NationStates Jolt Archive

Nueve Italia's Garibaldi and Emanuelle Military Industries (GEMI) have developed an aircraft that can operate where no plane previously has been able to: underwater.

Project Volo Profundo, or Deep Flight, has produced and succesfully used an underwater fighter plane, capable of engaging enemy ships and subs, and perfect for water reconaissance and exploration. The Aeromar (Sea Flyer), as it is called, is perfect for either military or scientific purposes.

The way the Aeromar works is that instead of using a ballast system to control descent and ascent, as conventional submarines do, the Aeromar uses stubby inverted wings to provide "negative" lift that pulls the craft down. This downward force negates the slightly buoyant characteristics of the Aeromar. At cruising speeds the craft is neutrally buoyant and depends on its thrusters to drive the sub up or down, the same principle used in airplanes (or Bernoulli's principle in reverse). This principle allows the Aeromar to dive at incredible rates, with the prototype reaching a descent rate of 480 feet per minute. Also, the "sub" is capable of making extremely quick turns by applying the rudder, the flaps of the wings, and by reversing one of the propellers, much in the way a hovercraft turns. By doing all three of these actions, a pilot can make an Aeromar one of the most manueverable things in the water.

All the crafts are battery powered, making them enviromentally safe and non-fuel dependent, which can be an expensive hassle in combat and scientific exploration.
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So far, there are four types of the craft:
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The AM-P

http://www.deepflight.com/images/df1sub.jpg

This is the prototype model of the current craft. It was built to test the principles that make the plane work, and work it did.

Specs:
Crew: 1 person, prone position
Life Support: 18 Hours
Flight Endurance: 1-4 Hours
Dimensions: 13 ft. long, 8 ft. wide, 3 ft. high
Weight: 2,860 lbs.
Speed: 4-12 knots
Operational Depth: 3,300 fsw (feet of sea water)
Construction: Glass (viewport) Epoxy composite (main structure)
Ascent Rate: 650 feet/minute
Descent Rate: 480 feet/minute
Pitch range: +/- 90 degrees
Roll Range: +/- 90 degrees
Armament: 4 small torpedoes (located in wings)

Price: 48,000 USD
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The Aeromar

http://www.deepflight.com/images/opport_2.gif

This is the first conventional fighter version of the Aeromar. One crew member controls the craft, while the other controls weapon systems or cameras and oxygen levels

Specs:
Crew: 2 people, seated position
Life Support: 24 hours
Flight Endurance: 4-6 hours
Dimensions: 22 ft. long, 12.2 ft. wide, 6 ft. high
Weight: 3,800 lbs.
Speed: 5-8 knots
Operational Depth: 1,500 fsw
Construction: Glass (viewport) Epoxy composite (main structure)
Ascent Rate: 600 feet/minute
Descent Rate: 320 feet/minute
Pitch range: +/- 90 degrees
Roll Range: +/- 90 degrees
Armament: 4 small torpedoes (located in wings)

Price: 54,000 USD
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The Aero Camuso

http://www.deepflight.com/images/wfsub.jpg

This is a smaller, quicker version of the Aeromar. It's name literally means "Snub Plane", and it is used mostly militarily as a quick attack craft or scout sub.

Specs:
Crew: 1 person, prone position
Life Support: 12 hours
Flight Endurance: 2-6 hours
Dimensions: 11 ft. long, 2.5 ft. high, 3 ft wide
Weight: 1,500 lbs.
Speed: 8-12 knots
Operational Depth: 150 fsw
Construction: Glass (viewport) Epoxy composite (main structure)
Ascent Rate: 670 feet/minute
Descent Rate: 490 feet/minute
Pitch range: +/- 90 degrees
Roll Range: +/- 90 degrees
Armament: 2 small torpedoes (located in wings)

Price: 40,000 USD
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The Spruzzomar

http://www.deepflight.com/images/df2sub.jpg

This is the most advanced Aeromar currently developed by GEMI, designed to push all conventional boundaries. It is the ultimate explorer and can destroy enemy ships and subs with relative ease.

Specs:
Crew: 1 person, prone position
Life Support: 96 hours
Flight Endurance: 8 hours
Dimensions: 16 ft. long, 9 ft. wide, 4 ft. high
Weight: 5,000 lbs.
Speed: 6-14 knots
Operational Depth: 4,000 fsw
Construction: High-grade polyurethane (viewport) Titanium (main structure)
Ascent Rate: 700 feet/minute
Descent Rate: 450 feet/minute
Pitch: +/- 60 degrees
Roll: +/- 60 degrees
Armament: 4 small torpedoes (located in wings)

Price: 75,000 USD
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All of these craft either come in the military or scientific versions. The military versions can raise their max payload with the fitting of 2 more small torpedoes on the underbelly of the craft attached to a weapons rack. Scientific versions have camera equipment in place of torpedoes, and can be equipped with titanium or plastic "grippers" or claws on the front of the craft to manipulate objects underwater. All versions (civilian, military, scientific) come equipped with a high-power lighting system on the front of the craft.

Targeting: Military versions use the simplest of concepts for targeting: point and shoot. The craft must be rather close to the target anyway (250-350 yds. or so), but then again, its targets are usually huge (ships, subs), so it can't really miss. The small torpedoes have fins, much like aerial rockets, to keep them stable in flight.

OOC: Now, I need the community's opinion: Would anyone be interested in purchasing these (or buying the rights to produce them)? I know that the civilian version is at least feasible (it has been built by a one, Graham Hawkes), but does anyone have any problem with the military versions? Any input or critique (as long as its constructive) is welcome.

*bump* for ideas or business proposals

OOC: Might buy some of these when I get around to building up a navy, but as far as a suggestion goes, listing the armament perhaps?

OOC: How fast do the planes go in the air?

Kolvokia: Armament has been listed, I'll make it more apparent though. The max armament for the craft is 4 torpedoes in the wings (2 for the Aero Camuso), and an additional 2 more can be added under the craft attached to a weapons rack.

British Londinium: The planes do not go in the air: They are underwater fighter craft or exploration craft. The idea is to have something quick and manueverable in the water, whether for scouting or first-strike opportunities

We would like 200 Aeromars, and we will pay whatever price that seems decent.

The Royale Group, plc. would like to buy production rights for the Æromar and the Spruzzomar.

I think you might be gettin a little generous with some of the depths if you are using something you can see though with out too much distortion as a guide...

EDIT: and polyurethane is a foam...

We'd like to buy the production rights to all four!

... well, what can I say. Well done. A few questions, though. How would such a craft achieve proper targeting? Does it use sonar? If it does, where's it mounted? They don't all seem to have the space for a bow mounted array.

Also, how much do they cost?

I'm sure several of the larger, better established nations have projects along these lines (i know i use something similar for spec ops insertion), but this being the first to be released to my knowledge, it seems good.

EDIT: depths may be a tad overstated(def for the last one - 70 km depth?), but polyurethane's a plastic. nothing wrong with that.

OOC: Well, I knew I had some holes in my design. . . ok, time to edit a bit.

I'll also add prices, but I'm not really sure how much to charge. Any ideas (and be reasonable)?

I'd go with about 31 million per unit for the less advanced ones and 42 million for the Spruzzomar.

Update: Added targeting "system" and fixed outrageous depth (prolly still pretty bad anyhow)

As for prices how does something in the $10,000,000 range sound? too low/high?

Sounds sort of low. I think you should charge for them what you would for an aircraft.

I think it's a touch high. Personal submersibles are in the $10,000-100,000 neighborhood; a militarized submersible with better materials and technology shouldn't bust the bank. Ten million sounds high for a series of submersibles based on proven technology. Hell, that cost is in line with NSized main battle tanks.

Edit: Added set prices, will negotiate price to buy production rights. Taking all orders now from prices listed: all previous orders are negated.

*bump* for sales/suggestions

We will buy production rights for all four.

Production Rights for all four craft (The AM-P, the Aeromar, Aero Camuso, and the Spruzzomar) will total around 600 million USD.

*bump* for sales/help (any assistance I can get on bettering this thing would be greatly appreciated, this is my first time trying to design something)

The Royale Group shall pay two billion USD for production rights to all four.

The Federation will pay 700 million USD for the production rights of the four vehicles.

We will pay the entire cost. Thanks.

British Londinium, Ra and, and Constantinalia:

Production Rights are confirmed for ONLY 600 million, no need to spend the extra money. Blueprints will be sent by hand to respected nations in two days time.

*bump* for sales/advice

I think your prices are to low.

Well, better for the consumer? You're definately getting a great deal, and besides, they are relatively easy to produce: no jet engines, no rare materials (except for the last one, may want to raise that price. . . *makes mental note*), and there's no really complicated technology either. . . may raise some of them though. . .

Yes it is better for the consumer, but it might mean you are losing money on every sell you make.

*bump*

We are wondering if you have more advanced supercavitating models based on the shkval technology. We would be interested in purchasing some if you do.

OOC: Sorry for displaying my ignorance here. . .but I have no idea what supercavitating means or what the shkval technology is. . . at all.

Ministry of Defence Procurement Order

We would like to pay for the production rights of the Spruzzomar-Class SSFs (Ship Submersible Fighters). Full payment shall be made automatically upon statement of the cost of these rights.

MoD Official

damn I haven't checked this in awhile ... still, consider this a

Bump

for sales.

Not exactly uber-affiliated with military terms, but where would the ships enter the water? From port, aircraft carrier, whatever floats your boat, etc?

All aeromars can be boarded and launched from port, but all Nueve Italian Imperial Navy carriers have been specially outfitted to launch these fighters from man-made "bays" in the lower decks of the carrier.

This is a brief explanation of supercavitation, there are currently supercavitating torpedoes, a small submarine might be able to do this. If it exists, it would probably be secret.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supercavitation

Well, thank you very much for explaining that! Looks like you do learn something new every day ...

OOC: Cut the dive depth down to around 200-500fsw for the last three. Sub's get their strength because their hull is circular and the water pushes equally on all sides [hence why big subs are a bad idea, the sub is so big that the water pressure is different], these subs except for the first one, all defeat that princple, they'd be crushed like plastic bottles.


Cut the speed by half on all but the first one also, there is a reason that subs have teardrop shaped hulls, hydrodynamics

OOC: Cut the dive depth down to around 200-500fsw for the last three. Sub's get their strength because their hull is circular and the water pushes equally on all sides [hence why big subs are a bad idea, the sub is so big that the water pressure is different], these subs except for the first one, all defeat that princple, they'd be crushed like plastic bottles.


Cut the speed by half on all but the first one also, there is a reason that subs have teardrop shaped hulls, hydrodynamics

OOC: as all four of these vehicles have RL counterparts that work at the listed depths and speeds, I'm not too sure if I should cut them down. Granted, because of the reasons stated (which are good, thank you for pointing them out), I will state here why both the speed and operational depth of the last 3 aeromars will not be changed: the later models are, after all, supposed to be more advanced: not more flawed.

To answer how these vehicles can move and dive to the extent that they can, I can offer up the explanation of the "sea-flight" principle that makes an aeromar an aeromar, and not a submarine.

See, a submarine works through ballast: gain it or lose it to ascend or descend. They tend to be torpedo-shaped (due to the reasons you stated), and aren't particularly manueverable. An aeromar, on the other hand, is streamlined, like a fighter-jet pretty much. Much like fighters have become flatter, now have swept-wings, and still can go faster because of the principles of lift and air-flow, so too does the aeromar work.

The Underwater-Fighter, because it, too, is designed in a similar way (flattened, rounded in front to provide "water-flow" instead of air-flow, and with wings to provide inverse lift), it, technically, should be able to cruise at the noted speeds. Hydrodynamics taken in, this craft was not designed with only the principles of water in mind: it is a true aero-nautical vehicle. Much like the designs of the stream-lined fighters allow them greater speed, turning rate, and so on, so too does the same design work on the aeromar.

Deep Flight One, on which the AM-P was based on, has made a depth of 3,300 fsw, while, granted, the Aeromar design, based off of the Deep Flight Aviator, has only achieved a depth of 1,500 fsw. The depths I have given are the actual operating depths of these craft, and therefore will not be adjusted. The speeds too will also not be adjusted, as they are based on actual findings.

Aurum Domus Special Operations Command

We would like to purchase 5 Aero Camusos. Money will be wired upon order confirmation.

We would like to acquire 400 Aeromars, to make our first Underwater Fighter Strike Squadron for the Navy, the total cost will be 21.6 million dollars, which we have wired to you for payment.

Thank you,

Bob Frank
Department of the Navy
Calizorinstan

If any help is needed for development of weapons to equip your Underwater Fighter "Plane" please contact us

Thank You

Ernest Dantag,CEO Dantag Heavy Industries Corporation

OOC: Ah, I remember when this was first posted.

Good times.

Aurum Domus Special Operations Command,

Your order has been confirmed: please wire the money and you're shipment will arrive in 1 RL day

Emanuelle Nicodermi
Co-President of GEMI
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Mr. Frank, Department of Navy, Calizorinstan,

The payment has been received, and therefore, your order has been confirmed and shipped. Please allow 1 RL day for its arrival.

Emanuelle Nicodermi
Co-President of GEMI
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Ernest Dantag, CEO Dantag Heavy Industries Corporation,

Your offer is intriguing, however, the aeromar is currently at its pinnacle level of performance for now. If Dantag Heavy Industries Corporation would like to work jointly with GEMI to produce a new Aeromar-variant, we would be more than willing to hear such a proposal.

Emanuelle Nicodermi
Co-President of GEMI

We are going ot think about it

Thank You

Ernest Dantag,CEO DANTAG HEAVY INDUSTRIES CORPORATION

We would like to purchase 10,000 Aeromars. If my calculations are corect that is 540,000,000. Thank you my good sir for your help.

OOC: You do already know that sunlight penetrates only the top two or three hundred feet of the seas, at the best, right? Given the apparent reliance on the pilot's own eyes as sensors (because there's no room for a good Sonar system?) operating at depths below that level -- or at night -- would seem to require powerful headlights, but does this design actually have any of these? And of course the light from those would also have only a short range underwater, which would make high-speed operations outside of the day-lit waters decidely risky and thus reduce this design's effectiveness relative to more conventional models of mini-sub...

We would like to purchase 10,000 Aeromars. If my calculations are corect that is 540,000,000. Thank you my good sir for your help.

why are you posting Can't you see it's a dead thread ???
same goes to you too Bears Armed

why are you posting Can't you see it's a dead thread ???
same goes to you too Bears Armed

Calm down, Isa. Bears Armed was merely making a point.

why are you posting Can't you see it's a dead thread ???
same goes to you too Bears Armed
Oops! Sorry, I probably should have started hibernating weeks ago so I'm not as alert as I could be...

Oops! Sorry, I probably should have started hibernating weeks ago so I'm not as alert as I could be...

understanding and sorry for my post .there meant to be a why at the end of your name which i left off

understanding and sorry for my post .there meant to be a why at the end of your name which i left off
Okay.

I've just posted a closure request for this thread, over in Moderation, anyway.