None. No national conventional army that would last longer than it takes to drive across their country at 50 kph.

So the US has a unique ability to intervene where it sees fit - a capability far, far greater than any ability it had in previous wars.

On one hand, many nations would like the US to use this power to their benefit - at times and places of their choosing.

The UN exists - but it is completely impotent. The EU exists, but they have only a limited ability to project power within Europe using the framework of NATO - they have no real international conflict intervention capability outside of the US.

Other large nations like Russia and China cannot compete with the US in open combat - and they don't have the ability to project their forces realistically beyond their own borders.

So when the US acts in its own interests, which changed substantially in scope and viewpoint since 911, and those interests do not coincide with the scope and viewpoint of other nations, those other nations get upset.

Because the interests don't coincide.
Because the US has been permanently freaked out by 911.
Because there's nothing they can do to stop it.

Try treating the US like a recently raped woman who now has a shotgun and knows how to use it. You're not realistically going to be able to tell her to calm down, and she's not going to listen to you when you tell her to put down the shotgun.

You don't even have a shotgun.

And calling her a bitch at this point in time isn't going to earn you any longevity credits.

So are Jews, and that's something that Arabs leaders need to hear, much more than we do.

They are people of the book, but you're only given the priveleges that come along with that when you aren't trying to destroy the people who give it to you. Jews invaded Palestine. The fact that they lived there thousands of years ago has nothing to do with the fact that they kicked Arabs off that land (some of which may not even be Arabs, but Arabized Jews and other ancient peoples). That's like Indians coming back now and kicking you off your property, because their ancestors used to inhabit it. The Arabs did not kick Jews off that land, the Romans did, and also many Jews left by choice. I would be angry too if someone demolished my home, killed my children, ruined my life. That's no excuse for suicide bombing, however, Palestine has no military to speak of. Israel does, and they use it frequently on civilians, many of whom are women and children. I think there are definitely some Arab leaders unwilling to compromise, however, look who they have to work with. Sharon is a notorious war criminal (right wing jack ass Sean Hannity even spoke about this, as he favors Ehud Barak to be Prime Minister). I'm surprised Sharon even made a truce with Abbas, because Sharon is as racist as it gets. He was probably being pressured. If he ruled Israel with absolute authority you can bet your bottom dollar there wouldn't be any Arabs left there, and Israel would probably be much larger.

how did you stop communism? and also, have you ever heard of the patriot act?
The U.S outspent it. The world hates the U.S because once the Soviet Union fell, U.S protection was no longer needed. No one likes a lone super-power.

I hate the US because....

wait I don't hate the US.

I sure don't agree that we a re a Christian nation spreading the word of the Lord though *shudder*

And I know the US has done some pretty horrible things thruought the world. NOt everything the US does is good for the rest of the world. Let he without sin cast the first stone beeyotch!!!!

I hate the US because....

wait I don't hate the US.

I sure don't agree that we a re a Christian nation spreading the word of the Lord though *shudder*

And I know the US has done some pretty horrible things thruought the world. NOt everything the US does is good for the rest of the world. Let he without sin cast the first stone beeyotch!!!!
I can agree with that. However, I would say that the U.S does more good than bad, and I also think that some of the people that "hate" America do so because it is popular to bash the U.S.

Firstly i want to say i am british, i love the americans and everything they do for us:

First World War: teh Allies were losing - USA came in and saved the day - dont give me all that crap about it wasnt just america, without america we would have lost.

Second World War: Germany had conquered the whole of france and the majority of europe - on the brink of defeat the americans came in lost thousands of men protecting lands thousands of miles away, the americans died for Europe - it was one of the greatest selfless acts in history.

With out the USA as much as we love a bit of friendly banter we owe the big time - with out them we would be under the rule of the Nazis.

Also America is doing a grand job on fighting world terror and tyranny if George W. successor is a strong willed and selfless as george then i believe that soon there woud be very little organised terror and wars

I hate the US because....

wait I don't hate the US.

I sure don't agree that we a re a Christian nation spreading the word of the Lord though *shudder*

And I know the US has done some pretty horrible things thruought the world. NOt everything the US does is good for the rest of the world. Let he without sin cast the first stone beeyotch!!!!

word.

I guess I have that big brother complex. I can criticize this country all I want to. It's mine. And it needs to be criticized. However, when other people from other countries, especially people from places with colonial and imperial histories who contributed to the fucked up nature of today's world, you all just need to shut up. Or to criticize your own country at the same time. And don't over criticize this country either, as many foreigners tend to do. Once you start making fun of other countries moral values (OMG, you don't have legalized prostitution! You're fucked up!), we will have a problem.

You're wrong. Christians are given the title "People of the Book" not infidel. An infidel was a pagan who tried to destroy a muslim, for the most part. At the time in Arabia, Muslims were persecuted and killed by Pagan Arabs. It also says in the Qur'an that if these infidels were kind, be kind in return. I'm tired of people like you spreading your hateful garbage. Also, most Arab countries are nothing remotely like theocracies, and this country, the U.S., is not a democracy. It's a republic, where we elect our congressional representatives, but we don't directly elect our president. These things can be taken by an amendment, as this government is not expressly a democracy. If it was a democracy, it would be easy to change things when the majority of the population favors such changes, and it isn't. For instance, the majority of Americans want national healthcare, but do we have it? No.
You're wrong. You're wrong. You're wrong. Dude, how many times have I heard that before? Millions. How many times was I actually right? I would say, 75% of the time. Since I DARE to disagree (gasp) people usually just start their post with "You're wrong" or some such tired phrase. Well. Back to the argument. "People of the Book"? Where did you pull that from? Never heard that before. Gimme a source here. Okay, if my facts are wrong, gimme evidence. (I am a college-level CX debater-need evidence.) Maybe the beef the Muslims have with us isn't religious. However, it is obvious that the Muslims have a beef with us. Otherwise, why would terrorism even EXIST? Now, my "hateful garbage" you so lovingly refer to is not "hateful" at all. I can honestly say that there is no particular group of people I *hate*. I am a very diverse person, being part. . . well. . . everything in my heritage. I have studied many cultures, objectively. What I am referring to is the Arabic nations overseas, which you cannot deny are predominantly Mulsim. Now, let us move to the "theocracy" point. You cannot deny that the Muslims arevery religious people. They pray five times a day with their head to the ground facing Mecca. And in this type of culture, people look to the church (oops) Mosque for guidance. When the religious leaders of a country tell you what is holy and what is not, what is or is not sinful, and so on, this guidance influences every aspect of your life. (This is why I dislike organized religion.) Even voting. So where the people are very devoted to their religion, they will only elect leaders which think the same way as them. Muslim fundamentalists. I think I can safely say that the Arabic countries are theocracies. Now, the US is not a DEMOCRACY? If so, it is only in the rulebooks, and, as you say, the constitution can be amended. But the electoral system we have works fine. After all, the electoral college vote only differed from the majority public vote in three cases. These presidents are long dead. Don't be banging our electoral system, its worked for two hundred years and its still going. National healthcare is a dream, my friend. Drop it. There is NO WAY that the US can provide medical care for everyone AND support our defunct social security system AND the war in Iraq AND the national defense budget AND whatever else is going up on the new 1.7 trillion dollar national budget. Not gonna happen. Tax money can only go so far, and, according to people like *you*, the national defecit caused by Bush(supposedly) is bringing this country down. How do you expect the government to support a new federal healthcare plan?
Don't get me wrong, the government sucks ass currently. But its what we have got to work with, whether we like it or not. Peace out, dude, and try harder next time.

Alright, I'm going to look at the original topic one step at a time. We can pull the information as to why people hate america right out of the post, I think!

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld.

Let's hope it's not because they're so much more literate than us. (Zing!)

We stopped hitler we stopped communism,
Whoa! Stop right there, you've already hit the borderline of misinformation. This is the kind of incorrect "common knowledge" that helps to identify why people hate the country.
Firstly, WWII. Did we "Stop hitler"? We defeated Hitler at some very key points, and played an integral part in ending the war. But we were not the sole nation responsible for the victory. In fact, RUSSIA stopped Hitler, at great expense to their own homeland. Hitlers armies got stuck, like every army that tries to attack Russia gets stuck, due to the fact that Russia is huge, cold, and completely empty of any resources because Russia burned them down before armies could take them. The U.S. homeland was hardly touched. Also, Russia was involved in the war earlier, lost (I think, this may not be accurate) more troops, and generally did a kick-ass job in addition to hundreds of other nations. So, reason number one to hate America? We have a superiority complex.

Second, we didn't stop communism. We really didn't. There's still a billion followers around today, and that's actually an ok thing. Communism isn't evil. It was introduced by Karl Marx as the natural solution to the problems of capitalism, I.E. the huge gap between the rich and the poor (The U.S. still has a problem with this, reason 2 for the poor citizens). The ideals of it are that every persons work should be valued equally, which is actually appealing to many people. It's a very interesting economic theory and although the applications in real life have generally failed, there was no non-selfish reason that the U.S. should want to stop communism. It's that very sentiment that involved us in Vietnam, which was bad. Really, really bad. Most of the Cold War was kind of pure idiocy motivated by self interest, and that leads us to this statement:

we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people.

This is a half truth, it makes us sound like a benevolent nation. We're not. We generally only act in our own self-interest and that doesn't include the interests of other nations (Reason 3). The spread of Democracy and freedom is promoted because free and democratic nations are less likely to shoot at us and perform acts of terrorism. But the United States has in several cases gone into a nation, set up a democracy, and left that nation immediately afterwards. The result? The country collapses because they are unable to support a democracy.

We ARE the strongest nation. That's reason 4, right there. Nobody can STOP us when we decide to do something however wrong it is, and disagreeing with the U.S. can cause some truly brutal effects on your economy in a global market. We bully. Sometimes its not even purposeful. The United States is a large friendly dog in a small room - it's intentions are good, but it can't wag its tail without knocking over a chair.

Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord.


This. Is. Bad. The First Amendment of the Constitution, the Sixth Article of the Constitution, and a good portion of common sense formed the basis of what we call "The Seperation of Church and State". The United States cannot be a Christian nation and be fair to the thousands of minority religions that are present in the U.S. When we start using government as opposed to churches to "spread the word", we oppress other religions, harm our own cultural diversity, and make decisions not centered towards the good of the people or other nations. We limit individual rights - the Gay Marriage amendments, for example. We offend our own people - take House Resolution 153, asking the president to declare a time of "prayer and fasting" for the U.S., and asking the nation to "Humble itself before God in repentance for its national sins". And as we get closer and closer knit with the church, more and more bad things happen. You want to know an example of how religious views in government can be really, really bad? Try the Holocaust. Or the Crusades. The U.S. has sound reasons to keep governmental law away from religion and to keep religion away from governmental law, and the people who realize this HATE that we're starting to shy away from that.


Why do you hate us?

Why do you say "You?". "You" is everyone who reads this thread. I'd say a tremendous amount of people don't hate us. Many are completely apathetic, probably couldn't care less. Saying "You" in a forum is like saying "Everyone but me." Remember reason number 1?

But the United States has done a lot to deserve hatred from certain groups, both inside and outside of our nation. A very large part of this is due to the viewpoints of citizens such as these - who justify our actions as opposed to learning from them, who don't learn the facts before making a decision, and who put religious viewpoints into governmental issues. This is a serious problem, and we need to try our best to increase the understanding of the issues, fix the problems we do have, work to be better than what we are. We can't just say the problem is someone elses opinion, because then we'll never grow as a country. And that, quite frankly, sucks.

I hope everyone gets the picture now.

You're wrong. You're wrong. You're wrong. Dude, how many times have I heard that before? Millions. How many times was I actually right? I would say, 75% of the time. Since I DARE to disagree (gasp) people usually just start their post with "You're wrong" or some such tired phrase. Well. Back to the argument. "People of the Book"? Where did you pull that from? Never heard that before. Gimme a source here. Okay, if my facts are wrong, gimme evidence. (I am a college-level CX debater-need evidence.) Maybe the beef the Muslims have with us isn't religious. However, it is obvious that the Muslims have a beef with us. Otherwise, why would terrorism even EXIST? Now, my "hateful garbage" you so lovingly refer to is not "hateful" at all. I can honestly say that there is no particular group of people I *hate*. I am a very diverse person, being part. . . well. . . everything in my heritage. I have studied many cultures, objectively. What I am referring to is the Arabic nations overseas, which you cannot deny are predominantly Mulsim. Now, let us move to the "theocracy" point. You cannot deny that the Muslims arevery religious people. They pray five times a day with their head to the ground facing Mecca. And in this type of culture, people look to the church (oops) Mosque for guidance. When the religious leaders of a country tell you what is holy and what is not, what is or is not sinful, and so on, this guidance influences every aspect of your life. (This is why I dislike organized religion.) Even voting. So where the people are very devoted to their religion, they will only elect leaders which think the same way as them. Muslim fundamentalists. I think I can safely say that the Arabic countries are theocracies. Now, the US is not a DEMOCRACY? If so, it is only in the rulebooks, and, as you say, the constitution can be amended. But the electoral system we have works fine. After all, the electoral college vote only differed from the majority public vote in three cases. These presidents are long dead. Don't be banging our electoral system, its worked for two hundred years and its still going. National healthcare is a dream, my friend. Drop it. There is NO WAY that the US can provide medical care for everyone AND support our defunct social security system AND the war in Iraq AND the national defense budget AND whatever else is going up on the new 1.7 trillion dollar national budget. Not gonna happen. Tax money can only go so far, and, according to people like *you*, the national defecit caused by Bush(supposedly) is bringing this country down. How do you expect the government to support a new federal healthcare plan?
Don't get me wrong, the government sucks ass currently. But its what we have got to work with, whether we like it or not. Peace out, dude, and try harder next time.

Investigate before you speak. In Lebanon, the president is a Maronite Christian. The Prime Minister is a Muslim. Most Arab countries are secular. That is a fact. Look it up. Jews and Christians are People of the Book to Muslims. Look it up. Bush wasn't elected the first time according to the popular vote, and he isn't dead. The Iraq War isn't supported by the majority of the people, so there is no reason to have to finance it. We should be financing things the people actually want. And yes, the deficit is caused by Bush. He destroyed Clinton's work in about 6 months. The only thing which is blamed on Bush that is debatable is the actual state of the economy, not the deficit. That is actually Bush's fault FOR SURE and there is no way around it. For a college student, you lack general knowledge of the world and its people. There are many Muslims in countries that are just as secular as any American. Go to Beirut or Cairo, and you'll see. And no, Muslims or Arabs or Pakistanis or anyone in a predominantly Muslim culture don't have animosity towards America. They may not like Bush, but then again, most of the world doesn't. Once again, for a student so sure of himself, you really should investigate the Middle East and the governments that abide there, as well as Islam. You seem to just know what someone may have told you, or implied, or perhaps were given a generalization of one country and then applied it to the entire region. Next time, do your homework.

Helpful links to educate yourself:
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/
http://www.harunyahya.com/32terrorism_people_soc09.html
http://firdaus.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t5423.html

EDIT: I think it's pretty interesting that the Palestinians who are quite hateful towards Israel (and rightfully so) actually elected someone elected extremely moderate to be their President. Look at the majority of the middle east. Since when have you known Egypt, Lebanon, Jordan, Oman, or North Africa to be any sort of a problem due to their governments? I would say Yemen isn't really a problem, but they spawned a terrorist (a Yemeni JEW to be exact) who killed Israeli Prime Minister Rabin and ruined any sort of chance to have had peace back in the 90s.

EDIT AGAIN: I'm looking at your post again and again and I keep finding errors in it. Studied many cultures objectively, eh? Then why is it that you know nothing even remotely basic about Islam or its beliefs, which are often stated in the news? Why is it you know nothing about Middle Eastern governments? Seriously, it seems like you get you "objective studies" from stereotypes.

They hate us because we are WAY too tigger-happy, and because we proselytize too much. Oh, and did I add we claim we're devout so much we're annoying?

-Shalrirorchia, (Ohio)

"People of the Book"? Where did you pull that from? Never heard that before. Gimme a source here.

The source would be Qur'an, in which Jews and Christians are referred to as the "People of the Book". The Qur'an being the Muslim holy book.

However, it is obvious that the Muslims have a beef with us.

Right ... so how do you justify the millions of Muslim Americans (like me) who live quite peacefully within a country that you claim they're supposed to hate?

You cannot deny that the Muslims arevery religious people. They pray five times a day with their head to the ground facing Mecca. And in this type of culture, people look to the church (oops) Mosque for guidance.

Point of referrence for you: The position of forehead, nose, palms, knees, and toes on the ground is but one of the positions that makes up salat (prayer). Of course, someone who has extensively studied various cultures would already know this .... wouldn't they?

After all, the electoral college vote only differed from the majority public vote in three cases. These presidents are long dead.

George Bush is long dead?! Since when?

The source would be Qur'an, in which Jews and Christians are referred to as the "People of the Book". The Qur'an being the Muslim holy book.


That's right. You have to be nice to christians now. (The benefits of atheism become apparent ;) )

I am an American. I'm also Irish, Scottish, German, English, and Austrian. I am proud of what I am. It's true that the United States of America has done wrong. But it's also true that the United States of America has done good. Every human is capable of good and evil. I believe that nations are the same. Our nations live, breathe, and compete to survive.

I'm thankful for what I have. I cry when I see the faces of the soldiers who die. I cry for the people they leave behind. I cry for the people who are grateful for their sacrifice. I cry for the people who take those lives for granted.

Not so long ago, in this country of mine, young men were asked to leave their families and fight in foreign lands. Since the birth of this nation, men and women have been asked to die for this country. They have been asked to march toward death and to become smoke in the sky. If people did not believe in this country, then no one would die for it.

The history of this world of ours is different because every nation tells a different story. I know what I have learned might not always be completely true. Because of that, I have tried to live my life in such a way that I can look at a problem and face it without bias. I try to live my life in such a way that I can walk down the street and smile all the same to whatever person comes my way. I try to live my life in such a way that I can be friends with a person regardless of their race or beliefs. I want to learn and understand things. I want to walk down the street without fear and be able to cast the vote for what I believe in without bullets tearing through my body. I want to live in a place where my children will be safe and grow up to be good people. There are places in this world where these simple things could not happen. Thankfully, there are also places in this world where my simple desires can be met. I am thankful for being born into one of these places.

Tomorrow morning, when I wake up and get in my car to go to school, I could die. I could simply cease to exist. Some people would cry and some people wouldn't care. I know that my death would be meaningless to just about every person on this earth. That's the way it is for most of us.

What you believe is what you believe. How you live is how you live. How you hate and love is how you hate and love. I believe that every person who lives deserves to make their choices. I am thankful that I live in a country where I can make these choices. My country, the United States of America, may not be perfect, but to me it is what I want. To me, this country is great. I am proud of what I am. Whatever you believe is what you believe. But what I have told you is what I believe. I believe it with all my heart and soul. I believe in my country. I believe in this country's people. Most importantly, I believe in this world's people. I believe in the human good. I believe in this world.

Jews invaded Palestine.

Jews immigrated to Eretz Israel to escape persecution and genocide. They purchased over-priced land utterly unsuited to agriculture from Arab landowners -- and turned it into some of the most productive farm land in the []world.

The Arabs did not kick Jews off that land, the Romans did, and also many

No, the Arabs did, in the 7th century A.D.

Jews left by choice.

Yes, the alternative being death. :rolleyes:


I would be angry too if someone demolished my home, killed my children, ruined my life.

Then you understnad the plight of the Jews!


Palestine has no military to speak of. Israel does, and they use it frequently on civilians, many of whom are women and children.

That is a flagrant lie. The Israeli Defense Forces DO NOT target civilians! That's the domain of the cowardly murderers of Hamas, Hezbollah, and their allies.

I think there are definitely some Arab leaders unwilling to compromise,

"Unwilling to compromise"? With the exception of Jordan and Egypt, the Arabs won't even recognize Israel's right to exist!


Sharon is a notorious war criminal

Sharon is the elected leader of the State of Israel. Throw whatever unsubstantiated slanders you will, it is the Arab leaders who are responsible for the conditions the "Palestinian" Arabs face.

I'm surprised Sharon even made a truce with Abbas, because Sharon is as racist as it gets. He was probably being pressured. If he ruled Israel with absolute authority you can bet your bottom dollar there wouldn't be any Arabs left there, and Israel would probably be much larger.
Right, now he's a racist. :rolleyes: Let me tell YOU something -- if Israel's neighbours didn't have such utterly incompetent militaries, there would not be a Jew alive today in the Middle East, and Israel would only exist in history books.

Second, we didn't stop communism. We really didn't. There's still a billion followers around today,

There aren't a billion followers. There are a billion-plus people who languish under tyrannical Communist dictatorship. :rolleyes:

Communism isn't evil.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

It was introduced by Karl Marx as the natural solution to the problems of capitalism,

There's nothing "natural" about it; Marx was trying to destroy capitalism.

But the United States has in several cases gone into a nation, set up a democracy, and left that nation immediately afterwards. The result? The country collapses because they are unable to support a democracy.

Name ONE such case, because that sure as hell wasn't the result in Panama or Grenada.

That's right. You have to be nice to christians now. (The benefits of atheism become apparent ;) )

Lol! I'm always nice to Christians until they stop being nice to me. I believe in the words of Malcolm X when he said, "I believe in the brotherhood of man, all men, but I don’t believe in brotherhood with anybody who doesn’t want brotherhood with me."

Lol! I'm always nice to Christians until they stop being nice to me. I believe in the words of Malcolm X when he said, "I believe in the brotherhood of man, all men, but I don’t believe in brotherhood with anybody who doesn’t want brotherhood with me."
Now I feel all warm and fuzzy inside. :)

People hat us because where a bossy nation, we tell other nations what to do.

Its because about 3/4 of this world is fucking dumb. I don't give a damn if they hate us so badly they make up a false god over it. Really, the whole world can blow me and the Red White and Blue. All we have done for them is answer there bitchy cries for help, how do we get repaid? There education systems are rigged civicly that all there tought is were evil and we control them secretly, and they grow up to hate us untill they need help again. So, we relentlessly help then they start being little immature dicks. Really, screw the world. I think we should have let Communism opress Europe, make them find out what the real evil is like. So really, don't even ask why they hate us, yea now watch all these hissy prissy Hippies and non/anti americans freak out at this post. What are they going to do? Continue bitching at me, a American, like they have done for generation by generation bitching to America then suddenly saying that were evil? Hah, go right ahead.

( If I were leader, I'd just close off the boarders, ignore the world's cry for help then reopen 2 years later....see how they think of us then )

Now I feel all warm and fuzzy inside. :)

Well, you should. (I'm assuming you're Christian based on your name)

It's the way things should be. I know Jesus preached that one should love your enemies, but Jesus was just a man and not worthy of worship (in the Muslim opinion).

I do love my enemies because Isa (Jesus) said it was proper, but I won't necessarily be nice to them. I don't think that a person being a Christian automatically makes them a judgemental and horrible person. I will judge the person by the actions of that person.

If that person wants to call me a "filthy cave-dwelling woman hater" just for being a Muslim, then I'm not going to waste my time trying to make them my friend. Make sense?

I feel the same way when it comes to being Christian. If someone wants to cut your throat and feed you to their dogs just because you're Christian, then just don't hang around with them. Isa would have, sure, but who among us is Isa?

Sucks to be you.

No, sucks to be you, cos your country's rule will be overthrown and its mercenaries slain.

No, sucks to be you, cos your country's rule will be overthrown and its mercenaries slain.

Fat chance. You have no idea of the tyranny that is to come. It is already too late to stop the US.

The reasons that I hate America are too numerous to list, but I'll give it a try:

Gatorade. Sugar water. More sugar than a coke! Not the original formula. The Gatorade containers on the sidelines of football games are filled with WATER! Your body does NOT need the crap that it sweats out -- your sweat glands are part of your excretory system! You NEED Gatorade like you NEED to eat your own POOP!

Actually, that's pretty much it.

Oh wait. Jesusland. I hate America (everything south and central) cause they voted for such an obvious charletan, who is willing to harm this stinkin nation of Gatorade drinkers so that his friend's stock interests can do just a little bit better.

Then there is pokemon, but that's not really our fault now, is it?

----

Just the facts please, ma'rm.

Fat chance. You have no idea of the tyranny that is to come. It is already too late to stop the US.

Never!

( If I were leader, I'd just close off the boarders, ignore the world's cry for help then reopen 2 years later....see how they think of us then )
If you were leader, I would ask you to close off the boarders and don't open them ever again.^^

Jews immigrated to Eretz Israel to escape persecution and genocide. They purchased over-priced land utterly unsuited to agriculture from Arab landowners -- and turned it into some of the most productive farm land in the []world.

No, the Arabs did, in the 7th century A.D.


Yes, the alternative being death. :rolleyes:


Then you understnad the plight of the Jews!


That is a flagrant lie. The Israeli Defense Forces DO NOT target civilians! That's the domain of the cowardly murderers of Hamas, Hezbollah, and their allies.

"Unwilling to compromise"? With the exception of Jordan and Egypt, the Arabs won't even recognize Israel's right to exist!


Sharon is the elected leader of the State of Israel. Throw whatever unsubstantiated slanders you will, it is the Arab leaders who are responsible for the conditions the "Palestinian" Arabs face.

Right, now he's a racist. :rolleyes: Let me tell YOU something -- if Israel's neighbours didn't have such utterly incompetent militaries, there would not be a Jew alive today in the Middle East, and Israel would only exist in history books.

No. It is a fact in history that the Romans forced most Jews to leave Jerusalem and the majority of Palestine. The Muslims never forced Jews out. EVER. Get that through your head. Please stop spreading lies. If Jews were so persecuted in Europe that they faced death, why is it that so many Jews fought for Germany in WWI? Also, what about the uproar of Israeli soldiers shooting a little girl in the head recently? Yes, she was definitely a threat to the state of Israel. Idiot. They did indeed invade Palestine. While some Jews purchased land, it is a known fact that they forcefully took land from Palestinian landowners as well. I'm honestly tired of your lies. Some of this is debatable, but historical facts of the Jewish Diaspora, which occurred during ancient times, and the fact that land was taken from Palestinians are not matters of opinion, but of fact.

EDIT: Jewish Diaspora http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_diaspora
I can't get over your lies and misrepresentations of history. Jews were no more persecuted during the 19th and 20th centuries until the rise of Nazi Germany than they are today. Homes destroyed, my ass. Idiot. The Arab countries don't have to compromise at all, and any compromise they make is entirely out of their own goodness; it was their land that was invaded. Sharon is indeed a war criminal. He can't even visit Belgium because of it. The Sabra and Shatila massacres should ring a bell, but chances are you are so brainwashed you've never even heard of them. And yes, he is racist. He at one time advocated wiping the Arabs from the face of the earth.

To end, the Jews were exiled by the Romans almost 2000 years ago. The Arabs eventually settled there, and then Jews came (most of them illegally) from Europe. While some of them purchased land, the majority of them simply booted the Palestinians off. They demolished their homes and killed many of them. Civilians, many of them children, are killed everyday by the Israeli Army.
As of August 2003, according to an AFP count, a total of 3,399 people have been killed as a result of the intifada, including 2,560 Palestinians and 778 Israelis.

Herzl, the founder of the Zionist pigs, wrote in his charter that he would deport the natives. Article III gives the JOLC the right to deport the native populations, an act aiming at legitimizing ethnic cleansing, by granting "The right to exchange economic enclaves of its territory, with the exception of the holy places or places already designated for worship. The owners shall receive plots of equal size and quality procured by it [the JOLC] in other provinces and territories of the Ottoman Empire…" (8)

Why do some people "hate" the USA?

Because they don't really know us.

I think it's because:

1) You do so much good for the world (just butt out).
2) You stopped Hitler (that was actually the Russians and the British).
3) You stopped Communism (that was actually Gorbachev).
4) You spread democracy and freedom (didn't do Iraq much good).
5) You have the freeest and strongest nation (well that's not bragging - and it's wrong)
6) You are a Christian nation (and that's a good thing?).

I'll respond to each of these by the number indicated:

1) I agree with this to an extent. If the US would stay out of alot of other countries' business, they wouldn't hate us so much. However, if we don't do anything to help countries that are suffering from oppressive dictatorships and genocide (the UN doesn't seem to do much about this) then people complain that we have all this power/money and we aren't using it to help. You can't have it both ways people!

2) I agree that the Russian could have won the war with the US's help, but not necessarily so. If you recall the NAZI's last offensive against the US, they almost succeeded in forcing back the Allies. What if the NAZIs had used those forces against the already battered and tired Russian troops. It is very probably they could have won in the eastern front. The British didn't do that much, except help gather intel, train and equip insurgents, and provide a staging point for D-Day. Most of the fighting on the western front was from Americans.

3) Yes, under extreme pressure and years of military opposition from the US, forcing to greatly overspend on the military budget. This led to a great decline in the Russian economy, which in turn led directly to the fall of communism in Russia.

4) While, yes, in the short term perhaps Iraq is doing worse then it was before the war, and I believe we should not have started this war in the first place (or should have finished it in the gulf war). However, these types of things can only be measured in the long term. I believe that in, say, ten years Iraq will be much better off then it ever was under Saddom.

5) Actually, we are the strongest nation (militarily that is), but I don't think anyone should say who is "Freeest". That, I think, is more of an opinion and depends on one's own definition of freedom.

6) If being a christian is what the entire population desires, then that is a good thing. However, as was pointed out, we are not a christian nation, we have a separation of church and state. The population is simply predominently christian.

As with most things, nothing is black or white, right or wrong. Please, don't judge the entire nation on the beliefs of individuals. Try to judge people individually and their own merits and faults. If everyone did that, I think the world would be a better place.

And I would ask those among you who d strongly dislike the US, to compare the US to the superpowers of the past: the USSR, Rome, England, etc. Are we really so bad as to deserve so much hate? Would you prefer one of those blatently imperialistic, genocidal, or extremely descriminatorial nations in our place?

Because they refused to negotiate with Mussolini and Tojo even though they were more then willing to surrender. They commited some of the worst war crimes in history in Tokyo, Hiroshima and Nagasaki. All the while giving Stalin a free pass to invade and destroy as he pleased.
The current regime has no concept of nationalism in the least.

2) I agree that the Russian could have won the war with the US's help, but not necessarily so. If you recall the NAZI's last offensive against the US, they almost succeeded in forcing back the Allies. What if the NAZIs had used those forces against the already battered and tired Russian troops. It is very probably they could have won in the eastern front. The British didn't do that much, except help gather intel, train and equip insurgents, and provide a staging point for D-Day. Most of the fighting on the western front was from Americans.


To be honest, by that time the Russians were unstoppable. They were finally out-producing German War factories, and they had more than enough troops to crush Germany.

Because they refused to negotiate with Mussolini and Tojo even though they were more then willing to surrender. They commited some of the worst war crimes in history in Tokyo, Hiroshima and Nagasaki. All the while giving Stalin a free pass to invade and destroy as he pleased.
The current regime has no concept of nationalism in the least.
What happened in those cities is the direct fault of a defeated government that refused to surrender and was willing to sacrifice it's citizenry.

To be honest, by that time the Russians were unstoppable. They were finally out-producing German War factories, and they had more than enough troops to crush Germany.
Do you think perhaps they were outproducing the German war machine because England and the US were bombing German factories to shit?

Do you think perhaps they were outproducing the German war machine because England and the US were bombing German factories to shit?
I would have to agree with that. But the post had referenced Germany having to devote troops to counter the Allied invasion. I think had we just continued to bomb them, the Soviets would have rolled across Europe. God knows what the world would have been like if that happened.

What happened in those cities is the direct fault of a defeated government that refused to surrender and was willing to sacrifice it's citizenry.
Except, if you had read the post, they were willing to surrender.

Except, if you had read the post, they were willing to surrender.
Not an unconditional surrender as the Americans demanded. You can try to create revisionist history if you want, but facts are facts. What is your opinion of all the attrocities the Japanese perpetuated on China? Perhaps you did not read about that in any of your history books.

People hate the U.S. because to bossy we tell people what to do, and if we REALLY wanted to help people we would be in Africa helping those people in Rawanda. AND WHO CARES IF THE U.S. IS A CHRISTIAN NATION! I mean it is not like God cares what nation your from.

speaking as an american, more than likely its the same reason i hate rich celebrities... i see these people who have resources beyond compare and the potential to actually do so much good, but all they do is dress up their houses and occasionally throw some pity money at the poor so they can land a human interest story in a magazine. not to mention they tend to shove their noses into things that arent their problem. lending their "expert philosophy" to political ideals and international policies... The usa needs to step back and get our house in order before it starts telling others how to live. sadly as long as the anti-christ himself is in the white house, we wont get much done...

i dunno where I heard this but what I heard was that trash was the USA's biggest export. IF this is true then I suspect people hate the USA because we make better cheese and wine than many other countries.

Because they refused to negotiate with Mussolini and Tojo even though they were more then willing to surrender. They commited some of the worst war crimes in history in Tokyo, Hiroshima and Nagasaki. All the while giving Stalin a free pass to invade and destroy as he pleased.
The current regime has no concept of nationalism in the least.

The japanese were not more than willing to surrender! The japanese people were prepaired to defend the home islands to the last man. People who complain about the bombings don't ever seem to awknowledge this. If we hadn't dropped the bombs, we would have had to invade their home islands. It was predicted that such an invasion would cost 1 million american lives (which is more than were killed in the bombings.) This was only American lives. The combined death toll would be far higher, and the japanese citizens (such as the one's killed in the bombings) would be fighting alongside soldiers. Even after the bombings the emperor had to step in a force a surrender. There was even and attempted coup to prevent this. Thats how much they didn't want to surrender.

It was a choice between two evils, and we chose the lesser of those evils. There was no other option.

Actually, the Arabs did not have anything to do with the removal of the Jews from what is now Israel.

"In 63 BC, Judaea became a protectorate of Rome. Coming under the administration of a governor, Judaea was allowed a king; the governor's business was to regulate trade and maximize tax revenue. While the Jews despised the Greeks, the Romans were a nightmare. Governorships were bought at high prices; the governors would attempt to squeeze as much revenue as possible from their regions and pocket as much as they could. Even with a Jewish king, the Judaeans revolted in 70 AD, a desperate revolt that ended tragically. In 73 AD, the last of the revolutionaries were holed up in a mountain fort called Masada; the Romans had besieged the fort for two years, and the 1000 men, women, and children inside were beginning to starve. In desperation, the Jewish revolutionaries killed themselves rather than surrender to the Romans. The Romans then destroyed Jerusalem, annexed Judaea as a Roman province, and systematically drove the Jews from Palestine. After 73 AD, Hebrew history would only be the history of the Diaspora as the Jews and their world view spread over Africa, Asia, and Europe."

It was the Romans, not the Arabs. It certainly wasn't Muslims as they wouldn't even exist for another 600 years.

I am an American. I'm also Irish, Scottish, German, English, and Austrian. I am proud of what I am. It's true that the United States of America has done wrong. But it's also true that the United States of America has done good. Every human is capable of good and evil. I believe that nations are the same. Our nations live, breathe, and compete to survive.

I'm thankful for what I have. I cry when I see the faces of the soldiers who die. I cry for the people they leave behind. I cry for the people who are grateful for their sacrifice. I cry for the people who take those lives for granted.

Not so long ago, in this country of mine, young men were asked to leave their families and fight in foreign lands. Since the birth of this nation, men and women have been asked to die for this country. They have been asked to march toward death and to become smoke in the sky. If people did not believe in this country, then no one would die for it.

The history of this world of ours is different because every nation tells a different story. I know what I have learned might not always be completely true. Because of that, I have tried to live my life in such a way that I can look at a problem and face it without bias. I try to live my life in such a way that I can walk down the street and smile all the same to whatever person comes my way. I try to live my life in such a way that I can be friends with a person regardless of their race or beliefs. I want to learn and understand things. I want to walk down the street without fear and be able to cast the vote for what I believe in without bullets tearing through my body. I want to live in a place where my children will be safe and grow up to be good people. There are places in this world where these simple things could not happen. Thankfully, there are also places in this world where my simple desires can be met. I am thankful for being born into one of these places.

Tomorrow morning, when I wake up and get in my car to go to school, I could die. I could simply cease to exist. Some people would cry and some people wouldn't care. I know that my death would be meaningless to just about every person on this earth. That's the way it is for most of us.

What you believe is what you believe. How you live is how you live. How you hate and love is how you hate and love. I believe that every person who lives deserves to make their choices. I am thankful that I live in a country where I can make these choices. My country, the United States of America, may not be perfect, but to me it is what I want. To me, this country is great. I am proud of what I am. Whatever you believe is what you believe. But what I have told you is what I believe. I believe it with all my heart and soul. I believe in my country. I believe in this country's people. Most importantly, I believe in this world's people. I believe in the human good. I believe in this world.


Word.
Dude, totally agree with you. However, I must add something. The UN. Although the individual nations within it are good, maybe, the UN itself is a corrupt and bloated organization in and of itself. Run by immoral people like Kofi Annan, and his son, and the five security council member, (which includes
G.W Bush, I don't support him.[Wow, a Republican who doesn't like Bush! Amazalating!])
Peace out.

By the way, I thought I would add something. Austrian is not an ethnic group, it's a nationality. Austrians, as in the predominate native group of Austria, are ethnic Germans. Rather than join the German Empire, they started their own and conquered other territories to become the Austro-Hungarian Empire, until the end of WWI.

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?
I don't hit anythig. What r u trying to say?
Now if that aint true... :rolleyes:

I hate the assholes who got the rest of the world to hate America. Now I'm trapped here. I am hated by the Americans for being anarcho-communist (plus a few other things, but mainly my politics) and I am hated by the rest of the world for being American (I don't even consider myself American since I don't really hold American cultural values).

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?
I know some of my responses are going to repeat what others have said, but there are just too many posts to wade through to make sure it hasn't been said before. So here goes ...

I can't undrstand why people hate the America.
For the most part. people don't hate America, or the common folk of America. They dislike our government and foreign policies (ranging from mild annoyance to hate). For the most part, the "everyone who criticizes America hates America" line is a line of rhetoric favored by the right wing but lacking any substance.

We do so much good for the owrld.
We do some good for the world. We do some bad for the world. Other countries also do good for the world. Part of the ire that we receive is born in the fact that a lot of Americans prop up our humanitarian efforts in order to show how good we are, and ignore all the contributions that others have made. For instance ...

We stopped hitler
"We" only played a part in stopping Hitler. Have you ever heard of that WWII board game called "Axis and Allies?" It's not called "Axis and America." There were other nations who played key roles in the defeat of Hitler -- not the least of which included Great Britain and Russia. And those nations sacrificed a lot more in human lives in the doing of that task than we did.

we stopped communism,
First of all, communism hasn't been stopped, it's still alive and well in China, North Korea, Cuba, and some other places. I believe you're referring to the Cold War, which was not about stopping communism, it was about halting the proliferation of nuclear weapons. Although we played the bluff-and-wait game better than the Soviets did, we still did not end Communism in the Soviet Union. The Soviet Union collapsed for several reasons, most of which had nothing to do with the US.

we spread democrasy and freedom.
That's debatable. "Freedom" is a very subjective term. It is informed by the political and religious worldviews of those who are defining it. What we consider "freedom," others do not. And as for democracy, we haven't had a whole lot of success with that either. We've managed to help set up an elected government in Afghanistan, but it's still not a democracy. Nor is Iraq, whose only step toward democracy thus far is one single election which appears to have put into power a party that is most likely to establish a theocratic government, not a democratic one. An election to choose leaders is not a democracy, it's simply one ingredient among many, but a democracy is not achieved unless ALL those ingredients come together (including the people not only voting on their leaders, but also voting on whatever legislation those leaders try to pass).

We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people.
Freest is a subjective term. We can't say we are the freest, because there is no measuring stick for what does or does not constitute freedom. I'd say that "strongest" is also somewhat subjective. If you're talking about military strength, then yeah, nobody comes close. If you're talking about the strongest economy, then that is very debatable. If you mean that we have the greatest degree of sympatico between our leaders and our people, that's just laughable. As far as using it to help people, sure we do. We also use it to hurt people. We also use it to dictate what's best for other nations, which is wrong. We also use it to coerce other governments into seeing things our way, which is wrong. We also use it to prop up corrupt governments that are economic or strategic allies and try to convince people they're the good guys (Reagan-era Iraq, for instance, as well as Israel).

Plus we are a christian nation
Uh, no we're not. Our nation is a melting pot of religions, all of whom are guaranteed equal treatment under the constitution. Our founders were Christian, certainly (most of them, anyway), and some of the choices they made in establishing our earliest laws were certainly informed by their worldview, but they did not intend that all succeeding generations must also be Christian, nor that all people should give value to their morals for the same reasons as they. We are a secular nation, as our founders intended.

and we spread the word of the lord.
That depends on who you mean by "we." Our government doesn't, or at least they aren't supposed to, they are supposed to stay out of the religion game entirely, at least in their official capacity. Our various religious leaders, of various religions and denominations, spread what they believe to be the word of their God, but they don't speak for America, they speak for their church or denomination, and sometimes not even that.

I know some of my responses are going to repeat what others have said, but there are just too many posts to wade through to make sure it hasn't been said before. So here goes ...


For the most part. people don't hate America, or the common folk of America. They dislike our government and foreign policies (ranging from mild annoyance to hate). For the most part, the "everyone who criticizes America hates America" line is a line of rhetoric favored by the right wing but lacking any substance.

Sort of - but America is a democracy, it is government of the people for the people, these foriegn policies are the foriegn policies of the American people. No dictator has told America to adopt these policies. It is fair to say that most of the world sees the actions of the American government as the actions of the American people.

"Freedom" is a very subjective term. It is informed by the political and religious worldviews of those who are defining it. What we consider "freedom," others do not. And as for democracy, we haven't had a whole lot of success with that either. We've managed to help set up an elected government in Afghanistan, but it's still not a democracy. Nor is Iraq, whose only step toward democracy thus far is one single election which appears to have put into power a party that is most likely to establish a theocratic government, not a democratic one. An election to choose leaders is not a democracy, it's simply one ingredient among many, but a democracy is not achieved unless ALL those ingredients come together (including the people not only voting on their leaders, but also voting on whatever legislation those leaders try to pass).


Freest is a subjective term. We can't say we are the freest, because there is no measuring stick for what does or does not constitute freedom. I'd say that "strongest" is also somewhat subjective. If you're talking about military strength, then yeah, nobody comes close. If you're talking about the strongest economy, then that is very debatable. If you mean that we have the greatest degree of sympatico between our leaders and our people, that's just laughable. As far as using it to help people, sure we do. We also use it to hurt people. We also use it to dictate what's best for other nations, which is wrong. We also use it to coerce other governments into seeing things our way, which is wrong. We also use it to prop up corrupt governments that are economic or strategic allies and try to convince people they're the good guys (Reagan-era Iraq, for instance, as well as Israel).

Freest? America is a western democracy - about average for the group.

Strongest military strength? America is good at beating the armies of the smaller third world countries. It is not strong enough to dominate France or Britain or China. It is strong enough to protect America, but not strong enough to operate offensively against any competitor.

Sympatico between our leaders and our people, laughable? The American people choose to or choose not to vote. It is this decision that shapes the relationship between the leaders and the people. It is seen from the outside as the choice of the American people, no coercion is seen.

Political alliances? Israel and Saudi Arabia direct the funding of $millions to American politicians.

Bravo!

Well said Cocopuff. :cool:

Sort of - but America is a democracy, it is government of the people for the people, these foriegn policies are the foriegn policies of the American people. No dictator has told America to adopt these policies. It is fair to say that most of the world sees the actions of the American government as the actions of the American people.

A little news flash. The USA is not a direct democracy. it is a representative democracy. This means that the foreign policy is that of those individuals elected to represent the people, not of the people themselves. Theoretically there should be no difference, however, in practice representative democracy is only democratic one day in each term of office.
Anyone who sees the actions of the US government as necessarily reflecting the will of the US population has to be suffering some serious delusions.

Sort of - but America is a democracy, it is government of the people for the people, these foriegn policies are the foriegn policies of the American people. No dictator has told America to adopt these policies. It is fair to say that most of the world sees the actions of the American government as the actions of the American people.
Then they are ill-informed. The US is not a democracy. It never has been. It is a representative republic. There is a difference. In a true democracy, every bit of leglislation put forward by the government would be put to the people for a vote. In actuality, the American people are offered a voice in very little of this process. We don't vote on our foreign policies. We just vote on the people who make them. Actually, we only vote for some of the people who make them, others are simply appointed. Take the invasion of Iraq, for instance -- I don't recall my vote ever being sought. Did they ask you to vote? And voting for a leader is not an automatic endorsement of every little thing that leader does in the future, unless one believes that the voting public is psychic. I voted for Bush the first time around, but there was no understanding in that vote that I was going to be endorsing a preemptive invasion of a sovereign country.


Strongest military strength? America is good at beating the armies of the smaller third world countries. It is not strong enough to dominate France or Britain or China. It is strong enough to protect America, but not strong enough to operate offensively against any competitor.
I don't know. Taken individually, I am pretty sure the US could defeat Britain or France, though I'm not so sure about China. But it would weaken us considerably, and I seriously doubt we could defeat a combined force (at least not without resorting to nukes).

Sympatico between our leaders and our people, laughable? The American people choose to or choose not to vote. It is this decision that shapes the relationship between the leaders and the people. It is seen from the outside as the choice of the American people, no coercion is seen.
I didn't say anything about coercion. That it is seen from the outside as the choice of the American people is simply a testimony to how little some of the outside world knows about our internal politics. I am not implying that there is coercion, just that the American people are left out of the process more often than non on specific issues.

Political alliances? Israel and Saudi Arabia direct the funding of $millions to American politicians.
Which is why our "war on terror" will continue to ignore them both. I've said it before, I'll say it again -- the "war on terror" is really a "pick your terrorist war."

By the way, I thought I would add something. Austrian is not an ethnic group, it's a nationality. Austrians, as in the predominate native group of Austria, are ethnic Germans. Rather than join the German Empire, they started their own and conquered other territories to become the Austro-Hungarian Empire, until the end of WWI.

Austrians are not ethinic Germans. They just happen to speak German is all. They have a distinct history and background, which is why the rheinisch call them the beef-chinese.

Austrians are not ethinic Germans. They just happen to speak German is all. They have a distinct history and background, which is why the rheinisch call them the beef-chinese.

They are ethnic Germans. At the time of the Holy Roman Empire, they addressed themselves as German people, and even existing as an independent state considered themselves a member of the pan-German nation. That's why Hitler directly annexed it to Germany. Their history is about as distinct as any other German state, such as Hess, Bavaria, etc.

....Jesus hates your bad grammar.

HAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAH
Kan wins teh prize!
That was awesome dood.

HAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAH
Kan wins teh prize!
That was awesome dood.

Holy gravedig Batman!

Why must you gravedig this?

Why must you gravedig this?
Why'd Jesussaves have to get deated?Cuz people are stupid. That's why.

I hate the assholes who got the rest of the world to hate America. Now I'm trapped here. I am hated by the Americans for being anarcho-communist (plus a few other things, but mainly my politics) and I am hated by the rest of the world for being American (I don't even consider myself American since I don't really hold American cultural values).

Maybe you should try emigrating to North Korea where your cultural values would be more appreciated.

Just a thought

Why'd Jesussaves have to get deated?Cuz people are stupid. That's why.
Oppression?
Yes, oppression. Ask Drunk commies, I'm sure he'll tell you.

How I miss Jesussaves. HerPower too.

what is thread, like a year old? how the hell did someone find this?

Holy gravedig Batman!


Gravedig?
Did I bring up an old threat or something? I have not yet understood the meaning of this "gravedig."


I clicked link.
I found funny post.
I commented on funny post.

There is no sin in reviving good humour.

A year old?
Oops.

Again.
Clicked link. Laughed. Commented.


Apologies (well, not really, I still found it funny)

I'll respond to each of these by the number indicated:

2) I agree that the Russian could have won the war with the US's help, but not necessarily so. If you recall the NAZI's last offensive against the US, they almost succeeded in forcing back the Allies. What if the NAZIs had used those forces against the already battered and tired Russian troops. It is very probably they could have won in the eastern front.


Sigh.., The thing that gets me the most about who won the war is the prevailing wisdom that says the Russians would have won even without the US. It is one of the great if's of the war but lets assume for argument's sake the US sat it out. Just remember that by late 1943, we were flying strategic bombing missions over Germany and by 1944 those were going on 24/7. We, the US, essentially destroyed the Luftwaffe singlehandedly. German airpower in the East was almost non-existent due to aircraft being diverted to defend the homefront. Not to mention that massive amounts of German resources were diverted to maintain industrial production capacity. Could the Russians have done it? Nope. Small bomber fleet for starters and could not make a round trip raid. The strategic bombing campaign is completely ignored by many or not fully understood in terms of it's impact on the war. Had Germany been able to use the Luftwaffe as a combat arm on the battlefield as opposed to flying bomber interception, it would have been a totally different outcome.

No US aid, which for the Russians completely transformed a foot army into a motorized one with the help of 100,000 Detroit made trucks. Oh sure the Russians could have made them too but then that takes away from armor production which for them was significant.

No threat from the West wold have freed up another 1.5-2 German million troops in the Eastern theater.

Britain would have eventually sued for peace as they could not have matched German industrial production or manpower. Germany could have essentially ignored England and not be any worse for the wear as Britain did not have the capability of landing any kind of threatening force on the continent.

The British didn't do that much, except help gather intel, train and equip insurgents, and provide a staging point for D-Day. Most of the fighting on the western front was from Americans.

Completely untrue. England pretty much kicked the German and Italian armies out of North Africa on thier own. We came in late in the campaign and by that time, the German/Italian forces were pretty much at the end of their rope. Now even without us, Britain would probably still have won the campaign but that would have been about it. They did not have the capability of carrying Sicily on their own or the Italy for that matter.

The thing people need to understand that there was more to that war than who got the higher bodycount. We like to say we won it because what most people forget that while fighting the Germans, providing material aid to our allies (not to mention completely outfitting the entire Free French army) we were also pretty much singlehandedly fighting the Japanese in a completely different theater of war. Granted the Brits and Aussies were there but the mother load was carried by the US.

In the end, the victory was a team effort. Without either the Russians or the US, the Germans would have more than likely won, at least in terms of a negotiated peace with the Russians.

A Zombie-thread? An undead thread? Quick Martha, get the shotgun...

A thread has come back from the dead! Run, run for your lives or at least your sanity! :eek:

speaking as an american, more than likely its the same reason i hate rich celebrities... i see these people who have resources beyond compare and the potential to actually do so much good, but all they do is dress up their houses and occasionally throw some pity money at the poor so they can land a human interest story in a magazine. not to mention they tend to shove their noses into things that arent their problem. lending their "expert philosophy" to political ideals and international policies... The usa needs to step back and get our house in order before it starts telling others how to live. sadly as long as the anti-christ himself is in the white house, we wont get much done...

Speaking as a Dutchman, I find that you understand 'America bashers' a lot.

Wow, where do these things go after a year?

Anyways, what do the stars beside the thread mean?

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?

You pretty much answered the question...

you pretty much answered your own question...
I'm from America and I totally agree. :-|

Lets put it this way.

I am an american, soon to be citizen of canada. I have traveled quite a bit and have found that America is only really good if you live in it and never leave it. Think about our foriegn policy for example....
And the way we get involved in every little issue in the world...
Whether people ask us to or not...

KInd of like a religous zealot tries to convert people - America is being zealous about assimilating the world to our culture.:eek:

maybe people don't like being proselytized......It does sorta feel like a stick up the ass.....

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?

You do so much good for the world? Maybe for yourselves.
You put many dictators into power in South America.

You're helping AIDS spread in Africa by denying them condoms.

You bankrupted your "allies" in Europe.

In Australia, you forced an elected government out of power.

In the Middle East, you helped Saddam Hussein and the Taliban, and actively support the repressive regime of the Saudi Arabians.

In the rest of Asia, you've interfered endlessly in Korea (north and south), you essentially put Pol Pot into power, killing millions and leaving thousands of square miles of minefields. Your use of dioxins leaves people a horrible reminder of your actions in Vietnam, as does your use of Agent Blue, which leaves the land still unworkable in many areas. In China, you criticise their human rights whilst your actions in Guantanimo and the PATRIOT act tell their own little tale.

You didn't stop Hitler, Hitler stopped himself by his ridiculous theories about warfare and his constant interfierence in the military of Germany.

As for Communism - have you convenientely forgotten about Vietnam? China, perhaps? What of Laos? Cuba? (Note : These are American-brand "Communist" countries - there has never been a genuinely communist country)

You spread democracy amd free where you choose, and you ignore it where you choose. Why don't you recognise Hamas' government? Why have you installed so many horrible dictators around the world? Why is there martial law in Iraq? You abuse your power in so many ways it makes me choke.

Your übermensch-esque vews of Christianity over all other religions disgusts me too. It's one faith. There are many in the world and just because America is mostly Christian does not make it the best religion. People should adopt a religion by choice, not have it forced upon you.




That's why we hate you.

Its jealousy of our enormous power and influence..the weak always hate the strong. There might be some anti semitism involved as well since so many people hate us for supporting Israel.

You didn't stop Hitler, Hitler stopped himself by his ridiculous theories about warfare and his constant interfierence in the military of Germany.



Errr, the germans "ridiculous theories about warfare" are some of the most effective and well thought out ideas about war that this world has ever seen. Its called 3rd generation warfare. It revolutionized the way that the west fights wars. Do some research before you start shouting false statements.

Thats why i hate crazy loonies.

Holy Cow! Talk about gravedigging! A thread over a year old, and one by Jesussaves none the less!

Quick, pass me the shovel, this one needs a good whack on the head!

Is this a sign of the second coming of Jesus...























...saves

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?

We hate you because


You go around the world with your extreme version of christianity, trying to convert everyone.
You're nations isolationist policies helped Hitler come to power. The League of Nations could have been effective enough to stop Hitler if America was in it.
You use your strength to try and shape the world around you.
The communists offered unilateral disarmament which would have brought an end to the fear of nuclear war. You ignored them.
Your attempts to stop Communism were very bloody, and in countries such as Afghanistan you installed a government worse than the Communist one could have hoped to have been.
You have helped the spread of aids in Africa by refusing to give them condoms
You are moving closer and closer to banning abortion.
Less than a hundred years ago, you had segregation between white and black people. In parts of America you are still highly rascist.

We hate you because


You go around the world with your extreme version of christianity, trying to convert everyone.
You're nations isolationist policies helped Hitler come to power. The League of Nations could have been effective enough to stop Hitler if America was in it.
You use your strength to try and shape the world around you.
The communists offered unilateral disarmament which would have brought an end to the fear of nuclear war. You ignored them.
Your attempts to stop Communism were very bloody, and in countries such as Afghanistan you installed a government worse than the Communist one could have hoped to have been.
You have helped the spread of aids in Africa by refusing to give them condoms
You are moving closer and closer to banning abortion.
Less than a hundred years ago, you had segregation between white and black people. In parts of America you are still highly rascist.



Holy fuck pay attention this thread is over a year old

He was a troll who got both him and his parent nation deleted

Do you really think he is going to reply to your bulleted list?

Errr, the germans "ridiculous theories about warfare" are some of the most effective and well thought out ideas about war that this world has ever seen. Its called 3rd generation warfare. It revolutionized the way that the west fights wars. Do some research before you start shouting false statements.

Thats why i hate crazy loonies.

The german theories about war were good. Hitler screwed them up because he took overall control which made distributing orders slower and he was a atrocious commander, who only got out of date information from the front 'cos of the speed of war.

You go around the world with your extreme version of christianity, trying to convert everyone.
Last time i checked, there weren't any US gov't backed/funded christian preachers
You're nations isolationist policies helped Hitler come to power. The League of Nations could have been effective enough to stop Hitler if America was in it.
Haha that's great. First you guys say that we should stop meddling in other nations business, then you say that it is bad when we are isolationist
You use your strength to try and shape the world around you.
Yeah i totally agree. It's totally unacceptable to use your capabilities to try to bring good to the world. We should stop giving out any aide to the world because it's mean to give people things.:rolleyes:
The communists offered unilateral disarmament which would have brought an end to the fear of nuclear war. You ignored them.
Link me.
Your attempts to stop Communism were very bloody, and in countries such as Afghanistan you installed a government worse than the Communist one could have hoped to have been.
Yeah, and we should be punished greatly for trying to correct our mistakes now.
You have helped the spread of aids in Africa by refusing to give them condoms
First off, link me. Second, they don't really live in an area where they have the free time to go off having sex for fun. They have sex for the natural reason to produce offspring. Condoms not really helping ya there. The majority of aids is not being spread by sex in africa but by mothers breast milk. So if anything we should give them milk.
You are moving closer and closer to banning abortion.
Doubt it. And i bet you love El Salvador.
Less than a hundred years ago, you had segregation between white and black people. In parts of America you are still highly rascist.
The second part is just a high amount of disinformation. It is very damaging to your reputation to be racist in america.

Holy fuck pay attention this thread is over a year old

He was a troll who got both him and his parent nation deleted

Do you really think he is going to reply to your bulleted list?

Why can't i talk to myself?
:upyours:

The german theories about war were good. Hitler screwed them up because he took overall control which made distributing orders slower and he was a atrocious commander, who only got out of date information from the front 'cos of the speed of war.

Thats not a theory buddy.:rolleyes:

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?
you pretty much answered your own question...
Indeed...and the US didnt stop Communism...It was those damn Poles...

Good, like invading countries for no reason? IT would have been better to fund a revolution. Spread democracy and freedom? We dont even have that here. Freeest? No, Sweden is freer. lol

Word of the lord...please don't make me want to go bomb a church...

IT would have been better to fund a revolution.

Yeah, cause that has worked out real well in the past. Just look at afghanistan were bin laden was apparently constructed out of thin air by the US. Or in iraq where we "made" saddam.

Gravedigging a Jesussaves thread. And so close to Easter, too.

The irony!

Gravedigging a Jesussaves thread. And so close to Easter, too.

The irony!
haha...I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought that.

a whole new generation to be touched by Jesussaves. It's an Easter miracle!

haha...I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought that.

a whole new generation to be touched by Jesussaves. It's an Easter miracle!
Too bad they didn't pick the Harry Potter thread or the "Satan wants your children" thread though.

Too bad they didn't pick the Harry Potter thread or the "Satan wants your children" thread though.
ahh yes...those were wonders to behold

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?

cause you can't spell.
Not everyone in the world wants to be christian, you know. I hope you realize that. If you don't, then ... that's why people hate America -- because we have to many people here like YOU.

Jesus christ, I just wasted like 2 hours of my life reading this thread.

I really don't fucking believe it....


This thread being grave dug... People still believing it... what the fuck?

Maybe you should try emigrating to North Korea where your cultural values would be more appreciated.

Just a thought


Hahaha. You're trying to sledge someone who posted that comment about a year before and who doesn't even regularly post anymore.




Btw: worst gravedig I've ever seen, and I've seen a few..

I really don't fucking believe it....


This thread being grave dug... People still believing it... what the fuck?
I don't get how someone found it after a year...and didnt notice.

does this confirm that Jesussaves was the best puppet?

I can't undrstand why people hate the America. We do so much good for the owrld. We stopped hitler we stopped communism, we spread democrasy and freedom. We have the freeest and strongest country in the world and we use it to help people. Plus we are a christian nation and we spread the word of the lord. Why do you hate us?


I'm an American and, based on what you're saying, I would hate us too.

There are other, better reasons to like America - like Americans. When we aren't being self-righteous about how good we are. When we aren't proseletysing (sp) the "American way" as if it were the only way, we are pretty nice people to be around. We're friendly, generous, loyal, pretty much boy/girl scouts - as long as we don't keep reminding people about how friendly, generous and loyal we are.

I think it's because:

1) You do so much good for the world (just butt out).
Hey, we help! Not much, but still.
2) You stopped Hitler (that was actually the Russians and the British).
And us! We had a part, too.
3) You stopped Communism (that was actually Gorbachev).
Hey, we sure didn't keep it going!
4) You spread democracy and freedom (didn't do Iraq much good).
Yeah, gotta agree there (for the most part).
5) You have the freeest and strongest nation (well that's not bragging - and it's wrong)
Strongest, we pretty much are. Freest? We're somewhat free. Cetrainly not the freest, though.
6) You are a Christian nation (and that's a good thing?).
Not legally, we're not. And why would it be a bad thing? What's so bad about spreading love and charity?!

Oppression?
Yes, oppression. Ask Drunk commies, I'm sure he'll tell you.

How I miss Jesussaves. HerPower too.
It is amazing how well known Jesussaves is even though he only had 200 post when deated.

Yay! Jesussaves!

Cool, I saw this thread & thought Jesussaves had returned from the deat! :)

Then I saw how old it was realised there's been no resurrection for Jesussaves. :(

I hate Jesussaves

A year old?
Oops.

Again.
Clicked link. Laughed. Commented.


Apologies (well, not really, I still found it funny)
HA hA ha

I hate Jesussaves

But Jesussaves, how can you hate him?

But Jesussaves, how can you hate him?
Because he was designed to be hated. By God, of course :).