NationStates Jolt Archive

Related to this: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=538793

All OOC stuff will go in here. Oh, and I edited my post.

Would you like to have a mod split the OOC comments into the new thread?

Edit: Actually, since the CAP nations seem to have gotten your war mixed up with the Far Echo Islands conflict from another thread, would you prefer it if I just had the relevant stuff removed?

Fordock: Awaiting information on my anti-satellite attack on your... sattelites.

Toori: Early PMT=Tech up to 2040. I dont think your spaceships would be included as such. Just a guess.

Frozopia: How many Anti-Satellite Missile are you firing?

All: I will be posting what I am deploying momentarily.

Irony of ironies, Vetalia is on Red Tide's side yet again. Of course, it's been a generation since that disaster, so things have changed quite a bit.

Heh Red Tide. Thought I'de give PMT a go, and who better to fight than my previous occupiers.

Edit I will see for the anti-satellite missiles. Not striking just yet. How many satellites for military purposes do you have that I can be aware off?

OOC: How many sattelites, well if you count the anti-ballistic/anti-satellite missile 'Brilliant Pebble'(perhaps I should have used those in the opening anti-satellite attack, oops) mini-sattelites, there are potentially tens of thousands of them. If you mean just communication, navigation, tungsten rod, and spy sats... oh, about seven to eight hundred total approx. I never really got a precise number, I doubt anybody ever has a precise number for how many sats they put up.

Gonna be alot of missiles then. Using a number from the top of my head, say 900? Priority list I guess:

Large scale Orbital weaponry (im assuming if any of these, theres few).
Communications (as many military comsats as possible).
Spy satellites, to a lesser extent.

Fordock: Awaiting information on my anti-satellite attack on your... sattelites.

Toori: Early PMT=Tech up to 2040. I dont think your spaceships would be included as such. Just a guess.

Frozopia: How many Anti-Satellite Missile are you firing?

All: I will be posting what I am deploying momentarily.

OOCly- I didn't have time to say this but I call Bullshit. Fordock exists in around the tech and time of 2010. If you don't like it don't attack us because we are MT exclusive NO PMT. I shall respond IC in the main thread soon.

OOCly- I didn't have time to say this but I call Bullshit. Fordock exists in around the tech and time of 2010. If you don't like it don't attack us because we are MT exclusive NO PMT. I shall respond IC in the main thread soon.

Err... hate to break it to you, but I said early-PMT allowed in the thread. Heck, I said it in the thread title. If you missed that, sorry, but they're included. MT is considered to be up to 2020(although there's disagreement), while PMT is up to 2100. My nation mainly sticks to MT(MT=up to 2020 tech) with some early PMT elements(such as my Superdreadnoughts, which are a staple of NS Navies).

EDIT: Here is what I am deploying:

The 8th Dreadnought Battlegroup:
1 Raven Class SuperDreadnought
1 Tsunamis Class Supercarrier
2 Bluebird Guided Missile Cruisers
5 G(un)-Battleships
5 M(issile)-Battleships
12 Tidal Wave Class Guided Missile Destroyers
24 Mockingbird Class Frigates
12 TC-2C Anti-Submarine Warfare Helicopters
Assorted Supply Ships

The Invasion Fleet:
10 Tidal Wave-Class DDGs
20 Mockingbird-Class Frigates
10 TC-2C ASW Helicopters
10 TC-2A Heavy Rocket Helicopters
6 TC-2B Transport Helicopters
6 Khan-Class Amphibious Assualt Ships
Assorted other transports

The Invasion Force:
1 Field Army consisting of 3 Army Corps.
Each Army Corp(175,000 men each) consists of:
1 Armored Division(20,000 men)
1 Mechanized-Infantry Division(20,000 men)
3 Motorised-Infantry Divisions(20,000 men)
5 attached specialised* brigades(5,000 men each)

*By specialised, I mean devoted mostly, but not entirely, too one particular arm of a Army or another(IE: Artillery, Anti-Air, Engineer, Armored, etc. etc.)

Ok will probably deploy my counter attack once the Red Tide are in Fordock waters. This will include the satellite missile attack and a naval attack.

Red Tide, you have a telegram.

Replied.

Fordock, where are you?

OOC - Starving. Or I was. Jewish and today was Yom-Kippur = No food for the entire day = Lack of brain power.

Ah... so... are you done fasting now? Or do we have to wait till tomorrow?

Nope just finished about a few hours ago. Still though I overate and now I feel sick so I'll get back to it tomorrow.

Cool, my parents are going to kick me off the computer in 8 minutes anyways.

Ok have a look at the naval force i intend to send

1 Command Dreadnaught Battleship
1 Battleships
6 Escort Carriers
2 Arsenal Ships
50 Frigates
20 Heavy Cruisers
20 Light Cruisers
5 ASW submarines
5 Anti-Shipping submarines
500 Marines

Aircraft:
42 Fighter Bombers
42 Interceptors
42 Escort Fighters
10 ASW Helicopters
20 Utility Helicopters

Replied.

Got it;

This time, TG for Vetalia.

OOC: :taps foot impatiently:

OOC - Starving. Or I was. Jewish and today was Yom-Kippur = No food for the entire day = Lack of brain power.

OOC: Stop complaining, being Muslim and fasting is harder. :p

RedTide, the offer for the mercs still stands if you want them to charge at the cost of preventing casualties in your army. xD

OOC - opps forgot about this. On it now crafting a reply.

OOC: Stop complaining, being Muslim and fasting is harder. :p

RedTide, the offer for the mercs still stands if you want them to charge at the cost of preventing casualties in your army. xD

OOC: .....

Since when did my nation ever care about casualties? :p

OOC: .....

Since when did my nation ever care about casualties? :p

Since your soldiers were sad? :eek:

... I dont get it.

... I dont get it.

Neither do I, now buy some mercs.

Maldorians: We'll see how things go first.

Fordock: I need you to both respond to the fact me naval force is quite obviously heading for the city of Meshkrat and my anti-sattelite launch in this post: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13071651&postcount=20

On it.

Red Tide inform me when your ready to clash swords.

Red Tide, any idea on what kind of economic infusion your country will need to sustain this war? Cargoes of equipment, hard Vetalian rubles and consumer goods await...

OOC: Mostly, I also have a few coastal defense guns hooked up to nuclear power generators that use railguns. Thats about it.

EDIT: TIMEWARP!

EDIT2: OH! I also have 2 SuperCapitols(even bigger and meaner SuperDreadnoughts) that use them.

Red Tide, those electric guzzling railguns are reserved to your Superdreadnaught right? Just trying to get a better idea on the tech we are using.

C'mon Red Tide. No defence system is 100% effective, Every single one of those 650 missiles being destroyed is unrealistic. Realise that each missile is going to be using a helluva alot of ECM to at least cover its attack.

No system is 100% perfect assuming a sufficiently large enough attack. Below that point, the kill ratio starts going up. When you have a mere 650 missiles against tens of thousands of Brilliant Pebbles... well, I think you get the picture.

As for the ECCM... well, ASAT missiles can easily be tracked via InfraRed Sensors, I dont know if there are any real countermeasure against those that can be utilised by ASAT missiles. Ill check though and get back to you on it.

oh shit 10's of 1000's? Is there enough orbit space around the earth for that amount?

Around Real Life Earth? I dont know, honestly...

Around NS Earth(which I assume to be a fractal reality), most likely, yes.

Red Tide do you use Rocket assisted shells in your ships btw?

Yes, it not only extends their range but also increases their speed. But what you really have to worry about are my CM-4s.

Red Tide, what is a missile battleship or a CM-4?


Btw awaiting your reply in the IC.

My Navy has two different battleships, the G(un)-Battleship and the M-Battleship. The G-Battleship is loaded down with guns, two turrets with three eighteen-inch guns on each turret, a dozen 122mm dual-purpose guns, and another dozen WHIRLWIND Anti-Missile/Anti-Air Systems.

The M(issile)-Battleship is loaded down with about 1,500 VLS Missile Tubes, 50% of which are devoted to Surface-Air missiles, 30% of which are devoted to anti-ship missiles, and the remaining 20% devoted to anti-land missiles. It also has two 122mm DP guns and a dozen WHIRLWINDs.

The CM-4 is the standard Red Tidean Anti-Ship Missile, a few of which are capable of critically damaging a Superdreadnought, its specs can be found here: http://z4.invisionfree.com/NSDraftroom/index.php?showtopic=949

As to any IC developments, I am awaiting for Fordock to show up.

Argh Im sorry Red Tide, Im not totally happy with the tech your using so im gonna have to pull out. Also gonna be busy with freshers week in uni next week. Sorry man.

... Okay?

Okay, first problems have appeared. They're the result of misunderstanding and probably lack of knowledge in the respective subject. These problems are.

1. The Fuel-Air Bombs have not been dropped yet. My post stated pretty clearly(at least, I think so) that the planes were awaiting my invading soldiers to call in points of particularly heavy resistance and then drop them.

2. When I say fuel-air bombs, I mean fuel-air explosives or, even more simply, a thermobaric bomb. When I said you, you probably THOUGHT I meant something akin to incendiaries like napalm and magnesium. What I really mean is this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermobaric_weapon#Weapon_effects

In essence, the bomb works by dispersing flammable vapor via a small explosive charge in a rather good sized area, then detonating the vapor with a somewhat larger explosive charge. Now that we got the mechanism out of the way, I suggest you read the weapons effects part so you can prepare yourself for when I actaully drop those bombs.

Otherwise, your post is fine. Ill have to reply tommorrow afternoon though(school blocks this website).

Ah sorry. Will look at that link. My school doesn't block this though. Hell they don't even know of it.

Lord SumGuy: In addition to Maldorians concerns...

Where the did you come up with four-hundred thousand fighters!? My nation only has 300,000 aircraft, not fighters, total aircraft! And I am a six billion nation with probably the most militarized people RPing on NS! Unless your using WW2 era prop-planes, there is no way a nation 1/3rd my size can afford that many.

In addition, where did you find the room to land 80,000 fighters? That is alot of aircraft.

Lord SumGuy: In addition to Maldorians concerns...

Where the did you come up with four-hundred thousand fighters!? My nation only has 300,000 aircraft, not fighters, total aircraft! And I am a six billion nation with probably the most militarized people RPing on NS! Unless your using WW2 era prop-planes, there is no way a nation 1/3rd my size can afford that many.

In addition, where did you find the room to land 80,000 fighters? That is alot of aircraft.

fighters, as in people who are fighting...thats really all i can call them since they arent official soldiers..

Lord SumGuy: In addition to Maldorians concerns...

Where the did you come up with four-hundred thousand fighters!? My nation only has 300,000 aircraft, not fighters, total aircraft! And I am a six billion nation with probably the most militarized people RPing on NS! Unless your using WW2 era prop-planes, there is no way a nation 1/3rd my size can afford that many.

In addition, where did you find the room to land 80,000 fighters? That is alot of aircraft.

Was gonna add that too...I hope he meant fighters like warriors not aircraft....*twitches*

Swarms of Sopwith Camels!!!!! *runs off*

look at the post above yours maldorians...

fighters, as in people who are fighting...thats really all i can call them since they arent official soldiers..

Lord Sumguy: Oh...

:feels foolish:

Had you said volunteers, I might not have made this mistake. Ah well, all is cool now. And since they're coming in on commercial aircraft, they'll have to arrive at cities not yet occupied/being fought over. As Red Tidean policy is to shoot down any none-Red Tidean aircraft getting too close to its forces/territory.

Mal(can I call you Mal?): Lol.

Mal(can I call you Mal?): Lol.

Yay! And remember, hire ma mercs. *Nudge* *Nudge*

Hire zem!!!111!21 *Whips out AK-47 and runs off screaming*

Red Tide, part of my last IC post was aimed at you. Any response?

Oh, right that... Ill get right on that.

OOC - Sorry for delaying so much still thinking of my course of action.

Oh, right that... Ill get right on that.

I shall look forward to it.

OOC: Since Red Tide didnt post a response to the AL deployment, he isnt blockading the coast, and the AL is using civilian craft only...

Lord Sumguy, I don't know about Red Tide, but I specifically mentioned that Manthian submarines would be spreading out and sinking any non-friendly vessels they found in Fordockan waters, including civilian ones. It's a few posts above yours.

I shall look forward to it.



Lord Sumguy, I don't know about Red Tide, but I specifically mentioned that Manthian submarines would be spreading out and sinking any non-friendly vessels they found in Fordockan waters, including civilian ones. It's a few posts above yours.

on all sides? They'd be pretty spread out if they were covering all of the Fordockian waters. You ok with 10% of the AL ships being sunk?

on all sides? They'd be pretty spread out if they were covering all of the Fordockian waters. You ok with 10% of the AL ships being sunk?

They should be spread out - clustering large numbers of submarines in a small area is asking for it. And I would expect I have enough subs to cover the whole country, albeit loosely - though, is there a map?

And yeah, sure. I'm not picky about numbers.

Fordock, I have seen the map on your Wiki page, however it does not have a scale. Could you give me a rough estimate of the length of your coastline/the scale of the map? I know about how many vessels I would want covering any given area of sea, and I am fairly sure I have enough ships available to put a fairly tight blockade in place (with time, of course), but I would like to make sure.

Thank you.

Fordock: I never said your soldiers were routing, the fact is, there are still airborne units behind your lines and in your soldiers escape paths way. There is also the fact that no matter how you retreat, I am going to be harrassing you with offshore artillery(at least until you fall out of range) and air raids as you fall back.

And I probably would still wind up taking the harborfront pretty much intact, as I just blew a large hole in your lines with thermobaric bombs and that was where that big armored column was heading for threw your hole.

As for your aircraft, yeah, probably a handful(say, six-seven?) of your aircraft will still be in the air, but lets take some things into account. The first thing is, these aircraft have just become unorganised as it is a statistical fact they are probably going to be from different squads. Also, they just had a large number of friends either dead or chances are going to fall into Red Tidean hands, thats going to effect their morale. And I need you to post some of your aircraft surviving and attempting to take out some of the cargo planes(there's alot of them).

As for the two legions that are left behind, depending on how many men each of your legions have, there probably wont be enough to form a real front inside the city, so they'll eventually wind up surrounded. Also understand that some of the civilians will not be able to get out of the city before it gets occupied. This is actually a mixed thing, as the civilians will be able to form a resistance, some of which will be rooted out by the inevitable Intellegince-Commissarat Occupation Battalions and some will be able to continue.

As for nukes... well, obliterating Meshkrat would have been a bad idea and lets leave it at that.

Anyways, I need a IC reaction from you to continue.

PS: Red Tidean WMD doctrine states that the tactical usage of chemical weapons on the battlefied is permissable, the strategic usage on cities requires higher authorisation. Nukes and bio weapons are regarded as 'politically risky' and launch authorisation is held only by the General-Secretary(for nukes) and Defense Minister(for bio-weapons).

Yeah. I do have nukes. But there a secret. I decided not too because I wanted to be able to recapture. And I was intentionally leaving the city intact. Also expect HEAVY civilian resistance. I think I'll post a few soldiers leaving plans for my FSSM-01. Expect some deaths.

Fordock, a responce to the AL troop landings?

Just assume they landed. The bulk of my military is at the wall, the plains or Sumetra and the other Provincial capitals.

i need your forces to make contact with them and give them orders...

http://img528.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fordockstrategicalmapmg3.jpg

A strategical Map. For those who don't want the tourist map. These are current deployment and are slightly roughed but accurate. This should give everyone an indication of major cities and where my armies are. Please note my armies are to scale others are not.

Before I reply: Fordock, are your men using motorised transportation(EG: trucks, hummvees, etc) to get out of the city?

Some are on Elusion Class Vehicles (Check my wikipage) others on jeeps and others are just running. But it remains semi-orderly with units dismissed by certain transports. So a whole unit would have elusions, a whole unit would be running, and a whole unit would be on jeeps, and another unit would be on civilian craft and so on and so forth.

@ Red Tide: If by heavy equipment you are reffering to things like artillery, then no. The AL's main strength is in superbly trained, flexible units of infanty equipped with a wide variation of equipment for dealing with almost any threat. They do have about 40,000 APC's and other land transport vehicles, as well as about 10,000 tanks. They have almost no air force, but the infantry are equipped with relatively large amounts of antitank/anti-air equipment, as well as plantable explosives such as C4.

Hmm... that many is going too be really hard too hide.

Fordock: how extensive is your transport infrastracture? As in, what condition are your roads and railroads in? This is vastly inmportant in relation to Lord Sumguy, you, and me, as getting troops up there is going to be difficult if the infrastructure is poor(or blown up ;)).

Now that you mention it... I should be starting strategic bombing raids soon.

OOC - Transport is VERY built up. Being anti-global warming and all that 75% of Fordockians don't even own a car and there are tons of trains and plains and public transport.

So Public transport is huge
Private rather small.

So roads = Awesome for the buses
Railways = Dominant method of travel and tons of backup systems. Fordock runs on train time. In fact the Fordockian clock is set by the time off of the clock in the large station in the capital.

Greal, please note that the Manthian blockade, while it may be made up of ships alone, certainly does not lack the ability to strike at aircraft traveling into or out of Fordock via SAMs, and certainly will do so if given the opportunity.

Large cargo aircraft of the type needed to transport tanks and other heavy equipment are rarely radar-stealthy, and since I am basically surrounding the entire country with ships, I have posted detection of your planes. If there is anything you think I have not taken into account, feel free to let me know.

Also, since you did not specify, I left it up to you to determine the route your planes are flying into the country. Doesn't really matter to me since I can cover basically anywhere.

Numbers for my last IC post are a little vague, so here's some basic information: This missile strike has about five thousand Tomahawks to play with (with some more being kept in reserve), with any major deep-water ports on the scale of NY city or Singapore receiving large shares of the attention and smaller ports getting smaller presents.