NationStates Jolt Archive

or did the severity of what people are reporting in take a nose dive.

before, I noticed alot of serious flaming/baiting/trolling being reported. I mean really serious ones. People calling others F#*king @$$holes, M*th*rF#*kers and other extremely Not Nice things. Things that really needed Mod Attention.

Now days, we have reports of people calling others Idiots and Ignorant and labeling the smallest (in my opinion I will admit) thing "flamebait", "Spam", and "Trolling." Many of which are misunderstandings or can be ignored if some skins were thicker.

is it just me, or do others see this trend also?

-snip-

You're not the only one seeing this trend ..

Many of which [...] can be ignored if some skins were thicker.That's my take on it.

(I appreciate posting after a mod has isn't really contributing to the spirit of posting less in Moderation. But still.)

You're almost certainly right. I haven't been long enough to chart that sort of change: and I'm more than likely someone who sometimes report things that could probably be brushed off (five in one go, I believe, was my record). In most cases, it's not that I'm offended: merely that I see it as no problem to report a violation.

But that's besides the point. You may well be right, as I say, but what could be done about it? Other than mods taking a harder line in terms of telling people "oh, come ON: is it really worth losing sleep over?", I'm not sure there would be a way to actively stop people reporting less vicious flames.

Also, the issue of "skin" can be misleading. At times, it is people being unable to accept criticism: I agree. But there are often pretty serious flames that I doubt actually cause offence. A recent troll made some fairly explicit comments about one player that were rightly reported: the player added, however, that he found it pretty funny. Sometimes, for better or for worse, players report what they see as inappropriate comments/behaviour, even if it doesn't offend them personally.

or did the severity of what people are reporting in take a nose dive.

before, I noticed alot of serious flaming/baiting/trolling being reported. I mean really serious ones. People calling others F#*king @$$holes, M*th*rF#*kers and other extremely Not Nice things. Things that really needed Mod Attention.

Now days, we have reports of people calling others Idiots and Ignorant and labeling the smallest (in my opinion I will admit) thing "flamebait", "Spam", and "Trolling." Many of which are misunderstandings or can be ignored if some skins were thicker.

is it just me, or do others see this trend also?

I think this cuts both ways. I think people report things, myself included, not with the intention of a player getting officially warned or forumbanned, but instead receiving an unofficial warning or a request to behave. Reasons for doing this are obvious, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. Sometimes all it takes to keep a poster from going off the deep end is a mod suggesting they cool it or back away from the computer to cool or some such thing.

There are lots of young people on this forum and lots of people who at one time or another have behaved immaturely and it lends to a tendency to test the boundaries all the time. When mild flaming/flamebaiting/trolling goes unabated, it becomes moderate, then unabated becomes more aggressive.

We all know there are some posters here who are hot-headed or just plain unreasonable and they are going to do what they're gonna do and the mods just have to clean up the mess afterward, but the majority of posters benefit from being told they are stretching the rules and that sooner or later they're gonna break. I think all in all it makes for a more respectful forum where we base our interactions on discussion and not on who can find the sneakiest way to insult someone while not officially breaking the rules.

But I also agree that as more mild flames/flamebaiting/trolling gets attention, posters begin to have more of an expectation of mod action in more mild cases, adding to the mods already heavy load (thus the cuts both ways comment).

I really think the levels of the incidents they would like to be reported should be set by mods (as hard as that is to do) by telling posters when they feel that a report is too mild to be even worth commenting on in the thread.

EDIT: If the measurement is whether or not we are capable of ignoring such comments (in response to the thicker skin post), then I suspect the quality of posts is going to go down as a result. I can't think of anything that people are going to say to me that isn't just going to make me disappointed that their argument is so weak that namecalling is necessary. I don't think the thickness of the skin of a particular poster should be the measure of what is and isn't appropriate on the forums.

is it just me, or do others see this trend also?

It's not just you. I recall back when I was a mod "groups" of people were fair game. You just couldn't flame an actual NS player. And even then it usually had to be a flame, as you have pointed out. Thicker skins would be nice!

It's not just you. I recall back when I was a mod "groups" of people were fair game. You just couldn't flame an actual NS player. And even then it usually had to be a flame, as you have pointed out. Thicker skins would be nice!

Then you're not just talking about reporting as JuNii is, but you're talking about Mod action. It sounds like what mods would act on when you were a mod was more grievious rulebreaking than gets a mod response now. I think that's a whole seperate issue.

Then you're not just talking about reporting as JuNii is, but you're talking about Mod action. It sounds like what mods would act on when you were a mod was more grievious rulebreaking than gets a mod response now. I think that's a whole seperate issue.

Hmm, I didn't even notice I did that, but I guess you're right. It does seem like people get warned for things they never use to. But I don't want to hijack this thread. I just agree people need to grow thicker skins. I mean when does being PC go to far?

I should end it there.. as said, don't want to hijack on a different topic. Sorry about that.

Hmm, I didn't even notice I did that, but I guess you're right. It does seem like people get warned for things they never use to. But I don't want to hijack this thread. I just agree people need to grow thicker skins. I mean when does being PC go to far?

I should end it there.. as said, don't want to hijack on a different topic. Sorry about that.

Actually, it's not my thread and not for me to say, but I wasn't implying hijacking. I was just saying that posters getting thicker skins and mod action are seperate issues. It seems to me that they're intertwined.

On that point, I haven't really noticed that warnings or forumbans have tended toward being more easily given. If anything I think I notice a lot more mod action that does not actually involve warnings or forumbans. I don't know if that trend is intentionally, but I find it to be beneficial. I wholly believe that if not for a mod comment on the inflammatory nature of some of my posts I would be still travelling down a path of slowly pushing that envelope. I suspect that I some point (perhaps even before this) I would have earned myself an official warning, which I'm quite happy not to have. I think people tend to worry about any mod activity like they've been sanctioned, when, in reality, if they haven't officially warned or given you the mod version of a time-out, then I figure the poster has just gotten a free lesson on what is and what is not appropriate behavior in the forums.

I think any perceived view that mods have become more sensitive to rulebreaking may be from the increased activity that hasn't amounted to official warnings and related punishments. Again, I don't think the level of post that receives a warning has actually changed.

JuNii, if this is hijacking, I humbly apologize but I think the issues are fully intertwined.

or did the severity of what people are reporting in take a nose dive.

before, I noticed alot of serious flaming/baiting/trolling being reported. I mean really serious ones. People calling others F#*king @$$holes, M*th*rF#*kers and other extremely Not Nice things. Things that really needed Mod Attention.

Now days, we have reports of people calling others Idiots and Ignorant and labeling the smallest (in my opinion I will admit) thing "flamebait", "Spam", and "Trolling." Many of which are misunderstandings or can be ignored if some skins were thicker.

is it just me, or do others see this trend also?

It goes in cycles, in my experience. For a while folks will only report very grave offenses and then something sets off a pattern of hypersensitivity among active posters and you get more complaints. That dissipates until the next time when something sets folks off, and the invalid complaints pile up again.

Another factor is the invariable 'supporters' of someone who gets in trouble, or players who think that for whatever reason they should be above a particular ruling, or that a ruling shouldn't apply to them on account of nation age, supposed status, etc. That also tends to add to the 'frivolous' or somewhat useless complaints. It snowballs.

One person gets nailed for something, then the next thing you know, someone else sees something similar concerning a player they don't agree with, so that gets thrown up with a 'well THIS didn't get nailed, so why me/my friend?' and so on and so forth. Or things get dredged up from the past, or this case is compared to that, for whatever reason ... and there you have your escalation like HotRodia mentioned.

I can understand how rulings and judgements change over time. It's a dynamic site - the rules by nature are dynamic as well. Add to that the differing mixes of mods, the lessons learned through months, and now years of moderating, there being more time available now to see developing patterns and the like ... it only stands to reason that trends will wax and wane, and while some things may remain the same, minutae within the system may shift now and then.

I agree that it isn't always so much a matter of 'thicker skin' so much as 'having a little common sense'. Regardless, it doesn't hurt to ask so long as it isn't blatantly ridiculous, given the fact that lines do shift a tad now and then, and every case is different. That's what the Moderation forum is for, no?

JuNii, if this is hijacking, I humbly apologize but I think the issues are fully intertwined.
no not hijacking. I did kinda meant this as a place for mods to blow off some fustration, but the direction it's taking is fascinating. so Stephistan, Jocabia, no worries from me.

Another factor is the invariable 'supporters' of someone who gets in trouble, or players who think that for whatever reason they should be above a particular ruling, or that a ruling shouldn't apply to them on account of nation age, supposed status, etc. That also tends to add to the 'frivolous' or somewhat useless complaints. It snowballs.

One person gets nailed for something, then the next thing you know, someone else sees something similar concerning a player they don't agree with, so that gets thrown up with a 'well THIS didn't get nailed, so why me/my friend?' and so on and so forth. Or things get dredged up from the past, or this case is compared to that, for whatever reason ... and there you have your escalation like HotRodia mentioned.

I can understand how rulings and judgements change over time. It's a dynamic site - the rules by nature are dynamic as well. Add to that the differing mixes of mods, the lessons learned through months, and now years of moderating, there being more time available now to see developing patterns and the like ... it only stands to reason that trends will wax and wane, and while some things may remain the same, minutae within the system may shift now and then.

I agree that it isn't always so much a matter of 'thicker skin' so much as 'having a little common sense'. Regardless, it doesn't hurt to ask so long as it isn't blatantly ridiculous, given the fact that lines do shift a tad now and then, and every case is different. That's what the Moderation forum is for, no?

I certainly can't argue what you have said and of course just like life, the site is certainly dynamic as well.

I must admit though I have often seen a person get forumban after forumban yet never get deleted, where as for the same offense another nation is deleted. I admit that many factors are at play, you would not give the same rope to a new player who has not been around very long to show that this is some what out of character for them, where as older nations the mods do tend to know their post history better and are in a better position to know if the person was just having a bad day and it's out of character for this person to be that way.

All in all though the mods are fair and try their best and for that we should be grateful that we have a much more sane site then most other free for all forums.

I guess what I'm saying is I really have no complaint, just making an observation. Heh, it all works out in the wash as they say. :)

Hmm, I didn't even notice I did that, but I guess you're right. It does seem like people get warned for things they never use to.
This has been going on since Euro was promoted to Forum Mod. With more active moderators, it makes sense that more offenses will be punished than earlier.

/ends hijacking