NationStates Jolt Archive

Modedit: this is a thread for discussion of the new Regional Influence rankings. Theories? Ideas? Post 'em here!

- Sirocco
---------------

I don't remember this being there before, but then if it was, I'm gonna fell stupid....

what does it mean? where did it come from?




Regional Influence: Dominator


does anyone else have one? it's under the little frame thingy where it says like "Eonomy" and it's on the same line as your Region.

anyway, WTF?

oh, and if you have one (I'm gonna assume you all do) what does yours say?

EDIT: did anyone else notice that in the sentence "I'm gonna feel stupid" that I mispelled "feel", now I do feel stupid :( I will leave it just the same, proof of my idiocy. (or poor typing skills when confused, either way)

also, I don't think "gonna" is a word. ;)

I was initially very confused myself, but came across this (http://www.nationstates.net/pages/influence.html) in the news section. Still doesn't explain the exact terms as far as I can see, but you get the idea :)

I'm an "instigator". I assume that means my nation has practically sod all influence, but I don't play with all the defending/invading stuff in mind, so I'm not bothered.

my puppet is "ambassador", and this one is "contender"


all the answers you seek: http://www.nationstates.net/news/

I'm an instigator. So proud!

Hermit :D

my puppet is "ambassador", and this one is "contender"


all the answers you seek: http://www.nationstates.net/news/
One of my puppets is a 'Dominator'. Ok, so it's in a two-nation region, but that's beside the point.

This is a minnow. :(

I don't remember this being there before, but then if it was, I'm gonna fell stupid....

what does it mean? where did it come from?

Regional Influence: Dominator

does anyone else have one? it's under the little frame thingy where it says like "Eonomy" and it's on the same line as your Region.

anyway, WTF?

oh, and if you have one (I'm gonna assume you all do) what does yours say?
That's new, but I have no idea where it came from. Mine says "Regional Influence: Ambassador"

I don't remember this being there before, but then if it was, I'm gonna fell stupid....

what does it mean? where did it come from?




Regional Influence: Dominator


does anyone else have one? it's under the little frame thingy where it says like "Eonomy" and it's on the same line as your Region.

anyway, WTF?

oh, and if you have one (I'm gonna assume you all do) what does yours say?I wager it has something to do with how much of a percentage your nation has of certain variables (population, etc) in your region.

Might have to do with UN status...

Mine is "Superpower", which is not surprising since there's only two other nations in my region. You'll notice regions have labels too, now.

Whoa! Weird... hehe, turns out my influence is Minnow :D Possibly reflecting the fact that my contempt for politics leads me to not bother partaking... or that there was something I was meant to do to boost it but couldn't be arsed. Who knows?

But yeah, anyway, what's it all about eh?

I wager it has something to do with how much of a percentage your nation has of certain variables (population, etc) in your region.

Might have to do with UN status...

Mine is "Superpower", which is not surprising since there's only two other nations in my region. You'll notice regions have labels too, now.
yeah, there are only 2 nations in my region, me and hubby, he is Superpower, I am Dominator, and our region is "Backwater" LOL

we suck. :eek:

I'm a 'dealmaker' but then my 9 nation region is classed as 'backwater'

This nation is Powerbroker, my other nations are Contender and Handshaker.

I wonder what the rankings mean, anyone know?

yeah, there are only 2 nations in my region, me and hubby, he is Superpower, I am Dominator, and our region is "Backwater" LOL

we suck. :eek:Yay for Backwater Regions!!!

Doesn't really matter though. I'm still founder of my own region and wield unlimited power, muahahaha! :D

I am Negotiator, and I have been UN delegate for 500 something days...and the regional power is high....hmmmm the founder is only a minnow...and he is mighty miffed about it too! lol

What the hell is a truckler?

Edit: Fuck those guys. :upyours:

Regional Influence: Dominator


*whipcrack*

yeah, there are only 2 nations in my region, me and hubby, he is Superpower, I am Dominator, and our region is "Backwater" LOL

we suck. :eek:
ROFLMAO! :D

*whipcrack*
yep, my first thought was "damn skippy I am a dominator" then I was like "WTF? when did that show up? what does it mean?" so I started the thred.

There's a big discussion on it in Technical, in one of the stickies, although it's kind of died down in the last hour.

Duckspeaker in a region of 90, here. I really wish we knew how many points any person/nation had, and how many points any region had. That'd make it so much easier for us to figure this out. :headbang:

One of my puppets is in a little backwater region, that me and my Canuck have to ourselves, and I am a dominator there...although I posted that I ought to be 'Donimatrix' really...;)

There's a big discussion on it in Technical, in one of the stickies, although it's kind of died down in the last hour.

Duckspeaker in a region of 90, here. I really wish we knew how many points any person/nation had, and how many points any region had. That'd make it so much easier for us to figure this out. :headbang:I think the only way to find out is by entering regional control. It tells you how much influence you need to spend to do something. Basically, it's not really important unless you're UN delegate it seems...

I would tend to disagree. There's probably a higher purpose than just abolishing the need for the Griefing Laws for delegates. Even if there's not, they list all the possible listings for the civil rights/economy/political freedoms, so I do think they should list the rankings for this, but it's all up to the mods. *Shrug*

It does all seem to be a big secret, how they worked out the different rankings and what they mean...I am quite scared of the ducktalker one....after all, what does it even mean?

yeah, there are only 2 nations in my region, me and hubby, he is Superpower, I am Dominatrix, and our region is "Backwater" LOL

we suck. :eek:

fixed. :D



edit: One of my puppets is in a little backwater region, that me and my Canuck have to ourselves, and I am a dominator there...although I posted that I ought to be 'Donimatrix' really...;)
damnit! :p

As I am alone in my region, I am Hermit.

Negotiator. What does THAT mean?

Me, I'm an Eminence Grise. That's about as cool as it gets, I figure.:)

*thinks*

...these aren't based on the *old*, pre-jolt forum titles, are they?

I remember maybe Negotiator, Ambassador, and I think Instigator. Most of them are unfamiliar though. Eh, I can't remember back that far.

*thinks*

...these aren't the *old*, pre-jolt forum titles, are they?

I remember maybe Negotiator, Ambassador, and I think Instigator. Eh, I can't remember back that far.
Sadly, I wouldn't know, as I joined 4 days after the move.

Eminence Grise


What the heck is that?

Regional Influence: Powerbroker

Eminence Grise


What the heck is that?
A powerful adviser or decision-maker who operates secretly or unofficially.
Apparently.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/eminence%20grise

Apparently.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/eminence%20grise


Oh. Well then yeah, thats me alright.:p :rolleyes:

Regional Influence: Powerbroker

That's another one I remember. I think i'm onto something.

Have you folks noticed the "regional influence" thing on your nation? So I guess I'm a dealmaker, whatever that means.

Eminence Grise.....

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=477234

:)

I noticed that today, mine says "Regional Influence: Ambassador" and I have no idea what the hell that means. I'm more confused considering I really don't get involved with Nation States outside of General here... I can't imagine why I have any "influence" at all really. Weird.

Since everyone is so interested in them, I thought I might as well start a thread for you all to discuss it more deeply.

I was the one who suggested Eminence Grise. :)

That's another one I remember. I think i'm onto something.

You're definitely on to something, seeing as Sirocco made a pre-upgrade comment on his blog (http://siroccothemod.blogspot.com/2006/04/it-approaches.html) that they were going to haul the old pre-Jolt forum titles out for the new NationStates upgrade. :)

Do any of the '02-'03 nations remember the full list and hierarchy of the pre-Jolt forum titles? That could help us sort out which titles represent greater influence...

That said, there appear to be some new ranks as well; some (such as Eminence Grise) appear to fall in the normal title hierarchy, while others (Hermit and Duckspeaker, for example) probably are the result of special conditions - Hermit denotes a nation that's the only nation in its region, and given how "duckspeaker" is used in 1984, I suspect that the Duckspeaker influence category denotes someone who has consistently endorsed the region's Delegate for some time...

Also, I will state here and now that puppets are nice. I have 2 Power nations, 5 Eminence Grise nations, 4 Truckler nations, and a Minnow nation at the moment...

This nation is Powerbroker, my other nations are Contender and Handshaker.

I wonder what the rankings mean, anyone know?
/stares at your join date/ You ought to know if anyone.

On another note, I'm Eminence Grise. Kewl. That's what comes from having nine endorsements and being the founder. :p

Any chance of a list of the titles?

You're definitely on to something, seeing as Sirocco made a pre-upgrade comment on his blog (http://siroccothemod.blogspot.com/2006/04/it-approaches.html) that they were going to haul the old pre-Jolt forum titles out for the new NationStates upgrade. :)

Do any of the '02-'03 nations remember the full list and hierarchy of the pre-Jolt forum titles? That could help us sort out which titles represent greater influence...

That said, there appear to be some new ranks as well; some (such as Eminence Grise) appear to fall in the normal title hierarchy, while others (Hermit and Duckspeaker, for example) probably are the result of special conditions - Hermit denotes a nation that's the only nation in its region, and given how "duckspeaker" is used in 1984, I suspect that the Duckspeaker influence category denotes someone who has consistently endorsed the region's Delegate for some time...


Arrgh, confusing mergeness. A duckspeaker could be someone who consistently endorses several different Nations.
*speculates*

Being a minnow sucks...I have a question why isn't it based on regional ranking as well? That would make more sense to me.

Tell me, old plum, is Eminence Grise for UN delegates of regions with delegate controls turned off?

You're definitely on to something, seeing as Sirocco made a pre-upgrade comment on his blog (http://siroccothemod.blogspot.com/2006/04/it-approaches.html) that they were going to haul the old pre-Jolt forum titles out for the new NationStates upgrade. :)

Do any of the '02-'03 nations remember the full list and hierarchy of the pre-Jolt forum titles? That could help us sort out which titles represent greater influence...

Oh, awesome! I feel so special and smart. Heheh :p

Alas, I can't really remember the rankings order. Too long ago.

Hey Guys, Mine says I'm a Superpower while all of the residents in the region I'm delegating are all Enforcers...What does that mean? I mean, I know that there are some of the residents that deserve the title of SuperPower as well...but I mean...Why me? All I am is just the Delegate. Also, what are the ranks for the Regional Influence? The Region I'm delegating states that the region is a Backwater...what does that mean??? If anyone can help me out...could you PM me, because I know I'm not going to be able to come back onto the forum..

I'm a "duckspeaker," and I found this...

In the novel Nineteen Eighty-Four by George Orwell, duckspeak is a Newspeak term meaning literally to quack like a duck or to speak without thinking. Duckspeak can be either good or bad, depending on who is speaking, and if what they are saying is in following with the ideals of Big Brother. To be speaking rubbish and lies (bad), or to be speaking rubbish and lies for the good of "The Party" (good).

http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Duckspeak

Meh...I don't know why I'd really fit in that category, but better than minnow. :D

Yesterday, I was a Power Broker.
Today, I am an Eminence Grise.
I still do not know what either mean.
Wierd.

ya, i just changed from a vassal to a truckler...

Has anyone yet figured out the general hierarchy of the ranks? So far my list (in alphabetical order) is:

Ambassador
Auxiliary
Contender
Dealmaker
Diplomatic
Dominator
Duckspeaker
Eminence grise
Enforcer
Envoy
Handshaker
Hegemony
Instigator
Minnow
Negotiator
Power
Powerbroker
Superpower
Truckler
Vassal

1st. There needs to be a more defined explination of how this works and a list of these new classifications

2nd. As I read the information these rankings will infairly balance toward favoring nations that participate in the UN. For instance I, at this moment are not in the UN, and have been in my region much longer than the info trolling for this change commenced. Why is my influence a minnow...and everyone else that's not a UN member, while our UN countries all have higher ratings.

3rd. I think the idea is really great with a bit of tweaking

2nd. As I read the information these rankings will infairly balance toward favoring nations that participate in the UN. For instance I, at this moment are not in the UN, and have been in my region much longer than the info trolling for this change commenced. Why is my influence a minnow...and everyone else that's not a UN member, while our UN countries all have higher ratings.


It also matters how big your region is. I've been in the same region since February, and I'm a minnow. One of my puppets has been in a region since late March, and he's a vassal, probably because his region is much smaller than mine.

Remember that nations have only been accumulating influence since March. It can't tell the difference between someone who's been in a region for two years and one who's been there for two months.

That is what has been siad all that I am saying is that at this juncture that it is unfairly leaning toward UN members. That may work itself out over time but right now it is tilted.

That is what has been siad all that I am saying is that at this juncture that it is unfairly leaning toward UN members. That may work itself out over time but right now it is tilted.Well, when you find a way to be UN Delegate without being in the UN, we'll worry about the difference.

Well, just as in real life, it makes more sense for a UN member to have more influence than a non-UN member.

Yet, I can see the issue here. Perhaps there could be something similar to endorsements that can be for anybody, regardless of UN status. By allying or supporting another nation, their influence grows a lot and yours could grow a little. I'm just thinking out loud here, though.

Well, just as in real life, it makes more sense for a UN member to have more influence than a non-UN member.

Yet, I can see the issue here. Perhaps there could be something similar to endorsements that can be for anybody, regardless of UN status. By allying or supporting another nation, their influence grows a lot and yours could grow a little. I'm just thinking out loud here, though.

That option makes alot of sense to me. Especially because in my region UN members are a heavy minority, and less influential then non-UN members.

From the Technical Forum:

']Here are answers to a few questions I've seen raised in various places:

Q. Shouldn't Influence take into account a nation's population?
A. If it did, the game would be dominated by its oldest nations. These nations would make extremely powerful invaders, and have a permanent advantage over newer players. We don't think this would be fair.

Q. Shouldn't Influence take into account military or economic strength?
A. One of the quirks of NationStates is that it does not reward you for subscribing to a particular ideology. You can certainly argue that highly militaristic nations would, in real life, be harder to handle than others. But if we built this into the game, all players would have a strong incentive to make their nations militaristic, at the expense of those who didn't. We still want to allow players to make all kinds of nations, not just capitalist ones with strong militaries.

Also, of course, we are talking about the sytem that determines how hard it is to "eject" a nation from its region. It's a bit weird to argue about what is "realistic."

Q. Shouldn't Influence take into account how many times I log in, or post on the RMB, or send telegrams, or some other measure of my activity?
A. The game can't measure whether you're posting interesting, thoughtful contributions to your RMB or just garbage. It would be dangerous to reward things like posts and logins, because some players would start doing those things just to get the reward.

Players may also wish to note that military strength, population, etc, have never determined how easily a nation can be ejected from its region in the past. So we are not introducing any change in that respect.

Q. Why should UN nations earn more Influence than non-UN nations?
A. Two reasons. First, a nation that has joined the UN and won some endorsements has demonstrated a certain level of involvement in the game and their region. Second, players are limited to a single UN nation, but can control many non-UN nations. So if non-UN nations earned Influence rapidly, then one player could control a formidable invasion army all by himself.

Q. Why have you abolished the concept of "natives"? Natives deserve to be treated differently to invaders.
A. We haven't abolished the concept so much as moved it from a moderator judgement to a part of the actual game. Previously, moderators were frequently called on to make subjective judgements about whether nations qualified as "natives" or not. Yet there isn't any logical point at which a nation suddenly becomes "native"; rather, it gets steadily more native the longer it's there, and the more support it has from other residents. This is what the Influence system recognizes. Natives are still protected, only now without needing to call on the moderators for help.

Q. The Delegate in Region X is ejecting dozens of nations--doesn't this prove that the system isn't working?
A. No. What we're seeing so far is a few Delegates who have been in power for some time spending some (or most) of their Influence in order to perform ejections. These Delegates can hardly be considered "invaders," after controlling their regions for so long. And they have weakened themselves by performing purges, meaning that they are less able to repress rebellions in the future.

We are not trying to stamp out political ejections, or prevent Delegates from being dictators. Such things will continue to be part of the game, and as always, players have two ways of dealing with it:
(a) Work to get the Delegate unelected and replaced with somebody else
(b) Move to a better region

Q. My region has a Founder and doesn't like these changes.
A. If your region has a Founder, it's largely unaffected by them. A Founder can still undo anything a Delegate does, even deny the Delegate access to Region Control.

Q. Why is my tiny, non-UN nation in Region X a "Superpower", but my big UN nation in Region Y a "Minnow"?
A. Because Region X contains fewer influential nations than Region Y. Your non-UN nation is thus a more important part of Region X than your big nation is of Region Y.

Q. My nation has been a resident of this region for two years. Why don't I have bucketloads of Influence?
A. Because the system is new, and nations only started building Influence a month or two ago. Sorry about that, but we can't tell how long nations were in their regions before then, or how many endorsements they had.

Q. I had a nation deleted for breaking an "Invasion Griefing" rule, but now those rules have been abolished. Can I have my nation back?
A. No. We don't retroactively punish players for breaking rules that didn't previously exist, and we don't pardon players who broke rules that have now been removed. Players must abide by whatever rules were in place at the time.

I am but a mere minnow apparently, unnoticed amongst all the ' bigger fish '
........I have yet to make my mark in the world.
I'm just wondering how long it takes to get sufficient clout to make any difference in this ' game '......all I ever get to do is decide on small issues affecting nobody but my own country.
If things dont look up shortly I'm off to try ' Discworld Mud '.....which is even more bewildering! :headbang:

You're definitely on to something, seeing as Sirocco made a pre-upgrade comment on his blog (http://siroccothemod.blogspot.com/2006/04/it-approaches.html) that they were going to haul the old pre-Jolt forum titles out for the new NationStates upgrade. :)

Do any of the '02-'03 nations remember the full list and hierarchy of the pre-Jolt forum titles? That could help us sort out which titles represent greater influence...

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=5073046&postcount=1

Courtesy of Hack.

I am but a mere minnow apparently, unnoticed amongst all the ' bigger fish '
........I have yet to make my mark in the world.
I'm just wondering how long it takes to get sufficient clout to make any difference in this ' game '......all I ever get to do is decide on small issues affecting nobody but my own country.
If things dont look up shortly I'm off to try ' Discworld Mud '.....which is even more bewildering! :headbang:

Several solutions:

1. Don't worry about it. One of my nations has been fairly active offsite, and in the same region since he started. He's a minnow, as are several even more experienced players. It only makes a real difference in an invasion.

2. Join a smaller region. It's easier to be a big fish if you're in a small pond.

3. Join the UN and get people to endorse you.

1. Don't worry about it. One of my nations has been fairly active offsite, and in the same region since he started. He's a minnow, as are several even more experienced players. It only makes a real difference in an invasion.
Which means when there is an invasion in your region you might be invaded and could be booted by the new UND.

If things dont look up shortly I'm off to try ' Discworld Mud '.....which is even more bewildering! :headbang:
It's not a bad MUD, as MUDs go. Pretty good, actually.
On the other hand, What you described previous to the mention of the MUD sounds like what everybody had to do before this change. Now you can become more influential than older nations, which was previously impossible, not only because there was no Influence ranks, but because they'd always be stronger than you.

I'm wondering what the XML feed url for influence is, I'd like to add the feed to my regions off-site board user profiles.

Hermit
Minnow
Vassal
Truckler
Handshaker
Envoy
Instigator<
Diplomat
Ambassador
Auxiliary
Contender
Enforcer
Eminence Grise<
Powerbroker<
Superpower<

Ignore the arrows. I know not all levels are up, but those are what the another forum has posted. The NationStatees Mods refuse to publish an official list. Hermit, is special, insothat a nation being the only one in the region is awarded this titlle.

Hermit
Minnow
Vassal
Truckler
Handshaker
Envoy
Instigator<
Diplomat
Ambassador
Auxiliary
Contender
Enforcer
Eminence Grise<
Powerbroker<
Superpower<

Ignore the arrows. I know not all levels are up, but those are what the another forum has posted. The NationStatees Mods refuse to publish an official list. Hermit, is special, insothat a nation being the only one in the region is awarded this titlle.
dealmaker

I am an Eminence Grise, what rank is this and what the heck does it mean? is it above powerbroker?

Doesn't look like it.

One of my puppets is a Eminence Grise and he's a Delegate with 3 endos in a Moderate region.

Hermit
Minnow
Vassal
Truckler
Handshaker
Envoy
Instigator<
Diplomat
Ambassador
Auxiliary
Contender
Enforcer
Eminence Grise<
Powerbroker<
Superpower<

Ignore the arrows. I know not all levels are up, but those are what the another forum has posted. The NationStatees Mods refuse to publish an official list. Hermit, is special, insothat a nation being the only one in the region is awarded this titlle.

ok two things,

1. Hermit is the best possible ranking, this is why it is almost always found on a one nation region (this isnt my idea, its from the tech forum)
Though, I'm still not sure about that hermits only being single regions stuff. Cause this is the second day that one of my single nation regions has actually had 2 nations in it. And the original resident is still a hermit but the new guy has moved form minnow to handshaker, and now he's an auxilliary. But the original inhabitant is still a hermit.

2. the order seems right, since im new to the region that im in and my rank has gone from vassal to Truckler to Handshaker in the past four days, and my region has been getting smaller and ive been there longer and longer

1. Hermit is the best possible ranking, this is why it is almost always found on a one nation region (this isnt my idea, its from the tech forum)


Um...no. You fail at understanding the definition of the word "hermit."

A "Hermit" has both the highest and lowest Influence ranking in its region: the only one. A discussion on where that rank would list between the ranking levels which actually ARE comparitive seems rather academic to me...

Ballotonia