NationStates Jolt Archive

Well, seeing as all old stickies and announcements were destickied/announcified during the move, you'll notice that not all the original stickies/announcements are there. So out there, in the wilderness, buried under all the other drivel, are some poor lost stickies and announcements that need to be returned to their former glory.
So, anyone feels like going through and digging up some of the old stickies/announcements and posting their new Jolt links in here, we'd be most grateful. Find an old sticky, and Sirocco will be your friend for life. Or something. :D

We have some old stickies in our regional forum. I'll get them soon for you :)

Links don't work anymore. I have more where this one comes from.

How to treat the mods: A player's guide.

1. Do not, under any circumstances, protest against being given a warning. It's just that, a warning. Nothing more. You will only be deleted if you complain in a loud, obnoxious level, or keep on doing what you were doing.

And quite frankly, then it's your own damn fault. Examples of this include Carthese, and... actually, too many to mention. The Keeper of the Hall maintains an excellent list.

2. If you have been deleted, do not make a new nation for the express purpose of being a jerk to the moderators. They are busy people, and will delete you if you act like an arse again. Nations such as this include Kalamshan/Calamshan, and again, sadly, too many to mention.

3. Never, ever, ever, ever insult a moderator. Under any circumstances. They're just doing their job. The moderators are unpaid, and they keep this entire website operating wonderfully. Be thankful. Sure, if it's not that rude, you might get away with it, but why risk it? The mods are our friends.

4. This is not an independent site. This site is owned by Max Barry. He alone decides what is allowed here, him and his servants the administrators. The mods interpret as they see fit.

You left the rules of your own society behind when you entered this site. People, get that through your heads!

5. Don't make nations whose names resemble those of the mods. The mods reserve the right to delete those nations on sight.

6. Don't waste the Moderators's time.

7. If you really think you were treated poorly, you can send an e-mail to Violet, asking her to review your case.

Don't.

8. Before doing anything whatsoever in this game, you should click the following links and read through to the end. The FAQ (http://www.nationstates.net/pages/faq.html) is especially vital, and the Terms & Conditions (http://www.nationstates.net/pages/legal.html) should be read through, as I've said in the past, at least once a month.


9. When you post a report by the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help), remember to, at the top, write what it is you are reporting about. Forum problems go *here*. Everything else goes to theGetting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help).

10. No matter how tempting, don't exploit a loophole. Under any circumstances. Yes, I know it's fun, and it may be Human Nature. BUT FIGHT THAT URGE!

It only causes trouble for the Mods.

11. This example was given to demonstrate one of the more difficult problems might have.

Bad Player: HEY! You deleted my nation, and I wasn't doing anything!

Moderator: Yes, you were.

Bad Player: NO I f--- WELL WASN'T, YOU STUPID TOTALITARIAN CRAP-SACK!

Moderator: You are the weakest link. *IP pans the bad player* Good bye.

OR

Smart Player: Pardon, but I think you deleted my nation wrongfully.

Moderator: No, we didn't.

Smart Player: Oh. Well, I'll start over from scratch, shall I?

Moderator: Yep.

As you can see, the best thing to do is not get deleted in the first place.

12. It's a very bad idea to compare the mods to totalitarian regimes, especially since in a totalitarian regime you would be killed for even thinking like that.

Ah, for the good old days...

13. Do not post if you are only going to post to insult the mods, and not make a reasoned argument.

14. A basic rule of thumb is, if you can imagine your post making someone cry, then don't post it.

15. (Suggested by The Keeper of the Hall)If you are tired of one of your nations DO NOT get rid of it by Suicide by Mod!, that can get them real annoyed and you end up as another name on the Keeper's list. The proper way is to just ignore it for a month and it will go away from inactivity or you can move it to the Graveyard region.

16 Under no circumstances flame anyone, or insult anyone. Ever. Ever. Ever. Can not be stressed enough.

(Credit for these both go to one of our finest moderators, Neutered Sputnicks)

17. Dont expect the Mods to be on YOUR time schedule.

18. Dont push your luck. Just because you're the consumer does not mean you can be as big a jerk as you'd like and not be told by management to leave.

19. (Recommended by Tactical Grace) The moderators are players just like the rest of us. If you prick them, they will bleed, if you outsmart them, they will cry, and if you flame them too much, they will delete you... okay, so maybe not exactly like the rest of us. But in the all-powerful eyes of the Admin, we and them are one and the same. They have as much right to enjoy the game as we do. Possibly more.

I mean, what would the NS forum be like without Scolo? And Siri? And Melkor Unchained?... actually, it would be a hell of a lot easier for me to conquer. But that's not important. What is important is that they are entitled to take part in any portion of the game that catches their fancy.
<====>

I'll add more as they occur to me.

There are two different issues here:

1) The only authority above a mod is admin, and they aren't likely to overrule them, so you pretty much have to do what they say.
2) Mods must be held accountable for their actions.

This combination is what makes life interesting so this is my recommendations should you desire explanation for a Mod's actions or feel they were unjust (which is essentially saying you want an explanation). When you make your post please remember the following:

1) Keep it polite, civil, and non-confrontational. Remember point #1. If you piss off a mod, it will just make everyone's lives more difficult, and it can count as griefing. Not to mention, as they are people, they will give all of your requests lower priority and it will take longer.
2) Do not accuse a mod of doing something wrong, ask why they did it and then be patient.
3) Listen to what the mod has to say, even if you don't agree with it. If it seems reasonable (even if you don't agree) accept it and move on your way. If you still don't understand, politely ask for clarification.
4) If it seems unreasonable, sit on it for a day or two and think about it.
5) If it still seems unreasonable, and you consider it especially important (as in abuse of mod powers), then you should probably say so (politely) in the thread, listing your direct complaints. Please listen to what the mod has to say and what the community has to say. If a significant number of people in the forum supports the mod's actions, they are almost definitely in the right. Don't continue as you will lose the argument. People, as a whole, don't kiss up to mods, and really do express their honest opinions. If forum members tell you that you are in the wrong, LISTEN TO THEM.
6) If it still seems unreasonable then you might want to consider emailing admin@nationstates.net

P.S. NEVER send a telegram to a mod related to moderator business unless SPECIFICALLY requested to.

Haha, I can't post quotes only. the forum doesn't accept it :)


Game Moderator


Founded: 11 Mar 2003
Posts: 8567

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 3:33 am Post subject: Issue Repetition

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Every week or so, someone posts a question along the following lines:

"I keep getting the same issues over and over again. What's up with that?"

Granted, some are more or less polite about it, but the question remains. So, let's answer it once and for all, and be done with it.


There is a limited number of issues. At the writing of this announcement, there are around 90 issues for the game to choose from.

Not all nations qualify for every issue.


If you're a capitalist country, you don't qualify for issues about introducing capitalism.

If you're a democracy, you don't qualify for issues about granting people the right to vote.

If you have destroyed <insert industry here> you don't qualify for issues specific to <insert industry here>.

In other words, some issues have a "validif" phrase. If you don't meet its requirements, you can't get it.


Brand new nations only receive the original 30 issues.

Since issues are assigned randomly, you will get repeats. The game engine doesn't check to see if you just got said issue, all it cares about is if you qualify for said issue.

Everyone who's been playing for awhile has a specific issue that they seem to get constantly. For me, it's Harry Potter Censorship Row.

Yes, new issues are being added. However, only a handful of the Game Mods are coding them, so it takes time.

No, you can't help in any way, shape, or form. We're not being mean, we just have no way to give you access to issue editing without giving you access to all sorts of other Mod-things.


Please feel free to read the Stickies in this forum, as they have pretty much everything else you could want to know about Issues, including a list of them, and how to submit them.

Sorry, I don't know where I got this from. The links are messed up, but here it is:
What's Legal and whats not


Whats not legal, A.K.A Griefing for delegates and invaders


-Ejecting a large number of natives (judged on a case-by-case scenario- 40% is a good meterstick for measuring it though)
-Spam/flood the regional message board and regional happening
-Take over by use of UN Multies
-Interfere with the natives' ability to come and go from the region as they please. (This includes kicking people out and leaving them on the ban list, passwording the region without giving the password to the natives, and the like.)
- Reploid Productions

But, taking over a region is legal, right?
Broadly speaking, yes. I can move my friends and myself into your region and become the delegate. What I can't do is kick everyone out of the region. That's where "griefing" comes in. It's generally a fine line and the mods get a lot of requests to look at situations that may or may not be griefing.
Where griefing is definitely 100% illegal is when you do it with your 500 UN Member nations. As you all know, having more than one nation in the UN is illegal by itself, and using these multiple nations to take over regions is very illegal.
-Enodia


(40% is a ROUGH estimate. In a region of 600, ejecting 50 could be considered griefing. It's relative.
-Neutered Sputniks

You can read more about it here, and read the mods ruling about the legality of region invading and what you can't do.

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...1478151#1478151 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1478151#1478151)
and you can read about whats legal and not here
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=38763




What is legal


Region invading is legal, what's illegal is griefing, as long as you do not do any of the things pointed you will be legally ok and a mod won't delete you. The mods have decided that invasions are legal, but that doesn't mean that the mods like invasions. Infact, most, if not all, region invading is the bane of nationstates, so don't go blaming them.

Read about some of their opinions here!
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...der=asc&start=0 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=68616&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)


Which Delegates are considered natives and which are invaders


Here's the question

"-If an invader delegate convinces the native members of the invaded region to endorse him (assuming 50+% endorse him), is he still considered an invader? What if the other invading nations leave?"

And here's the response

"For a delegate to be considered a native delegate, he/she must have enough native support to remain in that position without the assistance of other non-natives - invaders or neutral."
-Neutered Sputniks

See the original thread here
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2465285#2465285 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2465285#2465285)

There also was a question that what if a native and foreign support to prop himself to the delegacy, would he be considered a invader delegacy or not, and the answer was yes!

Truthfully, however, it would make sense that liberators not decide who a region's delegate is, but the people of the region. To this end, I'm inclined to state that supporters do indeed matter. As of right now, Hideout's supporters are not natives, and even though she may be a native, her delegacy is more likely to be considered an invader delegacy.

Original Thread
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2395170#2395170 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2395170#2395170)


Who is considered a native, and natives rights!


Natives are just that: the region's natives. Invaders are, you guessed it, anyone belonging to the invading group (and yes, that includes the counter-invaders as well, they're not native, and they're not neutral - which leaves only one category). And neutrals are, well, they're the ones belonging to neither group (Mods, Modlings, players on neither side but attempting to gain intel for the Mods).
-Neutered Sputniks

Your rights as a native
Natives are generally not allowed to be perma-banned. However, when a Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)
(Which means you can't permanently ban a native!!)
-Neutered Sputniks

In a region that can be passworded the password must be given to all the natives immediately following a change by the invaders.
(You must give out the password to the natives!)
-Neutered Sputniks

Would those Native nations that are banned for the 1-2 days, still be considered natives if they come back, or would they not be considered natives, having been out of the region?
Yes they would

What the invader can do to you natives!
"Native becomes overly unruly - i.e. spamming/griefing/etc. - the invader delegate is allowed to leave said nation on the ban list a little more permanently (1-2 days approx.)"
-Neutered Sputniks


Good thread about natives
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...der=asc&start=0 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=107554&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)





Invader Delegates responsibilities

As the delegate you must
-Give out the password to all natives immediately or else face deletion

Scolopendra wrote:
Fisz wrote:
I forgot the password.

Translation: Didn't send it to the natives.
Result: Griefer.



The story is that Fisz took over Monte Carlo, did some things and passworded the region and failed to give out the password, in result Fisz was deleted!

You also must send the password to all natives!

More Clarification
Elaboration on invasions and passwords:

Saying "Telegram me for the password" is not an acceptable substitute for telegramming the password to natives. While you may request that non-natives telegram you for the password, you must actively telegram the password to all natives as soon as you impose or change the regional password.
-Cogitation

Read more here!
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...er=asc&start=40 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=103426&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=40)


What invaders can't do


Invaders cannot spam the regional happenings with puppets to cover their tracks, you can move 1 puppet with you though
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2365936#2365936 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2365936#2365936)
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2370369#2370369 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2370369#2370369)

Invaders cannot perm ban the natives from the region
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2433966#2433966 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2433966#2433966)

Invaders must give the password to natives as soon as soon as the region is passworded
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2433966#2433966 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2433966#2433966)

Invaders may not use U.N puppets to prop them into the delegacy(duh!) Mods can see you so don't try
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2418020#2418020 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2418020#2418020)

Impersonating another player to gain info is allowed, but to ruin his or her reputation is not
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...2422140#2422140 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2422140#2422140)

What to do if any of this happens and possibly get the invaders deleted


File a getting help report
http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help
Preferred Method by mods

Or ask for help in the moderation forum
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=9
Less preferred method

If you have questions ask them in the moderation forum
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewforum.php?f=9

As a last resort if your region gets invaded ask outside groups for help, examples are the Rejected Realms army or Macto, or try to ask for help from the NM here http://merit.jink.org

If you have questions you may also ask them at the NS MIRC Chat
at network EsperNet and channel #nationstates, you can also ask your fellow nations!




Regions of Importance, Thanks to Kandarin(Delegate of the RR)
Key

Political designations:

P1- Dictatorship. Absolute rule by one player, usually the Founder or Delegate of the region or founding Admin of the organization's forum.

P2- Council or limited democracy. A small percentage of players(in very large regions, this may still be a large number) decide things, and the opinions of lower-ranking players are heard, but are not law. (Note: This description is a default for regions not fitting the other categories.

P3- Representative democracy. The democratic process in the region and/or its subordinate organizations is open and fair, but the region is so large that the percentage of the region's nations represented is still small. (Example: North America has over 200 people, but only about one eighth of those are active players who choose to take part in regional politics)

P4- Senate or true democracy. A very large percentage(more than a third) of the region's members vote democratically on almost all issues.

Regional/Alliance size designations:

R1- Less than 18 players

R2- 19-36 players

R3- 37-100 players

R4- 101-500 players

R5- 500+ players

------------------------------------------------------------

Air Strip One- Small region-crashing group, member of the Imperial Commonwealth.
P1, R3, Website

Alliance Defense Network(ADN)- Interregional defense alliance. A recent invasion of one of their protectorates by the Atlantic Alliance has pushed the two blocs to war.
Website, Forum

Allied Liberation League (ALL)- Co-defensive agreement and defensive/liberational alliance, formed by several regions: North America, The Meritocracy, Holland/Nederland, American Alliance, Utopia, North Alerica
Forum

Armageddon- A deeply Christian region, also poltically conservative, Allied with Capitalist Alliance and The Meritocracy as a MACTO pact member.
P2, R4, Forum

Atlantic Alliance- Mid-sized offensive/defensive alliance, shrunken as many players left due to inactivity. Its primary goal is world domination. An increasing focus on region-crashing has put it at odds with the ADN and many counter-invaders. Potential members are screened.
P2, R2, Forum

Canada- Large, well-organized region.
P2, R4, Forum

Capitalist Alliance- Conservative region, Allied with The Meritocracy and Armageddon as a MACTO pact member.
P2, R3, Forum

East Pacific, The- Nation birth region, solid centralized leadership, Delegate runs an NS flagmaking service.
P2, R5, Forum

Empire of Imperials- Large region, built by an older invader who once headed the Empire of Power, currently neutral until it can grow large enough to intervene in foreign events.
P2, R4, Forum

England- Large English region. SABRe signatory. SCDT signatory.
P4, R4, Website

Europe- Player-created super-region, a Founder was recently added after a power struggle between Delegate candidates threw the region into turmoil.
P3, R5, Forum and Regional Map

Farkistan/Farktopia- Homes to an extremely old, skilled region-crashing group.
P2, R3, No Forum

Freedom Alliance (FA)- Democracy-loving group based in North Alerica and United States. Allied with The Meritocracy and The Rejected Realms, Opposes Atlantic Alliance. Potential members are screened.
P4, R3, Website

Free Pacific Army, the- Defensive alliance, a former satellite of The Pacific, now independant as the Pacific is controlled by a dictatorship. SCDT signatory.
P2, R4, Forums: Official, Historical

Golden Hills, The- Large region, in the process of merging with the Sardaukar Confederacy. ADN signatory. SCDT signatory.
P2, R3, Website

GREAT Britain- Mid-sized, generally friendly region. SABRe signant.
P2, R2, Website

Great Britain 3- British region, is merging with the SABRe region of England. ADN signant.
P2, R2, No Forum

Heartland, The- Large, well-organized region. Its leader is a Game Moderator, Ineptia. Allied with Wysteria and Texas. Potential members are screened.
P3, R4. Website

Holland and Nederland- Two regions that work as one. Made up mostly of Dutch players, and as such uses the Dutch lanquage primarily. Opposes Blue Moon and invaders in general. ALL signatory.
P2, R4, Website

Imperial Britain- Smallish well-organized region. SABRe signatory.
P2, R3, Website

Imperial Commonwealth- Large region-crasher base. Potential members are screened.
P2, R3, Forum

Imperial Council, The- Large region-crasher base, has rarely seen action.
P2, R3, No Forum.

Ireland- Large region, security is tight due to lack of a Founder. Potential members are screened. ADN signatory.
P2, R3, Website

Island Nations of Aramir- Large, party-atmosphere region. Many residents moved there from the now-nearly-empty Monte Carlo.
P2, R3, No Forum

Japan- Older region, generlly isolated from the rest of the NS world.
P2, R3, Forum

Lazarus- Like the Rejected Realms and the five Pacifics, this region is an integral part of the game. It is the home of nations newly resurrected after being deleted for inactivity. Due to the rarity of resurrections, it has only 62 nations as of this post, most of them non-UN. It has no Delegate, no Forum, and no organization whatsoever.

Meritocracy, The- Democracy-loving organization, based in the regions of The New Meritocracy, New Meritocracy, and Meritocratic Isles. The Meritocracy values the political and economic sovereignty of nations, and as such UN membership is forbidden in its regions; However, most Meritocrats have UN puppets, which can be found in all manner of other regions all over the Nationstates world. Allied with Capitalist Alliance and Armageddon as a MACTO pact member. ALL signatory. SCDT signatory. Potential members are screened.
P4, R3, Forum

Monte Carlo- Small region, has endured many shifts in governement, largely due to modbombings of its original members. Currently a shadow of its former self. See: Island Nations of Aramir
P2, R1, No Forum

NetWork Radio- a group of reporters who report on events in the Nationstates world.
P3, R1, Forum

North America- A large, well-organized region, home to many active RPers. ALL signatory.
P3, R4, Website, Historical Forum

North Pacific, The- Nation-birth super-region, several recent friendly changes of Delegacy. At the time of this writing, the second-largest region in the world. ADN signant. SCDT signatory.
P2, R5, Forum

Pacific, The- The original nation-birth super-region. A dictator has siezed power by force and ejected at least a thousand people to hold onto his power.
P1, R5, Forum

Realm Of Ambrosia, The- Small, tight-knit region. the Founder is a Forum Mod, Cogitation.
P2, R3, Forum

Rejected Realms, The- Super-region that is the destination of all those ejected from other regions. Ejecting nations is impossible here. Allied with Sardaukar Confederacy and Freedom Alliance, Opposes Atlantic Alliance. ADN signatory.
P2, R5, Forums: Official, Unofficial, Historical

Rejected Realms Army- Offensive/defensive alliance that is linked to the government of The Rejected Realms. Alliances and enemies are the same as the Rejected Realms. Potential members are screened. ADN signatory.
P2, R2, Forum

Roman Empire, The- Democratic region based on the government system of the ancient empire of the same name. Opposes Atlantic Alliance. SCDT signatory.
P4, R2, Forum

Sovereign Alliance of British Regions (SABRe)- As the name states, an alliance between British regions. Includes Imperial Britain, England, GREAT Britain, Britain, United Kingdom, and British Empire.
Forum

Sardaukar Confederacy- Self-styled as a loose alliance of interdependant states. ADN signatory. SCDT host.
P2, R4, Website

Sardaukar Confederacy Defense Trust (SCDT)- A large co-defensive agreement between several dozen large regions. Opposes Atlantic Alliance.
Forum

South Pacific, The- A nation-birth super-region and highly democratic in choosing its officers. Largest region in the world at the time of this writing. SCDT signatory.
P2, R5, Forum

Texas- Large, well-organized region, Allied with The Heartland and Wysteria.
P2, R4, Forum

United Kingdom- A British region, the UK is heavily pro-human rights, and the democratic nature of almost all of its occupying states furthers this image.
P2, R2, No Forum

Urbanites- Home to a powerful defensive/liberational alliance, this region is opposed to most region-crashers.
P2, R3, Forum

West Pacific, The- Nation-Birth Super-region, the current Delegate has enjoyed a long, peaceful rule. ADN signatory. SCDT signatory.
P2, R5, Forum

Wysteria- Large region, Allied with Texas and The Heartland.
P2, R4, Forum and Regional Map



Versions
1.0 finished December 29, 2003 at 11:32AM Eastern Time
1.2 images added
1.3 f--- up the whole thing, lost spelling corrections!
1.4 Fixed
1.5 added Kandrin's region groups list
1.6 December 30th, added Kandrin's updated list!

Hopefully this helps and thanks to Crazy Girl for compiling the list, and The Basenji for the help with the spelling, and Kanadrin for the list of regions.
-Garrison II
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopi...der=asc&start=0 (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=101820&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

Here is another one:



Ex-nation





Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2003 9:48 pm Post subject: FYI: What Godmoding Is

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Godmoding is:




Saying what happens to other people's stuff.

Example: "Okay, I just blew up 300,000 of your troops!"
Why this is Godmoding: Because in FreeForm Roleplay, it's up to the person being attacked to determine their own losses. This leads to...




Refusing to take any losses. Or lose. Ever.

Example: "Oh, well, my soldiers had personal forcefields so none of them were actually hurt. "
Why this is Godmoding: This is probably where godmoding gets its name (from God Mode in Doom, where you were invincible after typing IDDQD). Naturally, if nobody ever takes a hit, the fight degenerates into "I HIT YOU!" "NO YOU DIDN'T!", etc.




Having übertech, armies that are too large, etc.

Example: A 2 day old nation with a population of 6 million posts "My 6 billion man army in vades u with NUKES!!!!1"
Why this is Godmoding: Okay, little guy nations, I know you're anxious to start throwing your weight around, but let's be honest; you are piddling nothings when you first start out in the world. You really shouldn't start with nukes, and your army shouldn't ever be more than 5% of your population(that's for what you can field...the rest represents non-coms, supply lines, factories, etc). See this incredible, yet sadly unstickied, thread for details: http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=13017

This is just a short list. Other nations, please feel free to contribute (SERIOUS!) additions to this list.

Reposted from the NS forum, since if RP will be enforced here I think this will be important here too. If I'm completely off base here, feel free to delete this thread.

ADDED BY SLAGDOR THE MODERATOR:
Godmod and godmode are both acceptable terms... but what's the difference? Click here to find out!

ADDED BY TJHAIRBALL THE MODERATOR:
Also, everybody's happier if you pay attention to logistics. And if you don't know much about Role Playing, there are people willing to teach you.[

ALSO ADDED BY TJHAIRBALL:
Some various threads on the clinky and nitty gritty technical side of things:
Some things you should know about tanks. -Clan Smoke Jaguar
Some info on military equipment pricing. -Clan Smoke Jaguar
Some info on naval vessels -Clan Smoke Jaguar



Game Moderator


Founded: 17 Dec 2002
Posts: 3786

Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2003 10:15 pm Post subject:

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Troops and Godmoding
As well as the troops that just won't die, godmoding extends to troops which do other interesting things.

Stealth Troops
"Stealth" is a cool word, but it doesn't mean "invisible". A stealth bomber is just harder to detect than an ordinary one is on radar - ditto stealth fighters. To my knowledge, there is no such thing as a "stealth tank", "stealth rocket launcher" or anything else like that.

Invisible Troops
The temptation with magic (of any description) is to make people and things invisible. Thus, "my invisible tank has driven into the middle of your city. HA HA."
Think about this for a minute. Invisibility only extends to sight - an "invisible tank" would still make noise, especially when it shot you. "Invisible troops" would be even harder to work with, doors would open by themselves and all those orders of the sergeants would be very audible.

Very Fast Troops
NationStates is a big place. You might have a large army, but if it's all on one side of the world fighting in one war, it can't suddenly appear on the other side of the world fighting in another war. In other words, your battalions can only be in one place at once.


Ex-nation





Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2003 10:17 pm Post subject:

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Acts of God

The cheapest godmode tactic of them all -- invoking God. Surely there is nothing more repugnant than that, especially to those of us who -are- religious. This is a game. God has better things to do with His time than intercede in someone's RPing.



Game Moderator


Founded: 17 Dec 2002
Posts: 3786

Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2003 10:20 pm Post subject:

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The Space-Time Continuum and God-Moding
Just because your country zips around in flying saucers and comes from another planet doesn't mean it's invincible. See below:

Future-tech VS Present-tech
What's to stop an M-16, well-aimed, from knocking out all sorts of important bits of androids?

Future-tech VS Past-tech
Even a catapult could do some sort of damage. Ditto a crossbow bolt - they're still effective murder weapons today.

Present-tech VS Past-tech
If your castle's being shelled by tanks, try to tip some boiling oil over them. Crude, but effective.


Powerbroker


Founded: 24 Feb 2003
Posts: 2286

Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2003 5:03 am Post subject: Why High % Armies are Quite Unrealistic

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There are a lot of nations which claim to have ungodly percentages of their population in their military (ranging from the 20% IF and NRBC claim, to the more reasonable 2.5-4% i saw when i first got here). At first, we want to say, yes, militaristic regimes can in fact dragoon this many troops into service, especially if they have compulsory military service and big defense spending. I agree, nations like that can in fact raise large % militaries, but for numerous economic reasons, most of the %'s used are in fact insanely self destructive.

Let's use the US as a case study, not for their military, but because information on their census is very readily availabe. Circa 2000 the census put the US population around 250 M, with ~108 M of those people between the ages of 18 and 44. Now, to be realistic, most nations are not going to have women serving in the same capacity as men (i'm not saying it's right, just that realistically, that's how it is). So your pool for troops is more than half of 108 M, let's say 70 M to represent women in support roles, whatever. Coincidentally, 18 to 44 is also the primary demographic for the labor pool; after 44 non professionals tend to get pushed out in favor of younger workers who can be paid less, work more and not put in for viagra perscriptions under the company health plan. So every soldier you take means you are losing workers.

If you doubt the power of military service to greviously affect the labor pool, look at the US during WWII; it as widely accepted that the need for women to work, replacing the men who left for Europe and Asia, forced owners to accept women into the workforce. What % of the workforce did they make up, if they were only replacing men who left? 10% 15% It sounds small, but in economics, 5% is a apocolypic shift.

So whey IF dragoons 20% of his TOTAL population into military service, that's 20% of 565 M = 113 active military personel. But, out of his labor pool, which using the US statistics is ~40% of the population, that's half of your available workers. HALF.

And then, let's get to the point that these nations are either making their own arms or buying them. The point can be made either way; either a huge portion of your production is being siphoned off from Dept I or Dept II goods (that's consumer or capital goods if you're wondering) into the useless Dept III (means of destruction, weapons). So if IF claims to be able to launch x number of missiles because he makes nothing but missiles all day, who is growing the food, making the appliances, running the stores? It's an economists nightmare. If you don't make the weapons yourself, you need to fund those purchaces, which means huge amounts of production for export, which still leaves the country, leaving your country with nothing to eat or sit on.

Some people might try to bring up DPRK (N. Korea) as an example of a nation with a huge % military, but I have yet to be provided with the stat to back that up. Furthermore, their economy is toast. If you want that high %, are you willing to accept that your economy is incapable of providing for your people? Likely not, since people say a powerhouse economy allows them to fund huge militaries. This is true, to a point. There's a line when the military steps on the economy's foot.

Still not convinced huge military %'s hurt the economy? What happens when you take a large % of your work force and, effectively, remove them from the labor market? Labor supply goes down while demand goes up, driving wages up, which (if you're a classical economist) kills profitability.

Now let's take a military that is 2.5% of total population. This is, clearly, a more realistic claim, but still fatal to their economy. Let's say a nation has 12 M citizens. 2.5% of 12 M = 300k, availabe labor pool for 12 M = 4.8, so active military personel out of the labor pool = 7%. Adjust for unequal male/female involvement, you're looking at closer to 10%. Not to bad, but still very high in terms of yanking a segment of the population out of the labor pool. But also remember, that active personel is not combat personel. What % of that 300k is actually going to see any combat? How many troops can this nation deploy at a time, vs how many are actually employed?

Now I'm not saying you can't claim to have 2.5% of your total population in your military, but they won't all be storming the beaches and I'd like to see people taking the economic effects in stride. I'm at the point where I feel like a god mode is when you just assume away a problem (i.e. my bombs never miss, my soldiers never die etc), and assuming the economic effects of large militaries away, well, you get my point. All I want here is to add more depth and dimension to this game and, maybe, get people to think twice about what they're doing.

edit: added because it's true and necessary for some people who can't quite get a grasp on reality:

there is also the issue of economies of scale. the larger your nation the larger the economic superstructure to keep your nation running is. you see, we all think intuitively that mechanization decreases the number of workers we need to make the same amount of goods; tractors increase farm yeilds while requiring fewer hands, robots in car factories speed production. what you don't think of but is nonetheless true is more workers end up being needed to make the tractor than are saved in the tractor's use. this is why technology only increases with population; you need larger and larger labor surpluses in order to spare those people to make new things.

tractors are made of engines, wheels, axles, frames, spark plugs etc etc, and all these parts need seperate lines, if not whole factories, to make. so when you increase your tech level you also increase the % of the population that needs to stay in the work force in order for your nation to function. this is true down the line; every high tech gadget you've got lowers the number of troops you can raise. not that it matters, high tech is meant to make soldiers more effective, and if you keep a small, well armed army you get to overlook those huge force projection problems a 2M man infantry group is going to have.

so my point in this addendum is, as you get bigger plan to decrease the % of people in your army. this means your army size will remain static or grow very slightly, but that's not a big deal because it has other pay offs. but if you think that a 400M person nation is going to drop 5% of its population on the battlefeild expect to see this link again and have a very nit picky economist wonder about what exactly you're doing.

Did I post this one before?

Ever wondered what godmoding is? Ever pondered upon the subtle differences between trolling and flamebait?

Well, just for you lucky people, here are those answers:

Forbidden Actions

AdSpam: Spamming other people's regional messageboards with adverts for your region. The only places where you are allowed to put advertisements are the Gameplay forum or the regional messageboards of the feeder regions (The Pacifics and The Rejected Realms). And even then, don't over-do it. Report AdSpam using the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help). Edit: The region Lazarus is not a feeder region. Do not post regional advertisements there.

Events Log Spamming: See Spam.

Flame: Expressing anger at someone in uncouth ways with OOC comments (i.e. swearing, being obnoxious, threatening etc.)though it does to watch what you post IC as well unless the other posters know you're not serious. Flaming in the forums should be reported in the Moderation forum, in the game itself, through Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help).

Flamebait: Posts that are made with the aim of angering someone indirectly. Not outright flame, but still liable to bring angry replies. It's in the same context of trolling but with flamebaiting it's just the one person.

Godmoding,Godmodding/Wanking and (puppet) Multiing: Look here: http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=43557
Gravedigging: Posting a reply on a long disused thread; bumping threads that aren't used anymore.

Griefing: Harrassing a nation because of what they did or said. Also see Region Griefing.

Klamathing: See Spam.

Multiing: See UN Multiing.

Nation Hijacking: Stealing someone else's nation by gaining their password. This should be reported using the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help).

Obscenities: Sexually graphic images and posts. Very strictly forbidden. Obscenities in the forums should be reported to the Moderation Forum. In-game (such as an obscene flag) should be reported through the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help).

Post-Whoring: See Spam.

Quote Pyramids: When replies with quotes get quoted and then that reply get's quoted and so on and so forth. It's OK if it's just a few quotes but once they start getting monstrously huge, it is not OK.

Regional Messageboard Spam: Spamming a regional messageboard. Only founders should clear the spam - it helps if you clear it with messages saying '--clearing spam--' or something to avoid being accused of spamming yourself. Nations who keep spamming a particular region are Griefers which is far more serious. Report RMS using the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help).

Region Griefing: Region Griefing is the malicious cousin of "region crashing". Where "crashing" involves moving several nations into a region at once and taking over the delegate-ship, griefing involves less savoury events afterwards. Basically the same as Griefing, only it's a bunch of nations (the region crashers) being griefed. Report this using the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help).

Spam/SPAM: Off-topic, irrelevant and multi-posts that clog the server. This includes posting lots of smilies which is known as Smilie Spam. Also akin to spamming is Post-whoring which is when a player posts anything just to increase the postcount. Going in and out of a region and hence filling up the regional events board with departing and arriving messages is known as Events Log Spamming and is not allowed. Spamming to the point where you get deleted is known as Klamathing. Spamming in the forums should be reported through the Moderation forum, and In-game, through the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help).

Thread Hijacking: Appropiating a thread for a discussion totally unrelated to the original purpose of said thread.

Trolling: Posts that are made with the aim of angering people. (like 'ALL JEWS ARE [insert vile comment here]' for example). Also is used to refer to making obviously silly topics that people nonetheless will reply to. (making a case for the proof that teletubbies exist for instance. There will always be someone who feels compelled to post 'No they don't.' Threads like this should just be ignored.)

UN Multiing: Primarily someone who has more than one UN nation. Also, in Roleplay, Puppet Multiing is when someone uses their other nations in wars to give themselves an advantage. Not against the game rules, but very likely to tick people off. Suspected UN multies should be reported using the Getting Help Page (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=help), never the Moderation forum.

Edit by MGH for semantic and connotative reasons. Re-edit to note that you aren't to advertise in Lazarus.

Some of these (like my issue repetition one) have already been re-stuck.

Some of these (like my issue repetition one) have already been re-stuck.


I didn't know that, and after re-reading Myrth's post, I see that this is not what he was asking. Sorry......

No problem. It will help us out for when the search feature is turned back on so we can find the missing stickies :)

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=342360

Yeah . . erm . . didn't really have the time to go digging through the vast wasteland that is the United Nations thread backlog. It was previously stickied by Enodia, and a re-sticky would be appreciated.

Yeah . . erm . . didn't really have the time to go digging through the vast wasteland that is the United Nations thread backlog. It was previously stickied by Enodia, and a re-sticky would be appreciated.

First, someone has to find it!
;)

Here's GMC's "We don't care that you're not a mod." thread: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=337610

(Should this one even be restuck, since no one uses the not a mod tag anymore? But it's here if you want it. ;))

It's hard to resist the urge...

Ahh the hell with it

Shhhh. Be vewwy vewwy quiet. We're huntin' stickies!

I'm sure I noticed some round the place *hunts*

*pounces upon http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=274376*

Re-sticky!