NationStates Jolt Archive

Would there be in any hope in launching an appeal to remove the Ignore feature from the Jolt forums for us NationStaters?

I do not believe it's effective for debating, when essentially, a nation can ignore anyone for anything at any time, even if there's no reason for doing so.

It's detrimental to the debate process, and if I launch the appeal, I will go into more detail.

I support Tuesday Heights completely in this, if it's feasible.

I don't know why it would matter to you if the person you're debating is so pathetic as to ignore you when you make a better point than them. Is that really all you're concerned about?

I don't know why it would matter to you if the person you're debating is so pathetic as to ignore you when you make a better point than them. Is that really all you're concerned about?
Maybe that "pathetic" person got tired of the constant meddling in a legimit question to the mods. I requested a mod answer, yet the thread is already on its third page, because some mod wannabees wanted to force their opinions on me. The "ignore" option is a fine tool, if you get tired of the person, and s/he doesn't want to stop after repeated requests.

The "ignore" option is a fine tool, if you get tired of the person, and s/he doesn't want to stop after repeated requests.
I know - I like the ignore tool and am defending it here. I think...

Maybe that "pathetic" person got tired of the constant meddling in a legimit question to the mods. I requested a mod answer, yet the thread is already on its third page, because some mod wannabees wanted to force their opinions on me. The "ignore" option is a fine tool, if you get tired of the person, and s/he doesn't want to stop after repeated requests.Opinions that don't agree with yours? How dare they? Carinthe, despite what you seem to think you are not the only person who's views are valid on here. You one of the few cowardly enough to use the ignore option solely because you're losing the argument.

I can see your point about only wanting a staff member's opinion regarding a subject. Sometimes it can be hard to read through pages of material to find the answer you've been looking/waiting for when non-staff fill the rolls.

That being said, I also think the ignore feature can be a double-edged sword that hurts as much as helps a situation. Perhaps an alternative to ridding it completely is to have ignores set on a time limit, and therefore must be periodically re-submitted. That way, when it falls off (say about 3 weeks after being placed), the user (who generally will tend to forget such contrivances exist) will see the posts again of the one they had ignored. If seeing their posts again inspires more feelings of negativity and such, then the invoking user can just re-activate the ignore.

Additionally, I wonder if the ignore feature allows for "global" ignoring so that puppet nations can not intrude on the invoking nation's right to ignore?

I don't know why it would matter to you if the person you're debating is so pathetic as to ignore you when you make a better point than them. Is that really all you're concerned about?

If does matter, because it effectively stops the debate; what if everybody here ignored everybody else how would we be able to have a debate to begin with on the forums... plus, it makes it very dangerous for others to respond in Moderation thread when reported and the like.

Instead of [Ignore]ing them, couldn't you just... ignore them?

Instead of [Ignore]ing them, couldn't you just... ignore them?

This is true.

If does matter, because it effectively stops the debate; what if everybody here ignored everybody else how would we be able to have a debate to begin with on the forums... plus, it makes it very dangerous for others to respond in Moderation thread when reported and the like.

You wouldn't have a debate. Of course, ya don't need an ignore button to ignore someone. For some odd reason, it seems people want to debate, otherwise why would there be so many arguments in the general forum.

It's not like everyone here doesn't have the ability to simply walk away from the computer screen whenever they want to. lol

Would there be in any hope in launching an appeal to remove the Ignore feature from the Jolt forums for us NationStaters?

I do not believe it's effective for debating, when essentially, a nation can ignore anyone for anything at any time, even if there's no reason for doing so.

It's detrimental to the debate process, and if I launch the appeal, I will go into more detail.

I can't support this measure because if you want to ignore someone for IC or OOC reasons, you don't have to read their posts.

Part of the First Amendment many Americans hold dear includes the right of association or the right to refuse to associate with someone. If someone's a bad RPer or a Godmodder or generally a bloody wanker, I shouldn't be compelled to read his tripe.

I see where you're coming from, and I agree that an actual Ignore button is an understanding feature for those who wish to employ it, however, when it's used as a tactic to upset, derail, and dethrow a debate (particularly in Moderation), I think it needs to be addressed.

I see where you're coming from, and I agree that an actual Ignore button is an understanding feature for those who wish to employ it, however, when it's used as a tactic to upset, derail, and dethrow a debate (particularly in Moderation), I think it needs to be addressed.

I think the people who do that often enough will have word spread about their doing so and they'll lose face in the NS world. And some people wonder why others don't want to RP with them...

Maybe its just because i dont flame or spam but I dont find the ignore function to be a problem.

Tuesday's got some good points. But debating is not the only thing to be done on the forums. And this feature is effective for other things.

Would there be in any hope in launching an appeal to remove the Ignore feature from the Jolt forums for us NationStaters?

I do not believe it's effective for debating, when essentially, a nation can ignore anyone for anything at any time, even if there's no reason for doing so.

It's detrimental to the debate process, and if I launch the appeal, I will go into more detail.

FOR GOD'S SAKE NO!!!!
Mods do NOT react quickly enough to Flamebaiters...the Ignore Feature has allowed me to keep my sanity and civility!

You don't want the Ignore feature...fine, then don't YOU use it!!

But don't prevent ME from having it, to get rid of flamebaiters that Mods either can't or won't or refuse to deal with!!

I NEED my Ignore feature!!!

Well. You could also just look away from their post. It's not as if someone's sitting right beside you as you read a thread, forcing you to hone in on one persons specific post, is there? Have you no free will?

Maybe its just because i dont flame or spam but I dont find the ignore function to be a problem.
If you have a look at this thread: http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=6699608#post6699608 you'll see Carinthe is using it whenever anybody disagrees with her. Thinking about it, it is a bit harsh to stop everyone from using though. Perhaps only those who are obviously abusing the facility should have it removed.

And Labrador, I say this with the greatest affection and as a fellow leftist, but you could just try keeping control of your temper instead.

Instead of [Ignore]ing them, couldn't you just... ignore them?

NO!!!
If I have to look at them, I am not able to ignore them!
I wanna be able to completely block them out!
Unless you Mods wanna MOVE IT when flamebait is reported, don't mess with the Ignore feature!!
It is the ONLY thing that allows ME to maintain civility on these boards!

Well. You could also just look away from their post. It's not as if someone's sitting right beside you as you read a thread, forcing you to hone in on one persons specific post, is there? Have you no free will?

It is much more effective...AND MORE SATISFYING...to shoot them with the Ignore cannon for pissing me off!

If you have a look at this thread: http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=6699608#post6699608 you'll see Carinthe is using it whenever anybody disagrees with her. Thinking about it, it is a bit harsh to stop everyone from using though. Perhaps only those who are obviously abusing the facility should have it removed.

And Labrador, I say this with the greatest affection and as a fellow leftist, but you could just try keeping control of your temper instead.

sorry...no can do...right-wingers quite literally make me see RED!!!
They REFUSE to accept the validity of ANY argument that questions their view...they continue to drag the same tired Red Herrings over issues instead of addressing the points I would ask them to address...NO...I'd rather plain and simple not look at them, okay?

NOW, there are some who have a differing opinion than me that don't make my Ignore list...because they at least have VALID, LOGICAL reasons for their disagreement...and they ACTUALLY CITE SOURCES for claims they make. Those people do not get Ignored by me. It's the ignoramuses that get Ignored. and there's too many of them to expect the Mods to deal with. Let me deal with them myself, let me keep my precious IGNORE button!! I love that thing!!

It is much more effective...AND MORE SATISFYING...to shoot them with the Ignore cannon for pissing me off!But if you do that they've won. Much better when dealing with flamebaiters to remain calm and rationally dissect their post, point by point, in front of them. It annoys them far more. ;)

But if you do that they've won. Much better when dealing with flamebaiters to remain calm and rationally dissect their post, point by point, in front of them. It annoys them far more. ;)

no. Becuase they will refuse to acknowledge I'm right. Even when I dissect their argument right in front of their face. And so they just piss me off. Better to Ignore them. I win, when I IGNORE them, because then I DON'T HAVE TO LOOK AT THEIR INANE POSTS ANY MORE!!

And, I am therefore relieved of the temptation to flame back...and i am therefore NOT at risk of getting my nation DEATED, because a Mod refused to respond when alerted of flamebait!!

the last time I got a warning (on the old boards) the person giving me the warning EVEN ACKNOWLEDGED I had been provoked...yet I still got a warning!! And risk having my nation DEATED!! No WAY!! I want to simply IGNORE them if they show the slightest sign of provokation.

Hey, at least I'm being honest and not pulling any punches here. I want my Ignore button! I want to USE it.

If Mods would react IMMEDIATELY to flamebaiters, I might feel differently. But they don't. so let ME deal with it, MYSELF...with my handy Ignore Cannon!!

But don't prevent ME from having it, to get rid of flamebaiters that Mods either can't or won't or refuse to deal with!!

The mods are volunteers and have a life of their own, you realize that, right?

If you can't "help" yourself to responding to flaming, perhaps, you shouldn't be playing a game which might cause you to deal with it?

If you can't prevent yourself from becoming upset at someone ignoring you, maybe this isn't a game you should be playing?

I think that the ignore button can be a valuable tool. I agree that sometimes it's almost too hard not to respond in kind to a flame. This is when immediately finding other people that you know to bitch at is helpful.

But... in the nuts&bolts forums, I don't think the ignore feature is as necessary. There may be the occassional flame in moderation, but since the point of these forums is rational discussion, you shouldn't have to ignore anyone.

So ideally, you couldn't ignore someone in the technical/issues/moderation forums, but you could elsewhere. Impossible, I know. :p

Mods decide:
Offending ignoring

The Issue:
Forum users are confused and angry about a new feature on jolt that allows people to not display, or ignore, post by another person.

The Debate:

1. Tuesday Heights, SpamQueen advisor and leader of “Get this option turned off” said: “I do not believe it's effective for debating, when essentially, a nation can ignore anyone for anything at any time, even if there's no reason for doing so. I aggree that an actual Ignore button is an understanding feature for those who wish to employ it, however, when it's used as a tactic to upset, derail, and dethrow a debate, the user needs to be addressed.
[Accept]

Effect: People who misuse the feature will be warned
Stats: Fun -1, Debate +1

2. ”FOR GOD'S SAKE NO!!!!” says Labrador “Mods do NOT react quickly enough to Flamebaiters...the Ignore Feature has allowed me to keep my sanity and civility!” “If I have to look at them, I am not able to ignore them!”
[Accept]

Effect: Posters will be encouraged to use the feature as much as they can in order to cut down on flame wars
Stats: Fun: +1, Moderation +1, Debate -2.


3. "The [ignore] option is a fine tool, if you get tired of the person, and s/he doesn't want to stop after repeated requests.” states Cathrine, the original offensive ignorer. “Maybe that person got tired of the constant meddling in a legimit questions!”
[Accept]

Effects: Posters will be allowed to use the feature any way they want, just not encouraged.
Stats: Fun +1, Debate -1

Mods Position: The mods have yet to formalize a position on this issue.

Mods decide:
Offending ignoring

The Issue:
Forum users are confused and angry about a new feature on jolt that allows people to not display, or ignore, post by another person.

The Debate:

1. Tuesday Heights, SpamQueen advisor and leader of “Get this option turned off” said: “I do not believe it's effective for debating, when essentially, a nation can ignore anyone for anything at any time, even if there's no reason for doing so. I aggree that an actual Ignore button is an understanding feature for those who wish to employ it, however, when it's used as a tactic to upset, derail, and dethrow a debate, the user needs to be addressed.
[Accept]

Effect: People who misuse the feature will be warned
Stats: Fun -1, Debate +1

2. ”FOR GOD'S SAKE NO!!!!” says Labrador “Mods do NOT react quickly enough to Flamebaiters...the Ignore Feature has allowed me to keep my sanity and civility!” “If I have to look at them, I am not able to ignore them!”
[Accept]

Effect: Posters will be encouraged to use the feature as much as they can in order to cut down on flame wars
Stats: Fun: +1, Moderation +1, Debate -2.


3. "The [ignore] option is a fine tool, if you get tired of the person, and s/he doesn't want to stop after repeated requests.” states Cathrine, the original offensive ignorer. “Maybe that person got tired of the constant meddling in a legimit questions!”

This is the position your mods are preparing to adopt.

Effects: Posters will be allowed to use the feature any way they want, just not encouraged.
Stats: Fun +1, Debate -1

The Mod Position
Rep Prod the Mod has indicated her intention to follow the recommendations of Option 3.

;)

Okay guys, really, calm down. Lab, this is mostly aimed at you, as you seem to be on the brink of flipping out over there about what is really a non-issue. (Not a warning, just a friendly "Dude, cool yer jets!" sort of thing =)

The short version: I'm sure if we rallied enough, we could get ignore disabled for on Nationstates. However, it's not worth the effort, really, and I think the rest of the mods will agree that it's a useful function. Trying to enforce 'proper' use of the ignore function would quite honestly be an absolute nightmare.

Now, as for ignoring people simply for disagreeing... there's nothing wrong with that. Sure, it's a cowardly means of ducking out of a debate or whatever, but really... would you want to try and have an intellectual debate with someone who cries "Ignored!" at the slightest hint of holes in their side of the debate?

Something else to keep in mind that is a very common (and very underhanded) trick that some of these people who ignore everyone who disagrees with them may be actually doing:
Step 1: Get into debate with somebody
Step 2: Get all huffy, cry "I'm ignoring you!", and then not actually utilize the ignore function
Step 3: Watch the aforementioned somebody get all ticked off, and perhaps post something nasty about them, thinking that their post won't be seen.
Step 4: Cry to moderators or other authority that "So-and-so is flaming meeeeeeeeee!"

Remember guys, no matter how many hours we all spend on this game, it IS still just a game. =)

http://rpstudios.ian-justman.com/junk/CGgoods/RepProdtheModsig2.JPG
~Evil Empress Rep Prod the Ninja Mod
~Master of the mighty moderation no-dachi Kiritateru Teikoku

Heres my idea: We all try to act respectful and polite to each other, then we won't need to worry about ignoring anyone...

Just some wishful thinking :]

I know what went wrong. I should have kept my mouth shut. An ignore button is a fine tool, but people should not gloat when using it. That is mildly flamebaiting, and demeaning to the other party. Next time when a person uses the "ignore" option, it is better not mention it. The other party thinks s/he won the argument, and you are happy too. Problem solved. :cool:

I believe this can be locked now.

Apart from it would be interesting to know if it's actually possible to flame/flamebait someone who's got you on Ignore. After all they both rely on your targets reaction. (I'm also thinking of the precedent sent by the "unregistered can't be flamed" here).

If nations used the ignore function with the intent to get a poster to flame in retaliation to it, I'm sure the mods would find out, and the "ignorer" would be warned.

If nations used the ignore function with the intent to get a poster to flame in retaliation to it, I'm sure the mods would find out, and the "ignorer" would be warned.
Indeed.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

Indeed.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

It is a brand new feature in NationStates. Mistakes will be made :headbang:

It's more the opposite I'm asking. Can you be said to flame a nation if you know they've got you on Ignore?

It's more the opposite I'm asking. Can you be said to flame a nation if you know they've got you on Ignore?

You can be punished for flamming even if the "victim" don't answer or can't see your post. If I offend [put someone here] the mods will see and punish me. They don't care if [my victim here] can see my words or not. And that's the way it should be.

It is a brand new feature in NationStates. Mistakes will be made :headbang:
Could you elaborate, please? I'm not sure where you're going with this discussion. :confused:

You can be punished for flamming even if the "victim" don't answer or can't see your post. If I offend [put someone here] the mods will see and punish me. They don't care if [my victim here] can see my words or not. And that's the way it should be.
Correct.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

Could you elaborate, please? I'm not sure where you're going with this discussion. :confused:

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

Well, since many of us are kinda new to this feature, it is easy to have fun with it. This is not my personal thought, but if somebody's gonna flame for being ignored, the danger exist that an occasional smirking will be done.

Well, since many of us are kinda new to this feature, it is easy to have fun with it. This is not my personal thought, but if somebody's gonna flame for being ignored, the danger exist that an occasional smirking will be done.
You're still slightly unclear. There are:

The person using the Ignore function
The person being ignored
Spectators

Are you referring to spectators smirking at the person being ignored? It might help if you made up a situation to illustrate what you mean.

I'd also like to point out that the Ignore function works both ways. If someone is using the Ignore function against you in an immature, childish manner, then just Ignore them back and stop worrying about them.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

You're still slightly unclear. There are:

The person using the Ignore function
The person being ignored
Spectators

Are you referring to spectators smirking at the person being ignored? It might help if you made up a situation to illustrate what you mean.

I'd also like to point out that the Ignore function works both ways. If someone is using the Ignore function against you in an immature, childish manner, then just Ignore them back and stop worrying about them.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

Very good, Cogitation. The freedom of speech does NOT include the right to be heard. And if I don't wanna hear what someone else has to say, it is my right to stick my fingers in my ears, dance around and sing "la-la-la-la-la-laaaa, I can't heeeeeeeeaaarrrrrr you!!!!!"

I know what went wrong. I should have kept my mouth shut. An ignore button is a fine tool, but people should not gloat when using it. That is mildly flamebaiting, and demeaning to the other party. Next time when a person uses the "ignore" option, it is better not mention it. The other party thinks s/he won the argument, and you are happy too. Problem solved. :cool:
You're still slightly unclear. There are:

The person using the Ignore function
The person being ignored
Spectators

Are you referring to spectators smirking at the person being ignored? It might help if you made up a situation to illustrate what you mean.

I'd also like to point out that the Ignore function works both ways. If someone is using the Ignore function against you in an immature, childish manner, then just Ignore them back and stop worrying about them.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

I'm quoting myself here, in the same thread. I think that will sufice, since I'm getting a bit paranoid here. Another vague description for; "I wonder why you are questioning me here, in the moderator's forum, while I have done nothing wrong."

Very good, Cogitation. The freedom of speech does NOT include the right to be heard. And if I don't wanna hear what someone else has to say, it is my right to stick my fingers in my ears, dance around and sing "la-la-la-la-la-laaaa, I can't heeeeeeeeaaarrrrrr you!!!!!"
I'd agree with the "stick my fingers in my ears" part. (Off-topic: I prefer foam earplugs, myself.) The sing-and-dance part, however, is not necessary (and, in fact, counterproductive); there's absolutely no need to say that you're ignoring someone.

One other thing: You still seem to be rather hyperactive. Take a few deep breaths and take it easy. ;)

I'm quoting myself here, in the same thread.
Okay, gotcha! :) "Use the ignore function on someone, but don't make announcement about it."

Agreed.

I think that will sufice, since I'm getting a bit paranoid here. Another vague description for; "I wonder why you are questioning me here, in the moderator's forum, while I have done nothing wrong."
Relax. :p

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

I'd agree with the "stick my fingers in my ears" part. (Off-topic: I prefer foam earplugs, myself.) The sing-and-dance part, however, is not necessary (and, in fact, counterproductive); there's absolutely no need to say that you're ignoring someone.

One other thing: You still seem to be rather hyperactive. Take a few deep breaths and take it easy. ;)


Okay, gotcha! :) "Use the ignore function on someone, but don't make announcement about it."

Agreed.


Relax. :p

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation

Fair enough. As long as no one takes away my ability to stick my fingers in my ears, by taking away my Ignore feature, I guess I can resist the singing and dancing part...even though it is OH SO SATISFYING....

Fair enough. As long as no one takes away my ability to stick my fingers in my ears, by taking away my Ignore feature, I guess I can resist the singing and dancing part...even though it is OH SO SATISFYING....
[Star Wars Reference] Resist the Dark Side. [/starwars] ;)

--The Democratic States of Cogitation

[Star Wars Reference] Resist the Dark Side. [/starwars] ;)

--The Democratic States of Cogitation

Yes, Master Yoda. Fear leads to anger...anger leads to hate...hate leads to SUFFERING!!