NationStates Jolt Archive

Bush is not the bogey man in fact I do not fear him personally but rather the people behind him and yes there are people that this man has allowed to influence him and his decisions who have no business doing so.

Bush touts no child left behind while underfunding it as shown in his own budget which will cut funding for the program by several billion which was needed to make it effective.

He touts his medicare plan which does not in any way shape or form fix medicare nor does it provide any real viable options when it comes to prescription drugs, it does however benefit the drug companies.

He proposes a so-called ownership society where I would have the ability to invest some of my Social Security in the stock market, in most cases I'd be better off taking that cash to vegas. One good hard crash and my supposed security is flushed right down the toilet.

He took us to war on lies. Granted I supported the removal of Saddam due to the fact that his regime was as bad as any other dictatorship with regards to the torture of his own people, however that was not the reason given and when the reason given proved false he did not have the intestinal fortitude to say "I was wrong" instead we are "staying the course" which is needed but he would not be a man and own his mistakes. We need to fix Iraq, we own it now and can't pull out however history will recall the fact that this was more a war of opportunity rather than real necessity.

The list goes on, I could have supported bush and did support him after 9/11 however my confidence in him is shot, he does not represent me nor does he represent most of my beliefs both public and personal and is not the man I want leading my country.


All legitimate concerns, save one... investing money in the stock market is not remotely akin to "gambling". It is a staple for conservative retirement portfolios everywhere, and if you were saving for your own retirement (as i suggest you do! ) it would certainly be your wisest choice, barring maybe real estate. Bottom line here is that Social Security is doomed to implosion. Its either going to bankrupt us all or completely screw a generation of retirees because the money simply isnt there. Period. When Social Security was enacted, it was a short term measure to encourage retirees to spend their savings, pulling us out of the depression (in part). There was ONE retiree for every THIRTY TWO working stiffs paying into SS. Now the ration is ONE to THREE. And rising. The stock market ploy is only an attempt to simulate what taxpayers should be doing for themselves if they were plannign their own retirement instead of counting on Uncle Sam to fund their geriatric years.

Also note that when you say, "one good hard crash", you realize there hasnt been a "good hard crash" since 1928, right? The US economy is built to encourage sustainable growth, thats the purpose of the Federal Reserve Board, and it performs admirably, especially with Greenspan at the helm. Its not failsafe but in the event that the stock market endured a significant enough crash to "flush your money down the toilet", the government wouldnt be able to pay out your entitlements anyways because we would be headed for another depression. Social Security is a dying program.

No child left behind: all rhetoric. No federal program can help the schools, no matter how much money is involved. Only one thing will improve education in the US: better teachers. As it is right now, the best and brightest minds go into law or medicine or science because thats where the money is. Only an effective doubling of a teachers salary will make this profession worthwhile, and only a new generation of enlightened, educated, and intelligent teachers will improve the next generation of Americas youth. Stop spending so much money on useless stuff; books help but teachers are living breathing textbooks. Computers help but everyone has one already, quit wasting money buying state of the art computers year after year, any 18 year old who has cable can tell you that its more cost effective to buy a 2 year old computer by a factor of about 5. In fact ALL CONSIDERATIONS in a school should be secondary to the quality of the teachers. Anyways, Bush is way wrong on this program, but hes only saying what people want to hear, and thats why people elect politicians, because they say it. He doesnt really have much choice when telling the truth, if he knows it, would get him canned. People dont want to hear, better teachers, they want shiny new books and brand new school buildings.

Medicare plan? Youre right, Bush is wrong again but im sure we disagree as to why. No true fiscal conservative should be talking about medicare at all. Hes not a fiscal conservative but he pretends to be one... and his plan is something but whats really needed is free market intervention, bringing drugs from Canada wont stifle research, it will encourage it as each company attempts to patent new drugs and capitalize on the consequent years of competition free sales.

Iraq? dont get me started. Bleh. Ive said enough.

Bushrepublican liars, What non-historical shit?

No Dreggas, I do not think you are anti-semitic. I can concede that there is bad blood on both Palestinian and Jewish hands, but there is no reasoning with the Palestinians (and when I say Palestinians I do not mean the people, I mean Arafat and the Palestinian Authority. The Palestinian people can be very rational and many want to be Israeli citizens to have the same freedoms.). They hate Israel for the same reasons that many people hate America. Israel has capitalism, prosperity and freedom (not just for Jews). Many of them would be glad to see Israel pushed into the ocean.

I think Israel has done a pretty good job of not seeing Israelis as being just the Jewish people. Of course there are some people, like certain more radical members of the Likud Party who think in terms of Jews and everyone else and not interms of Israel and other states. Arabs living in Israel have the same rights as Jews and Christians. If an Arab citizen of Israel criticises Sharon, the government does nothing to him. We can already see what the West Bank and Gaza would be like if Yasser Arafat were given that region as his own country. He rules over Palestinians under the Palestinian authority like a dictator. If they criticise him or the authority, they go to jail or disappear. On the whole, it is not all black and white, but Israel is in my opinion definitely more right.

Mesazoic, I believe the title for the most powerful country in the world to grace the earth still belongs (just barely) to Britain or Rome (although that was an empire).

Mmm..

- arrogance
- head-up-my-ass syndrome (only a few people)
- the fact that some think nuclear missiles solve problems they have no reason to be part of

Okay Tallaris, if you want to talk about Japan, then post something about Japan. I am more interested in Europe because that is where the Germans killed my ancestors and the rest of Europe did nothing to help the Jews.

Do you have sources, or indeed reasons at all for all of your accusations? Bush is certainly not the best president the US will ever have, but he is not a bad man, not a puppet, not an imbecile or a homophobe. Unfounded accusations such as these are part of the reason Bush has no respect in the world; it creates an atmosphere which encourages Bush bashing. Take an honest look at Bush. He certainly has faults, he has certainly made mistakes, and i dont think hes improved our country noticably, but he isnt the antichrist either (although i have heard him called that many times, no joke). The world does respect America, the title of this thread notwithstanding. The bottom line with America is this: some Americans may be fat or uneducated or bigoted. They may be hideously ignorant. That is what America is all about. Every American may not be forced to recieve a world class education, but every American has the opportunity to learn anything they want. America may not have the best health care system in the world, which takes care of every citizen or permanent resident, but no American is denied care in a time of need, and Americas doctors and surgeons are the best in the world. Americans have the opportunity to be obese, but Americans have the infrastructure and disposable income to be healthy and live long lives as well. We live by the sword and die by the sword and with opportunity comes the opportunity to fail. Our environmental policies are abyssymal, but the research to solve the most pressing concerns ofthe day is largely being done here in the US. (dont get me started, we are stubborn bastards, and the advancement of ethanol as a fuel is severely retarded by alcohol production regulations :headbang:)

I dont know if anyone will take the time to read this rant, or respond, or understand the gibberish ive come up with. Take an honest look at the US though, and Bush, if you do read this. Ask yourself why we are so bad? Have we hurt you personally or your nation as a whole? Or are you doing what you hate us so much for, imposing your point of view on us.


NOT A HOMOPHOBE! Ha, what the hell are you talking about. Bush is a racsit peice of **** just like his daddy.

He is an intolerant, ruthless, warmongering hypocritical, ill-concieved son of a sow. Interbred with the devil himself. Born with a swastika embedded on his head. His tiny mind was warped with his fathers ramblings on how much he loved ronald reagen. Old Reagen even pounded little Bush's ass for a while. In his semen was the greatest evil in the world. The substance the bred the most vile scum on earth:

PEOPLE LIKE YOU!

Look you commie pinko faggots, any one of you that is in another country, we could DESTROY. Lets list the problems with your natoins eh?

Britton:
Lost to America TWICE and we were weaker then them.
Almost tooken over by France...nuff' said

France:
Panzy ass faggots
Genocides own people
Too afraid to get there hands a bit bloody

Germany:
Like France, Panzy ass Faggots
Defeated by the fucking world Twice..

Har....

BRITAIN didn't really care if they lost the USA, I'm sure. You seem to fit the bill for 'entirely illiterate'... TOOKEN?! haaaaaaarrrrr.

France, I agree with the fact they are scared of blood, but they're not pansy ass fags as you say.

OOOOHHH NO!!! Germany sucks cos it was 175+ countries against them!! Kneel to Jesus!

I don't think you make much sense. Despite the fact that you think the US could obliterate the rest of the world by itself and live by itself on Earth, the other eight "nuclear-wielding" countries have (of course, combined, but who cares) more radioactive firepower than you do. I hope you built a bomb shelter just in case Israel, Pakistan, France, India and the crew, as we'll call them, gang up on you. Plus I'm sure the other countries of the world which you've screwed despite their wishes would be more than happy to help out with beating the shit out of you before you could say "Shock and awe".

Oh, I almost forgot. Let's get back to listing the PROBLEMS about your country, as the topic suggests. Or are you going to get scared, again, and start rambling off useless bullshit that has no merit and makes you look like a Jingoist pot-smoking whore?

http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/Our_Culture/americans.htm

By a Canadian in 1973, most holds true to today. Next time you should get that we are a country like yours. Sure we have our ups and downs, but who doesn't? Do I like rap? No, but it is in Europe as well. Do I like Bush? No, but our reps elected him. I can go on about things I like and dislike, doesn't change the fact it is low when you make opinions that aren't true. American's aren't the fattest so you know, that title goes to a Bikini Island. McDonald's is worldwide, and it is good food. Opinion there. Starbucks is a corporation, not America. "Having a 2 party system," it is better than a dictatorship. :-\
*Mind all I read the first few pages.*
"Hollywood" - as in movies or the stars? I hate how stars are treated, but I enjoy movies.

I would like to note that Canada/British have won 4 different campaigns against the USA, of course these are the same guys we won against in war of 1812 and notably the Battle of New Orleans were the US Forces commanded by Andrew Jackson had 13 dead compared to the British 2,109 dead.

America isn't great, but it is as good or better than your country. Now I ask you this, if America is so horrible then how come you play games with Americans, and talk to Americans?

NOT A HOMOPHOBE! Ha, what the hell are you talking about. Bush is a racsit peice of **** just like his daddy.

He is an intolerant, ruthless, warmongering hypocritical, ill-concieved son of a sow. Interbred with the devil himself. Born with a swastika embedded on his head. His tiny mind was warped with his fathers ramblings on how much he loved ronald reagen. Old Reagen even pounded little Bush's ass for a while. In his semen was the greatest evil in the world. The substance the bred the most vile scum on earth:

PEOPLE LIKE YOU!

I see, how eloquent. Can i see some sources on your information?

http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/Our_Culture/americans.htm

By a Canadian in 1973....

Good point. I agree America is under-appreciated, but honestly, there has to be some REASON for everyone to be quoting 37+ things.

Okay Tallaris, if you want to talk about Japan, then post something about Japan. I am more interested in Europe because that is where the Germans killed my ancestors and the rest of Europe did nothing to help the Jews.

If I offended you, I am sorry. Also if you're under the impression that I don't believe Holocaust happened (I'm not sure why this would be since I never said anything about it, but it sounds like you think I might believe this), you could not be even more wrong. I'm sorry that your ancestors suffered, but do not play the "I'm a Jew, feel sorry for me" Card. While the Holocaust was very, very tragic, Jews aren't exactly sqeeky clean either. Need I remind you that Israel isn't exactly be too kind to the Palestinians (Yes I realize not all followers of the Jewish religion are in Israel, but a good portion are)?

If you want me sympathize with you about the Holocaust, you've got no problem. Whether you were a Jew, Gypsy, homosexual, or whatever and had to endure the horror of the death camps, I'm sorry that humans as a species can be real a-holes sometimes. But if you expect me to sympathize with the Jewish community 24/7, you got another thing coming because nothing is more hypocritical to me than committing what can be summed up as genocide, but expecting others to fell sorry that you had to be on the receiving end of genocide. In other words, Jews deserve no more praise nor scorn than any other group of the people.

Keljamistan
Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 213 Wanna know what I think is funny?

How every single thread invariably descends into Bush v. Kerry hell.

How do you guys always seem to do that?

For example:

Person #1: I like strawberry jam over blueberry jam.

Person #2: Well, obviously, blueberry jam is BETTER

Person #1: Oh yeah, well you won't HAVE any jam at all if Bush is reelected!

Person #1: Well, at least Bush won't give it away for free, like Kerry!



I don't know how to do the whole thing where you post someone elses stuff and its all easy, but Keljamistan, that has got to be the funniest thing I have ever read. Anyways, to the topic, America is great. But so is every other country in the world. Every country has something to offer to the world. Every country does something better than another country. Every country does things worse than another country.

The thing that America is great at (in my opinion) is allowing people to build a new life for themselves. My father is an immigrant from Mexico, and he started his own business about twenty-five years ago and was succesful. Granted luck was involved, my father did not just get money handed to him to do this. My father did this on his own, and that is what American Capitalism is built on. This would not have been possible in Mexico.

I have never been outside North America, so I do not judge other countries that I have never been to. I hear great things about them though. And I wish, rather than trust what you watch on your TV at night, everyone could see the good things about America. Once again, we have our flaws, but we have our amazing successes as well. Just as any other country does. Everyone should realize that although we all live in different countries and we have different opinions and we have different posessions and we have different lives, we are all part of humanity, and unless we work together for the common good (of course common good is all in opinion as well), let's jsut say the world won't turn out to be a great place.

Also, itd be great if someone could tell me how to do that thing where you have the quote from someone else and it says "originally posted by" so i can give credit to those people.

Do you have sources, or indeed reasons at all for all of your accusations?

There are indeed sources and reasons for what I said. Why don't you try to do some research before attempting to come across as informed?

Was that a question?

No its a statement like MY GOD MAN WHAT IS WRONG WITH STARBUCKS.

No its a statement like MY GOD MAN WHAT IS WRONG WITH STARBUCKS.

It looks better if you say GOOD GOD MAN! WHAT IS WRONG WITH ALL THAT IS STARBUCKS!?!


;)

http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/Our_Culture/americans.htm


>>Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or women on the moon?<<


That question is from the above link. That question also does not make sense. The Soviets were trying to beat NASA to the moon. The author seemed to miss such a basic fact.

Just some food for thought.

There are indeed sources and reasons for what I said. Why don't you try to do some research before attempting to come across as informed?

Yes? Im not the one who has a long string of ephitets for the President of the United States. What sort of research would you have me do? Come up with reasons why he is not any of those things? Im sorry friend, but dont get hostile with me. You are levelling the accusations, the burden of proof is on you. I implied that you DONT have sources or reasons, forgive me, im sure you do... what are they? Why dont you answer my question in an intelligent fashion, calling me uninformed might fly if we were both in 3rd grade but youve made a few insightful posts so im pretty sure youre above that.

wow, the jealousey is tearing us apart. I think the world needs to relax. We should all unite under the banner bareing the words " Where would we be without the USA?" Just think about it for a while... :fluffle:

>>Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or women on the moon?<<


That question is from the above link. That question also does not make sense. The Soviets were trying to beat NASA to the moon. The author seemed to miss such a basic fact.

Just some food for thought.

The author also seemed to miss the point the the US doesn't have vastly superior space technology. Sure we put a handful of guys on the moon, but when it comes to space stations, the US can't compete. Even the International Space Station is mostly based off of existing Russian space station technology.

No Tallaris, I do not expect anyone to sympathise with us much. I agree, as I said in an earlier post, there is much bad blood on both the Jewish and Palestinian side of the conflict. I am not playing any "cards", I am simply stating facts as I know them, mostly from relatives whose memories may very well have been tainted by personal biases (understandable given the circumstances). No offense was taken to any of your statements. I was a little sarcastic a few posts earlier and I hope no one was offended. The country that gave my family and my people a good home and has treated us so well when most other nations want rid of us one way or another was being attacked, and I felt a strong duty to come to her defense.

No Tallaris, I do not expect anyone to sympathise with us much. I agree, as I said in an earlier post, there is much bad blood on both the Jewish and Palestinian side of the conflict. I am not playing any "cards", I am simply stating facts as I know them, mostly from relatives whose memories may very well have been tainted by personal biases (understandable given the circumstances). No offense was taken to any of your statements. I was a little sarcastic a few posts earlier and I hope no one was offended. The country that gave my family and my people a good home and has treated us so well when most other nations want rid of us one way or another was being attacked, and I felt a strong duty to come to her defense.

Dagnia,

No problem, I wasn't offended. I was merely trying to support my opinions. All I was saying was that maybe topics like who was better in WWII should be avoided (And yes I realize I brought WWII in posts after that. What can I say other than human=hypocritic?) especially in a discussion about another touchy subject as we're discussing here in this thread. If I offended anyone with that particular post (I'm sure everyone knows the one I'm refering too), I'm sincerely sorry because that was never my intent.

And how can a country represent democracy and free choice when a president gets elected when less that half the population votes for him purely because he won in the rich states?

except for the fact that he lost the 2 richest states... (cali, NY) and one pretty much every single small rural farming state in the country.

First of all, considering the British heldout as long as they did with minimal help, I would not go around insulting their role in WWII. Second, why is WWII discussed so damn much in this forum? All it seems to bring up is "my nation's better than your nation at making war and killing people". If I'm not mistaken, talk of WWII is avoided in conversation in Japan because of the hard feelings it always manages to bring up. Smart people if you ask me.
You seem completely ignorant about post-war Japan. Japan has whitewashed the past to make themselves seem like innocent victims even though during WWII they perpetrated the Pacific Holocaust against Chinese, Koreans, Filipinos, and other Asians - one of the worst genocides in history. In Japan, textbooks do not mention any of the Pacific Holocaust, which was just as bloody and sadistic as the Nazi Holocaust. They are even reluctant to admit they lost WWII; because of the government censorship and distortion of history, many Japanese do not even know who fought WWII, much less who won. Japan's problem is that it is talking too little about WWII, and the nation refuses to confront the crimes that their nation committed. Japan holds the "Three No's policy": No admission of aggression, No apology or repetence, and No compensation for the victims, many of whom are still suffering from the gruesome medical tests and chemical warfare that the Japanese inflicted on on them or their ancestors during WWII. Many convicted Japanese war criminals and mass murderers like Tojo Hideki are literally considered gods by Japanese. Can you imagine if the German government denied that the Nazi Holocaust existed, or if Adolf Hitler is considered a hero by today's Germans? You are terribly ignorant and wrong if you call Japan's policy of denial "smart"... Japan needs a serious introspection and needs to thrust the issue of WWII and Pacific Holocaust to the center of national attention in order to assure that such a horrific thing never happens again. Right now, by covering up and denying, they are spitting on the memories of millions killed by Japan during WWII.

You seem completely ignorant about post-war Japan.

Maybe, I am mistaken, but I was under the impression that it is considered a big no-no over in Japan that FOREIGNERS shouldn't bring by anything WWII related. Maybe I should have worded my statement different? Either way, I'm not avocading that people should completely forget about the war. After all, knowledge of past events provides us all with a way to learn from past mistakes and to prevent such mistakes from happening again. All I was saying is that touching on touchy subjects should be avoided, especially when we're focusing on a topic like this. If my point was used out of a relavent context, then I apologize.

And by the way, I never implied I was an expert on all that is Japanese, though I do appreciate that you are trying correct a misunderstanding I apparently seem to have.

Yes? Im not the one who has a long string of ephitets for the President of the United States. What sort of research would you have me do? Come up with reasons why he is not any of those things? Im sorry friend, but dont get hostile with me. You are levelling the accusations, the burden of proof is on you. I implied that you DONT have sources or reasons, forgive me, im sure you do... what are they? Why dont you answer my question in an intelligent fashion, calling me uninformed might fly if we were both in 3rd grade but youve made a few insightful posts so im pretty sure youre above that.

A President does not seize control of a country. In the the elections of 2000, two counties in Florida had more votes than voters. Just something to think about.

You flatter yourself with thinking I am getting hostile with you. I assure you, a faceless screen name on a message board is not worth that much energy.

I am a firm believer in people doing things on their own. If I have aroused your curiosity, then you should look it up for yourself. If you are too lazy or apathetic, then you obviously do not care enough to know. A friend of mine aroused my curiosity to the point I had to find out. If I just give you the sources, then I am taking a part away that I feel is important. If you don't like it, I'm sure someone would be willing to give you the sources. I'm just not one of them. If you do decide to do research, I congratulate you for having an open mind and the initiative to want to improve yourself. This is a trait very few people seem to have. If you don't feel like doing the research, then obviously I cannot congratulate you.

This insults me to my CORE. I personaly dont give a damn of what you forieners think, but this is an Insult to my pride for my country, wich could very easly kick Britton's Ass, Canada's ass, we could utterly destroy any country on earth. We can take the entire damn world on and have a chance of winning.

first, no you couldn't (in fact, I don't think you could take on China, but that's just me.) If u don't care, then don't post in threads which are critical of you county. In fact, why did you post in here? patriotic duty?

The author also seemed to miss the point the the US doesn't have vastly superior space technology. Sure we put a handful of guys on the moon, but when it comes to space stations, the US can't compete. Even the International Space Station is mostly based off of existing Russian space station technology.

Considering it's from 1973, I don't think that is surprising.

Considering it's from 1973, I don't think that is surprising.

:p

Sorry, I didn't see the date.....

:p

Sorry, I didn't see the date.....

No need to apologize. I'm sure most people didn't see the date.

Maybe, I am mistaken, but I was under the impression that it is considered a big no-no over in Japan that FOREIGNERS shouldn't bring by anything WWII related.
Due to the government's censorship, it is a big no-no for anybody, whether Japanese or non-Japanese, to talk about WWII there. When honest historians try to mention WWII in school textbooks, the government ruins their careers and bans what they write. There are many ultra-nationalist right wing activists in Japan who refuse to hear criticism of Japan, and have assassinated hundreds of Japanese politicians, journalists, and scholars who bring up uncomfortable truths about Japan's wicked past.

Maybe I should have worded my statement different? Either way, I'm not avocading that people should completely forget about the war. After all, knowledge of past events provides us all with a way to learn from past mistakes and to prevent such mistakes from happening again. All I was saying is that touching on touchy subjects should be avoided, especially when we're focusing on a topic like this. If my point was used out of a relavent context, then I apologize.
The touchy topic of Japanese war crimes should be confronted, discussed, and debated at all costs, even if people become uncomfortable with what they find. It is sad to see that western education does not teach much about the Pacific Holocaust and therefore many westerners are ignorant about the monstrous evil that happened in Japan during WWII. It is even more disturbing that the Japanese government does not teach Japanese people about WWII history and thus prevent Japan from ever understanding or atoning for its crimes.

And by the way, I never implied I was an expert on all that is Japanese.
You are accusing others of being unbalanced in their analysis of WWII and concentrating only on Europe, but you yourself are not treating the subject with knowledge and fairness.

you know.. i looked over the first 10 pages of this post.. and you know what i didn't find listed..

-Walmart! Destroyer of good ol' Mom and Pop shops everywhere.

Germany:
Like France, Panzy ass Faggots
Defeated by the fucking world Twice..

Yeah.. ok, taking your logic, not that it's historically correct. But it took the entire world twice, to stop germany (who is one nation, about the size of texas).

Tallaris,
You are right. In the end, it does not really matter who was better. Many nations got together with the common purpose of defeating a dangerous nation and the Allies won. I guess it is natural for a patriot to always think his country is the best at everything no matter what. But I don't think it could have been done without the US (I admit, there were others that played roles just as important that we could not have done without) and Europe does not give this country nearly enough credit. I don't think Europe should constantly praising us, but when I hear some European pseudo-intellectual condemning America because we don't do anything for the world or that we are the cause of everything that is wrong with it, I get physically ill. If there is another power that does not immediately affect us, but does affect Europe, I believe Americans will think twice before lending a hand.
I don't think you are a hypocrite for making WWII posts. If there is a fact one knows, then it is perfectly right to state it, so unless repect for truth makes one a hypocrite, then I don't think so.

You are accusing others of being unbalanced in their analysis of WWII and concentrating only on Europe, but you yourself are not treating the subject with knowledge and fairness.

Would you prefer it if I'd delete all the posts I made on this thread? I sorry if I'm not an expert on WWII. I'll admit that, but I think I know more than most, as this and other threads have shown. So sue me, I'm a fucking chemistry major NOT a damn historian. But as a member of the scientific community, I do try to treat ALL subjects with knowledge and fairness. If I failed to do that, too bad. No one is prefect, after all. So get off my case. I mean I make one damn statement about Japan and you're all over me. What's you're problem?

Would you prefer it if I'd delete all the posts I made on this thread?
Um, no, why would I? Anyways now you won't have to make the same error in the future.

Would you prefer it if I'd delete all the posts I made on this thread? I sorry if I'm not an expert on WWII. I'll admit that, but I think I know more than most, as this and other threads have shown. So sue me, I'm a fucking chemistry major NOT a damn historian. But as a member of the scientific community, I do try to treat ALL subjects with knowledge and fairness. If I failed to do that, too bad. No one is prefect, after all. So get off my case. I mean I make one damn statement about Japan and you're all over me. What's you're problem?
You made an honest mistake, I understand, but the widespread ignorance about Japan's WWII history is very unfortunate... my family was from China and witnessed firsthand the brutality of the genocide perpetrated, it truly disturbs me that such a brutal Holocaust continues to be unknown to most of the world... every time something like this about Japan comes up I always write up my thoughts on the matter.

Um, no, why would I? Anyways now you won't have to make the same error in the future.

You did not answer my last question. What's your problem? I got your point the first time you stated it, and I truly appreciate the clarification you provided. But I do not appreciate the accusation that I don't try to approach subjects with knowledge, with fairness and without bias. I do make an effort to approach subjects with knowledge, with fairness, and without bias, and I'm absolutely insulted that you accused me of not doing so.

Mezazoic said alot of crap in that post slating Britain, germany and france. Firstly, Britain only ever got defeated once by America in the independance war, and America may have been weaker but they had France on their side aswell. Britain has never been almost taken over by France, our country has only been successfully invaded once and that was in 1066 by William the Conquerer. We actually conquered alot of France in the Hundred Years War, but of course you never would have heard of that. Britain gave America alot like people have said - language, political ideas etc, and not to mention decent music :cool:

But anyway, on the list, Ignorance should be up there. I mean, i went to America this summer and someone asked me if we had ketchup in Britain. Many Americans dont know the difference between England and Britain, aand have never heard of places like Wales and Scotland. I'm English and i could list a good number of American states and at least recognize at accent or something like that.




i do believe england was invaded by scotland and successfully at that....

You Europeans sure have short memories. If it wasn't for America in WW2 you all would probably be ruled by Nazi's. Then if we had intervened in WW2 but not given a shit about Europe during the Cold War you'd all be run by Authoritarian Communists. Europeans have no long term memories *goes off mumbling something about Europeans and memories*

A President does not seize control of a country. In the the elections of 2000, two counties in Florida had more votes than voters. Just something to think about.

You flatter yourself with thinking I am getting hostile with you. I assure you, a faceless screen name on a message board is not worth that much energy.

I am a firm believer in people doing things on their own. If I have aroused your curiosity, then you should look it up for yourself. If you are too lazy or apathetic, then you obviously do not care enough to know. A friend of mine aroused my curiosity to the point I had to find out. If I just give you the sources, then I am taking a part away that I feel is important. If you don't like it, I'm sure someone would be willing to give you the sources. I'm just not one of them. If you do decide to do research, I congratulate you for having an open mind and the initiative to want to improve yourself. This is a trait very few people seem to have. If you don't feel like doing the research, then obviously I cannot congratulate you.

You havent aroused my curiousity. Ive heard all of those things many times before, and theyre for the most part baseless and jeuvenile accusations. I truly want the best for this country, so if you want to influence my opinion you can feel free to tell me why you think those things. As it is ive heard enough ignorant blither of that sort to want to go look more of it up. I would have to dig through hundreds of blatantly partisan lies to find any proof at all of GW's bigotry and corruption, if it exists. As it is I think its a safe bet to assume youre just another hate-spewing leftist, unless you reconsider and explain your position, a turn of events i would welcome.

(example: 2 Florida counties? You realize that this particular inconsistency was caused by the "snowbirds" who summered in NY state and wintered in Florida voting in both states illegally? Many of these senior citizens voted twice; the number is impossible to judge becasue a full intra-state collaboration was never done but of the 1000 or so that were corroborated by both states, 68% were Democrats. !6% were Republican. I bet that really handed the election to Bush! Or i suppose thats a GOP coverup? If this isnt the instance youre talking about let me know, im open to new ideas.)

You did not answer my last question. What's your problem? I got your point the first time you stated it, and I truly appreciate the clarification you provided. But I do not appreciate the accusation that I don't try to approach subjects with knowledge, with fairness and without bias. I do make an effort to approach subjects with knowledge, with fairness, and without bias, and I'm absolutely insulted that you accused me of not doing so.
As I said I realize you made an honest mistake so I apologize if I came off as too harsh. But also keep in mind that the other WWII history debaters are not necessarily ignorant of Pacific war history just because they are currently preoccupied with topics pertaining to the European theater.

(example: 2 Florida counties? You realize that this particular inconsistency was caused by the "snowbirds" who summered in NY state and wintered in Florida voting in both states illegally? Many of these senior citizens voted twice; the number is impossible to judge becasue a full intra-state collaboration was never done but of the 1000 or so that were corroborated by both states, 68% were Democrats. !6% were Republican. I bet that really handed the election to Bush! Or i suppose thats a GOP coverup? If this isnt the instance youre talking about let me know, im open to new ideas.)

Just one reason why I believe voter registration should be tied to driver licenses. If we allowed driver licenses to double as voter registeration card a lot of problems would be solved. More examples/reasons:

1) Simplifies voter registration. I believe part of the reason people don't vote over here is because its a pain in the ass to register. In fact, when I registered my township clerk fucked up my paper work and didn't notify me that I wasn't techinically registered because of the fuck up for over a year! Just make it automatic when you get a driver license, and we cut down on paper work and stupid errors like what I had to go through.

2) Driver licenses already have you're information on them. Well except for your district, but that could be easily inserted in the magnetic strip most licenses have nowadays.

3) You could just sign in and swipe your card to vote. This also prevents people from voting twice because once you've swipe your card the machine can check to make sure you haven't voted already in the same election.

You Europeans sure have short memories. If it wasn't for America in WW2 you all would probably be ruled by Nazi's. Then if we had intervened in WW2 but not given a shit about Europe during the Cold War you'd all be run by Authoritarian Communists. Europeans have no long term memories *goes off mumbling something about Europeans and memories*
The only reason (historically) the Americans did manage to be one of the largest driving forces in reversing the war's outcome was because they had been out of the European theature until December of 1941, only really entering the war with troops in 1942.

The British held up ok.

The Germans were doomed when they had the arrogance to hold two different fronts in the war.

The only reason Stalin even took Eastern Europe was because Russian needed "buffer" protection from Germany and the west.

As I said I realize you made an honest mistake so I apologize if I came off as too harsh. But also keep in mind that the other WWII history debaters are not necessarily ignorant of Pacific war history just because they are currently preoccupied with topics pertaining to the European theater.

If I came off sounding like that, I'm sorry. However, you have to admit some of the threads that debate WWII on here do give the impression of being ignorant of the other fronts. (Hopefully I'm not digging myself into a hole here).

You Europeans sure have short memories. If it wasn't for America in WW2 you all would probably be ruled by Nazi's. Then if we had intervened in WW2 but not given a shit about Europe during the Cold War you'd all be run by Authoritarian Communists. Europeans have no long term memories *goes off mumbling something about Europeans and memories*

I think it's funny how, speaking of wars, Canada was involved in WWI from the start and the U.S. just "decided" to enter the war in the last year, and you all think you single-handedly stopped it. Canada probably did more work and sacrificed more per capita in both wars, but OH NO WITHOUT AMERICA WE WOULD ALL BE RULED BY THE AXIS OF EVIL!!!! BAH!!! RUN AND SACRIFICE YOURSELVES BECAUSE JESUS IS FUCKING COMING! AHHHHHHHHH!

OH NO WITHOUT AMERICA WE WOULD ALL BE RULED BY THE AXIS OF EVIL!!!! BAH!!! RUN AND SACRIFICE YOURSELVES BECAUSE JESUS IS FUCKING COMING! AHHHHHHHHH!
I thought it is because of the US we are ruled now by the Axis of Evil.

Just one reason why I believe voter registration should be tied to driver licenses. If we allowed driver licenses to double as voter registeration card a lot of problems would be solved. More example:

1) Simplifies voter registration. I believe part of the reason people don't vote over here is because its a pain in the ass to register. In fact, when I registered my township clerk fucked up my paper work and didn't notify me that I wasn't techinically registered because of the fuck up for over a year! Just make it automatic when you get a driver license, and we cut down on paper work and stupid errors like what I had to go through.

2) Driver licenses already have you're information on them. Well except for your district, but that could be easily inserted in the magnetic strip most licenses have nowadays.

3) You could just sign in and swipe your card to vote. This also prevents people from voting twice because once you've swipe your card the machine can check to make sure you haven't voted already in the same election.


Not a bad idea at all, but what about people who dont have licenses/state ID cards? Even a state ID costs like $18 here in Ohio, a license is $22, obviously not a big deal for most people but it does require that you pay money to be able to vote, which i would oppose on principle. I absolutely agree with you that the system need to be updated and centralized somehow. I mean, come on... every bank in the nation has a minute by minute tally of the funds in your account, cant our government keep better track of the very activity that makes us a democracy? A nationwide, computerized system is really in order, whether its license-based or not. The only problem is that the government would have everything special ordered by contractors, and every township in the US would have to end up buying 5-10 machines at $3000 a pop for some needlessly expensive piece of technology whos job could be done by a ti-85 calculator.

Had the Soviet Union or United states not gone to war with Germany, Europe most likely would have been totally conquered by Germany.

The Soviets were the main reason that Germany lost, but if the soviets had not gone to war then America would have still beaten Germany. The U.S. might not have been able to do it while fighting Japan at the same time, but after Japan fell allowing America to devote all of its attention to Germany, it would have been over.

You havent aroused my curiousity. Ive heard all of those things many times before, and theyre for the most part baseless and jeuvenile accusations. I truly want the best for this country, so if you want to influence my opinion you can feel free to tell me why you think those things. As it is ive heard enough ignorant blither of that sort to want to go look more of it up. I would have to dig through hundreds of blatantly partisan lies to find any proof at all of GW's bigotry and corruption, if it exists. As it is I think its a safe bet to assume youre just another hate-spewing leftist, unless you reconsider and explain your position, a turn of events i would welcome.

(example: 2 Florida counties? You realize that this particular inconsistency was caused by the "snowbirds" who summered in NY state and wintered in Florida voting in both states illegally? Many of these senior citizens voted twice; the number is impossible to judge becasue a full intra-state collaboration was never done but of the 1000 or so that were corroborated by both states, 68% were Democrats. !6% were Republican. I bet that really handed the election to Bush! Or i suppose thats a GOP coverup? If this isnt the instance youre talking about let me know, im open to new ideas.)

I was not aware of this "snowbirds" incident. My understanding is that you cannot be registered to vote in two states. If you have ever moved into a different state since being registered, this may make sense to you.

Calling me a hate-spewing leftist without evidence at hand shows your ignorance. Apparently, you are among the ranks of those who practice intolerance as well. Congratulations my friend, for you are part of the problem.

Since I am being nice, I decided to give you one source. This source talks about Bush's "divine inspiration/calling". You can read about it here (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A37944-2003Jun26?language=printer). The source is the Washington Post. Stories similar to this one can be found if you try to look it up.

It's no surprise to me that you never looked anything up. You were afraid you'd find something you didn't like. Do not fear knowledge, for it can set you free of the shackles of ignorance and mediocrity.

Not a bad idea at all, but what about people who dont have licenses/state ID cards? Even a state ID costs like $18 here in Ohio, a license is $22, obviously not a big deal for most people but it does require that you pay money to be able to vote, which i would oppose on principle. I absolutely agree with you that the system need to be updated and centralized somehow. I mean, come on... every bank in the nation has a minute by minute tally of the funds in your account, cant our government keep better track of the very activity that makes us a democracy? A nationwide, computerized system is really in order, whether its license-based or not. The only problem is that the government would have everything special ordered by contractors, and every township in the US would have to end up buying 5-10 machines at $3000 a pop for some needlessly expensive piece of technology whos job could be done by a ti-85 calculator.

The United States of America is not a democracy. This would be apparent if you knew the difference between a democracy and a republic. Time for some basic politics. It's a shame such a thing even needs to be said if one considers what this forum is for.

A democracy is a system of government in which ultimate political authority is vested in the people.

A republic is form of government in which sovereignty rests with the people, who elect agents to represent them in the law making process.

The Republic of the United States of America is what is known as a representative democracy. A representative democracy is a form of government in which representatives are elected by the people make and enforce laws an policies.

If you do not wish to call it a representative democracy, you can call it a republic. The fact you can call it a republic should be apparent to most since it is in the United States' official name. Of course, some people are not that observant. Likewise, some people apparently do not know the difference between a democracy and a republic.

how about a reason why America is cool?

1. The drive to introspect as a ethos. Thankfully, we americans are finaly beging to examin our faults and work toward addressing them. Further, we are beging to reexamin our stregnths and assess how than can be champion in a more efficient, non-abbrasive way. The United States a history of slow, steady, and ultimatley absolute tradition of reform in the aforementioned, and a additional respects.

2. International relief. Granted Bush (AKA monkey moron/evil genious from hell) has provided robust humanitarian, political, and social contention in Iraq, but that doesn't change the fact that in the event of internatioinal disasters American relief workers are among the first foreign teams on the scene. American dollars, although i wish more, are allocated for internationial problems. alot of them.

3. the above two are a partial result of a strong and austere liberal tradition. This liberal tradition is fluid and cyclical in our politcal establishment but even once you examine our political history ultimatley our polity has gravitated toward a progressively stronger liberal manifestation.

4. we catalyzed the global impetus toward democritization.

But seriously look, bash the US, fine. But not as a matter of respect but as a matter of epistemic responsibility keep in mind what utility is yielded if the 'bashing' isn't geared toward a constructive end.

that is one thing i want to put on why Europeans are not COOL...

1. although you are perhaps the worlds greatest critics you are becoming more and more visceraly reactive to American problems, you complain, you moan, you accuse, but generally without any constructive ends. also i think it may be you who has the 'small penis syndrome'; you project judgement accross to our end of the atlantic in reactive magniloquence. keep in mind that just as we have had, and still have much to learn from you, you have had and still have much to learn from us.

The United States of America is a great nation. It is lessened by nationalistic rants like those displayed here, as are various European nations by 'Euro rants'. What makes a country great? Not the size of its dick. Since WW2 seems to be dragged into most of these tedious arguments, let's start there. Britain, with the co-operation of its empire / commonwealth partners, and along with France, had the guts to declare war on Germany, thus starting WW2. America joined only days after Pearl Harbour, when Hitler made the biggest mistake of the war and declared war on the US. Does that make America great? No. But the US did take on the mantle of greatness immediately after the war when it stayed in Europe and hence 'guaranteed' Western Europes freedom from Soviet aggression and probable invasion.
There's no greatness regarding Americas nuclear strength. That is a weapon that if used, assures destruction for all.
America is great because of its humane and democratic ideals. It is not great when it tries to foist those ideals on unwilling countries.
America is great because in the profit and loss account, it is still a force for 'good' in the world.
The only way to judge a nations greatness is to study its history. The US is responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands round the world. That is not 'great'. However, despite the clumsiness, the arrogance, America, at its heart still stands for liberty and justice.
If America wants to remain great it must learn that military might is the very last tool it should use.
Teddy Roosevelt had a lesson for all nationalistic, flag-waving Americans, 'Talk softly and carry a big stick'. The US is tending more and more to shout and wield the stick as a first or second option.
The world would be in a sorrier state without the actions of the US during the last 100 years but it is not unique. Britain, France, Canada etc can be proud to say the same. We are more alike than different, even to name-calling.
Be brave America and grow up a little.

Obviously you do not understand the meaning of "military victory"

okay
Give me a good definition of military victory.

...In this post-ideological age, anti-Americanism fills the void left by defunct belief systems. It has become a powerful trend in international politics today—and perhaps the most dangerous. U.S. hegemony has its problems, but a world that reacts instinctively against the United States will be less peaceful, less cooperative, less prosperous, less open, and less stable....

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/story/files/story2670.php

Hating America - The World's Most Dangerous Ideas
By Fared Zakaria

You seem completely ignorant about post-war Japan. Japan has whitewashed the past to make themselves seem like innocent victims even though during WWII they perpetrated the Pacific Holocaust against Chinese, Koreans, Filipinos, and other Asians - one of the worst genocides in history. In Japan, textbooks do not mention any of the Pacific Holocaust, which was just as bloody and sadistic as the Nazi Holocaust. They are even reluctant to admit they lost WWII; because of the government censorship and distortion of history, many Japanese do not even know who fought WWII, much less who won. Japan's problem is that it is talking too little about WWII, and the nation refuses to confront the crimes that their nation committed. Japan holds the "Three No's policy": No admission of aggression, No apology or repetence, and No compensation for the victims, many of whom are still suffering from the gruesome medical tests and chemical warfare that the Japanese inflicted on on them or their ancestors during WWII. Many convicted Japanese war criminals and mass murderers like Tojo Hideki are literally considered gods by Japanese. Can you imagine if the German government denied that the Nazi Holocaust existed, or if Adolf Hitler is considered a hero by today's Germans? You are terribly ignorant and wrong if you call Japan's policy of denial "smart"... Japan needs a serious introspection and needs to thrust the issue of WWII and Pacific Holocaust to the center of national attention in order to assure that such a horrific thing never happens again. Right now, by covering up and denying, they are spitting on the memories of millions killed by Japan during WWII.



Maybe, I am mistaken, but I was under the impression that it is considered a big no-no over in Japan that FOREIGNERS shouldn't bring by anything WWII related.

Due to the government's censorship, it is a big no-no for anybody, whether Japanese or non-Japanese, to talk about WWII there. When honest historians try to mention WWII in school textbooks, the government ruins their careers and bans what they write. There are many ultra-nationalist right wing activists in Japan who refuse to hear criticism of Japan, and have assassinated hundreds of Japanese politicians, journalists, and scholars who bring up uncomfortable truths about Japan's wicked past.

Maybe I should have worded my statement different? Either way, I'm not avocading that people should completely forget about the war. After all, knowledge of past events provides us all with a way to learn from past mistakes and to prevent such mistakes from happening again. All I was saying is that touching on touchy subjects should be avoided, especially when we're focusing on a topic like this. If my point was used out of a relavent context, then I apologize.

The touchy topic of Japanese war crimes should be confronted, discussed, and debated at all costs, even if people become uncomfortable with what they find. It is sad to see that western education does not teach much about the Pacific Holocaust and therefore many westerners are ignorant about the monstrous evil that happened in Japan during WWII. It is even more disturbing that the Japanese government does not teach Japanese people about WWII history and thus prevent Japan from ever understanding or atoning for its crimes.

Trilateral, I agree to a point. But you have some vast exagerations and oversimplifications. The right wingers have taken pot shots at or tried to knife a few politicians and journalists, yes. But no way, no how have there been hundreds of assassinations. Text book authors are not ruined or banned. Their text's aren't adopted for the classroom, but not banned. People do talk about the war. There are deniers, but there are also people, including former soldiers who have spent much of their life trying to atone.
People do talk about the war. It is not a forbidden subject. The government doesn't teach much about it in schools, but many governments avoid teaching about or whitewash their crimes, especially recent ones.
(Out of curiosity, are the events of the Cultural Revolution taught in schools in China?)

I was not aware of this "snowbirds" incident. My understanding is that you cannot be registered to vote in two states. If you have ever moved into a different state since being registered, this may make sense to you.

Calling me a hate-spewing leftist without evidence at hand shows your ignorance. Apparently, you are among the ranks of those who practice intolerance as well. Congratulations my friend, for you are part of the problem.

Since I am being nice, I decided to give you one source. This source talks about Bush's "divine inspiration/calling". You can read about it here (http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A37944-2003Jun26?language=printer). The source is the Washington Post. Stories similar to this one can be found if you try to look it up.

It's no surprise to me that you never looked anything up. You were afraid you'd find something you didn't like. Do not fear knowledge, for it can set you free of the shackles of ignorance and mediocrity.

I have plain and clear evidence that you harbor a good deal of hatred towards GW Bush. You call him, among other things, a "bigot", "moron", "puppet", "thief", "liar" and religious zealot. Those certainly strike me as hateful remarks. And you presented them as fact, without providing and sources to back them up. While the term, "hate spewing leftist" is certainly very confrontational, it seems to fit you very well. When pressed about your sources, you give me an article which admits itself that the quote you attributed to GW Bush, that he invaded Iraq because "god told him to" is very unreliable, having been translated from english to arabic, written in arabic then translated by a different translator back into english, and printed in a hebrew news publication. Indeed, the text of the quotation changes even within the article: from "God told me to strike at Saddam" to "God inspired me to hit Saddam". Remember that the source for this remark is the head of the Palistinian Authority, a non secular figure. Any remark involving a diety seems likely to be jumbled. Even if this quote were 100% accurate, it seems as if the phrase, "god inspired me to hit Saddam" is a pretty far cry from your assertion, which was that he was so religious that "Jesus told him to invade other counties". Thats very far out of context indeed. For all you know, "god inspired me to hit Saddam" could have meant that he was unsure of a course of action, or lacking the strength to follow a course of action he knew was right, and after praying, he felt that God had given him the inspiration to proceed. I dont know, and neither do you.

Regarding the voting scandal: it seems like you havent done your homework here... tsk tsk. maybe
You were afraid you'd find something you didn't like. Do not fear knowledge, for it can set you free of the shackles of ignorance and mediocrity
It is in fact very illegal to vote in 2 states, or to register, but that didnt stop quite a few people in the last election. The penalty is 5 years in jail and/or a $10,000 fine, but poor communication between offices in certain states apparently makes it difficult to be found out, as is the case with NY and Florida.


The United States of America is not a democracy. This would be apparent if you knew the difference between a democracy and a republic. Time for some basic politics. It's a shame such a thing even needs to be said if one considers what this forum is for.

A democracy is a system of government in which ultimate political authority is vested in the people.

A republic is form of government in which sovereignty rests with the people, who elect agents to represent them in the law making process.

The Republic of the United States of America is what is known as a representative democracy. A representative democracy is a form of government in which representatives are elected by the people make and enforce laws an policies.

If you do not wish to call it a representative democracy, you can call it a republic. The fact you can call it a republic should be apparent to most since it is in the United States' official name. Of course, some people are not that observant. Likewise, some people apparently do not know the difference between a democracy and a republic.

Wow, just wow. The same person who somehow turned "God inspired me to hit Saddam" into "Jesus tells him to attack other countries" is now picking nits over 2 terms which imply similar sorts of government and in laypersons terms are interchangable, not to mention having little to do with the thrust of the post itself. I can assure you that i am very familiar with the nomenclature used to identify various forms of government, but in this instance the term was not used to define a government but merely to establish a point. In fact, according to Websters Dictionary, the literal definition of the term, democracy, is:
de·moc·ra·cy n. pl. de·moc·ra·cies
1. Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.
2. A political or social unit that has such a government.
3. The common people, considered as the primary source of political power.
4. Majority rule.
5. The principles of social equality and respect for the individual within a community.

While if you are talking in earnest about a form of government, or comparing different governments, refering to the US as a "democracy" would not be strictly accurate, in this instance I believe the usage is completely justified.

I suggest that if you have a problem with my political views you address the issue at hand and not play games with technicalities.

Not a bad idea at all, but what about people who dont have licenses/state ID cards? Even a state ID costs like $18 here in Ohio, a license is $22, obviously not a big deal for most people but it does require that you pay money to be able to vote, which i would oppose on principle. I absolutely agree with you that the system need to be updated and centralized somehow. I mean, come on... every bank in the nation has a minute by minute tally of the funds in your account, cant our government keep better track of the very activity that makes us a democracy? A nationwide, computerized system is really in order, whether its license-based or not. The only problem is that the government would have everything special ordered by contractors, and every township in the US would have to end up buying 5-10 machines at $3000 a pop for some needlessly expensive piece of technology whos job could be done by a ti-85 calculator.

Yeah, the payment part of that does suck, but I would hope it just applies strictly to the license rather than the act of registering, if you understand what I'm trying to say. As for those without license, I can't see why a registration card couldn't be issued, without a fee of course, that has the same capabilities as the license, with the obivious exception that you can't drive.

As for the machines, I can't help you on the price. All I can say is that such machines are needed though badly, and I don't see any reason why a fully electronic system would allow more vote tampering than current methods. I mean we have to have our ballots feed in a machine electronically anyway, so whose to say votes can't already be tampered wtih electronically after there tallied by the machine?

Best economy in the world. Enough said. We can bury any other country in the world militarily, economically, and politically. So step up and take a shot at the title.

Yeah, the payment part of that does suck, but I would hope it just applies strictly to the license rather than the act of registering, if you understand what I'm trying to say. As for those without license, I can't see why a registration card couldn't be issued, without a fee of course, that has the same capabilities as the license, with the obivious exception that you can't drive.

As for the machines, I can't help you on the price. All I can say is that such machines are needed though badly, and I don't see any reason why a fully electronic system would allow more vote tampering than current methods. I mean we have to have our ballots feed in a machine electronically anyway, so whose to say votes can't already be tampered wtih electronically after there tallied by the machine?


Dont get me wrong I completely agree with you; all good ideas. Im just trying to bring up possible problems, obstacles, and objections.

Best economy in the world. Enough said. We can bury any other country in the world militarily, economically, and politically. So step up and take a shot at the title.

Actually, I'm glad nobody else has the political system you have. Absolutely confounding... just have party leaders and whoever wins the most seats becomes Prime Minister (like good old Canada). Not that your system is bad, it's just sooo overtaxed and huge-ass, to say it bluntly. The campaign for 2008 starts right after this election, it seems.

I thought it is because of the US we are ruled now by the Axis of Evil.

Good point, but I wouldn't take that value as far. ;)

It was the first time that the 'winner' had people chucking things at him as he went to the inauguration ceremony.

Actually, it wasn't. President Hayes earned the nickname Your Fraudlency during his term. The election was very close and he was NOT well received.

Seriously though, the electorial college needs to be done away with, it was only done because the founding fathers didn't trust the US citizens to be informed enough to make decisions for themselves. And in this current age, where a 15 year old kid (albeit a rather gifted kid) can expose government secrets, I don't think that holds true anymore.

I disagree. The electoral college needs to be updated. I'm very much looking forward to seeing if Colorado gets their referendum on this issue passed. But abolishing it is not the answer. Its purpose was not about not trusting the US citizens. It was about trying to make fair representation to each group. Why should candidates campaign in rural areas without the electoral college? They wouldn't need to. They would just spend their campaigns focused in metropolitan areas, avoiding those outside the heavily populated regions.

First of all I am American, and I am getting pissed at people that are saying; "Americans can kick the world’s ass", and "America is a Dictatorship that wants to take over the world"

1) First of all, America is not some invincible Superpower that can take on the world militarily...While we currently have the title "Superpower", we cannot go launching wars against other countries without the support of our allies….Some of you Americans that beat the war drums and say “America is the BEST, WE WILL KICK THE WHOLE WORLD’S ASS, **** THE WORLD”, you truly make Americans seem like idiots and you should shut up (Not directed at anyone in specific)…We depend on other countries just as they depend on us…..

2) You people that say “AMERICA IS A DICTATORSHIP, TOPPLE THE GOVERNMENT AND STOP THE CONQUEST OF THE WORLD”, are quite frankly a bit nuts….First of all, it is impossible to conquer the world. Look at how our military is being bogged down by Iraq. Next, there are these things called Nuclear Missiles that assure MAD…..Now you’re probably saying that the US goal is complete dominance over every country in the world, not necessarily conquest. Well in 1991-94, we had the perfect chance: political instability, economic growth (US), and military growth (US), why didn’t we strike then? I did not agree with the war in Iraq. Some of it was probably due to a dependence on oil, but not world dominance.

3) What I think, is that America can’t live without the world, and the world can’t live without America. The US is somewhat of Hypocrisy. But no more than the British, Germans, USSR, French, etc. used to be….(British used to gas the Kurds in Iraq….there is some quote by Churchill which I wish I could find…but he basically said “I don’t know why people are squeamish about gassing uncivilized tribes in Iraq”…Course it’s kind of easy to find dirt on the Germans or the USSR\Russia…)

Anyway, maybe I’ll explain my position later. Now I have both sides angry at me

First of all I am American, and I am getting pissed at people that are saying; "Americans can kick the world’s ass", and "America is a Dictatorship that wants to take over the world"



America could kick the world's ass(militarily). Unfortunately that doesnt mean a damn thing because

1) we would be dead broke and implode
2) we could not occupy/control any of it
3) The military would not go along with it
4) the public would DEFINATELY not go along with it
5) who the hell would want to do this in the first place?

Reason 458546) Americans are just so very VULGAR. They have no sense of fair play, unlike "Britton" where regular duals are conducted and we admit that we have lost wars in the past!
Reason 458547) you can't concentrate on anything not shiny or not being blown up. you don't play cricket. any game which is played over five days and then can end in a draw is truly awesome.

by the way i don't like cricket... i love it (see wot i did there)

Dont get me wrong I completely agree with you; all good ideas. Im just trying to bring up possible problems, obstacles, and objections.

Oh, I understand completely. Every voting system has its problems, even after it is implimented. You don't have to go very far for that for examples of where that's happened. Wasn't to long ago when we where having problems in Florida with hanging chads. Apparently no one counted upon some of the elderly voters being too weak to punch a hole in a piece of paper. :D

I am so sick and tired of these threads bashing america, if I made a thread called "Reasons why Europe Sucks" you people would be having a coniption fit! Most of europe is too busy bashing america to see anything wrong with their own homelands. Europe is quick to dish out critiques about america but get all ass hurt if we say anything thats not "politicaly correct." Hey Europe wake up, you are not perfect and neither are we. So get the hell over it.

I am so sick and tired of these threads bashing america, if I made a thread called "Reasons why Europe Sucks" you people would be having a coniption fit! Most of europe is too busy bashing america to see anything wrong with their own homelands. Europe is quick to dish out critiques about america but get all ass hurt if we say anything thats not "politicaly correct." Hey Europe wake up, you are not perfect and neither are we. So get the hell over it.

I wouldn't say Europe is perfect, but I can't off the top of my head think of a single thing that really sucks about Europe that doesn't also suck about America.

Obviously there are things that America is better at than Europe, and things that suck about Europe. But I challenge you to think of 1 thing that sucks about Europe that America has found a suitable solution to.

For your informatoin, dureing the War of 1812, we DID try to take over Canada. We have never lost a war, NEVER.

And I wonder in what state you are living and in which US history textbook you ben reading in order to give that response?

I am so sick and tired of these threads bashing america, if I made a thread called "Reasons why Europe Sucks" you people would be having a coniption fit! Most of europe is too busy bashing america to see anything wrong with their own homelands. Europe is quick to dish out critiques about america but get all ass hurt if we say anything thats not "politicaly correct." Hey Europe wake up, you are not perfect and neither are we. So get the hell over it.
We win since because were nations not states we get to say that what ever you say sucks in Europe doesnt suck in some of the nations so we can just say that :D

You just go ahead an think what ever you want about us. I'm gonna tell you a secret.

We dont give a flying fuck what you think about us, and thats what makes us cool. Deal with it.

I'm not just right, I'm far right!

Trilateral, I agree to a point. But you have some vast exagerations and oversimplifications. The right wingers have taken pot shots at or tried to knife a few politicians and journalists, yes. But no way, no how have there been hundreds of assassinations. Text book authors are not ruined or banned. Their text's aren't adopted for the classroom, but not banned. People do talk about the war. There are deniers, but there are also people, including former soldiers who have spent much of their life trying to atone.
People do talk about the war. It is not a forbidden subject. The government doesn't teach much about it in schools, but many governments avoid teaching about or whitewash their crimes, especially recent ones.
(Out of curiosity, are the events of the Cultural Revolution taught in schools in China?)

Thank you for clearing that up. What you're saying is much more in line with what I had learned about your nation through my World Cultures teacher in high school, who did actually go over there to Japan and teach for a year. I can't remember when he said he was over there, I think he said it was sometime in the late 70's or maybe the early 80's, but I do know he was over there. While he was no expert on Japanese culture and history, he was nevertheless genuinely interesting and knowledgable in it.

Anyway, that makes a lot more sense than what Trilateral was saying. Yeah Trilateral may have oversimplified or exagerated a few things, but I am not to say anything more about it since I too did oversimplify.

I am an American.

This thread disturbs me.

Why?

Because of the other americans than have shown how uneducated and how they have proven themselves complete dumbasses.

I would like to formally apologize to the world for all the dumbasses in America, which include, but are not limited to, those who hate France because they have won very little wars and disagree with america, those who created "Freedom Fries", those who think America is the best because we can destroy the world 50 times over, and President Bush.

::is glad he goes to one of the best High Schools in the country::

But creating an America Bashing thread isn't much better. It is a complete load of generalization.


Thank You.

I am an American.

This thread disturbs me.

Why?

Because of the other americans than have shown how uneducated and how they have proven themselves complete dumbasses.

I would like to formally apologize to the world for all the dumbasses in America, which include, but are not limited to, those who hate France because they have won very little wars and disagree with america, those who created "Freedom Fries", those who think America is the best because we can destroy the world 50 times over, and President Bush.

::is glad he goes to one of the best High Schools in the country::

But creating an America Bashing thread isn't much better. It is a complete load of generalization.


Thank You.



That needed to be said. thanks.

I have plain and clear evidence that you harbor a good deal of hatred towards GW Bush. You call him, among other things, a "bigot", "moron", "puppet", "thief", "liar" and religious zealot. Those certainly strike me as hateful remarks. And you presented them as fact, without providing and sources to back them up. While the term, "hate spewing leftist" is certainly very confrontational, it seems to fit you very well. When pressed about your sources, you give me an article which admits itself that the quote you attributed to GW Bush, that he invaded Iraq because "god told him to" is very unreliable, having been translated from english to arabic, written in arabic then translated by a different translator back into english, and printed in a hebrew news publication. Indeed, the text of the quotation changes even within the article: from "God told me to strike at Saddam" to "God inspired me to hit Saddam". Remember that the source for this remark is the head of the Palistinian Authority, a non secular figure. Any remark involving a diety seems likely to be jumbled. Even if this quote were 100% accurate, it seems as if the phrase, "god inspired me to hit Saddam" is a pretty far cry from your assertion, which was that he was so religious that "Jesus told him to invade other counties". Thats very far out of context indeed. For all you know, "god inspired me to hit Saddam" could have meant that he was unsure of a course of action, or lacking the strength to follow a course of action he knew was right, and after praying, he felt that God had given him the inspiration to proceed. I dont know, and neither do you.

You do not have your plain and clear evidence of hatred towards Dubya, as I do not hate anyone. The post that you want to refer to was made in jest. Anyone with a decent ability in reading comprehension should be able to figure that out. I'm sure though you just enjoy being confronttational. Despite being in jest, there was truth to the post.

Whether "God" inspired or told Dubya directly, it really doesn't make much of a difference in the end. Here you have a supposed Christian that is not worthy of the title. Being a Christian is not about going to church, wearing a gold cross, or even reading the Bible. It's about emulating "Christ". Christianity is about compassion. Since Christians view that "Christ" is either "God" or part of "God", in jest it could be used interchangeably. Why would a compassionate "God" want to see all of the innocent in Iraq injured? Whether he said "God" told him to or that "God" merely inspired him, it is an obvious sign Dubya is off his rocker. If he did say "God" told him to, then delusions of grandeur are obviously at work here. If he is being inspired, then that is a threat as he is to uphold the Constitution, not the Bible.


Regarding the voting scandal: it seems like you havent done your homework here... tsk tsk. maybe It is in fact very illegal to vote in 2 states, or to register, but that didnt stop quite a few people in the last election. The penalty is 5 years in jail and/or a $10,000 fine, but poor communication between offices in certain states apparently makes it difficult to be found out, as is the case with NY and Florida.

I am quite aware that it is illegal to vote in two states. That is why they remove you from the other state's voter list. You would have been aware of this had you understood what I meant about moving after you are registered to vote.

Wow, just wow. The same person who somehow turned "God inspired me to hit Saddam" into "Jesus tells him to attack other countries" is now picking nits over 2 terms which imply similar sorts of government and in laypersons terms are interchangable, not to mention having little to do with the thrust of the post itself. I can assure you that i am very familiar with the nomenclature used to identify various forms of government, but in this instance the term was not used to define a government but merely to establish a point. In fact, according to Websters Dictionary, the literal definition of the term, democracy, is:
de·moc·ra·cy n. pl. de·moc·ra·cies
1. Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.
2. A political or social unit that has such a government.
3. The common people, considered as the primary source of political power.
4. Majority rule.
5. The principles of social equality and respect for the individual within a community.

While if you are talking in earnest about a form of government, or comparing different governments, refering to the US as a "democracy" would not be strictly accurate, in this instance I believe the usage is completely justified.

While the average person does not know the difference between a republic or democracy, a political scientist does. As this forum is for something that has a lot to do with politics, it would be improper to use the laypersons' definition. Just because the average person would use two terms that actually mean two different things interchangeably, that does not mean that we should should lower ourselves to their level of mediocrity. Had this been an average discussion though, I would agree with you that it doesn't matter that much.

I am an American.

This thread disturbs me.

Why?

Because of the other americans than have shown how uneducated and how they have proven themselves complete dumbasses.

I would like to formally apologize to the world for all the dumbasses in America, which include, but are not limited to, those who hate France because they have won very little wars and disagree with america, those who created "Freedom Fries", those who think America is the best because we can destroy the world 50 times over, and President Bush.

::is glad he goes to one of the best High Schools in the country::

But creating an America Bashing thread isn't much better. It is a complete load of generalization.


Thank You.

I was thinking the same thing. This is disturbing. And I am planning to applied to work for the state department....if the Bush doesn't get relected. I want to work to improve other countries relatiosn and not destroy it further.

I wouldn't say Europe is perfect, but I can't off the top of my head think of a single thing that really sucks about Europe that doesn't also suck about America.

Obviously there are things that America is better at than Europe, and things that suck about Europe. But I challenge you to think of 1 thing that sucks about Europe that America has found a suitable solution to.

ahhh lets see body odor... it's called bathing and please use some deodorant

Very well said.


And by the way, for others, Vietnam was not a war. It was a conflict. There's a Difference, (like the balkans) Conflict, not war.

war is war...conflict is war... the only difference being that an "offical" war is declared at and recognised by the united nations, a conflict is an "unofical" war, undeclared for expediant public relations political purposes.

Yes, I AM an American. Although I'm glad that I'm not in some 3rd world dictatorship, that doesn't mean that I can't be angry about the state of thigns here.

-"Patriots" who yell at anyone who DARES to point out flaws in their country(whatever happened to FREE SPEECH? You know, one of the oh-so-precious freedoms that these "patriots" boast about?).
-Poor school systems.
-Blindly following leaders.
-Boasting about how they could destroy the world better, erm, how they have a better military & bomb stock than everyone else.
-A president who screws everything up. He caused job losses, ignored warnings about the 9/11 attack, started a war against Iraq for made-up reasons(first the "connection to 9/11", then the "WMD"), caused 4.soemthing TRILLION defict...I could go on and on and on...
-People who are too lazy to actually EXERCISE instead of going on whatever the latest diet fad(which usually hurts more than it helps, if it works at all) is.
-Did I mention people who bash anyone who dares to speak out against America?
-Micheal Jackson
-Lack of knowledge about other countries, other than the ones we're currently invading(and even then we dodn't seem to actually know much)
-Homophobes, racists, religous fanatics, etc...
-Patriot act, and anything else that takes away out CONSTITUTIONALY PROTECTED freedoms.
-The War on Drugs. All the money wasted on it results in very little progress. Just treat the addicted, jailing them has been shown to not help anything.
-A tendancy to use war, not diplomacy to get their way.(the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki is a good example. The Japanese were ready to give up, all we had to do was let them keep their emperor. But NOOO, we had to do things our way and terrorize the people of those 2 cities, and cause them great pain and suffering)
-A government that gives the rich people/corperations just about everything they want. "A tax cut that won't do anythign but give you more money to horde? Sure! Encouragement to move operations to other countries? Why not? Looser enviromental regulations? OK!", etc...
-Hyper conservatives. Just because some people want people to have rights, and for big business to not stomp on the people doesn't mean that someone is a "pinko commie".
-Last but not least, people who despise those who talk about what's wrong with America(in case you couldn't tell, I REALLY REALLY hate those people)

And a bit of Yang for the Yin(or is it the other way around?):What's right about the US:
-We DO have good living conditions compared to most of the world.
-The bill of rights(and the rest of the constitution). It's nice to know that unlike some other coutnries, our government(normally) can't take away our basic rights.
-The fact that, like in the rest of the would, the right(right, as in correct/just, not right, as in right-wing) wins out in the end.
-The fact that the people screwing the US up are the minority(for the most part)
-The safeguards we have in place to prevent the minority from being stomped on by the majority
-French fries :d

It's OK Chansu.... go ahead..... don't hold back..... tell us what you
really think!

Just let me add one more to your list.... politians that win elections before
all the votes are even counted.... It really burns
my cookies!!!!

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
:mad: :headbang: :mp5: :sniper:

-The bill of rights(and the rest of the constitution). It's nice to know that unlike some other coutnries, our government(normally) can't take away our basic rights..... " Unless your name is GEORGE W. BUSH ":gundge: of course.

http://usera.imagecave.com/Kormanthor/ships3.jpg

Damned Electorate College!!!!!

Oh Sorry I guess that was more then one wasn't it :cool: :D

I'm not sure what number we're on...but


#N) Al Gore, for inventing the Internet.

If any of you are americans having you insulting gits we have you so count your self on the list
#N+1) Shitty Education system.

Whats wrong with starbucks.

Their coffee is way too cold. Decent-tasting, but when I want a HOT chocolate I expect it to be hot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Enodscopia
Whats wrong with starbucks.

Their coffee is way too cold. Decent-tasting, but when I want a HOT chocolate I expect it to be hot.

Their to expensive

Wow... 22 pages and over 300 posts about a topic that is entirely subjective. You'd almost think there was a point to all of it...

3) Starbucks.
4) Will Smith.

Dude, baristas at Starbucks make better money than our childcare workers AND have benefits. Plus, they make a mean mocha.

And as for Will Smith: "Parents Just Don't Understand" is the finest hip-hop album EVER. Well, OK, I tell a lie, but it's still awesome.

Im Patriotic, what can i say?

Dude, that's not patriotism.

Look you commie pinko faggots, any one of you that is in another country, we could DESTROY. Lets list the problems with your natoins eh?

Britton:
Lost to America TWICE and we were weaker then them.
Almost tooken over by France...nuff' said

France:
Panzy ass faggots
Genocides own people
Too afraid to get there hands a bit bloody

Germany:
Like France, Panzy ass Faggots
Defeated by the fucking world Twice..

Question: when did how much ass you could kick determine your coolness factor? Back in grade school, I thought the bullies were fucking asshole idiots, not the cool people.

One word: Oprah.

we could utterly destroy any country on earth.

Lol, so true, you bloody well could and you wouldn't hesitate to either. In case you've failed to notice, this is exactly the problem. What with that muderous snake as your President, it's your pathetic 'with us your against us' attitude. What. a. load. of. crap.
Go to hell Bush. :mp5:

coca cola (coffee flavoured water with your sugar?)



*gasp* I agree with most of these things.. but coca cola AND starbucks are the best thing ever! Heh.. *raises hand* caffiene addict here. Anyways.. the rest I agree on.

I'm an american and i'd like to make some additions

- Bush (the man can't even talk right)
- so many friggin fat people
- government owned by corporations
- christian conservative terrorists (see jerry falwell)
- freedom fries (stupidest thing i have ever heard)
- the extreme level of ignorance
- NRA gun nuts
- the elitist attitude
- 51% of the electorate seems to be lacking any basic intelligence

This insults me to my CORE. I personaly dont give a damn of what you forieners think, but this is an Insult to my pride for my country, wich could very easly kick Britton's Ass, Canada's ass, we could utterly destroy any country on earth. We can take the entire damn world on and have a chance of winning.
I hope you don't represent the average American opinion.

God knows what would happen if the world's greatest military power had such an insecurity complex

Reasons to hate America. None. It's an illogical concept. And as usual this crap turns into a Europe V USA bowl of over-ripe shite. The US is far and away the most powerful nation on Earth...........for now. Europe is stumbling toward eventual integration. Right now, the US and EU are roughly equal economically, the EU is striding toward political equality. What the situation will be in fifty years is anyones guess, things happen too quickly these days.......9/11 anyone? Europe and America (and Canada, Aus etc) have an overwhelming amount in common. It is a sad fact that the current administration has managed to widen the Atlantic dramatically. Anyone with more than a few brain cells knows that the worst possible political scenario is that the ocean grows wider. No two 'blocs' have so much in common, so much shared history, so much shared pain and suffering, so much reliance on each other, despite what the American neo-cons and European lefties tell us.
America, you virtually 'invented' globalisation, the onus is on you to focus on strengthening it rather than weaken and damage it, as Senor Bush is doing.
There is no logical reason to 'hate' America and there is no logical reason to 'hate' Europe.

I hope you don't represent the average American opinion.

God knows what would happen if the world's greatest military power had such an insecurity complex

He isn't, and i would hope that all the europians and canadians that have been posting all this Anti American BS don't represent the average Europian. I am presently serving in the US Air Force and I am proud to say that I would Stand with any Freedom loving Europians and Canadians any time. That being said i'm going to try to show where some of this Anti Europian feeling is coming from. In the past we have time and time again answered the call for help coming from Europe. We asked for help for our current war, and not only did we not get support we have recieved nothing but criticism which only strenghtens the terrorist actions and gets more Americans killed. This really feels like betrayal. I have no intentions of belittling the help recieved from our allies that have been supporting the effort in Iraq Many countries are helping, and every bit helps. We apprieciate this help, but Americans are still taking a majority of the casualties as well as bearing the majority of the econmic burden.

I am an American .... I don't hate anyone, regardless where they live. I would like it just fine if we could all live in peace together. I am however very disappointed in our electorial system and the politians who exploit it.... namely one... George W. Bush.
I want everyone to know that nearly 50% of Americans wanted to rid our selves of him as our president. But, somehow he did it again, he got re elected before all the votes were counted. I know, I voted on a provisional ballot, and was told that it wouldn't be counted for at least ten days which would have been Nov. 12th. So here we are on Nov. 3rd and he has been declared the winner again. Why am I angry.... because
my vote and many americans votes were never counted. The electorial
college should be disbanded. I feel as if I have been raped and left by the side of the road to die!

http://usera.imagecave.com/Kormanthor/AbusedDog.jpg

In the past we have time and time again answered the call for help coming from Europe. We asked for help for our current war, and not only did we not get support we have recieved nothing but criticism which only strenghtens the terrorist actions and gets more Americans killed.

Yes there is an element of truth in that but the Euro view (and the fact) is that the US entered WW1 after being attacked, three years into the conflict and only began the fight against Hitler following his insane declaration of war on America, long after France had been defeated and GB and its Imperial and dominian allies had been resisting the Nazis for years. It's also wise to remember that in 1939, Britain and France declared war on a superior military force after it had begun its attack on Europe, whereas America invaded an 'inferior' Iraq premptively. And remember France, Germany and of course GB waded in with the US in the first Gulf war and in Afghanistan.

Question: when did how much ass you could kick determine your coolness factor? Back in grade school, I thought the bullies were fucking asshole idiots, not the cool people.
Yeah, and how is that list possible? I mean, the French commit genocide against their own people AND they're afraid to get their hands a bit bloody? I'm sure something is very wrong.

MAN I WANT TO MOVE TO THE GREATEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD WERE I KNOW HOW TO SPEAK THEIR LANGUAGE!THE U.K. of course.Man the U.S. is going down the shithole just like the Romans did.Stupid Bush you screwed up our empire!

well not just bush.I could name many more.

China is going to take the U.S.'s place

much angsty anti-americanism wenches ye be.

story of America:
2004-2034=la di da la di da spendin' on oil investin' in oil don't give a crap about nethin' but OILLLLLLLL!YEEE HAWWW
2035-2045=Oh crap oh crap!Oils bitin' me in the back.Oh no he comes another Al-Qaedia attack.Oh crap were done and now our story is doneeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

what China is!

and Rap music
:headbang: SO many things I want to scream at you for
37.)Pigs

The US won't be that concerned with oil for 30 more years.

1) The US now essentially controls Iraq,
2) With a Republic majority in legislative and executive branch, there will probably be a war in Iraq soon (Why do you think the Osama video was released? So they can say he was in Iran),
3) Technology. Just because the government doesn't promote and sponsor the research of alternative fuel sources, doesn't mean the research does not exist. I'm going to school to go into this industry.

Do you realy need a reason to make a statement about America? Because, The Empire of Presidency gives its citizens that very thing when the President feels like it.

Because there were three good candidates for President and the people voted in their favourite.

A lot of people are getting very angry about that, so democracy must be very uncool!

btw did you pick 37 for the Kevin Smith thing?

Because there were three good candidates for President and the people voted in their favourite.

A lot of people are getting very angry about that, so democracy must be very uncool!


Democracy is Great..... George Bush's idea of democracy is uncool

In all things moderation..... I've had more of George Bush then I can stand!!

Because there were three good candidates for President and the people voted in their favourite.

A lot of people are getting very angry about that, so democracy must be very uncool!

You mean the Libertarian, Green, and Constitutional party candidates?

Greed Sucks

ahhhh, poor babies, hahahahahhahahahahahahahahaha, Mock America all you want, yeah, it's currupt and crappy, but it's still better than the pieces of crap you call countries, MUHAHAHAHAHA

I hate the US government.
major bones to pick w/ my gov:
War on Terror
USA PATRIOT act
Homeland Security

<-bush over there me over here-> :sniper:
game over

I supported all the forigen countrys out there in the world until I read this thread. I still do, and there are some issues I agree with you on (W. Bush) but by insulting the country as a whole, you have injured my pride, my honor, and my soul.

Remind me never to support your countrys in any of my arguments ever again.

This insults me to my CORE. I personaly dont give a damn of what you forieners think, but this is an Insult to my pride for my country, wich could very easly kick Britton's Ass, Canada's ass, we could utterly destroy any country on earth. We can take the entire damn world on and have a chance of winning.

I'm an American, and your comments are exactly why I may leave the country I love for good. While I don't agree that all rap music or Will Smith is bad, I can't argue with Dr. Phil, Martin Lawrence, Dr. Laura, or McDonald's. Most importantly, I can look at the good and the bad things about my country and THINK. Americans are becoming increasingly unable to do that. That is the worst thing about my country.

If America decides to take on the world (and it looks like they are trying to these days) America will lose. America is losing already. We can barely read, we knwo virtually nothing about the rest of the world, and many of us, yourself included, keep talking about "foreigners" as we become more and more isolated and uninformed. This is DUMB. We need to admit as Americans that we are dumb, and do something about it. We've got all these great resources and idiots in charge of them. I love my country, but I also can accept what's wrong with it. "Kicking ass" is outdated and unproductive. Grow up and stop acting like the bullies of the block and be a better example.


Geez.
How embarassing.

For your informatoin, dureing the War of 1812, we DID try to take over Canada. We have never lost a war, NEVER.

We lost in 'nam.
That was the modern us army against a rag tag group of rebels. they did not even have an air force, and they still beat us.

Yes there is an element of truth in that but the Euro view (and the fact) is that the US entered WW1 after being attacked, three years into the conflict and only began the fight against Hitler following his insane declaration of war on America, long after France had been defeated and GB and its Imperial and dominian allies had been resisting the Nazis for years. It's also wise to remember that in 1939, Britain and France declared war on a superior military force after it had begun its attack on Europe, whereas America invaded an 'inferior' Iraq premptively. And remember France, Germany and of course GB waded in with the US in the first Gulf war and in Afghanistan.

Yes your are right in ww1 we were late. We were late, but we came. We helped end it and save many lifes at the cost of over 50,000 lives as well as the money we lent to the allies to fight which was never paid back. Then in WW2 while not in direct conflict we supported GB with Destroyers, volunteer pilots, and merchant ships. After the war we helped rebuil Europe and stood with you against the USSR. We worked together for our very survial. We created a bond that would serve both Europe and the US well in The first Gulf War and places like Kosovo. We need to maintain this bond. The US is not the superpower that it once was. Most americans know this.

I disagree with bush's decsision to go into Iraq as quickly as he did. He rushed it for no reason. But i also don't think can just wait around. The nature of war has changed. With one weapon being able to destroy whole cities you can't afford to be wrong. But as it is the US is spread too thin. We don't have the troops to rotate out units in the frontline, and we don't have the recruitment to replace soldiers when their time of service ends. The reasons bush used to go into Iraq weren't justified, but that doesn't mean going into Iraq is a bad thing. We have the oppertunity to give an opressed people freedom. I believe that is a cause worth fighting and dying for. Iraq can be built up, but our chances with out the help of the world are very slim. Europe has 2 choices they can sit back and watch us fail dooming thousands of innocent lives as well as putting the Iraqi people into the hands of who ever could fill the power gap quickest, or the could step up like allies chip in and give these people a future.

We lost in 'nam.
That was the modern us army against a rag tag group of rebels. they did not even have an air force, and they still beat us.

Yeah...those Migs were all imagined...

This insults me to my CORE. I personaly dont give a damn of what you forieners think, but this is an Insult to my pride for my country, wich could very easly kick Britton's Ass, Canada's ass, we could utterly destroy any country on earth. We can take the entire damn world on and have a chance of winning.
I was just rolling through here and wasn't going to say squat until I came to your post, and since you insulted my pride, I will add this to the thread:

- arrogant Americans who think they are invincible

BTW, the only way you could take on the whole world would be by use of nuclear weapons?

I was just rolling through here and wasn't going to say squat until I came to your post, and since you insulted my pride, I will add this to the thread:

- arrogant Americans who think they are invincible

BTW, the only way you could take on the whole world would be by use of nuclear weapons?

Hey do you mind. I'm an american and i think his comment was stupid. So if you would address him as an indivdual i would appreciate it. Thanks.

I was just rolling through here and wasn't going to say squat until I came to your post, and since you insulted my pride, I will add this to the thread:

- arrogant Americans who think they are invincible

BTW, the only way you could take on the whole world would be by use of nuclear weapons?

I think Mesazoic is really from the planet Krikkit.

Just about 100% of these things are the fault of maybe 100 or so people really. Give or take a couple hundred thousand of course.

Hey do you mind. I'm an american and i think his comment was stupid. So if you would address him as an indivdual i would appreciate it. Thanks.
I did address him as an individual unless you think America is invincible too?

BTW, he did take a pot shot at my country or else I would not have posted in the first place.

I think Mesazoic is really from the planet Krikkit.
Well he certainly isn't grounded in earthly realities. :eek: