NationStates Jolt Archive

What's Legal and whats not


Whats not legal, A.K.A Griefing for delegates and invaders
http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:h90YDhjCkiMC:www.mgcars.org.uk/namgar/stop.jpg

-Ejecting a large number of natives (judged on a case-by-case scenario- 40% is a good meterstick for measuring it though) - UPDATE: Line struck by Cogitation. Monday, March 1, 2004
-Spam/flood the regional message board and regional happening
-Take over by use of UN Multies
-Interfere with the natives' ability to come and go from the region as they please. (This includes kicking people out and leaving them on the ban list, passwording the region without giving the password to the natives, and the like.)
- Reploid Productions

But, taking over a region is legal, right?
Broadly speaking, yes. I can move my friends and myself into your region and become the delegate. What I can't do is kick everyone out of the region. That's where "griefing" comes in. It's generally a fine line and the mods get a lot of requests to look at situations that may or may not be griefing.
Where griefing is definitely 100% illegal is when you do it with your 500 UN Member nations. As you all know, having more than one nation in the UN is illegal by itself, and using these multiple nations to take over regions is very illegal.
-Enodia


(40% is a ROUGH estimate. In a region of 600, ejecting 50 could be considered griefing. It's relative.
-Neutered Sputniks - UPDATE: Line struck by Cogitation. Monday, March 1, 2004.

From this (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2789468&highlight=#2789468) thread:
OK...THERE IS NO SET PERCENTAGE
-Neutered Sputniks
UPDATE: Quote added by Cogitation. Monday, March 1, 2004.

The 40% guideline was originally quoted in regards to the Francos Spain case, which is a case of an internally-elected Delegate, not an invasion. Although I might be mistaken about what the tolerance is for internally-elected Delegates, the tolerance for Invader Delegates is definitely much, much less. To avoid running afoul of the Mod Squad, Invader Delegates should limit themselves to ejecting ONLY those natives who are a direct threat to the Invader Delegate's position. Also remember that any ejected natives must be removed from the banlist instantly.
-Cogitation (UPDATE: Added by same Monday, March 1, 2004.)

You can read more about it here, and read the mods ruling about the legality of region invading and what you can't do.

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1478151#1478151
and you can read about whats legal and not here
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=38763







What is legal
http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:U7CswCF_jbcC:www.jewishworldreview.com/cols2/thumbs.up.jpg

Region invading is legal, what's illegal is griefing, as long as you do not do any of the things pointed :!: you will be legally ok and a mod won't delete you. The mods have decided that invasions are legal, but that doesn't mean that the mods like invasions. Infact, most, if not all, region invading is the bane of nationstates, so don't go blaming them.

Read about some of their opinions here!
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=68616&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0








Which Delegates are considered natives and which are invaders[/size]
http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:nzgsuXFcCxwC:news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1500000/images/_1501525_alkida_ap300.jpg

Here's the question

"-If an invader delegate convinces the native members of the invaded region to endorse him (assuming 50+% endorse him), is he still considered an invader? What if the other invading nations leave?"

And here's the response

"For a delegate to be considered a native delegate, he/she must have enough native support to remain in that position without the assistance of other non-natives - invaders or neutral."
-Neutered Sputniks

See the original thread here
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2465285#2465285

There also was a question that what if a native and foreign support to prop himself to the delegacy, would he be considered a invader delegacy or not, and the answer was yes!

Truthfully, however, it would make sense that liberators not decide who a region's delegate is, but the people of the region. To this end, I'm inclined to state that supporters do indeed matter. As of right now, Hideout's supporters are not natives, and even though she may be a native, her delegacy is more likely to be considered an invader delegacy.

Original Thread
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2395170#2395170







Who is considered a native, and natives rights!
http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:6Anj3jX7uqcC:www.calindian.org/images/rights.gif

Natives are just that: the region's natives. Invaders are, you guessed it, anyone belonging to the invading group (and yes, that includes the counter-invaders as well, they're not native, and they're not neutral - which leaves only one category). And neutrals are, well, they're the ones belonging to neither group (Mods, Modlings, players on neither side but attempting to gain intel for the Mods).
-Neutered Sputniks

Your rights as a native
:arrow: Natives are generally not allowed to be perma-banned. However, when a Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)
(Which means you can't permanently ban a native!!)
-Neutered Sputniks

:arrow: In a region that can be passworded the password must be given to all the natives immediately following a change by the invaders.
(You must give out the password to the natives!)
-Neutered Sputniks

:arrow: Would those Native nations that are banned for the 1-2 days, still be considered natives if they come back, or would they not be considered natives, having been out of the region?
Yes they would

What the invader can do to you natives!
"Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)"
-Neutered Sputniks


Good thread about natives
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=107554&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0


First, I will try to define "native" and "non-native".

A "native" is a nation that resides in the region long-term, where the owner of that nation considers that region to be home. (I'm not sure what the judgement is for players with many puppets and who keep several puppets in several places long-term. Carinthe and Crazy Girl: I'm looking at you, here. :p ) If a native nation grants a UN endorsement to any nation, then the endorsement, itself, is called a "native endorsement".

A "non-native" is the catch-all designation for any nations that aren't natives. The "native" and "non-native" sets are all-inclusive and mutually-exclusive; a nation must be one or the other, not both, and not neither. Spies residing in a region long-term and working for an outside force are not natives. If a non-native nation grants a UN endorsement to any nation, then the endorsement, itself, is called a "non-native endorsement".

...

Next, I will define "Internally-Elected Delegate" and "Invader Delegate".

An Internally-Elected Delegate is a Delegate who has more native endorsements than any other nation in the region. The Delegate, himself/herself might be a non-native, but has the greatest support from natives.

An Invader Delegate is a Delegate who holds the position only because one or more non-native endorsements keeps that Delegate in power. The Delegate might be a native, but if someone else has more native endorsements than the Delegate, then the Delegate is an invader Delegate.

This is important, so I'll spell out the implications clearly: It's possible for a "native" to be an "Invader Delegate" if someone else in the region has more native endorsements. It's possible for a "non-native" to be an "Internally-Elected Delegate" if that nation has more native endorsements than anyone else.

The rights of a native of an invaded region is dependent upon whether or not the nation, itself, is native. The limitations on the actions of a Delegate are dependent ONLY upon whether or not the Delegate is an "Invader Delegate" or an "Internally-Elected Delegate", according to the definitions above.

Invader Delegates may not permanently ban natives from the region. Invader Delegates must distribute any new password to all of the native nations. Invader Delegates may not mass-eject natives.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
NationStates Game Moderator

...

One may note that it is therefore illegal for an "Invader Delegate" who is also a "native" nation to permanently ban himself/herself from the region. To this, my response is: "Get a life. :p "

--The Jovial States of Cogitation
"Laugh about it for a moment."
NationStates Self-Proclaimed Court Jester




Invader Delegates responsibilities
http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:XwDQ-CFIkMEC:www.whmc.af.mil/perspective/responsibility.jpg
As the delegate you must
-Give out the password to all natives immediately or else face deletion

I forgot the password.
Translation: Didn't send it to the natives.
Result: Griefer.


The story is that Fisz took over Monte Carlo, did some things and passworded the region and failed to give out the password, in result Fisz was deleted! :lol:

You also must send the password to all natives!

More Clarification
Elaboration on invasions and passwords:

Saying "Telegram me for the password" is not an acceptable substitute for telegramming the password to natives. While you may request that non-natives telegram you for the password, you must actively telegram the password to all natives as soon as you impose or change the regional password.
-Cogitation

Read more here!
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=103426&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=40







What invaders can't do
http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:puF2LYO5lTIC:www.rarebeatles.com/sheetmu/smyoucan.jpg

:arrow: Invaders cannot spam the regional happenings with puppets to cover their tracks, you can move 1 puppet with you though
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2365936#2365936
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2370369#2370369

:arrow: Invaders cannot perm ban the natives from the region
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2433966#2433966

:arrow: Invaders must give the password to natives as soon as soon as the region is passworded
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2433966#2433966

:arrow: Invaders may not use U.N multies to prop them into the delegacy(duh!) Mods can see you so don't try
[Moderator Edit - Cogitation, November 22, 2004, 4:27 PM EST] This should read "...not use U.N multies....". It previously said "...not use U.N puppets...."; that was not correct. [/modedit]
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2418020#2418020

:arrow: Impersonating another player to gain info is allowed, but to ruin his or her reputation is not
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2422140#2422140



What to do if any of this happens and possibly get the invaders deleted
http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:7DduADll4b8C:www.antiquelabelcompany.com/tell.jpg

File a getting help report
http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help
Preferred Method by mods

Or ask for help in the moderation forum
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=9
Less preferred method

If you have questions ask them in the moderation forum
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=9

As a last resort if your region gets invaded ask outside groups for help, examples are the Rejected Realms army or Macto, or try to ask for help from the NM here http://merit.jink.org

If you have questions you may also ask them at the NS MIRC Chat
at network EsperNet and channel #nationstates, you can also ask your fellow nations!




Regions of Importance, Thanks to Kandarin(Delegate of the RR)
Key

Political designations:

P1- Dictatorship. Absolute rule by one player, usually the Founder or Delegate of the region or founding Admin of the organization's forum.

P2- Council or limited democracy. A small percentage of players(in very large regions, this may still be a large number) decide things, and the opinions of lower-ranking players are heard, but are not law. (Note: This description is a default for regions not fitting the other categories.

P3- Representative democracy. The democratic process in the region and/or its subordinate organizations is open and fair, but the region is so large that the percentage of the region's nations represented is still small. (Example: North America has over 200 people, but only about one eighth of those are active players who choose to take part in regional politics)

P4- Senate or true democracy. A very large percentage(more than a third) of the region's members vote democratically on almost all issues.

Regional/Alliance size designations:

R1- Less than 18 players

R2- 19-36 players

R3- 37-100 players

R4- 101-500 players

R5- 500+ players

------------------------------------------------------------

Air Strip One- Small region-crashing group, member of the Imperial Commonwealth.
P1, R3, Website

Alliance Defense Network(ADN)- Interregional defense alliance. A recent invasion of one of their protectorates by the Atlantic Alliance has pushed the two blocs to war.
Website, Forum

Allied Liberation League (ALL)- Co-defensive agreement and defensive/liberational alliance, formed by several regions: North America, The Meritocracy, Holland/Nederland, American Alliance, Utopia, North Alerica
Forum

Armageddon- A deeply Christian region, also poltically conservative, Allied with Capitalist Alliance and The Meritocracy as a MACTO pact member.
P2, R4, Forum

Atlantic Alliance- Mid-sized offensive/defensive alliance, shrunken as many players left due to inactivity. Its primary goal is world domination. An increasing focus on region-crashing has put it at odds with the ADN and many counter-invaders. Potential members are screened.
P2, R2, Forum

Canada- Large, well-organized region.
P2, R4, Forum

Capitalist Alliance- Conservative region, Allied with The Meritocracy and Armageddon as a MACTO pact member.
P2, R3, Forum

East Pacific, The- Nation birth region, solid centralized leadership, Delegate runs an NS flagmaking service.
P2, R5, Forum

Empire of Imperials- Large region, built by an older invader who once headed the Empire of Power, currently neutral until it can grow large enough to intervene in foreign events.
P2, R4, Forum

England- Large English region. SABRe signatory. SCDT signatory.
P4, R4, Website

Europe- Player-created super-region, a Founder was recently added after a power struggle between Delegate candidates threw the region into turmoil.
P3, R5, Forum and Regional Map

Farkistan/Farktopia- Homes to an extremely old, skilled region-crashing group.
P2, R3, No Forum

Freedom Alliance (FA)- Democracy-loving group based in North Alerica and United States. Allied with The Meritocracy and The Rejected Realms, Opposes Atlantic Alliance. Potential members are screened.
P4, R3, Website

Free Pacific Army, the- Defensive alliance, a former satellite of The Pacific, now independant as the Pacific is controlled by a dictatorship. SCDT signatory.
P2, R4, Forums: Official, Historical

Golden Hills, The- Large region, in the process of merging with the Sardaukar Confederacy. ADN signatory. SCDT signatory.
P2, R3, Website

GREAT Britain- Mid-sized, generally friendly region. SABRe signant.
P2, R2, Website

Great Britain 3- British region, is merging with the SABRe region of England. ADN signant.
P2, R2, No Forum

Heartland, The- Large, well-organized region. Its leader is a Game Moderator, Ineptia. Allied with Wysteria and Texas. Potential members are screened.
P3, R4. Website

Holland and Nederland- Two regions that work as one. Made up mostly of Dutch players, and as such uses the Dutch lanquage primarily. Opposes Blue Moon and invaders in general. ALL signatory.
P2, R4, Website

Imperial Britain- Smallish well-organized region. SABRe signatory.
P2, R3, Website

Imperial Commonwealth- Large region-crasher base. Potential members are screened.
P2, R3, Forum

Imperial Council, The- Large region-crasher base, has rarely seen action.
P2, R3, No Forum.

Ireland- Large region, security is tight due to lack of a Founder. Potential members are screened. ADN signatory.
P2, R3, Website

Island Nations of Aramir- Large, party-atmosphere region. Many residents moved there from the now-nearly-empty Monte Carlo.
P2, R3, No Forum

Japan- Older region, generlly isolated from the rest of the NS world.
P2, R3, Forum

Lazarus- Like the Rejected Realms and the five Pacifics, this region is an integral part of the game. It is the home of nations newly resurrected after being deleted for inactivity. Due to the rarity of resurrections, it has only 62 nations as of this post, most of them non-UN. It has no Delegate, no Forum, and no organization whatsoever.

Meritocracy, The- Democracy-loving organization, based in the regions of The New Meritocracy, New Meritocracy, and Meritocratic Isles. The Meritocracy values the political and economic sovereignty of nations, and as such UN membership is forbidden in its regions; However, most Meritocrats have UN puppets, which can be found in all manner of other regions all over the Nationstates world. Allied with Capitalist Alliance and Armageddon as a MACTO pact member. ALL signatory. SCDT signatory. Potential members are screened.
P4, R3, Forum

Monte Carlo- Small region, has endured many shifts in governement, largely due to modbombings of its original members. Currently a shadow of its former self. See: Island Nations of Aramir
P2, R1, No Forum

NetWork Radio- a group of reporters who report on events in the Nationstates world.
P3, R1, Forum

North America- A large, well-organized region, home to many active RPers. ALL signatory.
P3, R4, Website, Historical Forum

North Pacific, The- Nation-birth super-region, several recent friendly changes of Delegacy. At the time of this writing, the second-largest region in the world. ADN signant. SCDT signatory.
P2, R5, Forum

Pacific, The- The original nation-birth super-region. A dictator has siezed power by force and ejected at least a thousand people to hold onto his power.
P1, R5, Forum

Realm Of Ambrosia, The- Small, tight-knit region. The Founder is a Game Mod, Cogitation. UPDATED: Monday, March 1, 2004.
P2, R3, Forum

Rejected Realms, The- Super-region that is the destination of all those ejected from other regions. Ejecting nations is impossible here. Allied with Sardaukar Confederacy and Freedom Alliance, Opposes Atlantic Alliance. ADN signatory.
P2, R5, Forums: Official, Unofficial, Historical

Rejected Realms Army- Offensive/defensive alliance that is linked to the government of The Rejected Realms. Alliances and enemies are the same as the Rejected Realms. Potential members are screened. ADN signatory.
P2, R2, Forum

Roman Empire, The- Democratic region based on the government system of the ancient empire of the same name. Opposes Atlantic Alliance. SCDT signatory.
P4, R2, Forum

Sovereign Alliance of British Regions (SABRe)- As the name states, an alliance between British regions. Includes Imperial Britain, England, GREAT Britain, Britain, United Kingdom, and British Empire.
Forum

Sardaukar Confederacy- Self-styled as a loose alliance of interdependant states. ADN signatory. SCDT host.
P2, R4, Website

Sardaukar Confederacy Defense Trust (SCDT)- A large co-defensive agreement between several dozen large regions. Opposes Atlantic Alliance.
Forum

South Pacific, The- A nation-birth super-region and highly democratic in choosing its officers. Largest region in the world at the time of this writing. SCDT signatory.
P2, R5, Forum

Texas- Large, well-organized region, Allied with The Heartland and Wysteria.
P2, R4, Forum

United Kingdom- A British region, the UK is heavily pro-human rights, and the democratic nature of almost all of its occupying states furthers this image.
P2, R2, No Forum

Urbanites- Home to a powerful defensive/liberational alliance, this region is opposed to most region-crashers.
P2, R3, Forum

West Pacific, The- Nation-Birth Super-region, the current Delegate has enjoyed a long, peaceful rule. ADN signatory. SCDT signatory.
P2, R5, Forum

Wysteria- Large region, Allied with Texas and The Heartland.
P2, R4, Forum and Regional Map



Versions
1.0 finished December 29, 2003 at 11:32AM Eastern Time
1.2 images added
1.3 fucked up the whole thing, lost spelling corrections!
1.4 Fixed
1.5 added Kandrin's region groups list
1.6 December 30th, added Kandrin's updated list!
1.7 March 1, 2004: Edit by Cogitation - Removed references to 40%, added that Invader Delegates should limit themselves to a few tactical ejections.
1.7.1. Same day as Version 1.7 - Cogitation managed to unb0rk the bad UBB code.
1.8 August 10, 2004: Edit by Cogitation - Added quote clarifying "native", "non-native", "Internally-Elected Delegate", and "Invader Delegate".

Hopefully this helps and thanks to Crazy Girl for compiling the list, and The Basenji for the help with the spelling, and Kanadrin for the list of regions.
-Garrison II
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=101820

Thats f'ing brilliant!

Could I ask you to post it in gameplay? Weve been compiling something simaialr but this is reallly perfect!

Very nice work

---Post Deleted by himself for being stupid---

I corrected spelling for you anyway.

What’s not legal, A.K.A Griefing

-Ejecting a large number of natives (judged on a case-by-case scenario- 40% is a good meterstick for measuring it though)
-Spam/flood the regional message board and regional happening
-Take over by use of UN Multies
-Interfere with the natives' ability to come and go from the region as they please. (This includes kicking people out and leaving them on the ban list, passwording the region without giving the password to the natives, and the like.)
- Reploid Productions

But, taking over a region is legal, right?
Broadly speaking, yes. I can move my friends and myself into your region and become the delegate. What I can't do is kick everyone out of the region. That's where "griefing" comes in. It's generally a fine line and the mods get a lot of requests to look at situations that may or may not be griefing.
Where griefing is definitely 100% illegal is when you do it with your 500 UN Member nations. As you all know, having more than one nation in the UN is illegal by itself, and using these multiple nations to take over regions is very illegal.
-Enodia


(40% is a ROUGH estimate. In a region of 600, ejecting 50 could be considered griefing. It's relative.
-Neutered Sputniks

You can read more about it here, and read the mods ruling about the legality of region invading and what you can't do.

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1478151#1478151
and you can read about whats legal and not here
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=38763




What is legal

Region invading is legal what’s illegal is griefing, as long as you do not do any of the things pointed you will be legally ok and a mod won't delete you. The mods have decided that invasions are legal, but that doesn't mean that the mods like invasions. Infact, most, if not all, region invading is the bane of nationstates, so don't go blaming them.

Read about some of their opinions here!
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=68616&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0


Which Delegates are considered natives and which are invaders

Here's the question

"-If an invader delegate convinces the native members of the invaded region to endorse him (assuming 50+% endorse him), is he still considered an invader? What if the other invading nations leave?"

And here's the response

"For a delegate to be considered a native delegate, he/she must have enough native support to remain in that position without the assistance of other non-natives - invaders or neutral."
-Neutered Sputniks

See the original thread here
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2465285#2465285

There also was a question that what if a native and foreign support to prop himself to the delegacy, would he be considered a invader delegacy or not, and the answer was yes!

Truthfully, however, it would make sense that liberators not decide who a region's delegate is, but the people of the region. To this end, I'm inclined to state that supporters do indeed matter. As of right now, Hideout's supporters are not natives, and even though she may be a native, her delegacy is more likely to be considered an invader delegacy.

Original Thread
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2395170#2395170


Who is considered a native, and natives rights!

Natives are just that: the region's natives. Invaders are, you guessed it, anyone belonging to the invading group (and yes, that includes the counter-invaders as well, they're not native, and they're not neutral - which leaves only one category). And neutrals are, well, they're the ones belonging to neither group (Mods, Modlings, players on neither side but attempting to gain intel for the Mods).
-Neutered Sputniks

Your rights as a native
Natives are generally not allowed to be perma-banned. However, when a Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)
(Which means you can't permanently ban a native!!)
-Neutered Sputniks

In a region that can be passworded the password must be given to all the natives immediately following a change by the invaders.
(You must give out the password to the natives!)
-Neutered Sputniks

Would those Native nations that are banned for the 1-2 days, still be considered natives if they come back, or would they not be considered natives, having been out of the region?
Yes they would

What the invader can do to you natives!
"Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)"
-Neutered Sputniks


Good thread about natives
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=107554&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0





Invader Delegates responsibilities
As the delegate you must
-Give out the password to all natives immediately or else face deletion
Scolopendra wrote:
Fisz wrote:
I forgot the password.
Translation: Didn't send it to the natives. Result: Griefer.



The story is that Fisz took over Monte Carlo, did some things and passworded the region and failed to give out the password, in result Fisz was deleted!

You also must send the password to all natives!


Read more here!
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=103426&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=40


What invaders can't do
Invaders cannot spam the regional happenings with puppets to cover their tracks, you can move 1 puppet with you though
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2365936#2365936
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2370369#2370369

Invaders cannot perm ban the natives from the region
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2433966#2433966

Invaders must give the password to natives as soon as soon as the region is passworded
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2433966#2433966

Invaders may not use U.N puppets to prop them into the delegacy(duh!) Mods can see you so don't try
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2418020#2418020

Impersonating another player to gain info is allowed, but to ruin his or her reputation is not
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2422140#2422140

What to do if any of this happens and possibly get the invaders deleted

File a getting help report
http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help
Preferred Method by mods

Or ask for help in the moderation forum
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=9
Less preferred method

If you have questions ask them in the moderation forum
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=9

Hopefully this helps and thanks to Crazy Girl for compiling the list
-Garrison II


Versions
1.0 finished December 29, 2003 at 11:32AM Eastern Time

Mistakes are in bold. Looks good.

~Bas

thanks!

Not a problem. Good luck with having this stickied.

~Bas

Oh crap i messed something up

Hmm, not bad. Moderation is a bit saturated with stickies and announcements, but I suppose Gameplay has room for something like this. If a Game Moderator checks that this is accurate . . .

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

Elaboration on invasions and passwords:

Saying "Telegram me for the password" is not an acceptable substitute for telegramming the password to natives. While you may request that non-natives telegram you for the password, you must actively telegram the password to all natives as soon as you impose or change the regional password.

I will bring this up for discussion with the other mods.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
NationStates Game Moderator

Yes, please post it in Gameplay, and let us hope that it gets stickified.

Brillant. 'Nuff said

Of the People-C,
The Mountains

Territory of

Trekkers,
United States,
President,
Freedom Allinace

One note on Lazarus:

Every time that a UN member gets an endorsement, it disapears. I believe that that is deliberately programed into the region.

Very nice!

Official Goobergunchian Seal of Approval
http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2002/TECH/science/11/07/viagra.wildlife/story.harp.seal.jpg

Just a few notes with the Regions of Importance section that are out-of-date:

Delegate of Europe is no longer a forum mod - in fact, Grated Cheese is now an ex-nation.

The Heartland's founder (Ineptia) is no longer retired.

That's a very nice piece of work, Garrison.

The region list is out of date, however. The most recent version of the list can be found at the Rejected Realms' forum, at http://s2.invisionfree.com/Rejected_Realms/index.php?showtopic=5.

Way to Garrison! That should make things clear for those inclined to raid and destroy regions.

Thanks Kandarin

Ok first off, what is the Deal with the formatting of this topic?

Second, you might want to point out that Farkistan and Farktopia have been at war with each other since about 30 minutes after Farktopia's founding.

=-=-=
Loop,
The One ane The Prime.
His Holiness the Lord High Protector/Executioner
My current flag
http://www.nationstates.net/images/flags/uploads/1_infinite_loop.jpg

Hail, Hail the Lord High Executioner!

So am i allowed to use a puppet (that is in the UN via a different e-mail) to help a native delegate to prevent an invader delegate taking over the region if I leave the region as soon as the invader gives up?
(by the way mods, who do you think are my puppets?(pleasepleaseplease dont post this for everyone to see)

By the way, nice post garrison.

So am i allowed to use a puppet (that is in the UN via a different e-mail) to help a native delegate to prevent an invader delegate taking over the region if I leave the region as soon as the invader gives up?
(by the way mods, who do you think are my puppets?(pleasepleaseplease dont post this for everyone to see)

Using a diffrent puppet? Would you have more than 1 U.N puppet if you made this one? Because if you do you can get deleted because it's cheating.

wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You might want to know that Quebec and France have a small alliance with forum (And recently repelled an invasion of France).

This is the game on the webbase so i dont except so much but no army and no power of total contry.
another thing what the f*** to play this game but nothing to do for it...so the game play itself or you play the game.
The issue handling is ok but in one day u handle the issue and that is? :?:
According to the Quote;
"Because sometimes even national leaders want to just hang out."
but i m hanging out all day long no activity and no brainstorming of nation. :!:
And some issue are damn Lame like nursery teacher dont eventhink of it to handle their 3 years old student. :lol:
Want to sell the book or Up for the Game site?
think of it b4 ppl sick of handling the lameass issue ever been heard on this universe.

To clear up some confusion, I tried to remove all references to the "40% rule" in ejections. In the process, I seriously botched the UBB code. Mea Maxima Culpa. I'm trying to correct the problem now.

HALLELUJAH! I fixed it!

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
NationStates Game Moderator

The 40% guideline was originally quoted in regards to the Francos Spain case, which is a case of an internally-elected Delegate, not an invasion. Although I might be mistaken about what the tolerance is for internally-elected Delegates, the tolerance for Invader Delegates is definitely much, much less. To avoid running afoul of the Mod Squad, Invader Delegates should limit themselves to ejecting ONLY those natives who are a direct threat to the Invader Delegate's position. Also remember that any ejected natives must be removed from the banlist instantly.
-Cogitation (UPDATE: Added by same Monday, March 1, 2004.)

Limiting ejections by invaders to those who threaten the delegate position is new. I recall Fisz ejecting Hide-Out (non-UN at the time) in Monte-Carlo just to insult Corinthe (Hide-Out), and Neut backed it up as being legal. I can think of other reasons for ejections as well, like political (when Atlantic was invaded, MrNonchalant's non-UN nation was ejected simply because he's the leader of the AA).

Ballotonia

I recall that at one point in the Francos fiascos that it was ruled that the Pacifics had no Natives only residents, similar concepts but not protected by nativity.

Limiting ejections by invaders to those who threaten the delegate position is new. I recall Fisz ejecting Hide-Out (non-UN at the time) in Monte-Carlo just to insult Corinthe (Hide-Out), and Neut backed it up as being legal. I can think of other reasons for ejections as well, like political (when Atlantic was invaded, MrNonchalant's non-UN nation was ejected simply because he's the leader of the AA).

Ballotonia
One could argue that if a situation like these came up again, it would be viewed as a threat to the delegacy. Id certainly see any of Corinthes or MrNonchalants puppets in a region I held as a threat. Course its up to the mods to decide if it is a direct threat I guess.

Very well written Gary.

What are the rules regarding eradication of an unholy nation? So far, invasion seems to consist of merely moving in more of your peoples than the natives. Is it possible to commit genocide? Also, is it allowed to conquer a region religiously?

What are the rules regarding eradication of an unholy nation? So far, invasion seems to consist of merely moving in more of your peoples than the natives. Is it possible to commit genocide? Also, is it allowed to conquer a region religiously?
War, trade, and genocide are not simulated by the NationStates game engine.

Invasion consists solely of taking over the Delegate position of a region.

As vilations of the invasion rules can result in immediate deletion, I consider this a critical matter. iSticky.

Can somone dig up a link where I explained "native", "non-native", "Internally-Elected Delegate" and "Invader Delegate"? Real life calls and I don't have time to find it myself. Thanks.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

Can somone dig up a link where I explained "native", "non-native", "Internally-Elected Delegate" and "Invader Delegate"? Real life calls and I don't have time to find it myself. Thanks.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=6674314&postcount=7

Cheers much Garrison.

Can a Founder set the Delegate's powers?

Can a Founder set the Delegate's powers?

A Founder can enable or disable Delegate powers, but can't allow partial powers - it's all or nothing.

Since the UN votes on what's legal and what's not, and so on, how does it ensure that these things are taken care of? It can't possibly monitor every single nations actions

i know this is kind of gravedigging but i felt compelled to ask, if an invasion manages to hold power in a region for a long period of time (say a few months) would the invaders still be invaders especially if the native now accepted the invader delegate

Say a group of invaders took over the region I created. I have it set so only I can expel other nations. Would it be griefing if I expelled them from my region. This is just the invaders, BTW.

1) invaders can be kicked as many as you like

2) if you are the founder, you can kick anyone and everyone from your region with your founder nation ;)

Thank you. I just wanted that for future reference. Wouldn't want those invaders taking over. :D

Hey, I was just wondering is somebody could clear this up for me ;

Can a Mod be delegate of a region with no founder ?

If so, is it illegal or legal for them to use their powers to screen all others, (ie their Telegrams etc) incase they are invaders?

i hate all these rules for war its a load of...well i dont want to say. But i think all this u cant beat prisoners of war is stupid..coz they hav jus killed ur best friend n ur suposed to say..."cup o' tea love". if u ask me there should b no rules ov war. War is war is war...people die get over it. in this day n age any one who needs to go to war or needs to defend themselves is a war criminal. By the standards in this day n age churchill or the duke of welington would b tried for 'crimes against humanity' i mite b talking a load of nout but das wat i fink!!

I found that very informative.Thank you.

Elaboration on invasions and passwords:

Saying "Telegram me for the password" is not an acceptable substitute for telegramming the password to natives. While you may request that non-natives telegram you for the password, you must actively telegram the password to all natives as soon as you impose or change the regional password.

I will bring this up for discussion with the other mods.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
NationStates Game Moderator

Clarification please.

It appears obvious that if a nation is plainly an invader-delegate, the rules are clear: s/he must inform the natives by telegramme immediately of the password. But what rules apply to a delegate whose status is less clear? For example, if a delegate is a native of the region, or if the delegate came in as a raider but has managed to gain a certain amount of native support, does the emphasis in the rules on "invader-delegate" mean the native delegate or native-supported invader is allowed not to comply so quickly?

I ask because there are regions where the invasion has dragged on for so long, and the real natives have been powerless to regain control. The result now is that the invader practically claims native status, and has failed to give out the password to the real natives on the grounds that he's preventing invasions (translation: he's preventing new arrivals, whether defenders or just friends of natives, from coming in and ousting him).

Question 1: Is this really permitted? Even if such a delegate were a native, shouldn't the password be sent out?

Question 2: Alternatively, is it allowed for an indisputably native delegate to delay distributing the password even from natives for a period of time, if s/he is trying to "smoke out" the spies in his region during an invasion?

If EVER your region is being invaded, and you notice this, there are several people you can contact. The region Equilism is full of fine, experienced defenders who will help you in your time of need. Contact Adyndril, the Military Minister, and these guys; Westwind and Equility, who are Commanders. Your request will be looked at, and sent along to the largest defender organization in the game, the ADN.. or, if it is handleable by Equilism alone, a region with over 100 UN nations, we'll be there within an hour, protecting your region in its time of need.

Good luck, and stay active.

I have two questions that did not seem to be answered:

1) If you takeover a region but don't kick anyone out...then you password protect it, do you need to give it to natives (because they obviously don't need)

2) What are laws regarding with founders? If you takeover a region and letting the founder back in means you'll most likely be ejected...what are the rules. Example is it legal to takeover a 10 nation region, kick out the founder, then password protect it...That's 10% kicking out of natives, doesn't seem to bad to me.

I believe the founder can excess regional control no matter where they are.

I have two questions that did not seem to be answered:

1) If you takeover a region but don't kick anyone out...then you password protect it, do you need to give it to natives (because they obviously don't need)

2) What are laws regarding with founders? If you takeover a region and letting the founder back in means you'll most likely be ejected...what are the rules. Example is it legal to takeover a 10 nation region, kick out the founder, then password protect it...That's 10% kicking out of natives, doesn't seem to bad to me.

If you are an invader or an invader supported native, then you must telegram everyone in the region the passwrd

I've tried to follow up some of the background of the points made in the original post by clicking on the links. Is it just me, or are those links incorrect or broken? I keep getting "404" messages. I'm trying to find some answers for a friend, but I can't get behind the things in the post.

TIA.

If you are an invader or an invader supported native, then you must telegram everyone in the region the password

Do you have to if you don't kick any natives out? I don't see the reason behind needing to give a password to a nation in the region all ready.

What about regions who like to roleplay and prefer not to bother with the whole "region-crashing" aspect of the game? Yes, I know password-protect the region and bar UN delegate from regional control, but what if that isn't enough?

Do you have to if you don't kick any natives out? I don't see the reason behind needing to give a password to a nation in the region all ready.

Yes, you do. Natives must be allowed to come and go as they desire.

If a password would be set without it being handed out, a native could end up outside the region waiting for the invader delegate to log in and respond to a query for the password.

Ballotonia

Can you then change the password at certain periods of time. Like send messages every few hours saying:

'Dear Native,
Between 10-1 NS Time the password is 12345''
..."Between 1-12 NS Time the password is 23456"
..."Between 12am-2:30 am the region is closed for update"
...etc.

So, they always know but it would cut down on them bringing help. Also,if a native leaves and moves to another region (past an update) then how long are they still a native. Would their rights diminish if they left on a permanent basis?

Another question: can you put restrictions on a region with natives. For instance, "everyone has 4 days to endorse the current delegate or resign from the UN." This won't kick anyone out except if they threaten.

AFAICS there's nothing wrong with changing the region password at regular intervals, so long as all the natives have all the passwords in advance. Although I'd be a bit dubious about the region being 'closed for update' at any point.

As to your second question, IIRC it is against the rules to require people to endorse any delegate. Saying "it won't kick anyone out unless they threaten" doesn't really cut it, you're still threatening to kick people out.

I want to bump Pure Thought's post. The links with the very basics, the FAQ of legal invasion at the top are broken.

An addition to "ze list" for you.

Atlantian Oceania Regional Defence Organisation (AORDO)
P2, R3, Forum (aoforum.3wide.com - forum also contains regional map)

Organisation of approx. 12-15 nations led by Starblaydia, primarily entrusted to defending the regions of Atlantian Oceania (AO), Atlantis and STARS from region crashing. Position on taking requests for counter-invasion unknown. (ie nobody's ever asked!) Also Starblaydia RP's as AORDO as an actual defence force in the AO Forums.

I might have missed it in this thread, but what is the Mod's definition of "native"?

Such as, how long would a nation have to reside in a region to be considered a native?

First, I will try to define "native" and "non-native".

A "native" is a nation that resides in the region long-term, where the owner of that nation considers that region to be home. (I'm not sure what the judgement is for players with many puppets and who keep several puppets in several places long-term. Carinthe and Crazy Girl: I'm looking at you, here. tongue.gif ) If a native nation grants a UN endorsement to any nation, then the endorsement, itself, is called a "native endorsement".

A "non-native" is the catch-all designation for any nations that aren't natives. The "native" and "non-native" sets are all-inclusive and mutually-exclusive; a nation must be one or the other, not both, and not neither. Spies residing in a region long-term and working for an outside force are not natives. If a non-native nation grants a UN endorsement to any nation, then the endorsement, itself, is called a "non-native endorsement".

...

Next, I will define "Internally-Elected Delegate" and "Invader Delegate".

An Internally-Elected Delegate is a Delegate who has more native endorsements than any other nation in the region. The Delegate, himself/herself might be a non-native, but has the greatest support from natives.

An Invader Delegate is a Delegate who holds the position only because one or more non-native endorsements keeps that Delegate in power. The Delegate might be a native, but if someone else has more native endorsements than the Delegate, then the Delegate is an invader Delegate.

This is important, so I'll spell out the implications clearly: It's possible for a "native" to be an "Invader Delegate" if someone else in the region has more native endorsements. It's possible for a "non-native" to be an "Internally-Elected Delegate" if that nation has more native endorsements than anyone else.

The rights of a native of an invaded region is dependent upon whether or not the nation, itself, is native. The limitations on the actions of a Delegate are dependent ONLY upon whether or not the Delegate is an "Invader Delegate" or an "Internally-Elected Delegate", according to the definitions above.

Invader Delegates may not permanently ban natives from the region. Invader Delegates must distribute any new password to all of the native nations. Invader Delegates may not mass-eject natives.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
NationStates Game Moderator

...

One may note that it is therefore illegal for an "Invader Delegate" who is also a "native" nation to permanently ban himself/herself from the region. To this, my response is: "Get a life. tongue.gif "
--The Jovial States of Cogitation


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