NationStates Jolt Archive

Nope. Not at all. I just don't like mealy-mouthed, ignorant little "pigfuckers" who wouldn't know reality if it slapped them across their simpering little mouths. :D
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145221&postcount=23

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145221&postcount=23
I rather expected someone to report this. I wasn't flaming anyone. Read the entire post, in context. It was in repsonse to Dobbsworld who compared me to a jihadist and then denied he said it. And note that the word "pigfuckers" is in quotes because it was a term Dobbsworld had used in a post just before mine.

Eutrusca, you're the one who compared yourself to a 'jihadist', or rather implied that I compared you to a 'jihadist'. I did nothing of the sort. All I said was that, "I'm sure if you were to ask, most suicide bombers'd describe themselves as being 'politically centrist".

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145078&postcount=16

It's not up to me how you choose to interpret my statement. That you choose to feel that it applies directly, to you, personally, is not my affair.

As to the use of the word, 'pigfuckers', yes, I'll of course fully own up to having used that term.

Thanks for your concerns. I don't think this amounts to anything more than a tempest in a teacup, and a half-filled teacup at that. I will of course abide by any decision taken by Moderation in these matters.

Thanks again.



*Edit: I just took a look through that thread, and my use of the word 'pigfuckers' doesn't appear in that thread. I think Eutrusca must have been thinking of a different thread when he posted.

Erm.


I don't think that this is the correct place to have a dick measuring contest. Just let the Admins hand out their ruling and get it over with.

Erm.


I don't think that this is the correct place to have a dick measuring contest. Just let the Admins hand out their ruling and get it over with.

What?

What are you implying?

Actually, don't bother answering. I was just waiting for the mods to rule on this. I don't think you're actually contributing to a resolution by chiming in, though.

Thanks anyway.

What?

What are you implying?

Actually, don't bother answering. I was just waiting for the mods to rule on this. I don't think you're actually contributing to a resolution by chiming in, though.

Thanks anyway.
I agree. ( Please don't faint! ) :D

I rather expected someone to report this. I wasn't flaming anyone.

"pigfuckers" is in quotes because it was a term Dobbsworld had used in a post just before mine.

Eutrusca; I'm not sure how you always end up with a free pass, but yet you always seem to get away with way more than anyone else (perhaps not anyone, but a lot) It doesn't matter if someone flames you and you flame them back. Both parties are just as guilty of flaming.

I don't know, maybe it's because of your post count or something, but it just doesn't make sense why you always get a free pass for things that most of us would be warned for. It's quite puzzling really.

Keep in mind that Eutrusca has to take a lot more shit than the rest of us because of his views, so he has more reason to give people shit. I'm not trying to justify his behavior (not my place to do so), just hoping to add some perspective.

Why are you all getting your two cents' worth in, here? This concerns two, no make that three people:

1) Deleuze, who complained about Eutrusca.

2) Eutrusca, who has had a complaint lodged against him.

3) Myself, (Dobbsworld) who was on the receiving end of some venting from Eutrusca, but may (or may not) have pushed a few buttons along the way.

This isn't about anything else. No further perspective is required. This is NS, not a soap opera.

Thanks for trying to 'help', but you're all needlessly complicating matters. I hope I'm not talking out of turn when I say that both Eutrusca and I are looking forward to an eventual resolution to this relatively small matter. I can't speak for Deleuze, I won't presume to.

Thanks nonetheless.

Keep in mind that Eutrusca has to take a lot more shit than the rest of us because of his views, so he has more reason to give people shit. I'm not trying to justify his behavior (not my place to do so), just hoping to add some perspective.

There is no perspective to add. Just because somebody takes more crap for their views doesn't mean that they are justified in responding in kind. Rules apply to everybody, there's no perspective in that, that's just the way it is regardless of belief.

Keep in mind that Eutrusca has to take a lot more shit than the rest of us because of his views, so he has more reason to give people shit. I'm not trying to justify his behavior (not my place to do so), just hoping to add some perspective.


That makes zero sense! If my views were totally out of touch with a majority of NS players (which is what you're implying with that statement, I personally see many that share his views) then I should be allowed to flame people because I some how have an unfair advantage? Give me a break!

Christ, I can't wait for the mods to lock up this thread.

Enough already.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145086&postcount=17
I'm sure if you were to ask, most suicide bombers'd describe themselves as being 'politically centrist'.

Ha.This post seems to have been the trigger. There is absolutely nothing wrong, here; it is being quoted for context. Note that Dobbsworld is not comparing Eutrusca to a jihadist.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145174&postcount=18So now you're comparing me to a "jihadist?" That's a kind of new record low, even for you. Possibly construable as flamebait. However, up until this point, this could have been treated as a harmless misunderstanding.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145189&postcount=21Ohhhh, feeling defensive? Look back, I didn't actually compare anything or anyone at all. It's not my fault if you leapt to that conclusion.

Are you feeling unduly sensitive today?Dobbsworld: Official Warning - Flamebait. Taunting Eutrusca.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145221&postcount=23
Nope. Not at all. I just don't like mealy-mouthed, ignorant little "pigfuckers" who wouldn't know reality if it slapped them across their simpering little mouths. :D

EDIT: I didn't actually compare anything or anyone at all there. If's not my fault if you leap to the conclusion that I was referring to you. :DEutrusca: Official Warning - Flaming. Calling Dobbsworld an "ignorant little pigfucker". Forumbanned for 2 weeks. He's already had a 3-day forumban, so this may be changed to deletion; this will require consultation with other Moderators.

Keep in mind that Eutrusca has to take a lot more shit than the rest of us because of his views, so he has more reason to give people shit. I'm not trying to justify his behavior (not my place to do so), just hoping to add some perspective.With all due respect, I do not see how this perspective is relevant. All players are required to be civil regardless of provocation.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
NationStates Game Moderator

With all due respect, I do not see how this perspective is relevant. All players are required to be civil regardless of provocation.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
NationStates Game Moderator

Allow me to clarify, if you will.

Let's have a hypothetical example.

Person 1: This person has often been attacked unnecessarily and assumed to be a bad person because their views differ from the mainstream. They finally snap and assualt someone for attacking their views.

Person 2: This person has occassionally been attacked unnecessarily because of their views. They finally snap and assualt someone for attacking their views.

I don't know about y'all, but I have a bit more compassion for person #1. I still have compassion for person #2, just not to the same degree (because I understand that we all have bad days and such). I may not be inclined to give special considerations to Person #1 when it comes to applying the rules, but I can certainly understand their greater frustration.

I was not suggesting that the rules should be different for Eutrusca, but that maybe we could take this factor into account when dealing with him as a player. Sorry if I wasn't clear on that earlier.

I was not suggesting that the rules should be different for Eutrusca, but that maybe we could take this factor into account when dealing with him as a player. Sorry if I wasn't clear on that earlier.Ahhh! Okay, I understand. You're arguing that players should adjust their behavior towards other players because of this; you are not arguing that Moderators should adjust their official decisions because of this.

In that case, I have no official comment.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

Let's have a hypothetical example.

Person 1: This person has often been attacked unnecessarily and assumed to be a bad person because their views differ from the mainstream. They finally snap and assualt someone for attacking their views.

Person 2: This person has occassionally been attacked unnecessarily because of their views. They finally snap and assualt someone for attacking their views.

I don't know about y'all, but I have a bit more compassion for person #1. I still have compassion for person #2, just not to the same degree (because I understand that we all have bad days and such). I may not be inclined to give special considerations to Person #1 when it comes to applying the rules, but I can certainly understand their greater frustration.

I was not suggesting that the rules should be different for Eutrusca, but that maybe we could take this factor into account when dealing with him as a player. Sorry if I wasn't clear on that earlier.

I have an opinion on it as a player. So if we take example #1 & 2 who deems it an attack and who deems it as "unnecessarily"? You? Me? The third guy from the left?

Lets take example #3 The Red Arrow, now there is a guy who had unpopular beliefs and was always being accosted for them, he was so far left that even liberals didn't want to hear what he had to say.

Where as Eutrusca claims right in his sig that he is a centrist. How is being a centrist unpopular? It's not. Now if we ignore Eutrusca's sig and look at his real political beliefs, that of a conservative and right winger, still not unpopular, many people on the forums are conservative and right wingers, yourself included. You seem pretty conservative in your posts.

So what I hear you saying is that if the right is being given a hard time we should have more compassion for them than if what? The left? The middle? The out to lunch?

See, I just don't get what you're saying, because Eutrusca actually has quite a few friends on NS and a lot of people agree with him. However even if that was not the case, if you can't handle the heat, you stay out of the kitchen. Because if you pick up a lighter and flame someone you're guilty of flaming no matter how popular or unpopular your beliefs are. And trust me, Eutrusca has had MANY chances, more than a lot of other people I've seen.

So I guess what I'd really like to know is what is so unpopular about Eutrusca's belief's that he should be given special consideration by the players of NS?

I have an opinion on it as a player. So if we take example #1 & 2 who deems it an attack and who deems it as "unnecessarily"? You? Me? The third guy from the left?

Lets take example #3 The Red Arrow, now there is a guy who had unpopular beliefs and was always being accosted for them, he was so far left that even liberals didn't want to hear what he had to say.

Where as Eutrusca claims right in his sig that he is a centrist. How is being a centrist unpopular? It's not. Now if we ignore Eutrusca's sig and look at his real political beliefs, that of a conservative and right winger, still not unpopular, many people on the forums are conservative and right wingers, yourself included. You seem pretty conservative in your posts.

So what I hear you saying is that if the right is being given a hard time we should have more compassion for them than if what? The left? The middle? The out to lunch?

See, I just don't get what you're saying, because Eutrusca actually has quite a few friends on NS and a lot of people agree with him. However even if that was not the case, if you can't handle the heat, you stay out of the kitchen. Because if you pick up a lighter and flame someone you're guilty of flaming no matter how popular or unpopular your beliefs are. And trust me, Eutrusca has had MANY chances, more than a lot of other people I've seen.

So I guess what I'd really like to know is what is so unpopular about Eutrusca's belief's that he should be given special consideration by the players of NS?well, that's where tolerance and understanding comes in. I for one try not to take attacks personally, even when it's obvious that they are. I would just quietly and politely point out that they are flaming or close to flaming and if they persist, then I leave it in the hands of the Mods.

most of the times I've pointed the Flaming/trolling posts, the poster responsible posts an apology and tries to go back to civil discussion. others are hung out to dry by the mods.

for people like Eutrusca who tries to stir up debate, I give the benefit of the doubt, for many people attack him and not the subject of the post. so I tend to take his flaming with a grain of salt.

others like Cat-Tribe tends to get fustrated with thick headed people like me, so when their posts get testy, I also swallow it for I know how stubborn I can get. :D

JuNii; I hear what you're saying, but as you, yourself have pointed out, Eutrusca does bait people into getting riled up and I too have seen him do it many, many times. So if you are putting yourself in that position and someone says something you don't like and you flame them, why should anyone players/mods give him special consideration? See that's the thing I'm not getting. If I go out of my way to rub people the wrong way, yeah, I'm probably going to start a flame war. That in itself is basically against the rules, flamebait!

Also, no matter what your belief's are or are not, there are going to be people on the forum who are going to disagree with your position. It doesn't matter if your thread is called "Kittens are cute" someone on the forum hates cats! You can bet on it! So, that is why the rules are the rules. They favor no side, no one set of belief's, they apply to everyone equally. I know the mods are not perfect, no one is, but I do believe they make every attempt on the most part to treat everyone equally whether they agree with the players belief's or not. Eutrusca nor any player should be any exception, ever!

JuNii; I hear what you're saying, but as you, yourself have pointed out, Eutrusca does bait people into getting riled up and I too have seen him do it many, many times. So if you are putting yourself in that position and someone says something you don't like and you flame them, why should anyone players/mods give him special consideration? See that's the thing I'm not getting. If I go out of my way to rub people the wrong way, yeah, I'm probably going to start a flame war. That in itself is basically against the rules, flamebait! most of his topics I see as more of "the other point of view." he starts most of his points using articals found on the web and uses them to spark discussions. now looking at the general tone of the other threads, it can seem like he's trolling. but One thing I suggest, is to read it... think on it away from the forum and read it again. if it still looks like flaming, then don't respond. most of the times, he's trying to show the other side of the argument. (The hardest thing to do and not make it look like flaming.)

Also, no matter what your belief's are or are not, there are going to be people on the forum who are going to disagree with your position. It doesn't matter if your thread is called "Kittens are cute" someone on the forum hates cats! You can bet on it! So, that is why the rules are the rules. They favor no side, no one set of belief's, they apply to everyone equally. I know the mods are not perfect, no one is, but I do believe they make every attempt on the most part to treat everyone equally whether they agree with the players belief's or not. Eutrusca nor any player should be any exception, ever!Yep, they favor no one, which is why Texan Hotrodders is asking for understanding. as he posts later, he's not saying to bend the rules for anyone, just show some tolerance and understanding. Eutrusca has said some things that I find offensive but, in reading the whole thread, I know that he's saying them in the heat of the moment and usually (alot more often then not,) he goes back to being polite after someone points out the flaming or after he takes a break from posting. that's where understanding and Tolerance comes in. the Mods act only if it seems like anyone is flaming/trolling with a purpose. most times, I find it more accidental than not.

Yep, they favor no one, which is why Texan Hotrodders is asking for understanding. as he posts later, he's not saying to bend the rules for anyone, just show some tolerance and understanding. Eutrusca has said some things that I find offensive but, in reading the whole thread, I know that he's saying them in the heat of the moment and usually (alot more often then not,) he goes back to being polite after someone points out the flaming or after he takes a break from posting. that's where understanding and Tolerance comes in. the Mods act only if it seems like anyone is flaming/trolling with a purpose. most times, I find it more accidental than not.

Then wouldn't it be lovely if everyone did this to all players? As Eutrusca's opinions are no better and no worse than anyone's, thus he should not get any special treatment, more so that people should always sit back and think about what they are about to post to anyone before they post it. The real guilty party in this one situation was in fact Eutrusca! Perhaps he should take Texan Hotrodders and your advice when and if he returns in 2 weeks, which I assume he will. (I know there were other players involved in rule breaking) but it does appear that Eutrusca was the greatest offender in this case and I have seen him do it and get away with it many times. So, maybe the mods are tired of giving him so many chances. I've seen players deleted for a lot less.

Enough of this. Xanaz and JuNii, an official decision has been made, and this is not a general discussion forum. Nonetheless, there is outstanding one point I wish to address.

Xanaz, in this thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=425760), you make pretty much the exact opposite argument about allowing someone you apparently approve of to be given a pass on the rules.I see this as nothing more than a lynch party to go after the new guy. I think it's really pathetic, so you don't like his style, maybe someone doesn't like your style.versusHowever even if that was not the case, if you can't handle the heat, you stay out of the kitchen. Because if you pick up a lighter and flame someone you're guilty of flaming no matter how popular or unpopular your beliefs are.
Then there'sHe used sarcasm to get his point across and for me that's added bonus points for being creative. If it was lost on some, I suggest you get a sense of humor.versusEutrusca does bait people into getting riled up and I too have seen him do it many, many times. So if you are putting yourself in that position and someone says something you don't like and you flame them, why should anyone players/mods give him special consideration? See that's the thing I'm not getting. If I go out of my way to rub people the wrong way, yeah, I'm probably going to start a flame war. That in itself is basically against the rules, flamebait!
I'm getting very mixed messages here. Apparently it's OK for someone to be provocative and profane if you like them, but it's flaming and trolling if you don't? Make no mistake, everyone who reads the Moderation forum knows exactly how you feel about "Eutrusca", and I'd say that an equal number know how you support "Leprous Monkeyballs". Nonetheless, both are forumbanned for flaming, because the moderation staff is capable of making a decision as to what constitutes acceptable behavior and what doesn't.
So relax, Kryozerkia, move on.. you posted this because you were pissed at him, it's pretty obvious dear.
Man, what a bunch of uptight people here complaining.
I agree. While I too accept the ruling, one does have to wonder.

Of course I'm not a mod either, same as all of you.
Nonetheless, you spend an awful lot of time second-guessing and criticizing us and others in oh-so-polite not-flames. Despite our intention of remaining polite and professional, there is a limit to our patience. We would greatly appreciate it if you would shelve your obvious favoritism towards certain players and animosity towards others, at least in the Moderation forum.

~ Frisbeeteria ~
NationStates Forum Moderator

Fris, apples and oranges, the other guy was using swear words. He never flamed anyone on NS. There is a huge difference.

Anyway, as you wish, this is moderation and not a discussion forum. I shall stop posting discussion type posts.

Just curious, could you tell us what the final punishment was when it's decided? It was unclear in Cogitation's post whether that decision was final.

Nonetheless, you spend an awful lot of time second-guessing and criticizing us and others in oh-so-polite not-flames. Despite our intention of remaining polite and professional, there is a limit to our patience. We would greatly appreciate it if you would shelve your obvious favoritism towards certain players and animosity towards others, at least in the Moderation forum.

~ Frisbeeteria ~
NationStates Forum Moderator

Since this isn't "discussion" and seems to be on topic of what you had to say to me, let me get this straight, you're complaining because I'm polite and don't flame people? Or is it that you just prefer that no one question any one? Frankly you got me confused on this one Fris! Darn me to heck for playing by the rules! LOL

(bold added by me)

Just curious, could you tell us what the final punishment was when it's decided? It was unclear in Cogitation's post whether that decision was final.
We're reviewing the decision and if there is going to be further punishment.

Enough of this. Xanaz and JuNii, an official decision has been made, and this is not a general discussion forum. Nonetheless, there is outstanding one point I wish to address.

[snipped for space saving]

~ Frisbeeteria ~
NationStates Forum ModeratorSorry Fris, It wasn't my intention to second guess or even complain about the mod decision. My point was that alot of people go running to the mods for every little percieved flame/troll (and most of the time, it's valid) I was just asking for more tolerance on the part of the players. to kinda ease up on the mod workload.

Sorry about that, and this will be my last post on this matter.

thanks for you patience.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9145086&postcount=17
This post seems to have been the trigger. There is absolutely nothing wrong, here; it is being quoted for context. Note that Dobbsworld is not comparing Eutrusca to a jihadist.Actually, I would consider that Dobbsworld is since Eutrusca make a big deal of being a "Centrist" in his sig.

But that's just IMO. It's still no excuse for the rest of what The Cap'n said, but I would consider it flame baiting (and report it) if someone said Jihadists would consider themselves "Pro Choice/Libertarians" after quoting me.