NationStates Jolt Archive

I wrote this manual for my region somewhere in the range of 6 months ago... did it by wading through various Forum threads...

I would like it if a mod or two can give it a once-over for accuracy, and so I can fix any errors...

It must be pretty decent though, for I've yet to have a subordinate deleted! ^_^

http://www.freewebs.com/nstge/Mods.html

Sorry about the drab page... I just uploaded it now, and felt it better to keep it muted and not slow D/L times.

Thanks in advance to all who take the time!

i'm not a mod, hope you don't mind an old player give some thoughts :D

Greifing would be the expulsion of 40% of the residents if you are the NATIVE delegate
-Greifing would also be the expulsion of 20% of the residents (or 20) whichever is SMALLER... this applies if you are the INVADER delegate

These numbers are more a rule of the thumb and you should always be careful when kicking nations as delegate..

It is not greifing to kick one or two people

it is when it's a region of just 1 or 2 natives :p

It is not greifing to kick a spammer
-It IS greifing to kick a spammer... and leave him on the ban list more than 36 hours (only applies if he is a NATIVE spammer... read below)

not so sure about this...
best to just report the spammer, never heard of the 36 hours rule..

Wait... so does that mean that ADN are technically invaders?
-Actually... sometimes they are! In the case with Northern Ireland, they picked the person they wanted as delegate... if that delegate had less native endorsements than the delegate who WAS there... that new delegate is an invader delegate!

you forgot to mention that person was the delegate before the invaders took over :rolleyes:

According to various NS Mods... a Native is anyone who can legitimately claim they are from that region... so figure we are talking like a month or two here.

not two months, the clue is, there is no time period for becoming a native.

someone can only be in the region for a couple of days before it gets invaded and be counted as a native..i agree, pretty fuzzy, so just keep in mind: better safe than sorry. always a good idea to discuss things with the mods to be sure.

Natives can be permanently banned from a region by a native delegate... but only for legitimate reasons.

what would you call legitimate reasons? i thought delegates could ban for no reason at all, as long as they don't ban too many..

Native spammers (like if 'Mattvia' went haywire if SL took over Germany) can be banned... but not for more than 36 hours.

again this rule...i'm curious where you got it from..

Natives MUST know a password... once a password is implemented by an invader delegate... all natives must be told BY THAT DELEGATE within 12 hours via telegram... failure to do this can be considered greifing!

not within 12 hours, but immediatly.

-The mods will delete you, plain and simple... no warnings, if's, and's, or's, or but's... so do not break 'em!

they don't always delete...sometimes they warn, remove a delegate tag, or just remove the nation from the UN

What happens if The German Empire got invaded... and I am (or anyone else is) greifed?
-Hit up the mods... if you know one personally... TG them... whether you do or don't, fill out a complaint form... this can be found here.

just a little suggestion: you could also mention the mods can be contacted on IRC?

As far as I know, there is no need to unban someone (even a native) if they've been spamming the region or being otherwise very unpleasant.

That's not exactly true Myrth, I don't think, at least. (Assuming the stuff in the thread is up to date).

From the Invasion/Delegate FAQ (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=301703)
Natives are generally not allowed to be perma-banned. However, when a Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)
(Which means you can't permanently ban a native!!)
-Neutered SputniksAnd a bit farther down from that:
"Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)"
-Neutered Sputniks

What happens if The German Empire got invaded... and I am (or anyone else is) greifed?
-Hit up the mods... if you know one personally... TG them... whether you do or don't, fill out a complaint form... this can be found here (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help). Don't advise people to telegram the mods. Telegramming is the worst of all possible choices, as moderators frequently log on as puppets so they can play the game, and mod emailboxes tend to fill up fast in any case.

Using Getting Help is the preferred method. If you want to capture Regional Happenings or the Regional Messageboard, use the new Additional Information checkboxes. You have to be logged in to use these new features. Please choose a single nation to submit only one such request for your region - don't flood the tasklist.

If it's a time-sensitive issue, Using IRC (#themodcave) is a good choice. A Moderation Forum topic may be started if you don't have access to IRC, but don't expect instant response.

Don't advise people to telegram the mods. Telegramming is the worst of all possible choices, as moderators frequently log on as puppets so they can play the game, and mod emailboxes tend to fill up fast in any case.

Using Getting Help is the preferred method. If you want to capture Regional Happenings or the Regional Messageboard, use the new Additional Information checkboxes. You have to be logged in to use these new features. Please choose a single nation to submit only one such request for your region - don't flood the tasklist.

If it's a time-sensitive issue, Using IRC (#themodcave) is a good choice. A Moderation Forum topic may be started if you don't have access to IRC, but don't expect instant response.

Okay.. I will change that. As to IRC, I dont think we have anyone in region with it... though I've always wanted to get it

To answer other people's questions as to where I got 36hrs from, whenever I saw a mod say 1-2 days, I averaged it... if I could get exact figures, this is what I was looking for when I made this topic. All in all then, there is not much to fix then right?

I'm going to disagree with both Myrth and Majesto here.

The Neut quotes are from the highly controversial ruling in the Monte Carlo invasion of mid-December 2003 (I usually refer to it as Corinthe v. Fisz. The application of this precedent came up in the Northern Ireland situation of mid-September 2004 (NationStates v. Galaxian). I'll simply quote from that thread:

Interesting. Doesn't the same sticky say this?

Your rights as a native
Natives are generally not allowed to be perma-banned. However, when a Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)
(Which means you can't permanently ban a native!!)
-Neutered Sputniks


if the native was causing unrest would that be considered unruly?

*Note-not affiliated with the invaders in question.

Didn't think the Monte Carlo (Corinthe v. Fisz) precedent was still in force...never liked that ruling anyway. *shrugs*

Anyway, that precedent was where Fisz (invader delegate) ejected and unbanned a puppet of Corinthe (native), whereupon Corinthe immediately rejoined the region. This occured repeatedly, until finally Neut ruled that Fisz could ban Corinthe's puppet for an extended period of time to stop her from rejoining.

I've never seen this precedent applied elsewhere, though, so I wouldn't rely on it.

ON EDIT:
*pounces*

Remember, every ruling is subjective, and not exactly set in stone. There can be very many different situations that cause those previous rules to become obselete, or to not really apply.

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=5648873&postcount=100

yeah, that mostly had to do with corinthe spamming the regional happenings in monte carlo and the RR (although i still think fisz was just as much to blame, never liked or agreed with that ruling either).

First of all, to the originator of this thread: Galaxian didn't unban Victories. I did.

Secondly, in the case of Corinthe v. Fisz do remember that it wasn't a single ejection. Neut made his ruling based on his view that the continual ejection/unban/rejoin/ejection cycle constituted spamming of the Regional Events, which is why he allowed Fisz to leave Corinthe on the ban list. This is clearly not the case here.

I gained the delegacy a few days ago. Yesterday, Victories was just plain aggravated. He talked down to everyone, and made a lot of natives feel insignificant. I was telegramed *BY NATIVES* asking me to eject him, because he was creating a negative environment. I ejected him, and banned him. I AM allowed to do that. That is what the eject button is there for. He was acting up, and no one wanted him here, so I did what I had to do to make the region better.

What rule have I violated? None, I think.

Well, see, if you were a native that might be the case, but since you are an invader, you have to remove people from the ban list. Natives requesting that you eject him is not sufficient. Know, you would have been more than welcome to eject him as long as you removed him from the ban list. Had this become a cycle of you ejecting him and him coming back, then we would look to see if the ruling in Corinthe v. Fisz applied.

IMHO, no. Neut clarified what was intended by unruly: spamming, griefing, etc... This does IMHO not apply to the normal intra-regional political affairs, so if one group of natives don't like/hate/wish to oust/whatever a certain other native and ask for that nation's removal, the invader delegate still isn't allowed to ban that native nation. The claim above is that Victories was engaging in (not quoted) unfriendly behaviour towards fellow natives. I've seen nothing to indicate it was reaching the level of flaming, flamebaiting, trolling, or anything that would make the Corinthe vs. Fisz ruling apply. Not saying it didn't, just that no evidence of it was posted here.

For the record, I don't like the way the ruling is presented either, since IMHO the decision on whether or not this applies should really be up to a mod, not to an invader who may be eager to decide to ban a native for a longer period of time. Note that in the Corinthe vs. Fisz case a mod placed Corinthe on the banlist after Fisz unbanned Corinthe (after ejecting for the unmpteenth time). Also, I'm still concerned that an invader could abuse this ruling as a mechanic: simply keep ejecting the same native nation over and over until the nation either doesn't return or the act of returning is deemed 'spamming' the regional happenings and that same nation may be banned for a longer period of time. But, that objection has more to do with interpreting the return of a native as spamming the Regional Happenings than the ruling that 'unruly' natives may be banned for a longer period of time.

Ballotonia

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=358275

As for what Myrth said, Corinthe v. Fisz is the only time I have ever seen an invader being allowed to ban a native, and I've been reading this forum regularly for over a year and a half now. I could be wrong, but I don't think so.

Two quick questions:

1). What is the best way to ask the mods a question about the rules in private?

2). I never get a response when I log into #themodcave via, mRC, what am I doing wrong??

1). What is the best way to ask the mods a question about the rules in private?

2). I never get a response when I log into #themodcave via, mRC, what am I doing wrong??
1) #themodcave

2) Dunno. I've never seen you in there. I'm there right now. Drop by, whydoncha?

Hi Im in #themodcave and see no one. I'm using mIRC, does this platform work with your platform? Are people on invisible mode or something?

Hi Im in #themodcave and see no one. I'm using mIRC, does this platform work with your platform? Are people on invisible mode or something?
You must not be on irc.esper.net. It does make a difference which server you choose. See this General Sticky (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=378125) or this NS sticky (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=278619) for all the best details.

Sorry for bumping this... but it fell of the front page.

I have addressed all issues brought up in this topic by anyone who reviewed it (thanks to all who did) and would like to know if a moderator can give a final ruling on its legitiamacy. Oh, and since no-one else here is from my region, I generalized the examples such that they should work in all cases now.

http://www.freewebs.com/nstge/Mods.html

Speaking from experience (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=395843), I would suggest you not hold out for an official Moderator endorsement. I suspect they avoid definitive rules on anything because of the number of exceptions that can be argued for any case. If you set a law in stone, someone else will happily demonstrate how their actions are legal under it. This may not seem fair, but at least this way their ability to actually do their jobs is not hindered.

Standard Disclaimer: I am not a Moderator. I don't need to decorate the wall with my forehead, thank you.

This is as true in Gameplay as in forum activities. For instance, recall when MrNonchalant attempted to force the Moderators to tell him exactly how often he could change a password on a region that he had invaded. He wasn't very happy with the answer he got.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=305454

Not to be annoying... but BUMP

I understand many think I would get an answer, but I am hopeful one of the Mods will have a free second to glance it over and give it a nod