NationStates Jolt Archive

OOC:

As some players may already be aware, I have not taken much time to work on my national military forces. Essentially, I am in serious need of advice from more experienced players who know the ins and outs of dealing with your nation’s armed forces. So, any valid advice that can be of help to me is welcome.

This is my first attempt at creating a cohesive military factbook. So far, I have left most manpower figures as round numbers for ease of use, and made the organization system modular to make RPing easier. Other than equipment lists, ranks, and a few financial details pertaining to spending and budgets, I have little in the way of a developed military thus far.

This has not served as too much of a hindrance, as I have not had to fight a real war on NS or sent troops into combat (amazing, I have used the forums since September 2007, and not had a war).

Any advice on how to organize the forces into logistics, combat, etc. is welcome. I especially need some ratios for supporting units. Cost and price of equipment is not to much of an issue right now; although I have a sizable force, quality is highly valued, perhaps more so than quantity.

So, without further ado, here is my rough factbook.

MILITARY FACTBOOK OF THE IMPERIAL FEDERATION OF THE MONAVIAN EMPIRE

DRAFT VERSION

General Information:

Members of the Monavian National Defense Council:

1. Marshal of the Army
2. Admiral of the Navy
3. Marshall of the Marines
4. Admiral of the Coast Guard
5. Marshal of the Air Force
6. Director of Military Intelligence
7. Deputy Minister of Defense
8. Minister of Defense (chairman and superior)
9. Director of the Monavian National Intelligence Administration

Minimum military age: 20 years
Percentage of total population in the Monavian military:
Available manpower: 7,520,000
Manpower fit for service: 318,543,100 citizens

Spending:

Percent of government budget spent on military: 10%
Military expenditures: $649,467,877,586.91
Expenditures in USD: $915,749,707,397.54
Amount spent per individual service member: $86,365.41
Amount spent in USD: $121,775.23

Breakdown of Service Branches:

Monavian Imperial Army: 900,000
Monavian Imperial Navy: 900,000
Monavian Imperial Air Forces: 900,000
Monavian Marine Corps: 750,000
Monavian Royal Coast Guard: 10,000
Monavian Imperial Army Reserve: 800,000
Monavian Imperial Navy Reserve: 800,000
Monavian Imperial Air Forces Reserve: 800,000
Monavian Marine Corps Reserve: 550,000
Monavian Royal Coast Guard Reserve: 5,000
Imperial National Guard: 1,100,000
Royal Guard: 5,000

Total regular service members: 3,465,000
Total reserve members: 4,055,000

Total: 7,520,000

Organization:

Platoon: 20
Company: 100
Battalion: 500
Regiment: 2,500
Brigade: 5,000
Division: 25,000
Corps: 100,000

Navy:

Naval Assets:

FIRST FLOTILLA:

1 Mayfield class super carrier
2 Constitution class missile frigates
2 King Basil II class medium cruisers
1 Heracles class missile submarine
1 Interceptor class hunter-killer submarine
2 Tiberius class attack submarines
5 Falcon class destroyers
2 Whitman class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Tornado class destroyer escorts
3 Pelican class patrol boats

SECOND FLOTILLA:

1 Valencia class aircraft carrier
2 Armadillo class missile frigates
2 Glacier class medium cruisers
1 Timberwolf class missile submarine
1 Albatross class hunter-killer submarine
2 Chariot class attack submarines
5 Tethys class destroyers
2 Hickory class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Liberty class destroyer escorts
3 Magnolia class patrol boats

THIRD FLOTILLA:

1 Mayfield class super carrier
2 Constitution class missile frigates
2 King Basil II class medium cruisers
1 Heracles class missile submarine
1 Interceptor class hunter-killer submarine
2 Tiberius class attack submarines
5 Falcon class destroyers
2 Whitman class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Tornado class destroyer escorts
3 Pelican class patrol boats

FOURTH FLOTILLA:

1 Valencia class aircraft carrier
2 Armadillo class missile frigates
2 Glacier class medium cruisers
1 Timberwolf class missile submarine
1 Albatross class hunter-killer submarine
2 Chariot class attack submarines
5 Tethys class destroyers
2 Hickory class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Liberty class destroyer escorts
3 Magnolia class patrol boats

FIFTH FLOTILLA:

1 Mayfield class super carrier
2 Constitution class missile frigates
2 King Basil II class medium cruisers
1 Heracles class missile submarine
1 Interceptor class hunter-killer submarine
2 Tiberius class attack submarines
5 Falcon class destroyers
2 Whitman class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Tornado class destroyer escorts
3 Pelican class patrol boats

SIXTH FLOTILLA:

1 Valencia class aircraft carrier
2 Armadillo class missile frigates
2 Glacier class medium cruisers
1 Timberwolf class missile submarine
1 Albatross class hunter-killer submarine
2 Chariot class attack submarines
5 Tethys class destroyers
2 Hickory class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Liberty class destroyer escorts
3 Magnolia class patrol boats

SEVENTH FLOTILLA (dry docked):

1 Mayfield class super carrier
2 Constitution class missile frigates
2 King Basil II class medium cruisers
1 Heracles class missile submarine
1 Interceptor class hunter-killer submarine
2 Tiberius class attack submarines
5 Falcon class destroyers
2 Whitman class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Tornado class destroyer escorts
3 Pelican class patrol boats

EIGHTH FLOTILLA (dry docked):

1 Valencia class aircraft carrier
2 Armadillo class missile frigates
2 Glacier class medium cruisers
1 Timberwolf class missile submarine
1 Albatross class hunter-killer submarine
2 Chariot class attack submarines
5 Tethys class destroyers
2 Hickory class minesweepers
1 Triton class amphibious assault ship
1 Phoenix class oilier
2 Liberty class destroyer escorts
3 Magnolia class patrol boats

Army:

*under construction*

Air Force:

*under construction*

Marines:

*under construction*

Coast Guard:

*under construction*

Ranking:

Grades:

A1 (5 star)
A2 (4 star)
A3 (3 star)
A4 (2 star)
A5 (1 star)
B11 (officer)
B10 (officer)
B9 (officer)
B8 (officer)
B7 (officer)
B6 (officer)
B5 (enlisted)
B4 (enlisted)
B3 (enlisted)
B2 (enlisted)
B1 (enlisted)

Army Ranks:

Marshal of the Army
Field Marshal
Vice Field Marshal
General
Commander
Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Captain
Major
First Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Staff Sergeant
Sergeant First Class
Sergeant Second Class
Corporal
Private

Navy Ranks:

Admiral of the Navy
Grand Admiral
Admiral
Lieutenant Admiral
Rear Admiral
Commodore
Captain
Vice Captain
First Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Ensign
Midshipman
Chief Petty Officer
Petty Officer
Seaman First Class
Seaman

Marine Ranks:

Marshal of the Marines
Field Marshal
Vice Field Marshal
General
Commander
Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Captain
Major
First Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Staff Sergeant
Sergeant First Class
Sergeant Second Class
Corporal
Private

Air Force Ranks:

Marshal of the Air Force
Air Marshal
Vice Air Marshal
Senior Commander
Commander
Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
Captain
Major
First Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Staff Sergeant
Senior Airman
Airman First Class
Airman Second Class
Airman

Coast Guard Ranks:

Admiral of the Coast Guard
Grand Admiral
Admiral
Lieutenant Admiral
Rear Admiral
Commodore
Captain
Vice Captain
First Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
Ensign
Midshipman
Chief Petty Officer
Petty Officer
Seaman First Class
Seaman

You could use some cut-backs on your active military.
A 25/75 split between active and resserve would be plenty.
Navy, army, and air-force should contain different organizational structures.


Your small-unit (coy+plt) sizes are relatively small.
Your divisional size seems large.
Seem to lack info on the mud-cruncher's loadout
(which a headache and a half to fabricate)


Aircraft would be grouped in squadrons of twelve or fifteen.


I don't readily recognize the ship classes, if you can find links for quick refferance, please use them.
Capships don't seem well enough protected.

You could use some cut-backs on your active military.

I am planning on reducing it somewhat for my next yearly fatbook update.

A 25/75 split between active and resserve would be plenty.

I would prefer a slightly less lopsided ratio. Nonetheless, reducing the number of active troops can have a positive effect upon its organizational system.

Navy, army, and air-force should contain different organizational structures.

Could you please elaborate? I know that air forces are based around the forms of aircraft in service and the amount of support which is required, and that naval units also determine how a navy is organized.

Your small-unit (coy+plt) sizes are relatively small.
Your divisional size seems large.

The forces are initially designed to be organized in a modular fashion. Tyhe rule was that there would be five platoons in a company, five companies in a battalion, five battalions in a regiment, etc. I used a figure of 5,000 for a brigade, since I am familiar with it being around that size.

The issue about divisions is that they need to be larger than brigades, and just having two or three in a division would not fit very well.

Perhaps you could provide me with some numbers to help me understand your point (again, I'm not an expert, so I may need some filling in).

Seem to lack info on the mud-cruncher's loadout
(which a headache and a half to fabricate)

I will deal with the equipment list, but generally, I prefer not to go into too much detail about what each individual infantryman carries at the moment, since I am looking to build a good framework first, and then attach details later on.

Aircraft would be grouped in squadrons of twelve or fifteen.

Understood; aircraft typically fly in triangular or line formations, so these numbers work perfectly.

I don't readily recognize the ship classes, if you can find links for quick refferance, please use them.

These are my own original ship classes. To add a degree of originality to the whole thing, I am inventing some of my own equipment. Since I haven't had to RP any war or use them yet (shocking!), I haven't written up the details of their design or any specifics about them. Those, however, will be forthcoming.

Capships don't seem well enough protected.

Could you please provide me with some suggestions?

I personally wouldn't worry about revising your overall manpower strengths provided you're within 0.5% of your total population so as not to brankrupt yourself. At the other end of the scale, tho, a platoon strenth under 30 personnel will find it hard to sustain operations. Also, imho, I would boost the size of the army at the expense of the air force total, which presently has far too many people in it for the number of aircraft you could possibly field, even factoring for logistics.

The problem with your ground forces is that you don't account for support troops. Your companies are 100 men, which is five platoons of 20. Where is the company CO, XO, and senior NCO? Also, most rifle companies have a mortar section and some radiomen and the like attached. The battalion has even more attachments. US Army battalions have 700 or so men and about 200 or so of those are in the HHC (HQ and HQ Company). The same is true is of brigades and divisions.

Check out this link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_organization) for more details.

I would boost the size of the army at the expense of the air force total, which presently has far too many people in it for the number of aircraft you could possibly field, even factoring for logistics.

I will definitely do that.

How about 1,100,000 in the Army and 600,000 in the Air Forces?

I personally wouldn't worry about revising your overall manpower strengths provided you're within 0.5% of your total population so as not to brankrupt yourself.

I have heard that 2% is an ideal maximum. At the present, I have 1.6751% of my population in the services, although that number will decrease over time, once I downscale as suggested.

At the other end of the scale, tho, a platoon strenth under 30 personnel will find it hard to sustain operations.

What about making a platoon consist of forty personnel, and divide it into four squads of ten? The new system could be:

Squad: 10
Platoon: 40
Company: 200
Battalion: 1,000
Regiment: 2,500
Brigade: 5,000
Division: 20,000
Corps: 100,000

Tolvan: I will reply after checking out the link.

Could you please elaborate? I know that air forces are based around the forms of aircraft in service and the amount of support which is required, and that naval units also determine how a navy is organized.
You pretty much summed it up yourself.
Since you cannot really just throw sailors onto boats in allotments of platoons.

The forces are initially designed to be organized in a modular fashion. Tyhe rule was that there would be five platoons in a company, five companies in a battalion, five battalions in a regiment, etc. I used a figure of 5,000 for a brigade, since I am familiar with it being around that size.

The issue about divisions is that they need to be larger than brigades, and just having two or three in a division would not fit very well.

Perhaps you could provide me with some numbers to help me understand your point (again, I'm not an expert, so I may need some filling in).
Oh, I see what you got there, Regiments and Brigades interloping with each other there...
That's what's screwing with your numbers on the 5*5*5 formula...
Try fiddling with numbers between 3 and 8, leaning often to the 3's.

A battalion can be as few as 300 to 1000 people.
Companies are between 100 and 300 (centurions?).

Sections are generally composed of one base-fire unit (LMG-team), multiple "Manuver" units (Riflemen), and maybe a "heavy weapon" such as a LAW-man or DMR.

I will deal with the equipment list, but generally, I prefer not to go into too much detail about what each individual infantryman carries at the moment, since I am looking to build a good framework first, and then attach details later on.That's alright. Although knowing the capabilities of your base-units (sections+platoons) and their limitations, would help you better determine what sort of support-weapons to issue higher-up the CoC...

These are my own original ship classes. To add a degree of originality to the whole thing, I am inventing some of my own equipment. Since I haven't had to RP any war or use them yet (shocking!), I haven't written up the details of their design or any specifics about them. Those, however, will be forthcoming.
To NSD with you! D:<

You pretty much summed it up yourself.
Since you cannot really just throw sailors onto boats in allotments of platoons.

Once I figure out how many people are needed to crew and support my navy and coast guard, I can deduce gow many I will need.

Oh, I see what you got there, Regiments and Brigades interloping with each other there...
That's what's screwing with your numbers on the 5*5*5 formula...
Try fiddling with numbers between 3 and 8, leaning often to the 3's.

A battalion can be as few as 300 to 1000 people.
Companies are between 100 and 300 (centurions?).

Sections are generally composed of one base-fire unit (LMG-team), multiple "Manuver" units (Riflemen), and maybe a "heavy weapon" such as a LAW-man or DMR.

From what I understand about army units, you typically have the majority composed of infantry, such as riflemen, and support these with heavier weapons, such as machine guns, mortars, small field pieces, etc.

Now, to your point about numbers between 3 and 8, I have a new system here, for your scrutiny:

Organization:

Squad: 10
Platoon: 40 (four squads)
Company: 200 (five platoons)
Battalion: 1,000 (five companies)
Regiment: 3,000 (three battalions)
Brigade: 12,000 (four regiments)
Division: 24,000 (two brigades)
Corps: 96,000 (four divisions)
Field Army: 288,000 (three corps)

Notice my use of the numbers 2, 3, 4, and 5. This results in my new service branch breakdown:

Breakdown of Service Branches:

Monavian Imperial Army: 864,000
Monavian Imperial Navy: 650,000
Monavian Imperial Air Forces: 500,000
Monavian Marine Corps: 576,000
Monavian Royal Coast Guard: 7,500
Monavian Imperial Army Reserve: 1,152,000
Monavian Imperial Navy Reserve: 900,000
Monavian Imperial Air Forces Reserve: 750,000
Monavian Marine Corps Reserve: 864,000
Monavian Royal Coast Guard Reserve: 12,500
Imperial National Guard: 1,100,000
Royal Guard: 5,000

Total regular service members: 2,602,500
Total reserve members: 4,778,500

Total: 7,381,000

Notice a reduction in troop levels by 139,000. Again, this, coupled with my growing population, shrinks my percentage of citizens in the military forces even more. This new number is 1.621%, a drop 0.0541%, which over time, will increase. Remember, Monavia's military is not an ultra-modern ubertech thingy from the future, and in my experience, the figure appears reasonable.

To NSD with you! D:<

That is always a good place to submit designs for scrutiny. I would not mind, say, writing up a brief description of each equipment piece and submitting it for suggestions, provided that no one utterly tears it apart.

Air Force could definitely use cutbacks that can be re-routed to the Army.

Your navy seems kinda meek and poorly supported. Just having AOR's isn't going to be enough to sustain any kind of long-term naval deployment. Check out the Wiki page on either the US Navy or the UK Royal Navy for some ideas.

As for the 25/75 split between active and reserves; you could go 45/55 or even 40/60 if you don't want to have a lacking active force.

Also, what's your strategic capabilities? Do you have any overseas military facilities or other bases outside of your nation? Does your air force have sufficient strategic airlift and attack capabilities?

Air Force could definitely use cutbacks that can be re-routed to the Army.

This is the second or third time I have received this suggestion. Do you have any particular numbers in mind?

Your navy seems kinda meek and poorly supported. Just having AOR's isn't going to be enough to sustain any kind of long-term naval deployment. Check out the Wiki page on either the US Navy or the UK Royal Navy for some ideas.

I will do that, since I will need to figure out the best way to project naval power.

As for the 25/75 split between active and reserves; you could go 45/55 or even 40/60 if you don't want to have a lacking active force.

If you have noticed in the preceding post (#8) you will see that I have made the reserves larger than the active forces, to the tune of about 60/40.

Also, what's your strategic capabilities? Do you have any overseas military facilities or other bases outside of your nation? Does your air force have sufficient strategic airlift and attack capabilities?

You raise a very good point there. I will break this down:

In terms of naval projection, I have bases on far-flung islands, however, they are sovereign territory of mine. Ditto for small army and marine bases, etc. I do not have any assets in foreign countries, though.

On a different note, I am a member of the Fegosian Union and the Delian league, so I have allies with jointly-owned bases, which could possible house some of my forces...

Now, in terms of air force power, this is my thought: much like the RL USAF, I want to bee able to send planes anywhere that I need to, as well as deliver bombs or troops to a location. As far as having other capabilities, I will need to work out the details.

Finally, as far as a missile system works, I use a three-layer missile shield to dela with incoming ICBMs and so on. A long-range system, such as in orbit, a medium-range system, which is more or less ground-based, and a short-range system, like the old Patriot missiles. The RL United States uses a similar concept. For launching missiles at hostile nations, a long range is important to me, as well as effective delivery.

That is always a good place to submit designs for scrutiny. I would not mind, say, writing up a brief description of each equipment piece and submitting it for suggestions, provided that no one utterly tears it apart.

Monavia, *I* am on NSD (NS Draftroom), and I can tell you that while your designs MIGHT get utterly torn apart there, you'll get help in making them better. Trust me, i've designed plenty, and the people at NSD have always helped to make my designs better. In fact, Lyras sells and uses some of my gear; so yeah, my stuff has really improved since I started at NSD.

TG me if you want to know more.

Once I figure out how many people are needed to crew and support my navy and coast guard, I can deduce gow many I will need.
Use the approximate total_crew_size*3 figure.


From what I understand about army units, you typically have the majority composed of infantry, such as riflemen, and support these with heavier weapons, such as machine guns, mortars, small field pieces, etc.
The majority is composed of support personnel. Not of riflemen, but unarmed or, in combat zones, PDW-armed support personnel. Truck drivers, mechanics, quartermasters, et cetera.
There's always a certain level of asymmetry between combat and support personnel. A 1,000 battalion won't have 100 10-men squads, it will have some squads, and some usually different-sized companies in support role.


That is always a good place to submit designs for scrutiny. I would not mind, say, writing up a brief description of each equipment piece and submitting it for suggestions, provided that no one utterly tears it apart.
It's not what it used to be some time ago. Now it's mostly just chatting and flaming. No one tears anybody's designs apart.

However, there's no way in the world to make that number of designs in reasonable time unless they're direct ripoffs of RL ones, and no one's interested in reading the ripoffs of RL designs. So simply using RL designs is not as bad an idea as it might seem.

Try using four companies and a headquarters platoon in a battalion.
And raise platoon-size to 50.

Fiddle with rgmt.
Give 80% of them CDLs and a 5-ton truck to drive...

It's not what it used to be some time ago. Now it's mostly just chatting and flaming. No one tears anybody's designs apart.
We ran out of ideas... D:<
FFS we had to tear apart a rubik-cube landmine and cheese-based explosives
U try making TNT from goatse-milk!

Though the "vitamin-cigar" was kinda a change for pace...
Apparently to be taken with V10's MRDs...

Monavia, *I* am on NSD (NS Draftroom), and I can tell you that while your designs MIGHT get utterly torn apart there, you'll get help in making them better. Trust me, i've designed plenty, and the people at NSD have always helped to make my designs better. In fact, Lyras sells and uses some of my gear; so yeah, my stuff has really improved since I started at NSD.

TG me if you want to know more.

Thanks, I could use the advice. Indeed, I have heard many positive things about NSD, however, some people complained in the past, which is why I have (more like had) my suspicions about the place. Still, I see your point. I will definitely be seeking their help in the future.

Use the approximate total_crew_size*3 figure.

If I am interpreting this correctly, this means that for every man on a ship, there needs to be three more on the ground to support it.

The majority is composed of support personnel. Not of riflemen, but unarmed or, in combat zones, PDW-armed support personnel. Truck drivers, mechanics, quartermasters, et cetera.
There's always a certain level of asymmetry between combat and support personnel. A 1,000 battalion won't have 100 10-men squads, it will have some squads, and some usually different-sized companies in support role.

So, logistics-wise, there should be something like four or five support personnel for every combat one. Also, what I was originally referring to was the combat personnel, in the case of how they are divided up.

It's not what it used to be some time ago. Now it's mostly just chatting and flaming. No one tears anybody's designs apart.

However, there's no way in the world to make that number of designs in reasonable time unless they're direct ripoffs of RL ones, and no one's interested in reading the ripoffs of RL designs. So simply using RL designs is not as bad an idea as it might seem.

I have no issues with using RL designs for some pieces of equipment (particularly aircraft), but again, I figure that I can use some of my own designs to make things more original.

Try using four companies and a headquarters platoon in a battalion.
And raise platoon-size to 50.

Fiddle with rgmt.
Give 80% of them CDLs and a 5-ton truck to drive...

So, if I am interpreting this correctly, this would change the system to:

Squad: still 10, for the moment
Platoon: 50 (five squads)
Company: 250 (five platoons)
Battalion: 1,050 (four companies and a command platoon)
Regiment: 3,150 (three battallons) this will require a command add-on
Brigade: 12,600 (four regiments) again, this will require a command unit, and possible MP units and so on
Division: 25,200 (two brigades) ditto to a command unit
Corps: 101,000 (four divisions)
Field Army: 202,000 or 303,000 (either two or three corps)

After that, I will need to factor in officers, will be a major pain.

We ran out of ideas... D:<
FFS we had to tear apart a rubik-cube landmine and cheese-based explosives
U try making TNT from goatse-milk!

Though the "vitamin-cigar" was kinda a change for pace...
Apparently to be taken with V10's MRDs...

That is hilarious!

I have recalculated the numbers according to the formula that Hurtful thoughts gave me. Here it is:

Squad: 10
Platoon: 50 (five squads)
Company: 250 (five platoons)
Battalion: 1,050 (four companies and a command platoon)
Regiment: 3,150 (three battalions)
Brigade: 12,600 (four regiments)
Division: 25,200 (two brigades)
Corps: 101,000 (four divisions)
Field Army: 202,000 or 303,000 (three corps)

Notice that I still need to account for command units above the battalion level, and that these are still rough numbers and estimates.

Since my navy and air forces are based around whatever equipment I will have, I will table that discussion and focus this thread on dealing with my land-based forces first. The new numbers for my service branches are:

Monavian Imperial Army: 909,000
Monavian Marine Corps: 606,000
Monavian Imperial Army Reserve: 1,212,000
Monavian Marine Corps Reserve: 909,000

Notice that the reserves are greater than the active forces. For the Army, it is 3/4 (active/reserve) and for the Marines, it is 2/3.

The point of having active troops is so you can quickly respond. Since you dont seem very militarily violent, you need only a small portion, as was suggested above. A 25/75 split would be very good, with the 75 being troops at home, or otherwise. A good way to calculate the number of troops your nation can support in total is that each nation has about 3% of their entire population in the military. This can go as high as 5% for a very strong military, and if you are under attack (The enemy is on your soil) you can go to about 10% more or less. However, don't expect your troops to be well armed, or have high moral with the 10%. You will have food shortages, weapon shortages, ammunition shortages, etc. Identical to the Russians in WWII. This also ties into how much money you put into your military.
This does in fact give a strong layout of the military but I have a few pet peeves. What is the average mud crunchers kit? What weapons do you have for them? What aircraft do you have? What vehicles do you have? Also, many of your smaller force groupings, the most important because they are the ones that do that fighting, are too small. The company can go from 100-250, but 100 is extremely small. I realize some of these are under construction.
Links please!
I do beleive that your navies are too large. Just my own personal opinion.
I beleive what should be said, has been said. Thank you for adding pretty much everything that is useful!

I'll agree with Daiwiz here, if you're in a conflict thar REQUIRES you to send more than 25% of your military to even have a spit-ball's chance in hell of success, you're in way over your head and cruising for a load of butt-rape at home w/o lube...

This does in fact give a strong layout of the military but I have a few pet peeves. What is the average mud crunchers kit? What weapons do you have for them? What aircraft do you have? What vehicles do you have? Also, many of your smaller force groupings, the most important because they are the ones that do that fighting, are too small. The company can go from 100-250, but 100 is extremely small. I realize some of these are under construction.
This part is best left to some heavy-thinking and bouncing any un-orthadox ideas off of others (and maybe trolling for any unorthadox ideas for "off the shelf" NSD-grade tech that happens to fit your military needs*) before setting it in stone.

*NSD has their own mall, storefront directory, org-charts, and generally contains links to their "tear it apart" threads, so it at least worth lurking around in, as a primer at the least.

Vault... had a bit of a "falling out" after he went socially-crazy...
His techy-skills are fairly good still, he just doesn't want to touch NSD with a 10-meter pole anymore...

If I am interpreting this correctly, this means that for every man on a ship, there needs to be three more on the ground to support it.
Those are generally for relief crews and light/regular maintnance.
Heavier overhauls would require a fully-decked-out port/shipyard regardless.

Marines should be "always vigilant".

What has been added by Hurtful is good. I realize that you have to look through a couple weapons before setting it in stone, but you should always the vehicles, weapons, etc set in stone before making something like this.

The point of having active troops is so you can quickly respond. Since you dont seem very militarily violent, you need only a small portion, as was suggested above. A 25/75 split would be very good, with the 75 being troops at home, or otherwise.

Then if I wnat to generate some new numbers, it should work like this, taking into account the new split, with the reserves boosted and the active forces decreased:

Monavian Imperial Army: 606,000
Monavian Marine Corps: 505,000
Monavian Imperial Army Reserve: 1,515,000
Monavian Marine Corps Reserve: 1,010,000

The new numbers indicate a active/reserve ratio of 6/15 for the Army and 5/10 for the Marines, with greater emphasis placed upon keeping the marines active.

A good way to calculate the number of troops your nation can support in total is that each nation has about 3% of their entire population in the military. This can go as high as 5% for a very strong military, and if you are under attack (The enemy is on your soil) you can go to about 10% more or less. However, don't expect your troops to be well armed, or have high moral with the 10%. You will have food shortages, weapon shortages, ammunition shortages, etc. Identical to the Russians in WWII. This also ties into how much money you put into your military.

Believe me, I have read and re-read a dozen or more strategy threads and stickies about the topic over the time I have been on NS. I need not be briefed on these points.

Generally, I have never had more than 2.3% of my population in the military while setting up my numbers.

This does in fact give a strong layout of the military but I have a few pet peeves. What is the average mud crunchers kit? What weapons do you have for them? What aircraft do you have? What vehicles do you have? Also, many of your smaller force groupings, the most important because they are the ones that do that fighting, are too small. The company can go from 100-250, but 100 is extremely small. I realize some of these are under construction.

I will check NSD for ideas, and come up with a proposal for the individual kit.

Vehicles can be based to be compatible for this purpose.

I have already expanded the size of my smaller units, please read my previous few posts. My company size is now 250, and my platoon size is now 50 (per Hurtful Thoughts' suggestion).

Links please!

What do you want me to link you to?

I do beleive that your navies are too large. Just my own personal opinion.
I beleive what should be said, has been said. Thank you for adding pretty much everything that is useful!

Thanks. I have such a large navy because I need to be able to project my naval power very far and in force, as well as transport large numbers of troops.

I'll agree with Daiwiz here, if you're in a conflict thar REQUIRES you to send more than 25% of your military to even have a spit-ball's chance in hell of success, you're in way over your head and cruising for a load of butt-rape at home w/o lube...

Unless I run into some big guys (like AMF or Emperor Pudu), I should not have this type of problem.

This part is best left to some heavy-thinking and bouncing any un-orthadox ideas off of others (and maybe trolling for any unorthadox ideas for "off the shelf" NSD-grade tech that happens to fit your military needs*) before setting it in stone.

*NSD has their own mall, storefront directory, org-charts, and generally contains links to their "tear it apart" threads, so it at least worth lurking around in, as a primer at the least.

I can always use NSD technology (without having to actually buy the equipment form them, since Lamoni and I have a tech sharing clause in our friendship treaty), and Lamoni is a member.

Vault... had a bit of a "falling out" after he went socially-crazy...
His techy-skills are fairly good still, he just doesn't want to touch NSD with a 10-meter pole anymore...

They must have really caused him some grief...

I can always use NSD technology (without having to actually buy the equipment form them, since Lamoni and I have a tech sharing clause in our friendship treaty), and Lamoni is a member.

While it's true that there is a tech sharing clause in our friendship treaty, that only extends between our two nations, Monavia. I could get in real trouble for buying stuff from NSD, and then giving it to you.

However, I *CAN* point you to the right storefront, or equipment that you can buy yourself. I can also tell you who to ask if you want something custom made.

If you have AIM, YIM, or MSN, TG me your handle; and we can talk further on this.

They must have really caused him some grief...

More to it than that. Depending on who you believe, V10 did bad things too.

While it's true that there is a tech sharing clause in our friendship treaty, that only extends between our two nations, Monavia. I could get in real trouble for buying stuff from NSD, and then giving it to you.

However, I *CAN* point you to the right storefront, or equipment that you can buy yourself. I can also tell you who to ask if you want something custom made.

If you have AIM, YIM, or MSN, TG me your handle; and we can talk further on this.

Sorry, I forgot about that...

More to it than that. Depending on who you believe, V10 did bad things too.

OK, that could explain the whole issue.

I have taken the time to organize my land forces in a more detailed fashion, up to the division level. Notice that I have not yet added logistics, fire support, armor, artillery, or weapons units, i.e., weapons company, weapons platoon, etc.

If anyone is interested in providing an example of how I can add the above items into the chart below, it would be most appreciated.

BASIC ORGANIZATION:

SQUADS (10 men):

Standard:

1 squad leader, typically an NCO
1 medic
2 light machine gunners, using a SAW type weapon
2 grenadiers, armed with assault rifles and grenade launchers
4 riflemen

Weapons:

*under construction*

PLATOONS (52 men):

Standard:

4 standard squads
1 weapons squad
1 commissioned officer
1 NCO, second in command to the leader

Weapons:

*under construction*

Command:

1 commanding officer
1 executive officer
1 intelligence officer
1 logistics officer (similar to a quartermaster)
1 operations officer
1 medical officer
1 communications officer
1 personnel officer
1 judicial officer
1 chaplain
1 administrative clerk
1 adjutant
3 rifle squads

COMPANIES (268 men):

Standard:

4 rifle platoons
1 weapons platoon
4 medics
1 administrative clerk
1 MP (military police) officer
1 executive officer
1 commanding officer

Weapons:

*under construction*

Command:

1 command platoon
3 rifle platoons
1 weapons platoon
4 medics
2 administrative clerks
1 executive officer
1 commanding officer

BATTALIONS (1,124 men):

Standard:

3 standard companies
1 weapons company
1 command platoon

Weapons:

*under construction*

REGIMENTS (3,640 men):

Standard:

3 battalions
1 command company

BRIGADES (14,612 men):

Standard:

4 regiments
1 command platoon

DIVISIONS (29,224 men):

Standard:

2 brigades
1 command platoon

These NSD threads might help.

http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4792&st=0
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4647&st=0
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4806
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4678
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4680
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4662
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=3789
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=1860
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4048
http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4045

On a platoon level, you have way too many extraneous personnel. You have almost a battalion level worth of "x officer(s)," which is entirely unnecessary. Do your platoons get so much trouble that you need a dedicated judicial officer?

Look at my platoon organization, which Lamoni already linked:

http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=4678

Under command, I would put the following:

-Platoon Leader
-Platoon Senior NCO (Independant of any squad)
-Radio/Telephone Operator

Big difference.

When you are organizing your unit structures, start by generally defining your types of units (the french word I used was Arme). After that, start by defining your platoons and sections/squads, since they are so small, you almost have to do them at the same time, for those Armes. Then build up. In this way, you can easily create composite units quickly, and if you forget something, it's easier to do it if you are working from the smallest units to the top units. Also, it allows you to know what your larger units are made of, which is mostly impossible the other way around.

But you seem to have gone this way. This is good. Go to global security (http://www.globalsecurity.org/) and look for US Army field manuals dealing with unit composition. That's what I've done. Use those as a guides, they generally have graphic depictions that are extremely easy to read. They require a bit of searching, though.

On a platoon level, you have way too many extraneous personnel. You have almost a battalion level worth of "x officer(s)," which is entirely unnecessary. Do your platoons get so much trouble that you need a dedicated judicial officer?

Look at my platoon organization, which Lamoni already linked:

http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftro...showtopic=4678

Under command, I would put the following:

-Platoon Leader
-Platoon Senior NCO (Independant of any squad)
-Radio/Telephone Operator

Big difference.

The command platoon, which I believe you are referring to, is the command unit of a battalion, or the command unit of a command company, which is part of a regiment.

Also, I used Wikipedia to determine which types of officers I needed. This is how you get the following:

1 commanding officer
1 executive officer
1 intelligence officer
1 logistics officer (similar to a quartermaster)
1 operations officer
1 medical officer
1 communications officer
1 personnel officer
1 judicial officer
1 chaplain
1 administrative clerk
1 adjutant
3 rifle squads

Again, I will look at other sources for information.

When you are organizing your unit structures, start by generally defining your types of units (the french word I used was Arme). After that, start by defining your platoons and sections/squads, since they are so small, you almost have to do them at the same time, for those Armes. Then build up. In this way, you can easily create composite units quickly, and if you forget something, it's easier to do it if you are working from the smallest units to the top units. Also, it allows you to know what your larger units are made of, which is mostly impossible the other way around.

But you seem to have gone this way. This is good. Go to global security and look for US Army field manuals dealing with unit composition. That's what I've done. Use those as a guides, they generally have graphic depictions that are extremely easy to read. They require a bit of searching, though.

I will do that.

The command platoon, which I believe you are referring to, is the command unit of a battalion, or the command unit of a command company, which is part of a regiment.

Also, I used Wikipedia to determine which types of officers I needed. This is how you get the following:



Again, I will look at other sources for information.



I will do that.

Don't put the command platoon in the write up for the regular platoon, you'll just end up confusing people. The command platoon goes under the next highest unit level, in your case, battalion.

I am bringing back this topic.

I have modified my previous system for land-based forces. As per Yanitaria's suggestion (below), I have changed a few things.

Don't put the command platoon in the write up for the regular platoon, you'll just end up confusing people. The command platoon goes under the next highest unit level, in your case, battalion.

You have almost a battalion level worth of "x officer(s)," which is entirely unnecessary.

I still don't understand this one.

Do your platoons get so much trouble that you need a dedicated judicial officer?

According to Wikipedia's information about European and American armies, there is usually a judicial officer (sometimes called a JAG (judicial advocate general) or something along those lines) in every platoon. If I am mistaken in my interpretation, please say so and correct me. I can't stand being wrong about something and not being able to fix it so that it is correct.

The new organization system (tentative and subject to more changes; note that not all of the officers are included in the higher levels yet):

BASIC ORGANIZATION:

SQUADS (10 men):

Standard:

1 squad leader, typically an NCO
1 medic
2 light machine gunners, using a SAW type weapon
2 grenadiers, armed with assault rifles and grenade launchers
4 riflemen

Weapons:

*under construction*

PLATOONS (52 men):

Standard:

4 standard squads
1 weapons squad
1 commissioned officer
1 NCO, subordinate to the commissioned officer

Weapons:

*under construction*

COMPANIES (268 men):

Standard:

4 rifle platoons
1 weapons platoon
4 medics
1 administrative clerk
1 MP (military police) officer
1 executive officer
1 commanding officer

Weapons:

*under construction*

BATTALIONS (1,124 men):

Standard:

3 standard companies
1 weapons company
1 command platoon, consisting of:


1 commanding officer
1 executive officer
1 intelligence officer
1 logistics officer (similar to a quartermaster)
1 operations officer
1 medical officer
1 communications officer
1 personnel officer
1 judicial officer
1 chaplain
1 administrative clerk
1 adjutant
3 rifle squads


Weapons:

*under construction*

REGIMENTS (3,640 men):

Standard:

3 battalions
1 command company, consisting of:


1 command platoon
3 rifle platoons
1 weapons platoon
4 medics
2 administrative clerks
1 executive officer
1 commanding officer


BRIGADES (14,612 men):

Standard:

4 regiments
1 command platoon

DIVISIONS (29,224 men):

Standard:

2 brigades
1 command platoon

CORPS (116,896 men):

4 divisions

FIELD ARMY (350,688 men):

3 corps

TOTALS:

ARMY:

1,052,064 (three active field armies)
1,402,752 (four reserve field armies)

MARINES:

701,376 (two active field armies)
1,052,064 (three reserve field armies)

ooc: I say nice job overall, but remember to use army groups and section as larger things. Look at this article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_unit#Units.2C_Formations_.26_Commands) and I think it will help. Under the modern military h something.

ooc: I say nice job overall, but remember to use army groups and section as larger things. Look at this article and I think it will help. Under the modern military h something.

Thank you. A "section" is typically smaller than a squad. I do not have larger units than field armies, as they are my largest unit.

OOC: as a real life marine, i personally think you should have a Commandant of the Marines, instead of a Marshall, we cooler than having marshals, in fact i dont know any military service that uses marshalls anymore.

Your navy is smaller than the real-life USN, but has more personnel on active duty. May want to move some of those people to reserves, or get more ships for them to staff -- don't want to be paying them just to sit around and wait for a ship assignment. Or maybe you do. Who knows. :P

As for the air force, you could probably support about ~7000 aircraft on active duty with those numbers, with x additional sitting around in warehouses. Back when I, uh, was a huge wanker, I organised squadrons of 24, but 12 or 15 (or 16, if you have four to a flight) is more common by far. A wing is usually five to six squadrons, a group is several wings, et cetera. Generally each squadron will have one AWACS/ELINT attached, and each wing will have logistical aircraft attached (carrying supplies and stuff). If you really want more detail, ask someone who knows more than me.

How does everyone handle their armored and artillary, percentage of the army? Separate entity?

OOC: as a real life marine, i personally think you should have a Commandant of the Marines, instead of a Marshall, we cooler than having marshals, in fact i dont know any military service that uses marshalls anymore.

An interesting point, however, my reason for using the term "marshal" came out of the idea of having an equivalent five-star rank to balance with the Army.

Your navy is smaller than the real-life USN, but has more personnel on active duty. May want to move some of those people to reserves, or get more ships for them to staff -- don't want to be paying them just to sit around and wait for a ship assignment. Or maybe you do. Who knows. :P

I plan to increase the number of ships. The names of the classes are arbitrary, I will later replace them with a combination of NS and RL ships, or make some up.

As for the air force, you could probably support about ~7000 aircraft on active duty with those numbers, with x additional sitting around in warehouses. Back when I, uh, was a huge wanker, I organised squadrons of 24, but 12 or 15 (or 16, if you have four to a flight) is more common by far. A wing is usually five to six squadrons, a group is several wings, et cetera. Generally each squadron will have one AWACS/ELINT attached, and each wing will have logistical aircraft attached (carrying supplies and stuff). If you really want more detail, ask someone who knows more than me.

I am hoping to work out my land forces before doing my air forces, and then going on to my navy and such.

How does everyone handle their armored and artillary, percentage of the army? Separate entity?

Free E-cookies for you. I was about to highlight that issue.

While I have most of my basic bread-and-butter infantry numbers taken care of, I have the following units to factor into my overall land forces:


Fire support, i.e. artillery, morters, rockets
Armor, i.e. tanks, APCs, etc.
Logistics units
Transport units
Miscellaneous equipment
Officers in command of units larger than regiments

How does everyone handle their armored and artillary, percentage of the army? Separate entity?

Neither.

For artillery a basic percentage is useless, and your regular units need organic artillery (not to say you should never have larger all-artillery formations, but that if you do they should be only part of your artillery with the rest organic).

Generally you will want fairly light artillery (squad-level mortars) attached at the platoon or company level, with larger units and larger pieces attached further up the chain (so a battalion might have a heavy mortars platoon/company and a division its own unit of heavier towed or self-propelled arty.

Armor is similar, firstly the amount of armor in a unit depends on the type of formation and its role (mechanized infantry battalion vs armored battalion vs light infantry etc), secondly armor will not be grouped alone except in small formations intended to work together in a fight, as practically armor cannot do any serious fighting without infantry support. So a blanket percentage is mostly useless in describing your army and separate large formations of armor are useless tactically.

What would be the best proportion of tanks versus infantry for an armored unit and a mechanized unit.

For an armored unit 2-4 dismounts per tank, for mechanized infantry, 5-10 ish dismounts per tank. To narrow it down from there you should be making your own decision as to how tank heavy or infantry heavy you want your formations to be. (For which other concerns come in, the types of wars you expect to fight, your terrain and infrastructure, how much money you like to spend...)

My thought is to have one light morter and one light machine gum per weapons squad. I would then place four of them, along with a squad carying a heavier morter/machine gun with them to form a "weapons platoon".

Comments?

What would be the best proportion of tanks versus infantry for an armored unit and a mechanized unit.
About 1 for every 30 infantry.
The 'low' range for a unit to be considered 'armored' would be 1 in 50
The upper would be 1 in 10 (including tank crew of 4, their relief crew, plus a pair of very dedicated mechanics)

Once the lead starts flying, these numbers tend to drop pretty quickly.

My thought is to have one light mortar and one light machine gun per weapons squad. I would then place four of them, along with a squad carying a heavier mortar/machine gun with them to form a "weapons platoon".

Comments?
A good idea, though some folks would replace a light mortar with either an automatic or underbarrel GL of some sort and maybe a few LAWs.