NationStates Jolt Archive

Yanitarian Military Calculator v2.2.1 (link) (http://files.filefront.com/YanMilCalc+v221xls/;12217370;/fileinfo.html)

You will need:


And NS Page (check)
Open Office Cacl OR Microsoft Office Excel. Any program that allows you to edit .xls files will work, but it is made for Open Office Calc.
An Economy calculator, like this one. (http://nseconomy.thirdgeek.com/)


First of all, this is basically a spread sheet. You'll see a row, which says "Do not touch anything below this row." DO NOT TOUCH ANYTHING BELOW THAT ROW. Actually, that's a bit of a lie. If you can figure it out, then go ahead. But if you need to change anything, and don't know what to touch, then ask, and I'll see about posting a quick tutorial. Additionally, if this is popular, I might be arsed to give v2.5 extra customization options.

Basically, use the economy calculator to fill out the relevant info. If the font is too small, Ctrl+Scroll forward with middle mouse button.

Important Stuff:

I need feedback. "Given enough eyes, all problems are shallow" sorta Linus Torvalds stuff.

Also, as per mod request: This calculator is my own work, and is not associated with Jolt.co.uk or Nationstates.net. I reserves all rights to this work, but if you ask nicely, I'll let you use this as a base for another calculator. In fact, I might ask you to work with me to improve it.

Previous Versions:
v2.0 (http://files.filefront.com/YanMilCalc+v20xls/;12014438;/fileinfo.html)
v2.1 (http://files.filefront.com/YanMilCalc+v21xls/;12062876;/fileinfo.html)
v2.1.1 (http://files.filefront.com/YanMilCalc+v211xls/;12068692;/fileinfo.html)

Very nice. Will especially help noobs and others get a rough idea of their ability.

Going by your budget calculator and how cheap it is to currently equip Forensathan soldiers, I could actually have over 1 million soldiers... and when you consider the military and law enforcement are actually a combined force, that jumps to well over 3 million. And the military itself is currently around 130,000, according to my factbook.

Methinks I actually need to up that number a wee bit.

Edit: Whoops. Had entered the wrong figures.

Hmm...this calculator seems to apply more to democracies/capitalistic states than it does to communist ones. It's still very good, though. I find it interesting how I get 276 million maximum infantry based off the information I gave it. :p

Then again, my troops are dirt poor and such, though extreme deflation sort of screws around stuff.

It's a bit weird to try to work out how a gendarme as your police force would fit in, especially considering they have the equivalent of a coast guard. I still have fewer troops than the calc says I could have, though!

Liking so far. ;) Also Santheres yeah, I too RP at present (even at mobilization) with slightly fewer troops than I "could" have by budget, but 'tis always good to leave yourself room for when the brown matter well-and-truly impacts the rotating coolant device.

Only quibble I have at first run-through Yani is that the way you defined 'combat troops' seems a bit unclear, even for something a bit obvious usually. What line (if any) did you draw between formation-support and general-support troops? From first glance it looks like you sort of lumped all support personnel together across the board, but that's not stated and might be worthy of another * section in the next version so it's clearer. Either way 'tis a minor point; good work, eagerly awaiting updates/improvements myself.:salute:

It's a bit weird to try to work out how a gendarme as your police force would fit in, especially considering they have the equivalent of a coast guard. I still have fewer troops than the calc says I could have, though!

Yeah, the same with us. Since we've got the State Security Bureau, the Secret State Police, the Vetalian Federal Police and the paramilitary Free Corps all involved in law and political subversion enforcement, and all of them have effective military training, it's not something that can be split up.

Not to mention our nation page doesn't accurately reflect the status of our nation at this point...

Oh, and clarification of my previous post, in case it's not obvious: I'm going to be using this to determine Forensatha's military size. Time to do a news story about a sudden surge in military membership and buy up some production rights for some guns.

Yanitaria, this is honestly an amazing thing you have created here. Do you do this type of stuff for a living, or just for fun? I have run a bunch of practices (ok, 5 in reality) so far, and I haven't found a problem.

On my nation itself, ironically I am current RP'ing with 5 million less then what the calculator says I should have. That is not even taking into account the "maximum amount" I COULD be allowed, where the difference is even greater. Fascinating.

Yeah, the same with us. Since we've got the State Security Bureau, the Secret State Police, the Vetalian Federal Police and the paramilitary Free Corps all involved in law and political subversion enforcement, and all of them have effective military training, it's not something that can be split up.

Not to mention our nation page doesn't accurately reflect the status of our nation at this point...

I suppose you could try to fiddle with the calc in this respect and turn it into all military. Well, that would only work if all your soldiers also have police training (which mine do, it's just that the gendarme are dedicated police and peacekeeping troops) I suppose -- though, that would imply equal training across the board, unless I'm mistaken, which mine don't have, as stated in the parenthetical. I also had to drastically lower reservist cost to account compulsory service (in some respect) even though those serving in this manner could be active and volunteers might end up in the reserve.

Hmm, if I had less homework, I'd try to modify it but I don't think I have the time.

I think this calc is best used as a guide. Yani can't accurately tell exactly how each nation's military is arranged, and its obvious its based off of a traditional military like in Europe and America. Using some calculator math you could either edit this or use paper or another document to figure out sizes and funding for your nations' situation.

Indeed, though I would say based a military like in America or perhaps England. A lot of European countries have different arrangements, like gendarmes and such. It's a good guide, though -- good layout, calculations that are simple to understand, and as such very editable to suit our individual needs. It's just a matter of our own time to figure out how we'd use what we have here to form what we RP.

Big problem I have found, I have a Tax Rate of 0%, throws off the entire calculator...

Big problem I have found, I have a Tax Rate of 0%, throws off the entire calculator...

Same thing happened to me. Although running a 1 billion+ nation with no taxes isn't exactly feasible in the first place.

I think this calc is best used as a guide. Yani can't accurately tell exactly how each nation's military is arranged, and its obvious its based off of a traditional military like in Europe and America. Using some calculator math you could either edit this or use paper or another document to figure out sizes and funding for your nations' situation.
Oh agreed, for sure; for example I generally RP my air force as having the same personnel overhead as my army (with appropriate adjustments for support and towards other branches) since it's equal in budget/priority/prestige/&c, and is even a separate service nonetheless sharing the same (army) government department with the army in my nation. The details differ, especially in the AF given the rigours of aircraft support and what this does to teeth/tail ratio there; but in general Yani's work is an awesome 1.0-version and definitely should go on to newer/better developments as-able.

Great Military Calculator. It says I can have up to 156 million troops maximum. :)

Taxation % according to NS page (NVO*): NVO means Numerical Values Only. What that means is that you should not put your answer in the form of a percent (e.g. 100%). You should put it as a numerical value between 0 and 100. On your NS page, it'll tell you how much your country taxes your populace, as a percent of your GDP. That's what it's asking for.


Just a little comment here...

You can select "Format" so it not only displays as a percentage but you can enter data as percent.

One minor thing, you'd have to change the formula so that it wouldn't divide the numbers provided by 100. It doesn't really matter just a matter of preference.

I rather like it. However I am going to take some things into account like I play as if I had 1/10 my actual size and gdp and such and my ratio of support to combat troops is better than average because I have a streamlined system (plus I'm adding semi autonomous UGVs to assist in that endeavor)

I need feedback. "Given enough eyes, all problems are shallow" sorta Linus Torvalds stuff.
It was Eric S. Raymond, and the quote is Linus's Law- "Given enough eyes, all bugs are shallow." [/Open Source Geek]
Other then that, it looks spiffy. Although if it gives Greal 156 million troops, the world is screwed.

Oh agreed, for sure; for example I generally RP my air force as having the same personnel overhead as my army (with appropriate adjustments for support and towards other branches) since it's equal in budget/priority/prestige/&c, and is even a separate service nonetheless sharing the same (army) government department with the army in my nation. The details differ, especially in the AF given the rigours of aircraft support and what this does to teeth/tail ratio there; but in general Yani's work is an awesome 1.0-version and definitely should go on to newer/better developments as-able.

This is actually v2.0

1.0 was extremely simple, but a few people found it handy.

Just a little comment here...

You can select "Format" so it not only displays as a percentage but you can enter data as percent.

One minor thing, you'd have to change the formula so that it wouldn't divide the numbers provided by 100. It doesn't really matter just a matter of preference.

I have no faith in human reasoning. You see, if I put it in percent format, someone somewhere wouldn't have gotten it. But as it is, more people will understand that not putting a percent sign is required.

It was Eric S. Raymond, and the quote is Linus's Law- "Given enough eyes, all bugs are shallow." [/Open Source Geek]
Other then that, it looks spiffy. Although if it gives Greal 156 million troops, the world is screwed.

Thanks for the correction.

Liking so far. ;) Also Santheres yeah, I too RP at present (even at mobilization) with slightly fewer troops than I "could" have by budget, but 'tis always good to leave yourself room for when the brown matter well-and-truly impacts the rotating coolant device.

Only quibble I have at first run-through Yani is that the way you defined 'combat troops' seems a bit unclear, even for something a bit obvious usually. What line (if any) did you draw between formation-support and general-support troops? From first glance it looks like you sort of lumped all support personnel together across the board, but that's not stated and might be worthy of another * section in the next version so it's clearer. Either way 'tis a minor point; good work, eagerly awaiting updates/improvements myself.:salute:

I am using the general ratios of support troops to combat troops, where combat troops are the men actually fighting the war. Obviously, though, if your military has enough casualties, troops are moved from logistical duty to combat.

It's a bit weird to try to work out how a gendarme as your police force would fit in, especially considering they have the equivalent of a coast guard. I still have fewer troops than the calc says I could have, though!

Actually, this calculator was worked with my Gendarmerie in mind. But since they are a military police, and therefore police, they ought to be budgeted through the police. That's why there is even a police category, aside from the fact that the police have at least basic military discipline, in most cases. Figuring for a Gendarmerie would be extremely difficult, however.

Big problem I have found, I have a Tax Rate of 0%, throws off the entire calculator...

If you only tax 0% of your gdp, then you don't exactly have much money laying around, now do you? The problem is that your NS page doesn't show that you probably tax .1% to .4%, so therefore it says it's 0%. Solution: Tax more, or put something between .1% and .4%.

Besides, if you have such a low tax rate, you aren't exactly trying to be a military power, now are you?

Yanitaria, this is honestly an amazing thing you have created here. Do you do this type of stuff for a living, or just for fun? I have run a bunch of practices (ok, 5 in reality) so far, and I haven't found a problem.

On my nation itself, ironically I am current RP'ing with 5 million less then what the calculator says I should have. That is not even taking into account the "maximum amount" I COULD be allowed, where the difference is even greater. Fascinating.


I did this for fun. Making an .xls calculator is very easy. Also, remember that if you use the maximum by population, your economy will start to dip.

Excellent. I know have a rough idea of my personnel, but I would like to know how many tanks, planes, etc, I have.

Excellent. I know have a rough idea of my personnel, but I would like to know how many tanks, planes, etc, I have.

That's up to you. Pilots are out of the question, it'd be way too complicated for a this calculator. Tanks are a maybe, but I am still trying to find my calculations from a few months ago.

Bump for world domination

OOC: Yan, check your PMs at NSD. I left you something.

OOC: Responded. I actually wouldn't have gotten it if I didn't empty my inbox on the suggestion of Questers.

So according to your calculator I can walk around NS with 547 million troops. Sounds about right :tongue:
Though I will stick with my RP numbers:

Active troops: 195 million
Ready Reserve: 105 million
Militia: 300 million
:gas:

which is about 74,862,931 less than my budget can support... i don't get why you have the two figures (and im using $500,000 per solider mind you)

Some people have budgets that allow them to support more soldiers than their population can contribute.

Some people have budgets that allow them to support more soldiers than their population can contribute.

That's where the IC justification for all of my fictional designs comes from. R&D doesn't come out of thin air, and neither procurement does.

This is a nice calculator.

Pity my defense spending is absolutely zero right now. (Of course, my economy is obviously in ruins, too, but that's beside the point.)

Same thing happened to me. Although running a 1 billion+ nation with no taxes isn't exactly feasible in the first place.

Unless everything is entirely privatised including the military.

Unless everything is entirely privatised including the military.

Even then. Mercenaries need to be paid.

Are we going to be expected/required to use this in future rps?

I'm sure some will find it useful, but others may find it restrictive or unsuited to their unique millitaries.

obviously participation / recognition of this is voluntary

Are we going to be expected/required to use this in future rps?

I'm sure some will find it useful, but others may find it restrictive or unsuited to their unique millitaries.

Not to mention it also relies a bit on one of the economy calculators, all of which are not necessarily entirely accurate. (I, for example, would currently be completely and utterly invaded and taken apart if I actually had zero defense spending, so of course my economy read-out doesn't reflect the actual spending.

Which is actually weird because I answered an issue about military spending to favor the Navy, which should've kicked it up at least a bit...)

So according to your calculator I can walk around NS with 547 million troops. Sounds about right :tongue:
Though I will stick with my RP numbers:

Active troops: 195 million
Ready Reserve: 105 million
Militia: 300 million
:gas:

which is about 74,862,931 less than my budget can support... i don't get why you have the two figures (and im using $500,000 per solider mind you)

There are more than two figures, be more specific. If you are talking about the max by population vs. max by budget, you population can only support so much, and at the max of that, you start to feel the pain economically. The max by budget simply tells you how many soldiers you can afford. You want to use the smaller number, but really, you always want the max by budget to be smaller.

And it's the maximum for a reason. It doesn't say "this is the number you have to use"

Some people have budgets that allow them to support more soldiers than their population can contribute.

Read the guidelines. If your population can't support as much as your budget, you have to use the population number, or spend more per soldiers.

Unless everything is entirely privatised including the military.

Even then. Mercenaries need to be paid.

What he said. Even hired killers have to eat.

Are we going to be expected/required to use this in future rps?

I'm sure some will find it useful, but others may find it restrictive or unsuited to their unique millitaries.

obviously participation / recognition of this is voluntary

What he said. You can choose to RP having a billion trillion dollars, but not many people will enjoy RPing with you. I imagine that the majority of people would require you to use this as a guide in the same way that they expect you to use the economy calculators (which are very accurate, they read the game's code and tell you what it says) to figure your military spending, instead of just saying "hur hur i put all mah stupid environmental budget in mah militaryz"

Not to mention it also relies a bit on one of the economy calculators, all of which are not necessarily entirely accurate. (I, for example, would currently be completely and utterly invaded and taken apart if I actually had zero defense spending, so of course my economy read-out doesn't reflect the actual spending.

Which is actually weird because I answered an issue about military spending to favor the Navy, which should've kicked it up at least a bit...)

No, the economy calculators are very accurate. A game requires skill, and therefore if you are planning to start wars with zero defence budget, you are simply choosing a strategy that obviously leads to failure. Unless the other player agrees to let you, you really should go by your defence budget. If the other player doesn't agree, it's wank.

It's ridiculous how many troops I can support budget wise because dumb NS has me at 0% tax so if I do 0.01 I can support something like 216,780,153,591 with budget and 534,950,000 with population. I RP at 29% tax rate so it's funny. Thank god I capped my population to 1.325 billion and set my military at 16,500,000.

No, the economy calculators are very accurate. A game requires skill, and therefore if you are planning to start wars with zero defence budget, you are simply choosing a strategy that obviously leads to failure. Unless the other player agrees to let you, you really should go by your defence budget. If the other player doesn't agree, it's wank.

I'm just saying that the economy calculators aren't truly reflective of what a real national budget would be. I know that my country wouldn't actually have zero invested in defense spending, no matter what the calculator says. (And especially considering how I answer issues in a way to BOOST my military, as I said.)

Well i like the calculator, working with the numbers alittle bit but it gives a general idea of where you need to be. just one thing could we drop the police force part and add a marine section either into the navy or a seperate column?

Read the guidelines. If your population can't support as much as your budget, you have to use the population number, or spend more per soldiers.

I was trying to decide the best, and most polite, way of replying to this. I settled on this:

How does that actually challenge what I said? Or change anything of the factual nature of what I said? It's just a case where you tell me to read the guidelines, then go ahead and restate what I actually said.

It's a realistic annoying. Most nations in real life cannot maintain an amount over 5% for their military for all of the time. Usually, raising it to 10% is a wartime action. The United States is a noted exception, but it's a nation that is, by NS standards, technically always at war, due to how its military is used.
Technically, very few in RL can even pull off 5% in war time. North Korea is one of the few (5.1% active), and look at how well their economy is doing! The US, on the other hand, maintains a military composed of .4% of its population. That's right folks, less than half a percentage point!

Damn it. Do you people always have to defuse the traps I set?

I'm just saying that the economy calculators aren't truly reflective of what a real national budget would be. I know that my country wouldn't actually have zero invested in defense spending, no matter what the calculator says. (And especially considering how I answer issues in a way to BOOST my military, as I said.)

Still, avoid wars until you do get a military budget.

Well i like the calculator, working with the numbers alittle bit but it gives a general idea of where you need to be. just one thing could we drop the police force part and add a marine section either into the navy or a seperate column?

Police stay because some police units are part of the military, like my Gendarmerie. I will add a marines section, though.

I don't agree. 100% tax is fully realizable, ...I find your 100% tax is wank is a completely false statement.... wank to use more than two.

This:

Uh...I think you missed the qualifier. He said that in a capitalist paradise, 100% taxation isn't possible.

Thank you Zinaire for answering the argument succinctly and quickly.

I was trying to decide the best, and most polite, way of replying to this. I settled on this:

How does that actually challenge what I said? Or change anything of the factual nature of what I said? It's just a case where you tell me to read the guidelines, then go ahead and restate what I actually said.

You say this:

Some people have budgets that allow them to support more soldiers than their population can contribute.

I know this. That is why there are two sections, one that figures the numbers by population, and one that figures the numbers by budget. If you population can't support it, obviously your budget can't no matter what.

I am not trying to be rude, it's just that I've already covered what to do when this happens, and I don't like repeating myself.

also you might try posting in gameplay etc.. not international incidents.

Please to be looking before you are to speaking:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=568552

You say this:



I know this. That is why there are two sections, one that figures the numbers by population, and one that figures the numbers by budget. If you population can't support it, obviously your budget can't no matter what.

I am not trying to be rude, it's just that I've already covered what to do when this happens, and I don't like repeating myself.

Oh! Okay, I see the problem. There was a mixup.

That wasn't directed at you. I was answering someone else. Sorry about that.

A few things: mainly you can't take this whole thing so serious and try to be super accurate to begin with.

Really it is silly to say that the entire gov't budget is based on income tax since, sales tax, property tax, excise and luxury taxes are totally ignored by the games xml feed, even though they could make up a significant portion of actual government budget. In nations with a 0% income tax, of course that is all there is. I don't really see the point in trying to determine an actual mathematical certainty about budget, percentage limits and so on, since you can't really do it. 5% of your population for military has always been sort of a gentleman's agreement to avoid wanking ala` "my 5 million person nation takes its 5 million infantry and marches into your capital"(which has happened on more than one occasion)
Really using the WA category is a bit limited as well, thats just how the WA classifies your nation. So a nation called a "Capitalist Paradise" by the WA based on issue selection but has a 100% income tax, is more of a socialist or communist country in practice but its still called that by the WA criterion. Just like modern day "communist" China is actually quite capitalist, but retains the descriptors of a communist state.


oh yes another thing: if you don't have any money allocated for defense and you get in a war, you can still have a military, but you must rectify the lack of a budget by RPing 'war debt' later on

A few things: mainly you can't take this whole thing so serious and try to be super accurate to begin with.

Really it is silly to say that the entire gov't budget is based on income tax since, sales tax, property tax, excise and luxury taxes are totally ignored by the games xml feed, even though they could make up a significant portion of actual government budget. In nations with a 0% income tax, of course that is all there is. I don't really see the point in trying to determine an actual mathematical certainty about budget, percentage limits and so on, since you can't really do it. 5% of your population for military has always been sort of a gentleman's agreement to avoid wanking ala` "my 5 million person nation takes its 5 million infantry and marches into your capital"(which has happened on more than one occasion)
Really using the WA category is a bit limited as well, thats just how the WA classifies your nation. So a nation called a "Capitalist Paradise" by the WA based on issue selection but has a 100% income tax, is more of a socialist or communist country in practice but its still called that by the WA criterion. Just like modern day "communist" China is actually quite capitalist, but retains the descriptors of a communist state.


oh yes another thing: if you don't have any money allocated for defense and you get in a war, you can still have a military, but you must rectify the lack of a budget by RPing 'war debt' later on

I want it to be as accurate as possible. That way it's make a better guide by which to base your military off of. Also, it might be the well known Draftroom pickyness.

5% is more than a gentlemans agreement. Beyond that you have major labour shortages.

I am not using the WA category. I am saying that, for instance, Nation A claims to be a Libertarian state, and RPs it as such, in entire seriousness (not like the Democratic Peoples Republic of Korea). Then how do they reconcile their 100% tax rate?

You do have a good point about War debt. I hadn't thought about it because I don't RP deficit spending. Still, it'd really hinder you, because having a corporate entity that controls the military is generally stupid, and just begging for trouble. If they sit around most of the time waiting to go to war, they will be either astronomically expensive, or require foreign contracts. OTOH, not having a corporate entity that does this, or building an army from scratch will takes months, or even years for multi-million men armies.

Request: Could everyone just ignore ICCD. I've asked the mods to clean up the threads, so it's really useless.

My military makes less than 0.2% of the entire population during war time. And it's one of the best and most mechanized ones of the world, to the point every GI Joe has a UGV at his squad disposal and could compete with what in certain nations with 5% armies would be considered "Elite Soldiers". The closest thing I'd find to it is the fictional "Brotherhood of Steel" from Fallout: a small, mobile military force with limited manpower but high technology, superior training and logistical support.

Quantity is not everything, and I'm writing a war RP thread to, among other things, prove it in a realistic and convincing manner. Third Spanish States income tax is 0%, but if I wanted to follow up with the extremely limited and superficial gameplay mechanics, which were never intended for truly serious statistics, all tax-less paradises would have to be hippie-lands without armies besides local militias.

Thus I have my own means (http://forums3.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13137926&postcount=2) of determining budget.

New, Smaller, better laid out than the last.

43% the size of the previous version. I am sure everyone will like this one better.

I like the colors Yan.

2.1 looks a lot better than the old one, nice work.

One issue though, since my real tax rate is 0% and a zero breaks the formulae, I tried setting this to 0.1% which seemed to yield decent results. However, when I set it to 0.000001% (which, of course, it closer to the actual rate of 0%), I get ludicrously high numbers. I'm not sure if there is an easy fix to this, but I thought I would point it out.

Just keep it at .1%. There really isn't anything one can do while still maintaining an RP tax rate modifier.

Also, by some horrible accident, making the fonts uniform (some where calibri, others Arial, which made the latter slightly bigger), and it is now larger. It's still a small file.

Awesome upgrade, now it says I can have 160 million troops. :eek: :D

86 million troops

that sounds reasonable. Well put together sir. I havn't played in quite a while so it was nice to see where i stood

like the upgrade still forgot the marines

Just keep it at .1%. There really isn't anything one can do while still maintaining an RP tax rate modifier.

Also, by some horrible accident, making the fonts uniform (some where calibri, others Arial, which made the latter slightly bigger), and it is now larger. It's still a small file.

OOC: Formula changes mainly reduced the size as well as tossing excess, empty spreadsheets. I've got a 10+ megabyte spreadsheet here at work that is in excess of 6,000 lines, multiple sheets, dynamic pivot table, and formula's as wide as the screen. At the same time I have one that is only 3.35 MB and it has 29,184 lines of data in it but on one tab.

[Pretty decent. Calculators don't take into account more specific national details and culture and stuff, and what we'd all like it to be, but moreover very good]

Better still. However, when I tinker with the reserve percentages I can see one major error that's new: you have total naval personnel numbers done as a sum of "Regular Naval Personnel" value plus "Reserve Naval Budget" value or so current version seems to say.:rolleyes: Check the sum at the cell for "NAVY - Total Personnel Allowance" and you should see what I mean; easily corrected, but I noticed it when trying to add naval 25% naval reserves too sent my 'Budget' personnel ceiling into the trillions (:eek:) so it bears reporting.

Awesome upgrade, now it says I can have 160 million troops. :eek: :D

Yes, but not all of them are combat troops

86 million troops

that sounds reasonable. Well put together sir. I havn't played in quite a while so it was nice to see where i stood

Thanks, but there is one glaring mistake that wagdog pointed out.

like the upgrade still forgot the marines

Marines are a bit more complicated, since it's based on the ships and doctrine. Not to mention that it widely varies (compared the number of UK marines to US marines, the ratios are hugely different. At this point, it's too big a thing to tackle.

OOC: Formula changes mainly reduced the size as well as tossing excess, empty spreadsheets. I've got a 10+ megabyte spreadsheet here at work that is in excess of 6,000 lines, multiple sheets, dynamic pivot table, and formula's as wide as the screen. At the same time I have one that is only 3.35 MB and it has 29,184 lines of data in it but on one tab.

Yes, and I will revise them later on, but when I first uploaded it, it was 29kb, and it jumped to 88kb just by changing the font in three lines.

[Pretty decent. Calculators don't take into account more specific national details and culture and stuff, and what we'd all like it to be, but moreover very good]

Thanks, but on the note of national details, there is simply no way to implement it. Too many variables.

Better still. However, when I tinker with the reserve percentages I can see one major error that's new: you have total naval personnel numbers done as a sum of "Regular Naval Personnel" value plus "Reserve Naval Budget" value or so current version seems to say.:rolleyes: Check the sum at the cell for "NAVY - Total Personnel Allowance" and you should see what I mean; easily corrected, but I noticed it when trying to add naval 25% naval reserves too sent my 'Budget' personnel ceiling into the trillions (:eek:) so it bears reporting.

Thank you for pointing this out, I have fixed it, and will upload it as v2.1.1.

Minor but important update to v2.1.1

What is the update? I don't really see it.... :$

What is the update? I don't really see it.... :$

Please refer to the post above the update announcement before asking this question.

Bump

Why would tax rates play into this at all? You ask for the Military and Law and Order bugets, which are already calculated from your tax rate, by the economy calculator, I just don't see why that would have anything to do with this. If I am wrong, please tell me how it does, it just bothers me, especially as my income tax rate is zero (There are other taxes other than income). Also, what if you want your reservists numbers to be larger than your regular military?

How it works is you tell it your budget (from a calculator) and the tax rate those budgets are derived from. If your NS tax rate is 1% and your military budget is $1 trillion but your RPed tax rate is 3%, it will multiply that number by three and give you a military budget of $3 trillion.

Why would tax rates play into this at all? You ask for the Military and Law and Order bugets, which are already calculated from your tax rate, by the economy calculator, I just don't see why that would have anything to do with this. If I am wrong, please tell me how it does, it just bothers me, especially as my income tax rate is zero (There are other taxes other than income). Also, what if you want your reservists numbers to be larger than your regular military?

Re: Tax Rates:

Because some people like to tax 100% and then claim that they only tax 10%. Not possible.

Re: Reserves:

Then you decrease the amount of money you spend on the reserves, increase the percentage of budget allotted to the reserves, or both.

Re: What Bothers You:

People that complain that they have to put in .01 for their taxes instead of zero bother me, and therefore think that the feature is so broken it really has no place in NS bother me, but I keep that to myself.

The NS page, in my opinion, should reflect taxation as percentage of the GDP, not income. Anyone who had read the original guide (and I know you had the calculator when it was posted) would have realized that therefore it is not just income tax that I feel it should represent.

Not to sound mean, of course. It's just that if it bothers you so much, write your own calculator, and stop asking why relatively convenient features are added. You see, it really is a pet peeve of mine. Reminds me of a comparison of Operating Systems as airlines, the gist of the joke being that most of the operating systems suck, while Linux requires you to put your seat in the proper position, and use a wrench to affix it with four bolts. The real punchline was that most people would listen to your glowing reviews, and cheap prices, and yet they are utterly fixated on what you had to do to your seat, refusing to ever use such a horrid airline.

And that is why it bothers me.

How it works is you tell it your budget (from a calculator) and the tax rate those budgets are derived from. If your NS tax rate is 1% and your military budget is $1 trillion but your RPed tax rate is 3%, it will multiply that number by three and give you a military budget of $3 trillion.

In most cases, the tax rate is actually dropped.

In most cases, the tax rate is actually dropped.

I suppose that's probably the case, but since both The Beatus and I have low/non-existent taxes, I decided to increase it as an example (and division is harder than multiplication....)

Once I get home, expect an update in a few hours.

V2.2 will feature:

Fixed Total Cmbt Troops by Pop
Tanks
New Color Coding.

Tanks? I wonder how many I ought to have....

Yanitaria, you make AWESOME calculators!

This looks great, tagged for 2.2

Tanks? I wonder how many I ought to have....

Yanitaria, you make AWESOME calculators!

Tanks Greal, that does mean a lot. [/corny play on words]

Actually, you'd be surprised just how much tankers will cost you, in terms of combat personnel. This calculator has just been one big realization that combat personnel really do require a lot of support to keep going.

Tanks Greal, that does mean a lot. [/corny play on words]

Actually, you'd be surprised just how much tankers will cost you, in terms of combat personnel. This calculator has just been one big realization that combat personnel really do require a lot of support to keep going.

Well, thats why I RP less then a million tanks.

Updated

OOC: I like the expansion.

OOC: I like the expansion.

You don't have to put OOC tags in this thread. It's all OOC.

Thanks for the compliment.

651,236 tanks. WHOA

Major update:

Fixed math problems in v2.2.1

v2.2 is flawed, please do not use it.

651,236 tanks. WHOA

More like 65,123 tanks

You may have underestimated a little.

Excellent update. Your calculators are professionally done.

I need feedback. "Given enough eyes, all problems are shallow" sorta Linus Torvalds stuff.
Well, what I can tell so far...

Air Force: Pilots can't comprise 10% of it. Not even all flight personnel, unless flying WWII machines.
USAF, for instance, has 1 operational aircraft per 60 total personnel. Anything less than 1 in 50, maybe at the limit 1 in 40 severely impacts the operability of airbases and aircraft.
I'd suggest to add "Aircraft:" and put it as 1/50. Keep the pilots count, but replace with "Aircrews:" and put it as probably 5-8%.

Navy: Not everyone in the Navy is a sailor. Someone has to keep the onshore facilities running. For instance, USN has 330,000 people, but only 110,000 are in crews.

Tweaks: It's not immediately obvious where the number of men per tank is (btw, maybe makes sense to change to "Tank crew size:"). I'd suggest a small visual tweak, group the user-entered variables together (join the black header), and put output an extra empty line below that.
Maybe combine the user inputs into one altogether.


As a more general direction of expansion, I'd suggest to also add a section on equipment cost calculation. Usually it's between 1.5x and 3x the annual budget, depending on the arm of service and other variables (say, how often it is upgraded).
I could collaborate on some of that.

Little math redone for you Yani.

For active tanks a nation should have no more then one tank per 300 soldiers. For a balance (As this calculator works for I assume). That's active. Total active and reserve can go to 150, but you then you have a 1993 ex-Soviet-esque quality force. If you remind me over msn tonight I'll crunch some numbers for you and give you some better rules of thumb.

Well, what I can tell so far...

Air Force: Pilots can't comprise 10% of it. Not even all flight personnel, unless flying WWII machines.
USAF, for instance, has 1 operational aircraft per 60 total personnel. Anything less than 1 in 50, maybe at the limit 1 in 40 severely impacts the operability of airbases and aircraft.
I'd suggest to add "Aircraft:" and put it as 1/50. Keep the pilots count, but replace with "Aircrews:" and put it as probably 5-8%.

Navy: Not everyone in the Navy is a sailor. Someone has to keep the onshore facilities running. For instance, USN has 330,000 people, but only 110,000 are in crews.

Tweaks: It's not immediately obvious where the number of men per tank is (btw, maybe makes sense to change to "Tank crew size:"). I'd suggest a small visual tweak, group the user-entered variables together (join the black header), and put output an extra empty line below that.
Maybe combine the user inputs into one altogether.


As a more general direction of expansion, I'd suggest to also add a section on equipment cost calculation. Usually it's between 1.5x and 3x the annual budget, depending on the arm of service and other variables (say, how often it is upgraded).
I could collaborate on some of that.

Re: Air Force: Thanks for that, I'll change it, since I was going off of something I read on NSD. I won't even include the number of pilots, since it's not as useful as the number of aircraft.

Re: Navy: I put about 42% not 100%, figuring in for spare crew members as well, which can do shore work when not on ships, and a note at the bottom explains it. However, I'll just change it to avoid confusion, and drop the spare crews. If somebody doesn't know how that works already, tough shit on them.

Re: Tweeks: I'll take some of these suggestions, but some things are that way for a reason. For instance, they aren't in one column so that the user edited variables are above everything else with out wasting screen space.

As for the Equipment cost, it doesn't really provide the average user with much usable info. I might add in an Equipment Acquisition Budget, though.

Little math redone for you Yani.

For active tanks a nation should have no more then one tank per 300 soldiers. For a balance (As this calculator works for I assume). That's active. Total active and reserve can go to 150, but you then you have a 1993 ex-Soviet-esque quality force. If you remind me over msn tonight I'll crunch some numbers for you and give you some better rules of thumb.

Okay, I'll try to remind you tonight. I was going by the Yom Kippur war figures, how the Egyptians had 1,000 tanks and 100,000 men for the initial attack.

You may have underestimated a little.

According to Sumer, the base number is overestimated.