NationStates Jolt Archive

Why delete my thread?
I was working within your rules - there was no off-topic discussion, no rudeness or insults and no...well, it was wrking within your rules....so, again, why?

Oh yeah...it was entitled I want a chat, and I want it HERE. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=9094797#post9094797)

It wasn't deleted, it was moved to a seperate part of the forums, most likely for being considered spam, which isn't welcomed in NS General.

It wasn't deleted, it was moved to a seperate part of the forums, most likely for being considered spam, which isn't welcomed in NS General.

Moved/deleted whats the difference..? Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't "spam" (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=spam)?

From: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=416023

Spam/SPAM: Off-topic, irrelevant and multi-posts that clog the server. This includes posting lots of smilies which is known as Smilie Spam. Also akin to spamming is Post-whoring which is when a player posts anything just to increase the postcount. Spamming to the point where you get deleted is known as Klamathing. Spamming in the forums should be reported through the Moderation forum, and In-game, through the Getting Help Page.

From: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=416023

Erm....point to me any point in my forum where that was going on please. I was merely talking to friends that i had met on that specific thread....it is a general (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=GENERAL) forum so therefore what we were talking about was on topic. Thank you.

Well, there is also a seperate part for the general forum in that rules thread, maybe this applies better?:

Chat threads: If you want to have a private conversation with one or two other people, this isn't the place to do it. One of the instant message clients (AIM, MSN) or an IRC /query is best. If you must chat on forums, use Jolt's Chat forum.

Well, there is also a seperate part for the general forum in that rules thread, maybe this applies better?:
Nope, still not really...you shouldn't call a forum "GENERAL" unless people are allowed to chat on it.

Well, that's something you need to take up with admin :p

Nope, still not really...you shouldn't call a forum "GENERAL" unless people are allowed to chat on it.

And the chat forum would be for...?

A topic of GENERAL interest -- that is, that one would reasonably expect everyone to want to weigh in on -- is what the GENERAL forum is for.

A request to CHAT with a few friends is what the CHAT forum is for.

And the chat forum would be for...?

A topic of GENERAL interest -- that is, that one would reasonably expect everyone to want to weigh in on -- is what the GENERAL forum is for.

A request to CHAT with a few friends is what the CHAT forum is for.

Have you checked the definition of the word GENERAL (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=GENERAL)?

Of the underpants, I don't understand what you wish to accomplish here.

You have seen in the One Stop Rules Shop where Chats belong.
Your thread was not deleted, simply moved there.

Your title, of "I want a Chat and I want it HERE" would seem to indicate you know full well that you were posting in the incorrect forum. You are not being singled out, no matter how you feel -- we move threads from International Incidents to Gameplay, from General to Moderation, and from whatever incorrect forum it is in to whatever correct forum it ought to be all the time.

Your reaction is to be belligerent and to expect us to conform to the way you want things run.

Does this not seem a little illogical to you?

You may, of course, do as you please on any forum that conforms to your rules. Kindly have the courtesy to obey the guidelines of this one.

Of the underpants, I don't understand what you wish to accomplish here.

You have seen in the One Stop Rules Shop where Chats belong.
Your thread was not deleted, simply moved there.

Your reaction is to be belligerent and to expect us to conform to the way you want things run.

Does this not seem a little illogical to you?

No, what DOES seem illogical to me is that threads started by non-mods and non-high posting people are moved/removed when they become the slightest bit chatty, whereas other threads started by mods/high posting, popular non-mods which get even more chatty and have even more what you call "spam" get left in the general forum. Logical?.....No.

Oh yeah, and that you are not allowed to "chat" in a forum entitled General (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=GENERAL)

Examples, please.

btw: Spamming General = not good.
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426820

Examples, please.

Seems chatty to me, especially if mine was. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426803)

Certainly the third post would be considered "off topic" (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426794)

OOh, and by the 4/5th post they're "off Topic" talking about coffee! (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=425700)

Let me just say...I am NOT spamming anyone (Unsolicited e-mail, often of a commercial nature, sent indiscriminately to multiple mailing lists, individuals, or newsgroups; junk e-mails.

Seems chatty to me, especially if mine was. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426803)

Certainly the third post would be considered "off topic" (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426794)

OOh, and by the 4/5th post they're "off Topic" talking about coffee! (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=425700)

Let me just say...I am NOT spamming anyone (

The main problem comes when the whole post gets off topic.

Spam has more meanings then that. I think it is in the rules section on what they call spam.

Seems chatty to me, especially if mine was. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426803)

Certainly the third post would be considered "off topic" (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426794)

OOh, and by the 4/5th post they're "off Topic" talking about coffee! (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=425700)


1) The topic was Father's Day, a current topic as it is a holiday being celebrated today. Leperous Monkeyballs is realtively new, not a "highly placed" poster or a moderator. It is also fairly on topic.

2) One post off topic, and then it veers back to where it ought to be.

3) Again, two posts off topic, and then it goes back to commercial spaceflight.

Let's reiterate: you posted a topic entitled "I want a chat and I want it HERE" when clearly, you know it does not belong there.

You claim that it has been deleted when patently, it has not; it and other threads posted in the wrong forums are moved to the correct forums, whether they be chat (a place for chat threads), spam (a place for pointless threads), Moderation (a place to ask for clarification or for a mod ruling), International Incidents and Nationstates (roleplay), Gameplay (discussion of how the game works), technical (questions about support), or NS2 (questions about the progress of version 2 of this game).

You claim that only new posters get moved to the spam forum when the evidence contained there is quite to the contrary.

Your examples of other threads going off topic are incredibly brief and not convincing in the least.

Lastly, you resort to spamming with "I want a pointless discussion, who else does".

Does this pretty much sum up the situation?

1) The topic was Father's Day, a current topic as it is a holiday being celebrated today. Leperous Monkeyballs is realtively new, not a "highly placed" poster or a moderator. It is also fairly on topic.

2) One post off topic, and then it veers back to where it ought to be.

3) Again, two posts off topic, and then it goes back to commercial spaceflight.

Let's reiterate: you posted a topic entitled "I want a chat and I want it HERE" when clearly, you know it does not belong there.

You claim that it has been deleted when patently, it has not; it and other threads posted in the wrong forums are moved to the correct forums, whether they be chat (a place for chat threads), spam (a place for pointless threads), Moderation (a place to ask for clarification or for a mod ruling), International Incidents and Nationstates (roleplay), Gameplay (discussion of how the game works), technical (questions about support), or NS2 (questions about the progress of version 2 of this game).

You claim that only new posters get moved to the spam forum when the evidence contained there is quite to the contrary.

Your examples of other threads going off topic are incredibly brief and not convincing in the least.

Lastly, you resort to spamming with "I want a pointless discussion, who else does".

Does this pretty much sum up the situation?
That second thread of mine was not me spamming....it was a question aimed at the general forum population to see who else wanted to simply chat...and who liked general pointless discussions. It was a serious poll as I have previously stated. I have already in this thread admitted that the subject of this thread is silly, I know that it was not deleted, but it was removed from the forum I intended it to be in. I will also now admit, that the FIRST one WAS intended to be a jibe at the mods (I apologise for that, and request that it is removed entirely). BUT my other thread about pointless discussions, was MEANT for the general forum as a question for which I wanted answers. If it has been moved, I will not get the answers I require. My other reasoning behind it, is that if you have a forum NAMED GENERAL people will assume that it is for GENERAL discussion, which includes, nay suggests, chat! Therefore I request that if you do not wish chat in the general forum, you change the name to "TOPICS THAT DO NOT HAVE ANY CHAT WHATSOEVER"

That second thread of mine was not me spamming....it was a question aimed at the general forum population to see who else wanted to simply chat...and who liked general pointless discussions. It was a serious poll as I have previously stated. I have already in this thread admitted that the subject of this thread is silly, I know that it was not deleted, but it was removed from the forum I intended it to be in. I will also now admit, that the FIRST one WAS intended to be a jibe at the mods (I apologise for that, and request that it is removed entirely). BUT my other thread about pointless discussions, was MEANT for the general forum as a question for which I wanted answers. If it has been moved, I will not get the answers I require. My other reasoning behind it, is that if you have a forum NAMED GENERAL people will assume that it is for GENERAL discussion, which includes, nay suggests, chat! Therefore I request that if you do not wish chat in the general forum, you change the name to "TOPICS THAT DO NOT HAVE ANY CHAT WHATSOEVER"

General Threads are used when the thread fits in no other category.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=426820
Again, you seem to be missing the point. Chat threads are not allowed in General, despite its dictionary meaning. NationStates has its own rules that the moderators have come to, and are upheld by the administrators, all the way up to Max Barry. If you have a problem with that, I'd suggest e-mailing admin@nationstates.net. Creating a thread called "Pointless Discussion" with one sentence as your first post "I want a pointless discussion....anyone else want one too?" is pretty obvious that you weren't aiming for a serious discussion.

Here in NationStates, it doesn't really matter where you want a thread. If it belongs in Gameplay, its going to be moved there. If it belongs in General, it goes there, and if it needs to be moved to the spam forum, that is where the moderators will move it. It's like requesting to the moderators that you want a roleplay thread to stay in Gameplay, just because you want it there. They are going to move it to the appropriate forum.

If you would simply look at the description of the General forum..
For discussion and debate about anything.
The General forum is for discussion and debate about anything. Of course, you could take this out of context and say you are 'discussing' anything. This is where the moderators point of view on specific threads comes into play. If they feel like it doesn't belong in General, and it would fit more within the spam forum, then that is their judgement. As quoted by Crazy Girl:
Off-topic, irrelevant and multi-posts that clog the server. This includes posting lots of smilies which is known as Smilie Spam.
The moderators determined your post to be off-topics for the General forum, and they moved them. Plain and simple.

Therefore I request that if you do not wish chat in the general forum, you change the name to "TOPICS THAT DO NOT HAVE ANY CHAT WHATSOEVER"
If you see any threads that are chat threads, report them here. The moderators aren't singling you out for your thread. The rule stands for all players. There is nothing wrong with a thread that involves serious discussion, and has a few posts involving chat, BUT ALSO those posters saying 'hi', are also involved in the discussion going on. An example would be:
"Hey, haven't seen you here in a while man!"

Anyways, to the discussion. I believe that the United States is overreacting....etc.
There isn't wrong with including small talk, just as long as you continue to stay on topic, and add to the debate/discussion. If the only thing you are including in the thread is the first part of that quote, then its considered spam.

Another thing to remember is that NationStates officials are not required to adhere strictly to the dictionary definitions of words. We will develop our own definitions of certain words (such as "spam") when formulating NationStates rules. In the event of a conflict between the standard dictionaries and NationStates-specific documents, the NationStates-specific documents take precedence.

Please reread The NationStates Terms and Conditions (http://www.nationstates.net/pages/legal.html) and The One-Stop Rules Shop (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=416023).

Any future appeals by you should not attempt to apply the standard definitions of any words that NationStates-specific documents provide a contradictory or alternate definition for. In other words, your appeals must be stated as "My threads are not spam as NationStates defines 'spam' because...." Any arguments of the form "My threads are not spam as Dictionary.com defines 'spam' because..." will be ignored by us.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
NationStates Game Moderator

...

My unofficial opinion is that we've done a good job of using The One-Stop Rules Shop to explain any special terms in NationStates that don't adhere to their standard definitions outside of NationStates.

--The Democratic States of Cogitation
Founder and Delegate of The Realm of Ambrosia

A little tasty tidbit... that website is not the most reputable one in the world. A peek in a real dictionary (or even history books) will show that the word 'Spam' comes from the popular (at the time) food of 'Spiced Ham' whether in a can or not. The brand that makes it now called themselves spam, for that is what they sell. A good parallel would be a soda company calling their product "Soda".

Anyway, over the years it has been adjusted to also incude the definition that OtU quoted, as unsolicited email has become as annoying and as prevelant as society now views spiced ham...

I just figured I'd point out exactly WHY NationStates moderators have given us a list of definitions of the terms they use, for we can see even with this one example how definitions would differ if we were left to our own sources.

OOC:

I would just give up "Of the underpants". Your not going to win this one.

OOC:Just a reminder: The "Moderation" board is for the discussion of NationStates rules enforcement. Thus, all comments are required to be Out-Of-Character and the OOC tag is unnecessary.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation