NationStates Jolt Archive

I am being isolated there, and when I invite some friends over to talk, I get ejected again. They are griefing, but they simply have found a way to griefe me and fool the mods at the same time. My next post will be where the y state that the intend to humiliate me. I need a beeter mod rule. I don't want to be ignored there. I am a person too, you know?! :x

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Seconds ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
25 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
25 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
25 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.
32 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Republic of Seth ownz Baal from the regional ban list.
32 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Holy Empire of Lord Skandus from the regional ban list.
33 minutes ago: The Free Land of Corinthe For Delegate departed this region for The Rejected Realms
33 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Free Land of Corinthe For Delegate from the region.
80 minutes ago: The Constitutional Monarchy of Ayoka arrived from The Rejected Realms.
105 minutes ago: The Free Land of Corinthe For Delegate arrived from Polonia.
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I don't want to be constantly humiliated. They simply keep on ejecting me, and taking me off the banlist all the time. What is happening here????? :x

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NationStates Moderators
Received: 11 hours ago A griefer delegate has the right to eject a native of the region like you as long as it doesn't ban you and gives you back the password. As you have returned to the region and are not on the banned list, this complaint is closed.
The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz
Received: 1 day ago The new password:

The name of a Slavic God. Written in a capital letter.
The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz
Received: 1 day ago HideOut, I don't like you. And since the rules permit me to eject a native for strategical matters and unbanning it afterwards, I will do so, for the simple strategy of humiliation.

Do NEVER humiliate the Atlantic Alliance and it's members, as you have done in the past, CORINTHE.
[/code:1:ea7553cd6a]

I will not tollerate this constant griefing humiliation. You mods have to delete me, or stop it all! :evil:

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2 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
5 minutes ago: The Republic of Puppet nr 784523 departed this region for The Free Pacific Army
5 minutes ago: The Republic of Puppet nr 784523 arrived from The Free Pacific Army.
6 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
6 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
6 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.
7 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
32 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
32 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
32 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.

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Monte Carlo Civil Headquarters
Messages from regional members are co-ordinated here.

Lodged From Message
21 minutes ago The Armed Republic of Dust Land en ik houd niet van wanneer ju Polen met lager geval schrijf :]
9 minutes ago The Constitutional Monarchy of Ayoka what was that?
7 minutes ago The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz Zij zijn slechts kinderen.

Ale tak w ogóle to lepiej pisać po Polsku, żebyśmy coś naprawdę wywnioskowali.
6 minutes ago The Armed Republic of Dust Land wat wat was ??
4 minutes ago The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz Nothing important. I'm playing with HideOut because I don't like her.

No więc Duścik, piszta cośik tutej bo mnie łeb boli od tych trzeylingwizmów czy jak to się już mówi.
4 minutes ago The Armed Republic of Dust Land aprenda que las idiomas y usted sabrán ;)
2 minutes ago The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz Dust Land yo quiero tequila Oy! :)
1 minute ago The Armed Republic of Dust Land apenas tengo gusto de la vodka Polaca :D
Seconds ago The Constitutional Monarchy of Ayoka okay, this is confusing..
Seconds ago The Colony of HideOut You just raised the issue again.
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Obviously the griefers know, just like me, at what time the mods are mostly inactive, but I will rather be deathed, than let this humiliation go on!

hmmm, corthine. The mods are inactive because they actually have external lioves like most of us and, Have more important things to do like help others. This is a game issue not a forum issue.

hmmm, corthine. The mods are inactive because they actually have external lioves like most of us and, Have more important things to do like help others. This is a game issue not a forum issue.

But they are ignoring this griefing for longer now.

irrelevant!! The mods are ignoringt these threads cause it's not supposed to be here.

cor, hou je nou verdomme rustig!
straks pakken ze jou nog, en dan?

My personal understanding of the rules: Invaders are allowed to make a few TACTICAL ejects of natives to remain in power. To repeatedly eject a native for the sole purpose of causing grief is... griefing! (Duh!)

Anyway, I'm no mod, so perhaps they feel differently about it. Or maybe they still need to get to your complaint of repetitive non-tactical (griefing) ejections. You DID file that as a complaint, did you not?

Ballotonia

My personal understanding of the rules: Invaders are allowed to make a few TACTICAL ejects of natives to remain in power. To repeatedly eject a native for the sole purpose of causing grief is... griefing! (Duh!)

Anyway, I'm no mod, so perhaps they feel differently about it. Or maybe they still need to get to your complaint of repetitive non-tactical (griefing) ejections. You DID file that as a complaint, did you not?

Ballotonia

What is er so tactical about ejecting a non UN member?

well, just calm down first, and when a mod gets his lazy butt online, we'll ask, okay?
i'm sure there is something we can do, but you really need to calm down..

irrelevant!! The mods are ignoringt these threads cause it's not supposed to be here.

Actually, I do appreciate this being posted here because it clarifies what is or is not allowed by invaders. At least, if a Mod would provide a clarification it would be.

A complaint should be filed using the getting help page. This does not preclude there being a topic on this as well to discuss what is happening. As far as I know there is no exact ruling to cover this situation, so a mod ruling on this would be uncertain.

Ballotonia

A complaint should be filed using the getting help page. This does not preclude there being a topic on this as well to discuss what is happening. As far as I know there is no exact ruling to cover this situation, so a mod ruling on this would be uncertain.

Ballotonia

I did file a complaint in getting help, but mods always tell me that it can take weeks before they see that. That's why it is here too.

My puppet has been sent to the RR for the fourth time now :evil:

Nice temperature outside, don't you think?

My puppet has been sent to the RR for the fourth time now :evil:

Move back in immediately, and keep a log of it happening.

Ballotonia

well, there are 2 mods online now, wonder how long it'll take for them to see this, and respond ;)

I understand how that must be frustrating but i don't think it is illegal and it is getting annoying with all the threads called Monte Carlo Griefed! Please don't post them

Emperor Matthuis

:evil:
:x
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2 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz barred UN Delegate access to Regional Control.
2 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz updated the World Factbook entry.
10 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
15 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
16 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
16 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.
30 minutes ago: The Holy Empire of Wodka departed this region for USSR
32 minutes ago: The Holy Empire of Wodka arrived from Poland.
32 minutes ago: The Holy Welsh Empire of Emperor Matthuis departed this region for The Rejected Realms
33 minutes ago: The Holy Welsh Empire of Emperor Matthuis arrived from Monte Carlo.
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This whole charade qualifies as flamebaiting also :evil:

Actually, Ballotonia, you're incorrect.

Making a few tactical ejections - whether UN or not (and Corinthe, everyone knows you, and to be honest, if I invaded a region, I would be sure to tactically eject any nation of yours - take it as a compliment :wink:) - is most definately not illegal. How else are invaders to hold a conquered region? Even ejecting the same nation time and again is not griefing because you continue to put yourself in the same position. You must understand, when you move back into the region, you are opening yourself up to being ejected again.

It does not constitute griefing in this case. Sorry.



And, once again:

To everyone else who feels it necessary to speculate on Mod rulings, please dont. If you're not a GM, please dont post your opinions on matters requiring a GM response. Posting factual evidence is OK, posting opinions is not.

:evil:

He is humiliating me Neut. You better delete me now, because I will not stop! He is griefing me personal. You obviously didn't read anything posted here!

YOU continue to allow yourself to be ejected...it's not his fault you keep coming back. If you're going to open yourself up to continued ejection, it's not griefing.

If he were doing so with many, many other nations, that'd be one thing. He's doing so with one. Hardly grieifng in my opinion.


Want to move back into your region? I'd suggest either using a puppet, or having some friends assist you in dethroning the new delegate.

YOU continue to allow yourself to be ejected...it's not his fault you keep coming back. If you're going to open yourself up to continued ejection, it's not griefing.

If he were doing so with many, many other nations, that'd be one thing. He's doing so with one. Hardly grieifng in my opinion.


Want to move back into your region? I'd suggest either using a puppet, or having some friends assist you in dethroning the new delegate.

I don't know it anymore. He would like to have a Francos position there. I am awfully tired of this game, because I don't understand the rules anymore. Don't you see that he is humiliating me. He even stated it in ther hq and has send me a TG saying that he is doing this to humiliate me :(

And, Corinthe, you're letting him. You're giving him plenty of opportunity. Regroup, and then rejoin the fight for this region with some powerful allies.

Asking me to delete someone for wielding his power in the manner in which he's doing so is hardly fair. He has every right to tactically eject a native or two, and to continue doing so if that native continues to return.

dude, let it drop, sputnik told you the rules and why what is happening is not griefing. Go find a new region to join.

And, Corinthe, you're letting him. You're giving him plenty of opportunity. Regroup, and then rejoin the fight for this region with some powerful allies.

Asking me to delete someone for wielding his power in the manner in which he's doing so is hardly fair. He has every right to tactically eject a native or two, and to continue doing so if that native continues to return.

NO!!!!!!!!! Just tell him to stop humiliating me. Don't you understand that this has nothing to do with Monte Carlo anymore. :evil:

Lower your tone, young lady.

Stop giving him the opportunity to "humiliate" you. Dont come crying to the Mods because you dont like the way the game is going. Fight back! Take the region back, now who would that humiliate?

that's easy. Stop trying to re-enter the region and he'll stop trying to humiliate you.

No! :evil:

zeg, das wel een ideetje, dan kun je ze er zelf lekker uit schoppen ;)

Then dont come here asking the Mods to do your dirty work for you.

Then dont come here asking the Mods to do your dirty work for you.

Lol, you have never done anything for me. I have always reported stuff for other's. Never for myself! :evil:

yes, but when you post for yourself, it seems that you are in the wrong. Leave poor sputniks alone. The mod is only doing the free job any mod of any forum is supposed to do. Interpret the rules and make a ruling. This time it hasn't gone in your favour, tough luck.

This has nothing to do with who's reporting what, or who's involved.

This has to do with an invader employing a legal tactic, and you giving him opportunity to do what you're complaining he's doing. If you dont like what's going on in this region, YOU do something about it. It's not against the rules, and thus, not the Mod's responsibility to do intervene.


Exetonia, this is between Corinthe and myself at this point. Please keep your comments to yourself. Thanks.

ok sputniks, decision respected. Signing out.

I would not eject Corinthe out of the region. But the thing is that she spammed the civil HQ with a dutch chat with Crazy Girl. She entered my region with a motto "ENDORSE CORINTHE-UNENDORSE FISZ". She made posts about Monte Carlo's "griefing", wanted to maliciously have my person deleted. I have grew tired of her, and I am unhappy with the fact that I must always unban her.

what? you speak your native language there, and even mess around with a translater (now that's funny)

so why can't we speak dutch there?

what? you speak your native language there, and even mess around with a translater (now that's funny)

so why can't we speak dutch there?

Because he's the current delegate, and says so.


Everyone back off.

I would not eject Corinthe out of the region. But the thing is that she spammed the civil HQ with a dutch chat with Crazy Girl. She entered my region with a motto "ENDORSE CORINTHE-UNENDORSE FISZ". She made posts about Monte Carlo's "griefing", wanted to maliciously have my person deleted. I have grew tired of her, and I am unhappy with the fact that I must always unban her.

I will keep on coming back! It is my region too, and I am allowed to speak my oqwn language there. I have never flamed at you, but you have done everything to make me angry. Now I am angry, so you have to deal with it! I will keep on returning, because it my right to do so! You are just objecting my use of native language, I don't know any rule about using that?!

Everyone back off.

PLEASE LOCK

neut, i got a question for you, is it okay if i telegram it to you?

Everyone back off.

PLEASE LOCK

I'll back off, if you stop griefing my nation Hideout! :evil:
Just don't eject her anymore, and don't break any rules!

I will stop! I say the truth! :wink:

And Francos Spain is a very good man, a role model.

I will stop! I say the truth! :wink:

And Francos Spain is a very good man, a role model.

Well, if you like to have a region with me in it, you are in for the long ride. I am there longer than you are, and I will be still there after yuo are long gone. Unless the mods give you the right to eject me and password the region :evil:

My personal understanding of the rules: Invaders are allowed to make a few TACTICAL ejects of natives to remain in power. To repeatedly eject a native for the sole purpose of causing grief is... griefing! (Duh!)

Anyway, I'm no mod, so perhaps they feel differently about it. Or maybe they still need to get to your complaint of repetitive non-tactical (griefing) ejections. You DID file that as a complaint, did you not?

Ballotonia

What is er so tactical about ejecting a non UN member?

It is a way of keeping certain disruptive natives of the region from being disruptive for a period of time.

Honestly Corinthe, did you really have to start ANOTHER topic on this?

Actually, Ballotonia, you're incorrect.

Making a few tactical ejections - whether UN or not (and Corinthe, everyone knows you, and to be honest, if I invaded a region, I would be sure to tactically eject any nation of yours - take it as a compliment :wink:) - is most definately not illegal. How else are invaders to hold a conquered region? Even ejecting the same nation time and again is not griefing because you continue to put yourself in the same position. You must understand, when you move back into the region, you are opening yourself up to being ejected again.

It does not constitute griefing in this case. Sorry.

And, once again:

To everyone else who feels it necessary to speculate on Mod rulings, please dont. If you're not a GM, please dont post your opinions on matters requiring a GM response. Posting factual evidence is OK, posting opinions is not.

Ok... Not a ruling I was expecting. So Fisz can basically deny her normal access to her own region by continuously ejecting her again and again. And when she finally gives up and there's one less native in the region, can he then proceed to follow the same strategy with the next native?

Did you read this part?

Received: 1 day ago
HideOut, I don't like you. And since the rules permit me to eject a native for strategical matters and unbanning it afterwards, I will do so, for the simple strategy of humiliation.

Do NEVER humiliate the Atlantic Alliance and it's members, as you have done in the past, CORINTHE.

I don't see how this qualifies as a tactical ejection. It serves no purpose other than to grief the native in question. It's actually done with that specific purpose in mind.


Also, if I'm personally interested in a ruling or clarification thereof, and I wouldn't be allowed to post in the thread for anything other than providing information, does this mean I should start a new thread for what is essentially the same topic? Seems silly to me to do so, but I'll gladly do so if you wish.

Ballotonia

I will stop! I say the truth! :wink:

And Francos Spain is a very good man, a role model.
so much for that..

1 minute ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
5 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
5 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
5 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.

Notice the smilee :wink:

yes, i can imagine you smiling..

Seconds ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
Seconds ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
Seconds ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.
2 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
3 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
3 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
3 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.
6 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
10 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
11 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms

another francos? anothe pacific? *makes popcorn*

god just leave the little boys with thier toys; they'll tire of them eventually.

Change Region
This is the place to move your nation from one region to another. A fleet of military-grade choppers will fly in and physically transport HideOut to a better location.

[Create a New Region]


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Move to an existing region:

The Colony of HideOut is banned from Monte Carlo.

Find the region you want to move to, then click the link that says, "Move your nation to (the region) today!".

[List all regions]

HideOut, you can create a new region :wink:

You're not currently banned.


Ballotonia, it is one thing to ask for clarification. In your case, you were attempting to provide clarification. As you are not a GM, and this requires a GM's clarification, I asked that you not attempt to provide that clarification. Is that REALLY so much to ask?

8 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
8 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.


So this is what that ruling comes down to: two people endlessly repeating steps until one of them gives up doing something. At least in chess there's a rule to prevent this from ruining a game. It seems Fisz decided to break the loop by not immediately unbanning HideOut. For now at least. Now I'd like to hear Neut argue how that is legal as well ;)

Ballotonia

You're not currently banned.


Ballotonia, it is one thing to ask for clarification. In your case, you were attempting to provide clarification. As you are not a GM, and this requires a GM's clarification, I asked that you not attempt to provide that clarification. Is that REALLY so much to ask?

I am banned, but you simply don't ssee it on the screen: Here:

This is the place to move your nation from one region to another. A fleet of military-grade choppers will fly in and physically transport HideOut to a better location.

[Create a New Region]


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Move to an existing region:

The Colony of HideOut is banned from Monte Carlo.

Find the region you want to move to, then click the link that says, "Move your nation to (the region) today!".

[List all regions]

And now...

1 minute ago: The Colony of HideOut arrived from The Rejected Realms.
2 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz removed The Colony of HideOut from the regional ban list.
12 minutes ago: The Colony of HideOut departed this region for The Rejected Realms
12 minutes ago: The Anti-Corinthe Inquisition of Fisz ejected The Colony of HideOut from the region.


wash - rinse - repeat - wash - rinse - repeat - wash - ....

Funny...I'm looking in the Mod Centre, and it doesnt show you as being banned.

Although, at this point, I'm becoming somewhat inclined to allow the ban as you are causing the regional happenings to be spammed. Your continual return to the region, knowing full well what will happen, is causing the regional happenings to be spammed.

Although, at this point, I'm becoming somewhat inclined to allow the ban as you are causing the regional happenings to be spammed. Your continual return to the region, knowing full well what will happen, is causing the regional happenings to be spammed.

Likewise: Fisz is spamming the regional happenings as well, ejecting HideOut knowing fuill well she'll return.

FYI: In Chess the rule is that whomever started the loop must break it (after three loops maximum).

Also: Each step in this loop causes Fisz to put three entries on the Regional Happenings, and HideOut one...

Ballotonia

Funny...I'm looking in the Mod Centre, and it doesnt show you as being banned.

Although, at this point, I'm becoming somewhat inclined to allow the ban as you are causing the regional happenings to be spammed. Your continual return to the region, knowing full well what will happen, is causing the regional happenings to be spammed.

Lol, no suprise here. You may do what you want, but you are obviously not helping me or anyone. Actually you are tyhinking of banning a native :? Lol, this is going to far, since I didn't do anything to provoke this

Why would you punnish me?

Quoting Ballotonia: "So Fisz can basically deny her normal access to her own region by continuously ejecting her again and again. And when she finally gives up and there's one less native in the region, can he then proceed to follow the same strategy with the next native?"

He's right, isn't he? At least, to my opinion. I think his reasoning makes sence.


"Ballotonia, it is one thing to ask for clarification. In your case, you were attempting to provide clarification. As you are not a GM, and this requires a GM's clarification, I asked that you not attempt to provide that clarification. Is that REALLY so much to ask?"

It really isn't necessary to be pissed of at Ballotonia, he's just saying his opinion. Quelle reaction,.. Ik ben de mod, dus ik weet alles beter. (waar is dat vertaalprogramma of die nederlandse mod gebleven)


"Your continual return to the region, knowing full well what will happen, is causing the regional happenings to be spammed."

Com'on, you know who's poking fun at the rules... and it isn't corinthe.

Because you've been given other options, and you are the one provoking the ejections. Regardless of who is doing the ejection, and who is caused to put more entries on the regional happenings, You, Corinthe, are the one instigating it. You enter the region, knowing full well you will be ejected yet again, thus, causing spam on the regional happenings.

Ballotonia, please, stay out of this. I've already stated, this is between Corinthe, Fisz, and myself.

I didn't talk. All I did was returning to Monace. You did a good job to help griefers all over NationStates. I'll send an e-mail to [violet], that you are helping invaders to keep natives out of the region!

And I'll reply to the inquiry by stating that I was attempting to allow that what you are doing is spam, and you know full well what you're causing.

Quit whining Corinthe.

since I didn't do anything to provoke this

You started threads concerning the "griefing" of Monte Carlo, wanting me to get deleted.

Afterwards you maliciously spammed the civil HQ with Dutch talk along with your friend CrazyGirl.

Your friend Crazy Girl has 150 puppets, and I had to ban them one after the other until I reported her.

You came to the region with a nation called "Corinthe for Delegate" with a motto "Endorse Corinthe, Unendorse Fisz".

You do not know the rules, yet you consider yourself as always right.

THEREFORE you shall be silenced by force. I will unban you sooner or later, but this will happen again if you give me a hard time.

"You came to the region with a nation called "Corinthe for Delegate" with a motto "Endorse Corinthe, Unendorse Fisz". "

Wrong, that's an old nation of mine. I once created it when Corinthe ran for delegacy in the pacific. Now, I recycled it, and I replaced "Franco" in the motto by "Fisz". I hope that isn't forbidden, is it? Otherwise,i'll change it.. By the way, my nation didn't do anything;

"You came to the region with a nation called "Corinthe for Delegate" with a motto "Endorse Corinthe, Unendorse Fisz". "

Wrong, that's an old nation of mine. I once created it when Corinthe ran for delegacy in the pacific. Now, I recycled it, and I replaced "Franco" in the motto by "Fisz". I hope that isn't forbidden, is it? Otherwise,i'll change it.. By the way, my nation didn't do anything;

No, it's not illegal.

It's not illegal but highly unappropriate in the region where I am the delegate.

And I'll reply to the inquiry by stating that I was attempting to allow that what you are doing is spam, and you know full well what you're causing.

Quit whining Corinthe.

Darn e-mail didn't work. Some POP3 error :cry: You have always been agains me Neut. I think it's time to stop this game. What you did now was definitely biased. His constantly ejecting was perfectly alright and my returning is called spam. Don't you ever say again that you are not biased. You never liked me, and you were always on my skin. The e-mail was not send to [violet] because of some POP3 error, but in my heart I know you are wrong in this. If you just simply said to him that he had to stop ejecting me, you would have had two happy players. But no, you decided to let your bias take over and let the invaders band the evil native Hideout and keep her on the banlist, because her desperate attempts to stay a native of Monte Carlo ware abviously malicious and should be stopped immideately, so the nice people, who did nothing bad, than only ejecting a native could live in peace, and have a new strategy for the next invasion.

Corinthe, I have nothing against you. I am not showing bias. I am merely saying that both sides are at fault.

To imply that I should always rule in your favor is ridiculous, and to believe that had I told Fisz to stop everything would have been kosher is incredulous.

Go back and reread my first post to you, and then follow the thread through it's progression.

Please. No sentiments in rulings. Thank you.

Corinthe, I have nothing against you. I am not showing bias. I am merely saying that both sides are at fault.

To imply that I should always rule in your favor is ridiculous, and to believe that had I told Fisz to stop everything would have been kosher is incredulous.

Go back and reread my first post to you, and then follow the thread through it's progression.

But being unbiased, you decided to punish me. You don't care that I just deperately wanted to return, you simply call it spam. That is a good example to all future invaders. Heck, I learned something too. It is okay to eject natives, just make sure that it looks like spamming, and Neut will say it's okay to keep them on the banlist. You just want me to invade, yes? Or create a new region. Well Monte Carlo has more natives, are you gonna tell them that too? You know darn well, that if I decide to take it back by force, he would simply password the region, or have you forgotten how to stop invasions? Heck no, Hideout is a native, and has the right to return to Monte Carlo!

Yes please. Organise an attack and invade Monte Carlo to get rid of the bad, bad, bad Atlantic Alliance. Now THIS would be fun. I will unban you, but please. Stop complaining to moderators and INVADE ME! This is why I am still stuck on NationStates: INVASIONS! :)

Yes please. Organise an attack and invade Monte Carlo to get rid of the bad, bad, bad Atlantic Alliance. Now THIS would be fun. I will unban you, but please. Stop complaining to moderators and INVADE ME! This is why I am still stuck on NationStates: INVASIONS! :)

I am not going to invade. I wait for the ruling of [violet] and tone a bit down on my gameplay here. Obviously mods are biased, and there is nothing I can do about it. Laugh all you want, I am tired of this. On the end, I will be native of Mone Carlo again, and you found a brand new strategy to exploit.

I never said you werent a native, nor that you couldnt return. I simply told you to quit provoking the situation. Now, if that's being biased, because I didnt rule that invaders couldnt even eject natives, well, then perhaps you need to take step back and look at the big picture.

You know Corinthe, you could take revenge and invade Polska...

I never said you werent a native, nor that you couldnt return. I simply told you to quit provoking the situation. Now, if that's being biased, because I didnt rule that invaders couldnt even eject natives, well, then perhaps you need to take step back and look at the big picture.

Well, the big picture is, that you made a 180 on the ruling. I just want to get back to Monte Carlo. I bet that tomorrow I will still be in the RR, and 4 or 5 day from now, I still be in the RR. The return of natives to their home region is completely in the spirit of the game. Having their return barred by a mod is definitely not a rule, and also not in the spirit of the game. That my movements spammed the regional happenings of the RR can be said of Francos also, but again you rule agains the vicim in favour of the ruler! But than again, Hideout is just a puppet right? You showed being biased when you stated that you would do the same if you had Corinthe in your region! I am not a bad girl. I am just very active. I don't grief. I spam very minimum. I don't lie, and don't flame. I came close sometimes, but I am just very emotional about wrong doings.

Darn server will never let me post this, but at least I got it off my chest. Btw, I did send that e-mail. It was that stupid period at the end of it :twisted: I didn't send the e-mail to get you punished. I just hope to get back to Monte Carlo as soon as possible!

-.-

I don't believe Neut has actually given a ruling on this... just warned Corinthe that she should be careful to avoid being guilty of flooding the regional happenings.

I made no 180.

I stated that if I were an invader, I wouldnt want you in my region. Mainly because of all your connections. Same goes for any other player with connections to anti-invader invasion groups.

You can attempt to turn this into a personal thing, however, the fact remains that Fisz was ejecting you from the region, as is his perogative. Ejecting one player is hardly griefing, and doing so over and over again is hardly griefing when that same player continues to reperform the same action over and over and over with no rest.

-.-

I don't believe Neut has actually given a ruling on this... just warned Corinthe that she should be careful to avoid being guilty of flooding the regional happenings.

And baared the return of a native, because the invaders wouldn't stop ejecting!

I made no 180.

I stated that if I were an invader, I wouldnt want you in my region. Mainly because of all your connections. Same goes for any other player with connections to anti-invader invasion groups.

You can attempt to turn this into a personal thing, however, the fact remains that Fisz was ejecting you from the region, as is his perogative. Ejecting one player is hardly griefing, and doing so over and over again is hardly griefing when that same player continues to reperform the same action over and over and over with no rest.

It has become personal, when Fisz changed hid prequisite of his nation, and many times stated that he did all this to huliate me. You helping him to get rid of me, doesn't stop me. It only makes things harder!

Well technically, as there is no written rule on this kind of thing, Fisz is inside the rules.
You're not allowed to leave a native on the ban list. However, Fisz doesn't want Corinthe in the region because of all her connections, thus he can eject her.
There is also no written rule that forbids the ejectee from returning, so Corinthe can return if she likes. However, there is a rule against flooding the regional happenings list be repeatedly performing an action. So Corinthe should be careful...
Neut isn't saying she can't return, just that she shouldn't just return immediately and repetitively.

When I left this thread earlier this afternoon, there was some dispute over whether HideOut has been banned. I can confirm this now.

Monte Carlo Regional Control (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=display_nation/page=region_control/region=monte_carlo)

Incidentally:

33 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks departed this region for The Guardian Patriot Alliance
35 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks arrived from The Guardian Patriot Alliance.
37 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks departed this region for The Guardian Patriot Alliance
39 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks arrived from The Guardian Patriot Alliance.
40 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks departed this region for The Guardian Patriot Alliance
41 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks arrived from The Guardian Patriot Alliance.
41 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks departed this region for The Guardian Patriot Alliance
41 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks arrived from The Guardian Patriot Alliance.
42 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks departed this region for The Guardian Patriot Alliance
42 minutes ago: The United States of The Bonny Bonny Banks arrived from The Guardian Patriot Alliance.

IMHO, that is indisputably spam.

Well technically, as there is no written rule on this kind of thing, Fisz is inside the rules.
You're not allowed to leave a native on the ban list. However, Fisz doesn't want Corinthe in the region because of all her connections, thus he can eject her.
There is also no written rule that forbids the ejectee from returning, so Corinthe can return if she likes. However, there is a rule against flooding the regional happenings list be repeatedly performing an action. So Corinthe should be careful...
Neut isn't saying she can't return, just that she shouldn't just return immediately and repetitively.

I am banned. That is not a fair action after an invasion. If he would just have let me be, he probably would have been ejected by me again, but that's all within the rules. I was just trying to get into my own region.

yeah, neut said in some other thread it was okay for fisz to leave hideout on the banlist..

I want to make it clear that I stated that in this instance, there are somewhat extenuating circumstances - namely the unending moving of Hideout back to the region, knowing it would be kicked.

I want to make it clear that I stated that in this instance, there are somewhat extenuating circumstances - namely the unending moving of Hideout back to the region, knowing it would be kicked.

And being biased, it never came up in your head that there was the unending ejections, knowing that Hideout would come back anyway, as she has learned was the right thing to do. It never came in your head that maybe there was a compromise possible, in which both sides could be happy. You are able to twist rules, but you are not able to make compromises!

And how long should I stay on the banlist now, knowing that Fisz is not gonna leave?

I want to make it clear that I stated that in this instance, there are somewhat extenuating circumstances - namely the unending moving of Hideout back to the region, knowing it would be kicked.

I want to make it clear that I stated that in this instance, there are somewhat extenuating circumstances - namely the unending moving of Hideout back to the region, knowing it would be kicked.

Sure, but when will I be able to get back to Monte Carlo? You're not gonna tell me, that I have to wait until Fisz leaves, right? He'll probably (80% chance) put another mate on the place, and nothing will change for me. As soon as I say something, they will eject me, claiming to be native also and that I was spamming. You're not doing one budge in my direction, I know enough. :x

Counter-invade. Take the region back. I suggested that a long time ago.

Myrth, you post here?! :o

Myrth, you post here?! :o

Yase.

Counter-invade. Take the region back. I suggested that a long time ago.

Yeah, yeah, I know that you sugested that. Those AA guys are cowards, he prbably will password the region as soon as he smells something. I have never invaded a region before, and the leader I know are all mouth.

exciting. it's another pacific. look at what Francos started. i hope he's proud. wonder what will happen next? do we just let the game be taken over by these kinds of people while the mods ask us to just reinvade?

and backed by the AA. interesting.

Actually, Ballotonia, you're incorrect.

Making a few tactical ejections - whether UN or not (and Corinthe, everyone knows you, and to be honest, if I invaded a region, I would be sure to tactically eject any nation of yours - take it as a compliment :wink:) - is most definately not illegal. How else are invaders to hold a conquered region? Even ejecting the same nation time and again is not griefing because you continue to put yourself in the same position. You must understand, when you move back into the region, you are opening yourself up to being ejected again.

It does not constitute griefing in this case. Sorry.



And, once again:

To everyone else who feels it necessary to speculate on Mod rulings, please dont. If you're not a GM, please dont post your opinions on matters requiring a GM response. Posting factual evidence is OK, posting opinions is not.[emphasis added by me]

I was just wondering what all "Tactical Ejection" covers. I was always under the impression that it was to clear the endorsements from opposing potential delegates. If it can cover other things, then why aren't tactical bans allowed? The only thing that is changed by a nation leaving a region and coming back are that all it's endorsements are lost, so there is not really a tactical reason to eject a non-UN nation.

Also, it seems to me that the region for corinthe's puppet's ejection was "You are corinthe's puppet." Maybe I missed something, but is there another tactical reason for her ejection?

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This is getting funny.

Counter-invade. Take the region back. I suggested that a long time ago.

Yeah, yeah, I know that you sugested that. Those AA guys are cowards, he prbably will password the region as soon as he smells something. I have never invaded a region before, and the leader I know are all mouth.

Humph. How so? Least I'm smarter than the FPA/RFP/RRA/PAFBLBBLDBBL. Idiots.

Also, Neut is right. I know my status in the AA will make you scream "BIAS!!!11", but I'm saying this as a player of the Nationstates game.

Also, it seems to me that the region for corinthe's puppet's ejection was "You are corinthe's puppet." Maybe I missed something, but is there another tactical reason for her ejection?



She was also very disruptive in the region civil hq before being banned.

If I were invading a region, I also would not want Corinthe in the region. Not because of her connections, because I laugh at her friends. But because she's friggin relentless.

I want to make it clear that I stated that in this instance, there are somewhat extenuating circumstances - namely the unending moving of Hideout back to the region, knowing it would be kicked.
If Hideout were to stay out of the region for a length of time, then return, how long would this length of time have to be in order for an ejection to become unacceptable (assuming that Hideout doesn't provoke ejection in any manner beyond returning to the region, and that it is unbanned immediately afterward)? A one hour gap? Three hours? Six? Twelve? 24? Never?

If the answer is a finite length of time, then how is that any different to leaving the nation banned for that length of time after the first ejection? If the answer is never, doesn't that effectively negate the rule against permanently banning natives? A ruling against Hideout would seem to set a precedent which would allow what is effectively exclusion of specific natives from a region for a certain period of time, which would appear to conflict with "natives must be free to come and go as they please".

While I am generally in favour of "don't complain, take it back with a counter-invasion", I think that applying an "invaders can't ban natives, as long as those natives are willing to stay out anyway" ruling is going too far.

Corinthe is a special case. Usually invaders must unban the ejectees automatically. But this is a special case, so there is a special treatment.

Corinthe was being disruptive before her ejection. She then returned and was immediately ejected. The precedent I'm attempting to set is that natives can't grief the invaders - what Corinthe was doing would be considered griefing if the shoe were on the other foot, would it not?

The idea behind the "natives cannot remain banned" ruling was to allow natives a chance to retake their region from the invaders - not to allow natives to do as Corinthe has done.

There's a fine line here, and this is an unusual circumstance. Had Corinthe instead taken it upon herself to rally her friends and retake her region, rather than come whining to the mods, attempting to have the Mods intervene to get rid of a problem she didnt want to have to deal with herself, the ruling here might have been different.

Remember, every ruling is subjective, and not exactly set in stone. There can be very many different situations that cause those previous rules to become obselete, or to not really apply.

Ultimately, I ruled that Fisz should be allowed to continue to keep Corinthe out of the region because she was stirring up trouble in the Regional Headquarters. Had she been attempting to lead a counter-invasion on the Regional Headquarters, that would be a different story.

My personal understanding of the rules: Invaders are allowed to make a few TACTICAL ejects of natives to remain in power. To repeatedly eject a native for the sole purpose of causing grief is... griefing! (Duh!)

So you would fault the invaders for her continuing to come into a region she is not wanted in? If I understand this correctly, she keeps entering a region she knows she is going to be kicked out of. It sounds like a problem, but not with the invaders. I guess the inverse would be she is actually complaining that she is not kept on the ban list.

Did I read this wrong, this would be beyond wacky.


I won’t post much on the situation (beyond the wacky comment) I feel Neut dealt with succinctly.

Glad, but surprised the dialogue has continued this long, as it seems thus far to be the same issue posted over and over again. Active dialogue can be fair, and encourage sense of community. Just don’t be surprised if nothing changes.

That said, Neut has stated that facts are allowed if not opinions, so I will try to add my voice in hopes that this is simply an misunderstanding in which you simply did not understand things as was said by someone else.

As to being kicked then removed from the ban list, I already stated it would be odd to blame them for your decision to go back. More importantly though, the rules. It is perfectly legal for an invader to kick out a few nations. It is not necessary for you to know their strategy, as you suggest there would be no strategic advantage to kicking out a non-UN nation. They are allowed to kick you out. But they are not allowed to keep you on the ban list.

If you want to petition Max that invaders should be able to kick out natives and keep them on the ban list, go ahead, but you likely want get far. It is to your advantage that you are allowed back in (though not so much to your advantage you keep going back in). If you want to give invaders the power to permanently kick out natives, sure go for it. It will be an uphill battle and will likely be a cause of more grief in the game, but as an invader would it provide us more of an advantage, sure.

Again, Neut, not trying to step on your shoes by posting any opinion, saw your request not to, but you said facts were okay, and simply trying to see if I can help communication by approaching from a different direction…


~Ack

Sorry, can resist anymore!


Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.



STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah...that's a good way to get deleted Hideout. :roll:

Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.




The day that a native, thant desperately tries to return to his own invaded region becomes a spammer, is the day that I stop playing this game. But I am not going away without this little message to the moderators that think that this is justice!

STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Okay, I'll make this easy.

I will add HideOut to the banlist. That way, Fisz doesn't grief, and HideOut (aka Corinth) doesn't get smacked for, honestly, spamming regional happenings.

--Scolo

Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.




The day that a native, that desperately tries to return to his own invaded region becomes a spammer, is the day that I stop playing this game. But I am not going away without this little message to the moderators that think that this is justice!

STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.




The day that a native, that desperately tries to return to his own invaded region becomes a spammer, is the day that I stop playing this game. But I am not going away without this little message to the moderators that think that this is justice!

STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.




The day that a native, that desperately tries to return to his own invaded region becomes a spammer, is the day that I stop playing this game. But I am not going away without this little message to the moderators that think that this is justice!

STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Okay, Corinth, now you're spamming with puppets.

--Scolo

Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.




The day that a native, that desperately tries to return to his own invaded region becomes a spammer, is the day that I stop playing this game. But I am not going away without this little message to the moderators that think that this is justice!

STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.




The day that a native, that desperately tries to return to his own invaded region becomes a spammer, is the day that I stop playing this game. But I am not going away without this little message to the moderators that think that this is justice!

STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

STOP SPAMMING WITH PUPPETS, NOW!

Received: 61 minutes ago Don't spam regional happening boards, please.




The day that a native, that desperately tries to return to his own invaded region becomes a spammer, is the day that I stop playing this game. But I am not going away without this little message to the moderators that think that this is justice!

STFU!!!!!!!!!!!!

I never thought I'd see the day... Corinthe Klamathing.

FORUMBANNED

~Evil Empress [Rep Prod] the Forum God