NationStates Jolt Archive

The other thread got a bit messy so I start a new one here. Please make your OOC -statement and deployments in here so we can keep the OOC crap to a minimum in the other thread. If you want to discuss tech i refer you to the old thread. May it rest in peace.

If you think i've forgot something important please TG me and I'll fill it in here.


Here, the OOC thread for the Eurusea-Syskeyia war thread.

Also, Pantocratoria, your ships are being escorted by Expeditionary Strike Groups [ESGs]. There basically like the ESGs that the US Navy has, but for this mission they're leaving the LPDs and LSDs as home. (Insert stupid drug jokes here. ) The Wasp-class amphibious assault ships are each carrying 20 F-35B JSFs and 6 ASW compound helicopters. (I think I mentioned it on the other thread).

St. Peter Claver Island itself has 5 corps of Army soldiers, meaning that there are 15 mechanized infantry divisions and 10 armored divisions on the island. No to mention the provincial Air Defense Division, and the elite 38th Airborne Division, forward deployed to the island but now in a defensive role due to, well, you know.

On another note, the island's civilians are evacuating. Women and children first, then the men (those who have not chosen to stay behind, of course.) And the governor has declared of emergency



I skipped the part with EMP missiles since it seems that was Retconned, if it wasn’t please tell me and I’ll put it in again.


OOC: Deployment

2 Carriergroups each consisting of:

1 Carrier Jehovah-Class
2 Carriers Matthew-Class
3 Battleships Vengeance-Class
8 Anti-ballistic ships
16 destroyers
6 Cruisers
6 submarines
18 Transports (Hovercraft)
4 Supply ships

And folks, I'm not heading for St. Claver anymore, heading for South west of the gulf of Syskeyia. Consider parts of Gulf of Syskeyia mined and dangerous to travel through. (AS you can see in my posts) I also has agreed about this with Sysk in private TG.



Look, I don't know half of what the hell's going on, but I do know that I positioned the Chimaean First Fleet, that's a whole crapload of ships and so forth, somewhere off Syskeyia on joint exercises. Yet everyone's ignored that. Thanks... but I guess it's fair enough 'cause I haven't been on the forums a lot

So I have two choices; continue from where I am or just pretend Chimaea was never involved.

I'd chose the former but you guys have absolutely lost me in the fine machinations of your bitchfest.

I'd chose the latter but I don't wanna leave Syskeyia in the lurch.

I have no idea with all this Island stuff... The Reich forces seem to have blockaded it (or blockaded something) even though my forces are already in the vicinity but what the hell o.O

This RP is rapidly starting to get boring. And Syskeyia, in this day and age of NS most nations probably would have EMP shielding; I know I do ever since I was attacked with EMPs over Amerigo and in the Clock Hill war.


edit: sorry, my question is: what is it you want me to do in the confines of the story?



I hope this thread will facilitate things for us. I think we made a mistake and forgot about you. Sorry =)


Chimaea, my excuses for forgetting about you. Don't exactly know where in the gulf you were situated. But it's only me and a few Eurusean floating fortresses left there, it was meant to be a decoy, and as such it apparantly worked.

My two carrier groups are right now outside Bendicilim and the Gulf is full of mines. You may either sweep the mines or try to go around them. Whatever you choose to do, it will take you some time, and give me time to do what I came for. I'm not exactly sure where the other guys are. But so far Chimaea, Syskeyia and Pantacrotia is on one side, dunno about that black wolf guy. And Eurusea, EC, Abatoir, me and some more on the other side. Where I have no prescence in vicinity of St. Claver Peter Island.

The other thread got a bit messy so I start a new one here. Please make your OOC -statement and deployments in here so we can keep the OOC crap to a minimum in the other thread.

Sounds fair to me.

I skipped the part with EMP missiles since it seems that was Retconned, if it wasn’t please tell me and I’ll put it in again.I'm operating under the same assumption.

Here's my forces, all pretty standard, assume modern / near-future tech for the ships and aircraft. Naval stuff isn't exactly my forte, but it isn't exactly Abatoir's either. Being future-tech, underwater, this is about the extent of their surface navy.

2 Carrier groups each consisting of:

1 Carrier, NIMITZ-class
8 Anti-ballistic ships
16 destroyers
6 Cruisers
6 submarines
Misc supply, ammo, hospital, and landing ships.

Both carriers launched three wings, for a total of six wings, bombers and fighter escort.

The jets have longer than standard ranges, which places the ships further out than normal from St. Peter Claver isle. To be perfectly honest, I'd completely forgotten about Chimea's fleet. Perhaps, Chimea's fleets were doing operations and the fleets formed around them, effectively blocking the Chimean fleet as well as the Syskeyian fleet.

However, that's something more for the Reich. I'm just a random evil nation who's been bribed into bombing the hell out of some island. I'm not into the whole "will of gawd" bit.

Excellent, would never cross my mind to question the motives of a nation that has come to fight the enemies of the true faith ;-) Keep up the good work and do your deployment here. we might just BUMP into eachother somewhere near Sykeyia

we might just BUMP into eachother somewhere near Sykeyia

As long as you don't bump into me, we're all good, heh.

Just stay on my good side Hack, just stay on my good side. (another shameful bump)

Just to address this once and for all:

Now, for onbe thing, I launched almost 2,000 EMP cruise missiles at the Eurusean-Reich fleet. One thousand, nine hundred and twenty to be exact. Personally, I think that would have taken out a considerable amount, if not the whole of, the Eurusean-Reich fleet.

Now, aside from the fact that 1,920 missiles fired from 250 B-52s is either a non-total discharge or each bomber is carrying 7.68 missiles, there's numerous problems with this launch:

1. Firstly, it destroys your 'good guy' claim completely. You have so far issued no ultimatum to the Eurusean fleet or even attempted to communicate that you don't want them there. Now, my copy of the Good Guy playbook might not be the same as yours, but I always thought the good guys exhausted every other option before resorting to killing people.

2. Second, it makes no sense. Your only justification for this war, since you ignored the terrorist attack, is a public TV broadcast which has been stated to be fictional by the Eurusean government. To call that a flimsy justification for firing on a fleet which had made no hostile action is near-criminal understatement.

3. Third, since it's unjustified, it would look incredibly bad to your allies, especially given the recent rather erratic behaviour of the Syskeyian government elsewhere regarding issuing a death sentence against a foreign citizen without trial and then rescinding it almost immediately. Couple that to firing on a fleet which has made no hostile action without even issuing them an ultimatum and you'd be lucky if you had any allies left afterwards.

4. Fourth, it's basically a Deus Ex Machina resolution to a tense situation, and I never have liked those.

If you STILL want to fire, add this in afterwards:

Floating Fortress Alternate

General Kyznetsov blinked as she looked at the radar readout, 'Dear God, those Imperialist bastards have opened fire? Confirm this!'

A man at the radio shouted over, 'Ritardando confirms, comrade-General! Missiles in the air and headed for our position!'

Kyznetsov sat in her chair as blast screens covered every exposed hatch and window on Alternate, 'I want a Defence Bomb ready to launch as soon as those missiles enter our effective intercept range!'

The crew acted as they had been trained to, moving to stations as klaxons sounded across the fleet, submarines quickly submerging.

Moments later, a single missile climbed into the sky over Alternate's stern and sped out to sea. As it reached the centre of the swarm of Syskeyian missiles it detonated, the fireball briefly glowing hotter than the sun as it spread, condensation soon forming a spectacular dome of water that spread for a while before falling back into the sea.

Kyznetsov smiled, 'Now, get me Foreign Affairs!'

Eurusean Office of Foreign Affairs

Sergei read the report blearily, still wearing his nightgown and striped pyjamas, fumbling for a cigarette and typing slowly, 'Wish they wouldn't get me up in the middle of the fucking night...' he mumbled.

'Eurusea condemns the appalling imperialism displayed today by Syskeyia in firing on peaceful Eurusean vessels without warning. We will not stand for this kind of foul aggression against our nation, and we know that the other glorious nations of The Reich stand with us in solidarity on this matter. We demand that your nation formally condemns Syskeyia for this attempted act of piracy and barbarity on our vessels, and stand by us in our battle to bring the evil government who ordered this crime to justice.

Comrades, justice must be served.

~Sergei Alexiev, International Affairs, on behalf of Comrade-Premier Kurchatov.

He nudged one of the men walking past his office doorway, 'Comrade, to be sent to the Chimaean and Pantocratorian governments immediately.'

Look, I don't know half of what the hell's going on, but I do know that I positioned the Chimaean First Fleet, that's a whole crapload of ships and so forth, somewhere off Syskeyia on joint exercises. Yet everyone's ignored that. Thanks... but I guess it's fair enough 'cause I haven't been on the forums a lot

Basically, the Eurusean fleet near Syskeyia turned around and left while another Eurusean fleet moved on St. Peter Claver Island, a Syskeyian colony in the South Pacific [whereas Syskeyia is Southeast Asia, or Thailand to be more precise]. There's now a Veganian fleet moving on Syskeyia again, however.

As far as what's there, Eurusean Floating Fortress standard battlegroup consists of:

1 Floating Fortress
4 AEGIS Platforms
2 Carriers [one a 'true' carrier, the other a flat top barge]
5 Battleships
2 Battlecruisers
4 [i]Prometheus Class Gunships
22 Destroyers
2 Kraken-type Artillery Submarines
16 Submarines [2 SSBNs included]
1 Overlord Ironclad Airship
1 Arsenal Ship

For a total of around six hundred Eurusean combatants present at the Island.

Seems like he still wants to do that Eurusea. Could you move your IC-post to the IC thread?

OOC: I never retconned the so-called "missilewank" attack. I merely changed the "they would reach the targets thing" to a thought of the commanders. The missiles were fired, and I won't respond to your "attacks" until you acknowledge my EMP attack.

The attack is now written as this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by me
What followed was a sight to behold, if anyone could behold it. Over two hundred B-52s, arranged according to squadron and in battle spread formation, launched one thousand, nine hundred twenty EMP cruise missiles at the huge Eurusean-Reich fleet.
The missiles would reach their targets, no matter what, the commander thought.



Oh, and the first post of mine in this thread was made on the day I knew of the thread.

God bless,

The Republic of Syskeyia

Just to address this once and for all:

Now, aside from the fact that 1,920 missiles fired from 250 B-52s is either a non-total discharge or each bomber is carrying 7.68 missiles

A B-52 can carry up to eight cruise missiles. 8 missiles per B-52 x 24 B-52s per squadron x 10 B-52 squadrons = 1,920 missiles.


1. Firstly, it destroys your 'good guy' claim completely. You have so far issued no ultimatum to the Eurusean fleet or even attempted to communicate that you don't want them there. Now, my copy of the Good Guy playbook might not be the same as yours, but I always thought the good guys exhausted every other option before resorting to killing people.

2. Second, it makes no sense. Your only justification for this war, since you ignored the terrorist attack, is a public TV broadcast which has been stated to be fictional by the Eurusean government. To call that a flimsy justification for firing on a fleet which had made no hostile action is near-criminal understatement.

Hmmm, and if an abnormally large fleet was detected near your[/i[] waters, wouldn't you be suspicious.

Also, the broadcast was real, the foreign affairs government is lying, and we know it. C'mon, you're an evil Reich-loving psuedo-Christian nation, any anybody with an once of sense knows that those types of governments cannot be trusted to tell the truth. So there. :P

3. Third, since it's unjustified, it would look incredibly bad to your allies, especially given the recent rather erratic behaviour of the Syskeyian government elsewhere regarding issuing a death sentence against a foreign citizen without trial and then rescinding it almost immediately. Couple that to firing on a fleet which has made no hostile action without even issuing them an ultimatum and you'd be lucky if you had any allies left afterwards.[/quote]



4. Fourth, it's basically a Deus Ex Machina resolution to a tense situation, and I never [i]have liked those.

Well, how about we just say that the EMP attack basically neturalized enough fortresses so that the Eurusea/Reich forces are equal to those of Syskeyia/Chimaea/Pantocratoria. I hate this OMG W3 8R3 G01NG T0 T8K3 UR 15L8ND this that seems to be going around.

How about the St. Peter Claver Island situation be a kind of Bastogne-type thing. You know, the Syskeyians fight to the limits, take a severe toll, but ultimately prevail.

Basically, the Eurusean fleet near Syskeyia turned around and left while another Eurusean fleet moved on St. Peter Claver Island, a Syskeyian colony in the South Pacific [whereas Syskeyia is Southeast Asia, or Thailand to be more precise].

Just a clarification- Syskeyia is not Thailand. It is "somewhere in Southeast Asia," but I'm not claiming the RL Thailand as my own or anything. Nevertheless, there are significant Thai influences on Syskeyia (most notably in architecture)

There's now a Veganian fleet moving on Syskeyia again, however.

Yes, the Vegana situation. They're going to take Benedicitia (my southernmost major port on the Sykeyian mainland), do some atrocities, burninating, etc., and then I throw them back into the sea.

So the "evil bad guy atrocities" quotient will be taken up in that theater of operations. ;)

As for fleet locations, I've always thought that the E/R fleet would be approaching the island from the west, and the Chimaean-Syskeyian fleets are in between the Bad Guys and the island.

I'd write an IC post today, but I don't have the energy for it.

God bless,

The Republic of Syskeyia

Hmmm, and if an abnormally large fleet was detected near your waters, wouldn't you be suspicious.

Suspicious, yes. Aggressive without warning while claiming to be the good guy? No. Talk before fighting, that's your prerogative if you want to be the good guy. If you don't, you're not.


Also, the broadcast was real, the foreign affairs government is lying, and we know it.

No, you don't. You suspect it's real, but you haven't tried any way of confirming it before jumping into your B-52s and declaring war based on what might be a TV show for all you know. Oh wait, you didn't declare war either.

Well, how about we just say that the EMP attack basically neturalized enough fortresses so that the Eurusea/Reich forces are equal to those of Syskeyia/Chimaea/Pantocratoria. I hate this OMG W3 8R3 G01NG T0 T8K3 UR 15L8ND this that seems to be going around.

That involves enough cruise missiles flying through the Defence Bomb explosion to sink 450 vessels in the Eurusean fleet alone, and even then, numerical parity isn't going to mean equal fighting capacity. This is not a battle between two sets of numbers, and I'm not using my fleet at it's full capability anyway. Didn't you notice how my attack on the island was only launched from two ships instead of all six hundred?

The missiles that survived the Defence Bomb would at very best have disabled one or two vessels assuming rather heavy-handedly that any of them would be undamaged enough to finish their flight runs and survive various high-energy laser point defence and heavy flak. You would have committed political suicide in the process and given Eurusea every justification it ever needed to take St Peter Claver Island and even have a reasonable claim to be the good guy in this whole affair. You actually already did that some time ago, but that'll come out only if Syskeyia ever bothers with that whole diplomacy thing.

How about the St. Peter Claver Island situation be a kind of Bastogne-type thing. You know, the Syskeyians fight to the limits, take a severe toll, but ultimately prevail.

It seems more like a Wake Island / Iwo Jima [for the Japanese] thing to me, where one side fights to the limits, takes a severe toll, but ultimately doesn't prevail. In war you sometimes lose even though you fight your very hardest, that's just the way things are.

I've always thought that the E/R fleet would be approaching the island from the west, and the Chimaean-Syskeyian fleets are in between the Bad Guys and the island.

They can't be between the first Eurusean fleet and Syskeyia AND the second and St Peter Claver, that's a somewhat logic-defying formation.

C'mon Lads! can you respect my statement that this is a bitchin free thread?

The discussion about the whereabouts of the fleets definitely is valid here. The discussion about who is good or who is bad and how certain actions is bad should be in the bitch thread. Lets just play along with the action, go with the flow. If someone makes a mistake, lets IC play that out. Not kick ass in this thread.

I see excellent propaganda possibilities for Eurusea due to that attack, and Sysk has to take that. I also made an agreement with Sysk for Bene.. (I never remember the correct name) but that doesn't mean that The rest of the guys has to do that. Its between me and Sysk.

So keep this thread decently bitchfree. Please

Me as a nation doesn't understand jack of this. LET EAT SOME TASTY BERRIES!

Sheesh. So, Eurusea, you...

1) Broadcast an anti-Syskeyian propoganda speech to your entire nation and then claim it was just some fictional nothing*

2) Launch 100+ ships into the Gulf of Syskeyia, claiming to have a "peaceful exercise"
2a) Send a 600-ship fleet to St. Peter Claver Island, the fleet in the Gulf. Now, um, for what reason would a government send hundreds of warships into alien waters (last time I recall, you have no friends nor interests in Southeast Asia [i]or the South Pacific) other than invasion? I mean, 600 warships? Not even the NS maritime powers like Ruhr and Iansisle would send that many warships into one place. It's a frickin' invasion, and anyone who cab add 2+2 can see that.

Then, when I launch a valid attack (and a large one at that), you 3)claim to blow up all my missiles so all your ships in your OMG UB3RL33T K1LL1N6 FL33T can emerge unscathed.

You want to play that way, fine. The B-52 tail gunners shot down every single one of the Hand of Lenin's missiles, your artillery shots did little if any damage, and my forces will repel anything you send against me. :P

God bless,

The Republic of Syskeyia

*Even if it was, the fact that the state controls everything and the fact that we knew the message was from Eurusea- well, we knew that the "kill Syskeyia" message had state support- it's not like some lunatic on channel 486 played or anything like that.

Okay, let's calm down here. The last OOC thread was locked for pointless bitching and going way off topic. This is Vegana's thread, let's respect his wishes, okay? Now then, as someone involved in the thread, but not in the war, let's take a look at what we've got going on here:

The "death to Syskeyia" stuff was "on cinema screens and from propaganda speakers around the nation." Technically, unless you have HUMINT (spies) inside Eurusea, you'd have no way of knowing about that propaganda. However, it seems that Eurusea's letting that slide, but do keep it in mind.
Propaganda, by its very nature, is incindiary. Iran's been preaching that America is the "white Devil" and that Americans should die for around 20 years now. No invation (yet).
"Peaceful exercises" off the coast of a nation that you hate isn't terribly new, really. However, Eurusea was in international waters...
"Good guys" vs. "Bad guys". Um, no. This isn't some Columbia Serial. To base your entire view of war on NS as being good vs. evil is insane. Sometimes, the "good guys" don't win. Furthermore, you're forcing things into a very basic, some might say childish, black and white paradigm. These are complex nations with complex motivations. While "we're the good guys" is perfectly acceptable in character it quickly grows tiring out of character.
Tail gunners shooting incoming missiles?
Currently, from where I'm sitting, Syskeyia is horribly outnumbered. Eurusea has around 600 ships puttering about in various areas, Vegana, Endless Crimes, God's Own, North Star, and Abatoir all have a couple carrier groups each mucking about in the general area. Syskeyia is currently fielding 10 squadrons of bombers.

Now, let's all calm down a touch. Syskeyia, I'm getting the feeling that you'd much rather be doing someone else. If you don't want to be involved in this war, don't be. "[M]y forces will repel anything you send against me," is pure godmoddery, and you know it, regardless of what cute little emoticons you add.

I hate this OMG W3 8R3 G01NG T0 T8K3 UR 15L8ND this that seems to be going around.



Wha... I think I agree with you. Though it could quite easily be the other way around.

Then, when I launch a valid attack (and a large one at that), you 3)claim to blow up all my missiles so all your ships in your OMG UB3RL33T K1LL1N6 FL33T can emerge unscathed.

How many times do I have to tell you the attack isn't valid because you haven't attempted to tell the Eurusean fleet you don't want it there or declared war?

You want to play that way, fine. The B-52 tail gunners shot down every single one of the Hand of Lenin's missiles, your artillery shots did little if any damage, and my forces will repel anything you send against me. :P

I told you repeatedly that the fleet had anti-missilespam systems, and there's no way cruise missiles can survive a nuclear detonation. That is not the same as any of those claims and you know it. Stop being childish and waving your OMG WEPPENZ around and try talking to the damn fleet.

Exactly, Now on the other hand No Reich army has ever needed a valid reason to attack. Ohh.. All your anger make this soooo complicated. I remember the good ole days when men were men and sheep were nervous.

Now, Since I am outside that St. Claver stuff and wants to purify Bendici.. (DAMN!) Could you get on with that. waiting fo an reaction.

I'll be posting soon. I'm evacuating the forces from the island, hopefully to a friendly port (one of WA's ports, I think.) I'll be posting once I get a response from WA. Then I'll use those units in the "cavalry" that eventually liberates Bendecitia from Veganan hands. Sort of a "poetic justice"/turnabout/irony thing.

The southernmost major port, which Vegana will attack is Bendecitia. Just so Vegana remembers the name: Ben-de-ci-ti-a. From the Middle English workd bendecite which is in turn from the Latin benedictus. Possible nominal relation to the name of St. Benedict.

Must be getting to work soon.

God bless,

The Republic of Syskeyia

I'd really like to be involved in this RP (especially if it settles down a bit as the signs of OOC cooperation in this thread are beginning to suggest it might), and I have posted several times IC in the RP thread. As of yet, I've been ignored by basically everyone. I'm Syskeyia's ally, and I'm going to assist in Syskeyia's defence, so it would be nice if every so often, somebody would read my posts.

Thanks to Vegana for posting this second thread, and for the telegrams which reassured me that I do in fact exist, but I'd really appreciate it if Eurusea in particular could reply to Pantocratoria's diplomatic overtures, especially since OOC Eurusea has been complaining about a lack of diplomacy on the part of Syskeyia.

What I'd like is for Syskeyia to retcon the missile launches so I can retcon opening fire and get down to some actual diplomacy. Unfortunately, while the commander of the Eurusean fleet in that area, General Kyznetsov, isn't a particularly unreasonable person, relatively speaking, she's not inclined to discuss peacefully while people are shooting at her. I'd like to get to talking too, Pantocratoria, but I just couldn't see a sensible way for Comrade Nicole or the General to react to that message.

I'd prefer it to remain shooting-free for a while, since negotiations breaking down is far more fun to RP than playground shouting of 'I got you' / 'No you didn't' ad infinitum.

So, if I get a retcon of the Syskeyian missile launch I'll do likewise with the fleet and the Hand of Lenin opening fire, and we can try [and duly fail] to settle this diplomatically first.

Status of things right now, I imagine, is that the Endless Crimes and North Star fleets are still on their way, the Veganian fleet has just turned back to Syskeyia again, the Pantocratorians are about to arrive at the island, and at the island nobody has fired or been evacuated. The Leviathan is probably lurking around somewhere in the middle of the ocean, insofar as it's capable of doing so.

Ok, now for the rest and my suggestion for the outcome of this, following the rather inevitable breakdown of negotiations: rather than Syskeyia defending the island from the Eurusean / Reich fleet [which, at something like a ten to one numerical disadvantage by the time North Star arrives, is probably completely impossible] Eurusea takes the island after a brave but doomed defence by the Syskeyian defenders.

HOWEVER:

Since most likely the island's docks would have been ruined either by the attacking fleet or the defenders [on purpose], most of the Reich fleet has to leave almost immediately* after dropping off a taskforce to secure [and OPPRESS!, obviously] the island, leaving only a small naval force to hold on. At this point, some kind of allied Pantocratorian / Chimaean / Syskeyian force can try it's hand at a suitably messy liberation of the island. After all, just because I manage to capture the island doesn't mean I can hold on to it forever, does it?

Opinions, so we can carry on?

*Apart from anything else, there's no reason in the world Syskeyian harbours would be dredged deep enough for Floating Fortresses.

...hmmm, sounds like a good idea. Though if negotiations break down, I'd probably start evacuating- civilians first, with the military performing a defensive maneuver to protect the noncombatants as they are evacuated to the planes, boats, etc.

I'll just retcon the 38th Ariborne being there at the time (I don't want to see that unit wiped out, as there are some characters there I'd like to keep). Not like they were really needed there since I nixed military intervention into Panama (WA knows what I'm talking about.)

Anyway, shall we do a heavy retcon of posts, or start over fresh?

God bless,

The Republic of Syskeyia

Just looked at the Reich map. Eurusea, are you still bordering Objectivist Insurgents? I know the map needs and update, but that's up to Nitemere.

I was gonna post this big speech Gen. Dievecha says to his men before the battle begins, but I lost my mental "jolt" right now. No pun intended. I was gonna post it here first because I'm not sure exactly who he would give it to- the corps commanders, the division commanders, probably not all the troops, though. I dunno. What do you think?

I'll be posting using this account right now, as I'm close to 1000 posts as Syskeyia and I'd like my 1000th post to be special. (Note to self: need to adjust Sys Mars specs.) Anyway, I mentioned that I want to Gen. Divecha(sp?) to give a moving speech about the strategy he intends to use.

Basically, the plan is to evacuate as many civilians as possible from the island, and the soldiers will fight to the death until all the civilians that can be evacuated are evacuated. What remains of my navy will then escort the ships carrying refugees (though I also plan to evacuate by air) to one of Western Asia's ports (Guam, Wake Island, or another one whose name escapes me at this moment).

I'm think this storyline could have a very good "reversal of fortune" so to speak. The war starts, and it goes badly. Vegana has taken the city of Bendecitia, Reich warplanes control the skies above southern Syskeyia, a quarter of a million Syskeyian troops died helping civilians evacuate from St. Peter Claver island, the island is now in Eurusean hands and a large number of refugees are now in (and island).

Then, the tide turns. New air force technology helps Syskeyia take back her home skies. A task force made up of some of the best units in the Syskeyian Army then drives south to retake Bendecitia, defeating the Reich and driving the occupiers into the sea. Finally, in invasion fleet is assembled, and St. Peter Claver Island is retaken, and the war is over.

This will help me include some technology updates for my military that I've been thinking about- namely giving the Future Warrior's body armor (http://www.defensetech.org/archives/000929.html) (just the armor- nothing else) to equipping my F-16s with thrust vectoring (it can be done on a single-engine jets- just look at the X-31 (http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/Newsroom/FactSheets/FS-009-DFRC.html).) Also, I might be buying some 120mm LAHAT missiles from WA, and the destruction of my carriers might give me reason to buy some trimaran carriers from WA. :)

And the whole dramatic shift would be better if it happened once Sukothai returned to Syskeyia.

God bless,

The Republic of Syskeyia

I can only speak for Bendecitia, and the outline you make is what we agreed about. Just give us time to do some RP in the city, you might be able to pick up some good resistance there as well. My fleet is not big enough to hold bendecitia against your aarmy anyway. St. Peter Claver island is another story, and that is for Eurusea to decide

Blarg, been a bit busy recently hence the lack of posting from Eurusea, and didn't think it was worth switching accounts yet, so here goes:

I don't really see Eurusea being part of The Reich continent as such, more close to it and allied with it that way, so the old map isn't really that accurate anymore.

I doubt all the civilians will make it off the Island in time, since some will stay behind anyway and there just won't be time for that kind of operation. I'd say half or so, being generous.

The most dangerous unit Eurusea is deploying to St. Peter is the 75,000-ton Ground Battleship [i]Doramascher, a semimobile super heavy artillery platform which will make any immediate landing on the island by Syskeyian forces hazardous to say the least. The best way to act against her is attack her with a ground special forces team before any main landing, as she's not exactly lacking when it comes to anti-air or point defence, and her main guns [22-in in a high-angle full-traverse mount and eight 16-in guns in double turrets] are extremely dangerous against shipping but vulnerable around the pivots. She's a tough little bugger, but nobody said this would be no challenge at all, ne?

Hehe, I need some more participation in the invasion thread. I want closure on the invasion so I can start a diary over what will happen in the town until I'm flushed out from there. I've written some pretty disturbing posts I want to start putting in there. Oh the Joy of a Good Pogrom in the name of Christ!

Still, the artillery rained down on the city, blowing holes in house, church, and barracks alike. No discrimination did the shells know as they smashed the provincial capital, dotting the white plaza of the city's Forum with hundreds, if not thousands of black-brown artillery holes.


Don't forget about the artificial Prions. For those who doesn't know what that is I have only one thing to say. Creutzfeld Jacob syndrom. The prions are supposed to affect the people but the ones affected are not contagious. But it will create some interesting effects with a accelerated mad cow disease among the people, might also create some scare since it is hard to know if it IS contagious or not until thouroughly checked. More a chem attack than a bio attack, we're there to save the souls ;-)


[OOC: I'm assuming that you have "regular" (i.e. non-convict) officers in you're battalions, pointing pistols at the convicts' head to ensure they fight- I think that's what the Nazis did.].

Nope, no officers for the penal battalions. We use dog collars instead, think wedlock, with chemicals inside. Every squad is briefed of their objectives before they are sent to their death. Usually simple objectives such as "Destroy the tower" or "take that hill". The collars are set on a specific time and if they are not disarmed after that set time the dog soldier dies. This keeps them from running away and staying close to their objectives once they are accomplished. Sometimes the disarmament squad doesn't make it there in time, and they wont search for you. *Shrugs*

It could have been a surveillance officer you shot, there probably would be some unlucky few of them there.

bump

Well, the St. Peter Claver front has started. I'll post the defense soon, but I'd prefer it if the attackers stopped posting for a bit. You see, I have this speech in my mind that Gen. Divecha(sp?) gives to the division commanders right before the battle starts. I don't have the exact working, but he sort of outlines his strategy- to evacuate as many civilians as possible, or die trying. Bascially, he'll talk about how defending the innocent etc. is what soldiers are all about, how it is the essence of what they do and so on. Real noble, heroic stuff. Might bring a tear to your eye. Problem is I haven't been able to put it all together. But I will. Maybe today, maybe tomorrow, at least by Saturday.

Well, got to go now.

God bless,

The Republic of Syskeyia

[OOC: Aargh! The thing ate my post! Anyway, here's what happens in response: The B-52s launch their EMP missiles at the fleet and then head for Syskeyia. Meanwhile, the antiship missile crews pick their targets and ready themselves. If the Euruseans attack the EMP missiles with a Defense Bomb, the island crews will wait until the blast is no longer destructive, but still blinding. Then, they fire their missiles at the fleet.

Also, the fleet assumes a defensive position around the refugees, and will wait until as many refugees as possible are onto boats. Then, they'll leave.

Not to mention the fact that two F-14 squadrons and one F/A-18 squadron are flying out to engage the Iron Casket.]

OK. So the war is underway. Just saying that St. Peter Claver Island is defended by MTHEL systems. They should be effective against some of the missiles and possibly shells (I think WA referred to MTHEL taking down shells in RL- I'm not sure). Of course, for drama's sake (at least) they'll only take down some of the shells, missiles, etc.

OK. So the war is underway. Just saying that St. Peter Claver Island is defended by MTHEL systems. They should be effective against some of the missiles and possibly shells (I think WA referred to MTHEL taking down shells in RL- I'm not sure). Of course, for drama's sake (at least) they'll only take down some of the shells, missiles, etc.

And here's a linky so people know what it is. That system will get some rockets but I doubt it gets shells...

http://www.ausa.org/www/armymag.nsf/0/A469D9BDB2C9CF2185256B4C00565F52?OpenDocument

MTHEL has shot down artillery rounds on firing ranges but not under combat conditions. I believe it was fired at artillery shells rather than battleship cannon rounds, so it's use against them is fairly dubious, and it *would* be all but useless against extremly large or 'armoured' bullets.

Ack! I was gonna write a basic description of Benedictia, but my time is running out. :( Just a little info: virtually every village, town and city in Syskeyia is centered on a town square called the Forum, which has the principal parish church/[arch]diocese cathedral, the main government buildings (like governor's house, city hall, provincial legislature etc.) as well as a statue (usually of the two Consuls who reigned at the place's founding) in the center of the square. Even when suburban sprawl came about, the suburbs were built according to this type of plan (so each suburban "city" has a Forum of its own)

The principal Forum of Bendecitia, of course, is located downtown, which is closer to the shore than most suburbs.

That's all for now.

Isn't Benedictia on mainland Syskeyia? As far as I know, they're only going for St. Peter.

[OOC: Aargh! The thing ate my post! Anyway, here's what happens in response: The B-52s launch their EMP missiles at the fleet and then head for Syskeyia. Meanwhile, the antiship missile crews pick their targets and ready themselves. If the Euruseans attack the EMP missiles with a Defense Bomb, the island crews will wait until the blast is no longer destructive, but still blinding. Then, they fire their missiles at the fleet.

Also, the fleet assumes a defensive position around the refugees, and will wait until as many refugees as possible are onto boats. Then, they'll leave.

Not to mention the fact that two F-14 squadrons and one F/A-18 squadron are flying out to engage the Iron Casket.]

Ok, via the dreaded 'merging' ritual this post is now in this thread instead of the IC one for two reasons, namely [1] It's OOC and belongs here and [2] there's some kinks that need working out of it first.

The major flaws in this plan are firstly you're got the Eurusean forces in the wrong place, and secondly you're planning based on a weapon you don't ICly know exists. Let's deal with the first first.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Eurusea/St-Peter.jpg

As y'see, the Eurusean fleet actually arrived from the North [Eurusea is tundra at it's Northernmost point and temperate at the southernmost, so arriving from the North makes sense] and not the West as you assumed [Belenov's fleet that was in Syskeyia is now arriving at St Peter from the West, but we're talking about Kyznetsov's two fleets]. That means your B-52s will be flying straight towards the fleet rather than at some weird-ass oblique angle like you're assuming.

The second point here is that while you know about defence bombs OOCly now, you still don't know they exist in-character, so making a plan based entirely on their existence isn't really, well, possible.

Thanx for making it clear. The situation is:

Vegana continued for Mainland Syskeyia, mined the bay of Syskeyia and went for the southernmost of Syskeyians bigger cities, namely Bendecitia. Our fleet and our air strikes is happening there.

At the same time, in a region far far away (well maybe not that far away)

THe rest of the Reich, and Eurusea is surrounding St. Peter Claver. which as far as I know is an island, a pretty long way from Mainland Syskeyia.

Just a thing... EC said that the Syskeyian fighters waited until scrambling. That's not true, the fact is, they scrambled at the outset of the attack, if they were not in their air already. (Sorry if I did not clarify that earlier)

I mean, this place has been prepared for an Amerigan invasion since the end of the Slaver War...

Ok, just a random note: In the post I'm writing now I'm assuming that the Syskeyian anti-ship missiles are built for use against armoured ships. If they're not, subtract almost all the casualties among the Eurusean fleet.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Other%20stuff/reibann.gif

Just a thing... EC said that the Syskeyian fighters waited until scrambling. That's not true, the fact is, they scrambled at the outset of the attack, if they were not in their air already. (Sorry if I did not clarify that earlier)

I mean, this place has been prepared for an Amerigan invasion since the end of the Slaver War...

You missunderstood. I meant the fact that your fighters were waiting above the Island, rather than trying to intercept the coming attack as early as possible. How high they were while waiting is not an issue. Well, it is, but a relatively minor one.

Just read the post about your point-defense missiles "swatting" down my millies "like flies"...

*sighs* Is there any way I can effectively protect my fleet against your ships? :rolleyes:

Just read the post about your point-defense missiles "swatting" down my millies "like flies"...

Search for: 'like flies'

Word has finished searching the document. The search item was not found

Still many hit, flames billowing from dozens of ships.

Yah, that's a real ineffective attack there.

Good point, GMC.

Just a note: I could use a description of the beaches I'm landing on [I'd say three landings or so seems about right]. It's a little hard to describe an assault on a beach if you have no idea what it looks like, hence the rather sparse landing post.

Oh, a little stab at rendering the view from the West of the island...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Eurusea/StPeter-ultra.jpg

Actually, given the timeframes involved I'd have thought Pantocratorian troopships would have arrived at the Island just after the Eurusean fleet but before they opened fire...In any case, SITREP for yourself, Pantorcratoria.

On hand at present at St Peter are naval units from Abatoir [2 CGs] 56 combatants from Endless Crimes [near but haven't arrived] and three fleets totalling 900 combatants from Eurusea. There's a full amphibious assault on the island underway [with the first wave, or rather what's left of it, having already landed] from the West and heavy bombardment from the North. At this stage it probably looks to be a lost cause [and further that's been OOCly agreed to be the case.]

Just a note: I could use a description of the beaches I'm landing on [I'd say three landings or so seems about right]. It's a little hard to describe an assault on a beach if you have no idea what it looks like, hence the rather sparse landing post.

Oh, a little stab at rendering the view from the West of the island...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Eurusea/StPeter-ultra.jpg


Cool pic. :)

Anyway, the beaches are generally sandy (like most south pacific island beaches), though in the green brush, hills and stuff are a menagerie of excellently camouflaged fortifications. Throughout all the island are a ton of fortified stuff, giving the Syskeyian army a lot of advantage (or does it) in facing an invasion force.

Much of the fortifications has been built not only to support infantry, but APCs and armor as well.

Think the fortification level of Quemoy and Matsu on Samoa, and you'll get a general idea of what the island is like.

Gotta go.

Um, more thinking of a description of the area the landings are taking place in, as in a rough description of what's ahead. You know, a 'there is a bunker to the right and a pillbox to the left' kinda thing for reference. Sorry I wasn't more specific.

Um, more thinking of a description of the area the landings are taking place in, as in a rough description of what's ahead. You know, a 'there is a bunker to the right and a pillbox to the left' kinda thing for reference. Sorry I wasn't more specific.

Well, I don't think I have my defenses that well planned out OOC, though IC it's up to that detail. :)

Also, the vast majority of elves in Bendecitia were evacuated... well, once we knew the Reich was on its way to invade the mainland. There might be a small number of elves left in the city, but those still in Syskeyia-held territory are probably getting plastic surgery done on their ears in the hospitals still under Syskeyian control. :)

Well, I don't think I have my defenses that well planned out OOC, though IC it's up to that detail. :)

Also, the vast majority of elves in Bendecitia were evacuated... well, once we knew the Reich was on its way to invade the mainland. There might be a small number of elves left in the city, but those still in Syskeyia-held territory are probably getting plastic surgery done on their ears in the hospitals still under Syskeyian control. :)

Well, Even if this attack took ages IRL it was supposed to be a surprise attack, and we DID cut off the northern roads from Bendecitia so expect a smaller amount of elves to get away than expected...

Don't know how many elves you want to keep in their homes with their belongings and their real estate

True about plastic surgery, And that's why we use dogs to sniff them up =) I'll write a new post about that...

Could we have some responses to our attacks?

Well, I don't think I have my defenses that well planned out OOC, though IC it's up to that detail. :)

Ya, understood, but a simple description of the three beaches I'm thinking light minefields and obstacles on the lower beaches since it's unexpected going into blockhouses and maybe buried tanks on the upper beachs with artillery just past them as per [i]Operation Bunker Shot in Ace Combat is workable. If you want I'll have a crack at working up three overhead sketches based on Ace Combat and my D-Day companion. I'm guessing the three beaches are ajoining and there's a good road system leading off / to them for the naval bases and ports.

As a rough guide, how big is St Peter?

OOC: Since I don't know the strength of the Syskeyian escort relative to your own forces, despite your assertions that the fight is insanely one sided, perhaps you and Syskeyia could both give a list of the naval assets involved here? I apologise if you've posted this elsewhere, I know Syskeyia has, but with all the threads this storyline has spawned, and all the venom spewed forth, I have certainly missed it.

Also, Pantocratoria's transport ships [should] be being escorted by eighteen Expeditionary Strike groups. Each ESG consists of the following
1 Wasp-class Amphibious Assault Ship
1 Ticonderoga-class cruiser
1 Arleigh Burke-class destroyer
1 frigate, either Oliver Hazard Perry or Eliat-class
1 Seawolf-class submarine
Each Wasp-class ship has, for this mssion, the following contingent of aircraft:
20 F-35B STOVL Joint Strike Fighters
6 MH-60X Paladinhawk ASW compound helicopters (Basically an ASW-equipped Knighthawk with a Vectored Thrust Ducted Propeller system

And now my (Endless Crimes') own stuff... So, 56 transporters/ tankers/ stuff are still enroute to St. Peter Claver.

They are guarded by 4 frigates and 4 destroyers.

Four carriers are falling back behind the main force, guarded by four frigates and as many destroyers.

The main force, the ones currently attacking the transports/ escorts:

Four big battleships. Think, four 50cm triple turrets as main armament, some smaller armament, missile launchers, a couple helicopters/ VTOLs, lotsa armour, and relatively slow (Not faster than 27kts, currently prolly about 21- 24 kts)

Eight heavy cruisers. Somewhat better armed/ armoured than germany's pocket- battleships (Of course, all with (post)modern materials, not 1930s crap) Again, relatively slow, couple helicopters.

Eight light cruisers. 'Light' being relative.

Eight destroyers and

Eight frigates.

Also a couple submarines. I would think about eight directly there, eight more somewhere along syskeyia and/ or St. Peter, disturbing civilian traffic (Only counting anti- ship thingie. Count as many Missile- launching submarines). Relatively easy to detect, again, big, slowly, and comparably noisy. On the other hand, featuring lots of torpedoes currently used.

This all is, of course, disregarding losses that happened.

The carriers will soon begin to receive the planes that returned from St. Peter. Keep in mind, due to EC's strategic concept, the carriers are somewhat better armed, when it comes to guns/ missiles, than a Nimitz. But again, they are slow. well, actually, everythign EC has is overarmed and slow...

So, numerically speaking, you're actually outnumbering me, however, I wield more than just a little bit more firepower.

Thanks, that's quite helpful. Not that I have any thing I can really do about the fight other than take casualties, but at least now I know the size of the forces involved and can react accordingly.

[OOC: The Syskeyian defenders aren't exactly "poorly trained and poorly equipped." The units you're facing aren't exactly the Syskeyian Army's finest, to be sure, but the Army ensures that all the soldiers recieve basic training, every man a rifleman, etc. I dunno, think of the US Army units at the beginning of the Battle of the Bulge.

As inspiration escapes me at the moment, let's just say that the Corps' Armored divisions (mostly abrams tanks, but some Sabra medium ones as well), is making its way to encounter the Veganan panzers.]

Dunno anything of Battle of Bulge, I'll look it up. BUt basic training hardly makes them anything less than soft resistance. Even the penal batallions gets basic training. Where as the shock troops are battle hardened veterans with excellent equipment and training. And our tanks are made by our too large automotive sector =)

Can we get the battles over with so we can get down to business?

Um, two major problems here:

[1] Eurusea prioritises fire on combatants in the order: carriers - battleships - cruisers - destroyers and so on down the tonnage scale. In other words, they'd barely have engaged destroyers if there were battleships still afloat, and at visual ranges and with Eurusea having fired first there wouldn't be much left afloat with a Syskeyian flag on it by now. Casualties in the Eurusean fleet so far have assumed that some damage was caused by the ships that escaped the first volley and Mezzoforte's burst [which would be precious few]

[2] There's not much hope of punching a hole through the Northern fleet, which is twice the size of the one to the West. You have your 50%-or-so from Belenov ignoring boats and aircraft moving past his fleet [West].

Also, I've been a little busy with my engineering coursework recently and compy-chan needs a new PSU, so I'll try to get a post up in the next few days.

Great. So I have no fleet, I've done no effective damage to your navy (as you can STILL OMG N0T H38V 8 H0L3 IN T3H FL33T), and I can't even get the 1-1.5 million refugees I want to safety, and its all OMG TEH RACIST COMMIE FASCISTS R BLOWING U ALL UP LOL. I'm not opposed to losing the island, but you're not even giving me a chance to do something good.

Also, the fact that you, GMC, seem to have this belligerent attitude against me, means that as far as I'm concerned, the Eurusean fleet just magically sunk into the sea, the country of Eurusea has sunk beneath the waves, and the other fleets have magically been transported back to their home ports. If you want me to unignore you, let's resolve the problem in this thread. I shall continue with the Bendecitia/Vegana storyline.

Are you having some problem reading my posts?

I've done no effective damage to your navy

Still many hit, flames billowing from dozens of ships.
Between the fleet and the island the sky was lit by bursting flak...the many damaged ships an indication that it wasn't a one-sided duel.

[Iron Casket is going down in the next post, too.]

Note: This is compared to you having posted no casualties at all until your most recent post.
'Effective damage' does not equate to a situation where you can beat a ten-to-one [or something] numerical advantage in a straight-up fight. Particularly given that since the Eurusean fleet hasn't enveloped the island to the East and South there's really no point in trying to bust through the North fleet instead of just avoiding it.

I can't even get the 1-1.5 million refugees I want to safety

You have your 50%-or-so from Belenov ignoring boats and aircraft moving past his fleet [West].
[Which was in my previous post to this thread]

Get that? Since you weren't posting casualties or what your units were doing I assumed you would be trying to escape to the West [towards Syskeyia] rather than trying to punch through an entire fleet when you don't have to . Or, hell, escaping to the [i]east or south where there are no Eurusean ships. We agreed you would get roughly 50-60% off the island, as far as I was concerned since you didn't say what they were doing they would try to head West for Syskeyia, so I posted them going past Belenov's fleet:

Belenov sighed, ignoring the little civilian boats streaming past his fleet as he moved closer to the Island[...]

If you want them to evac North, just change that to Kyznetsov ignoring them, but driving a wedge through the fleet when it's obvious they're not bothering with civvie boats anyway is rather a wasteful exercise. The point is I gave you the refugees once already, they can hardly evacuate again.

Would you mind NOT flying off the handle with ignores over things we've already covered several times over? The agreement OOC was you get 50-60% off, Eurusea takes the island, you retake it. You have your 50-60% one way or the other, so that's in order. I'm playing this granting you as much rope as I possibly can; no mention of air support, no saturation bombing, leaving the docks alone for civvies to escape, leaving the Absolute Barriers on every Floating Fortress down for no apparent reason - in other words I'm doing the best I can to play down the capabilities of the Eurusean ships present to make this longer / more interesting. You could at least return the favour by giving me the benefit of the doubt and not thinking I'm out to kill everyone on the island even though we agreed I wouldn't do anything of the sort.

I think you need to look at Syskeyia's response in the light of the whole attitude you appear to have towards him. Just from the threads about this war, it is painfully obvious that you have an OOC problem with Syskeyia. How are we supposed to RP a war when there's such open OOC hostility?

This is a game, and we're supposed to be having fun, despite whatever awful fates befall our citizens IC! So can I suggest that since after 4 pages of OOC discussion, resolving the little sticking points, we still haven't even come close to addressing this underlying OOC hostility, which is the root of all these other little arguments, that we just find a way to bring this RP to a conclusion as soon as possible. I know I'm certainly not having any fun, and I'm fairly peripherally involved at best. Forget making it longer or more interesting - it's already interminable and tedious, and I'm assuming that unless you can work out whatever OOC issues you've with each other, it is going to remain that way.

My 'hostile attitude,' be it real or imaginary, has nothing to do with my RP. There is an OOC agreement in place, Syskeyia seems to believe I'm failing to keep up my end of it because he's misreading what I'm saying. This is all.

And, um, mind skipping calling other people's RPs 'interminable and tedious?'

Sorry about "going off the handle," accusations of belligerency infecting RP, etc. OK, I'm not punching a hole in your fleet... um, I think I might post a little something.

So bye now. :)

Alright, I posted some evacuation stuff.

What do you all think of my RP/writing skills? Do I need to improve?

Anyway, the "pallet" system I mentioned is the Tactical Pallet System (http://www.geocities.com/dominantlogistics/pallet.html) described in the link. I've been using the said system since about the time Melkor threatened to invade me, so it's plenty in use, NS-wise. I'm also using the Tracked Supply Vehicle (http://www.geocities.com/dominantlogistics/tsv.html) described in the article.

Dunno what I'll do with my navy. Since the civvies are evacuating in the east, I won't be trying to punch a whole in the Eurusean fleet- though all my navy ships being destroyed would make my causulty-counting easier. :)

I like your writing Sysk. But you know that it is up to you to declare your own losses? The last three posts are great descriptions of panicking citizens and desperate defense. Since the outcome of both these RP's already are determined, I think Eurusea has The right to beat you bloody. These RP's is a two-way street where you pay your due in full, upfront. I would never have allowed a predefined outcome of a RP if I didn't feel it was important for the storyline of my nation to have this battle. To be frank there has been a lot of OOC diplomacy just to get this going, so could we get on with it?

As I said, great posts SYsk, now add your losses and please write similar posts in Bendecitia, I'm giving you all sorts of intros into different storylines but so far I feel I don't get much response.

RP seems pretty good other than the aforementioned missing casualty figures. Slight edit you need in your last post; all of my posts have so far been sunset - night, so unless your last post goes before the others there won't be much sun.

My 'hostile attitude,' be it real or imaginary, has nothing to do with my RP. There is an OOC agreement in place, Syskeyia seems to believe I'm failing to keep up my end of it because he's misreading what I'm saying. This is all.

And, um, mind skipping calling other people's RPs 'interminable and tedious?'

I didn't mean their RPs were tedious, I was referring to the whole OOC attitude which has accompanied this war. Everyone is doing this supposedly to have fun. I don't see the point in continuing if we're not enjoying ourselves. But if everyone is happy, let's go on.

Hmmm, I was thinking about how to take down the Dorasmascher(sp?) once Eurusea takes the island. GMC/Eurusea suggested SpecOps, and I'm leaning towards that. How many do you think I would need to sneak in and take it down? What about weapons. For side arms, I'm thinking about using the Stoner Rifle, as GMC has said the Eurusean army uses AKM clones and such, so I'm guessing they'd use AK-47 rounds. Not sure about the SpecOps squads' machine guns- I'm thinking the Mk.48 (http://www.fnmfg.com/products/mk48/mk48%205-28-2003.jpg). I dunno.

I've just read this thread (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=276940) (or at least the first page) again, and I'm wondering if you have any suggestions.

Dora-chan is currently halfway though being redesigned [the initial sketch's length / width ratio is screwed and it wouldn't turn, she's now got two points of articulation in her chassis and the tractors have been redesigned]. She's arriving in the post I'm working on now, actually.

Top priority for any assault would be disabling her main 22-inch high-angle gun [which you wouldn't even be aware of the existence of until she started deploying it, since it retracts for transport]. A big stack of ATGMs might do enough to bugger the pivot, depending on precisely what point in the storyline it looks like she should go down . The rest of the thing...Well, I'd like to see what your specforces come up with. Keep numbers relatively low, since she'll have a fair slab of other vehicles around her so sneaky / hidey is better than big and targety. Either way, any serious naval gunfire or airstrikes when the Syskeyia relief gets in range [which would be a bad idea with Dora's main gun still up] and she'll go the way of all Unsupported Really Huge Things.

[Incidentally, the 'real' Ground Battleship Doramascher turns up in the old arcade game [i]1945, though they only share a name. Gotta love those pointless references. And a 'Battle Air Ship' called Iron Casket appears in 1945 II, for that matter]

Standard Eurusean gear varies wildly depending on mission requirements and survival rates; Yana's rifle is probably not far removed from a Mosin-Nagant, and there's plenty of horrible sheet-steel stamped SMGs in the first wave that landed, second wave may be predominantly AKM-ish assault rifles with the odd semi-auto SVT-thing. Eurusean MGs around there are either heavy two-man watercooled bastard-things that haven't changed in about a hundred years [and you'll see what those are doing] or cute pan-magazine LMGs with variably dreadful build quality [y'know, like that (http://world.guns.ru/machine/mg34-e.htm)]. It's worth noting the third landing wave is an actual rifle division rather than conscripts, so they actually have vaguely up-to-date equipment.

Addition: Having read that thread, I agree with half and disagree with the other half.

To explain; I don't like stereotypes. I don't like renting a war film and being able to tell which characters will die after ten minutes. These things are bad.

HOWEVER...

That thread goes too far the other way. There's nothing interesting about a squad of superhard steroid-chewing commandos who eat broken glass and death for breakfast, wash it down with pain and then piss fire and shit bullets all afternoon. If you follow that thread exactly, you end with a squad of near-identical Rambo stereotypes stomping around FEELING NO FEAR and being MANLY.

I also disagree on casualties; casualties are a fact of combat, and no matter how good your training they can happen. Brecourt Manor is held up as a textbook assault on a fixed position even though they lost a man there. Bear in mind: Dora-chan is totally outside the range of things any Syskeyian commando will have been trained to deal with, they have no idea of her capabilities and will be making a split-second plan based on very unclear intel . While it's written in stone that they'll succeed in their objective, the question here is whether [i]any of them will come back from the attack, not all of them.

Well, in writing the assault I wanted to show some kind of "medal-worthy" action or something. I'll revise it to make it more "horrors of war" attitude if I have the time. If you'll note, I increased the casualties. :)

Oh, sure. I have no problem with that as it was, actually, since the first wave of Eurusean troops had no training. I meant casualties in the team[s] attacking Dora once Eurusea has taken the island, not that group of soldiers.

....Today would be a good day, several of the leading men and women of Bendecitia had requested a meeting with him, he looked forward to see what kind of people it was who were the first to embrace the good cause. The first always was the wolves, the ones that ate their mates, not much better than elves. His men had spent all night to try to secure the pockets of resistance that still existed and search and apprehend the elves that still were to find in Bendecitia. He had reports of all the different ways that the nephilim had tried to hide themselves. Mutilations of their ears, disguises, plastic surgery even plain hiding, but his special forces had rooted them out with their special trained hounds. The hounds were able to sense the scent of an elf in a crowd of hundreds and his men were patrolling through areas of high population as well searching the premises located through the city files. It was hard work and he had doubled the crews on the streets to round up the parasites of mankind as early as possible.

He stepped into his office and sat down behind the great desk, he looked at the monitor showing the room outside his office. Five men and two women were assembled there, looking nervous, they always did. He examined the men, they tried to look determined and hard, the women were talking to eachother with quiet voices. he would enjoy this, who knew?, maybe they could help him in his task.

Umm, when did I give you permission to RP my citizens? Yes, I know that you are eager to do evil oppression thingys to my people, but St. Peter Claver Island hasn't fallen yet. I dunno, I know that soon after you take Bendecitia I have to retake it, and it would be anticlimactic for me to retake Bendecitia and then have St. Peter Claver Island fall. I just thought it would be a nice dramatic thing for them to follow at roughly the same time (the Republic's darkest hour...)

Ohh I haven't, just giving you another chance to enter the RP. Right now it's kind of a one man show, and I giving you loads of different chances waiting for you to choose one.

When you have an invading army there's always opportunists, that's what I'm showing with that post. That's what happened when the Germans invaded, the japanese, the chinese, the americans in Iraq etc. That's what life and humanity is like. I leave the resistance and the actions of your citizens to you but so far there hasn't been any actions has it? Looking forward to a post from you.

not to mention the great thing with fluid time. This thread is separated from the St. Claver thread. WE could completely finish of that and then you just put in the same date in the titles of your post when you do your counter offensive.

Originally Posted by Menelmacar
OOC note to Vegana et al: You can probably assume that there are very few Elves left in the city, as I arranged with Sysk well over two months ago for them to be evacuated to other cities and then to Menelmacar (I have IRC logs regarding this). When your forces entered Bendecita there were probably less than one or two thousand left, and probably less - those who were either too proud or too attached to their homes to leave or naïvely expecting mercy (or at least decent treatment) at Reich hands.



OOC note, well as I am sure you are aware of since you surely read the thread. This was a surprise attack that started more than three months ago, 10-08 to be exact. (I have this forum logs regarding this, this thread actually. So all your logs proves is that you had discussion with him a month after the attack started. ;P) AKA before you had the discussion with Sysk. So basically the attack would have taken place before you would have moved them.

BUT i have no problem with just taking on a few thousands instead, I always assumed the vast majority of elves would be smart and sneaky enough to get out of the city when the first assault started. Feel free to RP any elves still in the city if Sysk allows it, need some interaction anyway. And bear in mind that the cleansing is not entirely elves, there are lot of people that will get eradicated during these days

Don't want to sound rude, since I'm quite aware of my own tendency of, well, posting in rather irregular intervals, but still... I could use some sort of reply regarding me shelling that cute troop convoy/ warfleet mixture, so I can continue... Last reply regarding the matter (By me) was 9 days ago...

OOC: It was a surprise attack, yes, but it was less than two months ago that you approached Bendecita. For the first month you were engaged in fleet maneuverings and taking St. Peter Claver Island. By the time you approached Bendecita your intentions were obvious. ;)

But yeah, any further OOC posts will be elsewhere.


WEll, sorry to say this Siri, But my attack on Bendecitia started with an air attack at the 10-08, continued on the 11:th and the 12:th until Syskeyia asked for a freeze at the 12:th. Which you can see in the thread. WE start an artillery bombardment the 18:th and again Syskeyia asks for a freeze of the RP. And finally we continue at th 6-09.

Not to mention that I saved a T-gram from Syskeyia confirming my attack that he posted 97 days ago... So... I would say I approached Bendecitia long ahead of the two months you talking about. But as I said, I don't mind elves getting away, I'm trying to initiate a good RP here... So far I haven't got much response, So once again, if Sysk admits it, why don't You RP an elf or two in the City? I think it might be good fun! And we could play along like good kids without risking a full-scale war. Just a good old RP


The Republic of Syskeyia
Received: 97 days ago >The plan, which I know will reveal and I trust you are good enough RP not to use this, but to play along.

The veganian expedition has now efficiently cut of the seaways in Gulf of Syskeyia with the mines. These mines will dissolve in a while, but right now it makes the aterways very hard to travel. I will strike against your nice coastal town of Bendecilm, while artillerying and sending airstrikes towards Nukajam and Portus Navalis to keep flights and naval assistance from reaching Bendecilm.

I will use the excuse of you having caught or destroyed some of my hightech Cleanerdeployers. ( a very valid excuse in RL today, strangely enough) and rescuing some men. (the cleanerdestroyers are ofcourse unmanned)

I will then perform some atrocities in Bendecilm, with ethnic cleansing and burninating until you can reach teh city by land and I will allow you to through me back into the sea. Under fierce fighting ofcourse.

This should increase your status as good and a good RP, as well as my evil points will go up.

What do you think?

Good idea. Though my people have a lot of guns, so you'll take a lot of casualties getting my cities (and it's Benedicitia, I think.) I think I'll make sure (OOC, of course), that there are only some of my "generic" divisions guarding the city. It'll be a good RP.

OK Vegana, I can understand your frustration with doing a "one-man" RP, but PLEASE stop RPing my people, you're doing it all wrong. Yes, the Syskeyian forces may have been stopped; but that does NOT mean all the people are going to be passive and just submit to all the evil atrocities you're going to do and accept all the "rats are evil" propoganda etc. In guns stuff Syskeyia is a lot like Switzerland - all males (save clergy and religious) are issued assault rifles and must keep them in the home, they practice shooting regularly, and the women often have handguns and/or carbines as well. (The M1911 is popular.) And we've got lots of shooting competetions and stuff, so we have practice.

I'll post something tomorrow morning.

Dude, small children do act that way if you lead them on, whole police investigations have had to be shut down because of totally false 'evidence' gained by asking leading questions of children. But ya, it is up to you to RP them [slaps Vegana with a fish]

But ya, I think Veg is just getting a lil' frustrated at getting no answers in that thread.

Also, do you want me to follow up in the other thread with another post, and if so is there a church or cathedral near the North side of St Peter City, and if there is, what's it called?

*gets slapped with a fish*

Yes, I would rather have anyone play the other people. Otherwise its just gonna be a one man band and that's no fun at all. Bear in mind that I so far only has picked up normal reactions from people. This is the way people act under these circumstances, according to history and Psychology as I am sure you are aware of. (witch processes, the Incest tribunals in Norway etc..) But I would love to have you post in your thread! We need some resistance Goddammit! ;)

I was going to write some reistance stuff now, but I got distracted and mIRC and I'll try to write something tonight.

Somewhere in Bendecitia
{Argh. Loss of inspiration. OK, here's what happens - some militia, sneaking through the urban framework of the city - manage to get into an abandone building several stories high. From this, a squad of militia managed to find a line of logistics trucks (or at least one truck) [it's a fuel truck], fired a rifle grenade, causing the truck to go kablooey). Just a scene that would illustrate the resistance still going on the city.}

Yay! An answer! I guess you stating my casualties makes up for me RP'ing your citizens in that poor way. Cause I asume you didn't fire on your own fuel trucks? ;-) Keep up the good work! I need the challenge!

Um, hello?

Yeah, I'm here. Sorry I haven't responded, but I don't exactly have carte blanche access to the Internet at home :) Think about wrapping the "fall of St. Peter Claver Island" up? ;)

Also, do you want me to follow up in the other thread with another post, and if so is there a church or cathedral near the North side of St Peter City, and if there is, what's it called?

<Points up>

Well, there might be a few small towns north of St. Peter Claver City, but the city does house most of the island's population. North of the city is St. Peter Claver Joint Forces Base, a ludicrously fortified and equipped miilitary base with army, air force and navy facilities. The central cathedral on the island is St. Peter Claver Cathedral, the only cathedral on the island and head ot the St. Peter Claver Island Diocese. It's in St. Peter Claver City's Forum, a plaza that also contains the chief city and provincial governmental buildings.

North of the city is St. Peter Claver Joint Forces Base, a ludicrously fortified and equipped miilitary base with army, air force and navy facilities.

Should almost certainly be all but destroyed by now and largely evacuated, yes?

Need a response...

While I'm at it... yeah... from either pantecratoria or syskeyia... or can I just assume the fleet was, well, sunk, and go on?

Given that I don't actually have any warships there, just transports being protected by Syskeyia, I have been leaving the actual sea fight to Syskeyia. As such, I'd like to leave that call to Syskeyia, but there is no way my transports would be dumb enough to just wait to die once their escort had lost the battle - they're just not brain washed enough to want to drown at sea in a foreign war en masse. ;)

I'd like to see the sea battle resolved in RP, or RP as many of my transports trying to flee as possible if we're just going to call the battle lost. Either way, I am waiting on Syskeyia before I can get more involved either RPing my troops landing or RPing them dying/fleeing.

OK, I've got an assault plan. The basic outline of the operation can be seen in the below pic. (forgive the quality, I whipped it up on MS Paint in a hurry :) ) Vegana, how many divisions do you have in Bendecitia? I don't know what a PanzerGruppe is (or whatever they're) called and I tend to think in divisions, brigades, battalions etc. You see, I need to know how many forces are in Bendecitia before I can determine the size of the liberation force.

Also, I'm surmising this will be a city fight. (Am I correct?) Does anyone know any good sources on urban combat (online and free- I'm not about to buy a book on it anytime soon or anything like that. ;) )

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/retakecityplan.jpg

Just looked at CSJ's tank guide today, and I think I'll upgrade the caliber of my Abrams from 120mm to 135-140mm. I just thought of it today, however, but since I've said to be refitting some of my divisions, I hope its acceptable to say that they refitted Abrams units have them. :)

If so, than pics of said M1A4S shall be up soon (at least by Thursday :) ).

When he says hostilities have ceased he means St Peter has fallen and Syskeyia has retreated [http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=7652917&postcount=49]; there are no Eurusean ships present at Syskeyia itself, so technically he is telling the truth, hee.

Gah, my attention has been all weird. So my posts have been intermittant.

I'm going to launch the initial attacks on Benedictia now or very soon--First Fleet will provide air cover and artillery and so forth (they've been slowly navigating through the bio minefield jellyfish things) and the Marines will attack from the north down to Benedictia and Airborne and regular Army will attack from West, as per that arrow in Syskeyia's map. First Fleet troops will make a simultaeneous assault on the ports.

I need to know: Vegana's air force presence, naval presence and the nature and numbers of troops in Benedictia (for example are they all professional troops or conscripts or what).

The Chimaean troops coming down from the North will act more as a net against a retreat into the Northern parts of the region and move quite slowly and methodically. They will also offer a defence against Vegana (Veganian? Vegan? :p) troops stationed between the north border and this underground tunnel system the Syskeyians are going to pop out of.

The CAF deployments within each area will be as follows:

North: 4, 000 Marine Corp, with mainly light to medium armour. They will have artillery strikes available but the bulk of any air support will need to be provided by Syskeyia. I hope you're reading this lol.

West: 6, 700 troops, consisting of Airborne and regular Army units. These forces will be backed by medium to heavy armour, heavy artillery from the First Fleet and air cover from the same.

First Fleet: 2, 500 Marines, amphibian landing craft, heavy artillery and air cover and all the bits and pieces that the First Fleet has.

The special forces thing is just a bit of fun. I don't mind if they're wiped out or something, or maybe ge tholed somewhere and blow themselves up... maybe just before the Marines reach their position :p I don't mind. Go for glory.

Oh and yeah, reinforcements... er, say 2, 000 Airborne + reg. infantry stationed in safe zones to the North and South, who'd move along behind as the net closes.

So what is that, 15, 200 troops and support? I'm sure that's ok...

As written in the beginning of this thread... The two carrier groups Nephilim Smiter and Holy Avenger




Originally Posted by Vegana
OOC: Deployment

2 Carriergroups each consisting of:

1 Carrier Jehovah-Class
2 Carriers Matthew-Class
3 Battleships Vengeance-Class
8 Anti-ballistic ships
16 destroyers
6 Cruisers
6 submarines
18 Transports (Hovercraft)
4 Supply ships



North of the city there are 3 Panzer gruppen (á 150 Tanks) 50,000 Shocktroops (elite), 12,000 Inquisitors (crazed more-than Elite) and the surviving Dog soldiers from the 3:rd and 5:th penal Batallion. (around 70,000) (militia/guerilla, No heavy weapons) Spread to harass and defend the partisan way.(without any support by the locals though, more likely to rape, pillage and spread havoc. Think of the Harlequins in the france/brit 14 century war)

There is also anti-air defense thinly spread together with the Panzer Groups.

South of Bendecitia/ in Bendecitia there is 50,000 Shock troops and 10,000 Inquisitors and about 8,000 security troops. Mobile artillery units has been deployed in the city. Airplanes from the Carriers are used to defend the city from air attacks as well as the carrier groups themselves. Any progress from the syskeyian Gulf will be slow since it is mined, with the type of mines described earlier in the thread.

The attackers that come from the west will encounter the lightest resistance, the fleets will be sitting ducks in a mined ocean for the unmanned attack planes, and the forces from the north will meet heavy resistance. Just as has been explained in the thread.

I will have some trouble posting quickly, so please take it slow. its end of Q4 so I'm closing deals. This might make me less attentive to answer, please excuse me for that

Ok. I was obviously misinformed (or I confused it with something else) about the number of troops you have at hand x_x I'll have to adjust my own numbers accordingly. Obviously 15, 000 isn't a realistic response.

Other than that, cool.

Yeah, Normally I would have withdrawn most of the troops after capturing a city, but the way this is played its only been a week, and there still is a lot of resistance nearby. And Mea Culpa, I saw that one post I thought I had posted had been eaten by the evil NS-monster. Its the one where the penal batallions is sent north. I will repost it, as I try to keep posts on file nowadays. =)

All right. My revised stats...

I'll need something like 90, 000 soldiers on the ground.

Since Syskeyia is attacking underground mainly at the North, I won't have as many troops there, just enough to make sure there's no backwards-attacking.

Hrm.

20, 000 troops to the North.

50, 000 troops to the West.

20, 000 troops from the First Fleet.

Um, entry from the West is possible isn't it? There's a landmass to the west, though I dunno who owns it. Possibly no-one.

Is that better?

Some things to deal with:

Names: Syskeyian ususally are named after a Catholic saint, and have an Asian surname (usually from Southeast Asia, India, or China - I've been using KateMonk's Onomastikon (http://www.gaminggeeks.org/Resources/KateMonk/) for finding surnames recently. :) )

Oh, and some pics of the M1A4S:
The M1A4S Abrams MBT
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/m1a4.gif
In standard Jungle/Woodland cammo
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/m1a4_camo.gif
In Urban Cammo (in case the battle for Bendecitia is in the city itself
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/m1a4_urban.gif

Nice site :) I'll keep the name thing in mind. Can you number your forces for each part of the battle?

Well, since you've got 90,000 troops, I was looking at my people, and a complete Syskeyian Army Corps (3 mech inf. divisions, 2 armored divisions+ Corps-specific units) has 130,700 people, though I do subscribe to the "every man a rifleman" philosophy, so a corps-sized task force, or just sending in I Corps may do the trick. :)

Proposed TOE:
I Corps

1st Infantry Division (Mech)
2nd Infantry Division (Mech)
3rd Infantry Division (Mech)
1st Armored Division
1nd Armored Division


TF Cloudkicker

11th Airborne Division
38th Airborne Division
77th Airborne Division


...Whatever divisions currently fighting defensively north of Bendecitia I can muster

...and what naval forces I can whip up to help Chimaea's First Fleet destroy the Reich naval forces (if that's OK with Vegana)

My troops are about to land in Syskeyia itself to join the defensive positions north of Benedictia. This deployment consists of the following:

The Infantry Legion of the Exarchate of New Jerusalem
(15,000 combat troops and their support vehicles and personnel)

The Imperial Equites Division
(2000 light tanks and their support vehicles and personnel)

The Fourth Provincial Infantry Legion
(12,000 combat troops and their support vehicles and personnel)

There were some casualties lost at sea from these formations, but that gives you an approximate strength.

...Whatever divisions currently fighting defensively north of Bendecitia I can muster

...and what naval forces I can whip up to help Chimaea's First Fleet destroy the Reich naval forces (if that's OK with Vegana)

Excellent, finally some action! Well, the deal was that you were to flush me out of Bendecitia, whatever happens outside that I leave for RP to decide. But don't think I will make it easy for you! ;)

Still in closing mode, just logging in quickly a few times a day to see what happens, will start heavy posting around X-mas

Ack! The allied offensive has yet to commence, and Vegana's sending reinforcements! :( Anyway, I'm ready to roll when Chimaea is. Not sure about what to do with those bio mines. I've got 150-something mine-clearing ships, so I think's I'll try to "bust some holes" in Vegana's minefield to let my fleet through to the ocean (and, consequently, Chimaea and Pantocratorian vessels into Syskeyia :) )

On another note, how long does it take to write an RP post for you? I'm usually allowed 30 minutes-1 hour on the 'net at home and whenever I try to write a "well-RPed post," I get stick or something (Even if I know what I want to write). Any suggestions?

Also, the "'thirty-fives" mentioned are the new 135mm smoothbore tank guns mounted on the M1A4S Abrams tanks being fielded with the new divisions. :)

On another note, how long does it take to write an RP post for you? I'm usually allowed 30 minutes-1 hour on the 'net at home and whenever I try to write a "well-RPed post," I get stick or something (Even if I know what I want to write). Any suggestions?

My last post has a listed edit time of 123 minutes [sayeth Word], though much of that I was doing other things, t'be fair. Best way to write posts I find is to make pages of really hard to read notes and write on the back of my hand a lot, print out half-finished posts and proof-read / add to them while I'm at work, etc... Then prop them on a coffee table next to compy-chan and get typing.

And go and watch the whole series of Band of Brothers again if I feel uninspired.

Just read some of the new posts, and some thoughts...

Vegana, you do realize that there aren't really any mountains north of Bendecitia- the mountains are west of the city, unless your troops are digging in mountains [n]northwest[/b] of the city, as the Synora Mountains basically goes across the entire land boundary of Syskeyia.

Also, do you have to send reinforcements? You've already got two hundred thousand troops in the city, and that's a lot. There's only so many divisions I can send through the underground tunnels, and while I know that you're not going to make it easy for me to retake the city, but I don't want to face a numerically superior foe.

Though I do appreciate the Iesus reinforcements... as my troops would just [i]love[/i to fight the forces of Matty. :)

All right, now that the end of year has passed, I can get back to concentrating.

eep.

So umm... the dynamics have changed I see. I have 90, 000 troops against a force numbering in the hundreds of thousands (along with IC soldiers, and he should post force strengths). Syskeyia doesn't post as much as I feel comfortable with but I realise irl limitations apply. Lavenrunz is... negotiating... or something... and Vegana has just launched 100 unmanned planes against the First Fleet, which I don't even have stats or capabilities for :) And to top it off, I have no clue about Naval warfare.

Well... crap :p I think I'm up that famous Creek again, the one without the boat accessory.

and Vegana has just launched 100 unmanned planes against the First Fleet, which I don't even have stats or capabilities for :) And to top it off, I have no clue about Naval warfare.Ummm... They... Fly, and make things go boom?

Ya'know, it is kinda pointless to post made- up statistics vs. made up statistics, ends in bitching. So I would go with above and assume reasonable results :P

PS: Naval warfare is quite simple: Stay afloat, and make sure your opponent doesn't.

It's a bit more complicated than that, if I want to stay afloat :p

You Aint seen nothing yet Chimaea! ;) Gonna be some fleet maneuvers around there. Wont be any reinforcements in Bendecitia though. Those troops are heading somewhere else, having a hard time enough to let me get flushed out as it is ;)

Will not mention any more mountains north of Bendecitia now, they're digging in and that will prove fatal, you'll see...

Well, I did my sea battle. Is it any good?

I'll have to read it again. Long posts take time to read. :)

Um, GMC, you know that Syskeyia has compulsory gun ownership, right? And that the citizens of St. Peter Claver Island have been preparing for an invasion (by Amerigo) since, um, the end of the Amerigan Slaver War? I don't think they;d be as "docile and submissive" as you make them out to be. :rolleyes:

I'll have to read it again. Long posts take time to read. :)

Um, GMC, you know that Syskeyia has compulsory gun ownership, right? And that the citizens of St. Peter Claver Island have been preparing for an invasion (by Amerigo) since, um, the end of the Amerigan Slaver War? I don't think they;d be as "docile and submissive" as you make them out to be. :rolleyes:

Well, firstly there is the point that nobody's yet really trying to mistreat anyone on St Peter and it's hard to drum up resistance against an occupation force that seems relatively benign and is actually helping people and rebuilding.

Second point is you haven't RP'd any resistance or given me any details here of what people might be doing, so I had to either [a] do nothing or [b] assume your resistance was biding their time for some reason hoping someone would try to re-take the island eventually, getting organised during that time and not risking blowing their cover [and ending various civilian lives] by randomly blowing shit up.

Of which [b] seemed the more sensible option. The vast majority of active resistance would be in the south sector belonging to Endless Crimes where Nasty Shit Is Happening, anyway.

Ok. I've got the whole day free, unexpectedly, and I'm going to re-enter the fight. At long last.

Through the course of these actions I'm going to bring another ten thousand troops into Syskeyia, bring the total Chimaean presense to 100, 000. Because various people are beginning to get scary.

As an additional side-note; I doubt St Peter Island is self-succificient [and if it was it probably isn't anymore]. That would mean that all remaining Syskeyian civilians and any resistance personnel would at present be totally dependant on supplies shipped in by the Eurusean occupying force. Under such circumstances, it'd be pretty unlikely any major attacks would be carried out until / unless people became aware of a rescue operation.

This was the point to the scene with the fake ration cards; such a setup would be necessary to get food to any remaining Syskeyian soldiers still in hiding.

Well, I got some contact north of Bendecitia and on the sea side.

Sysk. What kind of energy do you use for your city? Gas, Nuclear, coal? Where is those power supplies located?

Need some more details of the city itself, both for me and the others since we're really close to urban combat now.

Well, most of the power would be from nuclear power, as I always choose the nuke power plant option in the power issue. And we're pretty excellent nuclear engineers (no Cherynobyls here :) )

Sorry I cut that post short, but I'm sort of short of time right now.

Aressi- ARESS (Anti-Radiation Enhanced Sea Sparrow) missile. The F-22AJ carries two on the wing pylons, plus two more in the bays (the F-22 has two central bays, and the LANTIRN system takes up one bay.) Got the idea, was well as the use of F-22s in air defense suppression, from here (http://www.geocities.com/dominantlogistics/raptor.html). Guess I'll be brushing up on my Harold Coyle and Tom Clancy for some inspiration tonight.

Coming tomorrow...

PARATROOPERS!
AIRDROPPED TANKS!
DETAILED BATTLE SCENES!

Same Sysk time, same Sysk channel.

(Oh, and Chimaea, it's Nukajam. I know the names might be a bit hard to read, but I've lost the "original" terrain map... long story.)

Heh, ok I'll edit if I remember.

That dogfight's gonna be weird, I'm going to have to play Jetfighter a bit to get the hang of it.

I see Iesus has somehow arrived via Navy without somehow encountering any Syskeyian/Chimaea forces/mines in international waters ;) But we'll let it go.

*COUGH*
Just to clear up....
The 3(yup. count 'em. three !) subs are "tasked with harashing the Chimaea fleet"......so we arnt avoiding your ships in international waters....they are in fact moving to attack those ships in international waters.
I'm sorry this wasnt clear in the post(I thought it was but I'm me:p) I will attempt to be more specific in future(aslong as you promise to read the posts more closely:P asummption is the mother of naughtyness)

Ummm... just how big is the Gulf of Syskeyia? I thought it was huge... I imagined that most of the First Fleet would be in the gulf?

Well that changes things... I think...

Well, since I've finally got a sketch of Dora I'm happy with:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Eurusea/Doramascher-final-above.jpg

And the Stalin Tank mentioned previously:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Eurusea/Stalin-above-concept.jpg

OK, I think I'll be able to post some combat and perhaps some "resistance" scenes this week if not this weekend.

Vegana, what kind of forces should I be expecting when I first go into the front lines? I need to know in order to write the battle scenes. :)

If you coming from the west you will first enter mined territory, followed by dug in shock troops when you come inte the suburbs... they have panzer and all. If you come from north you will first encounter "soft" penal batallions, propelled grenades are the heaviest they have. then the same as from the west when you come to the suburbs.

You will however encounter diseased soldiers with high fevers and many dead

we will start barraging units as they come closer, we don't really care about civilians, or own troops in those barrages as our soldiers main function is to die for the fatherland. We even might barrage in the inner city if you have a good enough troops concentration there

1. I would need to know the approximate population of St. Peter Claver.

2. I would love a Syskeyia post in the thread in question.

3. Godgodgod I need to slow down.

[/randomness]

I haven't been as inactive as people think. I've been writing a king of narrative to tie in the lose end of that special forces mission before major combat started. 5, 204 words now. And it's only half done, if that.

I can post what I have, in parts, now or I can post the whole thing when I finish. Whatever you guys want.

Post it in parts, makes it more readable

And done!

Sola Gratia: The True Story of Recon 1 (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=393859)

Just a note... Kwokwing's forward command post consists of a M577A4+ (http://www.jedsite.info/fulltrack/mike-number-us/m577_series/m577-series.html) variant of the MTVLS (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/Syskeyian_Mobile_Tactical_Vehicle_Light) family of vehicles, which are basically spun off from the M113 family of vehicles, and four Vikings (http://www.army-technology.com/projects/viking/) carrying comm equipment.

Of course, the M577 will have appliqué armor and be powered by a hybrid diesel-electric engine... not that it's relevant to the RP or such, just so you'd know. :)

not that it's relevant to the RP or such, just so you'd know. :)

...don't make me come over there >.<

Oh wait...

...and four Vikings carrying comm equipment.

Scanning the post, I read that first. Out of context it's far funnier than it has any real right to be.

Just a note that I'll get to posting stuff about the Bendecitia front(s) and the St. Peter Claver Island resistance this weekend. :)

Scanning the post, I read that first. Out of context it's far funnier than it has any real right to be.

Hmmm, if we ever decide to do a mock "blooper reel" of this RP...

OOC: Just a general note here, Pink Bunny Cola is an international corporation and not just a Knootian venture. There would not be Knootians in Vegana at any time nor would they run PBC Vegana. So, uhm, you'd be seizing stuff registered under a Veganan brand, and run by Veganans and with Veganan employees. So, really, this would only hurt yourself. The amount of arrests is therefore pegged firmly at zero. I guess you could ban PBC Reich or whatever it is called from paying liscencing fees to the main brand though.

And... several other joint ventures? Last I checked the DDR still has an embargo on all things Reich stemming from the SATO days. (which is also a reason for the above legal structure - a Knootian-run PBC would be banned from trading with the Reich)

Also, the 'Knootoss has declared war' thing is (I assume) propaganda, since we never declared war. You could have misread, obviously.

OK, I'll take casualties. What kind of artillery do you have- SP or towed? 'Cause if it's the latter than they'll be easy targets?

What's the number of artillery pieces you got? Because the I Corps alone has 360 M155 155mm assault guns, 378 MLRS launchers and 72 203mm SP howitzers.

And that's not copunting the (155mm-caliber) Assault Gun Mortars and 155mm-caliber Assault Guns assigned to each maneuver comapny HQ.

Just giving you numbers to see what you're up against.

OOC: Just a general note here, Pink Bunny Cola is an international corporation and not just a Knootian venture. There would not be Knootians in Vegana at any time nor would they run PBC Vegana. So, uhm, you'd be seizing stuff registered under a Veganan brand, and run by Veganans and with Veganan employees. So, really, this would only hurt yourself. The amount of arrests is therefore pegged firmly at zero. I guess you could ban PBC Reich or whatever it is called from paying liscencing fees to the main brand though.

And... several other joint ventures? Last I checked the DDR still has an embargo on all things Reich stemming from the SATO days. (which is also a reason for the above legal structure - a Knootian-run PBC would be banned from trading with the Reich)

Also, the 'Knootoss has declared war' thing is (I assume) propaganda, since we never declared war. You could have misread, obviously.

Heh, Seizing and confiscating generally means that all the "Stuff" as you call it now belongs to the Veganian government. Think Cuba and Castro. There will be a very limited number of arrests and the big factories will continue making soda, but no franchising money or anything like that will go back to PBC INC. That's a market of 40 Billion + being lost for PBC. WE expect PBC, which is as we've been talking about before, a majority knootian owned corp to put pressure on their governement.

And when it comes to war... Well considering that there are Knootian civilians involved in the conflict and the things said in the parliament (if that was totally secret, disregard that) and Knootians helping our enemy with military supplies. Could that be interpreted as anything else but an act of war?

OK, I'll take casualties. What kind of artillery do you have- SP or towed? 'Cause if it's the latter than they'll be easy targets?

What's the number of artillery pieces you got? Because the I Corps alone has 360 M155 155mm assault guns, 378 MLRS launchers and 72 203mm SP howitzers.

And that's not copunting the (155mm-caliber) Assault Gun Mortars and 155mm-caliber Assault Guns assigned to each maneuver comapny HQ.

Just giving you numbers to see what you're up against.

WEll, You made an attack, and my artillery fired upon the area where they knew there were troops assembled. Your artillery doesn't help to protect you from that. I will take casualties when you fire upon me with your guns.

Vegana, I don't mind if you are only taking light casualties but I'd like at least an ic explanation for them. From what I can figure out, I've launched at least three powerful attacks against your fleet now, with only four ships damaged. I specifically aimed my submarines' torpedos at the battleships, and yet I have not heard of any damage to them. I have also launched a large attack with a squadron of my planes, which also has received no response.

Vegana, I don't mind if you are only taking light casualties but I'd like at least an ic explanation for them. From what I can figure out, I've launched at least three powerful attacks against your fleet now, with only four ships damaged. I specifically aimed my submarines' torpedos at the battleships, and yet I have not heard of any damage to them. I have also launched a large attack with a squadron of my planes, which also has received no response.

WEll, I think i have? One cruiser is down. I'm taking damages on my flagships even if they are using counter measures and anti -aircrafts. Several of my lighter ships are heavily damaged and sunk and some of my Hovercrafts is down too. I'm taking a heavy toll here...

The battle ships are much better armed and prepared for attacks from the air and the sea. The submarines you have will be countered with Destroyers but I haven't put them up yet because I felt that the air attack was more imminent. When you get by the destroyers (since my subs are by Chimaean fleet) you might be able to strike at my carriers. But its not like I'm putting them in front. They are the best guarded both by air crafts, destroyers and placed in the middle of my fleet. I'm even desperate enough to use 1 Kt nuclear warheads on your ships with my thingies when my planes are approaching. Which will kill off them.

Could you tell me where your planes are because they seem to be attacking me and guarding your fleet at the same time?

Umm... if you're going to launch a low-scale nuke the part of the Baron Defence Grid above Syskeyia can detect it and shoot it out of the air... though since everything is so close to each other it might not be able to shoot it in time. I dunno... if y'all like a nuke attack I can just ignore it or miss for the sake of the story. *is not that concerned* ;p

And yes, I know, I have to post. Shh.

Vegana: just because I have some planes doing some things doesn't mean I can't have others doing others. I have TEN carrier groups in this theatre, which gives me nearly six hundred planes. So I have posted some attacking your fleet, some ready to counter an air attack, and some in reserve, ready to support either the fleet or the landing marines. Divide them evenly into thirds if you like.

Now, if I happened to miss you posting damage beyond four smaller ships wrecked, I apologize. But it doesn't seem like you've taken much damage at all compared to me.

Also, frankly, unless you STATE that your defenses from destroyers take out my attacks, you're not thinking about this clearly, I think. You see, with my AWACs in the air, and my satellites also sending images I can target anything I want to. This is, btw, modern tech and quite reasonable.

As I've said, I don't mind if you have reasons, but I'd like to see them very clearly in character.

Umm... if you're going to launch a low-scale nuke the part of the Baron Defence Grid above Syskeyia can detect it and shoot it out of the air... though since everything is so close to each other it might not be able to shoot it in time. I dunno... if y'all like a nuke attack I can just ignore it or miss for the sake of the story. *is not that concerned* ;p

And yes, I know, I have to post. Shh.

No nukes fired. Their stuck to trained critters underneath Lavenrunz fleet. One 1 Kt charge weighs about 50 kg with tech from the Eighties. So no, I wont launch missile strikes.


Vegana: just because I have some planes doing some things doesn't mean I can't have others doing others. I have TEN carrier groups in this theatre, which gives me nearly six hundred planes. So I have posted some attacking your fleet, some ready to counter an air attack, and some in reserve, ready to support either the fleet or the landing marines. Divide them evenly into thirds if you like.

Now, if I happened to miss you posting damage beyond four smaller ships wrecked, I apologize. But it doesn't seem like you've taken much damage at all compared to me.

Also, frankly, unless you STATE that your defenses from destroyers take out my attacks, you're not thinking about this clearly, I think. You see, with my AWACs in the air, and my satellites also sending images I can target anything I want to. This is, btw, modern tech and quite reasonable.

As I've said, I don't mind if you have reasons, but I'd like to see them very clearly in character.

I hear you. Must admit I missed that you had ten carrier groups parked outside Bendecitia *Bangs his head for being absent and missing their approach*

I agree with your targeting, as I have the same. I will try to make some time to write a more covering post.

Um, Vegana, how big is that force you mentioned in your last post in the war thread? You know, the one with the phony tanks and the armored force on your/my (I forgot which) left flank? Because I need to know what size the battle is before I can write.

And yes, I will agree to the cease fire, but OOC I hope we can have one last big firefight. :)

Just in case there is anybody involved in this RP not aware of Vegana's thread here:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=399013

Um, Vegana, how big is that force you mentioned in your last post in the war thread? You know, the one with the phony tanks and the armored force on your/my (I forgot which) left flank? Because I need to know what size the battle is before I can write.

And yes, I will agree to the cease fire, but OOC I hope we can have one last big firefight. :)

Ok, the phony one is quite big. Much like the ones that the serbs did in the balkans to make Nato spend their bombs on false targets. It's made to deterr and make you reroute your forces into an ambush.

THe ambush cant be too big. It consists of a small point force with Inquisitors and Jaeger Panzer. that is supported by a brigade of Shock troops. But the actual ambush could be played in a small valley if thats ok with you. That way it would only be a few tanks and maybe a few hundred soldiers.

Looked at your post Vegana, and it seems you have the fake tanks + ambush on the Chimaean front.

Heck, at first I thought it was on my front, and I've sort of got an idea for that (Your ambush involves a supported a brigade, so I thought it might be nice for me to have a "heroic brigade" fighting them?)

Could you please retcon it so that I face it?

Just a request. :)

ummm...

I think you missunderstood what I wrote...

Yet, this alone wasn't enough. And as such, it didn't take more than mere hours until each Placard was graced with two crosses, one to the left, one to the right, on each of them, a random Syskeyian Cherubim had found nearby was nailed, bleeding, in agony, yet, thankfulkly, dying quickly within the quarter of an hour, as unlike the romans, EC didn't use means to prevent circulatory collapse.

Still, their pleading, their begging for help... But two Cherubim 'guarding' the place, everywhere, were quite efficient in securing the areas.Bold added.

Which means that they grabbed the two nearest Syskeyians and crucified them, not themselves. And two Cherubim are guarding the placard. Well, and the poor syskeyians dying from circulatory collapse.

As such...

"No positive effect, sir. They replaced the placards, and are now crucifying two Cherubim next to every placard."

"Did you say crucifying?"

"Yes sir."

Damn, the colonel thought. But their own soldiers... he laughed quielty to himself. Hell, that's sacreligous and stupid.I suggest you edit this part.

Oh, and as for distinguishing between Cherubim/ Seraphim, the Seraphim are generally taller (Roughly 10cm), and have significantly larger wings. So, should be easy enough to distinguish between them.

Getting close enough is an entirely different issue, seeing as there are... Roughly 500 of them present, and they're rather well protected. The lower ranked ones should be doable, though. The higher ranked ones are rarely seen outside their rooms.

Oh, and keep in mind that they are mildly psychic. They cannot hijack a mind, but reading it is doable if they're aware of a relevant presence. Of course, this is kinda unknown to you (Or indeed, basically everyone), so until you manage to get an Eurusean psychic to inform you of weird stuff inside the EC half of S. Peter, it should take a while to figure it out. I guess that surviving Syskeyian resistance members are spreading some rumours of the Cherubim (They cannot read a mind, but they can detect a nervous system) being kinda accurate when searching for said resistance members, though.

So, once you have figured this out: Stay OUT of their line of sight (Amusingly enough, this is easy to do, as they're generally trying to avoid dangerous situations, so a well hidden sniper should be quite capable of doing it).

Vegana, I'm confused. Do you realize that one of my marine divisions is actually past the beach? I posted that and thought that was what you were reacting to. Now it seems like there ARE defenses on the beaches. If so...well I mean I've landed in force. I'm not quite sure how to respond to what you're writing.

Vegana, I'm confused. Do you realize that one of my marine divisions is actually past the beach? I posted that and thought that was what you were reacting to. Now it seems like there ARE defenses on the beaches. If so...well I mean I've landed in force. I'm not quite sure how to respond to what you're writing.

Well, Think Omaha Beach, but not as fortified. You landed on the beach, now you have to pay the price. The defenses are after the actual beach, since it doesn't make much sense to build entrenchements in the sand. When you come enmasse like that you make an excellent target.

The Martyrs work is to pin you down and paint you for the heavies while you still are concentrated. I'm sorry if that didn't come out completely clear. I thought it was obvious when I wrote that they were watching your troops land and let them come closer before they unleash their firepower. My bad. *swears over paranoid german IT-companies that don't allow IRC*

*swears over paranoid german IT-companies that don't allow IRC*Seeing the things you would use IRC for, I wouldn't call it paranoid. More realistic :P

Well if You know the other thing the huns make us do.. Wait! You DO know! You're one of them! ;)

... Work?

My condolences :P

Sorry I haven't been around much. Now that university has started NS takes... well, a much lower place in my priorities x_x

But I'll post. Just... slowly. :p

Well, Think Omaha Beach, but not as fortified. You landed on the beach, now you have to pay the price. The defenses are after the actual beach, since it doesn't make much sense to build entrenchements in the sand. When you come enmasse like that you make an excellent target.

The Martyrs work is to pin you down and paint you for the heavies while you still are concentrated. I'm sorry if that didn't come out completely clear. I thought it was obvious when I wrote that they were watching your troops land and let them come closer before they unleash their firepower. My bad. *swears over paranoid german IT-companies that don't allow IRC*

You know...
I think there is a major miscommunication here. Because I posted my recon battalions moving BEYOND the beach several posts ago. Read what I wrote carefully, please. I assumed that there WERE no defenses on the beach. Really, you might have posted this attack when I began the landings.

Speaking of landings...

I've been thinking of how to retake St. Peter Claver Island.

1st part- use specops to destroy the land battleship.

2nd part- Invade the island

The invasion would consist of 130 Expeditionary Strike Groups (http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/news/.www/esg.html) supported by 10 Carrier Battle Groups. I'd first try to destroy the Stalin tanks from the air (Mavericks, big bombs, cruise missiles, etc.), as I'm not really sure the Abrams over even the Hellfires could destroy them (and, c'mon, how effectively can you hide a 3,000-ton tank?). Of course, there would be naval bombardment and such. With that, do you think that 12-13 mechanized infantry divisions would be enough to defeat the Eurusean-Reich forces and retake the island? (I'm assuming the vast majority of the OMG wankfleet of d00m has left.)

1st part- use specops to destroy the land battleship.

'Disable the main gun' maybe, which, as I said, isn't extended and only would be when the strike group appeared, meaning you'd lose a couple of ships to that big 21 before it was gone. Actually destroying a Ground Battleship is a lil' beyond the reach of infantry and a job for airstrikes or naval bombardment.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Eurusea/Doramascher-final-above.jpg

Her main gun is located under the hatch with the star on it, with the barrel under the C-C-C-P section which opens forwards to deploy the gun.

2nd part- Invade the island

The invasion would consist of 130 Expeditionary Strike Groups (http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/news/.www/esg.html) supported by 10 Carrier Battle Groups. I'd first try to destroy the Stalin tanks from the air (Mavericks, big bombs, cruise missiles, etc.), as I'm not really sure the Abrams over even the Hellfires could destroy them (and, c'mon, how effectively can you hide a 3,000-ton tank?).

They're not hidden, they're in the open to be more intimidating to potential troublemakers. Priority is the turret and not the chassis unless you're trying to breach their reactor, much the same as Dora-chan.

The Stalin uses a pair of 12-inch L75 glide cannons in the turret, just for reference; 'glide cannon' here referring to the barrel being held inside an outer barrel for support, which it recoils inside using runners, much the same as the 305mm L85 gun used by GMC's Death Adder (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/GMC/Death-Adder-Concept.jpg).

Of course, there would be naval bombardment and such. With that, do you think that 12-13 mechanized infantry divisions would be enough to defeat the Eurusean-Reich forces and retake the island? (I'm assuming the vast majority of the OMG wankfleet of d00m has left.)

Sounds like far too many, actually; Eurusea has pulled all conscripts off the island and only left the professional soldiers and political officers behind. 4-6 divisions if you want to make a decent fight out of it would do.

As a final note, if you don't make a lil' USS Arizona-style memorial to the Trinity after all this, I'll be extremely disappointed.

*Checks* Well, with regards to EC's forces, about 1/4 of the fleet is still present. Which is to say, one carrier, one battleship, four cruisers, eight destroyers. If my memory regarding the original numbers isn't betraying me.

On the ground, there should still be all ground forces (Roughly 56000 men altogether) present.

Your old airbases on St. Peter are now used by EC's airforce, they might have build some improvised airbases, too (Not sure what you had there beforehand). Numbers are limited, though. Think roughly 220 helicopters & planes, a good chunk of them being transporters, AWACS etc..

ICly, I will have trouble sending reinforcements (Some bigger attempt at a revolution back home), so there wont be much of a naval threat. I will attempt to get supplies in by way of aerial transports, though.

Oh, and there will be a few submarines in the vicinity of St. Peter. Say, eight.

Now... For EC's fleet presence... The ships are horribly overgunned, feature quite a bit of armour etc. etc.. I guess it will take you a 2:1 superiority to have a chance, and a 3:1 superiority to ensue victory. And outrunning (Which would be possible) isn't really a possibility, givcen that they're just sitting near St. Peter.

On the plus side, having said numerical superiority isn't that much of a problem, seeing as much of EC's resources goes into the space program, and said program isn't used in this thread.

The ground forces... Well, they are tactically... Well, lets say, missguided. But seeing as they will defend, you will have problems. And I don't know how eager you are on bombing defence positions with lots of bound hostages in them... But once your ground forces are landing, they will commit a few grave tactical mistakes, so it should work. On the other hand, the fleet did so in the initial battle, too, and you didn't use your chance... But hey.

The aircraft present should be vastly inferior, numerically. And their quality is object to discuss, so... You should manage air superiority within a relatively short period of time.

Of course, I'm compensating with a good amount of ground to air defences, so it might be costly.

Fleet numbers are known to you by way of simple reconnaissance. Same for air numbers. Approximate fleet capacities are known due to the initial battle near St. Peter, but you didn't really field serious opponents, so you might underestimate their capacities.

As for the ground forces, you know pretty much nothing, apart from approximate numbers.

'Disable the main gun' maybe,

Oops... that's what I meant. :(

Sounds like far too many, actually; Eurusea has pulled all conscripts off the island and only left the professional soldiers and political officers behind. 4-6 divisions if you want to make a decent fight out of it would do.

Hmm....well I might just have 12, as the total of EC's ground forces would equal 8 Syskeyian divisions in personnel alone. 8-10 divisions perhaps?

As a final note, if you don't make a lil' USS Arizona-style memorial to the Trinity after all this, I'll be extremely disappointed.

Heck, I hadn't thought of that. I'll do it. Though I have given thought to making the carcass of the Doramascher the basis of a war museum...

Hmm....well I might just have 12, as the total of EC's ground forces would equal 8 Syskeyian divisions in personnel alone. 8-10 divisions perhaps?For Eurusea, what GMC said. For EC, more. Seeing as this invasion cannot be anything but horribly costly, I guess you will suffer a lot. And Cherubim don't surrender. Depending on how fast you want to retake St. Peter (Fast to save civilian lives would mean horrible casualities for your troops, slow, with extensive bombardements should reduce your casualities rather drastically, but there wont be many civilians left, on the southern half).

For a little reference here, no ortillery from Constantinopolis. I've kept the Eurusean orbital strike platforms [of which there are several] out of this with respect to the tech level of Syskeyia, and I'd rather keep a 'no ortillery' thing going here. wankiness of precision ortillery]. After all, vapourising the Syskeyian relief / invasion fleet in one paragraph wouldn't be particularly sporting, or even interesting.

I can't say I have much interest in retaking this island--from an RP point of view. If you want Chimaean support, Sysk, it's going to be limitted--I can't see Lady Bryce being enthusiastic about it. She's want to just get back the civilian population from negotiations.

*sigh* I guess I can't be around as much as I thought, I'm up to my neck in work. I'll try my best but no guarantees =/

You know...
I think there is a major miscommunication here. Because I posted my recon battalions moving BEYOND the beach several posts ago. Read what I wrote carefully, please. I assumed that there WERE no defenses on the beach. Really, you might have posted this attack when I began the landings.

Well, You assumed wrong. This post would have you to believe otherwise:


Bendecitia, easter Front
Dug down in trenches the ninth brigade watched the forces emerge from the sea with glee. They intended to let them come a bit closer and then open up with everything they had. If this worked as planned the enemy would be driven back and they could activate the mines on that beach section to box them in. One of the men caressed the gun that stood beside him, it would definitely have its share of blood today.

and it is posted straight after your landing. You're walking into people dug in and ready to fire at you.

Kindly don't take that tone with me. Read these. If you have a problem with them, fine. Otherwise don't bloody patronize me.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333941&page=18&pp=15

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333941&page=19&pp=15

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333941&page=19&pp=15

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333941&page=20&pp=15

Not patronizing you, you just dont seem to see the same as I do.

You are deploying troops on a beach outside a fortified city. My troops are waiting for you. Your troops are out in the open. We wait until us opening fire will do the most damage.

I prefer doing this discussion over T-gram. And could you please use less of caps lock, I might think that YOU are trying to patronize ME and as you know that really makes a person pissed off...

I want it known that I'm out of this idiotic thread. I do not want to be involved with any Reich nations at all. I'm tired of being accused of a lack of integrity when in fact I have perfectly legitimate questions and am being given the brush off. I have never avoided posting casualties in a game thread. Just because Vegana thinks I should be role playing Omaha Beach is no reason why I should have to just because he bloody says so.

...eep.

I'll um try to get things wrapped up... less free time+more stress=Nationstates for me.

Alright, I lost my temper because I don't like people accusing me of trying to weasel out of things. I am willing to submit judgement on this to whatever mod is acceptable if Vegana is also willing to abide by that judgement. Let someone neutral decide who is right here.

Alright.

After reading (For the third time), I guess the major misscommunication is the definition of 'beach' differing between ya two. Between 'The first hundred meters after the water' (Lavenrunz) and 'The first kilometer landinward' (Vegana, supported by his 'Letting them land, waiting with the mines until they are further inward').

Now... From what I can see, this means that 1. The recon units couldn't really move further than to the ninth bataillon's trenches (Wherever they may be), and 2. They, together with parts of the first division are prolly the ones currently engaged by the ninth bataillon.

So... Where is the problem, again?

Well, Rezo's definition works for me. That is really what I was trying to get at, and yeah, I got frustrated because it doesn't make sense that I would have no idea at all of people right AT the beach. Maybe 'beach' is what is confusing.
Frankly, it is also that people--Rezo and Vegana--have used kind of rhetorical language about the fate of my forces that got me really frustrated; it made it seem entirely futile and pointless.

Anyway, I'll wait to see what Vegana says.

Um, Sysk:

Top priority for any assault would be disabling her main 22-inch high-angle gun [which you wouldn't even be aware of the existence of until she started deploying it, since it retracts for transport].

Ie, since the main gun hasn't been extended yet, you might know there was a large hatch on the upper surface, but not what was under it.

Ie, since the main gun hasn't been extended yet, you might know there was a large hatch on the upper surface, but not what was under it.

Oops.

Well, I've got some SR-71s, and they might have flown over the island taking pictures of it.

Dunno if the Dorasmascher (sp?) would fire at them. If not, then I'll moidify the post to say that they don't know what it is, maybe list some possible theories, etc.

<Mei_Ikari> Older versions [11-507] have a battery of mortars, version 607 mounts a single large mortar, versions later than Dora have a VLS array and sometimes ten ICBM tubes instead of the high-angle gun. Can't really generalise.

OK, here's something that's been bothering me.

This war has beeng going on since August or so.

Because of this, I haven't been able to get into any wars, and so on.

Right now, there's the Excalbian RP, and I plan to get involved. But I can't if I'm still involved in this war.

So, can we just agree that, for "timeline" purposes, the war is over and I have the island and Bendecitia (I think we've already agreed to it), and that my military has grown, we're rebuidling etc., and just blame it all on fluid time.

I'm not saying discontinuing the RP - I'm saying that we should, in IC stuff not directly connected to the RP, claim the war is over, etc.

OOC:
As far as the Excalbia thing is concerned, Syskeyia will still be at war unless the war is resolved somehow. Simply because Syskeyia being incapacitated features heavily in Knootian decision-making in this entire affair up to now.

Thank you. End of message.

I'll wait until GMC replies.

Um, that's for you two to work out between yourselves. Can't force Knoot to accept an application of fluid time regardless of whether I agree to it or not, really.

I feel kind of the same way but I'd like to hear from Vegana as well.

Ok, you didn't ask for my opinions but I shall voice them anyways ^_^

I'm kind of... annoyed by this very long and dragging RP. I got caught up with real life stuff and when I returned I just couldn't make my stuff flow.

I'd be glad if Vegana and Syskeyia replied in the negotiation thread and we had some sort of proper ending to it all. No need to RP out the battles, I think everyone is getting tired of it.

Actually, I've been looking forward to RPing the retaking of the island.

Just not the SpecOps taking out the big gun.

So can we just say some of my SpecOps disabled the gun and get on with it?

Actually, I've been looking forward to RPing the retaking of the island.

Just not the SpecOps taking out the big gun.

So can we just say some of my SpecOps disabled the gun and get on with it?

Sure. Cause, you know, doing anything difficult is no fun. Hell, why don't you just say you've got the island?

Oh! And while you're at it, why don't we just say that you single-handedly crushed the Reich beneath your heel?

Sure. Cause, you know, doing anything difficult is no fun. Hell, why don't you just say you've got the island?

Oh! And while you're at it, why don't we just say that you single-handedly crushed the Reich beneath your heel?

hehe....
anyhow, make peace or More boom boom! sick of 'us'* sitting on our arses doing nothing...

Actually, sarcasm aside, I think everyone is getting very frustrated about this one. I'd like to hear from Vegana first but honestly, let's either get it done or work out a referee or something.

Sure. Cause, you know, doing anything difficult is no fun. Hell, why don't you just say you've got the island?

Actually, I'm quite willing to RP the retaking of the island. Just not the SpecOps RP right now.

So, my suggestion is, right now we say that the gun was disabled, go on to RP the retaking of the island, and then maybe RP the specops thing later?

OK, here's the rough specops plan:

Sometime at night, the specops sneak in.

They either have a small vehicle (such as the Viking or the Wiesel) or they travel on foot- either is fine with me.

Anyway, they sneak up on the Dorasmascher and, with AT missiles (probably Starstreaks or Javelins if dismounted, maybe Hellfires if they have a vehicle), diable the main gun.

Then, they merge with the general resistance or get killed. Either reaction is fine. :)

Thing is, I don't want to wait until the end of a long, small-scale SpecOps RP to get to the invasion and thus the end of the war. That's all.

Well, since GMC won't reply, here's some pics:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/pacific_mtvl.gif
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/pacific_abrams.gif

The first pic is of the APC I'll be using (basically my MTVL "amphibiized" - similar to what the Italians did (http://www.jedsite.info/fulltrack/mike-number-us/m113_series/arisgator/arisgator-intro.html) and what can be done (http://www.geocities.com/armysappersforward/amphigavins.htm) with the Arisgator (http://www.arisspa.it/inglese/arisgator.htm) modification to the M113), and the other is of my Abrams (which shall arrive by LST.)

Now, I'm wondering what kind of cammo would be most appropriate for the island. Here's the two schemes I'm thinking about:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/pacific_bdu.gif http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/sys_new_bdu_armor.gif

Both of them are utilizing the "digital camouflage" thing that's all the rage in militaries these days. (But unlike the US Army's ACU, it actually works in combat! :) ) Just asking for your advice. :D

To pass the time while a certian someone refuses to respond, Here's a "battle map" of St. Peter Claver Island we can use as a basis for when the retaking takes place:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/spcbattlemap.gif
Basically, I'd like for people to post their "positions" of their (larger) units so we can get a basic idea of the general battle situation (I'm kind of a visual person :) )

To pass the time while a certian someone refuses to respond, Here's a "battle map" of St. Peter Claver Island we can use as a basis for when the retaking takes place:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/spcbattlemap.gif
Basically, I'd like for people to post their "positions" of their (larger) units so we can get a basic idea of the general battle situation (I'm kind of a visual person :) )

Hrm...It's a little difficult without any idea of the terrian or locations of minor settlements, unless the map is supposed to imply the whole island is flat...

In any case, having got hold of Knoot on IRC to work out what he was trying to say above, he meant that his RP is set at the same time as this one, meaning even if this one is finished it will only mean that it's then right after the battle on St Peter, with the Syskeyian Navy having taken severe losses, and St Peter and two coastal cities on the Syskeyian mainland needing to be rebuilt.

There would be calls from all across the military for resignations of high-ranking staff, calls for everything up to the complete replacement of all navy ships that would at very least end with all Iowa class ships still in service being mothballed or turned into museum-ships.

In other words, since I can't figure out how to carry on without the special forces RP section [which really isnt going to take that long] and you won't get to jump in to Knoot's RP regardless of how quickly or slowly this one is finished, we might as well get it done.

If we're going to end this, let's give it a proper end rather than rushing it.

To put thing succintly, I'm tired of this war. Why? Because it's tied up my nation since August or so.
Knoot-TB conflict? Can't support anyone, gotta fight off Eurusea.
Civil War in Reichskamphen? Nope, can't join, Eurusea's invading me.
Tripartite schism in Zvarinograd? Love to join, but no, gotta stick to the Eurusea war.
Christian-OIH conflict brewing in Excalbian Isles? Yup, teh Eurusea War strikes again.

And stop it with the "OMG U R going to recieve teh massive casualties" BS. I'm sick of it. You wanna know how many ships are in my fleet? Roughly one thousand. 980 if you take the Carrier strike groups and Expeditionary Strike Groups alone (the fleet also has ammo ships, tankers, hospital ships etc.) And don't go blowing up my transports. 12 mechanized infantry divisions is a lot of forces, and I'm not even sure if they are enough to retake the island, I would HATE it if you took the easy way out and killed them at sea.

I'd go on this rant, bashing all of you for your supertanks and Doujins and how you all think a military is worthless and stupid unless your wank and wank and wank because I REFUSE to become one of those nations who has an income tax of 100% and yet has a capitalist economy, becuase I want to keep my taxes down to 30-40%, a realistic economy, and don't want to suffer the massive logistics troubles of Mammoths and Dojuins and whatnot.

But I must study now.

Yes, the end's been a long time coming, which is exactly why we should end this war properly rather than trying to rush it. Go out with a bang rather than a whimper, as the saying goes. Now:

And stop it with the "OMG U R going to recieve teh massive casualties" BS. I'm sick of it.

You did recieve severe casualties among the ships stationed at the island. Already. Speaking in the past tense, as in the ships that were destroyed during the invasion. You're putting words in my mouth again; I am not saying the majority of the second fleet will get wiped out, I am saying the majority of the first fleet was wiped out.

12 mechanized infantry divisions is a lot of forces, and I'm not even sure if they are enough to retake the island, I would HATE it if you took the easy way out and killed them at sea.

Are you forgetting I'VE ALREADY AGREED YOU CAN RE-TAKE THE ISLAND again? And that said agreement means I could take no action that would completely prevent you from taking the island back? Meaning if your fleet suffers casualties, it won't be enough to stop that. Meaning if your landing force takes casualties at sea, it won't be enough to stop them re-taking the island.

Meaning that no action I will take will be aimed at going back on my word. I gave it, I keep it.

I'd go on this rant, bashing all of you for your supertanks and Doujins and how you all think a military is worthless and stupid unless your wank and wank and wank...

The Overlord Airship Iron Casket was one of the largest in Eurusea's Air Navy, and was shot down by missiles fired from Syskeyian F-14 and F/A-18 fighter jets. Which is pretty good going, all told. I could have wanked and said that modern air-to-air missiles had no chance against an armoured target about the size of a small carrier. I didn't.

The vast majority of the first and second landing waves on St Peter were wiped out, near total casualties on the first wave. I could have completely broken character and made them all professional soldiers or hell, even Red Commados. I could have made the entire assault force D-Commados even though there's only three in the entire Eurusean Federation if I'd wanted to play the 'rawr me big' game. I didn't.

The waters around St Peter contain a sizeable number of Eurusean shipwrecks as well as the Syskeyian ones, even though you were using things like 60-year-old Iowa mods against modern Eurusean battleships that would actually have better fire control, AA defences, gun range, firepower, armour and probably greater speed were I not cutting you breaks because GRAAR I WIPE THE FLOOR WITH YOU isn't any fun. Further, the Floating Fortresses never raised their Absolute Barriers and only one Overlord Airship out of ten did [i]anything.

Are you getting the picture here? I've said this before and I'll say it again, I've given you as many breaks to make this fair as I possibly could.

* There are no Floating Fortresses [or any surface ships bigger than cruisers] left at St Peter.

* They have not been reinforced. In fact, Turtsev actually reduced his force strength by sending the conscripts under his command back to Eurusea leaving only the professional soldiers.

* They have a grand total of three PS-11 Stalin Tanks and one Ground Battleship; no Air Fortresses, Levellers, Ground Carriers, Lucifers, Air Carriers, Ground Infinity Cannons...And the Ground Battleship herself is one of the older ones in the Eurusean People's Army. I have told you several times it can be destroyed, I've even been generous enough to say how.

* This entire RP is set before the excavation of Sekhmet so you don't have to try to deal with that.

How much more do you need to be given? I am asking that you make my life writing the end of this thread a little less confusing by taking the time to write two or three posts of Special Forces doing their thing before the Syskeyian fleet arrives.

Not to let me keep St Peter.

Not to let me wipe out your invasion force even though that's not what we agreed.

Would it kill you to have a little faith in my ability to keep my word?

because I REFUSE to become one of those nations who has an income tax of 100% and yet has a capitalist economy

Neither of my main nations have 100% income tax and a capitalist economy.

Oh, before I start writing the next post (Finally) (And while noting that just *writing* the commando thing instead of ranting here, would have cost you the same amount of time, while being more productive), I suppose that

1. The demarcation zone goes right through the island, the lake in the middle and st. Peter Claver city

2. The island is flat

3. My own forces (Somewhat larger than Euruseas, I think) will be concentrated on a) Fortifications at the coast (The ones they're building rigt now) and b) certain points inside the area they control. The rest will at that time (I.e. not now) be considerably free.

'Course, by that time, a good amount of the inhabitants will be dead, too. Come to think of it you should RP some underground trying to smuggle people (Predominantly Children) from my half of the Island to Eurusea's half. I suppose that 1. Your people will prefer the Euruseans to me and 2. The Euruseans, though nominally allied, have certain problems with EC's ideology & methods (Hence the wall), so they might not be entirely against such a thing, so long as such an underground cooperates with them.

... of course, such requires the Underground to give up on its 'Armed resistance' philosophy and to concentrate on the point of actually saving people from certain death, which is not something I've seen happening.

Sorry. I was just ranting, blowing off steam. Not everything was necessary aimed at you. I was just tired of looking through stuff, seeing ubertanks w/8in guns and all that, and the fact that some of the guys who have criticized me for my "puny" military on #irc have 100% tax rates and "Frightening" free market economies.

(As an aside, while I did name names, please don't take it personally - it's not meant to be.)

I guess the thing I have with RPing a specops force is, well, the old quote "better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt" will suffice when it comes to specops RPing.

2-3 posts? I thought it would take longer. But, well, any advice (basic to advanced) on how to do this specops would be greatly appreciated.

On a happier note, 1)I finished all my finals today and 2)I've been doing a lot of thinking on how to do the recapture of the island.

Oh, and a more detailed map of St. Peter Claver shall come soon- like today or tomorrow-ish. (Or Friday :eek: at the latest.)

EC, I have a problem with this part of your post:
When cellars were covered by the debris of skyscrapers...
Because there aren't really any skyscrapers on St. Peter Claver Island. The architecture of the island is very much High Gothic Revival, in contradistinction to the Neoclassical architecture that Amerigo exhibited at least before the Slaver War (he described one major building as "Greco-Roman" and there's a lot of Italian stuff to his nation, so, well... the people of St. Peter Claver Island, always in fear on an invasion by Amerigo, decided to "go in the opposite direction" and do everything "in the French style.")

Also, while the island's architecture is largely [neo-]Gothic [revival], the non-ecclesastical buildings of the isle are more Lyndhurst Manor (http://www.hudsonvalleyruins.org/yasinsac/lyndhurst/LyndhurstHaleBopp2a.JPG) and British Parliament then they are "quaint Victorian middle-class home" in style (if not in expense.)

'k, will edit as soon as I log into EC again.

'The man with the rifle shoots! When the man with the rifle is killed, the man without the rifle picks up the rifle and shoots! The man without the rifle follows the one who has the rifle!'

Just thinking... I was playing the "Stalingrad" level in Call of Duty, (just got the game) and right after the player leaves the boat, he goes into a line where a officer-type person is giving virtually the exact same briefing as you had your Eurusean guy give.

I have to wonder, was that a conscious reference to the game? :)

(On a completely different note, I have come to appreciate the utility of a scoped Mosin-Nagant as a sniper rifle in urban areas. :sniper: )

I have to wonder, was that a conscious reference to the game? :)

Yes, that's exactly what it was. I do it all the time, the references are usually just a little more obscure [Ground Battleship Doramascher from Strikers 1945, Battle Air Ship Iron Casket from Strikers 1945 II]

2-3 posts? I thought it would take longer. But, well, any advice (basic to advanced) on how to do this specops would be greatly appreciated.

Realistically, it needs a single post for them to realise the Ground Battleship has a main gun and has opened fire, presumably on a fleet that's coming to liberate them.

In that post, introduce a few people, avoiding the stereotypes as much as possible, ending with them starting out. If St Peter City had underground train lines those would be a perfect way to get there, otherwise there's always sewers.

Second post, they get there, spread out and start their plan.

Third post, following the return-fire they probably all get killed.

OK, just one thing...

I'm thinking of doing something to "draw out" the gun, so that I can OOC know the gun is there (and attack it with my specops) before it starts attacking my fleet.

Some thoughts:
Bombing run w/long-range bombers
Phony assault fleet

Any suggestions?

Oh, and the map is revised (with some elevations - no real, detailed idea where the minor settlements would be)

Sorry. I was just ranting, blowing off steam. Not everything was necessary aimed at you. I was just tired of looking through stuff like Midlonia, Zeppelin Manufacturers, FT stuff etc., seeing ubertanks w/8in guns and all that, and the fact that some of the guys who have criticized me for my "puny" military (like Marduk and Midlonia) on #irc have 100% tax rates and "Frightening" free market economies.

Quite how one can "not take personally" an obvious personal attack quite escapes me, anyhow, alot of my MEGA-TANKS are either in pathetically small numbers, or are still in the testing stages [despite some being in the MK II & III stages. Hell, I decommed some of them and cut them up [the older versions] and have placed in slightly more pratical or less crap-looking.

It's usually best to do what other people do and not point out people.
I request my name be removed from this silly list.

OK, just one thing...

I'm thinking of doing something to "draw out" the gun, so that I can OOC know the gun is there (and attack it with my specops) before it starts attacking my fleet.

As I said, be a little hard when you have no idea if it even has one; it's a little excessive to lose a stack of bombers on what is essentially a mission to gather intel about an enemy weapon. Also, your command doesn't have any idea what Syskeyian forces are left on the island, so couldn't really take action as if there were special forces there.

That make sense?

It would possibly be a good idea to follow the line of 'They have something big there. It [i]ought[/] to be a menace, so 1. check it out and 2. Once you know more, figure out the best way to manage a mission kill. Then, in 3. Kill it.'

Judging by what some people have said about the war (*coughKnootosscough*), you'd think that the Nazis had it better during April of 1945.

Well, to debunk this myth, I whipped up this map:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/ohonoreichtakessyskeyia.gif

Note, look how small a percentage of Syskeyia the Reich and Eurusea have managed to take (Syskeyian Mars and St. Peter Claver Island not shown to scale.) Yes, that's right, while several million Syskeyian have suffered from Reich/Eurusean occupation, the vast majority of Syskeyians are still under the de facto governance of the Republic. (The residents of Bendecitia and St. Peter Claver Island are, according to Syskeyian law, under the de jure governance of the Republic, but Reich and Eurusean troops make that .... a bit hard to enforce.) In fact, the war is going my way IMHO (Vegana has agreed to a ceasefire and will withdraw from Syskeyia, and I'm gearing up to retake St. Peter Claver Island.)

Just putting a certain canard to rest.

Just a few things (yes, I will revive the thread)

1) St. Peter Claver Island has roughly the same amount of land area as Okinawa. (About 1200 square kilometers)

2) I was planning on RPing some naval observers attached to army units (observing for artillery) How would that work as it does in RL?

3) Any plausible way I can get that big gun to come out of the Dorasmascher before the fleet arrives?

Hmmm... did some calculations recently, and it looks like I can send, at most 7 mech inf. divisions by sea to St. Peter Claver if I go with 1 mech inf. company per Expeditionary Strike Group (Armored units are put in the LSTs).

'Stan, I neep help. :)

Just got a TG from GMC.

Right now I'm seriously contemplating just having St. Peter Claver blow up in a big volcanic blast or something.

Because GMC is adamantly insistent that he blow some ships up with the Dorasmascher.

Personally, I don't think that there's enough time to assemble and plant a SpecOps force on the island if the fleet's already in range of the gun.

Of course, I could try to blow up the gun before the fleet arrives, but noooo, there's no way I could draw the gun without sending a fleet to the island (and I don't really think I can afford to do so, given my naval capabilities, my responsibility to defending the Gulf of Syskeyia, and my sealift capabilities.)

*sighs*

OK, let’s look at my invasion fleet.

Right now, I have it, oh, my entire amphibious capability (all one hundred and forty Expeditionary Strike Groups) with ten carrier battlegroups supplying the core of the naval firepower.

Want to know more?

The LHA/LHD amphibious assault ship that is the flagship of the ESG has a mechanized infantry company. (The other amphibious assault ships in the EGS will carry support, HQ stuff and the like..) It may also carry part of the company’s respective division’s aviation section. The tanks which help support the troops will be carried on LSTs (56 LSTs total, in order to carry all 7 divisions’ worth of tanks.) Each ESG is based on the current US military ESG.

The carrier battlegroups are based somewhat on the old American Carrier Groups. 1 carrier, 1 battleship, 2 cruisers, 2 destroyers, 2 frigates, 2 subs, and a Supply-class replenishment ship. The battleships will mostly be Jo von S-class types except for one Iowa (which, though needing replacement, I can’t afford to scrap until replacements are built.)

All of this which adds up to ten carriers, ten battleships, one hundred and forty LHD/LHA craft, one hundred and forty LPDs, one hundred and forty LSDs, one hundred and sixty cruisers, one hundred and sixty destroyers, one hundred and sixty frigates, and one-hundred and sixty submarines.

That’s over a thousand warships, and excluding the supply ships.

Yes, it’s large. But in order to win this battle, I think I need as much as I can get.

Oh, and what about time? Do you really think it is feasible to adequately raise and train a SpecOps force to take out the gun in the time between the fleet comes within range of the gun and the time the ground phase (hopefully) begins?

Please tell me, what is wrong with this scenario:
1. I find out there’s a Doramascher. I don’t know if said Ground Battleship has a big gun, mortars, ninja monkeys or Spinning Tops of Doom™, but from what I know about Dorasmascher, I know that it’s gonna be Bad News, either for Syskeyia at large (if it has, say, ICBMs) or for the invasion force (if it has mortars or, say, a ludicrously large gun). I decide to take it out.
2. I decide to destroy it by airstrike. I don’t know what it is exactly, but I know it must be blown up, and I can just say that I can use the firepower now that Vegana’s agreed to a ceasefire and thus I no longer need to bomb Veganan positions. Unfortunately, the airstrike fails, but I learn a valuable secret: the Dorasmascher has a big gun.
3. I get some SpecOps, and they disable the big gun (and presumably die.)
4. My fleet arrives at the island, my troops land, and after a hard campaign, I retake the island.

How does that sound?

OOC: How incompetent must our various intelligence agencies be if they can't tell us about the existence of a ship with an enormous phallic substitute / gun before it whips the damn thing out and screams "hello boys!" at Syskeyia's ships? Just saying, this thing is ENORMOUS. There is virtually no way that the construction of such a thing could be kept secret from foreign intelligence agencies.

Personally, I don't think that there's enough time to assemble and plant a SpecOps force on the island if the fleet's already in range of the gun.

Um, the specops are already on the island. They're troops in hiding who survived the invasion, remember? That's why this entire plot concept would work, and why you wouldn't lose a huge number of ships to this plotline; you don't have to train them or get them there because they already are there. With a reasonable timeframe from first sighting of her primary armament for remaining troops to assemble a force, throw together a plan of attack, get there and do it, I'd say a maximum of ten to twelve shots fired, not all of which will hit, not all of which will sink their targets if they *do* hit.

Again, you're stuck on this idea that I'm trying to sink your entire fleet. I'm not; I'm just saying there's no way that an airstrike would figure out what's under the upper surface plating because you don't fire large-calibre naval guns at bombers.

OOC: How incompetent must our various intelligence agencies be if they can't tell us about the existence of a ship with an enormous phallic substitute / gun before it whips the damn thing out and screams "hello boys!" at Syskeyia's ships? Just saying, this thing is ENORMOUS. There is virtually no way that the construction of such a thing could be kept secret from foreign intelligence agencies.
How would you know? Eurusea's paranoia puts Soviet Russia's to shame. Check back to the first post of the war thread: the announcement wasn't sent over international channels, it was sent through loudspeakers and film reels. Eurusea has a lot of tech, but it's not in the hands of the people. And since nobody has actually taken the time to infiltrate Eurusea, there's no way of knowing.

Hell, when Eurusea unburied Sekhmet, the only way I found out was because the Director of Intelligence told one of my officials. Otherwise, I would have been completely clueless. Anya's extraction only happened because of the pattern of nuclear explosions. They had managed to keep her secret for several years. I didn't even know why she was important until she showed me.

Spycraft is just like everything else. You can't just "know" what's going on, you have to work at it. And since nobody has tried to penetrate Eurusea, all you'll know is what satellites can show you. And to paraphrase The Simpsons: "We've used satellites, but all that's told us is that they didn't build it on the roof."

Um, the specops are already on the island. They're troops in hiding who survived the invasion, remember? That's why this entire plot concept would work, and why you wouldn't lose a huge number of ships to this plotline; you don't have to train them or get them there because they already are there. With a reasonable timeframe from first sighting of her primary armament for remaining troops to assemble a force, throw together a plan of attack, get there and do it, I'd say a maximum of ten to twelve shots fired, not all of which will hit, not all of which will sink their targets if they *do* hit.

Again, you're stuck on this idea that I'm trying to sink your entire fleet. I'm not; I'm just saying there's no way that an airstrike would figure out what's under the upper surface plating because you don't fire large-calibre naval guns at bombers.

OK, accepted.

This Saturday I'll leave on a trip, and I'll be gone for a week. While that means I probably won't be able to post, I might help plan the whole thing or something. :)

How would you know? Eurusea's paranoia puts Soviet Russia's to shame. Check back to the first post of the war thread: the announcement wasn't sent over international channels, it was sent through loudspeakers and film reels. Eurusea has a lot of tech, but it's not in the hands of the people. And since nobody has actually taken the time to infiltrate Eurusea, there's no way of knowing.

Hell, when Eurusea unburied Sekhmet, the only way I found out was because the Director of Intelligence told one of my officials. Otherwise, I would have been completely clueless. Anya's extraction only happened because of the pattern of nuclear explosions. They had managed to keep her secret for several years. I didn't even know why she was important until she showed me.

Spycraft is just like everything else. You can't just "know" what's going on, you have to work at it. And since nobody has tried to penetrate Eurusea, all you'll know is what satellites can show you. And to paraphrase The Simpsons: "We've used satellites, but all that's told us is that they didn't build it on the roof."

See, this sounds like a reasonable argument, but almost nobody RPs infiltrating anything. If we decided that our countries didn't do anything not explicitly RPed, then we'd all be the most incompetent governments ever seen.

Nobody has ever RPed infiltrating Pantocratoria (although one person talked about doing it once on IRC). That doesn't mean that nobody could, or that I don't just assume that other people's spies aren't so incompetent as to miss it when I build enormous new things.

IMO it just isn't reasonable to expect that you can build such wanktastically huge ships and the like whilst keeping them secret at the same time. These are immense things compared to the larged real world ships, which real world countries can't keep secret from their foes.

But you know, do what you like, I'm just getting impatient to see the thread over.

OK, accepted.

This Saturday I'll leave on a trip, and I'll be gone for a week. While that means I probably won't be able to post, I might help plan the whole thing or something. :)

So no different from usual then? ;)

See, this sounds like a reasonable argument, but almost nobody RPs infiltrating anything.And who's fault is this?

Look, there's a certain level of base infiltration that can be assumed. For the most part, having someone in nation reading news papers and looking for "weird stuff" can be assumed. Apply that to Eurusea. Do you think they announce in newspapers that they're building a ground battleship? No. Media's government controlled propaganda. People who stray too close to the factories are shot. People who talk are shot, as are the people they talk to. This is an oppressive regime. You can't assume that you know everything that's going on.

You want infiltration on a nation like Eurusea? Roleplay it. Or at least discuss it. Even if it's just on IRC.

My knowledge of what's going on in other countries has been roleplayed. My embassy in the Dominion doesn't spying work as well. Treznor's systems are largely compromised, but we worked that out OOC. I've worked out who I'm spying on and how. Don't blame me because you haven't.

If we decided that our countries didn't do anything not explicitly RPed, then we'd all be the most incompetent governments ever seen.Way to put words in my mouth.

That doesn't mean that nobody could, or that I don't just assume that other people's spies aren't so incompetent as to miss it when I build enormous new things.Pantocratoria is an open society with a free press. Rather a different animal than Eurusea.

IMO it just isn't reasonable to expect that you can build such wanktastically huge ships and the like whilst keeping them secret at the same time. These are immense things compared to the larged real world ships, which real world countries can't keep secret from their foes.So you know every major project of all 100,000 nations on the planet?

Come on. This is silly. Governments work on secret projects all the time. The fact that Dora is huge doesn't make much of a difference. Everything Eurusea makes is huge. Considering this is the nation with Stalin tanks, Megalith, and Floating Fortresses, it's not a stretch to imagine them building Dora without you knowing what the gun is.

Nobody complained about the Sickle gun cutting ships in half like butter. Nobody complained about not knowing about it. And yet, all of a sudden, everyone suddenly has to know about Dora's gun? Why?

GMC has told Sysk how to destroy the thing. He's promised not to annihilate the fleet. He's done everything short of actually writing out the posts for Sysk. Get over it already.

But you know, do what you like, I'm just getting impatient to see the thread over.You and me both. I've already done two plot lines with this thing. Personally, I think GMC should quit holding back and just have Eurusea crush Syskeyia. Ah well.

As opposed to a hellish life under a neo-fundamentalist, christian version of RL Iran, with zero in character presence?

So you want my citizens to live out a hellish life under a neo-Stalinist, psuedo-n00bish regime?Psuedo-n00bish? Are you actually reading what Eurusea writes? While he hasn't spent hours figuring out how he fits into WWII, the level of detail and back story for Eurusea is anything but n00bish. You really should try reading the character development and interaction. I know you don't care about anything other than posted losses, but all those words are rather important.

But, hey. Not as important as what carbine your soldiers used 50 years ago, I guess.

What I meant by "pseudo-n00bish" is that Eurusea is, in a sense, what a typical n00b nation would be like if it actually existed (they've got an OMG HUUUGE ARMY - but it's full of conscripts (half of which aren't even armed), and OMG WANKYBIG GUNS AND WEAPONS - that are unrealiable and blow themselves up a good portion of the time.) That's why Eurusea is "pseudo-n00bish"...

So playing the disasterous effects of stupid policies is "n00bish"? Funny, I thought n00bs ignored things like shoddy equipment, low morale, lack of training, and disasterous economies.

Perhaps less invective and less good-guy / bad-guy world-view is in order here.

As amusing as this discussion is, it might be nice to have actual posts.

Anyone mind if I skip the blahblah ships arriving bit I should have posted eons ago and do a scenic thing of Knootian volunteer infantry sucking at attacking the Reich?

I don't mind strongly any way but I think it would be fun to write.

What kind of Knootian would be willing to die for Syskeyia o.O?

Must've had a lot of mindaltering substances...

As amusing as this discussion is, it might be nice to have actual posts. Tell me about it. I've finished my two plot lines, so it's largely up to... well... Vacation Boy.

I don't mind strongly any way but I think it would be fun to write.Dying horribly at Eurusea's hand is fun? :p

Well, Rezo, I did send volunteers. I do not think it would be so much "fighting for Syskeyia" as "opposing the EVIL OMG Reich". And of course this is a good way to further thin out our already thin Catholic population which, counting the insanity of NS, still numbers in [hundreds of] millions.

And yeah, I was thinking of dying horribly, an ill-concieved infantry attack, and maybe testing one of my fancy new drone weapons. :p

And of course this is a good way to further thin out our already thin Catholic population which, counting the insanity of NS, still numbers in [hundreds of] millions.ZOMG! JENOSIDE! I INVAED J00!

Its not genocide if I decide that they choose to kill themselves for some random cause, is it? Catholics have the whole guilt trip thing going on anyway so they should jump at this opportunity to achieve martyrdom. To the slaughterhouse! :p

Its not genocide if I decide that they choose to kill themselves for some random cause, is it? Catholics have the whole guilt trip thing going on anyway so they should jump at this opportunity to achieve martyrdom. To the slaughterhouse! :p

Now now....lets correct a few things....
1)Catholic guilt is a sterotype, we are simply mindful of the sinful nature of humanity.
2)suicide isnt martyrdom and is forbidden by Church teachings. The martyrs grace is something else totally.....

now. continue the war! blood for God!

So playing the disasterous effects of stupid policies is "n00bish"? Funny, I thought n00bs ignored things like shoddy equipment, low morale, lack of training, and disasterous economies.
That's why I said Eurusea was psuedo-n00bish. Perhaps that wasn't the most accurate term, but still...

Anyway, it looks like Constatninopolis won't be posting (got a TG from him.) Anyone willing to send some good troops to help me retake St. Peter Claver Island? :)

OK, just some questions I need answered and I'll start posting war stuff again:

1. Is it OK for me to have SpecOps on the island (they were there at the invasion) doing recon of sorts?
2. How should I have reporters and other news media with the troops? Given that this battle will be a Big Important Event I know I have to have some media coverage, but how do I do it (yes, this involves characters and stuff. :P ) Should I do "embedding" (and how exactly is that done) or WWII-style war journalism (and how is this done)?

Oh, and anyone who wants to send forces to help me/attack the Reich should note that they will be under the ulitmate command of General Supija and Admiral Huhnh. Unified control of forces and all that. :P

Any advice on tactics? I'm not sure if the terrain allows anything other than a direct frontal assault. Yeah, you could try maneuvering around the mountains, but I think I'll need the peaks so that you can't use them for artillery spotting etc.

I think I know where this RP is going. :)

On a different note

'H-hello?' the voice was soft; weak and frightened. Davidov raised her hand quickly, 'Hold fire.' She coughed, trying to remember her lessons in Syskeyian.

Just a note - Syskeyian speak Latin and English. Davidov wouldn't have to know her lessons in "Syskeyian," she'd remember her lessons in those two languages. :)

Oh, and anyone who wants to send forces to help me/attack the Reich should note that they will be under the ulitmate command of General Supija and Admiral Huhnh. Unified control of forces and all that. :P

Lies.

Well, okay, formally the Knootian volunteers will be under the chain of command. We'll just promote a very loose Spanish Civil Waresque (Republican Side) appreciation of the concepts of "Orders" and "superior officer". ;)

Oh no. I have a specific job for them. And they will follow my orders. I've got the firepower to back my words up.

*practices whipping insubordinate Knootians*

OOC: You suggest shooting international war volunteers rallying to your cause? Way to destroy any sort of international support you might have.

:gundge: , or something.

Just a note - Syskeyian speak Latin and English. Davidov wouldn't have to know her lessons in "Syskeyian," she'd remember her lessons in those two languages. :)

To a Eurusean one of those two [or possibly both] would be referred to as 'Syskeyian,' since I don't have those real nations in my backstory. Other answers when I'm less tired.

Oh no. I have a specific job for them. And they will follow my orders. I've got the firepower to back my words up.

*practices whipping insubordinate Knootians*

You know, some Knootians aren't objectivist terrorists. In fact, hardly any are. Some are just like ordinary nice people, only Dutch.

The problem is, those Knootians who ARE objectivist terrorists are in the Hague.

OOC: You suggest shooting international war volunteers rallying to your cause?

What? Do you really think I'm going to let you send tons of ill-trained Knootian Catholics to their death in idiotic frontal infantry charges en masse? No way, Jose. :p

Unless they can fight well, they're staying in the rear.

Heh... hi everyone. Is this still going on? ^^

Heh... hi everyone. Is this still going on? ^^

Yes, I think it's past the 1 year point already.

Just a thought... I am willing to continue the RP, but can we, for "timeline" purposes, say that it's over already (i.e. in any "new RPs starting "now," we just assume that the war has ended? The war has taken more time to RP in RL time than has occurred in RP time, IMHO, so...

Some are just like ordinary nice people, only Dutch.UNPOSSIBLE!

Yes, I think it's past the 1 year point already.

Just a thought... I am willing to continue the RP, but can we, for "timeline" purposes, say that it's over already (i.e. in any "new RPs starting "now," we just assume that the war has ended? The war has taken more time to RP in RL time than has occurred in RP time, IMHO, so...Meh. "What Is" is somewhere at the 18 month mark, and it was supposed to be a quick lil' thing (hm, *pokes GMC for a post*)

As for the rest, go for it. I've got the same team of Special Forces in both What Is and Webs, and the second is a good six months to a year after the first. And even it is in "the past". Fluid time's funky like that.

So Are we saying the Reich is out of Syskeyia? 'Cause I don't even wanna THINK about it anymore :p

Psuedo-n00bish? Are you actually reading what Eurusea writes? While...

Geez... insults from a mod! :rolleyes:

Hmmm.... I finally post (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9548402&postcount=74), and nobody pays attention. The fleet is on its way.

Syskeyia.... JUST POST. Please. And what retcon is that thread referring to?

Syskeyia.... JUST POST. Please.

I did. :P

As for the retcon, I once simply plastered Eurusea's fleet with a ton of EMP missiles (per Western Asia's advice), just to end the war very quickly. After some [censored]in', (to which the title of this OOC thread refers to), we decided to retcon the thing back to the Eurusean fleet's arrival at St. Peter Claver island.

Now, if the REST OF YOU would post in response to my OMG F1NALLY POSTING11!!!!1, we could get this RP rolling again... :)

I did. :P
Post more? :)

Hummm... Providing an explanation after an 'OMFG POST!', after letting us wait for months while doing nothing but ooc posts with OMG PICTURES...

Nah. Not worth it.

Hummm... Providing an explanation after an 'OMFG POST!', after letting us wait for months while doing nothing but ooc posts with OMG PICTURES...

Nah. Not worth it.That would presume there would be any point left to posting. Are you willing to make that assumption? As I recall, Syskeyia has already ICly role-played the aftermath of this thread elsewhere.

Treznor, just shut up. (This thread doesn't involve you.) You too, DA. (If you can't say anything nice/constructive, don't say anythin at all.)

The major players in this RP (DA/EC, GMC/Eurusea, Vegana, and me) have agreed with the ultimate outcome to the RP (I get my stuff back) but we just want to finish this stuff.

Yeah, I know, I'm horrible at posting character stuff, but you chose to get involved with this RP, so you'll have to finish it.

Besides, it's a timeline issue. This war RP has been going on for at least a RL year, and personally the IC time has gone beyond it, and I'm sick of having to RP as if the war is still going on when in IC time, it's been over for a bit of time (since you're expected to write OMG LONG CHARACTER POSTS, this thing will take TIME, because I just can't write off War and Peace in and hour and a half, you know.)

Anyway, do you want to finish this RP or not?

Do what I do. Rip off War and Peace by Tolstoy. I am missing main frontline stuff anyway, and would suggest you just move on with the second post because the thing you did was introductory anyway.


:)

Do what I do. Rip off War and Peace by Tolstoy. I am missing main frontline stuff anyway, and would suggest you just move on with the second post because the thing you did was introductory anyway.


:)
That's why your posts read like they were translated from Russian to English to Dutch to English then...

:P

(oh and I agree, another post would probably be in order because the one which has just been done is fairly introductory)

You don't seem to get it...

Not that I'm surprised, mind.

Let me put this in really simple terms, sysk:

1. I have no issues with you assuming that for the purpose of many others threads, this has already been finished.

2. I have no issues with you posting short, insignificant posts every few months, mixed in with lots of pointless ooc. one gets used to it.

3. I have lots of issues with you posting the above and then suddenly demanding that we should all jump to accomodate you after you kept us waiting for aforementioned months. We have shown great patience, waiting for you while you managed a dozen or so ooc posts and ranted about things that had been cleared out long ago.

Now do the same.

So what? You're going to make us wait months before you post anything IC?

OK, so maybe I should have written more IC stuff earlier, and not waited months before "reviving" the RP.

And if you need some extra time to get your posts ready, go ahead.

But fi you're going to make us wait just to make me "pay," well, that's just dumb, stupid, vengeful, immature and wrong.

Just a FYI because I posted a rather long post:

-It is probably rife with false assumptions on my part. Feel free to correct them. I think I did some research but I may still be wrong.
-I did not have a particular Reich force in mind. Anyone who feels like responding on that side can, really.
-My time, OOCly, is rather low. Therefore this post does not intend to touch any "large" events but it is just something that I have been wanting to write during the summer holidays and which I finally did write now. A reply would be good, whatever the result is. I could do one or two more posts but please no long big drawn-out RP stuff because it was more something of a spin sort of thingy then an attempt to play any sort of mayor role. ;)

Re: Syskeyia are you going to post more now or not?

Well, Knoot, read your post. For the most part it's good, though I've got air superiority/supremacy in southern Syskeyia right now and I probably would have taken out any fixed AA installations while passing them by (now, if the AA was mobile, i.e. hand-held Stinger-type missiles manned by footsoldiers, that could be a different story).

On a more fundamental note, as the post is in mainland Syskeyia and not St. Peter Claver Island, it belongs in the original "Eurusea condemns Syskeyia, prepares for war" thread, not the SPC spinoff.

And yes, I shall post more.

Oops. Can you link me to the mainland thread then because I think it is rather buried. :confused: Is the main thread still active anyway?

Regarding AA, they might still have recently discovered tactical strongholds that are tough to crack and where you might prefer specops. Or it could be mobile. That would make it credible too that you would not simply bomb the shit out of it.

Also thanks ;)

Teh thread. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333941)

Oh, and the only people we Catholics call "Brother [So-and-so]," would be a "religious brother;" i.e., a member of a male religious order (like monks) who is not a priest.

And since brothers, sisters, priests, monks, and nuns can't fight in combat, there wouldn't be any soldiers called "Brother."

But fi you're going to make us wait just to make me "pay," well, that's just dumb, stupid, vengeful, immature and wrong....

[Enter a string of considerably hostile and malevolent expletives here]

Ok, now that this is done...

Perhaps we need our time to post something ICly, too, sometimes? Perhaps there are other things we need to do as well? Perhaps having this thread go at a pace of one post/ month means that it's rather low in the priority list?

Perhaps you could use common sense and assume that you're not the only one who needs his fucking time?

Teh thread. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333941)

Oh, and the only people we Catholics call "Brother [So-and-so]," would be a "religious brother;" i.e., a member of a male religious order (like monks) who is not a priest.

And since brothers, sisters, priests, monks, and nuns can't fight in combat, there wouldn't be any soldiers called "Brother."

Yeah. Well, seeing as a ceasefire has already been declared, presumably, my post would kinda be out of place there. I also feel kinda bad about gravedigging there so I gave the thing its own small "in the past" subthread. (See here) (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=443115)

Thanks for moving it anyway GMC, I was going to do the same at first but then I figured that it would not be in the right place in the main thread anyway because of the ceasefire and also because it does not really touch any of the main events.

I figure it could feature as a stand-alone small story, or someone could respond. Either way, really. Respond at leisure and only if you like to.

Re: brother. You are absolutely right. I was looking for a nice Catholic-sounding English equivalent to the Dutch 'kameraad' but in English Comrade has these terrible communist associations. It is indeed kinda stupid of me though, still. I'll change it to 'friends' instead.

Teh thread. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333941)

Oh, and the only people we Catholics call "Brother [So-and-so]," would be a "religious brother;" i.e., a member of a male religious order (like monks) who is not a priest.

And since brothers, sisters, priests, monks, and nuns can't fight in combat, there wouldn't be any soldiers called "Brother."

I hate to be picky but...
The term 'brother'(and 'sister') has been encouraged for use outside just vowed/professed communities.Our liturgy is full of the terms.
Lay communities and catholic training institutes I've been to have used the term widely.

"and I ask you, my brothers and sisters, to pray for me to the Lord our God" is just one example from the liturgy....

Actually, I was referring to using the term "Brother" as a title, i.e. "Brother Joeseph," nbot using it generally, i.e. Aragorn's "My brothers!" in the ROTK movie, or Henry V's "band of brothers" in the Shakespearean play.

Re: brother. You are absolutely right. I was looking for a nice Catholic-sounding English equivalent to the Dutch 'kameraad' but in English Comrade has these terrible communist associations. It is indeed kinda stupid of me though, still. I'll change it to 'friends' instead.

If it makes you feel any better, I have heard many comrades in the labour movement call each other "Brother $Name", so your chosen term has just the same connotations to me ;)

(and incidentally, most of those comrades were Catholic although they were not members of any of the sorts of communities or training groups Iesus is talking about)

Great. Dissention amongst the Catholic ranks. Does anyone actually want me to change it back? ;)

My newest post - I know I can do better than this, I think. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9633580&postcount=75)

Just trying to introduce the characters whom I'd like to use to give a "grunt's eye" perspective on the campaign. Well, at least one part of the campaign. And don't worry, their ineptness in trying to eat a naco (guess where that's from) doesn't mean they can't fight in combat - these men can fight.

(Why does every "detailed" IC post seem so well-written in my head, but end up so lackluster when I put fingers to the keys? Or maybe I beat myself up too much.)

But, just as they could not find out how to eat Vahm's meal, I am wondering about what kind of strategy I am to use for retaking the island.

I'm planning to attack initially from the north - one, because mainland Syskeyia is geographically north of St. Peter Claver, and two, because the northern side is Eurusea's side, so starting north and go south gives a dramatic build up, as I go from fighting relative honorable and decent Euruseans (not the word relative) in the north to the fanatical EC "angels" in the south. Sort of like starting a campaign fighting the Wehrmacht and ending it fighting the [WWII] Japanese Army.

But what exactly to do? I know "maneuver/'hit 'em where they ain't" and all is the ideal military tactic (as it were), but what about those hills? There's two big mountain/hills - the big domant volcano (on whose "spout" is now a lake - see the map (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v123/Syskeyia/spcbattlemap.gif)), and a smaller one to the southeast (where EC might want to make a "last stand" - hint, hint ;) ).

I'd assume that you'dve fortified the said mountain/hills, and while I'd like to evade them, I'm not sure if I could do that. Because you'd be able to see all my movements, and probably shell my troops while you were at it.

But there's a reason why everyone wants the high ground - uphill battles are general not a good idea.

So, any advice?

(Also, I presume they'll be some fighting on the beaches - I'm planning on having my troops landing on the beaches before/during a gigantic naval bombardment, and I'd hate for my ships to unload so much ordanance for no good reason. :) )

Oh, and on another note, I'm more a visual person, ergo the tons of pictures and stuff. The reason for the tactical map was to see where everyone's units were, and move my units accordingly.

Oh dear heaven above, you guys are still at it?

*rocks back and forth*

Ok. I'd like to say I'm gonna post, but chances are I'm not. University and other stuff is just too important atm; a major thread like this and I'd be wasting your time trying to keep up. If, and this is a possibility, you're still doing this in November sometime, I may join in :p

Are you considering my armies vanished? 'cause as far as I know they're still there. If you want to play chess with them, that's fine. They'll stay for a while in Syskeyia after the war, extracting in stages, whilst the First Fleet would remain--then suddenly get dragged back to Baron for the Baron War. That's my timeline. Just for your information.

Good luck, guys. Keep bitchin'.

edit: if you're gonna have a big negotiating pow-wow, contact me--may be willing to do that. But yeah. Blah.

more edit: if you want me to do a post where everything winds up, Chimaean-wise, then I'd be willing to do that too.

My newest post (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9729484&postcount=77)

Oh, and Amerigo never actually had St. Peter Claver Island. It was uninhabited when I took it at the beginning of the Amerigan Slaver Crisis. So there aren't any Amerigan buidlings here.

And, you should no that the Syskeyians' surnames are Asiatic, but their first names are almost always Catholic saints, biblical figures, etc. There might be a "Mrs. Sullivan" on the island, but she'd be in the minority, No that it would matter, though, but...