NationStates Jolt Archive

ooc: Im going to have to make a minority in ND to be the terrorists, like how the US views Muslims in its borders. Please dont respond with "OMG NO WAI DIS MEANS WAR DAWG!"
And before I get "OMG RACIST I IZ NOT MINORITY"
Minority: Less then majority. As in There arent a bunch of Fanboyists living here. About...Lets say a quarter of a million.

IC:

Head of State Robert Hamson, along with several military and police officials have formed a press conference in front of Logistical Command HQ.
http://intelligencemilitary.com/cia_jobs/T304457A.jpg
They have decided to reinstate the use of torture on suspected terrorists and the relocation of Fanboyists citizens
Its sunny, and General Freidrick is the first to walk to the podium.

"I would like to welcome the members of the press who have come here today, for State Head Robert Hamson has issued an order to reinstate torture on suspected terrorists. Members of his staff support this tough stance on terrorism, and see it as an effective way to combat the increasingly violent anarchist group calling themselves the "Freedom League. I thank you again for coming, here is State Head Robert Hamson with the official announcement. Questions may be asked once he has finished."

Freidrick steps down, and shakes hands with Hamson as he stands up and walks to the podium. Light applause ripples through the crowd when he steps up. He speaks in great bellows, shouting into the microphone with great passion

"In order to combat the anarchists, we must be merciless! They terrorize the people! They kill in the name of facism! I call upon the people of North Defese to be firm and give no quarter! Torture is the only way to get to these people! They are no longer human, they turn into animals! They strap dynamite to children and have them walk into stores, taking innocent lives! I will no longer tolerate terrorism in this nation. Because of the fact most of the acts commited by the 'Freedom League' where done so by Fanboyists citizens, all Fanboyist citizens are hereby demanded to submit to investigations by ISAD (Internal Security Affairs Department) officers or face deportation!"

He pauses to take a drink from a glass of water on the podium for continuing, slightly calmer.

"I have also authorized the use of torture on suspected terrorists currently detained in North Defesian territory. Tactics include:
Breaking chemical lights and pouring the phosphoric liquid on detainees;
Threatening detainees with a charged 9mm pistol;
Pouring cold water on naked detainees;
Beating detainees with a broom handle and a chair;
Threatening male detainees with rape;
Allowing a military police guard to stitch the wound of a detainees who are injured after being slammed against the wall in their cells;
Sodomizing a detainee with a chemical light and perhaps a broom stick.
Using military working dogs to frighten and intimidate detainees with threats of attack, and in one instance actually biting a detainee.
These tactics are the only way to show the anarchists we mean business. Thank you, and I will now answer your questions..."

ooc: I'm too tired to make up some major condemnation of your actions tonight, but I will post tomorrow.

"In order to combat the anarchists, we must be merciless! They terrorize the people! They kill in the name of facism!


((OOC: Fascism and Anarchism are opposites, and members of either ideology tend to hate the hell out of each other.))

ooc: Yes but the common people dont know that do they? They hear the words Anarchist and Facist and think biker gangs and Hitler. Which is just what the goverment wants.

They are acually terrorists, killing in the name of "democrocy"

((OOC: Actually, the common citizen would know that... have you ever heard an Anarchist speak without accusing everything of being "Oppressive Fascist Corporate Puppets"?))

(OOC: it is ND's nation, they can say his people are as stupid, and in the dark as they want.)

David Kukoomonga asked of Robert Hamson, "Hello, Sir, I am David Kukoomonga, with Goshawk Tonight. My question is twofold. Firstly, what does this mean for other minorities in your nation, should they fear the same could happen to them? Secondly what are your plans, if any to prevent an international scare, and have your tourism industry collapse overnight?"

Office of International Espionage and Tourism

Cedric Hapins, was standing, with a crowd of people, huddled around the flat screen, watching David Kukoomonga and Robert Hamson, as a press conference was unfolding half a world away. The implications of this press conference, were multifold. First, what would this mean from an intelligence standpoint, and second, and most important, what would this mean from a touristic standpoint.

((OOC: Yes, but still, even with the Anarchists and Hitler picture, a simpleton would know that Nazi Germany was far from lawless. It's common sense, really. But whatever, I'm just going to eventually post stating that should Fanboyists decide to invade, we'll assist them, as they are members of the IFA.))

OOC: Ah, seeing as this involves my nationals within his borders (though I'm unsure how they got there, seeing as immigration to any nation that has ever been at war with me is intensely difficult), I believe it is time for me to step in.
Actually, your country could be a haven for exiled communists from my country, as I expelled most of them a while back.
Also, GWO, its all-right. If he wants to make his people can be that miseducated and blind, let them be that way. Propaganda can be pretty powerful.


IC:
The General stared at the report from his intelligence officers in North Defese.
"So...we help them avoid getting annihilated by vengeful forces, and this is how we're repayed? I highly doubt people from the here would be protesting or fighting for democracy. I mean seriously, they practically begged us to rescue them from democracy twice!"
He glared at the report again. "Besides, how the hell did these people get in there? I thought we had emmigration to North Defese strictly controlled."
His aide shook his head. "Where do you think all those communists went? If I recall correctly, only a handful took your amnesty and came back."
"Oh shit. It'll look bad if we don't help our people abroad, but I'd rather puke my guts out than go crawling through shit to help our socialists and communists."
"Amnesty is amnesty, sir. You accepted them back under our protection. You could make the argument that we're too busy to help..."
Grimmeberger gave him that stoney look that promptly shut him up.
"Can't let 'em go. Bad for PR. Besides, we want some of that manpower back, anyway. Who better to crush the RBPA the next time it flares up than socialists? That will really destroy the rebel's fighting spirit!"
"Right you are, sir," the aide said rather weakly.
"Prepare a formal response at once."
"Absolutely, sir!"


From the Desk of Generalissimo Steven Phillip Grimmeberger

To General Robert Hamson

We have gotten wind of your harsh treatment of our nationals living within your borders. We will not stand for it.

First, any of those so-called "Anarchist-Fascist" rebels are highly unlikely to be Fanboyists, as most every true Fanboyist would rather chew off his or her leg than live in total disorder. Democracy gave us enough of that.

Second, the treatment of the rest is a purely racist policy, and therefore must be condemned by all civilized nations of the world.

Furthermore, your use of torture is, besides any moral objections, must be highlighted as counter-productive. Most people will confess to anything if put under enough coercion. If you truely wish to find those truely responsible, you must work to win the hearts and minds of those who may shelter those who fight you.

At this time, I am withdrawing any diplomatic personnel within your borders, and I must remind you that, due to the seperate nature of this conflict, we are not bound by the cease-fire and peace treaty regarding the previous Defesian War, or any of the terms contained within. If this unfair treatment of our nationals does not cease within one week, your country will be considered fair game for the use of military force in order to secure the safety of our people.

I hope you understand what you are doing.

From,
Generalissimo Steven P. Grimmeberger
Head of State, Fanboyist Federation of North Atlantic Territories (FFNAT)
Commander-in-Chief, Federal Armed Forces

PS - I'm sure the 44th would love to pay y'all a visit. Capiche?

To: Generalissimo Steven Phillip Grimmeberger
From: Logistical Command Director Saldin

We will question fanboyist citizens suspected of terrorist activities, if they have nothing to hide, they have nothing to fear. We are also investigating other violent minorities suspected of aiding the facist rebels, and public camera's have proven that 24% of the terror attacks were commited by a person of fanboyist nationality. Numbers dont lie.
On another note, our interoggation techniques are whatever the bloody hell we want them to be.
-----------------
Press conference
"Hello, Sir, I am David Kukoomonga, with Goshawk Tonight. My question is twofold. Firstly, what does this mean for other minorities in your nation, should they fear the same could happen to them? Secondly what are your plans, if any to prevent an international scare, and have your tourism industry collapse overnight?"

"We will only be investigating people suspected of aiding the terrorists, and the majority of suspected terrorists are of Fanboyist nationality. We have also arrested several Takaram's in a rundown neighborhood after reports of gang violence.
And I have no fear of our tourism business collapsing, we are working hard to make the streets safe for our citizens and any visitors to our nation."

((OOC: Fascism and Anarchism are opposites, and members of either ideology tend to hate the hell out of each other.))

OOC: Just throwing my two cents in:
As an aside, fascist governments have done something similar (that is: condemning two completely different ideologies (in the case of fascism: anarchism and communism) while not maintaining a distinction).

Communist nations do the same in loathing fascists and anarchists, although atleast most of those nations make a minimal distinction between fascism and anarchism.

As an aside, all three like to gang up on the republic-style democracy folks, who return the favor.

OOC:Interesting, very interesting.
My two-cents on the facist/anarchist fight: All people who are radical in a violent way in their beleifs, be they anarchist, despotism, facism, democracy, or what-have you will always technically be anarchist in a sense that they will cause hurt, death, etc to get their point across. Now, isn't this off his topic a bit?

Grimmeberger wrote the next message personnally, hand-written. It was messy, but legible.


To Whom it May Concern within
The Horribly Dense and Broken-Minded Government of Robert Hamson,

Are you, in fact, aware that 24% is not a majority? Therefore, Fanboyist nationals are not responsible for the majority of attacks, according to your own statistics. If you're going to shut the goddamn truth up, at least do it right! Evidently, either the numbers are lying, or you are. Which is it?

Second, I am noting the issue of torture simply from our own country's personal experience. We used torture for a short time, until we found out we could, in fact, make people confess to stealing Little Bo Peep's goddamn sheep. That is not an exaggeration. We seriously managed to make people confess to that under torture, in addition to their other crimes. In short, if you are going to be torturing anyone who is the slightest bit suspicious, you'll be torturing innocent people to the point where they will confess to doing all sorts of shit they didn't do, just so the torture will stop. And I guarentee, if you aren't finding real terror plots now, if you keep it up, you'll be finding real and fake ones galore.

Finally, as stated before, I'm sure Field Marshal Hohenzorn and the 44th would be happy to pay a goddamn visit, if you get my meaning. They got this wierd itch on their trigger fingers. Its caused by radiation, I believe. And, oh, I'm aware that your current government isn't responsible for that, but soldiers tend to forget technicalities like that real easy.

Consider this your second warning. You are familiar with baseball, no?

Think carefully.

Generalissimo Steven P. Grimmeberger
Head of State, Fanboyist Federation of North Atlantic Territories (FFNAT)
Commander-in-Chief, Federal Armed Forces

Message to Grimmeberger
From Robert Hamson

You speak as though we are torturing every Fanboyist we meet! Anyone suspected of terrorism is arrested, and we are investigating the Fanboyists more intently due to our recent war caused by the schizophrenic chancellor before me.

And I am thinking carefully. Im putting the peoples safety first, and to do that I must eliminate anything that threatens this nations well-being.
Be it terrorists, anarchists, or other individuals that could threaten this nations well-being.


ooc: On a unrelated note, what would happen if a unmarked gunman tried to take out Steven P. and you couldent prove ND did it?

OOC: I hope you guys don't mind, but I'm exceedingly bored being gainfully unemployed... If you do, just inform me by telegram or something.

IC:

The Minister of Defense sighed as he sat down at the table with the King and the remainder of the Cabinet. Whoever declared that the righteous had the moral obligation to combat evil had certainly never been placed in realpolitik. Here he was, Minister of Defense of a resolute capitalist republic about to suggest that said state intercede on behalf of a bunch of no-good pathetic authoritarian nationalists who on top of it happened to have been expelled from their nation of origin for being nutjob communists, and were now accused of being both facist and anarchists. Whoever wrote the Book of Rand really should have included a chapter about not sticking up for the rights of imbeciles and fools. Then again, he supposed that would undermine the entire argument about their moral superiority. Well, one can't have everything in the world.

King Elerossë Oronar smiled at the discomfort of his Defense minister. He'd already read the briefing. Surely a good show of moral condemnation would suffice to satisfy most people they were on the right side. Besides, by all accounts he'd heard, the nation of origin for the opressed peoples was more than capable of making any intervention militarily that it deemed necessary. "Minister, I believe we've all read the report you've prepared, so lets skip it. The Minister of Justice has confirmed that the actions taken are in contradiction of the principles of Capitalism as extolled in the Book of Rand."

The assembled Ministers nodded their assent. The Minister of Defense then proceeded to list available options, "There would be no point in placing an embargo, as to my knowledge we don't have much in the way of direct trade with them, though our lack of a method of tracking such a thing makes it rather impossible to judge, but at any rate, given the difference in size the advantage would certainly be to them anyway. Any unilateral military action is suicidal, and besides which would likely incur large public backlash since other nations are better posed to deal with the situation.

King Oronar nodded at the minister. "I think the best course of action is to simply offer our moral outrage and condemnation in regards to the actions taken and offer moral and limited material support to other entities that may seek to resolve the conflict. So say you?"

Around the table the Ministers of Justice, Defense, Treasury/Commerce and State replied with the ceremonial agreeance "Yes, so say I." The King nodded deciding that he would write the letter later, having instead more pressing business to attend to at the current time than a far off conflict on a people that he frankly didn't give a flying rat's ass over. "Now that that is handled, shall we discuss the actions required to bring ourselves into compliance with the body politic of the World Assembley?


Bureau de Roi
Les Affaires Internationals
Pour Concerned Nations
Par I Eldalante
RE: The situation regarding Ethnic Fanboyists Within the North Defese State

Dear Messieurs et/ou Mesdames as You Are:

The Eldlantean Government prides itself in general for refraining from interfering in items that are essentially matters of internal affairs of other nations, viewing them as sovereign entities entitled to deference in running their own affairs, believing in the end that all imperfect systems are doomed to eventually collapse under their own weight.

However, we must also remember that evil exists only by the sanction that we give it. In remembering this, we must also remember that to wantonly disregard the well being and rights of people who hold beliefs contrary to our own is to sanction the underlying evil involved, and thus we must in the end balance these interests.

Recent developments in the North Defese state give rise to considerable concern and very strongly tip the scale. The atrocities committed within that area have become a considerable threat to international peace and stability and as such are wanting of resolution, even if it means commenting upon and interfering in the sovereign affairs of the nation(s) in question to preserve international peace.

To this end, let the following be known:
1. The Eldalantean state condemns terrorism in all forms as a method to effect any sort of change. We remind all people that the initiation of the use of force, even against an unfair regime, is to engage in an evil that makes us no better than that which we fight.

2. We further condemn the gross violations of the inherent rights of man that the government of North Drefese has admitting to committing. We ask that they truly consider the ramifications of their actions and asks themselves if the instability and potential conflict they are inviting, aside from the moral wrong they are committing, can truly be justified by ANY amount of desirable outcomes stemming from these practices.

3. We recommend restraint from all parties in the effort to preserve international peace and stability and prevent the scourge of armed conflict from occurring, despite it being good for business.

4. Nonetheless offer moral and what material support we may to any action that ultimately rectifies the current situation and restores the rule of law and international peace.

OOC: To ND; odds are, the assassination attempt would fail: there is a full batallion of Shock Troopers (Elite Infantry) guarding the Presidential Palace at this point, as well as massive amounts of security throughout Vienna, as my country is in the midst of putting down a Communist insurgent organization. Beyond that, others have attempted to kill Grimmeberger before, and it must be born in mind, regardless of the fact that he is in his 60's, he is very fit, seeing as he still considers himself a soldier, and acts like one, including maintaining fitness requirements. He has, in his 50's, killed people in hand to hand combat. Asside from that, he carries his service revolver on him at almost everytime, including keeping it at his bedside while sleeping. He's just a tad paranoid.

So basically, an unmarked gunman could try, but he would probably die, without hitting his target. On the otherhand, he might just succeed, but its unlikely. As for being unmarked...such as it is, the country would probably attribute it to the Reds and their insurgency, and you'd probably get away with it.

However, if your gunman succeeded, there is a set-up line of succession, and Field Marshal Erik Hohenzorn (remember him?) would replace him, and I'm sure he would try to find an excuse for war.

By the way, I saw that post here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=589322). So I know what you're thinking, and I'm okay with it.

As for Eldalante: aww man...I wanted a war... *sad*

To Robert Hamson
From Generalissimo Grimmeberger
Re: Searches and Sweeps

That may be true (our recent war), however, I would note that it would be more efficient for you to go based entirely on evidence gathered, then make arrests: you're more likely to catch the real culprits, and miss those that are innocent. Alternately, if they are causing that much trouble, send them to South Defese: I'm sure they could use the population boost, and if these people stand against your government, they can't complain if they are outside of it. Of course, we would need to see what the South thinks of this.

To Robert Hamson
From Generalissimo Andrew Filie

I am aware of Generalissimo Grimmeberger's earlier message to you, and I would like to make an addition: be aware of Executive Order #229, especially the last two paragraphs. Thank you.

A copy of the Executive Order is attached.

Thank you, have a nice day.

Executive Order #229: Amnesty for Exiled Federals

Any former citizen or legal resident of the Fanboyist Federation of North Atlantic Territories (henceforth referred to as FFNAT) that has had citizenship, legal residency, or basic rights guarenteed under the Federal Constitution deprived or restricted under Executive Order #93 is hereby granted full pardon and amnesty. Those incarcerated or prosecuted for other crimes committed's prosecution or incarceration will stand.

Those who have had property seized under Executive Order #93 will be provided adequete compensation, should they opt to return to FFNAT and resume citizenship or legal residency. Property siezed under other orders or other grounds are excluded from this order.

Businesses, government agencies, or other employers may not use religion or ideology as criterion when hiring aforementioned citizens or legal residents.

No place of business, government agency or office may refuse sales or service to anyone based on religion or ideology.

Former citizens and legal residents (henceforth referred to as "exiles") who have settled outside the borders or legal jursidiction of FFNAT may, where the number of exiles exceeds 2,500, claim full protection for their population from the Federation, even if their community should exist within the borders of another nation-state, city-state, confederation, district, or international entity. Federal law shall be extended to such populations, in addition to local law and regulation. However, should cruel, unusual, or overtly harsh punishment or treatment ensue at the hands of another nation, action shall be required by the Federation to ensure the safety and integrity of rights of the aforementioned population.

All persons, businesses, offices, or government agencies may face charges of Obstruction of Justice, Failure to Comply with an Executive Order, Willful Ignorance of the Law, and Unjust Deprivation of Rights of a Federal Citizen, including fines no higher than IB$4,500 in the case of individuals, and no higher than IB$10,000,000 for businesses, removal from office (for government employees, officials, or officers), and/or 10 years of jail time, based on the seriousness of the offence and the number of offences committed by an individual, business, office, or other entity. Foreign entities that attempt to hinder the protection of Federal citizens are to be considered hostile, and may merit the use of the Federal Armed Forces to bring such external Federal populations into compliance with this order.

Officially it was a test of a new guidance system, officially it was planned months in advance, and officially it was totally unrelated to the Fanboyist's recent threats.

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v442/n7098/images/442018a-i1.0.jpg
A large wasteland in North Defese, at least 300 miles of complete desert devoid of life, was for a long time used as a military testing nuclear and non-nuclear weapons. It hasnt been used in 4 years, but now the sky is lit up at night...

Watch Bunker 7#
The bunker was placed out of the range of the blast, and the foot thick cement surrounding them should protect them from any radiation. The scientists squinted at the horizen, while others sat around drinking coffee and playing chess, waiting for HQ to confirm the missiles launch. It was a small Strategic nuclear weapon, only 22 kilotons in this case. The scientists where told it was a test and they where to act accordingly, but they knew better.

Observation ("weather") satellites had tipped the Federal Armed Forces off weeks in advance that a nuclear weapon was to be tested by a government still considered hostile to the Federation, and had acted accordingly, prepping the missile defense system in advance. Even if it was a test, "misfires" happen all the time. No reason not to be careful. On top of the fact that Steven Grimmeberger, the Secretary of State, was notoriously paranoid, and still had a lot of influence with the new head of state, and the military. So the Federation military was prepping accordingly, wiht all military leadership spreading out, especially FM Erik Hohenzorn, who was, in fact, gathering a force in the event that an invasion of North Defese became necessary. Not to mention that the negotiations being performed by the heads of government were being conducted outside the city of Vienna (as was standard procedure anyway, even when not on alert).

Hamson read the report on his new polished wood desk.
"They are running like chickens with the head cut off...hehehe!"
"Sir?"
He looked up startled, forgetting the Logistical agent was there.
"Nothing, erm, thank you for the report."
"Yes sir"
The officer saluted, then left, leaving Hamson alone in the large room with nothing but the eyes of the paintings boring down on him.
No wonder the Chancellor went insane.
related to another thread:
He began to read the rest of his report, which told of a nation called Bohivia declaring war on another nation he currently had trade negotiations with. Cerska would lose billions if Bohivia lost its oil reserves if it was apparent it was picking a fight too big for it to handle, and the layoffs could hurt the economy some. So he ordered a general mobilization of the armed forces and an increase to Defcon 3. He would have a press conference later.
He didnt even think of the fact the fanboyists might get the wrong idea...

Generalissimo Andrew Filie looked at the report on his desk. Then Grimmeberger took a look at it too. It detailed a general mobilization in North Defese. With the missile on the launch pad...

"Are these guys retarded or something?" Grimmeberger asked, incredulous.
"Apparently. Are they aware that we can take 'em out?"
"You'd think, seeing as a relatively small expeditionary force managed to wreck half of their military earlier this year."
"Geez. Colossal stupidity."
"I know, and to think. I actually thought this leader would be smart."
"Well...what do you think? I'm thinking we issue an ultimatum and start turning a few extra divisions to Hohenzorn's command."
"Are you trying to start a war? If we're wrong, we'll have threatened 'em into a war that wasn't necessary."
"And if we're right?"
"No harm done. Except to them."
"So what are you suggesting, then?"
"Add a few divisions onto Hohenzorn's command. Tell 'em that we're watching, so they need to tread carefully."
"Alright, then. You're sure?"
"Absolutely. At the very least, this guy has some common sense, not at all like their last leader."
"Alright, then."

And so, the following orders and messages were issued.

Executive Directive 22328
Due to a recent increase in military activity by North Defese, Infantry Divisions 11, 33, 34, 55, 43, 23, 31, 42, and 12, as well as Armoured Divisions 11 Prinz Eugen von Savoyen, 33 John Churchill, 24 Sir William Howe, and 14 William Alexander are to be transferred to the command of Field Marshal Erik Hohenzorn, to be added to the Reserve Expeditionary Force. The aforementioned units are to be combat ready within two weeks of issuance of this order.

Generalissimo Andrew Filie; CiC, Federal Armed Forces
Field Marshal Fedor von Wallenstein; CiC, Federal Army
and

From the Desk of Generalissimo Andrew C. Filie

To Head of State Robert Hamson, North Defese

Our independent observers have noted increased activity from your military, including preparation to launch or "test" a missile with a nuclear warhead, and a general mobilization of the military. Such actions may be regarded as hostile, and, if you do not stand down, future actions by the North Defesian military may, depending on what actions or maneuvers occur, be considered hostile by the Federal Armed Forces, and may merit a military response.

This is your final warning.

From,
Generalissimo Andrew C. Filie
Head of State, Fanboyist Federation of North Atlantic Territories
Commander-in-Chief, Federal Armed Forces

To: Generalissimo Andrew C. Filie
From: Logistical Command Director Robert
-
Once again you throw demands and ultimatiums without doing any investigation whatsoever, and prove to us your unconditional hostile stance towards this nation. Our nuclear test was planned months in advance, and the mobilization is due to a increase of alert levels which was changed due to the threat of a war with a business partner being threatnened with invasion. We are working to defend our allies and you now attempt to deny is the right to protect those we work with.
Your nation seems to jump the gun very often, I hope that dosent lead you to making a mistake.

Signed,
Robert Pierce

To LCD Robert Pierce
From State-General Steven Grimmeberger
-
We maintain a hostile stance at this point, good sir, because you have oppressed our citizens (who are still considered under our protection, under EO#229), and during a time of heightened tension, undergone a spike in military activity without so much as an explanation that it is not directed at us. It would be criminally stupid not to treat your recent actions with hostility.

As for the nuclear test, as we lack acess to your records (logically), we have no way of knowing how far in advance such tests are planned. For all we knew, it could have been planned months in advance, or it could have been a spur-of-the-moment let's-intimidate-the-Fanboyists thing.

And we do not jump the gun. We have given you three warnings. If we jumped the gun, we would have slagged half your cities by now. We informed you of the other two warnings.

Signed.
Steven Grimmeberger
Secretary of State
Field Marshal, Federal Army

OOC: Don't you just love the murkiness of international relations, communications, and politics?