NationStates Jolt Archive

Here is a list of ratings I have compiled; I couldn't find a complete listing in the forums; in the few days I have been playing here:

(RT)Economic -----------Political Freedoms----Civil Rights(-- )

(15)Frightening---------Corrupted------------Widely Abused
(14)All-Consuming-----Widely Abused-------Frightening
(13)Powerhouse-------Excessive -------------Excessive
(12)Thriving-------------World Benchmark----World Benchmark
(11)Very Strong--------Superb-----------------Superb
(10)Strong--------------Excellent---------------Excellent
(09)Good----------------Very good-------------Very Good
(08)Fair------------------Good-------------------Good
(07)Reasonable--------Average---------------Average
(06)Developing---------Below Average------Below Average
(05)Struggling----------Some------------------Some
(04)Weak----------------Few--------------------Few
(03)Fragile---------------Rare-------------------Rare
(02)Basket Case-------Unheard Of-----------Unheard Of
(01)Imploded-----------Outlawed-------------Outlawed

//--------------------------------------------------------------------//

Feel free to correct anything, I'l update it from time to time if valid errors are found.

Edited by Scolo der Game Mod for Level 15 Civil Rights (Widely Abused, as evidenced by Freebodnik IV

hey, that's pretty good! :D

Just because this is the first I've seen of this, I'm going to sticky it.


==Neutered Sputniks==
NationStates Game Moderator

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

whoa!!!!!!!!!!!!
your first post and it's stickied :D

Well done! I've been playing this game since december and I thought that World Benchmark was the best (or highest, however you want to put it) you could get for political freedoms!

Yes, I've been wondering about this breakdown myself. The only error I see that I know of is that #14 and $15 should be switched for economic level. I usually shift between those two with my other nation and All Consuming is definitely the higher of the two.

It most certainly is not. Frightening is the highest.

So you're telling me that raising tariffs on foreign auto imports and abolishing minimum wage laws is damaging my economy...?

Raising tarrifs does.

Are you sure? That wouldn't make sense. I'll pay close attention next time I get the issue.

NS doesn't seem to factor in trade deficits, therefore tarrifs are bad.

This is a very helpful thread. It deserved to be stickied.

Abolishing min wage laws means people begin earning less, which means less money is spent which means wages are lowered because businesses become less profitable - downward spiral


Raising Tariffs should improve your economy. If it's borderline, then it can lower it because of past decisions.

(RT)Economic -----------Political Freedoms----Civil Rights(-- )

(15)Frightening---------Corrupted

So what's the highest rating in Civil Rights? Or does it only have 14 levels compared to the 15 of the other two?

im not the best with civil rights ratings but ive seen a few with the title un benchmark..

Raising tariffs, or more generally, protectionism of national industry, indubitably harms a national economy because the economy is no longer producing at its most efficient values. International trade is predicated on the concept of comparative advantage -- if a nation allocates its resources to those industries at which it manufactures at a lower opportunity cost than its trading partners, these industries reap windfall profits, and consumers benefit substantially. The net effect of free trade is lower prices for consumers, greater quantity of all goods and services supplied, and specialization of workers and firms according to their most efficient parameters. Of course, free trade has a pernicious effect on inefficient national industries, but it also expands efficient industry, and provides jobs in those industries that generate a higher wage. The net benefits outweigh the net costs. As an historical aside, the Smoot-Hawley Act of the early 1930s in the United States, legislation that imposed tariffs on 33% of all imported goods, merely exacerbated the Great Depression.

Minimum wage is a very reasonable and humane tradeoff between economic efficiency and equality. Does the minimum wage adversely affect the economy? Yes. It increases unemployment substantially. Increased unemployment results in decreased production, which ultimately leads to decreasing wages. Do the gains earned by those workers enjoying the 'fruits' of minimum wage offset the increased employment? It is difficult to determine, but probably not. As someone mentioned in a previous post, higher wages boost consumer spending and investment, which spurs the economy. But realize that due to the minimum wage, there are now a plethora of workers who are consequently earning no wage save unemployment compensation or government entitlements, which are paltry in the U.S. However, minimum wage laws are the lifeblood of unskilled workers, and are certainly condonable.

Good stuff.

Wait, Neutered, Hack, I'm seeing a contradiction here. :?

So what's the highest rating in Civil Rights? Or does it only have 14 levels compared to the 15 of the other two?

I've looked through a number governments, mostly restricting myself to Anarchy types, and have not found anything higher then World Benchmark, Excessive, or Frightening (which I presume is the correct order) in Civil Rights. Of course, Civil Rights having just 14 categories seems a little off, so I will update if I am notified/find another missing link. On the flip side, there is also a possibility that I have made an error in the other two columns. :?

The lowest Civil Rights can get is "Unheard Of". "Outlawed" is only for Political Freedoms.

The lowest Civil Rights can get is "Unheard Of". "Outlawed" is only for Political Freedoms.

The Dictatorship of Tonton (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=display_nation/nation=Marathon)

UN Category: Psychotic Dictatorship
Civil Rights: Outlawed
Economy: Basket Case
Political Freedoms: Outlawed

Of course, this information may be altered due to a new legislation by Tonton, and therefore is unlikely to be permanent.

Doh! Even one of my own nations has "Outlawed"... sorry. :oops:

My nation's political freedoms went from World Benchmark to Excessive and it got me worried that they went down a bit, but it seems they only went higher. Great post! :)

Are we sure "Fair" is above "Reasonable" on the Economic scale? The word "Fair" just sounds like it's below "Reasonable" just a tad.

no way, i have excessive civil rights! now up to "frightening"... Public nudity, perhaps...

Hm, I've never had excessive political freedoms...went directly from World Benchmark to Widely Abused :(

Hmm, I usually have anarchy but I went down to Civil Rights Lovefest with one of the latest UN resolutions. The latest project is to get as high marks as possible in all three cathegories at the same time. Anyone pinned the three highest? Is it possible at all? At the moment:

Civil Rights: World Benchmark
Economy: All-Consuming
Political Freedoms: Excessive

I have several puppets that are trying to reach Anarchy.

Of course, they're so poor that the biker gangs wouldn't be able to afford motorcycles.

i have Excessive, Powerhouse, Excellent.

who can beat that?

i have Excessive, Powerhouse, Excellent.

who can beat that?

I can.

World benchmark, frightening, excessive

I had that (and anarchy) with Mac Anu at one point.

My best:

Civil Rights: Outlawed
Economy: Frightening
Political Freedoms: Outlawed

Who could beat that for a Dictatorship nation? No one, plus I'm a Corporate Police State

PWNED!

That's with Sythia, sorry.

Wait a miniute. Souldn't unheard of be lower than outlawed on civil rights and political freedoms :?:

In Civil Rights you can have poor, I think......

I have excessive political freedoms! :D

Everytime I put in tarrifs my economy jumps up 1 level... Everytime :D

Abolishing min wage laws means people begin earning less, which means less money is spent which means wages are lowered because businesses become less profitable - downward spiral

Raising Tariffs should improve your economy. If it's borderline, then it can lower it because of past decisions.

According to your Malthusian minimum wage argument, we'd all be making nothing right now since minimum wage didnt exist until like the 50s or something like that. The minimum wage means people begin earning what the market is willing to pay them. It's capitalism and it increases your economy. Raising tariffs harms your economy as far as I know. Subsidies help it though although I don't think they should; they basically pay people not to produce.

very good

Does anyone know the list of rankings for UN category as to what is more liberal r more conservative, if there is one of course. I don't really know how it's organized.

does nudity up civ rights? It downed mine once...

My best:

Civil Rights: Outlawed
Economy: Frightening
Political Freedoms: Outlawed

Who could beat that for a Dictatorship nation? No one, plus I'm a Corporate Police State

PWNED!
Meh your tax rate is a mere 93%...
Therefore I beat you with a 100% tax rate.
Civil Rights; Some (I leave them some options... mostly drug related)
Economy: Frightening
Political Freedoms: Outlawed

I vote that Frightening is greater than All-Consuming.

According to the recent "Variables" thread, I have a '479' economy. I'm not sure exactly what it means, but it's at least a hundred points above anyone else.

Besides that, I watched the building of my economy carefully. Unless I skipped Frightening on the way up to All-Consuming, then fell back down and hovered (while sacrificing everything in the pursuit of military and economic power), Frightening is the highest.

I vote that Frightening is greater than All-Consuming.

See this thread (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=47301&start=0).

Ballotonia

(Civil Rights, Economy, Political Freedoms)
1. Excessive, Powerhouse, Very Good (Capitalizt)
2. Outlawed, Imploded, Outlawed (Psychotic Dictatorship)
3. Excellent, Struggling, Superb (Left-Wing Utopia)

The first I am trying to keep a Libertarian paradise.
The second I am trying to keep a Totalitarian hell.
The third just started, and I will try to keep it as liberal/socialist as possible. Lots of rights. Probably a poor economy.

How can a high degree of Civil Rights be considered "Frightening?"

The more civil rights the better! Seems a bit of a misnomer to me!

How can a high degree of Civil Rights be considered "Frightening?"

The more civil rights the better! Seems a bit of a misnomer to me!

Frightening on civil rights is a bad thing. The only thing worse would be outlawed civil rights.

How can a high degree of Civil Rights be considered "Frightening?"

The more civil rights the better! Seems a bit of a misnomer to me!

Frightening on civil rights is a bad thing. The only thing worse would be outlawed civil rights.

Then why is "Frightening" so high up the chart?? I don't get it??

How can a high degree of Civil Rights be considered "Frightening?"

The more civil rights the better! Seems a bit of a misnomer to me!

Frightening on civil rights is a bad thing. The only thing worse would be outlawed civil rights.

Then why is "Frightening" so high up the chart?? I don't get it??
I think they confused economy with civil rights.

How can a high degree of Civil Rights be considered "Frightening?"

The more civil rights the better! Seems a bit of a misnomer to me!

Frightening on civil rights is a bad thing. The only thing worse would be outlawed civil rights.

Then why is "Frightening" so high up the chart?? I don't get it??
I think they confused economy with civil rights.

Well, then, the scale is wrong, and should be fixed. An abundance of Civil Rights could NEVER be "frightening!!"

Are you sure tehre's a "widely abused' category for civil rights? Last time most liberal nations was ranked the #1 had a frightening rating.

Well, then, the scale is wrong, and should be fixed. An abundance of Civil Rights could NEVER be "frightening!!"

The People's Republic of Kitsylvania (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=display_nation/nation=Kitsylvania)
"Love and Peace!"
UN Category: Civil Rights Lovefest
Civil Rights: Frightening Economy: Reasonable Political Freedoms: Excellent

frightening is the highest economy...and the (lowest) most civil rights

Don't forget it is your own political view that the more civil rights you have the absolute better. And while many Anarchists would clearly agree with you (I think that might be the RL example of complete Civil Rights being allowed) as well as many other players in the game, it is not a cingular truth. It is a politcal opinion. Thus, to make distinction between high and low, Max had to give indicators as Steel Butterfuly says.

does nudity up civ rights? It downed mine once...

That depends - did you allow it to be your choice, or did you make it compulsory?

If you make nudity compulsory, you're taking away their rights to be clothed if they wish.

(lowest) most civil rights
Huh?

:?: Forgive me I'm kind of new to Nation States. So please don't throw rocks at me - lol. I have looked at the chart for the ratings and understand it somewhat.

I do not however understand how the ratings are arrived at. I seem to be voting for more political freedoms, yet the ratings are sinking lower. The more political freedoms I vote for.. the lower my political freedoms sink in the ratings ?

And the more I vote on issues in an effort to raise my economic level the lower rated economy I end up with..

My Civil Rights seem to be staying at World Benchmark, and I like that.

The ratings are calculated by the way my government votes on the issues... correct ? I'm missing something somewhere... :roll:

:?: Forgive me I'm kind of new to Nation States. So please don't throw rocks at me - lol. I have looked at the chart for the ratings and understand it somewhat.

I do not however understand how the ratings are arrived at. I seem to be voting for more political freedoms, yet the ratings are sinking lower. The more political freedoms I vote for.. the lower my political freedoms sink in the ratings ?

And the more I vote on issues in an effort to raise my economic level the lower rated economy I end up with..

My Civil Rights seem to be staying at World Benchmark, and I like that.

The ratings are calculated by the way my government votes on the issues... correct ? I'm missing something somewhere... :roll:

This is correct. However, the issues must be interpreted carefully to investigate their outcome. One optionmay seem to grant more civil rights but in fact doesn't. Like the public nudity one. Making nudity compulsory will lower the civ. rights (as stated before). I had only one or two decisions doing the opposite of what I supposed them to do, and the reasons for it became clear when reading the effects (the third paragraph of your nations description). And sometimes an issue looks like giving pol. freedoms but does give civ. rights. And they can affect more than one stat so an issue raising pol. freedoms may reduce civ. rights or vice-versa.

What puzzles me is that I seem to go from "fragile" eco to "imploded" straight all the time, bypassing the "basket case". Furthermore, I just went up from a long-time "imploded" eco to "fragile" only due to a single issue. I don't believe that it will have had that much power to get my eco out of the hole and let it climb two levels? Therefore, I believe that "basket case" is in fact above "fragile", not below it.

The highest level of civil rights is Frightening. When the Most Liberal Nation UN report came around every nation in the top 100 had a frightening civil rights level instead of Widely Abused.

How can a high degree of Civil Rights be considered "Frightening?"

The more civil rights the better! Seems a bit of a misnomer to me!

I think that the game designer is pointing out that beyond a certain (very liberal/libertarian) point, personal freedoms can be detrimental to society.

For example, when children become involved...

Very few would argue that children should have the same personal freedoms as adults, such as being allowed to smoke or drink or gamble or to star in porn films. Most would argue that children should be forced to go to school, and that children should not be allowed to drive until they reach a certain age. A society free of ANY personal restraints starts granting those civil liberties to kids, and generally speaking, most people don't think that's a good thing.

However I agree with you that personal freedoms should be extended as far as possible for adults.

Notice that Political and Economic freedoms both have limits imposed on them as well. An absolutely politically free nation has surrendered gov't control of anything, which the designer feels is a bad thing. At best, it's an unstable place to live, with regime changes occuring so regularly that no leadership can enact any long-term solutions. At worst it's a rudderless ship, drifting aimlessly in an ocean of political activists.

A Frightening economy simulates the point at which money dominates every other priority. Imagine a system where murder is penalized by a steep monetary fine, and no prison time if the fine is paid -- the wealthiest could murder with impunity under such a system. Or the gov't starts selling nukes to the highest bidder -- a ridiculously unsafe society to live in.

Essentially, when a nation drifts too far in the direction of Economic, Political or Personal freedom the consequences become apparent. Beyond level 12 (or 13 in terms of the economy) and the freedoms are more negative than positive.

I don't get it. "Tourists from around the world come to visit the country's famous rainforests, the mining industry has taken a hit from tighter environmental regulations, citizens select which government department gets their income tax abstract metadatas each year, and guns are banned." And with that, my eco went from "fragile" to "struggling", which is, again, a rise of two? I've never hat the don't-bulldoze-the-rainforest issue increase my eco, always decrease (despite the tourism *g*). Therefore, it seems that "struggling" is below "fragile". Therefore I see it as:
imploded->struggling->fragile->basket case->... however, this would still mean that I actually went up two places the last time (imploded to fragile). Maybe the decreased pol. and civ. rights now? Or their increase by last time? Strange.

Abolishing min wage laws means people begin earning less, which means less money is spent which means wages are lowered because businesses become less profitable - downward spiral


Raising Tariffs should improve your economy. If it's borderline, then it can lower it because of past decisions.

no no no no...Tariffs restrict free trade...

Say you make a tariff, then the nations you traded with make tariffs, soon trade is so expensive that nations rarely do it

Tarrifs lower your economy

Abolishing min wage laws means people begin earning less, which means less money is spent which means wages are lowered because businesses become less profitable - downward spiral


Raising Tariffs should improve your economy. If it's borderline, then it can lower it because of past decisions.

no no no no...Tariffs restrict free trade...

Say you make a tariff, then the nations you traded with make tariffs, soon trade is so expensive that nations rarely do it

Tarrifs lower your economy
No, they would raise your economy but lower your economic fredoms (not displayed). Most of the issue effects are short-term, and tarrifs would probably raise economy and lower freedoms.