NationStates Jolt Archive

Now, I don't want to spoil anything, but Vetalia is likely to undergo a successful socialist/Communist revolution in the near future. If it succeeds, however, I have a bit of a problem:

What should the country be like? I leave this up to the RP community because I'd like to see what people would like to see in our country as we move in to a drastically different era in our history. So, the four most realistic options are listed and feel free to vote for the utopia of your choice. If people really want something else, I'll make sure to keep an eye on it even if it's not listed in the poll.

I'd say go for something that still allows a decent economy, and one that isn't overtly aggressive - one that welcomes diplomatic relations with nations of all types. Thing ANL I guess.

I didn't see Ruthless Capitalist on the list... seems like the only one that would fit Vetalia...

I would say modern PRC; it gives you some freedom to experiment. Personally, I would go for Stalinist state, since you have virtually full control, but it's your call. Post-Stalin gave way to a bunch of lunatics, especially Gorbachev.

Having a cult of personality would allow you absolute control in a sense...if that's what you're looking for.

Well, there's always Igovian Communism, as practiced by The Calcutta Communist Contract Organisation (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=551988).

Non-Marxist, Soviet-driven democracy with the following tenets:

1) Establishment of the community as society's base unit
2) Locally, direct democracy
3) Nationally, democratically accountable representation
4) State ownership of capital
5) Worker self-management
6) A fixed value-tax on capital goods
7) Perfect-competition in Igovian free-trade
8) Market-simulation through state control of prices

First espoused by comrade Graeme Igo, Grandfather of the Beddgelen Revolution, and put into practice in the Indian Soviet Commonwealth following the peaceful February Revolution of 1989, in which the Popular Soviets faced-down the Communist Party of India demanding the abolition of the Army and the Party. A chief contention is that democracy is an empty lie if it is confined only to the political arena and fails to saturate the economy, not to mention the military.

Of course, like any ideology, you'd be free to warp it as you liked, and perhaps by leaving out a few safeguards inherent to the Beddgelen model you could have a tyranny by majority or similar arrangement if you felt that it would be more entertaining. Current Igovian states in NS are far more democratic than any nation in reality, but you could choose to end up having everything managed by overbearing public committees, censoring this because it does not serve the general will and destroying that because it lacks majority sanction. Either way is good :)

Needless to say, Beth Gellert (AKA Beddgelert, AKA Soviet India) and likely the rest of the still-young Contract Organisation would be enthusiastic about lending support to a potential Igovian revoltuion in Vetalia, especially if they believe that its participants intends to be pure.

I would advocate a hardline Stalinist state with an absolutely stringent planned and autarkic economy, Anti-revisionist and highly isolationist following the line of comrade Hoxha. The DPRA would gladly support a Vetalia of that model.

PRC would make most sense for Vetalia but DDR or Romania style would be more interesting, I reckon.

On a semi-related note, this revolution would be absolutely horrific to Hamilay, Vetalia being a major trading partner and previously so capitalist. If it's open we'd definitely provide a lot of military support and also a homeland for refugees.

Parliamentary democracy with planned socialist economy and some market elements. Moldova supposedly had(or has) one.

Of course, I would suggest something "weirder" if you didn't mention you wanted only "realistic" stuff. Something like Third Spanish States economy(prepare for LULZ)

http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/9316/failureofthefreemarketmv9.png (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alliance_of_the_Libertarian_Left#Radical_free-marketeers)

I would favor either USSR or GDR-style - GDR for preference. As for Romanian style, Vetalia got rid of its Emperor just recently, and I think a government is more likely to evolve over time into a current PRC-style state, rather than start out there.

And as with Hamilay I imagine this could be extremely disruptive for Manth, given shared borders* and trade relations which are, if not as strong as in the past, still very significant.

*PS I have been assuming we still shared a border in Africa, but since I see you moved to Mediterranica is this still the case?

Expect all Vetelian assets in Red Tide to be nationalized and sold off when this happens.

That being said, I would go with PRC if you want to keep me as a friendly nation. It won't prevent your assets from being sold-off, but it will give you the most hope for maintaining relations with my nation.

I am personally leaning towards the PRC myself, but as I said it's up to you.

That being said, there are some aspects of our culture that are just too hard for any regime to eradicate; Vetalian socialism would definitely retain a lot of capitalist elements, but would mostly refocus them inward instead of on international markets. We would probably become something like a gigantic state corporation with some foreign competition to keep things efficient, but not so much that the state itself is threatened. Our country's penchant for order would lead to some pretty restrictive state control over anti-Vetalian activities, but it would be balanced by the sheer pervasiveness of organized criminal elements in the economy.

I imagine any and all Vetalian property, except for that located in socialist states would be expropriated, and Vetalian rubles would become a much more restricted currency than they currently are.

I am personally leaning towards the PRC myself, but as I said it's up to you.

That being said, there are some aspects of our culture that are just too hard for any regime to eradicate; Vetalian socialism would definitely retain a lot of capitalist elements, but would mostly refocus them inward instead of on international markets. We would probably become something like a gigantic state corporation with some foreign competition to keep things efficient, but not so much that the state itself is threatened. Our country's penchant for order would lead to some pretty restrictive state control over anti-Vetalian activities, but it would be balanced by the sheer pervasiveness of organized criminal elements in the economy.

I imagine any and all Vetalian property, except for that located in socialist states would be expropriated, and Vetalian rubles would become a much more restricted currency than they currently are.

Sounds like Titoism.

I vote PRC, so at least possible trade with our northern neighbor won't go out the door

I'd vote "TWSP-Style New Socialism", but it's not there :(

I vote PRC, mostly so my trillions don't evaporate like they did in BL.

Speaking of which, I need to know how I'd fit in. I have, according to your estimates, thirty trillion USD's invested in you. You also have a military base at New Vantepolis, as I am your protectorate.

And assuming a hostile regime comes up, you can probably expect some type of war. Hostile of course meaning that they nationalise Vantanian investments. However, to protect those investments, you may find this Capitalist sell you the noose to hang a different Capitalist... If you know what I mean.

Assuming you don't, I'd be willing to play dirty with the Commies, giving them (covert) aid to insure that my money is safe.

My nation is based on Nicolae Ceausecu's Romania and it is so awsome to RP. There are so many ideas and senario's you can take from that area. My old Dictator Provoçe and my current Dictator Milencu are based on Ceausescu

the economy is stagnant and living standards are crumbling. The people having rationing. powercuts are frequent. 2 hours of TV a day and all it shows is footage dedicated to the leader and his power hungry wife and family. Terevesti is based on Bucahrest as well with symetrical city plan. wide avenues and boulavards and identical apartments blocks. yes a communist Romania inspired nation is really awsome to RP
Not to mention rpíng fun didtators that loose touch witrh reality is so much fun too like when Provoçe and Milencu visit the country side, dead tree's are painted green to please them and when having contact with regular citizens they have to be quarentined for 48 hours incase they pass on an illness to the "Great Comrade Leader"

so go for the Romania style and we can be good friends :P

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=556105&highlight=Provo%E7e
/\ this was what life is like in Bulgislavia under Provoçe and what its pretty much like now under Milencu

Well, I think all four of the options could work out really well for Vetalia, but I ended up picking the cult of personality. I think that the Stalin-esque idea wasn't too fitting, and the East Germany idea didn't seem to fit either. The PRC idea is good, but it's too similiar to what I imagine you have now. Besides, we need more crazy dictatorships these days. It feels like we haven't had a good one since I threw guys into blenders.

For IC purposes, none of the above please. Otherwise, if you must be communist or socialist, please don't follow the masses and start introducing Russian-isms just because it's the first Communist country that comes to mind.

I belive your suppose to only put one joke option....

I belive your suppose to only put one joke option....

A joke option would be an actual utopia. ;)

Hmm, I'd personally say Juche; that's what my nation is based upon more or less. ^^

Hmm, I'd personally say Juche; that's what my nation is based upon more or less. ^^

LOL JUCHE XD

Seriously go Tito.

LOL JUCHE XD

Seriously go Tito.

Hmm, he was an interesting figure indeed. ^^

Bump-a-dump

Seriously go Tito.

Well, he did hold Yugoslavia together.

But the minute Vetalia becomes communist/socialist all trade will end. All $_value trillion dollars of it. D:

Well, he did hold Yugoslavia together.

But the minute Vetalia becomes communist/socialist all trade will end. All $_value trillion dollars of it. D:

Because nations with leftist economics don't trade? 0_o

Sorry, not following that one.

Because I (ICly) hate Communism/Socialism. And as Vetalia is a former ally we'd have a lot of trade.

Of course, our country is likely to suffer considerable realignment of trade from many of our former partners towards the socialist side of the NS world. Now, given that our country could never possibly abandon all of its old capitalist traditions, a lot of features would be retained (such as free convertibility of rubles on world markets) but would be filtered first through the state rather than the market. I'm envisioning socialist Vetalia like a massive state corporation, with all of the potential benefits and drawbacks of such a system.

Realistically, I'd like to see some real improvements, perhaps things like instituting a universal healthcare system and eliminating some of the gross income inequality of the late Meritocratic period, but at the cost of expanding the state's power over the economy and the corruption that stems from such power.

It may end up being a stepping stone towards liberal democracy in the distant future, basically helping our country return to what it was in the 1950's and 1960's.

How about murderous,corrupt and tyrannical?

Oh, wait. That's all types of Communism.

Go for PRC. Looks fun.

How about murderous,corrupt and tyrannical?

Oh, wait. That's all types of Communism.

Go for PRC. Looks fun.

Offence taken, name... well, there's not much point taking names, since we haven't got a military or any other ass-kicking vector.

Well, anyway, if you want Chivikistan's opinion, and let's face it, nobody does, we advocate an awkward blending of Titoist -for want of a more accurate term referencing the real creators of the SFRY's economic theory- economics with something remotely similar to Swiss democracy.

Offence taken, name... well, there's not much point taking names, since we haven't got a military or any other ass-kicking vector.

Hi, I'm Questers. I'm the scourge of Socialism.

Go with East Germany. Or Yanitarian Socialism. But seeing as you want to go with oppressive socialism, Yanitarian Socialism wouldn't work.

But seeing as you want to go with oppressive socialism, Yanitarian Socialism wouldn't work.

No, it would. :p

No, it would. :p

oshiiii—

Also, I've been thinking about a potential (and hopefully temporary) partition of our country and its colonies. "West Vetalia", whic'h of course would not be its actual name, would be capitalist and "East Vetalia" would be the socialist side.

Quite frankly, the thought of having a partitioned Vetalia City comprised of a capitalist half and a communist half would be pretty amazing, especially if there were foreign powers involved in its administration.

especially if there were foreign powers involved in its administration.

:D

:D

I think Mediterranica would have a heart attack if Haven were the occupying power of West Vetalia City.

"Haven" is not a single supranational body O_o

"Haven" is not a single supranational body O_o

The point is that a Havenic power is present in one of the region's biggest nations. :p

it would be nice to see a east german style communism again in NS, there's not many out there

Let them eat cake :p it is a city, after all.