NationStates Jolt Archive

Mornin all!

I've just had a nose through some of the threads on Moderation and stumbled across the one about RedSoviets deletion. I was quite surprised to see it, as he seemed quite a pleasant guy...

Reading more into it, I found that everyone who took part in the 'Invasion' thread had received a warning for 'malicious intent to spam.'

I'm curious.. I've looked in the rules and at th sticky at the top of the page and I can't find a ban on this. Yes, SPAMMING is forbidden, but intent to spam? I can't see how anyone on 'the list' could have forseen the warning and that maybe it's a bit harsh, given as there were no Mod comments at the time suggesting it could lead to a warning.

As for the 'invasion' itself.. I don't think it was Spam. It WAS a roleplay, all be it a comedy one (i.e. it was on a theme, there were characters, scenes and as much co-hesion as a comedy roleplay is ever likely to have!!)

Ok, I accept that it didn't fit in with the 'Nationstates Universe'... but to be honest, I personally wasn't aware that it had to, to be considered roleplaying on the NS forum. I suspect this is true of most of the participants, all of whom are General regulars.

It wasn't even really intended as a pop at those on NS.. they were welcome to join in, in the spirit of it.

I would be grateful for other (non-flaming, baiting, spamming) comments, particularly from Mods, in the hope that this issue can be looked at again, and perhaps the warning recinded.

Continuing with this foolhardy exercise will be considered malicious spam. All of you who have signed up... good job, you've just signed up for "malicious intent to spam" warnings.

We will not stand for this.

Thinking more about this, I'm further confused... I don't see how it is fair to say 'if you continue , you will get a warning'.. and then in the next sentence actually GIVE the warning.. it doesn't leave any time for the players involved to stop?!?

Hmm, I hae never agreed with the Intent to commit a crime as intent can be ruled as pretty much anything, you could say a kid in a car is intending to run a red light just because he gets into a car,

if someone hasnt actually commited the crime punishing them for it seems very 1984, (in the book the main character mentions how a newvous tic can get you reeducated because the tic proves you intend to do somethig wrong)

well that is my $2.15 worth,

I've been on the sidelines of this, but let me clarify a little.

If the 'invasion' had kept to General forum, where such antics are accepted, I doubt anybody would have had a problem. The problem was that certain players tried to actually drag it from General to the Nationstates roleplay forums. Now, General forum roleplays are all fine and dandy in the General forum. (Which, by the way, Spoffin, no matter how many people DO cry for the removal of the General forum, that ain't happening.) The Nationstates or International Incidents forums are NOT the place for General forum comedy roleplays. NS and II are for roleplays about nations. General is a place for roleplays about a forum invasion.

After the invasion thread(s) had been kicked over the General where they belonged, some people seemed hell-bent on continueing the invasion, from what I had seen. Now, as a mod, if a bunch of people in the General forum want to roleplay out taking over one of the other forums, that's all fine. When that roleplay starts to cease being roleplay (in this case, actually attempting the 'invasion'), then it becomes spam, as it can interfere with the nation roleplays going on, and/or clog those forums. Spam means more work for me to do in order to try and keep some sense of order to this madhouse.

I saw a few comments about "if we can't have our threads there, we can drag theirs here!", which, just frankly, smacks of "Dude, let's go spam and hijack the NS roleplayers' threads so that they get moved to General!" Again, a tactic that would ultimately fail, but generate more work for the mods, having to split or delete the spam posts from roleplay threads. Work that is quite a pain in the keister, especially on days where the forums are being uncooperative and plagueing everyone (mods included) with invalid_session and "This page could not be found" errors.

Anyways, that's my two arpean yen :wink:

~Evil Empress Rep Prod the Game Mod

But the thread where the following quote was located began in General and remained in General:Continuing with this foolhardy exercise will be considered malicious spam. All of you who have signed up... good job, you've just signed up for "malicious intent to spam" warnings.

We will not stand for this.

If we're being warned for posting on this thread ( http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=100643&start=140 ), then we haven't done anything wrong, as the RP on that thread was in General. In fact, it was my understanding that Scolo warned us because we were posting an RP in General.

And none of that excuses the belligerent tone of Scolo's warning.

:evil:

My observation is that Scolo's warning was issued after the invasion had taken place, not before. Thus, from his perspective, he was no doubt issuing a warning for spamming to those who had already taken part. Unless there is more to it, I am tempted to consider the "mailicious intent" business an unfortunate turn of phrase, which should not detract from the fact that what may be considered to be spamming had been perfomed by those players already.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

I'll try to clarify some parts

First of all from the thread in moderation about why the recon thread was moved:

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=100712&highlight=


I didn't move it, but it would seem to me to be quite clear. That was neither an OOC discussion of matters directly related to NS (and NS-RP), nor be an RP in the NS universe, and thus, clearly general fodder.

It was moved for the reasons sal stated. There is a big difference between RP and random people saying random things seemingly at random. Get that? Sounds funny out loud. Oh well.

I saw a few comments about "if we can't have our threads there, we can drag theirs here!", which, just frankly, smacks of "Dude, let's go spam and hijack the NS roleplayers' threads so that they get moved to General!"

I believe I wrote something along the lines Reploid quotes and I'll try to clearfy that part. I did that after I had read Karmabaijan's explanation about the difference between RP and random etc...

EDIT: I went find the exact quote:It seems like we are given a weapon by the Gods!


Take a look in the thread in the mod forum, we now have a legitimate way of plundering NS. If we can't go over there, we'll just have to get their threads over here... :twisted:

I don't know how anyone will interpret what I write, how can I? What I definately did not do, say or mean was that I or anybody else was going to spam any threads. On the contrary. I was thinking of helping the mods in this case by letting them know about some threads in NS where random people are saying random things seemingly at random.

How can you judge people for what you think they will do? What if you are dead wrong about your assumptions?

None of all this nonsense would ever have happened if the recon thread in NS had been left alone and not kicked back to general. No interference with RPs took place, most of the players involved had logged off when the thread was moved due to the fact that it was friday evening/night in Europe at this time.

NS and II are for roleplays about nations. I'm sorry, I didn't know that it was strictly forbidden/malicious spam to have roleplays with persons or vampires or whatever as characters in a story "somewhere" instead of nations vs nations. None did.


Btw, if anyone has forgotten it, here is the description of the NS forum:

International discussion about back room politics, inter-regional rivalries, and why llamas are a cooler national animal than squirrels.


I'm sure there are more questions regarding this and I'm willing to answer them if I can.

Best regards, BMV

My observation is that Scolo's warning was issued after the invasion had taken place, not before. Thus, from his perspective, he was no doubt issuing a warning for spamming to those who had already taken part. Unless there is more to it, I am tempted to consider the "mailicious intent" business an unfortunate turn of phrase, which should not detract from the fact that what may be considered to be spamming had been perfomed by those players already.

So then, if we only posted on the thread in General, then we're not subject to the warning?

If so, then why was the warning posted on the thread that started in General, rather than the thread that started in Moderation and moved to General?

In short, who, exactly, is covered by this mass warning and who isn't?

:evil:

That's not really for me to answer. I'm not really involved, other than pointing to some stuff on public record.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

In short, who, exactly, is covered by this mass warning and who isn't?



I think this is an exceedingly pertinant question, given the two strikes and your out policy. As there seemed to be a LOT of people participating in the 'Invasion plans' thread (on general), where the warning was given, you could potentially have a lot of people who aren't even aware they've HAD a warning!! (Such as Redsoviet.)

If the 'invasion' had kept to General forum, where such antics are accepted, I doubt anybody would have had a problem... The problem was that certain players tried to actually drag it from General to the Nationstates roleplay forums. Now, General forum roleplays are all fine and dandy in the General forum. (Which, by the way, Spoffin, no matter how many people DO cry for the removal of the General forum, that ain't happening.) The Nationstates or International Incidents forums are NOT the place for General forum comedy roleplays. NS and II are for roleplays about nations. General is a place for roleplays about a forum invasion.

After the invasion thread(s) had been kicked over the General where they belonged, some people seemed hell-bent on continueing the invasion, from what I had seen. Now, as a mod, if a bunch of people in the General forum want to roleplay out taking over one of the other forums, that's all fine. When that roleplay starts to cease being roleplay (in this case, actually attempting the 'invasion'), then it becomes spam, as it can interfere with the nation roleplays going on, and/or clog those forums. Spam means more work for me to do in order to try and keep some sense of order to this madhouse.

I saw a few comments about "if we can't have our threads there, we can drag theirs here!", which, just frankly, smacks of "Dude, let's go spam and hijack the NS roleplayers' threads so that they get moved to General!" Again, a tactic that would ultimately fail, but generate more work for the mods, having to split or delete the spam posts from roleplay threads. Work that is quite a pain in the keister, especially on days where the forums are being uncooperative and plagueing everyone (mods included) with invalid_session and "This page could not be found" errors.



++edited to save space++

Thanks for taking the time to respond Rep.

I agree, that once the 'Recon' thread was moved from Nationstates to General (and the reason for it given by the Mods - purely for those of us who honestly didn't understand that you couldn't do un-related RP on NS), then there should have been no further attempt to post the 'invasion story' on Nationstates. If there HAD been such a second attempt, then I'd agree any involved in that might be due a warning for failing to heed the words of the Mods and for creating spam.

As far as I'm aware (I could be wrong), there was no second attempt to start a thread in the NS forum.

The 'Invasion plan' thread on General, was ALWAYS on general, and was running at the same time as the 'Recon' thread. Hence, there was no time for anyone involved to stop, before the warning came down.

There was never an intention to spam, it was just a good natured role play based on various calls for general to be deleted. It was confined to a single thread in general and a single corresponding thread in NS with the official warning (and RS's deletion) being the first mod action :(

I am not sure about this, is the thread still around, or did it get DEATed?

I can understand all of the activity, this might just be a mix up of comunication. If the thread (scouting) thread had just gotten moved, then it would not have (IMHO) waranted a warning. Then again, I am not a MOD

--------------------
I AM NOT A MOD

Now, General forum roleplays are all fine and dandy in the General forum. (Which, by the way, Spoffin, no matter how many people DO cry for the removal of the General forum, that ain't happening.)
Just for the record, I made the first thread as a kind of...ironic gesture I suppose. It was a discussion (query?) about why the Generalites thought the RPers didn't like us. I did not actually suggest invading the NationStates forum.

The Nationstates or International Incidents forums are NOT the place for General forum comedy roleplays. NS and II are for roleplays about nations. General is a place for roleplays about a forum invasion.
I'm confused. It makes a difference whats being invaded? Also, single character RPs do go on in NationStates, and then things like the Volcano were General forum territory. Why is that?

General is a place for roleplays about a forum invasion.
This seems a little unfair. Under those rules, they'd be able to invade our forum, but we can't invade theirs! :lol: (this is not to be taken seriously either, and I hold no responsibility for the almost inevitable thread where some NS guys will try to take over General Forum.)

Continuing with this foolhardy exercise will be considered malicious spam. All of you who have signed up... good job, you've just signed up for "malicious intent to spam" warnings.

We will not stand for this.

The problem here, that's been said already, is that the warning was given AFTER the spamming took place. I signed off at noon EST on Friday, and Scolo's warning was issued 8 hours later...so how am I subject to that warning? Ex post facto law: If the "government" declares a certain action illegal, anybody who committed that action before the law took effect will not be prosecuted.

If I had continued to spam after the warning had been issued, then Scolo's action would've been just. However, why should I be deleted when I participated in the "invasion" before ANY mod issued a warning??

The problem here, that's been said already, is that the warning was given AFTER the spamming took place. I signed off at noon EST on Friday, and Scolo's warning was issued 8 hours later...so how am I subject to that warning? Ex post facto law: If the "government" declares a certain action illegal, anybody who committed that action before the law took effect will not be prosecuted.

If I had continued to spam after the warning had been issued, then Scolo's action would've been just. However, why should I be deleted when I participated in the "invasion" before ANY mod issued a warning??

First, as I stated, this thread isn't directly about your deletion. It's about whether 'intent to commit spam' is the same as 'commiting spam'.

Now if you're saying it is.. then Scolo or any other mod doesn't HAVE to give you a chance to stop it before they warn you, as it's already in teh site rules, which you've agreed to.

If however, it ISN'T the same thing.. which is the case I'm trying to build here, then perhaps the warning was a tad harsh and perhaps a lock of threads was a more suitable punishment.

That's for Scolo and the other Mods to decide.

Please help me keep this thread about the topic, RATHER than your deletion.

Another thing with the ex post facto law: When RedSoviet was created as a nation, there was nothing mandating that I had to agree to the site's terms and conditions before my nation was created!!

Another thing with the ex post facto law: When RedSoviet was created as a nation, there was nothing mandating that I had to agree to the site's terms and conditions before my nation was created!!

Were there not terms and conditions that you had to agree with before you started?

Even so, in law, you are still bound by the rules, even if you DON'T sign anything.. by continuing to post, you are considered to have agreed with them.

Either way.. like I said.. pelase can we keep the issue of RS deletion to the other thread.

If I had continued to spam after the warning had been issued, then Scolo's action would've been just. However, why should I be deleted when I participated in the "invasion" before ANY mod issued a warning??

You, Sir, are incorrect. Reread the second part of the warning wherein Scolo states that those who previously have signed up to join this spam invasion signed up to recieve warnings for doing so. See, the funny part of your statement is that you admit to spamming after you'd already been warned about Telegram Spam (was it not?). I would suggest that you drop this issue, and do so now.



To everyone else:

It would appear that there was evidence of this "invasion" not being simply contained within the thread. Thus, BMV, when you posted that you could spam other threads causing them to be moved to General, you were collaborating with the other actions already taken by those involved.

Had there not been any actions outside the invasion thread, there would not have been a warning issued. However, there was. Thus, a warning was issued.

Fight it all you want, you are all guilty. I'd suggest you all simply pack it up here, take what you have, and move on. A failure to do so could be indeed costly for your nation, as it just might be percieved as trolling.

Neut's got it.

I wouldn't have cared if it was just "oh, let's invade NS." Someone saying something foolish on General? I thought that's what it's there for.

However, when the threat was carried out... oh ho ho, that's something different. That is spamming, and seeing how there was a nice long list of people who signed up showing their interest in spamming...

In fact, RedSoviet (among others) participated in Beeker1's little "recon" thread, which was simply random General-esque posts thrown together. So, two warnings for spam equals one deletion.

You got caught. Deal with it.

To everyone else:

It would appear that there was evidence of this "invasion" not being simply contained within the thread. Thus, BMV, when you posted that you could spam other threads causing them to be moved to General, you were collaborating with the other actions already taken by those involved.


You, Sir, are incorrect too, but you are not alone it seems.

*sighs*

This "...spam other threads causing them to be moved to General,..." is a construction made by some of the mods. I have never said that. Ever. But I've heard that I have said that or similar more than one time now...

Neutered, you don't enjoy being incorrectly quoted either, right? Especially in a malicious way to change/add to the whole content of the original quote? I have never done that to you and I never expeceted you or any other mods to do that to me.

To everyone else:

It would appear that there was evidence of this "invasion" not being simply contained within the thread. Thus, BMV, when you posted that you could spam other threads causing them to be moved to General, you were collaborating with the other actions already taken by those involved.


You, Sir, are incorrect too, but you are not alone it seems.

*sighs*

This "...spam other threads causing them to be moved to General,..." is a construction made by some of the mods. I have never said that. Ever. But I've heard that I have said that or similar more than one time now...

Neutered, you don't enjoy being incorrectly quoted either, right? Especially in a malicious way to change/add to the whole content of the original quote? I have never done that to you and I never expeceted you or any other mods to do that to me.
I don't want to get deleted over this, but seeing as the thread is still open, I assume that posting this is not out of line.

I think BMV's comment was vague, I mean, obviously it was, otherwise there wouldn't be this dispute over it. But, threads which get spammed get locked, right? And, I assume that, as a long-time player, BMV know this, yeah? So, how could spamming threads possibly help to get threads moved to general? I mean, if a thread goes a lot off topic, it might get moved, but thats not spam. Spammed topics don't go to general, they get locked and the people get warned. So I mean, unless BMV is really stupid (which I doubt), and didn't think even for a moment, then he couldn't really have meant that at all.

Neut's got it.

I wouldn't have cared if it was just "oh, let's invade NS." Someone saying something foolish on General? I thought that's what it's there for.

However, when the threat was carried out... oh ho ho, that's something different. That is spamming, and seeing how there was a nice long list of people who signed up showing their interest in spamming...

In fact, RedSoviet (among others) participated in Beeker1's little "recon" thread, which was simply random General-esque posts thrown together. So, two warnings for spam equals one deletion.

You got caught. Deal with it.

With respect, I hope you don't mind me debating a few of these points, it isn't intended as trolling or baiting etc.

I don't believe the 'threat' WAS carried out. To the best of my knowledge, ONLY one thread in NS was posted to... the Recon thread, we didn't 'invade' ANY other threads.

We were also unaware (from what people have said), that posting a RP which wasn't set in the NS-Universe thingy, constituted spam. Had we continued to post to that thread AFTER your comments, then I would accept it as spamming, as it was, I feel there were no documented rules to follow on this issue. As you are obviously aware (what with being a Game Mod!), Spam is defined as:
Off-topic, irrelevant and multi-posts that clog the server. (source, the glossary of forbidden actions), please can you explain how the recon thread falls into this category?

As far as myself and other participants were concerned, the RP on the recon thread was NOT 'general-esque posts thrown together.' It contained characters, all be it charicatures and stereotypes, that you might find in a paraody RP.. which is all it really was.

If you (or ANY other Mods who were on and monitoring during the day), had said 'guys and gals, you are walking the fine line... we would have stopped (well, most of us anyway!) Unfortunately, the first thing we knew about a site misdemeanor of 'intent to commit spam' was when we received a warning for it!

For the record, the list of people, didn't sign up to spam.. they signed up to have a little RP 'fun'.

I don't normally make a habit of questioning decisions of the Mods, who I generally support and respect, but I feel in this occasion, the punishment was over the top.

As I say, I mean no disrespect and hope that this matter can be debated in a calm (non-rule breaking!!) manner!

I will say it again...SCOLO ISSUED THE WARNING 8 HOURS AFTER I WAS LAST ON!!!

Anyways...I still think this was a unjust action on the part of the mods, but they are the law, and in most cases, I agree with the law. But not here. Oh well. The thread was not spam, because it was an RP, which is allowed in the NS forum. Most times, I can respect someone's opinion on something, regardless of how I feel. But in this case, I cannot.

And again...why was I the only nation that posted in the thread to be deleted?

I will say it again...SCOLO ISSUED THE WARNING 8 HOURS AFTER I WAS LAST ON!!!

Anyways...I still think this was a unjust action on the part of the mods, but they are the law, and in most cases, I agree with the law. But not here. Oh well. The thread was not spam, because it was an RP, which is allowed in the NS forum. Most times, I can respect someone's opinion on something, regardless of how I feel. But in this case, I cannot.

And again...why was I the only nation that posted in the thread to be deleted?

Again, this thread isn't intended to be about your deletion. That is on a different thread, and I'd rather this one not get locked for being a duplicate!

The point the Mods (rightly) make, is that it doesn't matter WHEN they see an infingement, be it 8 minutes, 8 days or 8 weeks later.. a breach of the rules is a breach of the rules.... it gets a warning and if you've already had one, equals deletion.

The thrust of this thread, is to say that it WASN'T a breach of the rules, or if it was, then there was a difference in interpretation between the players and the Mods.

To everyone else:

It would appear that there was evidence of this "invasion" not being simply contained within the thread. Thus, BMV, when you posted that you could spam other threads causing them to be moved to General, you were collaborating with the other actions already taken by those involved.

Had there not been any actions outside the invasion thread, there would not have been a warning issued. However, there was. Thus, a warning was issued.

Let's see this "evidence". Please post links to the other threads in NS where the invaders posted.

I'll give you a hint to save you some time: there aren't any.

Fight it all you want, you are all guilty. I'd suggest you all simply pack it up here, take what you have, and move on. A failure to do so could be indeed costly for your nation, as it just might be percieved as trolling.

We are not guilty of spamming. The only thing we are guilty of is questioning the judgment of a mod who stepped out of bounds. If that's considered trolling, then you are again out of bounds. Threatening those who disagree with you is abuse of your moderator power, period. I think a follow-up message to admin@nationstates.net is in order here, as you are in need of a little moderation yourself.

:evil:

Threatening those who disagree with you is abuse of your moderator power, period. I think a follow-up message to admin@nationstates.net is in order here, as you are in need of a little moderation yourself.

Go for it.

Just to clarify something here, are the rules that you get one warning and then the next time you make a rule infringement you are deleted, or is it just if you get warned for something, and then do something similar to that again (Tgram spam, then forum spam), or is there something I am missing completely here.

EDIT: I went find the exact quote:It seems like we are given a weapon by the Gods!


Take a look in the thread in the mod forum, we now have a legitimate way of plundering NS. If we can't go over there, we'll just have to get their threads over here... :twisted:


This quote, in the context of the thread in which it was posted, sure as hell says "lets go spam threads causing them to be moved to General" - whether it was intended that way or not. Especially as this was already being undertaken by players.



The problem here, that's been said already, is that the warning was given AFTER the spamming took place. I signed off at noon EST on Friday, and Scolo's warning was issued 8 hours later...so how am I subject to that warning? Ex post facto law: If the "government" declares a certain action illegal, anybody who committed that action before the law took effect will not be prosecuted.

If I had continued to spam after the warning had been issued, then Scolo's action would've been just. However, why should I be deleted when I participated in the "invasion" before ANY mod issued a warning??

You, Sir, are incorrect. Reread the second part of the warning wherein Scolo states that those who previously have signed up to join this spam invasion signed up to recieve warnings for doing so. See, the funny part of your statement is that you admit to spamming after you'd already been warned about Telegram Spam (was it not?). I would suggest that you drop this issue, and do so now.


We are not guilty of spamming. The only thing we are guilty of is questioning the judgment of a mod who stepped out of bounds. If that's considered trolling, then you are again out of bounds. Threatening those who disagree with you is abuse of your moderator power, period. I think a follow-up message to admin@nationstates.net is in order here, as you are in need of a little moderation yourself.

So you think that even though two Senior Game Mods and two Game Mods have stated that you were indeed in the wrong, along with one of your own admiting to spamming, you're going to appeal to [violet] that you were not gulity of spamming and the Mods have no right to tell you that you were indeed guilty as charged and are being disorderly?

:twisted: he he he :twisted:

*Norman continues his warning free stance*

although someone put their name in a thread doesn't mean that they actually had any intent to spam, they were giving their support to what they thought would be an accepted Rp... don't see why you have to be so harse to them...

however...

any nation that did spam after it was clear that is wasn't accepted clearly has no excuse

~Normack~
General Forum King
My Airmax shoes for your beamer
lets trade now
http://69.57.141.218/367/22/upload/photo-2.jpg

:twisted: he he he :twisted:

*Norman continues his warning free stance*

although someone put their name in a thread doesn't mean that they actually had any intent to spam, they were giving their support to what they thought would be an accepted Rp... don't see why you have to be so harse to them...

however...

any nation that did spam after it was clear that is wasn't accepted clearly has no excuse

~Normack~
General Forum King
My Airmax shoes for your beamer
lets trade now
http://69.57.141.218/367/22/upload/photo-2.jpg

Spot on Norm!

Which I why we are questioning the fact that we didn't know it wasn't acceptable UNTIL the post that actually delivered the warning!

There WAS no post stating that ANY Mods found the thread was too close to the line between fun and spam.

To Dishonourable.... PLEASE don't make it personnal against any Mods.. that kind of line of debate doesn't do us any favours.

Just to clarify something here, are the rules that you get one warning and then the next time you make a rule infringement you are deleted, or is it just if you get warned for something, and then do something similar to that again (Tgram spam, then forum spam), or is there something I am missing completely here.

You are correct with your first instance. Those who received a warning, do not have any other 'lives'. If they break any of the site rules again, they are deleted. Hence Redsoviet, who had a prior warning was deleted.

The crux of THIS debate, is whether the site rules were broken. Obviously several of the Mods believe that 'intent to spam' IS against the rules. Given as there actually wasn't any spam, just a RP posted on the wrong forum.

EDIT: I went find the exact quote:It seems like we are given a weapon by the Gods!


Take a look in the thread in the mod forum, we now have a legitimate way of plundering NS. If we can't go over there, we'll just have to get their threads over here... :twisted:


This quote, in the context of the thread in which it was posted, sure as hell says "lets go spam threads causing them to be moved to General" - whether it was intended that way or not. Especially as this was already being undertaken by players.



I agree with what you say... but I didn't see ANYONE actually try this. I apologise if they did and I missed it, in which case I would say they probably WERE due warnings, but form what I saw, the ONLY thread in NS which was posted on during the 'invasion', was the Recon thread.

If no one actually did it, then it's possible that those reading it, took the same view that I did... that it was intended as a good humoured 'jibe' at the SN regulars.

I agree with what you say... but I didn't see ANYONE actually try this. I apologise if they did and I missed it, in which case I would say they probably WERE due warnings, but form what I saw, the ONLY thread in NS which was posted on during the 'invasion', was the Recon thread.

If no one actually did it, then it's possible that those reading it, took the same view that I did... that it was intended as a good humoured 'jibe' at the SN regulars.

Not sure I even saw it. I'm certain no-one acted on it....

I'll try to write this post well structured, but I'm not sure I'll succeed... :wink:

First point regarding spam
I still fail to see how posting in the Recon thread and only the Recon thread in NS is a violation of NS rules. I doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. I'm amazed to hear Reploid Production saying that Nationstates forum is not the forum for comedy roleplays, because I have seen exactly that in the past, even with moderators (although with puppet nations) participate in them. I'll give you a couple of examples:

Shentavo family reunion (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74138&start=0)
Very funny thread! :D

Bubba Shentavo International Cooking School (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74134&start=0)

From this I understand that SLAGlands participated:
What the hell is going on? (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74137&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

Now, I have heard from some of the mods that the players posting in the recon thread have been posting/spamming in other threads in the NationStates forum besides the recon thread, but so far I haven't seen any proof of that. I'm sorry if that happened and I know for sure that I didn't post in any other thread in NS.

Second point regarding malicious intent to spam
There is no such thing, is there? Either posts are spam or they aren't?

Third point regarding moved threads
Threads don't get moved from one forum to another after players have spammed them, do they? I haven't seen that so far. What I have seen is players posting in the mod forum asking mods to clean up the mess in their threads. I fully understand that cleaning up threads must be a boring task. Still, the threads don't get moved after they're cleand up. Why am I bringing this up? Because I feel that I need to explain this quote one more time:

It seems like we are given a weapon by the Gods!


Take a look in the thread in the mod forum, we now have a legitimate way of plundering NS. If we can't go over there, we'll just have to get their threads over here...

Now I'm going to give you an example of what I meant:


Dear Sirs! It seems to me that this thread (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74138&start=0) does not belong to the Nationstates forum, but rather General. Thanks ahead for the thread move!


This would be a legitimate way of "plundering" NS on one of it's treasuers, right?

I would think that the difference between saying "let's go and spam all threads in NS" and "let's get the threads from NS over to general in a legitimate way" is both important and obvious, but maybe that's just me?

Endnote
I think the warning for spam should be retracted for everyone involved in this mess. If there are evidence of one or more players posting in NS threads outside the recon thread, then this or these players may deserve a warning, but I haven't seen any rule violation made by any involved player so far.

Wow, this post got long! :shock: Sorry for making you read all this, but this is important, at least to me. My opinion is that we are unfairly and unjustly treated by the upholders of the law.

From this I understand that SLAGlands participated:
What the hell is going on? (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74137&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

The thing is, The SLAGlands is no longer a moderator. You cannot therefore use him as an example.

However, the rest of your post was very good, IMO.

From this I understand that SLAGlands participated:
What the hell is going on? (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74137&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

The thing is, The SLAGlands is no longer a moderator. You cannot therefore use him as an example.

However, the rest of your post was very good, IMO.

Ah.. but was Slaglands a Mod at the TIME of this participation? (not that it actually matter a jot!)

Anyway, well done BMV.. I think you put it in a better way than I could have ever done!!

Ah.. but was Slaglands a Mod at the TIME of this participation? (not that it actually matter a jot!)

SLAG was a mod then, but we have to find evidence of a current mod doing this whilst still being a mod, in order to validate our argument on this part of it.

Listen, I have nothing against those threads where Slaglands participated in. On the contrary, they're great. The reason for me bringing them up is just to illustrate I could never (and still can't) believe that the recon (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=100649&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0) thread was spam. If it isn't spam, then we (even those who didn't post in the recon thread) have been punished for something we haven't done.

Does anyone know how long it takes for a complaint to be dealt with when raised through the admin e-mail address?

Please note, I've compained about the decision regarding the warning and NOT the conduct of any Mods!

Does anyone know how long it takes for a complaint to be dealt with when raised through the admin e-mail address?


forever

I complained about someone who sent a very insulting TM to me and no action was taken against them

instead my own thread was locked

I'm beginning to think that all Mods are useless

Isn't the NationState's forum for International discussion about back room politics, inter-regional rivalries, and why llamas are a cooler national animal than squirrels. anyway? By it's very nature it's a silly forum, it's not even required to be an IC roleplaying forum. The general opinion is if your'e going to make a silly roleplay or a humouros GodMod Store you use NationStates.

A request was made to see the link to the thread where the threat to spam was supposedly made.

In response we were given a reiteration of an alleged quote with, once again, no evidence.

A request was made to see the link to the thread where the threat to spam was supposedly made.

In response we were given a reiteration of an alleged quote with, once again, no evidence.

Hi... I'm not sure to whom you are responding, as I've not seen any request to provide links. If you're referring to the thread where the warning was given, then there was a link given on post 7, page 1 of this thread. Thre was also a link posted on post 5, page 1 of this thread where the Mods originally commented on the action taken and I suspect is where the quotes you're looking for, came from.

Hope this helps.

Hi... I'm not sure to whom you are responding, as I've not seen any request to provide links.

He's responding to me, on page 2 of this thread:
Let's see this "evidence". Please post links to the other threads in NS where the invaders posted.
Still no "evidence." There is none. Neut responded with the quote from BMV which he alleges is evidence of a conspiracy to spam other threads, but he still can't point to any actual spamming of other threads.

:evil:

Hi... I'm not sure to whom you are responding, as I've not seen any request to provide links.

He's responding to me, on page 2 of this thread:
Let's see this "evidence". Please post links to the other threads in NS where the invaders posted.
Still no "evidence." There is none. Neut responded with the quote from BMV which he alleges is evidence of a conspiracy to spam other threads, but he still can't point to any actual spamming of other threads.

:evil:

Ohh! I see! Sorry (guess the quote pyramids CAN be a good thing!)

No, there's no 'evidence' of spam in other NS threads caused by this... I think BMV's post is very good as it explains what he meant by the statement that got people in trouble!

I have a quick little question.

I intend to spam all the time. In fact, except for my one RP going with Kain Irenicus and company, all I do is spam. Every time I log in, I intend to spam. So, with this out in the open, if I make an "Invasion" of the general forum thread, I will be deleted? I just want to get a hold on the situation, not cause you mods more problems ... Sorry if this comes out offensive, as I don't want it to be ...

Hi... I'm not sure to whom you are responding, as I've not seen any request to provide links.

He's responding to me, on page 2 of this thread:
Let's see this "evidence". Please post links to the other threads in NS where the invaders posted.
Still no "evidence." There is none. Neut responded with the quote from BMV which he alleges is evidence of a conspiracy to spam other threads, but he still can't point to any actual spamming of other threads.

:evil:

Thanks DS; you're right.

I wanted to quote both you and BMV but did not know how to put two different posts in one quote so I included neither.

I know this is a private site and rules of law do not apply etc etc but certainly rules of basic human civility should still apply, and I feel the Generalites have been denied this.