NationStates Jolt Archive

I am fed up of receiving whining telegram spam from people begging me to support their pathetic UN proposals. Is there anything that can be done to prevent this? An informal code of practice might be sufficient.

Thanks in advance.

---Post deleted by NationStates Moderators---

Just delete them...or...stop being the UN delegate whos job is to view proposals & gets TG's because people want to highlight their proposal....or...(What I think you might need to do) Leave the UN!

Just delete them...or...stop being the UN delegate whos job is to view proposals & gets TG's because people want to highlight their proposal....or...(What I think you might need to do) Leave the UN!

I think you're being unfair, Telegrams from your region when you are a delegate are fine, what I believe is being discussed here is telegrams from people who are not in you region. These due to the limited size of mail boxes are far worse in my opinion than email spam and should be firmly stamped upon.

Kev
Today's spokesman for Nebbyland.

Spam is a warnable offense, when I last checked. The Getting Help page can be found here (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help).

Since this topic is talking about spam, a warnable offense, I feel that this topic has more to do with "Moderation" than "United Nations". Hence, iMove.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
NationStates Forum Moderator

...

I would like to informally remind everyone, though (and I'm not speaking in a mod capacity, here), that it is the duty of Delegates to read the proposal list and approve proposals they wish to support.

--The Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
Founder of The Realm of Ambrosia

I maintain the position that tg's re: proposals are not spam - but I'd be interested in hearing if the mods would respond to such a complaint.

I think people have the right to promote their proposal given the short timeline to get the required votes that they need, however I also agree that they should be tactful in their aproach.

i.e. a single short note to ask you to look at a proposal is fair, but if they start bugging you with reminders to vote or anything like that then that should qualify as spam.

i.e. a single short note to ask you to look at a proposal is fairHowever, if your telegram "inbox" is limited in size by the number of messages then it does not matter how long said notes are - each note I receive may cause the deletion of a useful telegram.

i.e. a single short note to ask you to look at a proposal is fairHowever, if your telegram "inbox" is limited in size by the number of messages then it does not matter how long said notes are - each note I receive may cause the deletion of a useful telegram.

A partial solution is to simply copy and paste important tg's into a word document and save them on your computer.

I'm an active player, and I've never once lost a tg.

Did someone called! Look, the help link in my signature :lol:

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Corinthe, Queen of Eternity.
The getting help section! (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=help) (for all your gaming problems)http://www.nationstates.net/forum/templates/subSilver/images/whosonline.gif

This is how I look at it.. If you don't want to deal with UN business you don't have to be in the UN. If you're the delegate of your region and you don't want tg's from people asking you to support their proposal then I would suggest stepping down as the regional delegate. I hear a lot of people saying, "It knocks out important tg's from my role playing" well if you're a member of the UN that is a part of role playing to. Most delegates actually don't even use the forums, if you are trying to drum up support for your resolution you have to be able to lobby them for support. That in my opinion is being part of the UN.

Peace,
Stephanie.

This is how I look at it.. If you don't want to deal with UN business you don't have to be in the UN. If you're the delegate of your region and you don't want tg's from people asking you to support their proposal then I would suggest stepping down as the regional delegate. I hear a lot of people saying, "It knocks out important tg's from my role playing" well if you're a member of the UN that is a part of role playing to. Most delegates actually don't even use the forums, if you are trying to drum up support for your resolution you have to be able to lobby them for support. That in my opinion is being part of the UN.

Peace,
Stephanie.

So it was said....So shall it be.

[...] if you're a member of the UN that is a part of role playing to.

Well, in a lot of roleplaying UN membership is completely irrelevant. Sometimes even totally outside of the theme.

Also, UN membership and delegacy allows one possible access to the 'coveted' Regional Controls. To a lot of people, THAT's the holy grail of power, not whether or not some resolution passes. These people could care less about the UN. It's not the way I would prefer people to play the game, but with the way the game mechanics are structured one cannot reasonably blame them. When it comes to forcing other players to do stuff, regional controls are much more powerful than a UN resolution altering nation stats (which is comparable to an issue one can get get twice a day anyway.)

Ballotonia

I won't argue that a lot of people only want to be the delegate because they are power hungry. However I don't believe that the UN or we, the players who do take the role playing of the UN just as serious as the good folks in Nation States and II take their role playing should cater to this bunch. They give the rest of us a bad name IMHO. It is a perfectly legit reason to telegram UN delegates for support for a resolution. Just because some players only want the position for power doesn't negate that it's suppose to be a process of the UN in regards to proposing and passing resolution in the spirit of the UN. Not for the power hungry. I refuse to cater to them and listen to them whine when they have to receive tg's about perfectly legit UN business, because they only wanted to control the ban button!

Peace,
Stephanie.

<snip>

Peace,
Stephanie.

So it was said....So shall it be.

I don't think that Stephanie was speaking in a mod capacity, here. Note her signature.

--The Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
Founder of The Realm of Ambrosia

(I'm not speaking in a mod capacity, here. Note my signature.)

<snip>

Peace,
Stephanie.

So it was said....So shall it be.

I don't think that Stephanie was speaking in a mod capacity, here. Note her signature.

--The Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."
Founder of The Realm of Ambrosia

(I'm not speaking in a mod capacity, here. Note my signature.)

I think he knew that Cog.. hehe , he's the founder of my region and my friend. We also run RPU together. I think he was just being sarcastic. ;)

Peace,
Stephanie.

I won't argue that a lot of people only want to be the delegate because they are power hungry. However I don't believe that the UN or we, the players who do take the role playing of the UN just as serious as the good folks in Nation States and II take their role playing should cater to this bunch. They give the rest of us a bad name IMHO.

Do you regard your way of playing the game to be more legit than theirs?? Why should they cater to your roleplaying?

Shouldn't posting in the UN forum be enough to try and convince people?

It is a perfectly legit reason to telegram UN delegates for support for a resolution.

Imagine everyone who submitted a Proposal had this attitude. UN Delegates would have their TMbox cleared by requests for support about... 4 - 5 times a day?

Admittedly, at first I didn't mind either. I was getting one message every two days or so, so no big deal. But today I think I got about 4 messages (so far), and it's getting to be a tad much IMHO. If I hadn't kept up with messages throughout the day I surely would've lost some important ones.

So, I've decided that if I don't know the nation asking me for support, I will REPLY to the message, asking to be unsubscribed from their spam list. So far they haven't appreciated the gesture :).

For the record: I do check the list of proposals regularly, and support what I choose to support. If someone would want me to change my mind on that, they'd have to provide actual arguments. Generally these calls for support don't do that at all.

Ballotonia

Shouldn't posting in the UN forum be enough to try and convince people?

Unfortunately, I don't think most delegates read the UN forum.

I agree with Stephanie on this matter, especially since I submitted a resolution trying to educate people on what the term "SPAM" actually means. Is does not apply to anything you don't want. As for people asking to be "removed from a list" of delegates that receive telegrams, I doubt that will work. When I have snet out telegrams asking for support for a resolution, I just copy and paste my message, as I go down the list of delegates who have voted for the current resolution. That seems to be the best list from which to draw names. You could try and ask me not to T-gram you, but I don't look at the names...it takes so long to send those things out one by one, that you just click buttons, you don't read names. As long as the majority of delegates do not use the UN forum, that is the way things are going to be.

I agree with Stephanie on this matter, especially since I submitted a resolution trying to educate people on what the term "SPAM" actually means. Is does not apply to anything you don't want. As for people asking to be "removed from a list" of delegates that receive telegrams, I doubt that will work. When I have snet out telegrams asking for support for a resolution, I just copy and paste my message, as I go down the list of delegates who have voted for the current resolution. That seems to be the best list from which to draw names. You could try and ask me not to T-gram you, but I don't look at the names...it takes so long to send those things out one by one, that you just click buttons, you don't read names. As long as the majority of delegates do not use the UN forum, that is the way things are going to be.

I think I'll post something in the UN forum to see how many delegates actually read it.

Here's the low-down. Mass solicitation via telegram is spam. Cut and dry. Same as the crap spam advertisements I recieve in my mailbox every wednesday that I keep trying to find out who is responsible for sending so that I can call them up and inform them I do NOT want to receive their spam.

On a related note, I consider the organizational adds hung on my door to be spam as well, and generally are left to hang in the wind until it either blows away, or someone else takes it down - regardless of where it is "hung," it is undesired solicitation or as we call it: SPAM.


While it could be argued that as Delegate the solicitation becomes expected or a part of the job - I find this reasoning hard to substantiate.

I agree that it is the Delegate's responsibility to remain aware of all resolutions in the works and to vote timely in a manner representative of his region. However, the responsibility of discussion and voting in a timely manner remains solely on the shoulders of the Delegate and the permanent members of his/her region, not on outsiders attempting to garner support for their resolution, nor nations moving into a region to solicite support - this is what the forums are for.


--Neutered Sputniks--
NationStates Game Moderator

So, you are saying I can't telegram every nation in every region about penis enlargement without this being called "spam?"







:twisted:

:lol:

I can understand people getting UN related TGs when they are UN members, but how about those who aren't, like me? :? I get buttloads of TGs asking me to endorse/not endorse this or that nation, or vote on this or that resolution. I'm tired of it. WHY ME? Go away! :evil: This wasn't really a question, more of a statement. Although, if anyone can answer as to how those players sending me these TGs can be so blind as to not notice that I'm not in the UN :roll: , I would be grateful and probably appropriately amused :wink: . Sigh.....retarded people, we need a law against them. Can't we make all players pass an IQ test before allowing them to have nations?

<---Would probably fail :P

Obviously I'm not a mod, but Reploid, I'm afraid I must disagree.

Unsolicited messages may be considered spam, but if a nation chooses to accept a delegate position, messages about UN proposals are not truly unsolicited. It is all mail that specifically relates to a job that the delegates are supposed to do. Delegates are the only people who can approve a proposal and a huge number of them never read the proposal lists, let alone view the UN forum.

I don't think it is outrageous to send them telegrams that may remind them that they should do their primary job - act as UN delegate. Granted, if a delegate sends messages asking not to receive them, the TG senders should honor that request. Perhaps a lot of this problem could be solved by a 'Do Not Send' list in the UN forum.

-------------------Please do not disregard this message simply because I used my non-UN nation to post it.

One of my nations is a UN Delegate, and I just accept it as being part of the job. You do not get the status for nothing.

Having said that, spamming non-UN members about UN business is quite clearly absurd. If that happens to anyone repeatedly, it should probably be reported.

Unsolicited messages may be considered spam, but if a nation chooses to accept a delegate position, messages about UN proposals are not truly unsolicited. It is all mail that specifically relates to a job that the delegates are supposed to do.
I believe such messages are indeed unsolicited - the person does not actively seek them out. In addition, delegates aren't supposed to do anything - obviously they're answerable to the long-term UN nations in their region, but if someone is not in that region, what the delegate does is not their concern. Furthermore, nations don't have to accept the delegate position - in certain small regions, it is possible to become delegate without intending to.

I'd also like to point out a couple of other events when telegram spam is received - the last time I had a nation apply to and join the UN (after resigning my previous UN nation, of course), I received several telegrams asking me to join various regions. The same thing has happened when one of my nations was 11th (and later 6th) worldwide in a UN ranking. While not in the same category as the spam the delegtes would receive, it is quite annoying, and the "it's not really unsolicited" reasoning is invalid in this case.

Unsolicited messages may be considered spam, but if a nation chooses to accept a delegate position, messages about UN proposals are not truly unsolicited. It is all mail that specifically relates to a job that the delegates are supposed to do.
I believe such messages are indeed unsolicited - the person does not actively seek them out. In addition, delegates aren't supposed to do anything - obviously they're answerable to the long-term UN nations in their region, but if someone is not in that region, what the delegate does is not their concern. Furthermore, nations don't have to accept the delegate position - in certain small regions, it is possible to become delegate without intending to.

Since a given percentage of delegates are needed to approve proposals, I would argue that delegate are supposed to regularly browse the proposal list.

So if someone creates a small region with a few friends and becomes the delegate, they should read through all the proposals, as they've increased the required number of approvals by 0.06? I don't agree with that. Regardless, browsing the list does not imply approving any proposals, and sending unsolicited telegrams to someone because they haven't read a proposal (or worse, they've read it and disagree with it) is impolite at best.

Okay I send mass telegrams to delegates sometimes. I haven't read this thread so I didn't know it was spam. I will stop doing so until I have recieved information to the contrary, but in the FAQ it states that:

"The first thing to do is inspect the current UN resolution at vote (if there is one). If you agree, vote for it; if you don't, oppose it. Depending on how ardent you feel, you can also debate the issue in the forum, or wire telegrams to other nations."

Thus I believe teh FAQ would state that UN-related messages aren't spam. That said only one person has complained about recieving a message from me, and I apologized and didn't send him anything else.

Okay I send mass telegrams to delegates sometimes. I haven't read this thread so I didn't know it was spam. I will stop doing so until I have recieved information to the contrary, but in the FAQ it states that:

"The first thing to do is inspect the current UN resolution at vote (if there is one). If you agree, vote for it; if you don't, oppose it. Depending on how ardent you feel, you can also debate the issue in the forum, or wire telegrams to other nations."

Thus I believe teh FAQ would state that UN-related messages aren't spam. That said only one person has complained about recieving a message from me, and I apologized and didn't send him anything else.

Good point!

Very good point!!!

Peace,
Stephanie.

Hey if a delegate doesn't want to recieve telegrams, maybe we should set up a "don't t-gram" list similar to the "don't call list" in real life against telemarketing. That would settle the issue. What do you think?

Hey if a delegate doesn't want to recieve telegrams, maybe we should set up a "don't t-gram" list similar to the "don't call list" in real life against telemarketing. That would settle the issue. What do you think?

I like it.

Hey if a delegate doesn't want to recieve telegrams, maybe we should set up a "don't t-gram" list similar to the "don't call list" in real life against telemarketing. That would settle the issue. What do you think?

Very impractical, infact I'd go as far as to say it couldn't be done and enforced. And seeing as it wasn't enforced it would jsut waste time and give people false hope. It would be cool if it could work...

Hey if a delegate doesn't want to recieve telegrams, maybe we should set up a "don't t-gram" list similar to the "don't call list" in real life against telemarketing. That would settle the issue. What do you think?

Very impractical, infact I'd go as far as to say it couldn't be done and enforced. And seeing as it wasn't enforced it would jsut waste time and give people false hope. It would be cool if it could work...

They could have an asterik put next to their names or something like that and if you t-gram them about UN proposals, then it would be considered spam and it could be enforced by a warning or two, ejection from UN, possible deletion if it continues, etc, etc.

Sorry, I'm field testing my new sig. Is it working?

----------------
-President Z.D. Meier
Alliance of Democracy
U.N. Delegate

http://drs.yahoo.com/S=96062857/K=Ozzy+Osbourne/v=2/SID=w/l=II/R=218/*-http://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images/view?back=http%3a//images.search.yahoo.com/search/images%3fp=Ozzy%2bOsbourne%26n=20%26fl=0%26b=201&h=500&w=500&imgurl=www.royal.gov.uk/files/images/kids_photos_jubilee_ozzykermit.jpg&name=kids_photos_jubilee_ozzykermit.jpg&p=Ozzy+Osbourne&rurl=http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/Page1596.asp&no=218&tt=2,530

Sorry, I'm field testing my new sig. Is it working?

----------------
-President Z.D. Meier
Alliance of Democracy
U.N. Delegate

http://drs.yahoo.com/S=96062857/K=Ozzy+Osbourne/v=2/SID=w/l=II/R=218/*-http://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images/view?back=http%3a//images.search.yahoo.com/search/images%3fp=Ozzy%2bOsbourne%26n=20%26fl=0%26b=201&h=500&w=500&imgurl=www.royal.gov.uk/files/images/kids_photos_jubilee_ozzykermit.jpg&name=kids_photos_jubilee_ozzykermit.jpg&p=Ozzy+Osbourne&rurl=http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/Page1596.asp&no=218&tt=2,530

No

Godammit, sorry for bothering you all.

----------------
-President Z.D. Meier
Alliance of Democracy
U.N. Delegate

http://images.art.com/images/PRODUCTS/small/10045000/10045608.jpg

Greetings,

Since a given percentage of delegates are needed to approve proposals, I would argue that delegate are supposed to regularly browse the proposal list.

No, UN Delegates' job (originally) is to represent their region in the UN. Since Region Controls were added to the mix, they've become the police department in their region as well. Or the bully, however it is used. If region members don't care about the UN proposal list (and I can tell you many, many do not), there's no obligation for the UN Delegate to look through the list at all. Even if the UN Delegate does, there's no obligation to endorse some of the proposals. If the region members are happy with the Delegate, then that person will remain delegate (presuming they are granted a choice in the matter :) ).

I do not endorse most proposals, as I do not agree with them. It would be an interesting situation if besides 'support proposal', one could also do a 'vote against proposal', where all the 'against' votes would be subtracted from the in-favor votes. I wouldn't be surprised if by far most proposals would end their time with a negative total...

"The first thing to do is inspect the current UN resolution at vote (if there is one). If you agree, vote for it; if you don't, oppose it. Depending on how ardent you feel, you can also debate the issue in the forum, or wire telegrams to other nations."

It doesn't specify whether this is all UN Delegates in the NS World or just the nations you are in contact with.

For instance, I do sometimes ask fellow delegates to endorse a proposal, but only those I am already in contact with. This has never been a problem because we know one another, and send TMs back and forth anyway.

Sorry, I'm field testing my new sig. Is it working?

How about limiting field-testing stuff to General. We're discussing something here in this thread, so you're way off-topic.

Ballotonia

It doesn't specify whether this is all UN Delegates in the NS World or just the nations you are in contact with.

For instance, I do sometimes ask fellow delegates to endorse a proposal, but only those I am already in contact with. This has never been a problem because we know one another, and send TMs back and forth anyway.

I'd think that because it didn't specify it would mean all UN members...

It doesn't specify whether this is all UN Delegates in the NS World or just the nations you are in contact with.

For instance, I do sometimes ask fellow delegates to endorse a proposal, but only those I am already in contact with. This has never been a problem because we know one another, and send TMs back and forth anyway.

I'd think that because it didn't specify it would mean all UN members...

That is the way it reads TGM.. I agree

Peace,
Stephanie