NationStates Jolt Archive

standarte westland have a flag whit an iron cross

hitlers austria have an eagle and an ironcross

eugenic supermen have a celtcross

aren't there anyone who cares? and what exactly are ns's policy to this?

Iron Cross =/= against the rules.

Swastika == against the rules.

Would it be appropriate to add a note clearly stating that Swastiak flags are not permitted on the "Create Your National Flag" page? At present the ruling is not apparent to the new user creating a nation for the first time, all that is said there is "Non-flag-like or inappropriate images are not permitted."

"Create Your National Flag" page:
http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/02675/page=upload_flag

yeah, but for the swastika, that used to be like a native american symbol. The only reason the nazis had it as a symbol was because hitler liked it or something. I'm not saying that we should put a swastika on a flag, but you guys have to understand that it wasn't a symbol of hate until hitler took it.

This has been debated into the ground, Itranto. Regardless of what it used to mean, we must deal with what it means today.


Oooh...and I didnt know that BWO. I'll sic Max / [violet] on it.

no, im not saying that they should allow it, I'm just saying it used to be something else.

:tantrum: :tantrum: BE GONE FACIST FIEND!!! WE DON'T NEED YOUR KIND HERE!!!! :tantrum: :tantrum:

if max barry doesn't want nazis here he should forbid more things like sigrunes, wolfhooks and so on.

you can not say that there are hindus and odinists here who hav the swastika in thier flag. the people with that sign which i have seen have slogans like WHITE POWER!!!! and sign their forum posts with "death to ZOG" or 14/88

zog= zionistic occúpation government
14=the fourteen words, something like: we must protect our aryan race..., could the whole phraze a while ago
88=the 8:th letter in the alphabet, hh, (heil hitler)

As far as I can tell, Mr. Barry neither wants nor doesn't want nazis on NS. They are part of the ideological spectrum mankind has to offer, and NS has to reflect that.

BUT svastikas are not allowed as flags here. Period. No 'Ifs', no 'whats' and no 'buts'. If you want to be in NS you have to deal with that. They might give you a reason, they might not. But that is how things are.

If you want to have a nazi country here, well... some people will complain, but as long as you don't break the rules (go read them if you still haven't, including warnings and stickies), you can play as evilly as you want and you won't be deleted for your actions. Of course you might find yourself alone, or just able to join with people "of your kind" (no offense intended). Litaria is an example of some people's tolerance towards nazis, though getting to close to flaming or flamebaiting. :)

I once had a puppet named "Evil nazi minions". It got deleted. I am not sure if it was inactivity or something else (it had a nazi flag, though no svastika and I cannot remember the currency or the animal, so it is possible the fault was there). But as I had not cared, and I got some other puppets deleted more or less at the same time, I felt myself happy not to lose the rest of the puppets I did not want to lose, so I didn't even commented on Evil nazi minions deletion. Avoiding to make waves. :)

As for any other reason to sport a svastika on a flag (hindus, vikings, Odin-worshippers, you name it), well, to make it short: tough luck.

:tantrum: :tantrum: BE GONE FACIST FIEND!!! WE DON'T NEED YOUR KIND HERE!!!! :tantrum: :tantrum:

Hey, watch it.

Anyway, Iron Crosses are allowed. They could be considered a homage to Prussia or the Kaiser's Germany. Misuse of them by the nazis doesn't condemn the same way it does the swastika. The swastika was over-used, and was the direct symbol of Nazi Germany. It affects people in ways the iron cross does not.

ok so then the things to forbid are;
triskelons,
wolfhooks,
wheel crosses

more things you want to put up here? and can one send this to the moderators?

Ahem, IIRC, it was also said that no additional symbols would be forbidden. The svastika is an exception. So stop doing lists.

The communist sign of the hammer and sickle is way worse sign of opression than the svastika, as besides the USSR, lots of other nations have used it to kill and opress others, and if you count all of the people killed under a regime sporting that symbol, it would make nazis green with envy.

But it is not forbidden. And it seems it won't be.

Also, the cross has been used by "Christian" nations as an excuse to kill and opress. And most of today's flags have also been used for that. How many people have died in the colonies of England or France, to name two, just because the were "only natives" and "stood in the way"?

But that doesn't mean those flags will be forbidden.

I repeat that I seem to recall that only the svastika is forbidden. Not even the other Nazi (or neo-nazi) flags, as long as they don't sport the svastika.

Of course, I could be wrong (though I think I am not) OR this state of things can change (not likely). If you are unsure about a symbol or flag, ask a mod. If they say it's tasteless, or tactless, or idiot, or that they don't like it, go ahead. It is not against the rules. BUT if they tell you that flag is a no-no, think of another flag.

For instance, breasts are against the rules. In a flag, that is. I have been told that some mods even have two of them. But not on their flags. Or as currency (?) or national animal (!).

DarkSith Mars Colony is correct. Flags are almost by definition patriotic symbols of the state and its instruments. It would be difficult to find a prominent real-world flag not soaked with blood. The general rule is no swastikas, no pornography or other inappropriate imagery, no obscene language and no frame-distorting dimensions. Beyond that it becomes impossible to draw a line.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

Iron Cross =/= against the rules.

Swastika == against the rules.

IRON CROSS AGAINST THE RULES????

The Iron Cross is NOT a Nazi symbol it is a German medal of honor, dating back to nearly 80 years before Hitler was even born! The Swastika was not originally a Nazi symbol, it was used by Native Americans, Vikings, even Bhuddists. Hitler just perverted it. I am of German descent and despise the Nazis for what they did to my people's reputation.

Most of all I despise when people see the Iron Cross as a Nazi symbol. It is NOT one!!!

Iron Cross =/= against the rules.

Swastika == against the rules.

IRON CROSS AGAINST THE RULES????

The Iron Cross is NOT a Nazi symbol it is a German medal of honor, dating back to nearly 80 years before Hitler was even born! The Swastika was not originally a Nazi symbol, it was used by Native Americans, Vikings, even Bhuddists. Hitler just perverted it. I am of German descent and despise the Nazis for what they did to my people's reputation.

Most of all I despise when people see the Iron Cross as a Nazi symbol. It is NOT one!!!

=/= is a symbol for "is not equal to." The Iron Cross is not against the rules.

The Liberal Unitary Republic of Goobergunchia
Non-Moderator
Founder, Democratic Underground region
Making NationStates better since 17 May 2003

ON EDIT: Looks like I beat Non-Political Mac Fans to it - serves him right for trying to write too much. ;)

Crossman - no need to get so Cross, man ;)

As far as I can see the symbol "= =" means "is equal to" and therefore Yeah It Is Banned.

Reading the other posts seems to indicate that the Iron Cross is not in fact banned. That made me look at the "= / =" symbol, which suggests to me "Not Banned" - I cannot see any other reason for the difference between;

= = and =/=

Does this make sense to people?

On this subject, I simply want to say that yeah most flags have blood on them and yeah there are other symbols of Nazi Germany which might be seen as offensive. But to "proudly" *spits* display a Swastika on a national flag just because someone thinks it's "cool" or they do so simply because they have the freedom or right of expression to do so is probably the most stupid, childish, immature and deliberately insensitive act I can think of in terms of such imagery.

People should listen more to people like Crossman - the Swastika is an ILLEGAL IMAGE in moder-day germany and I got sick of seeing spotty teenage boys parading it in the UK and Eastern Europe simply cos they think it adds kudos or they are misguided in thinking that Nazism is a viable form of government.

People who think like that are more dangerous than the real Nazis ever were ;)

standarte westland have a flag whit an iron cross

hitlers austria have an eagle and an ironcross

eugenic supermen have a celtcross

aren't there anyone who cares? and what exactly are ns's policy to this?

WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU :?: :!: :?: :!:

:shock: Don't you people have anything better to do then stare at our flags?

You need a life....

Iron Cross =/= against the rules.

Swastika == against the rules.

IRON CROSS AGAINST THE RULES????

The Iron Cross is NOT a Nazi symbol it is a German medal of honor, dating back to nearly 80 years before Hitler was even born! The Swastika was not originally a Nazi symbol, it was used by Native Americans, Vikings, even Bhuddists. Hitler just perverted it. I am of German descent and despise the Nazis for what they did to my people's reputation.

Most of all I despise when people see the Iron Cross as a Nazi symbol. It is NOT one!!!

=/= is a symbol for "is not equal to." The Iron Cross is not against the rules.

The Liberal Unitary Republic of Goobergunchia
Non-Moderator
Founder, Democratic Underground region

Heh heh, well okay. Sorry. Whenever I see Iron Cross and Swastika mentioned together I go to red alert. Good to know then.

Crossman - no need to get so Cross, man ;)

Smartass...

People should listen more to people like Crossman - the Swastika is an ILLEGAL IMAGE in moder-day germany and I got sick of seeing spotty teenage boys parading it in the UK and Eastern Europe simply cos they think it adds kudos or they are misguided in thinking that Nazism is a viable form of government.

People who think like that are more dangerous than the real Nazis ever were ;)

Well thank you for your kind words about me.

Roarroarroar.

Whinewhinewhine.

The 4 point swastica is banned, no other symbols of the Third Reich are.

People should stop obsessing over other people's flags.

Personally, I think if the name of the country makes it obvious that the nation isn't in anyway affiliated with National Socialism (ie: Buddist Paradise, Iroquis Nation, ect...) and a good RP history then a bend in the rules should be given for a non-tilted swastica.
(The slanted sun swastica is an invention of the Nazis, to make it look like it was in motion.)

Not that it affects me too much.

PS: Hitler, regardless of whatelse you think of him, from his art background was a master in imagery and symbolism.

I wish this was small enough to be a flag.

http://kosumo.faereal.net/random/hitler-watermelon.gif
Der Fuerher loves his watermelon.

yeah, but for the swastika, that used to be like a native american symbol. The only reason the nazis had it as a symbol was because hitler liked it or something. I'm not saying that we should put a swastika on a flag, but you guys have to understand that it wasn't a symbol of hate until hitler took it.

I don't know about a native American symbol, but the swastika was certainly used as a cross in Gothic art. This is of course where Hitler got the idea from, along with the whole Third Reich business. There is also a very similar, although not identical symbol used in Hindu art.


Personally I believe that people are way too PC. I've seen people demanding we ban hammers and scicles as well as confederate flags. All banning flags does is impede RP. If you don't want to RP with someone playing as a Nazi Government thats your own choice, however so long as they aren't actualy OOCly hunting down Jews or something thats fine. Personally I am using an iron cross on my flag, although that does not mean I am RPing as a Nazi Government. Indeed the Iron Cross symbols far outdate the Nazi party, as does the swaztika.

PS: Hitler, regardless of whatelse you think of him, from his art background was a master in imagery and symbolism.

Amen to that.

Note this statement is not me admitting I am a Nazi or something similar. I am agreeing with the point that Hitler used symbolism well.

PS: Hitler, regardless of whatelse you think of him, from his art background was a master in imagery and symbolism.

Amen to that.

Note this statement is not me admitting I am a Nazi or something similar. I am agreeing with the point that Hitler used symbolism well.

Master, my butt, he was declared "Mediocre, and run of the mill"
and was not allowed to attend the art school he wanted to go to.
and he painted Landscapes and buildings, not a lot of demand for imagry or symbolism there.

the only reason his pictures hold any value today is because they were painted by a Foreign leader who was the object of a World War.

PS: Hitler, regardless of whatelse you think of him, from his art background was a master in imagery and symbolism.

Amen to that.

Note this statement is not me admitting I am a Nazi or something similar. I am agreeing with the point that Hitler used symbolism well.

Master, my butt, he was declared "Mediocre, and run of the mill"
and was not allowed to attend the art school he wanted to go to.
and he painted Landscapes and buildings, not a lot of demand for imagry or symbolism there.

the only reason his pictures hold any value today is because they were painted by a Foreign leader who was the object of a World War.

I don't think he's referring to any artwork that Hitler necessarily painted, but that Hitler was able to manipulate images and symbols well.

Vrak is correct. You will note that Soviet Haaregrad I said symbolism not art. Now believe it or not these words are not the same. Now were you to look at the Neuremberg rally or anything similar it is very easy to imagine how people can get swept up in the fever. Hitler produced a spectacle of sound, colour and symbolism which completely swept people away, in a manner that no other world leader has ever pulled off.

Hitler was declined entry to art school on the grounds that he was incapable of drawing people. His pictures of buildings are superb.

Not to contribute further to this already redundant thread but I have to say that 1 Infinite Loops image was fantastic.

Did you do that yourself or did you find that on-line?

I would like to propose that any National Socialist posting in General must first write a song about why the Fuhrer enjoys melons before launching into some demagogic tirade about how spotty socially awkward 16 year olds and caucasian unemployed dung movers are the superior race.

How can Hitler use the watermelon to further his aims? Or should I say, the symbolism of a watermelon? And what does a watermelon symbolize? Lazy summer days I'd think. And, quite obviously, Hitler is eating the watermelon in a fierce manner and then dropping it. This means, in my humble opinion, that national socialism cannot tolerate watermelonism and should grind it under the heel of the Fuehrer. Therefore, all good followers of Hitler should refrain from eating watermelons else they succumb to their enemies due to their own idleness.

How can Hitler use the watermelon to further his aims? Or should I say, the symbolism of a watermelon? And what does a watermelon symbolize? Lazy summer days I'd think. And, quite obviously, Hitler is eating the watermelon in a fierce manner and then dropping it. This means, in my humble opinion, that national socialism cannot tolerate watermelonism and should grind it under the heel of the Fuehrer. Therefore, all good followers of Hitler should refrain from eating watermelons else they succumb to their enemies due to their own idleness.

Swastikas are banned, because Max Barry (The owner of this site) said so. Not because they are bad. Max Barry doesn't want Swastikas on his site, period.
You can ban melons on your site, or in your house for that matter, just like Max Barry can ban Swastikas.

How can Hitler use the watermelon to further his aims? Or should I say, the symbolism of a watermelon? And what does a watermelon symbolize? Lazy summer days I'd think. And, quite obviously, Hitler is eating the watermelon in a fierce manner and then dropping it. This means, in my humble opinion, that national socialism cannot tolerate watermelonism and should grind it under the heel of the Fuehrer. Therefore, all good followers of Hitler should refrain from eating watermelons else they succumb to their enemies due to their own idleness.

Swastikas are banned, because Max Barry (The owner of this site) said so. Not because they are bad. Max Barry doesn't want Swastikas on his site, period.
You can ban melons on your site, or in your house for that matter, just like Max Barry can ban Swastikas.

Obviously, my above "tongue and cheek" flew waaaay over your head, Einstein.

Obviously, my above "tongue and cheek" flew waaaay over your head, Einstein.

Yupz. Thanks for pointing that out. I just didn't get the Melon - Swastika comparison :oops:

Actually, that image is an Evil Nazi Plot (TM) to ban watermelons in NS. Associating the imagery of a watermelon with the Führer, people will stop eating them, and, as they don't eat more watermelons, they'll stop spitting the seeds, that is the way watermelons spread throughout the world.

These clever and evil people manipulate the symbolism of watermelons for their own, evil purposes.

Associating the symbol of the watermelon with Hitler, they think will make possible to unban the svastika, which otherwise, wouldn't happen.

So, do we eat watermelons or not? Do the Nazis? Who cares?

BEFORE I START, THIS IS MEANT TO BE HUMOROUS IRONY! [/disclaimer]


Well, "...spitting the seeds..." is of course a well-known euphemism for "...spreading indoctrination and propaganda..." and is therefore as such an association between the 3rd Reich (plus associated aims) and the Nazi Fruit Farmer's Association's aims to make Watermelon's the Master Fruit.....

"Water" is symbolic of purity. "Melon" is symbolic of "breast" therefore "The Motherland" (modern times have caught up with Nazi ideology and as such the term "Fatherland" has been replaced, what with people wishing to distance themselves from a too patriarchal society!).

Therefore "Watermelon" refers to "The Pure Motherland" and as such wishes to eradicate all apples, pears, bananas, passion fruit, kumquats, carambolas and so on.........

I say ban the Watermelon before its seeds are spat too far for us to wipe it out!!!!!!! Maybe we could gRIND them into the dust? Okay - crap joke to end with ;)

:D

Hmm...Interesting points so far on why watermelons should and should not be incorporated into the quest for Lebensraum.

I would like to hear from some sort of foraging animal about this.

While censure should not be the norm here on NS, I'm fucking tired of all these infantile scumbag WP goons masquerading as 'nationalist reich nations' or whatever.

Keep the swastika banned, discourage use of the iron cross as a symbol for nazism, but allow it in imperial nations that actually knows what it truly stands for.

While censure should not be the norm here on NS, I'm f--- tired of all these infantile scumbag WP goons masquerading as 'nationalist reich nations' or whatever.

Keep the swastika banned, discourage use of the iron cross as a symbol for nazism, but allow it in imperial nations that actually knows what it truly stands for.

Well, I what you're getting at here but how are you going to decide who keeps what for their flag. If you mean by "only imperial nations" (I'll assume an RP sense here since that is the NS aspect I'm more familiar with) then the mods will have to figure out which nation is acting in an imperialist fashion. Your proposal, while well-intentioned, would create an unholy workload.

And for GEC:

The UAV assembly, part of the IOT drive and regulated by the PRRT system would mostly like undergo an EE failure if the LM protocol was adopted. :lol:

[quote=Red Scandinavia]While censure should not be the norm here on NS, I'm f--- tired of all these infantile scumbag WP goons masquerading as 'nationalist reich nations' or whatever.

Keep the swastika banned, discourage use of the iron cross as a symbol for nazism, but allow it in imperial nations that actually knows what it truly stands for.

Well, I what you're getting at here but how are you going to decide who keeps what for their flag. If you mean by "only imperial nations" (I'll assume an RP sense here since that is the NS aspect I'm more familiar with) then the mods will have to figure out which nation is acting in an imperialist fashion. Your proposal, while well-intentioned, would create an unholy workload.

A start could be to check mottos and national animals,

-people use jews as national animals so they can be exticted and main-course
-no need to mention the mottos, I suppose, they are often quite obvious. Or have someone seen "the Monarchy of Preussia, national motto: WHITE POWER!!!!!" ?