NationStates Jolt Archive

iam now posting this for the first time on the nation states forum iam now geting involed in the pacific battle there is no hideing it the mods have on more than one occasion acted on behalf of Francos Spain if this is mere coincidence than let this lay but in may mine that is not the case
two often to be mere coincidence as of now i and my friends in the RRA and meney more that iam not going to disclose i have a battle plan to take the pacific with out any need to hide it becouse the plan is in it vere nature vere good. that francos could do nouthing about it with out the help of the mods iam now going to tell you on this bord that ever time iam going to invade the region of the pacific you will no of it there will be no resion for you to get involde you will not have a leg to stand on if you do and i will run youer good neutrel name throw the dirt you are biased and will get involde in fact iam banking on it and if you do i will than have there vere ammuniition to see you all to the game creator for the remove of you game mod status iam not messing around with you lot now iam take this couse of action becouse i do firmle belive that you are cheating on behave of francos am teling you now that on 31/10/03 at one of the update time iam going to invade the region of pacific with the RRA and the rest of my allies you have been told any hick ups and you will be sign'in
youer own demise for you mod states ive had it with you cheating and lets have fun and cause the pain of a lot of nations in this game

ive told you this becoue my plan do's not need to be in the dark iam all most expecting you to try and stop me our fine sume way of kicking me out the game befor the the date but we will see how it turn out i dount have any faith in the mods any more after what hapion last night it just show that a game mods how play the game will and can have his way and the rest of the admin team will do nouthing about it

kane of gettersburg

[...]

post dleeted by self.

Yea its the thread that should read "The Wishy Washy decision on the Pacific...subject to change"

I think that possibly the mods were confused/mistaken on this issue, but implying intent is going a bit far. I can't believe theres a secret conspiracy with Francos or anything like that.

I would like to point out that most Mods were not even awake at the time, and are only now figuring out what happened. It is not as though there was some secret Operation Project Evil just waiting to be launched. Decisons were simply made on the spot, with time zones, as ever, doing their thing.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

how about punctuating that? please? the primary schoolteacher in me is screaming....

wasn't the mods. was violet. go read the (shudder) long thread.
telling people you have a cunning plan is probably not the best thing to do.

okay, kane, i couldnt' read that because of the spelling as well. could you rewrite it please?

How about some decency please. Gettersburg has a problem to write. So? Give the man a brake.
If you cannot read it. Sad. Try harder. Are you not interested to read it? Then forget he wrote it.
No person would write like that on purpose and therefore you should accept that he cannot write better. I know he wants to write better.
Comments like YOURS really make it hard for dyslectics to dare to write on a public forum where people who don't know them exists.

This goes for everyone here who even thinks about give such comments in the future.

Greymarshes

fine.
posted deleated by self.
his writing did not conform to any problem in my memory (is a spec ed trained teacher). but that doesn't say much as i am extrememly tired out today.

:edited for spelling. sorry for any offence taken:

I'll clean up the opening post when I have time, but not right now.

--The Demcoratic States of Cogitation

fine.
posted dleeted by self.
his writing did not conform to any problem in my memory (is a spec ed trained teacher). but that doens't say much as i am extrememly tired otu today.

Very funny. I understand that my opinion about you aren't worth anything for you. But my opinion about you went rockbottom down the ocean.

Have a nice life.

oh geez aboutthe mispellings? no i do that normally. ask my cabinet. no offence was intended by that and will be fixed next.

bisty, grey, could you both please calm down?

oh geez aboutthe mispellings? no i do that normally. ask my cabinet. no offence was intended by that and will be fixed next.

You just can't give it up can you? Why not?
Lets do like this instead. If you want to have fun over this, why not send me a t-gram so we can (without using curses) discuss this issue that way instead of destroying this threads purpose.

Guys, seriously, are you so petty as to argue about spelling?

Keep it on topic, okay?

At the time that the controversial decision had been made, numerous mods were not present. I, myself, had left several hours earlier after having made clear my position of no intervention beyond that of heavy multi sweeps.

http://www.weirdozone.0catch.com/projects/nationstates/salusasecondus/salusasecondus2.jpg
SalusaSecondus
Tech Modling
PGP: 0x0604DF3E

With all due respect,

If the Mods are allowed to make snap decisions, then they should not be countermanded. If the Mods are not allowed to make snap decisions, then they should not come into the region and make statements they can not back up.

I understand it’s a hard job, but that’s YOUR problem. You do it for free, so you must want it. If you want it, then do it well.

Either have the powers that be decide that Mods can make decisions that will be stuck to, or tell the Mods not to make decisions until the council of Mods can be convened. Anything else is unfair the players and the Mods that get countermanded.

If this was the first time this had happened, I could say it’s a learning experience. This is the second time this has happened… in the same region… triggered by the same mod. In both cases, Neut stepped in and made comments and threats with no back up. Then Neut is allowed to slither away from his comments because his betters disagreed. If Neuts decision making ability is that poor (which I don’t believe), why is he still a Mod? If [violet] doesn’t agree with Neut and Steph when it really counts, why keep them on the job?

The Mods and the Admin have made a terrible mess here. The fact that you can’t admit the staff screwed up only makes it that much worse.

I suggest E-mails to Max to describe the animosity players have against the last debacle. This is both mature and civilized. I recommend people not blame Neut for the decision he made… but I think people should loudly decry his effort to stop the liberation knowing full well his decisions might be discarded like stale bread. That is the crime here… not what he said, but that he said ANYTHING without the authority to back it up.

-Drakma-

greymarshes, glad you checkedyour tg's.

let's get the bastard.

I think that we have admitted that things did not go as they should have. Moderators al allowed to make snap decisions, however, admin is allowed to overrule us. This is done extremely rarely. Almost all moderator decsions have been allowed to stand.

We are working to improve our procedures and actions for the future.

http://www.weirdozone.0catch.com/projects/nationstates/salusasecondus/salusasecondus2.jpg
SalusaSecondus
Tech Modling

One the subject of the initial post, those who know Gettersburg know his heart is often in the right place, even if he chooses "interesting" avenues to present it.

While the RRA has not had a hand in planning this operation, we will support all attempts to liberate the Pacific. If this includes a public attack as presented, I have to but to change my UN nation one more time.

As for the the theme here which is moderation, I think as difficult a read as Gettersburg can be, the point is that there are some rather unhappy citizens of Nation States. Part of it of course is the failure to unseat Francos, it is human nature. But a large part is the feeling that we can not get the "rules" straight. I trust this incident will help in that regard, at least I hope so.

I would like to point out that most Mods were not even awake at the time, and are only now figuring out what happened. It is not as though there was some secret Operation Project Evil just waiting to be launched. Decisons were simply made on the spot, with time zones, as ever, doing their thing.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator


iam sorry but ive lost all faith in the mods and there way of doing things ive made my point and i will leve it at that plese dont take my spelling apart becouse iam delexit but do not call me stuped ive got a IQ 135
iam not staning down ive giveing you my dead line ive made my point
and i will let my sword do the talking from her thank you for you input

kane of gettersburg

sorry doble post



kane of gettersburg

Yes yes yes, we all know this shit, and there is not a damn thing we can do about it. I swear if I see another one of these flame bait, spams I'm gonna just go LOOSE!

:roll: agreed

With all due respect,

If the Mods are allowed to make snap decisions, then they should not be countermanded. If the Mods are not allowed to make snap decisions, then they should not come into the region and make statements they can not back up.

I understand it’s a hard job, but that’s YOUR problem. You do it for free, so you must want it. If you want it, then do it well.

Either have the powers that be decide that Mods can make decisions that will be stuck to, or tell the Mods not to make decisions until the council of Mods can be convened. Anything else is unfair the players and the Mods that get countermanded.

If this was the first time this had happened, I could say it’s a learning experience. This is the second time this has happened… in the same region… triggered by the same mod. In both cases, Neut stepped in and made comments and threats with no back up. Then Neut is allowed to slither away from his comments because his betters disagreed. If Neuts decision making ability is that poor (which I don’t believe), why is he still a Mod? If [violet] doesn’t agree with Neut and Steph when it really counts, why keep them on the job?

The Mods and the Admin have made a terrible mess here. The fact that you can’t admit the staff screwed up only makes it that much worse.

I suggest E-mails to Max to describe the animosity players have against the last debacle. This is both mature and civilized. I recommend people not blame Neut for the decision he made… but I think people should loudly decry his effort to stop the liberation knowing full well his decisions might be discarded like stale bread. That is the crime here… not what he said, but that he said ANYTHING without the authority to back it up.

-Drakma-

Just to make a couple of observations: Wasn't this a time-limited scenario whereby the Mods online HAD to make a snap decision if a decision was going to be made?

Stuff like this happens in real life. An employee HAS to make a decision while the supervisor isn't around. When the supervisor returns they may decide to reverse that decision. That is their right. But you don't hire people to do a job if you don't trust that their judgement will be right more times than not.

And for all the decisions the Mods make - you point to TWO and scream that it is a prevalent problem that must be addressed and resort to personal attacks such as "slither away"?

Did he have the authority to act in the absense of higher Mods? I dunno. Neither do you. I would expect that the answer is yes but that his decision was not the one that they would have made. That's for them to work out.... and I don't see where airing dirty laundry about "screwing up" helps anybody either.

Or, to put it back into the real world: If I get poor service at a restaurant, I complain to the manager. But I don't expect the manager to publicly humiliate his staff by chewing them out in public. That's not right either.

-Z-

Did he have the authority to act in the absense of higher Mods? I dunno. Neither do you. I would expect that the answer is yes but that his decision was not the one that they would have made. That's for them to work out.... and I don't see where airing dirty laundry about "screwing up" helps anybody either.
Actually, since he is a Senior Game Moderator, there are no higher Mods. The only authority higher than him is Admin themselves.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

Did he have the authority to act in the absense of higher Mods? I dunno. Neither do you. I would expect that the answer is yes but that his decision was not the one that they would have made. That's for them to work out.... and I don't see where airing dirty laundry about "screwing up" helps anybody either.
Actually, since he is a Senior Game Moderator, there are no higher Mods. The only authority higher than him is Admin themselves.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

Rep Prod, maybe :?:

When it comes to Forum Issues, Rep's the Queen (under [violet] of course). When it comes to Game issues, Melk, Rep, and I are all the senior ranking members.

Rep Prod, maybe :?:
That one is Admin.

Rep Prod, maybe :?:
That one is Admin.

Rep is a forum admin.. however she is the same rank as Neut when it comes to game issues.

Did he have the authority to act in the absense of higher Mods? I dunno. Neither do you. I would expect that the answer is yes but that his decision was not the one that they would have made. That's for them to work out.... and I don't see where airing dirty laundry about "screwing up" helps anybody either.
Actually, since he is a Senior Game Moderator, there are no higher Mods. The only authority higher than him is Admin themselves.

Tactical Grace
Forum Moderator

And it was clearly a unique situation that had to be dealt with. Frankly, I don't think he deserves the heat he is taking for making a tough decision that had valid arguments for both sides. No matter which way he chose there would have been people angered at the outcome, and there was a chance that admin would have chosen the other position.

But I understand why some people feel the need to vent.

-Z-

Just to make a couple of observations: Wasn't this a time-limited scenario whereby the Mods online HAD to make a snap decision if a decision was going to be made?

Stuff like this happens in real life. An employee HAS to make a decision while the supervisor isn't around. When the supervisor returns they may decide to reverse that decision. That is their right. But you don't hire people to do a job if you don't trust that their judgement will be right more times than not.

And for all the decisions the Mods make - you point to TWO and scream that it is a prevalent problem that must be addressed and resort to personal attacks such as "slither away"?

Did he have the authority to act in the absense of higher Mods? I dunno. Neither do you. I would expect that the answer is yes but that his decision was not the one that they would have made. That's for them to work out.... and I don't see where airing dirty laundry about "screwing up" helps anybody either.

Or, to put it back into the real world: If I get poor service at a restaurant, I complain to the manager. But I don't expect the manager to publicly humiliate his staff by chewing them out in public. That's not right either.

-Z-

I believe the gripe of many players with last nights events is not that the mods made a decision without consulting the Admin (that probably applies to most of their decisions, after all- the Admins can't be everywhere, otherwise they wouldn't need Mods), but that the mod ruling on the legality of the Pacific operation flipflopped in mid-conflict.

I stopped the invasion at the time I felt it was best to do so. I was attempting to wait for [violet] to appear to consult, however, as update time neared, I felt it best to interfere and essentially put the situation on hold, pending Admin input.

Ironically, as soon as Corinthe and her followers had left, [violet] appeared...

Those who control the flow of information left a senior "bueraucrat" to dangle in the wind...

sounds very familiar...

:lol:

I stopped the invasion at the time I felt it was best to do so. I was attempting to wait for [violet] to appear to consult, however, as update time neared, I felt it best to interfere and essentially put the situation on hold, pending Admin input.

Ironically, as soon as Corinthe and her followers had left, [violet] appeared...


for two long the mods have made one way our other that the pacific stay in franco hand how meny time have you neut had to help franco back in to power how many i ask you at lest 2 to my count and that one two meny becouse of no interfersion for you point iam driveing this becouse i now belive that you and proble other in the mods team have two much power and not any were the leshs you need for such power admin and one more think if you get power STOP say that you must speack to admin
blood stand up for you blunt use of power this is not the first and iam blood sure it whant be the last time you our one of you college will use you power in this way throws how play the game can and will abuse power yes vere well iam going to say it neut i think you like the way thing are and you trying to keep it that way any way you can yes iam talking about miss use of power and not ann stop sigh in sit admin you are responabule for this neut stand up for what you have done and stop dogeing the respoinabulte


kane of gettersburg

ps sorry for the spelling

I stopped the invasion at the time I felt it was best to do so. I was attempting to wait for [violet] to appear to consult, however, as update time neared, I felt it best to interfere and essentially put the situation on hold, pending Admin input.

Ironically, as soon as Corinthe and her followers had left, [violet] appeared...

Perhaps I missed it and this is only a suggestion, but when you feel you may need to consult with the Admin before making such a decision would it not be better just to tell us that is the case? If all parties were told to play as they wish, with the warning that what they were trying to do might not stand up to a well thought out ruling, I doubt this level of angst would exist. (Of course, I might be wrong .... I often am.) I appreciate your belief that the situation could have been replicated and thus un-doing your interference in the situation and I do beleive you acted in good faith. I am sure if I was Francos I would have hated to lose this way, but then again he is holding most of the cards right now.

Unfortunatly Neutered Sputniks, you did not just put the action on hold though, you also forcibly made nations leave and requested nations to pull endorsements at a time Corinthe was ahead, then with less than an hour to go we were told to go back and finish what we started after the lead had been taken away and many had gone to bed or elsewhere in an effort to follow what you told them would be the case, which didn't happen as you said. If they had any idea, they would have stayed and been there when needed. As the case was, they were gone because of you, and she lost by being two endorsements behind, when in fact she was 10 ahead at the time you did it.

it's all here: http://invisionfree.com/forums/The_West_Pacific/index.php?showtopic=216&st=0

Also you said: Seconds ago The Evilly-Biased Power-Hungry Rationally-Illogical Conservatively-Liberal Rampaging Virginal Sex-Fiendish Homophobic-Bisexual National-Socialisticish DEAT-Happy Judge, Jury, and Executioning Moddom of Neutered Sputniks The issue is not where the endorsee comes from, but where the endorsers come from.

But according to Nation States own rules:
Can I invade other people's regions?
Yes. The practice of "region crashing," where a group of nations all move to a region with the aim of seizing the UN Delegate position, is part of the game. Certain groups within NationStates are particularly adroit at this, and can attack very quickly.

Unfortunatly Neutered Sputniks, you did not just put the action on hold though, you also forcibly made nations leave and requested nations to pull endorsements at a time Corinthe was ahead, then with less than an hour to go we were told to go back and finish what we started after the lead had been taken away and many had gone to bed or elsewhere in an effort to follow what you told them would be the case, which didn't happen as you said. If they had any idea, they would have stayed and been there when needed. As the case was, they were gone because of you, and she lost by being two endorsements behind, when in fact she was 10 ahead at the time you did it.

it's all here: http://invisionfree.com/forums/The_West_Pacific/index.php?showtopic=216&st=0

ANd thats the part that gets me the most.

We are told to take it back ourselves and is stopped by a MODs actions. Question is will this happen again? If so, forget it. This place will become a ghost town leaving only those who hold onto hope they can still do it and those who don't care about anything but thier own little regions.

it's all here: http://invisionfree.com/forums/The_West_Pacific/index.php?showtopic=216&st=0


We can't see your links; you need permission to visit your forum.

ive now talk wth my friend and allys and it seem vere unlikele that we will invade on 31/10/03 in to franco region becouse we will not have the numbers to do so i will build my allys and friends up befor makeing a broud stament like that agean

on a personal basis i wish to say sorry for my accusation to Neutered Sputniks the decision you made was vere hard and after talking to siggi and gray how are my friends i now see were you were stnading between a rock and a hard place good luck and plese look after as all and now seeing it from the other side iam glad that we have mods sorry to you all for my words