NationStates Jolt Archive

Rather than have jumbled alliances and relations, this thread will be for the posting of various alliances and/or relations (trade sanctions, diplomats being expelled, and whatnot), so that other players aren't confused as to the status between two other states. If you've got an alliance, or a war, please post it here - it's unreasonable to expect people to know everything, and this will conduce to greater co-operation between players. If you wish to negotiate pre-existing (historical) treaties (OOCly, of course), between yourself and other nations, you may also do that here, before the game begins on Saturday. At that point you will no longer be allowed to 'backdate' treaties, as it could confer an unfair advantage, as well as be considered metagaming.

List of Alliances, Treaties, and Wars
Illar Empire:
Defensive Alliance with Anj Reich against the German Empire.
Defensive Alliance with Kingdom of Greco-Serbia.

Anj Reich:
Defensive Alliance with Illar Empire against the German Empire.
Allied with Ostia.
Guaranteeing the Independence of Ostia.
Guaranteeing the Independence of the Swiss Confederation.
Defensive Alliance with Incognitia against the German Empire

The German Empire:
Guaranteeing the Independence of the Swiss Confederation.
Recognizes the Belgian and Dutch territories of the Anj Reich.
Guaranteeing the Indepedence of the Kingdom of Greco-Serbia.
Guaranteeing the Indepdence of Osteia.

Commonwealth of Eastheim:
Allied with the Great Republic of Celtia.

Dictatorial State of Red Tide:

The New Roman Empire:
Signatory of the Treaty of Rome. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12454880&postcount=23)

Kingdom of Norhlandia:

Kingdom of Greco-Serbia:
Defensive Alliance with Illar Empire.
Guaranteeing the Independence of the Swiss Confederation.
Signatory of the Treaty of Rome. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12454880&postcount=23)

The Salo Republic:

Wolfestein:

Celtia:
Allied with the Commonwealth of Eastheim.

The Swiss Confederation:

Ostia:
Allied with Anj Reich.
Guaranteeing the Independence of the Swiss Confederation.

Incognitia:
Defensive Alliance with Anj Reich against the German Empire
Guaranteeing the Independence of the Swiss Confederation.
Defensive Alliance with Bautzen against the Treaty of Rome

The Byzantium League:
Signatory of the Treaty of Rome. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12454880&postcount=23)

Lycurgan Empire:
Guaranteeing the Independence of the Republic of Cyprus.

Anatolia and Crete:
Signatory of the Treaty of Rome. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12454880&postcount=23)

Bautzen:
Defensive Alliance with Incognitia against the Treaty of Rome

- - - - - - - - - -
Signup Thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=521118)
- - - - - - - - - -

Incognitia and the Anj Reich have a Defensive Alliance against the German Empire, and an agreement regarding the defense of mutual interests

the Anj Reich guarantees the independence of Ostia and the Swiss Confederation

A mutual defence pact between Anj Reich and Incognitia, along with an agreement to co-operate "in those two states mutual interest".

A guarantee of independence (assuming such things are recognised) of the Swiss Confederation.

Basically I have a wary eye on Germany, and a couple of things aimed at preventing their expansion at my or the Swiss' expense.

Assuming these are recognized:

I would like to initiate an Alliance between my nation and the nation of Incognitia with the hopes of aiding in a prevention of German dominance in Europe.

I would like to also like to initiate a defensive pact with the Illar Empire if they would accept.

Thirdly, the Kingdom of Greco-Serbia will guarantee the independence of the Swiss Confederation.

No to the Greco-Incognitian alliance, not least because we are casting our eyes on greater influence in the Adriatic, probably at your expense.
Also the General Staff are (possibly mistakenly, we shall see :D) confident in the ability of Incognitia and the Anj Reich to defeat Germany if necessary; especially if the Illar Empire honours their pact with the Anj.

Wolfestein recongizes Swiss independence. Also wishs for a alliance with any other nation. Also wishs to discuss with Red Tide for use of Our Baltic ports for trade, and non-military shipping.

OOC: The Kingdom of Osteia would like to be recognized properly now, due to the fact the nation has been "restored" by the moderators...(Thank god)...

Osteia recognizes it's allys, (In good standing), treaties, and all agreements remain firmly in place. His Majesty Antonio Vespillio would also like to extend his hand in friendship to any other nations, with the exception of Osteia's enemys, or her allys enemys, who to open up trade between our peoples.

Does the other Italian player (I think the Salo Republic) want to have a mutual defense pact and FTA?

I would like to initate a non-agression pact with the German Empire.

His Majesty Kaiser Frederick IV Franz Albert Hohenzollern of Germany and Reichkanzler Erzherzog Wilhelm Otto Hohenzollern zu Schwaben of the Kaiserlich Regierung wishes to make it known to all the nations of the world that Das Deutsches Kaiserreich

recognizes and pledges to uphold Swiss independence
recognizes and approves of the Anj Reich's claims to the provinces of the Netherlands and Belgium
pledges to support the German population in any and all countries that have a German minority
recognizes and pledges to uphold the independence of The Balkan Empire
whishes to extend a hand of friendship to the people of Norhlandia (see PM for further details)
wishes to extend a hand of friendship to the people of Landford
whishes to make clear it's intent to intervene if German people living in another land are treated unjustly
recongizes and pledges to uphold Osteian independence


OOC: And Dukarbana would be what country?

OOC: It's Wolfestein, not Langford anymore.

We accept the gesture of friendship from the German Reich.

The people of the Swiss Confederation would like to thank the Anj Reich, Incognita, the Kingdom of Greco-Serbia, Wolfestein, and Germany for their recognization and pledge to uphold Helvetic Independence. We would also like to extend an additional thanks to the German Empire for their pledge to support the largest minority in Switzerland, the Germans.

Also, the Swiss are interested in free trade with the above nations.

(And we'll build a nice big bank for all your money, if you wish. :D )

We will accept free trade with the Swiss and allow a bank branch in our captial, Remington.

His Majesty Kaiser Frederick IV Franz Albert Hohenzollern of Germany and Reichkanzler Erzherzog Wilhelm Otto Hohenzollern zu Schwaben of the Kaiserlich Regierung wishes to make it known to all the nations of the world that Das Deutsches Kaiserreich

recognizes and pledges to uphold Swiss independence
recognizes and approves of the Anj Reich's claims to the provinces of the Netherlands and Belgium
pledges to support the German population in any and all countries that have a German minority
recognizes and pledges to uphold the independence of The Balkan Empire
whishes to extend a hand of friendship to the people of Norhlandia (see PM for further details)
wishes to extend a hand of friendship to the people of Landford
whishes to make clear it's intent to intervene if German people living in another land are treated unjustly
recongizes and pledges to uphold Osteian independence


OOC: And Dukarbana would be what country?

OOC: Celtia

The Kingdom of Osteia....

*Recognizes and pledges to uphold Swiss independence, it being an honorable request.
*Recognizes the Anj Reich as a friend and ally in good standing.
*Opens trade to nations who come fourth (Friendly/Nuetral).
*Wishes to enter into diplomatic relations with Terror Incognita ASAP.
*Recognizes The German Empires pledge to support all nations with a Germanic population/minority present.
*Would like to thank all nations for recognizing our independance

oocly [not that most of this thread is particularly IC as such as yet]:

given HT's set up for this, it's debatable weather i have any 'Germans' in my nation at all, or anyone does other than the German empire.

the only thing RL Europe is counting for is physical, natural geography, remember? [that is, raw materials, mountains, rivers, etc.]

of course, i don't plan on mistreating any of my population Anyway.

Incognitia is very happy to engage in friendly relations with the Kingdom of Osteia, remembering that they have been honourable allies in the past. While we would perhaps stop short of a full military alliance given our limited ability to intervene in each other's territories, each including the other in any mutual defence pacts in which they are engaged would seem to us a good compromise.

Meanwhile Incognitia wishes it to be remembered that the only neighbour of Das Deutsches Kaiserreich not officially recognised, offered friendship, or any other olive branch, by that nation, is Incognitia.
This is considered by analysts of Incognitian relations to bode ill for future relations.

Just a shout-out to all of you guys, the New Roman Empire is always happy to work alliances, guaranteed Independence, ect. with other nations.

The Byzantium League approaches the Kingdom of Greco-Serbia and The New Roman Empire with the possibility of a trade and naval pact to protect the Mediterranean sea, and possibly expand the alliance later on.

The New Roman Empire agrees to a Mediterranean Defense Pact. We are happy to ally with you.

The Kingdom of Greco-Serbia recognizes the Byzantium League and agrees to mutual defense of the Aegean. We would also like to discuss a military pact and free trade relations with the Byzantium League.

We also wish to initiate a possible triple-alliance with the Byzantium League and the New Roman Empire seeing how we're all close in geography.

The New Roman Empire recognises the Greco-Serbian Kingdom and is happy to serve in the Mediterranean Pact with them and the Byzantium League.

Treaty of Rome:

1. The undersigned agree to a mutual defense clause and protect each other whenever one nation is in danger

2. All signed nations agree to allow each other to use their ports for refueling, repairing and rearming

3. All signed nations agree to gradually reduce tariffs to allow more trade

OOC: this look good?

Treaty of Rome:

1. The undersigned agree to a mutual defense clause and protect each other whenever one nation is in danger

2. All signed nations agree to allow each other to use their ports for refueling, repairing and rearming

3. All signed nations agree to gradually reduce tariffs to allow more trade

OOC: this look good?

OOC: I like it! I think it is a good basis for an alliance of sorts. Maybe later on we could make a sort of member thread for discussions on international issues and such.

OOC: Very good, it's settled. I also agree to the treaty. Excellent work gentlemen.

I'd like to propose an alliance and MDP with The Great Republic of Celtia (Dukarbana).

I'd also like to propose an alliance with The Duchy of Ostia.

The Great Republic of Celtia will agree to both pacts with The Commonwealth of Eastheim.

I'd like to propose an alliance and MDP with The Great Republic of Celtia (Dukarbana).

I'd also like to propose an alliance with The Duchy of Ostia.

OOC: It is Kingdom now, my old nation was restored.... :) i think the details are on PG. 4 or 5....

The Kingdom of Osteia does not require a military alliance to be formed at this point in time, however....



We do offer you trade rights and our friendship, now is not the time to create the alliance you seek for his majesty wishes to learn more about those who offer their friendship so generously...perhalps in time his royal highness will take a full alliance into consideration, but in the meantime accept our friendship it will benifit us both in the future.

The Salo Republic wishes to enter into a mutual defense pact with the German Empire against Incognitia

The Salo Republic also accepts the New Roman Empire's Mutual Defense and FTA in the interest of preserving the Italian peninsula's independence from foreign nations.

As minister of the Kingdom of Denmark, I would like to propose a Mutual protection pack to the German Empire.

ooc:... i so very much hope this doesn't end up with everything locked into a stalemate... i've had it happen in RPs before, and it's very boring. *laughs*

'my' part of the world looks to be going that way though :S

OOC: Hehehehe, ltos of alliances, defence pacts...i can see all hell breaking loose...if anyone makes a move..

You mean if Switzerland sets in motion its plan for world conquest?

You mean if Switzerland sets in motion its plan for world conquest?

OOC: You got to be kidding....im going to assume you are and laugh with you :) as so.. Ahahahahaha....

You laugh now. You'll see. You'll all see! *eye twitches maniacally*

You laugh now. You'll see. You'll all see! *eye twitches maniacally*

I laughed then and i'll laugh again...ehehehehehe ** LOl, Im just buggin.... :P

OOC:
I can assure you that no quadlingual country's goin' to conquer any worlds on my watch!

OOC:
I can assure you that no quadlingual country's goin' to conquer any worlds on my watch!

AHahaha ^^^^ Eh!

HT, i believe you missed a couple of things:

1: i THINK it was Incognitia who started the whole "guarantee Swiss independence" thing. he's not listed as having done so.

2: the German Empire specified their recognition of me because they only recognize the legitimacy of my rule in TWO of my five territories... presumably they have designs on the other three. it might be relevant to add that, as it's presumed that everyone recognizes the others by default, as no one is playing rebels or the like.

Fixorated. Also, the Defensive Pact with the Kingdom of Greco-Serbia is signed.

OOC: I believe for the sake of regional peace, we should invite the Republic of Anatolia and Crete to become a signatory of the Treaty of Rome. If my allies would agree of course.

OOC:
Did Nohrlandia get my TG?

OOC: I believe for the sake of regional peace, we should invite the Republic of Anatolia and Crete to become a signatory of the Treaty of Rome. If my allies would agree of course.

The Byzantium League approves of this, and suggests that an amendment be made to the treaty allowing for unmolested travel through the allied nations countries.

I call for a Mediterranean Alliance for those in who are Signatories of the Treaty of Rome. This would be a formal council, not just a piece of paper. Do the signatories agree?

The Byzantium League approves of this, and suggests that an amendment be made to the treaty allowing for unmolested travel through the allied nations countries.

As delivered by the Emissary of the Congress of Anatolia and Crete Princess Zeherra Kayle in Rome.

"We would be willing to be party to this treaty, however, we do have some concerns." She pauses breifly and unrolls a rough fabric scroll, embroydered in colour threads, an old art that is continued in the government for important documents. "We would like insurances that port fees must be paid, and the ports are under no obligation to provide supplies free of charge. Furthermore, " She takes a quick breath and licks her lips, "we suggest that we set up bank accounts with one another, in one anothers' territories so that we will have usable currencies for those times that ships do put into a port at a moments notice, so they are not stranded or burdens on local populations. We also ask that warships need permission to travel through the Bosphors Straight, and must pay the toll like all other ships, based on their class." She looks down one more time, " we also would like insurance that we can turn away ships that carry disease, or are in a shape that may damage the ports. Merchant ships of course shall be allowed movement bearing to any toll fees for the Bosphors. There is the special consideration that members must remain nuetral, except where a joint declaration by all members of the Treaty of Rome can mutually agree, that the war is applicable. In the instance where unfavorable war against an ally of member occurs, we should temporarily be able to refuse portage, until the war ceases with our allies. We should maintain the right to close port to a member in an offensive war where the other party requests our nuetrility. Defensive war acts shall not require mediation." She stops and rolls the scroll back up. " All said and done we would very much be interested in strengthening cooperation amongst our neighbors." She then starts drinking from a thin flask. " Does anyone have questions about the Stance of the Conference's stance on the Treaty of Rome?"

ICCD-Intracircumcordei;12461929']As delivered by the Emissary of the Congress of Anatolia and Crete Princess Zeherra Kayle in Rome.

"We would be willing to be party to this treaty, however, we do have some concerns." She pauses breifly and unrolls a rough fabric scroll, embroydered in colour threads, an old art that is continued in the government for important documents. "We would like insurances that port fees must be paid, and the ports are under no obligation to provide supplies free of charge. Furthermore, " She takes a quick breath and licks her lips, "we suggest that we set up bank accounts with one another, in one anothers' territories so that we will have usable currencies for those times that ships do put into a port at a moments notice, so they are not stranded or burdens on local populations. We also ask that warships need permission to travel through the Bosphors Straight, and must pay the toll like all other ships, based on their class." She looks down one more time, " we also would like insurance that we can turn away ships that carry disease, or are in a shape that may damage the ports. Merchant ships of course shall be allowed movement bearing to any toll fees for the Bosphors. There is the special consideration that members must remain nuetral, except where a joint declaration by all members of the Treaty of Rome can mutually agree, that the war is applicable. In the instance where unfavorable war against an ally of member occurs, we should temporarily be able to refuse portage, until the war ceases with our allies. We should maintain the right to close port to a member in an offensive war where the other party requests our nuetrility. Defensive war acts shall not require mediation." She stops and rolls the scroll back up. " All said and done we would very much be interested in strengthening cooperation amongst our neighbors." She then starts drinking from a thin flask. " Does anyone have questions about the Stance of the Conference's stance on the Treaty of Rome?"

OOC: This is the reason I wanted to make the Mediterranean Alliance Thread, lol.

IC: The New Roman Empire finds these requests legitimate and just. Welcome aboard.

OOC: This is the reason I wanted to make the Mediterranean Alliance Thread, lol.

IC: The New Roman Empire finds these requests legitimate and just. Welcome aboard.

OOC: tnx start er up, if it isn't already

Note that from now on, all retroactive alliances may not be concluded. Any alliances made must be RPed out, and the link to the RP in question posted in order to have your alliance, treaty, or other diplomatic status edited into this thread.

The Byzantium League inquires as to the possibility of the Salo Republic and Incognita joining the Treaty of Rome as signatory members.

The New Roman Empire also encourages The Salo Republic and Incognita to reap the benefits of joining the Treaty of Rome and the Pan-Mediterranean Alliance.

By the orders of His Majesty King Kallias Andreas Nikomachos of House Agiad and His Majesty King Straton Archelaus of House Eurypontid of Sparta, these things are to be known true.

The Lycurgan Empire;


Refuses to recognise the territorial claims of the Balkan Empire over the lands and peoples of northern Greece.
Wishes to extend the hand of peace to the Illar Empire.
Guarantees the independence of the Republic of Cyprus.

By the orders of His Majesty King Kallias Andreas Nikomachos of House Agiad and His Majesty King Straton Archelaus of House Eurypontid of Sparta, these things are to be known true.

The Lycurgan Empire;


Refuses to recognise the territorial claims of the Balkan Empire over the lands and peoples of northern Greece.
Wishes to extend the hand of peace to the Illar Empire.
Guarantees the independence of the Republic of Cyprus.


The Byzantium League warns the Lycurgan Empire not to trouble the Greco-Serbian Empire, and responds to the Lycurgan's outrageous claims by asserting that they had no people in the Kingdom of Greco-Serbia's land, and the Kingdom of Freco-Serbia is the true and sovereign leader of those lands.

The opinion of the Byzantium League has been noted.

The Republic of Tunisia wishes to extend a free trade agreement to the following nations:

Byzantium League
Lycurgan Empire
New Roman Empire
Anatolia and Crete

Incognitia would accept membership of the Treaty of Rome under one condition; that the mutual defence clause were removed.
Free trade and free movement is entirely acceptable, however we are not willing to be committed to defending all the other member states, and are frankly somewhat threatened by the Treaty-states as things stand.
(see the thread linked on the hub for more on this).

Tunisia wishes to extend a free trade agreement between her and Terror Incognitia.

Incognitia would accept membership of the Treaty of Rome under one condition; that the mutual defence clause were removed.
Free trade and free movement is entirely acceptable, however we are not willing to be committed to defending all the other member states, and are frankly somewhat threatened by the Treaty-states as things stand.
(see the thread linked on the hub for more on this).

You could be allowed to join without agreeing to the defense clause if you wish.

[ooc: note, some of this stuff is subject to HT's decisions and things... AND... does the conversation on this thread really count as RP, as such? if not, i foresee a lot of boring "catch up" diplomacy threads :D

IC:

To: the relevant official in Red Tide
From: Pemji, minister of foreign affairs, on behalf of Reichgone Albert Lux, Ruler of the Anj Reich.

due to the nature of events unfolding at this time, the Anj Reich sees the need for a ... powerful... ally, who has no natural interest in our downfall. as such, we would like to propose a defensive alliance, specifically against Wolfenstien. the current nature of the world looks set to put us in a position where this would be highly significant.


To: [whatever the nation in norway/sweden etc ends up being called]
From: Pemji, Minister of Foreign Affairs, on behalf of the REichgone Albert Lux, Ruler of the Anj Reich.

due to our close borders, the alliance between wolfenstein and the German empire, and your natural control of the balitc, we would like to formally request a full alliance with your nation. [i should have more details here, but, they've escaped my head and/or involve secret projects :D]

You could be allowed to join without agreeing to the defense clause if you wish.

Perhaps it has been unsatisfactorily explained: our government is opposed to the entire concept of a military pact spanning the Mediterranean, and will only join a purely trade agreement. Thus signing a revised Treaty of Rome is unacceptable, unless the current treaty is torn up and a new, commerce based agreement, signed.
It may have come to your attention that the Illar Empire agrees with our government on this point.

The New Prussian Confederacy agrues against such an action.

{OOC: Check TGs}

The New Prussian Confederacy agrues against such an action.

{OOC: Check TGs}

ooc: depending on which thing you're referring to... do we have another case of "how did you get that information?" here?

and, on a different note... if it's talking about my proposals there...umm... why the heck would they listen to you, shrimp boy? (i kid, i kid.. but your nation is pretty small)

OOC: I believe Candistan would have told me about such an act, seeing as i'm his allie. And size only matters in sex... lol.

OOC: I believe Candistan would have told me about such an act, seeing as i'm his allie. And size only matters in sex... lol.

What is this argument about?

{OOC: How I got the information that Incognito was telling you to make the Treaty of Rome a pure trade endeavor. Which I emphasized, not doing.}

What is this argument about?

ooc: not an argument, just making sure responses to communications were valid.... someone sends a message to someone else, and a third person all together responds? at the very least they're done for violation of diplomatic privilege. at most, bad RP and god moding.

{OOC: How I got the information that Incognito was telling you to make the Treaty of Rome a pure trade endeavor. Which I emphasized, not doing.}

OOC: Oh, I just have a question though. Why is Prussia worrying about things in the Med when it is in North Europe? This is just wasting space on the Alliance thread and making it harder to navigate. Someone make an OOC thread so things like this can be resolved.

{OOC: And seeing you as a judge, do you believe they were valid?

And I thought I told you why I was focusing on the Mediterrainian.}

I don't think that the Roman Empire would share this with those outside of the Pan-Mediterranean Alliance. Sorry.

Incognita is invited to join the Treaty of Rome without signing the defense clause.

The Nation of The Czechalprussian Empire wishes to establish a defensive alliance with The Nation of Dictatorial State of Red Tide. We hope you agree that our alliance will benefit both of our nations in many ways, such as one my nation would act as a buffer if you where to be invaded my nation would be attack first alerting you and allowing you to ready you military forces.

Incognita is invited to join the Treaty of Rome without signing the defense clause.

OOC: Covered on the "Illarian Empire speaks out..." thread.

Incognitia has an offer for Anatolia and Crete.
In return for a guarantee by Anatolia and Crete to remain neutral in any conflict, and to close the Bosphorus to ANY nation engaged in war (including ourselves), we will offer you most favourable trading conditions, and militarily guarantee your independence and neutrality.

(essentially a one-way mutual defence pact, in your favour, that you get paid for....with the one condition of closing the Bosphorus to naval vessels and war materiel of nations engaged in war.)

Waldenburg and the Anj Reich have an... agreement of sorts, [see my factbook for exactly what it entails] unfortunately, it's sufficiently odd as to make it hard to describe as "a defensive alliance" or anything else... i'll let HT be the judge.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=521466 [factbook with relevant exchange in it]

To: Salo Republic
Incognitia would like to open negotiations towards relations with the Salo Republic, primarily because we are wary of the Treaty of Rome states. We have reason to believe they have designs on both our territories, and wish to protect ourselves.
Failing that a mutual guarantee of neutrality and independence will be satisfactory for us.

OOC: A lie, but a plausible one.

To: Salo Republic
Incognitia would like to open negotiations towards relations with the Salo Republic, primarily because we are wary of the Treaty of Rome states. We have reason to believe they have designs on both our territories, and wish to protect ourselves.
Failing that a mutual guarantee of neutrality and independence will be satisfactory for us.

OOC: A lie, but a plausible one.

The Byzantium League reiterates the point that both Incgogniat and the Salo Republic have been invited to join the Treaty of Rome.

OOC: and this was brought up 2 days ago as well, page 4

The Byzantium League reiterates the point that both Incgogniat and the Salo Republic have been invited to join the Treaty of Rome.

OOC: and this was brought up 2 days ago as well, page 4

ooc: the me would like to know how you're aware of his communications with another nation that is not you? :P

After due deliberation the King of Bautzen, James III, and the Prime Minister (OOC: as of now un-named, but head of the Bautzen Liberal Party) regrets to inform The Byzantium League that we are not willing to sign the treaty of Rome at this time. We do, however, wish to remain friends for the time being. Perhaps at a later date the political climate in Bautzen will be more favorable to such an agreement.

OOC: He sent me a PM inviting me to join, I was looking at this thread and was to lazy to PM him a response.

ooc: the me would like to know how you're aware of his communications with another nation that is not you? :P

Such warnings and invitees would create movement of top officials and probably be in the news a little. i don't think it would be unrealistic for me to know of such a meeting.

Incognitia invites the King of Bautzen to consider a Mutual Defence Pact against any aggression from the signatories of the Treaty of Rome.

Incognitia invites the King of Bautzen to consider a Mutual Defence Pact against any aggression from the signatories of the Treaty of Rome.

The Byzantum League replies this is an example of believing a certain nation or nations is a threat, not like the specifically vague Treaty of Rome, pledging to defend you rother nations against agression from other nations.

The New Roman Empire would like to ask those against us signing it why they believe that we have nothing to defend ourselves against. We do. There are many defense-pacts and alliances all over Europe such as the Triple Entente in the North and the English Channel COnference in the West. Are you against this because you would lose your grip on the Middle Sea?

The New Roman Empire would like to ask those against us signing it why they believe that we have nothing to defend ourselves against. We do. There are many defense-pacts and alliances all over Europe such as the Triple Entente in the North and the English Channel COnference in the West. Are you against this because you would lose your grip on the Middle Sea?

OOC: Honestly this part here is laughable in reference to me I don't touch the Mediterranean anywhere.

IC: King James III informs Incognitia that it is willing to consider a mutual defense pact, as a sort of counterweight to the growing power of the Rome Treaty Alliance (OOC: I shall bring balance damnit:D). Though obviously this will require much thought and due deliberation in Parliament.

OOC: Honestly this part here is laughable in reference to me I don't touch the Mediterranean anywhere.

IC: King James III informs Incognitia that it is willing to consider a mutual defense pact, as a sort of counterweight to the growing power of the Rome Treaty Alliance (OOC: I shall bring balance damnit:D). Though obviously this will require much thought and due deliberation in Parliament.

OOC: it was originally seen as a threat to the Illar Empire in the Mediteranean.
IC:

The Byzantium league asks how Incognita or Bautzen see themselves threatened by the treaty of Rome if both were invited to join?

OOC: it was originally seen as a threat to the Illar Empire in the Mediteranean.
IC:

The Byzantium league asks how Incognita or Bautzen see themselves threatened by the treaty of Rome if both were invited to join?

OOC: Balance young tadpole, balance...

IC: It is the belief of the King and his duly elected Ministers that while our nations may remain friends it would be advantageous to form an alliance to watch for abuses on the part of the Rome Treaty Alliance, and to protect those from extortionary techniques that monopolies never fail to bring forth to remain one. Competition, my friend, is not inherintly bad; and it is through competition that advances are made.

OOC: Balance young tadpole, balance...

IC: It is the belief of the King and his duly elected Ministers that while our nations may remain friends it would be advantageous to form an alliance to watch for abuses on the part of the Rome Treaty Alliance, and to protect those from extortionary techniques that monopolies never fail to bring forth to remain one. Competition, my friend, is not inherintly bad; and it is through competition that advances are made.

The Byzantium Lague asks if competition must mean the needless slaughter of thousands of young men, for "advancing"?

The Byzantium Lague asks if competition must mean the needless slaughter of thousands of young men, for "advancing"?

Who has mentioned slaughter, surely not I. I meant in the form of competition between the alliances.

Who has mentioned slaughter, surely not I. I meant in the form of competition between the alliances.

Which can easily lead to war

Which can easily lead to war

Economic competition may lead to war, yes. But usually only if one side actively pursues war. Suffice it to say that Bautzen is not actively seeking war at the current time, but is prepared should war come upon it.

Economic competition may lead to war, yes. But usually only if one side actively pursues war. Suffice it to say that Bautzen is not actively seeking war at the current time, but is prepared should war come upon it.

Then why do you percieve us as a threat and enter into an alliance against us with Incognita? You seem to antagonize the situation by making us out to be the enemy, despite the fact we have made no indication to that effect.

Then why do you percieve us as a threat and enter into an alliance against us with Incognita? You seem to antagonize the situation by making us out to be the enemy, despite the fact we have made no indication to that effect.

OOC: Grrr, I answered this question in the Illar condemnation thread but...

IC: We favor the defensive pact with Incognita because it restricts the amount of cases in which we will have to take part in the terms of the treaty. If you notice Incogita only made it conditional on a war between him and you, whereas if I signed the Treaty of Rome I would have to honor the agreement to numerous nations with several different agendas.

Alright, after due consideration I have decided to accept Incognitia's offer of a defensive alliance to be activated upon war with any signatory member of the Rome Treaty Alliance.

Incognitia would like to offer three linked treaties to Caxistan.
First a non-aggression pact, confirming what both nations already know, that we will not be invading one another.
Secondly a Mutual Defence Pact that we will aid one another if attacked by either Wolfestein or the Duchy of Warsaw.
Thirdly that there shall be free trade between our nations, without tax or tariff beyond that levied on domestic traders.

Incognitia would like to offer three linked treaties to Caxistan.
First a non-aggression pact, confirming what both nations already know, that we will not be invading one another.
Secondly a Mutual Defence Pact that we will aid one another if attacked by either Wolfestein or the Duchy of Warsaw.
Thirdly that there shall be free trade between our nations, without tax or tariff beyond that levied on domestic traders.

OOC: I'm curious soes that include me as well? If not then I would ask to be made a party to it.

Incognitia would like to offer three linked treaties to Caxistan.
First a non-aggression pact, confirming what both nations already know, that we will not be invading one another.
Secondly a Mutual Defence Pact that we will aid one another if attacked by either Wolfestein or the Duchy of Warsaw.
Thirdly that there shall be free trade between our nations, without tax or tariff beyond that levied on domestic traders.

Caxistan accepts this treaty with Incognitia,but requests one more stipulation:
a small port along the coast of Incognitia to build small merchant ships to increase trade in Caxistan.

Imperial Message From: Lord Tarrow of the Waldenburg Admiralty
To: Igonita and It's Naval Allies

As you may be aware Waldenburg, maintains the largest fleet in exsistance on the globe, however without allies no one can stand alone. We wish to join this alliance and pledge to our fleet in protection of all our national waters and intereasts all over the world. Waldenburg wishes to expand it by increasing the limitations to a full naval alliance, not neccesarily, full military but our navies should act as one large detterant. If your gracious nations should accept this offer, Waldenburg suggest we set up a High Admiralty, who can judge the neccesity of our fleets positionings and actions. Togeather, as one, we shall be a force that must be dealt with, a force protecting one another's colonies from aggresors. The Waldenburg Admiralty prays you will accept this deal, and we may go forth in the future togeather.

The Warsaw Confederacy wishes to further its trading relations with Wolfstein, Incognitia and Caxistan. The Duke therefore invites these three nations to sign a treaty to allow free trade across the borders. This should greatly strengthen us economically.

#Bautzen
The mutual defence pact with our friends in Bautzen, we suggest stands as it is; a series of separate pacts aimed in different directions we see as more beneficial than full military alliance or more general pacts.

As to the free trade agreement, we would welcome your inclusion, and since our new friends in Caxistan are interested in trade, would expect no problems from their end either.

OOC: Yay! I get to buy any war materials I need through one of you two (as long as the Treaty of Rome doesn't invade Bautzen and he's thus neutral, anyway.)

#Caxistan
Our shipyards will very happily take orders for merchant vessels, and you may be assured that for as long as your nation is neutral in any conflict our navy will do all it can to enforce respect of their neutrality; and when you are at war your ships will be welcome to convoy and be protected with ours.

#Waldenburg
We appreciate greatly the spirit of your offer, but are concerned at the practical effect we could have, given that while myself and Bautzen do have coasts, they are in the Mediterranean and the Black Seas respectively, both of which are easily shut off in time of war.
If you are happy to ally with us, and wish a naval ally who could actually assist you, we would look most favourably on your agreeing to work with our friends in the Anj Reich. Not least access to the Panama Canal might be of some interest to your Admiralty...
Of course, given that we have long espoused free trade, we are happy to sign you up to the newly named European Free Trade Area; there is only one clause allowing restriction of trade, and that is war between two countries both members of the agreement, in which case both will be suspended for the duration, and prior tariffs return to effect.

#Warsaw Confederacy
You are most welcome to join the European Free Trade Area, now encompassing Incognitia, Caxistan and Bautzen, and hoping to expand further.

OOC: Quick question to Waldenburg, do you *really* have the biggest fleet? Cos I'd have expected that to be Illar.

OOC Yes I really do have the largest fleet though HT's has been slowly growing in size. Although it's a rather outdated, it probably is an equal to the Illarian. Quality Vs. Quantity sort of thing.


Imperial Reply From: Lord Tarrow Waldenburg Admiralty
To: Igonita and her Naval Allies

We are not in fact looking at this as a full military alliance but as a detterant to nations who seek to make war. If either of those seas are closed shut against your will Waldenburg will be their to assist you, hopefully peacfully. It is hardly a situation in which you shall be troubled, who would fight such a navy, one intended to keep the peace and one of innumerable size. We understand your decision, and Indeed we to have a naval force operating in the Black sea operating inside the nation of Kasinov and could see your hesitation... Also thank you for your suggestions but we already have a pact with the Anj, related to trade and naval affairs. Waldenburg would e happy to sign the European Free Trade Area and join you in at least that.

Signed:
Lord Tarrow (INS) Waldenburg Admiralty

OOC: Quantity over quality does not apply in 1914 naval terms. Dreadnoughts pwn pre-dreadnoughts so hard it isn't even funny, never mind the super-dreadnoughts that started to appear around 1910 to 1914 and made even the old dreadnought designs obsolete (the HMS Dreadnought for example, had been made out of date in just eight years because of technical innovations made after 1906).

Oh, and you'll have a TG in about 10 minutes.

OOC Very good point, but on the Dreadnaught score and battlescruiser score I'm up to date, it's the smaller ships the ones that would probably cost less just to scrap then upgrade that are really behind. I still have steam frigates which have only been crudely armored over, that's the quality bit.

OOC: Relative Liberty is quite right I'm afraid. Quality is crucial at this time, when having half a dozen fully up to date dreadnoughts can make you a Naval Power. The appearance of battlecruisers is a sign there - it's considered better to have a few battlecruisers than a heap of cruisers.
And, given the population disparity between you and Illar, there's no way you can match his quality AND quantity without bankrupting yourself, and incidentally stripping your army to the bone.
EDIT: just saw your response. I'm glad you recognise the need for quality over quantity in capital ships.

IC: Welcome to the EFTA. We will begin removing tariffs on your goods and sending random inspections to your country (as well as other member nations) to ensure tariffs are being steadily removed.

OOC Very good point, but on the Dreadnaught score and battlescruiser score I'm up to date, it's the smaller ships the ones that would probably cost less just to scrap then upgrade that are really behind. I still have steam frigates which have only been crudely armored over, that's the quality bit.

As the unkown horror said, given the huge difference in population, not to mention resources (Illar does control half of the world), there is no way that you could field as many dreadnoughts as he can. Any attempt to do so would most likely, if Illar responds in the same way as Britian did in hte early 20th century, result in an arms race which you have no hope of winning, and which would only further strengthen Illar.

Rather the contrary to what you said, I would expect your nation to field coastal defence ships (see swedish pansarskepp for furhter detail), a few pre-dreadnoughts that your Admiralty begs you to replace and a couple of up to date cruisers or frigates.

IC:
Seeing as how the strait of Öresund represents the only passage from the Baltic Sea into the North Sea bar the Kiel Canal, and the only passage wide enough to accommodate ships of war, the Strait represents strategic point in northern Europe not only to the Empire of Waldenburg, but to all states with an interest in the Baltic.

Seeing also that the Kiel Canal is the only other route from the Baltic to the North Sea, the Anj Reich has a firm interest in seeing the Strait of Öresund closed in favour of the Canal. Likewise, the Empire of Waldenburg has an interest in seeing that the Strait remains open, so that merchants may more easily travel the seas.

We therefore propose a Baltic co-operation between our two nations. This co-operation’s aim is to guarantee that the Strait of Öresund remains open. To this purpose the Empire of Germany pledges to defend the sovereignty of the Waldenburg Empire, the Empire’s control over the Strait and to avert any and all attempts to close the Strait. In return we ask that our ships may be exempt from charge when passing, that our merchants may be exempt from toll of their wares and that all ships that fly the flag of Germany may pass freely.

OOC2: Basically, I decided to post it here rather than TG you, as I seem to be unable to acces my NS page at the moment.

OOC You would think so, in the Baltic where a Dreadnaught can be taken out so easily by submarines and smaller craft, but Wadlenburg is also a colonai Empire, and sense it cannot compete Industrial or by manpower with the Larger nations it must rely on it's navy. And as reference in 1857 1\8 of the Danish state revenue came through taxing the Oresund, And I'm charging about twice as much as they did. I went over all of this in my factbook as well, if you'd like to look there I provided relative links and sources. Although yes in an arms race which I have a sinking feeling is already happening, I'm going to lose, if I haven't lost already.

And I may have been mislead on this but I thought the Anj had to declare the Kiel canal open as it is a man made waterway, or is it like the Suez where it just happens?

IC

Waldenburg is very greatful for the offer, but the German shipping provides a vital source of income to the Waldenburger economy. We cannot open the Strait completely. We would accept your offer as it is quite the gracious one, but we would need to haggle a bit on the terms. Our proposal is that all German warships or ships on direct government business may pass through without charge. Merchant ships though must still pay 1\2 the original tax (About 8 £) to pass through. That unfortunately is the best we can offer without bankrupting our country. Tariffs inside Waldenburg will also be reduced by around 20%. With these finacial bonus' we shall also guarentee that the German soveriegnty be kept alive also. That really is the best we can offer at the moment.

Signed:
His Most Gracious Imperial Majesty Wyatt Von Waldenburg III

OOC
You would think so, in the Baltic where a Dreadnaught can be taken out so easily by submarines and smaller craft, but Wadlenburg is also a colonai Empire, and sense it cannot compete Industrial or by manpower with the Larger nations it must rely on it's navy.This is the very essence of the problem. As you cannot compete with the larger nations, as you put it, industrial-wise or manpower-wise, you cannot compete with them naval-wise. It takes manpower and, more importantly, industries to build a navy. And not any old factories, but a industrial complex devoted to biuld warships. That was the failure of the Germans in the the Anglo-German arms race; they did not have that complex in the way the British did.
Dreadnoughts are rather slow, and the need to protect colonies was what gave rise to the battlecruisers. Seeing though, that your colonies are much more coherent that many others, I could definately see that you have a few stationed in North America to protect the East Coast, and perhaps one or two in Indochina. Your Baltic fleet on hte other hand, would not need as many and would be better suitable for heavy cruisers and pansarskepp. By virtue of your long coast line, you already dominate the North Sea, unless Illar suddenly thinks he needs to expand there too, and I fail to see how that could warrant a so large fleet.
As I said, battlecruisers and cruisers to protect your colonies, a few dreadnoughts if you want a little extra punch, and coastal defence ships for the Baltic.And as reference in 1857 1\8 of the Danish state revenue came through taxing the Oresund, And I'm charging about twice as much as they did. I went over all of this in my factbook as well, if you'd like to look there I provided relative links and sources.Money alone does not make a dreadnought. It takes steel, which you have, and the industry to support them, which I doubt that you have on the scale necessary.

Now, do take in mind that I do not say that you cannot have dreadnoughts, rather you should if you want to be a naval power, but that you should not have as many as Illar, unless Illar has a very good explanation for how he managed to acquire and maintain that empire of his witohut pouring a very larg eportion of his resources into the navy.

And I may have been mislead on this but I thought the Anj had to declare the Kiel canal open as it is a man made waterway, or is it like the Suez where it just happens?To tell the truth, I do not know. I assumed that it was opened simply because he could make a fortune of it if it was. Looking back at the Canal in RL though, it seems as if it wasn't, as the Allies felt the need to internationalize it in the Treaty of Versailles.

IC

Waldenburg is very greatful for the offer, but the German shipping provides a vital source of income to the Waldenburger economy. We cannot open the Strait completely. We would accept your offer as it is quite the gracious one, but we would need to haggle a bit on the terms. Our proposal is that all German warships or ships on direct government business may pass through without charge. Merchant ships though must still pay 1\2 the original tax (About 8 £) to pass through. That unfortunately is the best we can offer without bankrupting our country. Tariffs inside Waldenburg will also be reduced by around 20%. With these finacial bonus' we shall also guarentee that the German soveriegnty be kept alive also. That really is the best we can offer at the moment.

Signed:
His Most Gracious Imperial Majesty Wyatt Von Waldenburg III
While we understand that the Strait is of highest importance to you, and that the tolls taken make up a substantial portion of your empire's economy, we must insist that the taxes be lowered for merchant ships.
We propose that our merchants will not be asked to pay more than 6£*, and in exchange, all tax on Waldeburg ships passing through the Red Sea or Mozambique Channel shall be lowered by the same percentage.

OOC2:
* assuming I read you right, and eight pounds are ½ the original tax.

OOC: That's a damned cheek demanding money for passage of the Red Sea; after people have already paid Illar for the Suez passage...

And let's keep the plot moving, none of this alliance stuff! :cool:

EDIT: Posted one minute AFTER you did exactly as I asked. Now I feel stupid.

OOC Factories and man power can be shifted either way, Industiral expansion, consumer products, luxuries, or in my case warships. I completely agree I have nowhere near the resources neccesary to keep an upgraded fleet, and barely enough to keep the one I have. Neccisity is another matter though, it would seem that I wouldn't need Dreadnaughts, and focus more on as you say a lighter faster force, but this is not Europe of 1914, and Waldenburg, though probably not wise in the long run, chooses to maintain a large fleet.

On the part of making ships, Historically Denmark was a naval power, that's what orginally kept it out of WWI. It created ships very slowly, I believe the Peder Skram (1897 Model I think or around that year, took four years to complete, and it was outdated by the time it was finished.) Industrial wise, Waldneburg really must look to the sea, neccesity brings on innovation and really there isn't all that much to be had in Scandanavia. Historically it really is a shipbuilding society, although mainly not warships. I don't know why were arguing though, HT has approved it and I've already stated it's in poor conditon.

IC

Wadlenburg must regretfully decline this offer as we in fact have more provinces on Mozambique Channel then the German Empire does, it would be genrally uneccesary for us to pay a tax there at all. The Red sea however is very vital for our trade in, Asia and Madagascar. However we realize there is larger percent of German shipping heading through our Oresund then Waldenburger ships going through the Red Sea. So we suggest that 7 £ be paid for every ship passing through the Oresund, and seven being paid for every Waldenburger passing through the Red Sea. Considering the amount of traffic in the Red sea this should not cause any finacial problems to the German Empire, and is a reasonable reduction of the previous tax. Also as an added bonus we shall cut all export duties on Waldenburger opium, which we have a siezable monopoly on. There is nothing else we can give without seriously damaging our economy.

Signed:
His Most Gracious Imperial Majesty Wyatt Von Waldenburg III

OOC: Well, if HT has approved and you've made your mind up, then OK.

IC:
Wadlenburg must regretfully decline this offer as we in fact have more provinces on Mozambique Channel then the German Empire does, it would be genrally uneccesary for us to pay a tax there at all. The Red sea however is very vital for our trade in, Asia and Madagascar. However we realize there is larger percent of German shipping heading through our Oresund then Waldenburger ships going through the Red Sea. So we suggest that 7 £ be paid for every ship passing through the Oresund, and seven being paid for every Waldenburger passing through the Red Sea. Considering the amount of traffic in the Red sea this should not cause any finacial problems to the German Empire, and is a reasonable reduction of the previous tax. Also as an added bonus we shall cut all export duties on Waldenburger opium, which we have a siezable monopoly on. There is nothing else we can give without seriously damaging our economy.
We agree to the terms, and hope that our two nations may both grow stronger through this.

OOC2:
About that Madagscar bit, ignore that. I really must remember to save the updated map to my computer.

OOC3:
That's a damned cheek demanding money for passage of the Red Sea; after people have already paid Illar for the Suez passage...Oh, I don't force people to travel through the Red Sea, do I? 'Tis just that, well, Germany see an opportunity to make a fat load of money, and Germany takes it.
Now wonder how it comes that German possessions seemingly control two major passage ways to Asia, as well as the Persian Gulf.

ooc: errr... the what canal? did i miss something?

... oh, and Incognitia now tells me what/where it is. heh.

well, lets assume it exists. like the Panama canal, it's open, but taxed, with the amount Dependant on how much i like you, how much i can get away with without loosing the income, and any pre-existing trade agreements.

honestly, i didn't ever know that one existed *shame*

The Illar Empire finds German claims of control over the Red Sea to be utterly ridiculous, considering the size, and breadth of these waters, and, as such, refuses to recognize any German sovereignity in these waters. Furthermore, any attempt to board, sink, or stop Illar vessels travelling these waters will be regarded as an act of war, and appropriate action pertaining to such will be taken.

However, in the interest of peace, we are willing to negotiate a lowering of the fees needed to be taken in the Suez Canal for German ships in return for a waiving of fees and inspection for all Illar vessels travelling through the Gulf of Aden.

EDIT: Oh, and yeah. Waldenburg's stated that his navy is rusting and old, for the most part, and keeps him in a state of.. well, near-poverty to maintain. That's more-or-less realistic for a country of his size, I believe.

Imperial Reply From: Gerhard Hanning (MGA) Acting Foreign Minister Waldenburg
To: His Highness Prince Frederick of Germany

Again we wish to offer our condolences for your father and hope he returns to health quickly, and without hindrence. Mostly we are greatful that we were able to hash out an alliance, we are behind you all the way, and indeed the future looks bright for both our nations.

Signed:
His Most Gracious Imperial Majesty Wyatt Von Waldenburg III



OOC I think he meant the Gulf of Aden, and considering he mostly controls the Red Sea and Aden, we're probably only taxed once, but maybe not.

OOC: I know - but controlling the Red Sea is an entirely different thing than controlling the Suez Canal. I can stop ships going through at my will, because of the size of the canal. On the other hand, he can't stop ships going through the Red Sea, although he might have some luck at Aden. It's more of a pride thing, as well. The Illar, in this timeline, dug out the Canal. The Germans, on the other hand, didn't dig out Aden or the Red Sea.

The Combative Democracy of Jagaro would like to propose a defencive alliance between our nation and The German Empire under the conditions that The German Empire:

Recognises the sovernty of Jagaro
Comes to the aid of Jagaro in a time of need
Dose not attemt to influnce the interal afairs of Jagaro
Guarantee the saftey of Jagaron people with in the borders of The German Empire

In exchange The Combative Democracy of Jagaro will:

Come to the aid of The German Empire in a time of need
Guarantee the saftey of German people with in the borders of Jagaro

To His Excellency of the Illad Empire.

In order to assure its complete independence from the surrounding powers, the Confederacy of Warsaw invites the Illad Empire to assure its sovereignty in times of war and peace. In exchange, the Confederacy pledge itself to give aid to the Illad Empire whenever they may ask to do and special trading privilege.

#Bautzen
The mutual defence pact with our friends in Bautzen, we suggest stands as it is; a series of separate pacts aimed in different directions we see as more beneficial than full military alliance or more general pacts.

As to the free trade agreement, we would welcome your inclusion, and since our new friends in Caxistan are interested in trade, would expect no problems from their end either.

OOC: Yay! I get to buy any war materials I need through one of you two (as long as the Treaty of Rome doesn't invade Bautzen and he's thus neutral, anyway.)


If that is how you wish it we will respect your beliefs on this matter, however, we would propose a Triple Alliance between we three powers. However we are more than willing to simply sign a free trade pact.

Unfortunately, our ability to defend the Confederacy of Warsaw is diminished by the lack of a sea border. The Illar go wherever the waves do, however, but your country does not border the waves. We can produce a guarantee of indepedence, however it is unlikely that we will be be able to provide any major land relief in the event of a war.

- Secret Communique, Minister for Foreign Affairs

The Illar Empire finds German claims of control over the Red Sea to be utterly ridiculous, considering the size, and breadth of these waters, and, as such, refuses to recognize any German sovereignity in these waters. Furthermore, any attempt to board, sink, or stop Illar vessels travelling these waters will be regarded as an act of war, and appropriate action pertaining to such will be taken.

However, in the interest of peace, we are willing to negotiate a lowering of the fees needed to be taken in the Suez Canal for German ships in return for a waiving of fees and inspection for all Illar vessels travelling through the Gulf of Aden.The German Empire does not claim dominance over the waters of the Red Sea, and will not hinder in any way merchants or other travellers from traversing them freely.
His Imperial Majesty does however, claim sovereignty over the Gate of Tears, the strait of Bab-el-Mandeb, and will tax any and all ships that request passage.
Furthermore, the German Crown claims sovereignty and supreme lordship over the Guld of Aden, but recognizes the right of all nations' ships to pass through it freely and unhindered, provided that they do not challenge German sovereignty or in any way tro to disturb German control over the area. Failure to comply with German laws, or failure to follow orders given by German forces acting on behalf of the German Crown, will not go unpunished. Law-breakers and troublemakers will be fined and expelled under German law, and any attempt to defy the Imperial verdict will be met with fierce resistance and use of force.
We do fully recognize the Illar claims to the Canal of Suez, but the German Crown views it as an entirely separate case than the German claim of Aden and Bab-el-Mandeb, and we see no reason to refrain from taxing Illar ships wanting passage through the Gate of Tears.
His Imperial Majesty is however very positively inclined to the prospect of a mutual agreement between the two nations of Illar and the German Empire regarding the taxation of ships of either nationality when passing through the Suez Canal or the Gate. Rather than waiving all taxation of Illar vessels, in return for a mere lowering of the same taxes on German vessels in the Suez Canal, His Majesty proposes that all fees be halved by both parties.

Imperial Reply From: Gerhard Hanning (MGA) Acting Foreign Minister Waldenburg
To: His Highness Prince Frederick of Germany

Again we wish to offer our condolences for your father and hope he returns to health quickly, and without hindrence. Mostly we are greatful that we were able to hash out an alliance, we are behind you all the way, and indeed the future looks bright for both our nations.

Signed:
His Most Gracious Imperial Majesty Wyatt Von Waldenburg III
We are most delighted that our dear friends and trusted allies, the noble nation of Waldenburg, offer their support in these grave times.
It is indeed a time of troubles and hardship if such heinous crimes shall go unpunished, and we are grateful that our friends have offered to help us in our endeavour to bring the vile traitors to justice.

"What do you intend to do?"

"The trade from India is valuable, Marquis. It is my intent that we will either have the tax waived voluntarily, or we will.. waive it."

"Are you truly wishing to risk war with the Germans? If we go to war.. the German Army would smash our own, until we had the chance to draft a force of size that they could no match."

"The army? Hah! There is little chance Germany could reach the Illar mainland - or even our colonies. If we went to war.. it would cost the Illar, yes. But rather, the tax they impose on trade from India is cutting into our own money. If we must simply sail out and sink the German fleet, take their colonies in order to secure that trade.. make no mistake, Marquis. As Emperor, it is my duty to think of the welfare of the Illar people. And the wealth of the Illar people. I suggest that you deliver a.. rather more strongly-worded message to them. We do not accept German sovereignity over the Gulf of Aden, and nor do we accept their tax."

"But, Your Majesty-"

"Furthermore, if they refuse to comply, shut off all German trade through Gilbratar and Suez. We can live without trade from India for a time. And, of course, we can merely send our ships through the Americas. It will be expensive, yes, but the Germans will be made to understand that they do not control our lifeblood. I will be interested, as a matter of fact, in seeing how long their ships in Aden live without supplies, repair, or fuel."

"..your Majesty, I understand your concerns. I will deliver such a message to the Germans. Nonetheless, though, I must complain - perhaps I could negotiate some sort of deal with the Germans? Half tax on both Gilbratar and Suez in return for no tax at Aden? It is hardly as if we profit greatly from the German trade, in any case."

"Very well. Give them that. Negotiate, and that is the final offer you may give them. It is doubtful that the Anj, or the Incognitians would decry us for such an act, as the tensions with the Germans are fairly high. The Waldenburgers can hardly move out of port to challenge us, and it is doubtful that the Exavians would risk annihilation to fight us."

"Yes, Your Majesty. I will do what I can.

- - - - -
We see every reason - Suez was carved out by the Illar themselves, wheras your control of Aden is sketchy, at best. Rather, we do not recognize German sovereignity of Aden, and, furthermore, we find your claims of sovereignity over such a stretch of water to be spurious at best, especially considering that your ships rely on the Suez Canal for their very position there.

However, we are not unwilling to negotiate. We are willing to reduce both the taxes in Suez and Gilbratar on German shipping by half - a most reasonable offer, especially considering the lucrative trade in the Mediterranean which Germany may benefit from, in return for the waiving of the fee at Aden. This will, at the very least, allow German traders from Africa to sell their goods more cheaply, and, no doubt, will lower prices on all sorts of rarities throughout the German Empire.

- Marquis Hollosworth

Ireland is looking to extend its trading network internationally. Ireland’s economy is growing rapidly thanks in part to its rich African colonies. These colonies are funding and burst of growth in the industrial sector. These sectors include machinery, commercial and naval vessels and natural resources like steel, copper, lead, etc.

Our main goal is to establish concrete connections with oil distributors.

Imperial Message From: Waldenburg Economic Ministry Helmut Grey (OIH)
To: The Irish Republic

Waldenburg has heard your call for economic growth an indeed believes it can provide resources for oyur expansion. Oil can be drilled from our Canadian and American colonies as well as, natural gas from Denmark and the Baltic. The Americas also offer a vast natural reserve of coal, which would be a much cheaper fuel for Industry. However we can provide both and are more then happy to trade with you, hopefully for gold and money if possible, but machinery would also be more then acceptable.

Signed:
Sir Helmut Grey, Minister of Economics, Waldenburg

Incognitia would like to offer Ireland a part in the European Free Trade Agreement.
Several major nations are already members, and we welcome any nation prepared to trade freely.

To the most esteemed Mr. Helmut Grey
From: Sir Alastar Gearalt

We accept your proposal. Your coal and oil will be most beneficial to keep our economy on the rise. Though we have one concern we must address. We can offer money now, however in the near future it may, and probably will, become unsustainable to continue dealing monies.

To: Incognito
From: Irish Republic

We accept the generous invitation into the EFTA. We hope our membership will benefit others as well as ourselves.

The Confederacy of Warsaw invites the nation of Bautzen and Incognitia to sign the following treaty.

The Treaty of Warsaw

Bearing in mind that the nation of Bautzen and Incognitia have made significant investments within the Confederacy's Arm Indstury and being equally desirous to further its relations abroad, the Confederacy of Warsaw invites the nations listed therein to:

1)Guarantee the Independence of the Confederacy of Warsaw.
2)Come to the aid of the Confederacy of Warsaw if threatened.
3)Promote the Confederacy's Arm Industry.

In exchange the Confederacy pledges itself to:

1)Grant significant discounts to any products produce by the Arm Industry.
2)Come to the aid of Incognitia and Bautzen whenever they are threatened.
3)Grant exclusive trading rights. (OOC: You'll get first dips on everything)

To: Confederacy of Warsaw
This is acceptable. If you send a copy of the said Treaty to your embassy in Nescia, I will sign it and return it.
-Office of the Tyrant

First, members of the EFTA:
Ireland
Caxistan
Bautzen
Incognitia
Warsaw

Message From: Sir Helmut Grey (OIH) Ministry of Economics Waldenburg
To: The Rt Honorable Sir Alastar Gearalt

This is fine we understand and will accept industrial machinery at any point you no longer see fit to pay with currency. For our opening offer we suggest, 70,000 Tons of coal monthly for 30‡ (Or osmas, my currency, or equal to about 10 Dollars, in this case. As a rule of thumb one third.) a ton. You may choose to purcahse the full amount or only a limited amount. As for oil we are capable of offering 15,000 barrels monthly, for 45‡ a barrel. These are of course negotiable and we may have other things to trade in the future, should you be intereasted. If ever you are need of more you must only say and we can increase the output.

Signed:
Sir Helmut Grey


OOC And with the EFTA didn't I sign it as well or was that just a side treaty?

OOC: I think we should simplify the system a little. I've noticed that quite alot of treaties had been signed (nothing wrong with that since it was one of the major cause of WW1), but wouldn't it be simplier to group them up a little? It's getting hard to keep up with all of them.

OOC: It's an open treaty, if you're prepared to trade freely, you can join.
I admit I can't recall if you already had, so, list follows:

Ireland, Incognitia, Waldenburg, Warsaw, Caxistan, Bautzen.

bump for Bautzen.

The Irish Republic accepts said prices.

OOC: Wow, did I miss alot in a short period of time, o well to buisness.

IC: Bautzen see's these terms as acceptable ones and will agree to sign the treaaty. We hope that this treaty will bring many years of friendship, and prosperity to our nations.

The Triple Union

Being desirous to protect their people from outside threats, The nations of Bautzen, Caxidan as well as the Confederacy of Warsaw have agreed to form a defensive military alliance.

Incognitia would like to invite the Italian Social Republic to sign a non-aggression pact.
We have no wish to see our men dying on the Alps to advance ten yards here, ten yards there; and we feel this would serve as a foundation for good relations between nations that have no cause to dislike one another.

OOC: I would assume that in spite of the fact that these items are being posted publicly in this thread, they are not common knowledge until the involved parties choose to make them public, right?

IC:

It was late. After 10 PM in point of fact and Marcel Bouchard, the Immyrian Minister for Foreign Affairs was tired. His bloodshot eyes found those of his counterpart at the Ministry of Defense, Phillipe Gaulthier, and he sighed.

"I don't suppose we have much choice, eh Phillipe?" he breathed.

"None really, my friend. The Kingdom suddenly finds itself in need of a navy. Unfortunately, we know very little about naval doctrine. Being landlocked for so long will do that to you," Gaulthier paused and smiled. "The Empire is the premier naval power. If we want the best, we must deal with the best. They have as much to gain from a secure and safe Channel as we have not to mention our shared borders. I think they will scratch our backs if we scratch theirs," he rumbled, leaning back in his leather bound chair.

"I think you are right. I think, given our shared history however, that it won't be easy. Still, the necessity of a navy is real now," Bouchard replied.

"When will the communique' go out?" the Defense Minister asked.

"In the morning. It will head for Illar through private channels," was the muted reply.


To His Imperial Majesty Alutius V,

On behalf of His Majesty King Alphonse II and the people of the Kingdom of Immyr, we bid you greetings. We sincerely hope that this message finds you and the Imperial Family in good spirits and in good health.

At the request of His Majesty through his Prime Minister, we are contacting you regarding the possibility of mutual cooperation between our two glorious nations.

As we are sure you are already aware, the Kingdom's sphere of influence has increased over the past weeks and months. With its newly acquired access to the Channel and the open sea beyond, the Kingdom finds itself in a unique postion. Beachfront property and few naval assets to be exact.

We come to you now seeking assistance in the establishment of a modern, capable navy with which the Kingdom may secure its maritime interests. In return for this assistance, we are most willing to discuss border security, trade concessions, and common interests.

We await your response.

Most respectfully,

Marcel Bouchard
Minister for Foreign Affairs

and

Phillipe Gaulthier
Minister of Defense
Kingdom of Immyr

The Italian Social Republic is invited to join the treaty of Rome, consisting of the New Roman Empire, The Byzantium League (OOC: me!), The Balkan Empire, and the Republic of Anatolia-Crete.

OOC: I would assume that in spite of the fact that these items are being posted publicly in this thread, they are not common knowledge until the involved parties choose to make them public, right?

OOC: Well these sorts of things fall into 3 different catagories they are the following:
1). Public Declarations (the majority of alliances and such, barring a few)
2). "Private" Agreements, basically this is like Israel having nukes in RL but neither confirming nor denying that they have them. These are things which are really not secret but technically secret.
3). Secret Treaties, this is the kind of treaty that may be alluded to and known to people in OOC terms but in IC terms people have no idea that they occured.

For example the EFTA, and RTA (Rome Treaty Alliance) are hardely secret. However if I was to, say, sign a secret alliance with you and it is secret I probably wouldnt post it here, or call it something else, or make the provision secret so the rest of you dont know.

The Siberian Empire humbly requests to open communications with its neighbor of Wolfenstein. We would also like to inquire about the EFTA, (OOC: What it is) and about possible membership.

The Siberian Empire humbly requests to open communications with its neighbor of Wolfenstein. We would also like to inquire about the EFTA, (OOC: What it is) and about possible membership.

The EFTA is the European Free Trade Association, it strives to eliminate trade and tariff barriers through-out Europe and make the European market more free. The EFTA is open to all, as long as the government of any willing member nation agrees to open up his market to the rest of the EFTA for tariff free trade and foreign investment.

The Siberian Empire, upon the orders of the Premier on behalf of His Majesty, the King, hereby announces its intention to join the EFTA.

The Siberian Empire is provisionally accepted into EFTA.

The Tyrant advises that inspectors will be sent to judge the degree of compliance with the spirit of EFTA in due course; every new member has faced these inspections, and while all have faced some concerns, all have so far passed.

The Waldenburg Empire would like to begin formal relations with the nation of Wolfenstien. We believe that an alliance can be formed as we are already indirectly linked through our alliances with Germany.

The Waldenburg Empire would like to begin formal relations with the nation of Wolfenstien. We believe that an alliance can be formed as we are already indirectly linked through our alliances with Germany.

OOC: You don't *have* an alliance with Germany. You have an agreement on tolls in the Oresund.
If you want an alliance with Germany, obviously the only person who has a say on that is Germany...but you need to arrange it first.

And, if it's arranged but not posted here, it still needs to be posted up before it can be acted upon, because otherwise we have no way of knowing if what Nation A claims has been in place for weeks has actually, or is made up to match a changing IC situation.
If it exists, and no-one's meant to know, that's what SIC tags are for.

We are gaurenteeing each others Sovereignty, but yes I suppose not an alliance . That was part of the earlier agreement before the negotiations, and I can only assume as it wasn't withdrawn it's still intact.

Anyway that was a message to Wolfestien, nobody else needs to know that we have an "alliance" with Germany, as it was organizied in a different thread it is still secret.

OOC No unfortunately, always a problem, but i'm on most of my free time at least partially, I'll look into getting but it'll be at least till the weekend.

We are gaurenteeing each others Sovereignty, but yes I suppose not an alliance . That was part of the earlier agreement before the negotiations, and I can only assume as it wasn't withdrawn it's still intact.

Anyway that was a message to Wolfestien, nobody else needs to know that we have an "alliance" with Germany, as it was organizied in a different thread it is still secret.

OOC: Do you have IM of any kind? Thing or two I'd like to discuss, TGs is awkward.

OOC: I haven't been officially accepted...though I doubt there will be reason I will not be, so...

IC:

- Official Communique To The Nations Of Europe

The Republic Of Lyonnais would like to open diplomatic relations with Europe, especially our neighbouring countries. We wish to offer a non-aggression pact to our neighbours of the Swiss Confederation, Osteia, the Illar Empire and the German Empire. We are open to diplomatic talks with other nations also.

We are also interested in the trade group the EFTA and would like to enquire as to whether we can join. Lyon is well known as a fashion and silk centre, and it has more of a market full of luxury goods than natural resources.

Thank you.

Alain-René,
Prime Minister of the Republic Of Lyonnais

"So Lyonnais has finally decided to come out of its shell. Interesting timing, don't you think?" asked Alphonse, glancing casually at the communique in his left hand. His right hand was wrapped firmly around a glass of 1904 German red.

"I think they smell the blood in the water Your Majesty. Major powers will begin hurling high explosives at one another within six months. Neutrality will be no protection," the Prime Minister stated. "It appears the Republic is awakening to that fact. Note the call of non-agression pacts?

"Indeed. Should we reach out to them?" queried the King.

"Perhaps. If nothing else, we can go seeking trade agreements and the like. Lyonnaise has a reputation for producing an wide assortment of fine luxury products. Perhaps we could open our markets to them?" Prime Minister Dumont regarded his Sovereign closely, gauging his response. The King indulged him by playing his part.

"Come now Gilbert. Now is hardly the time to go seeking trade agreements for wine and chocolates when bullets are about to fly," smiled the King.

"Of course, Your Majesty. If Lyonnaise silks products and wines were to begin appearing in Kingdom markets, that might give some impression of normalcy to the general public. Perhaps get their minds off of the impending conflict. Stop some of those rumors on the street about Immyrian forces being deployed along Osteia's border," replied the Prime Minister.

"Rumors that happen to be true Gilbert," Alphonse pointed out.

"Just so Your Majesty but for now, to the public, they are just that; rumors. Let's give them something else to thing about," was Dumont's immediate reply. The King sighed into his wine glass.

"Very well, Gilbert. Reach out to them. Let's see if was can become friends."

OOC: Just setting the stage. Official communication to follow.

"And, as we can see, these younger states, so to speak, do not pose a threat to the Illar border. No, the state of Italy poses a massive threat to our borders, with their anti-monarchist stance. I personally believe that the Eastwall must be refortified to prevent a penetration of our lands as far as France. However, I can see your complaints, minister. A defensive pact on our borders will strengthen us immeasurably."

Telegram to the Republic Of Lyonnais, and the Kingdom of Immyr

A new situation arises in Europe, and nations grasp for their arms, as war looms on the horizon. The Illar are as well aware of this as any. However, it must be noted, that, out of all the nations in the world, only a scant three share a land border with the Empire. As you are both one of these, you are of special interest to the Empire.

We propose, simply, a pact of territorial defense, one-sided in its entire. Should warmongering nations seek to strike at the Illar homeland, they will surely seek to use your nations as roads. As such, in the event of invasion of either the Republic of Lyonnais, or the Kingdom of Immyr by any power, the Illar Empire requests consent to move their troops through and into your respective sovereign nations, so that we may better defend both you and ourselves.

- Emperor Alutius

OOC: I haven't been officially accepted...though I doubt there will be reason I will not be, so...

IC:

- Official Communique To The Nations Of Europe

The Republic Of Lyonnais would like to open diplomatic relations with Europe, especially our neighbouring countries. We wish to offer a non-aggression pact to our neighbours of the Swiss Confederation, Osteia, the Illar Empire and the German Empire. We are open to diplomatic talks with other nations also.

We are also interested in the trade group the EFTA and would like to enquire as to whether we can join. Lyon is well known as a fashion and silk centre, and it has more of a market full of luxury goods than natural resources.

Thank you.

Alain-René,
Prime Minister of the Republic Of Lyonnais

If Lyon is prepared to commit to trading freely, you will be very welcome to join the EFTA.
Incognitia Airlines would also like to offer an airship route to Lyon, linking in with those to Illar, Immyr, and of course the rest of Europe.

- Official Communiqué To Terror Incognitia

We are fully prepared to let a European Civilian Airline enter our nation and welcome your planes into Lyon. We also are interested in trading our luxury goods such as silk, food, wine and the general creations of the culture of Lyonnais between other nations freely, though our small high quality arms and plane manufacture industry is for private and close ally usage only.

Alain-René,
Prime Minister of the Republic Of Lyonnais

- Official Communiqué To Emperor Alutius

The Republic will not fight wars unless they are, so to speak, at our door. We are not a fighting nation, our military is large for mostly show, and we have come into the international stage hoping to make friends, not enemies. Though, we understand tensions are running high, and the world could be facing conflict - and we do not want our nation used as another stepping stone to yours.

We know little about this developing conflict, but if both sides could mutually agree not to invade us it would be ideal, otherwise, we accept your offer to help us if we are used as a means of transporting invading troops to your nation. No army will enter Lyonnais without our permission.

Alain-René,
Prime Minister of the Republic Of Lyonnais.

"And, as we can see, these younger states, so to speak, do not pose a threat to the Illar border. No, the state of Italy poses a massive threat to our borders, with their anti-monarchist stance. I personally believe that the Eastwall must be refortified to prevent a penetration of our lands as far as France. However, I can see your complaints, minister. A defensive pact on our borders will strengthen us immeasurably."

Telegram to the Republic Of Lyonnais, and the Kingdom of Immyr

A new situation arises in Europe, and nations grasp for their arms, as war looms on the horizon. The Illar are as well aware of this as any. However, it must be noted, that, out of all the nations in the world, only a scant three share a land border with the Empire. As you are both one of these, you are of special interest to the Empire.

We propose, simply, a pact of territorial defense, one-sided in its entire. Should warmongering nations seek to strike at the Illar homeland, they will surely seek to use your nations as roads. As such, in the event of invasion of either the Republic of Lyonnais, or the Kingdom of Immyr by any power, the Illar Empire requests consent to move their troops through and into your respective sovereign nations, so that we may better defend both you and ourselves.

- Emperor Alutius

"They can't be serious," scoffed one of the Defense Minister's aides. The Minister himself glanced across the cherrywood table at Général d'armée Michel de Arnaud, one eyebrow raised in a decidedly interrogative fashion. General de Arnaud reached up to scratch at his neatly trimmed goatee.

"They most certainly are serious. And right. Few powers can be considered the equal of the Empire in terms of naval power and none can be called superior. Any nation seeking to engage Illar will have to do so on land and that means coming right through our front yard," de Arnaud stated, pausing to examine the map spread before them all. A gnarled index finger traced the Kingdom's western and southern borders; those shared with the Empire and Lyon. His gaze then travelled further east, to Germany, the Anj Reich, and Incognita and his expression darkened. "We stand a greater chance of surviving a conflict if we act in support of the Illarian proposal."

"But they are effectively asking permission to garrison Imperial troops within the Kingdom's borders," protested the Interior Minister.

"At least they asked permission," quipped his counterpart at the Ministry of Defense. The Defense Minister went on before his colleague could speak up. "General de Arnaud is correct. For the sake of the Kingdom and it's people, we must act decisively now. Not tomorrow. Not next week. Now." Prime Minister Dumont chose that moment to sit forward, one hand raised to gather attention. He had been content to let those on the council debate the matter but the time had come for a decision.

"The King has asked that we handle this matter with expediency. As the civilian authority within the Kingdom, it falls to us to figure this out. I can appreciate everyone's points in this matter. For my part, I agree with the General. That being the case, we will respond to the Imperial request favorably. I'll leave that up to you Minister," he stated, his keen eyes focused directly onto the Minister for Foreign Affairs, who nodded in acceptance.


To: His Imperial Majesty, Emperor Alutius,

The government of the Kingdom of Immyr sees the wisdom in what you propose. With war looming on the horizon, it goes without saying that fortune will favor the prepared.

While the Kingdom cannot simply agree to unmanaged, un-planned for Imperial troop deployments within the Kingdom's borders, we can agree to the concept of mutual defense and cooperation.

To this end, we would suggest that Kingdom military commanders meet with their Imperial counterparts in order to formulate a plan for the forward deployment of Imperial Army units to the Kingdom's eastern most border. This meeting can take place at a time and location of your choosing.

It is our sincere hope that current cooperation of this nature will lead to further cooperation and closer ties down the road.

Most Respectfully,

Marcel Bouchard
Minister for Foreign Affairs
on behalf of His Majesty King Alphonse II
Kingdom of Immyr
OOC:We certainly don't have to RP the meeting. I just want a way to indicate the some planning needed to take place so that Imperial troops were not running pell mell through the streets in Immyr. ;)

To: Lyon
The EFTA works to eliminate tariffs and customs dues, not to force nations to arm others.
If your defence contractors choose to forgo the profits available in trading arms and aircraft, this is acceptable within the EFTA.
As EFTA is not intended as a military alliance, there is no requirement to share your defence-related technologies.
The only consequence of war between EFTA members is that one party will be suspended from EFTA for the duration of the conflict; EFTA cannot, therefore, force Member States to arm one another.

We hope this clears up your concerns,
John McGrath, Tyrant

Currently, despite Sukiaida's isolation, it wonders if it may strike some form of Alliance in any form with other nations. (As my neighbor nations don't seem to be too active at the moment.)

"Well, gentlemen. It appears meeting like this seems to happen almost daily, does it not?"

"Yes, my lord. It happens daily. As part of our daily meeting."

Alutius, King of Illar, Viceroy of Suez, Emperor of Africa, Lord Protector of Delhi, Lord of Mexico, and holder of a dozen other titles, laughed, his laugh a bell-like peal, charming, in its own way, almost convincing the listener that the man hardly had a brain of his own.

"Nonetheless, to business. The negotiations with Lyonnais have turned up little, as Alan could no doubt tell you, couldn't you, Alan?"

The same dour man who had spoken earlier spoke again. Third in line for the throne, he was not an inspiring, nor a charismatic candidate for the throne, but blood was blood, all the same. He had been appointed to his position to train him for the possibility that he might one day be emperor, above the sixty-year old man who sat in front him.

"Yes, my lord. Lyonnais seems determined to embark on a stance of neutrality. Of course, Lyonnais will undoubtedly be nowhere near as vital as Immyr, so the issue is moot."

Sharp-eyed, now, the old man's smile broke into a frown. "No, Alan. It is not. Every issue, with every country, is crucial. For even a two may form part of a flush, you know. You may not see it now, but it is possible that Lyonnais may one day save the Empire itself."

Alan laughed cynically, and looked at the Emperor. "My lord, I mean no disrespect, but-"

"But nothing, Minister. I am Emperor, and you may be one day, as well. Listen to me, boy."

Alutius gave another stunning smile - from a man of his age, it was unnerving, but he brimmed with vitality, the wrinkles on his face and nigh-white hair belied his vigorousness, and his activity - had you merely been able to listen to him, he would seem twenty years younger than he looked.

"Lyonnais is not crucial to our position at all, it is true, but consider it from a military point-of-view."

General Brownstone looked up at the mention of his forte. The Imperial Council shifted from week to week, depending on who it concerned, and only a few permanent members, including the Emperor, remained. In times of war, this changed dramatically, but, for now, it was still peace. For now.

"General, kindly tell Alan what lies directly south of Lyonnaise."

"The Divine Wall of Providence, your highness."

"The Spain-France Line, yes. Now, General. What lies east of that south of Lyon?"

"The King's Redoubts.. and the Eastwall."

Alutius chuckled. "Yes, the Eastwall. Now, as we all know, the Illar maintain a significant force in the Eastwall, which can be withdrawn to the King's Redoubts on great need. Tell me, Alan. What will happen if an enemy strikes south through Lyonnais, and manages to come up against the Eastwall? You know your geography, don't you?"

"I.. I.. Oh. The Eastwall will be cut off."

"Very good, Alan. Very good indeed. And if we lose the Eastwall garrison, which constitutes a significant portion of our defensive garrison, the Spain-France Line will be accordingly undermanned, which, if it fell, would constitute the end of the Empire. Thus, we can see that keeping Lyonnaise in our good graces is benefical to all in the long run."

Alan looked at the Emperor, annoyed. The old man had outmaneuvered him. Made him look stupid.

"Now, Alan. What news from Immyr?"

"Immyr, my lord, are far more amenable to our proposal. But this seems logical, as they were once Illar. They know that our futures are intertwined - should they fall, we will be vulnerable, should we fall, they will have already fallen."

"Good. Send them a response giving the assurances they want."

"My lord?"

"Obviously they want assurances that we're not going to use their territory as a mobilization ground whenever we feel the need. Anyone sane would. Give them that."


Telegram to the Kingdom of Immyr; King Alphonse II

Of course, in the interests of superior co-ordination, we can most assuredly agree to such a deal. Such co-operation, as you have said, can only ensure the security of both our nations, and, of couse, ties us closer to our friends in Immyr.

In the interests of peace, furthermore, I would most happily extend an offer to aid in the naval protection of Immyr overseas assets, so that the Immyr are not taken advantage of by powers who seek to diminish your power overseas, so that they furthermore weaken your front at home.

- Emperor Alutius


Telegram to the Republic Of Lyonnais; Prime Minister Alain-René

The conflict is developing, and, at present, the sides are somewhat unclear - although no shots have as yet been fired, tensions between Waldenburg and the Empire are high, as well as Waldenburg and a number of other nations, following a horrific incident at a negotiation inside of Incognitia. This treaty does not name specific nations, but rather recognises, in any strategic plan, there are only four routes into the Empire.

Firstly, the route by sea. This is countered by the Illar Navy, and made obsolete by such. Any invasion by sea would inevitably be undersupplied and undermanned, so there is little risk from such a thing.

Secondly, Italy. However, the great Eastwall is powerful, and it seems unlikely that it would fall to anything but the most potent of attacks.

Thirdly and fourth are Lyonnais and Immyr. These are two routes that the Illar do not directly have control over, and, as such, we, as well as you no doubt do, see the danger inherent in being a 'road to Illar'. Any greater power seeking to strike at the heart of the Empire would no doubt have to come through either Lyonnais or Immyr - or possibly both. As such, this pact is designed, realising that the very existence of the Empire puts both you and the Immyr under threat, and aims somewhat to ensure both of our people's protection so that we are less tempting of a target.

Our offer, in most aspects, is one of self-preservation - the primary reason most would have to invade you is the tempting road into the heartland of the Empire it leads to. And we would much rather stop the threat in your borders than in ours - a sentiment you, no doubt, can agree with.

- Emperor Alutius

Jean Saint-Pierre, the aging leader of the Opposition Party “Socialist Party For The Republic” (SPFR), is the most powerful man in the Republic. He has more strength, more public support, than the entire government of Lyonnais has, and is likely to be the next Prime Minister after the elections next year - though many argue he has ruled this country ever since he was elected leader of the SPFR twenty years ago.

A small man, most probably Italian, knocked on the door to Saint-Pierre's sprawling office - which was almost twice the size and twice as grand as Alain-René, and offered some of the best views over Lyon. Jean, in his usual non-caring tone, gestured him in, and another discussion began which would ultimately end up with Saint-Pierre having the final decision.

"Sir, word has come from inside the Government that the Illar Empire has offered us protection from the powers that wish to use us as a stepping stone to them..." Saint-Pierre interrupted him.

"Young man, who are you? Do you think I do not know this? Infact, I have been pondering my decision on this issue for the last few hours. I wished to know more about Italian Social Republic, the people who interested me the most out of the list of threats that Illar said could come to us - there name was, fascinating. They share similar ideals to me; I don't want us to be enemies of them..." He paused and sipped from a day old glass of whisky that sat on the desk "But, we must think about geography. I must say, I was offended when I heard that these Spaniards viewed us as a route to them, as if we were nothing more - but to many nations we may be just that. I'll write up my views on this issue and send them to our 'Prime Minister'" He finished, with a hint of sarcasm.

The man was about to leave before he turned around un-expectantly and said "But, sir, if you don't mind - surely it is Alain-René decision on what we do. He is our Prime Minister - well, currently."

Jean Saint-Pierre looked at him with a bemused look across his face, and laughed before saying "Oh please, what major decision has this country made in the last twenty years I have not had a part in?"


- Official Communiqué To Terror Incognitia

Then, we accept your offer for us to enter the EFTA and give you access to the creations of our culture, and would also like to officially welcome all planes from airlines into the city of Lyon.

Alain-René,
Prime Minister of the Republic Of Lyonnais

- Official Communiqué To Emperor Alutius

We understand your problems and that you wish to eliminate all possiblities of an easy entry into your country. We hereby accept your offer of assistance in times of war, though we are still unsure as to whether we wish to effectively drag ourselves into any conflict by having your troops stationed in our country. Though, we are willing to negotiate and we appreciate your offer, so if you inform us of the amount of troops, were you will station them, and various other details, we will likely accept, and hope to improve relations with our large neighbour.


Alain-René,
Prime Minister of the Republic Of Lyonnais

Telegram to His Imperial Majesty Alutius, Empire of Illar

The Kingdom of Immyr considers the matter decided then. With your permission, senior Military officers will meet with their counterparts in the Empire to develop rapid deployment plans in the event Imperial troops are needed at the border. We truly hope that it will never come to this though the reality of the situation precludes ruling out the necessity.

As for our meager overseas holdings, Your Imperials Majesty's generosity apparently knows no bounds. While we have few colonies, His Majesty King Alphonse nevertheless takes a keen interest in them. We are most grateful for your offer of assistance. Word will be sent immediately to the various colonial governors to expect contact by regional Illarian forces.

Most respectfully,

Marcel Bouchard
Minister of Foreign Affairs
on behalf of His Majesty King Alphonse II
Kingdom of Immyr

OOC: Just for future reference and to limit RPing the details, Kingdom officials will ask that any and all forces that would be deplyed through the Kingdom be clearly identified before crossing the border. Transit routes will be specified for these troop movements. These routes will, naturally, steer clear of major Immyrian cities as much as possible. Immyrian reserve forces will provide for traffic control along these routes. It will also be expected that Imperial forces will leave the Kingdom as quickly as possible once Immyrian and Illarian commanders agree that their presence is no longer needed. ;)

Bumped for reply to my post :)