NationStates Jolt Archive

Issues with issues...

27-11-2003, 23:45
Yesterday I received the death penalty debate issue. I voted it down despite crime being a problem. Now that the issue has been enacted, my country's dossier now includes the phrase "poltical extremist groups are outlawed" and my political freedom rank took a hit while civil rights ranking rose. This does not appear ot make sense to me... what de heck does political extremism have to do with the death penalty and why should my civil rights actually rise for this phantom issue being enacted...?????????

*is slightly confused...* :?
27-11-2003, 23:53
Firstly Modalert :arrow: Got Issues

Secondly, in response to this:

This issue is a bit weird, yes. Banning the groups actually counts as a civil rights increase, because the right to life is seen to take precedent over the right to freedom of speech. I personally dismiss this issue every time it comes around, as both options result in a decrease in liberties some way.

The reason political freedoms dropped is that you banned a political movement- those calling for the death penalty. They were expressing their views to government, and you banned them. This is why your political rankings took a hit
27-11-2003, 23:56

Modalert => issues?

Basically you just banned the people from expressing their desire for a death penalty, therefore reducing their political freedoms. You stole an election by outlawing the opposition. Sound reasonable now?

This was one of only two issues i dismised in my more liberal puppet before the new issues arrived, as niether option moved my nation where i wanted it to go.

I suggest you read the issues carefully, the effect is often easy to miss.
28-11-2003, 00:09
aahh was proposed by some extreme righties which I have no love for anyhow. All the better, muhahhaha *cough*

thanks for the clarification.
28-11-2003, 00:24
This is one of the really dodgy issues, like the whether or not to censor Nazis one. Its a quandry for liberals/ leftleaners, but very weird for right leaning states.

For instance, a psychotic dictatorship, which favours the death penalty, has to increase political freedoms to allow executions.

On the other hand, a Right-Wing Utopia might want political freedoms and the death penalty, so no problem there at all.
28-11-2003, 08:27
I still think somoething is worng with this. The issue asked if I wanted to enact the death penalty not explicitly outlaw extremist groups. Simply because I denied the request of a lobby of a certain political persuasion how does that translate into forbidding political extremism??? Something just doesn't make sense here. There is no mention of anything about death penalty in my country's dossier...
28-11-2003, 10:10
The option you chose (emphasis added):

2. "I'm sorry," says Civil Rights Unionist @@RANDOMNAME@@, "but this travesty cannot be allowed to pass. If the government needs to crack down on lunatic fringe groups in order to keep our great nation free of the death penalty, then so be it. We must ban the politics of hatred and fear!"

There's no option where you can simply have no death penalty but let those 'lunatic fringe groups' go on spreading their 'hatred and fear'.

28-11-2003, 10:44
ahh ty once again, i forgot the exact wording of the issue and the other parts i remeber I viewed more as non-sequitor rather than i other words thes issues are sometimes threefold with unrelated bs straggling on them.. interesting :?

*is ready to turn off issues altogether but would be left with nothing much to do...*
28-11-2003, 16:40
*is ready to turn off issues altogether but would be left with nothing much to do...*


Nothing much to do??

Get to the forums man, or find yourself a decent region (See sticky in NationStates forum)
28-11-2003, 18:15
Oh im having fun on the for our 'region' its a collectin of folks from another bbs and the participation there is also dwindling. My region seems kinda dead but I'm new here so I have no baseline for comparision