NationStates Jolt Archive

OOC: The LD-44 is Produced solely for the Rogue Nation of Sutufinai and possibly it's allies. It is not currently for sale, this is for Reference purposes only, OOC wise.

IC:
The Burnley Military Production Company was at one time a Subsidary of another arms manufacturing company in the early 1900s. Because of trade and tax laws it was determined the Subsidiary would get better payback and be more cost-effective if the entire sub-company broke away from the main company to get around the tax restrictions of it's parent country.

It mostly produced small arms and other weapons for the Sutfen, however more recently it has begun vehicle production. It's most ingenious and recent invention is the Burnley LD-44.

Name: LD-44
Weight: 45 Tons
Length: 28 feet
Height: 9 feet
Width: 14 feet
Engine: Markson ECMFT, 1,250 Hp.
Maximum Speed: 64.84 kph / 40.29 mph
Cruising Speed: 44.0 kph / 27.35 mph

Armament:
1 Burnley Bombard Series 2 Cannon (Turret Mounted) (40mm Hyper Velocity Cannon)
2 Burnley 12mm Machine Gun (Coaxial, Pintle mounted)

Armor: Steel with Burnley-Lamellor Reactive tiling over vital areas.
Front 110mm + 82mm*
Turret 50mm + 82mm*
Deck 25mm
Hull 25mm
Sides 60mm + 81/81mm*
*(Reactive armor (Where applicable), estimated added "Defense" to normal armor.)
Crew: 5 (Commander, Driver, Gunner, Loader, Electronics Operator.)
Designer: Burnley Arms Consolidated
Price: 816,938

Description:
The LD-44 was designed by the Burnley Corporation as a low cost alternative to the more expensive medium tanks produced massively across the world. Generally the Burnley is bought due to its cost by groups or nations who want the effect of actually having true armored vehicles with less of the overall costs of having just such a thing. While the ballistic standard of the world tends to be a 110 mm cannon of one sort or another the LD-44 utilizes a much smaller 40mm hyper velocity armor piercing cannon with autoloader specifically for the purpose of being able to use it's mobility and gun to exploit weaker facings on the armored units it might face and be utterly devastating against unarmored or lightweight vehicles of all types. The most unique aspect of the design is the LD-44's utter departure from the use of a normal internal combustion engine instead utilizing an external combustion engine to keep costs down. The engine itself is composed of a simple yet reliable compact steam-expansion engine that can use any burnable fluid as a pre-ignition agent. The advantages to the system are an utter lack of need for petrol or coal as a fuel source making the LD-44 a clean operating vehicle, that has virtually no engine noise and emits no more waste heat then an standard ICE. Such aspects come in handy as the likely buyers may not be able to get coal or petrol but usually can find some sort of high volume alcohol or another similar burnable liquid fuel. It should be of note that the LD-44 gets its nickname from the large water tanks incorporated into the engine compartment for the obvious reasons. As there are two such tanks inevitably for their seemingly large capacity crews have taken to referring to the vehicle as the 'camelback'. The most normal aspect of the design is the reactive armor which is designed to defeat incoming projectiles in the usual way.

OOC:

This design does strike me as being a bit all over the place Also is this supposed to be fully modern or some kind of WW1 tech?.

The dimensions are way off, particualrly the width, this is narrower than a mini!

Engine output is simply insane. Modern tanks of this kind of weight would have a roughly 1000HP engine.

Weapons a re a bit odd, it would help to include the calibre for the main gun in the stats and a 12mm MG (unless its a SMG firing pistol cartridges) is never goign to be light in any sense of the word. The common standard for MTB guns at the moment is 120mm or 125mm. 40mm mgiht be useful but porbabaly not as much as you might think, a 60mm alogn the lines of the Isrealli 60mm HVM might be more what you are looking for. of course with a 40mm auto gun why do you have a loader?

The armour is pretty poor even if it was just basic steel or early laminated armour of that actual thickness. ERA should give you a fair bit more.
This link: http://collinsj.tripod.com/protect.htm has a whole lsit of best guesses of protection levels for existing tanks, I would suggest havign a look at the soviet T-64, T-72 and T-80 and possibly the Leopard 1 for the kind of weight you are talking about.

Might I suggest saying how much the armor is, as opposed to how much it feels like. Also, might I suggest using rolled-steel if your a pre-modern tech, along with steel encased depleted uranium assuming your willing to add such to the weight. Reactive armor is a one use type of thing, and so is actually an add-on. Once it reacts, you have to replace the slab, and so using it as the main armor isnt all that effective. Plus its really only capable of stopping penetrators, like RPG warheads. If you use a normal round, then it will do damage underneath as it explodes. If you use a Sabot, it'll just go right through the sheet of metal, most likely without detonating it.
Why not simply have an auto-loader? It will up the cost, yes, but in the long run is cheaper because you then have one less person riding about. It will also make the crew much more comfortable.
Normaly the commander is the electronics operator. He operates the roof mounted MG, the electronics, the sights, and the radio.
I realize the width has already been touched on, but seriously, 4 feet is too small. If the width is 4 feet then the crew will need to be lined up in a straight line, and your armor will be much smaller. You have to take into account the arm and leg room for the crew, along with the armor.
Everything else that needs to be said has been. Listen to Crookfur and Beddgelert lol. I admit that I am a noob concerning vehicles.

(OOC: Heh, sorry for more OOC, but if Dawiz doesn't mind me saying so, I think you're better off listening to Crookfur. Oh, and cheers for that handy source there, Crook! Nice timing, as I'm in the middle of designing a crappier tank force for one of BG's many manifestations!

Dawiz... 24 foot is not long for a tank. It's what, 7.3 metres or so? Nine or ten is quite normal for a modern MBT, so a couple of metres less than that may not be at all unreasonable for a medium tank if it's modern, which I had thought we could assume from the use of reactive armour. As for it being more like an APC's length, well, perhaps the archetype of the (tracked) APC, the basic M113, is half the length of a typical modern tank, not a greater length. A more minor nitpick would be that it isn't necessarily the commander who operates the roof mounted MG. On some tanks the AA MG -if one is even fitted- is over the loader's position.
I don't see that he's actually specified the type of reactive armour, either. For all we know it could be non-explosive reactive armour.

All in all, though, I admit to being utterly confused by this design. The baffling 4-foot width and 1942ish armour strength seem like the work of any random n00b with no clue, but then some effort seems to have been put into other aspects. The engine I don't understand at all, for better or worse. 7,830hp in a 4-foot space with external combustion of whatever you feel like? 'tis starting to read as if this may be a joke thread... I might go and read more by the OP to see whether he's a lunatic or just pulling our collective leg ;) )

((No problem with ignoring me lol. I am surviving merely on gut feeling, and what I'v read in books lol. I don't dedicate my life or anything to this, so I doubt I know as much as those who do massive research lmfao. I figured that 24 feet would be a bit long because you can fit four people, average height of 6 feet, lying down head to tow. Seems a bit long IMO, but then I'm not one who puts alot of looksy into modern vehicles lol. Sorry for more OOC. I didn't know that the AA-MG is normaly over the gunners position lol. I also didn't know there was more than one type of reactive armor...Guess I had better learn to keep my nose out of things in the future lol...))

OOC: Sutufinai's nation is one that has no oil, thus their machinery is what most modern nations consider rudimentary. A vast majority of his equipment is steam powered and his nation's technology level isn't advanced that far since they have no oil. That is why this tank seems strange to so many nations. The reason it is a like a design from WWI is because his technology is still from their era.

IC: The Federation of Oseato is willing to supply whatever materials are needed for the Rouge Nation of Sutufinai to produce these are a large enough scale as needed for the Rouge Nation. Any heavy machinery or extensive manufacturing that need be done can be provided by Oseaton factories if your nation so wishes. We extend this offer as a sign of friendship and cooperation as the relationship between our countries grows.

OOC:That makes alot of sense then. Never mind with what I'v said lol.

Sutufinai's nation is one that has no oil, thus their machinery is what most modern nations rudimentary. A vast majority of his equipment is steam powered, and his nation's technology level isn't advanced that far. That is why this tank seems strange to so many nations. The reason it is a like a design from WWI is because his technology is still from their era.

(OOC: Heh, in my nation, people out-number barrels of proven oil reserves, so I don't think natural resources have much to do with development. If they did, Europe would probably not have slaughtered its way across Africa, Asia, and the Americas ;)

Anyway, right, okay, it's weird-tech, fair enough, but I think Crook's comments still stand. If his tech is sub-par for modern times, then the engine power is even further out. I don't know much about modern external combustion engines, but moving a 45-ton vehicle at 50mph on land with an engine crammed into a 4-foot-wide space? And the width issue at least needs a bit more explaining... is it, like, a bicycle, or something?

Ah, well, I'm going on too much, probably because of insomnia. I'll shush.

Oh, I seem to have switched accounts. Beddgelert has been Anglicised mid-thread. Hm.)

I modified the post somewhat, I read some numbers and words wrong. My bad, I think it's a bit more into the liking of everybody.

Sutufinai, went Isolationist in the latter days of World War Two. It literally had no outside contact because of the harsh terrain it is situated in. Because of this, and the lack of Petrol-based fuel, Sutufinai had no vehicles and built no vehicles. They are just beginning to upgrade their arsenal.

The reason there is an "Electronics Operator" as well as a "Loader" is because 67% of Sutufinai doesn't even have electricity to the country. Let alone computers. So a specially trained Electronics operator was added. On top of this, the Autocannon can be loaded with "Strip" clips like the older 40mm BOFORs guns. While the design of the weapon is completely different, as well as the ammunition... Because of dangerous things like the idea of EMP, or other debilitating things such as jamming or damage to the system running the Autocannon... A loader was included to assist in loading the weapon should it break. When not working the gun, the "loader" uses either his own personal weapon (regular infantry weapons are inside the tank's turret, strapped to the wall) or the Pintle mounted weapon to defend the tank from enemy infantry.

ooc:that is cool, but it still wouldent give you over 5000hp. the top RL tank engines in operation today are 1500 hp

OOC: Modified to 1,250 Horsepower.