NationStates Jolt Archive

This Thread is now closed due to the dropping of IGNORE Bombs on the Fourth Holy Reich causing them to not exist. There Will be no war ladies and gentlemen...please find a different conflict to particpate in.


Okay here is the sign up and fact/rule book concerning the war between Ellelt and the Fourth Holy Reich.

Below is the fact/rulebook...read it before signing up...it is considered binding.

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Great Patriotic War--Ellelt and Allies V. The Fourth Holy Reich and Allies: Fact Book And RPG Rules.

For the purposes of this war RPG, called Great Patriotic War--Ellelt & Allies V. The Fourth Holy Reich & Allies, this fact book is written. This shall be the set of rules, formulas, and information set forth for the entirety of the RPG which shall have concluded upon the Unconditional Surrender of one of the two major belligerent powers: The Fourth Holy Reich, and Ellelt.

This scenario RPG will take place on Earth and is a European Theatre WWII RPG. However, modern weaponry is allowed and the dating system shall definitely be 21st Century.

Interested nations will sign up in the appropriate sign up thread in the International Incidents (II) forum of Nation States (NS). NSUN nations will have to comply with NSUN resolutions during this war. The war will commence on 28 November 2006 at 00.00 hours Eastern (US) Standard Time (-5 GMT). Sign-ups will be concluded at that time, and no nation which has not signed up may participate in the war making this a closed RPG.

Playing states will select a country or countries from the list provided by this fact book, and the resources of these countries shall be the considered to be the resources of predicating nations…although the RL populations will not (except in cases of neutral nations). Nations will have the options of European/Soviet nations, nations of North America, excepting the Caribbean and Central America, northern Africa, and the Middle East. No Nation may sign up for a real country which is not contained on the list of this fact book. Any Nation that does will not be allowed to participate in this RPG.

Certain nations have already expressed to Ellelt, the author of this fact book, their intentions of participating by telegram and will not be required to re-sign up. The countries that playing nations sign up for shall be considered the playing nation’s homeland and shall receive the attack and defence bonuses there of within the borders Also the maps used will current except where herein noted.

Ellelt:
Comprises the nations of Russia (Except the region below the 20th North Latitude between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea), Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Belarus, Ukraine.

Serpovia:
Comprises the nations of Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan and the Russian Region below the 20th north latitude between the Black Sea and Caspian Sea.

Western Hemisphre:
Comprises the nations of Canada, and the USA excluding the states of California, Nevada, Utah, Colorado Arizona, and New Mexico.

The Fourth Holy Reich:
Germany, (the 2006 territory)

Notes on the Available countries:
Due to the volatile nature of Yugoslavia, that nation shall have the united territory as it had in 1989. Czech Republic and Slovakia shall be united into Czechoslovakia as was the case in 1989.

Europe:
-Iceland
-Norway
-Sweden
-Finland
-Denmark
-UK
-France
-Ireland
-Portugal
-Spain
-Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg (all one country)
-Switzerland and Liechtenstein (all one country)
-Italy
-Austria
-Hungary
-Poland
-Czechoslovakia (See note above)
-Yugoslavia (See note above)
-Romania
-Albania
-Greece
-Bulgaria

Middle East:
-Turkey
-Cyprus
-Syria
-Lebanon
-Israel (Including Occupied Territories)
-Jordan
-Iraq
-Iran
-Kuwait
-Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Bahrain, Oman, UAE, and Yemen (all one country)

North Africa:
-Morocco
-Algeria
-Tunisia
-Libya
-Egypt

North America:
- The US states of California, Nevada, Utah, Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico and also Mexico (All One Country)

Nations which have not been claimed by the end of the sign up will be considered neutral and shall not attack either power until attacked. Neutral Nations as stated above shall be played by the enemy of the country which invades first. Once a neutral nation’s entire territory is occupied it is out of the war. Neutral nations which are occupied shall maintain resistance forces which shall disrupt by 25% the logistical chain of the Occupying power (the nation which invaded the neutral first), and will remain so until “Liberated” by the enemy of the occupying power.

Alliances:

There are two different alliances within this scenario Ellelt & Allies, and The Fourth Reich & Allies. Each nation that signs up may declare allegiance to either, or may decide to declare war independently of the alliances, In which case the Alliances will not attack the country until attacked. Already committed allies of Ellelt are Western Hemisphre and Serpovia. Allied nations shall be able to move their troops within the territory of their allies freely.

Attack and Defence Bonuses:

Due to the fact that there are “homelands” in this scenario and various other factors to take into consideration these bonuses are intended to calculate military losses. Participating members shall be responsible for doing their own maths.

-Defence Bonuses;
+150% when defending the national homeland (applies to all including neutrals)
+75% when defending in mountains, hills, fortifications.
+45% when defending in plains, steppes, deserts, or cities

-Attack Bonus
+150% when driving out invading power (Applies to all including neutrals)
+ 60% when attacking from mountains, hills or fortifications
+ 10% when attacking from plains, steppes, deserts or cities
-45% when attacking by air drop or amphibious assault.

Armed forces shall be divided into two classes, Regulars and Conscripts.

Regular forces shall have a maximum of 10% of the NS population of your country, excluding any UN Mission/Clone/Puppet.

Example: Country x with population of 28,000,000 would have a maximum military of 2,800,000.

80% of armed forces shall be logistics.

Example: Country X’s Military of 2,800,000 men would have a total fighting men number of 560,000 men

Conscripts:

Conscript forces are persons of the population which have been drafted from the civilian population and are relatively poorly trained. The Combat effectiveness of Conscript Troops is 60% that of Regular forces, so when calculating casualties one must reduce his Defence or Attack Force by 40% in number when using conscripts.

Conscripts shall be determined by taking half of the unemployed population of a country.

Mercenaries:

Mercenaries are soldiers of fortune and have the same combat effectiveness of regular troops and may be used in the game. However, after 21 November 2006, No further Mercenaries may be hired by any party.

Casualty formulas:

Attack:

The attack casualty formula shall be the difference of the total attack force, minus any penalty for using conscript soldiers, Multiplied by the decimal expression of attack bonuses if applicable (for negatives that would be a negative decimal) and the total defence force, multiplied by the decimal expression of defence bonuses (if applicable).

This Difference shall then be divided by 3 to reveal the Attacker’s casualties.

Mathematical Expression:

(AF * Bonus) - (DF * Bonus) / 3

Notes: the asterisk (*) represents multiplication algebraically, and the fore-slash (/) algebraically represents division. Since the attacker doesn’t know if the defender is using conscripts or not, and the defender doesn’t know (unless told) if the attacker is using conscripts of not the opposing force attacker or defender shall use the entire number (unless previous told said units were conscripts) given for a location by the other player.

Defence Casualty Formula:

The defence formula shall be the difference of the defence forces (again with the penalties for conscript troops) multiplied by the decimal expression of the bonuses (if applicable) and the attacking forces multiplied by their bonuses and then divided by 5.

Mathematical formula

(DF * Bonus) - (AF * Bonus) / 5

Turns:

Each turn be taken by each player shall constitute five (5) minutes of a battle. Inorder for everyone to keep everything straight the poster is required to put the front the battle is on (for example if Fourth Reich attacks Ellelt thru Belarus...It would be called the Belarussian Front). And the Actual Battle, which shall be named for the closest RL town/city of the location of battle. This will mean you might have to check an atlas from time to time. Maps/atlases are available from Wikipedia.

Hey, one thing I noticed. I think that police officers should also be added in and given defense values. Also, the rules should be modified so that victory is attained when ALL of one side gives up or is defeated.

i'd love to join as the UK.

I'd join and take Poland so as to buffer the space between you two, but these rules, agh!

I'd join and take Poland so as to buffer the space between you two, but these rules, agh!

Dood! I am part of your confederacy. Be my ally, dammit.

By the way you have not put in France, but I assume that you have your own reasons so I request to play as the Western Hemisphre or Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg? Even if it is possible may I play as a version of the Kalmar Union, Norway & Sweden & Denmark, even as that is what I would prefer most of all?

i'd like to join as the saudi arabia conglomerate.

i'd like to join as the saudi arabia conglomerate.


allied with ...?

the UK...

Also, Ellelt, you need to differentiate the different attack and defense worths of tanks, bombers, jets, etc.

We're allied with Ellelt.

Dood! I am part of your confederacy. Be my ally, dammit.


Yea fine, put me in Poland

Yea fine, put me in Poland

Groovy. Call in your other allies. We have ass to kick.

So is this going to be an offical rp as if needed I can just send in a sub-kingdom of the Empire in a nation here so I do not have to officaly fight?

Well Western Hemisphre Already is playing...please note that. There is an actual NS country called that. You could take the conglomeration of the south western USA and Mexico, if my Comrade Mexico and America doesn't come in here and requests it before you do.

Also not putting in France was an oversight. I'm not thinking all that clearly, obviously my cold medicine is making me a little wousie.

As for Tanks, Jets Ect...I wont change the formulas for them but I will consider giving attack bonuses against ground forces and surface naval forces. As far as bombardment goes I will have to consider that. I will be editing the fact book until the game actually starts.

Now as I have things noted:

Blackhelm Confederacy--Poland--alliance?

British Londinium--UK--Ellelt & Allies, Serpovia and Western Hemisphire

Canary Wharf--Saudi Arabian Conglomeration--Alliance?

So is this going to be an offical rp as if needed I can just send in a sub-kingdom of the Empire in a nation here so I do not have to officaly fight?


The fact book says you may play as a country and remain neutral or ally with either myself and allies, or Fourth Reich and his allies. However the United Socialist States of Ellelt would like you to know that Fourth Reich beforehand violated my air space in response to a UN Debate, so I would welcome you and your people on my side of the war.

As for amending the rules to a total elimination of either one side or the other...I disagree. Also I notice that there isnt a ban on peace accords or changing of alliances, this is how RL wars are fought this is how the GPW will be fought. Remember Fourth Reich you are the one who declared war on me, not the other way around.

Dear Brothers in Christ & Wayward Heretics,

The Holy Empire of Pope Jackal I declares itself in alliance with The Fourth Holy Reich and all who ally themselves in the cause of righteousness. We claim for ourselves the devout Catholic nation of Spain. May God have mercy on the souls of our enemies, for we surely will have none.

In Nomine Patris Et Fili Et Spiritus Sancti, Amen.

Pope Jackal I

As for Tanks, Jets Ect...I wont change the formulas for them but I will consider giving attack bonuses against ground forces and surface naval forces. As far as bombardment goes I will have to consider that. I will be editing the fact book until the game actually starts.

A) You should put a list of different units, (like tanks, jets, bombers) etc, put a number of men required to man one, and give a general formula for increased strength according to the number of men. Also, increase range. I'll give an example.

Panzer. Requirement 5 men to a panzer. Strength of one panzer equals 10 times that of a single infantry unit. Bombardment capabilities. Range-half mile.

Or something like that.

Also, in there should be a different thread in which to play out battles, with a decreased amount of time per post. For example, each post represents 5minutes in battle?

To that, you should add a rate of fire. In the case of panzers...how does 1 round per minute and a half sound...as opposed to say the rate of fire of 1 infantry of say...30 rounds per minute, with half a minute of reload.

We won't actually begin the battle until tuesday, so you certainly have time to alter those ever so slightly. Also, perhaps in the element of different weapons. For example...

A rocket launcher is much stronger than an assault rifle per blast, much more effective against a tank, but has a much lower rate of fire, and must less ammo.

Just a few things to think about.

In fact, screw it. I'll post a formula by tomorrow. You can decide to keep it or to go with something else.

Also,

Now as I have things noted:

Blackhelm Confederacy--Poland--alliance?

I think he is allied with me.

Canary Wharf--Saudi Arabian Conglomeration--Alliance?

With you, I think.

Remember Fourth Reich you are the one who declared war on me, not the other way around.


Yeah, I know, but you aren't the only person I'll be fighting. I've pissed a few people off.

Okay, we will change the turn system so each post will represent 5 minutes of battle. But each post must have the battle front (for example fourth reich is attacking ellelt thru belarus...it would be called the Belarussian front.) and the actual battle name...the nearest city. (example the battle of Leningrad)

Also so Nobody gets confused, Volgagrad will be called Stalingrad...or at least thats what Serpovia told me in his email to me a few minutes ago...and the Capital of Ellelt is New Stalingrad which is Moscow in RL.

As for tanks jets ect...provide me the info, Fuhrer, on the types of equipment you will be using, and I will research the Soviet stuff myself. Anyone else who will use any other type of must send me the information about what they are using.

Also before I have a bunch of people with their panties in a bunch...I allowed Modern technology...that is technology that it is reasonable that many militaries would have as of the RL year 2000.

Check the First Post for the edits.

Alright, then may I have a nation called the Scandinavian Union due to their relatively small populations in each?

Okay, we will change the turn system so each post will represent 5 minutes of battle. But each post must have the battle front (for example fourth reich is attacking ellelt thru belarus...it would be called the Belarussian front.) and the actual battle name...the nearest city. (example the battle of Leningrad)

Also so Nobody gets confused, Volgagrad will be called Stalingrad...or at least thats what Serpovia told me in his email to me a few minutes ago...and the Capital of Ellelt is New Stalingrad which is Moscow in RL.

As for tanks jets ect...provide me the info, Fuhrer, on the types of equipment you will be using, and I will research the Soviet stuff myself. Anyone else who will use any other type of must send me the information about what they are using.

Also before I have a bunch of people with their panties in a bunch...I allowed Modern technology...that is technology that it is reasonable that many militaries would have as of the RL year 2000.

Check the First Post for the edits.

Elelt, it'll be even easier than that. I'll post by tomorrow evening, and you can tell me what you think about it.

Yeah, I know, but you aren't the only person I'll be fighting. I've pissed a few people off.

You can say that again.

I would like to get involved. My government is officially neutral (though they may not stay that way), but an Errikan owned company is providing mercenary services. I will probably hold Norway.

EDIT: Just incase you are running pop numbers and money, the Errikan Empire currently consists of Errikland, Errikan Arterus, Errikan Nordenland, and Errikan Africa. Our protectorates are Rachkldom and Youlando, though Youlando ceased to exist a while back and they have not yet restored it (they are pissed): for tribute, I take half of the budget of Youlando and one third of the budget of Rachkldom. I can also draft as much of their populations into military forces as I see fit for an extended period of time. Weapson, an Errikan company who is involved in this, is thoroughly involved in many other nations as well, and draws money from them as well, making their money impossible for me to track.

Alright, then may I have a nation called the Scandinavian Union due to their relatively small populations in each?

Just take Denmark or finland.

Yeah, I know, but you aren't the only person I'll be fighting. I've pissed a few people off.

Thats not my problem. If you think that I'm sympathetic...you don't know me very well. Of Course all Your enemies are welcome to join my alliance.

OK so far we have:

Blackhelm Confederacy--Poland--Alliance?

British Londinium--UK--Ellelt and Allies

Canary Wharf--Saudi Arabian Conglomerate--Ellelt and Allies (if you are allied with my ally you are also my ally)

Pope Jackal I--Spain--Fourth Reich and Allies.

Thats not my problem. If you think that I'm sympathetic...you don't know me very well. Of Course all Your enemies are welcome to join my alliance.

That's what I am saying. Even if I defeat you, I still have a number of other enemies to deal with...all of whom are certainly going to be fighting on your side.

Blackhelm Confederacy--Poland--Alliance?

Again, I am pretty sure that they are allied with me. They are fellow fascists.

Just take Denmark or finland.Well, problem is that I do not want to rp a country with a population of less than 10 million.

Just take Denmark or finland.

You may take Denmark, Finland, Sweden or all three...I believe Norway is taken though now...I will update the list again sortly.

Oh and Fourth Reich...dont be in such a Hurry...the war doesnt start until 22 November 2006 at 00.00 hours EST (GMT -5) so we have a total of six more days to hammer everything out.

Well, problem is that I do not want to rp a country with a population of less than 10 million.
the populations used will be the NS countries you are. we wont be using the real figures except for unclaimed neutrals.

That's what I am saying. Even if I defeat you, I still have a number of other enemies to deal with...all of whom are certainly going to be fighting on your side.



Again, I am pretty sure that they are allied with me. They are fellow fascists.

Blackhelm Confederacy will have to say that themselves, fellow fascist or not. In the RL WW2, which is primarily where i got the insparation for GPW as that was the Soviet name for WW2, Spain was fascist but neutral. Im not going to consider anyone your ally unless they say so.

The latest list.

Blackhelm Confederacy--Poland--?

British Londinium--UK--Ellelt et al

Canary Wharf--Saudi Arabia conglomerate--Ellelt et al

Pope Jackal I--Spain--Fourth Reich et al

Errikland--Norway--Neutral (for now)

Alright, then may I have control of Finland then?

latest list

blackhelm confed.--poland--?

Brit. Londinium--UK--Ellelt et al

Canary Wharf--Saudi Arabia--Ellelt et al

Pope Jackal--Spain--Fourth Reich et al

Errickland--Norway--?

The Scandinavians--Finland--?

Can I join as Israel?

yes of course...What alliance? Im far to lazy right now to retype all the lists out again...and to be honest far to medicated at he moment (i have the flu right now).

I'll remain neutral for now.

Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg (BeNeLux). With Ellelt and Allies.

Cheers.

Although it wasn't in the list, I'd like to join as Italy, remaining neutral for now.

Although it wasn't in the list, I'd like to join as Italy, remaining neutral for now.


That oversight has been corrected.

The current List:

Blackhelfm Confed--Poland--?

Brit. Londinium--UK--Ellelt et al

Chanary Wharf--Saudi Arabian Conglomerate--Ellelt et al

Pope Jackal I--Spain--Fourth Reich et al

Errickand--Norway--Currently Neutral

The Scandinavians--Finland--?

Nor Nuin Gilath--Israel--Currently Neutral

Terror Incognita--Benelux--Ellelt et al

Altunaland--Italy--Currently Neutral

Ellelt, here is a taste of the rules or whatever I am formulating. Tell me how this looks so far. I am trying to be as realistic as possible.

I. Basic Formula For Calculating Damage:


Hits = [[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / (a + f)] / s] (Round to the nearest thousand)

Casualties = [Hits/ (d*h*s*m)] (Round to the nearest thousand)

(r= rate of fire for all units in either the attacking party)
(e= explosiveness per hit of all units in either the attacking party)
(d= distance value—A word on distance values. 1) If two different groups in an attacking party have different distance values, then their damage must be calculated separately. 2) If the distance to a target exceeds the maximum distance of an attacking or defending party, then that party may not attack until that party moves in closer to the target. 3) A unit at point blank range (one fourth or less of its maximum firing distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 1. A unit at short range (more than one fourth but less than one half) of its maximum firing distance shall be considered to have a distance value of 2. A unit at mid range (more than one half but less than three fourths of its maximum firing distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 3. A unit at long range (more than 3 fourths but equal to or less than its maximum distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 3.)
(h= average of all health values of all units for either the attacking party— a word on health values. 1) An unharmed unit is considered to have a health unit of 1. An injured unit is considered to have a health unit of 2. 2) If two different groups in an attacking party have different health values, then their damage must be calculated separately.)
(m=movement value of the attacking party. If the attacking party is standing still, then the movement value shall be considered 1. If the attacking party is in motion, the movement value shall be considered 2.)
(a= armor values of the defending party)
(f=fortification value of the defending party)
(s=skill value of the attacking party—a word on skill values. 1) if skill values differ between units, then the damage must be calculated separately. 2) Professional soldiers are said to have a skill value of 1. Mercenaries and reserve soldiers are said to have a skill value of 1.5. SWAT police officers are said to have a skill value of 2. Ordinary police officers are said to have a skill value of 2.5. Conscripts are said to have a skill value of 3. Country bumpkins are said to have a skill value of 20.)

I dont know how you expect that to work. I have worked and re worked propblem after problem using the formulas you have provided with small numbers, large numbers etc. And I keep ending up with decimals.

How does one hit .66 soldiers? for that matter what is a .66 soldier?

I like the effort you put into this...but quite frankly its unworkable. Mostly because there is too much division.


The Current rules stand unless you can come up with a better substitute which this formula clearly is not.

r= rate of fire for all units in either the attacking party)
(e= explosiveness per hit of all units in either the attacking party)
(d= distance value—A word on distance values. 1) If two different groups in an attacking party have different distance values, then their damage must be calculated separately. 2) If the distance to a target exceeds the maximum distance of an attacking or defending party, then that party may not attack until that party moves in closer to the target. 3) A unit at point blank range (one fourth or less of its maximum firing distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 1. A unit at short range (more than one fourth but less than one half) of its maximum firing distance shall be considered to have a distance value of 2. A unit at mid range (more than one half but less than three fourths of its maximum firing distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 3. A unit at long range (more than 3 fourths but equal to or less than its maximum distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 3.)
(h= average of all health values of all units for either the attacking party— a word on health values. 1) An unharmed unit is considered to have a health unit of 1. An injured unit is considered to have a health unit of 2. 2) If two different groups in an attacking party have different health values, then their damage must be calculated separately.)
(m=movement value of the attacking party. If the attacking party is standing still, then the movement value shall be considered 1. If the attacking party is in motion, the movement value shall be considered 2.)
(a= armor values of the defending party)
(f=fortification value of the defending party)
(s=skill value of the attacking party—a word on skill values. 1) if skill values differ between units, then the damage must be calculated separately. 2) Professional soldiers are said to have a skill value of 1. Mercenaries and reserve soldiers are said to have a skill value of 1.5. SWAT police officers are said to have a skill value of 2. Ordinary police officers are said to have a skill value of 2.5. Conscripts are said to have a skill value of 3. Country bumpkins are said to have a skill value of 20.)

I like that part...give me a few minutes and perhaps i can come up with a suitable formula. The thing is realism is necessary but I dont want the maths so complicated it takes half an hour to calculate losses...

for this reason most rpgs use as many whole numbers (as opposed to decimals) as possible. Also, one must take into consderation moral, the main reason why the defense bonus for defending on the homeland soil is so high. People will do things to save their homes and families that they just wouldnt do on foreign soil. Also note that there is a similar attack bonus for attacking on the homeland soil...who would know more about where, and how to attack on a certain peice of real estate than those who live there?

Those bonuses will stay in...but the division has to go...just far too much of it.

How does one hit .66 soldiers? for that matter what is a .66 soldier?


Round to the nearest thousand. Besides, everything is divided into legions of 1000 men. So look at it like this...

1000 proffessional soldiers standing still with assault rifles attack a legion of 250 tanks in open field at a range of 5000 yards.

Hits = [[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / (a + f)] / s] (Round to the nearest thousand)

[[[(1000*1)/(3*1*1)] / 5]/1]]

That comes out to ~100 men. Round that down to 0 hits. No damage. See?

Perhaps your army is organized that way...others might not be. the best solution is this

Hits
[[(r*e)/d] / [(a+f)/s]] *number of units=hits

Example: You are attacking my t-34's with panzers using panzers at point blank range. and both of us are standing still.

[[(10*2)/1] / [(3+1)/1]]*100=500 hits total.

Casualties
[[(d*h*s*m) + (a+m)]*number of units] / hits = casualties

Example 2: same battle

[[(1*1*1*1) + (3+4)]*100]/500

which would be simplified as 700/500 equalling a total of 140 casualties on my side. because 7/5 is 1.4.

Of course at point blank ranges will be rare...plus there should be bonuses for certarin things...for examble firing uphill and hitting the target is more difficult than firing downhill for example.

Hits
[[(r*e)/d] / [(a+f)/s]] *number of units=hits

The problem with your formula is that a lack of skill actually increases damages. That ain't cool.

Look, just hear me out on this one.

[[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / (a + f)] / s]

r*e= that is the maximum damage that can be done with a particular weapon.

d*h*m. Those are factors unrelated to the skill of the individual that could otherwise detract from his ability to get perfect damage.

a+f. Those are factors unrelated to either the skill of the individual or the environment, but nonetheless pose a natural obstacle to damage.

Though, not that I think of it...The better formula would be

[[[(r*e) / (d*h*m)] / s] / (a + f)

IE, the formula takes the maximum damage that can be done...and then reduces it based on variable factors.

The reason you got .66 is most likely because you were only taking into a coule a few soldiers. Even then, it makes perfect sense.

[[[(8*1) / (4 * 2 * 2)] /1] / 1

Ie, one professional soldier who is far away, injured, and moving) firing a hand gun at a group of unarmored soldiers...it makes perfect sense that he would probably only have a 1/32 (.5 hits out of 16) chance of hitting something.

However, if you put that in terms of groups of a thousand...that comes up to 500 hits, just enough to round up to a thousand.

Anyway, it'll make a lot more sense when you see the entire text.

I read the entire text.

and as i have said i used large number and small numbers...the only conclusion i can come up with is you dont know how to do any fucking math.

when you use the / to represent devision in essence you are making it a fraction for example 4 divided by 2 (4/2) would come out to 2 when you simplify the fraction.

And you have far too many brackets in the formula, these formulas need to be as simple as possible...so even an idiot can do them. your complex rigamaroar is absolute rubbish.

Not that im supprized by that.

My example was using point blank range formulas...in battle point blank ranges are rare. so coming up with a realistic out come at the most extreme level means that my formula not only is simplier but makes more sense.

further more you place too much stock in skill. Having served in the USMC I can tell you it requires very little skill to shoot anything. Point in the general direction of the enemy and lay down lead. Why do you think that assault rifles are designed with automatic or simiautomatic mechanisms? because at most its the sheer number of bullets in the air that determine the outcome. Skill plays very little part in it excepting maybe snipering and special forces.

I read the entire text.

You couldn't have read the entire text because I haven't finished typing it, gosh dammit.

well when you finish it make sure to use the enter key once and a while...it makes things easier to read and hurry up about it.

THE FULL TEXT.

UNITS AND BATTLE

I. Basic Formula For Calculating Damage:

Hits = [[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / s] / (a + f)] (Round to the nearest thousand.)

Casualties = [Hits/ (d*h*s*m)] (Round to the nearest hundred)

Non casualty hits are considered injured. If a legion is declared injured twice, then that legion is considered dead. Legions do not heal. If a legion takes casualties, then it continues to be one legion, but with a reduced number of people.

(r= rate of fire for all units in the attacking party)
(e= explosiveness value of all units in the attacking party)
(d= distance value—A word on distance values. 1) If two different groups in an attacking party have different distance values, then their damage must be calculated separately. 2) If the distance to a target exceeds the maximum distance of an attacking or defending party, then that party may not attack until that party moves in closer to the target. 3) A unit at point blank range (one fourth or less of its maximum firing distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 1. A unit at short range (more than one fourth but less than one half) of its maximum firing distance shall be considered to have a distance value of 2. A unit at mid range (more than one half but less than three fourths of its maximum firing distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 3. A unit at long range (more than 3 fourths but equal to or less than its maximum distance) shall be considered to have a distance value of 3.)
(h= average of all health values of all units for the attacking party— a word on health values. 1) An unharmed unit is considered to have a health unit of 1. An injured unit is considered to have a health unit of 2. 2) If two different groups in an attacking party have different health values, then their damage must be calculated separately.)
(m=movement value of the attacking party. If the attacking party is standing still, then the movement value shall be considered 1. If the attacking party is in motion, the movement value shall be considered 2.)
(a= armor values of the defending party)
(f=fortification value of the defending party)
(s=skill value of the attacking party—a word on skill values. 1) if skill values differ between units, then the damage must be calculated separately. 2) Professional soldiers are said to have a skill value of 1. Mercenaries and reserve soldiers are said to have a skill value of 1.5. SWAT police officers are said to have a skill value of 2. Ordinary police officers are said to have a skill value of 2.5. Conscripts are said to have a skill value of 3. Country bumpkins are said to have a skill value of 20.)

II. How To Calculate Soldier numbers by Class:

(Round all final totals [of fighting men] up to the nearest thousand)

Professional Soldiers: Calculate professional soldiers by multiplying your nation’s population (at the start of the war) by .02 (for a total, including logistics), and then by .1 (to get a total number of fighting men).

Reserve Soldiers: Calculate reserve soldiers by multiplying your nation’s population (at the start of the war) by .3 (for a total, including logistics), and then by .1, rounding up to the nearest thousand (to get a total number of fighting men).

Mercenaries: A neutral nation may calculate the maximum number of mercenaries it may send by multiplying its total population times .1 (For a total including logistics), and then by .1, rounding up to the nearest thousand (to get total number of fighting men).

Conscripts: Calculate conscripted soldiers by multiplying your nation’s population (at the start of the war) by .5 (for a total, including logistics), and then by .1, rounding up to the nearest thousand (to get a total number of fighting men). Conscripts can only account for foot soldiers.

SWAT Police Officers: Calculate SWAT Police Officers by multiplying your nation’s population (at the start of the war) by .1 (for a total, including logistics), and then by .5, rounding up to the nearest thousand (to get a total number of fighting men). SWAT Police Officers cannot fight outside of the homeland. SWAT Police Officers can only use small arms and rifles.

Ordinary Police Officers: Calculate Ordinary Police Officers by multiplying your nation’s population (at the start of the war) by .4 (For a total, including logistics), and then by .5, rounding up to the nearest thousand (to get a total number of fighting men). Ordinary Police Officers cannot fight outside of the homeland. Ordinary Police Officers can only use small arms.

Country Bumpkins: Calculate the number of country bumpkins/rednecks (whatever you want to call them) by multiplying your nation’s population by your nation’s unemployment rate (For a total, including “logistics” *cough* Ma and Betty Sue *cough*), and then by .5, rounding up to the nearest thousand (for a total number of fighting men *cough* Pa and lil Johnny *cough*). Country bumpkins can fight only inside of the homeland, and only outside of major cities. (They don’t mix well with them city slickers.) Country Bumpkins can only use shotguns.

III. Weapons for Foot Soldiers*:


*(1) All foot soldiers have a daily movement of 10 miles per day, or 30 yards per minute during battle. 2) Foot Soldiers should be divided into legions of 1000, each legion possessing the same sort of weapon. For example: 10 legions of hand gunners, 2 legions of grenadiers, etc. 3) All foot soldiers have an armor value of 1.)

Small Arms:

Name/ Rounds per minute/ Explosiveness/ Maximum Range

Handgun / 8 / 1 / 110 yards
Shotgun /6 / 3 / 30 yards

Rifles:

Assault Rifle / 30 / 1 / 500 yards
Sniper Rifle /4 / 2/ 1000 yards
Carbine / 8 / 1 / 750 yards

Explosives (Explosives cannot be fired at point blank range):

Mortars / 2 / 10 / 200 yards
RPG Launchers /1 / 30 / 150 yards
Grenades /5 / 8 / 50 yards

IV. Land Borne Mobile Weaponry*:

*(1) Land borne mobile weaponry speeds shall be classified as either fast, moderate, or slow. A speed of fast shall be classified as a daily speed of 600 miles, or 1750 yards per minute. A speed of moderate shall be classified as a daily speed of 400 miles, or 1100 yards per minute. A speed of slow shall be classified as a daily speed of 10 miles, or 30 yards per minute. 2) Once a group of men is classified as being in a Land Born Mobile Weapon, they cannot be unclassified as being in one. 3) When a Land Born Mobile Weapon is destroyed, all men inside are also destroyed. 5) Land Born Mobile Weapons should be grouped into legions of 1000 men operating land born mobile weaponry— for example: 250 tanks or 200 Hummers. 5) To calculate the maximum number of soldiers that can be committed to land born weaponry, multiply the total number of non logistic reserves and professional soldiers by the percentage of funds dedicated to national defense, then multiply that by .5 (rounded up to the nearest thousand).

LBMW /Rounds per Minute / Explosiveness / Speed /Maximum Range / Men / Armor

Tank* / 4 / 20 / Medium 8400 Yards/ 4 / 5
*(Tanks cannot fire at point blank range)
Hummer / 50 / 2 / Medium 1000 Yards/ 5 / 3
Artillery* / 1 / 100 / Slow / 12000 Yards / 10 / 3
*(Artillery cannot fire at point blank range)
Rocket Artillery*/ 5 / 30 / Slow / 12000 Yards / 20 / 2
*(Rocket artillery cannot fire at point blank range)
Rocket Cycle / 1 / 30 / Fast / 150 Yards 2 / 1
Gun Cycle / 30 / 1 / Fast / 150 Yards / 2 / 1

V. Sea Borne Mobile Weaponry*:

*(1) Sea borne mobile weaponry travels at a speed of 480 miles per day, or 580 yards per minute. 2) Sea borne mobile weaponry shall be considered to have an armor of 10. 2) Once a group of men is classified as being in a Sea Born Mobile Weapon, they cannot be unclassified as being in one. 3) When a Sea Born Mobile Weapon is destroyed, all men inside are also destroyed. 4) Sea Born Mobile Weapons should be grouped into fleets of 1000 men operating sea born mobile weaponry, like with Land Born Mobile Weaponry. 6) To calculate the maximum number of soldiers that can be committed to air born weaponry, multiply the total number of non logistic reserves and professional soldiers by the percentage of funds dedicated to national defense, then multiply that by .25 (rounded up to the nearest thousand).

SBMW / Rounds per Minute /Explosiveness /Maximum Range / Men

Submarine* / 2 / 50/ 1800 Yards / 25
*(Submarines cannot be fired upon except by destroyers and other subs.)
Battleships / 10 / 20 / 8400 Yards/100
Destroyers / 5 / 30/ 1800 Yards / 50
Aircraft Carrier* /0 / 0 / 0 / 100
*(Aircraft Carriers can hold up to 10 aircraft each)
Amphibious Assault Ships*
*(Amphibious Assault Ships shall be considered part of the logistical force, and each ship can hold up to 1,000 men. They cannot attack.)

VI. Air Borne Mobile Weaponry*:

*(1) Air borne mobile weaponry travels at a speed of either F (fast) SF (Super Fast), or RFF (Really Freaking Fast). Fast shall be considered to be a speed of 1500 miles per day, or 2.5 miles per minute. A speed of Super Fast shall be considered a speed of 1500 miles per day, or 5 miles per minute. A speed of Really Freaking Fast shall be considered a speed of 1500 miles per day, or 10 miles per minute. 2) Air borne mobile weaponry shall be considered to have an armor of 3. 2) Once a group of men is classified as being in an Air Born Mobile Weapon, they cannot be unclassified as being in one. 3) When an Air Born Mobile Weapon is destroyed, all men inside are also destroyed. 4) Air Born Mobile Weapons should be grouped into fleets of 1000 men operating sea born mobile weaponry, like with Land Born Mobile Weaponry. 6) To calculate the maximum number of soldiers that can be committed to air born weaponry, multiply the total number of non logistic reserves and professional soldiers by the percentage of funds dedicated to national defense, then multiply that by .25 (rounded up to the nearest thousand).

ABMW / Rounds per Minute / Explosiveness /Maximum Range/ Speed / Men

Jet Fighter / 5 / 30 / 1 mile / RFF / 1
Bomber* /20 / 20 / 5 miles / SF / 5
*(Bombers can attack only once per battle. Bombers cannot attack air units.)
Attack Helicopter/60 / 1 / 500 yards / F/ 3

VII. ORDER OF COMBAT

Each post (during combat) shall count as 1 minute of battle. The order of battle is as follows:

I. Defending Fighters may elect to attack incoming aircraft.
II. If a non city is being attacked, a defending legion may elect to take refuge in bunkers.
III. If a city is being attacked, anti aircraft automatically fire at oncoming bombers. Damage shall be based on the skill level of the defending soldiers. A defending force that is predominately Conscripts shall destroy 1 percent of the attacking air force. A defending force that is predominately Ordinary Police Officers shall destroy 2 percent of the attacking air force. A defending force predominately of SWAT Police Officers shall destroy 3 percent of the attacking air force. A defending force predominately of mercenaries/reserves shall destroy 4 percent of the attacking air force. A defending force predominately of professional soldiers shall destroy 5 percent of the attacking air force.
IV. If a city is being attacked, defending Forces may elect to choose the number of forces (in increments of 1000) to hide in skyscrapers.
V. Defending forces select target legions. Defending forces move/fire. Defending forces calculate damage.
VI. Attacking forces R.P. the damage from the defending force’s attack, if any. Attacking forces select target legions. Attacking forces move and fire. Attacking forces calculate damage.
VII. Defending forces RP the damage from the previous attack, if any.
VII. Repeat steps IV through VI until the battle ends.

VIII: Fortifications

When a city is attacked, the defending player may opt for any number of legions to take refuge in skyscrapers. For the rest of combat, those legions cannot move. They can only fire and die. In that case, the units of those legions gain a fortification value of 3.

When a non city is attacked, the defending player may opt for one legion to take refuge in barracks. For the rest of combat, that legion cannot move. They can only fire and die. In that case, the units of that legion gain a fortification value of 5.

I'm with the Nazi

I'm with the Nazi

:D

I would make my own formula for this, but I would make it so complex only I could do it because I am to lazy to explain it.

We will represent the CA as well, and also support the Reich. We will take Iraq.

Okay latest list:

Blackhelm--poland--Reich

Brit. Londinium--UK--Ellelt

Canary Wharf--Saudia Arabia Con.--Ellelt

Errikland--Norway--currently neutral

The Scandinavians--Finland--currently neutral

Nor Nuin Gilath--Israel--currently neutral

Terror Incognita--Benelux--Ellelt

Altunaland--Italy--Currently neutral

Beiraq--Iraq--Reich

Once again...the formula is the same. Apparently you havent ran thru the math suffecent times to notice that it is unworkable. Reguardless of the size of the units you still have large amounts of decimals...infact the whole thing runs into decimals due to the mechanics of division.:rolleyes:

Further you are using Imperiral mesurments units. These must be converted into metric. No modern army uses the Imperial mesurment standard, indeed hasnt since the end of the WW2. And to be quite frank...I dont want to have to convert shit into miles just to make you happy, because Fuhrer, your happyness matters very little to me.

Further, I have printed up the document and will be running through it with a fine tooth comb. Meaning theres going to be changes.

I agree it will be wise to use metric as it makes more sense and adds more realism to the rp, though I now the conversion crap I just have taight myself that a meter is roughly four inches large then a yard. This though can cause quite a few wrong answers it does give you a workable idea of how big something is if you do not know what a meter is.

I would like to join this RPG, allying myself with Ellelt under Israel.

Sorry Comrade, but Israel is currently taken, you could however choose any other country you wish--provided it hasnt already been taken.

Europeans, Canadians, Mexicans, and everyone else can suck my United States of American fat one. Like, seriously, right here buddies:

<^>(-_-)<^>


We use standard.

That said, we should use miles, simply because it's easier to measure on a large scale. Miles are longer.

Besides, it doesn't effect the realism of the rp, because all RP discourse won't be taking place in the actual battle thread. So it's not like people are gonna be saying to each other "Move a foot that way" in the rp.

12 inches = 1 foot
3 feet= 1 yard
1760 yards = 1 mile

That said, I'll run some numbers through the formula and see what I get.

Hits = [[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / s] / (a + f)] (Round to the nearest thousand.)

Casualties = [Hits/ (d*h*s*m)] (Round to the nearest hundred)


Ok, let's presume that 1000 non moving healthy reserve RPG (Rocket Propelled Grenade) infantry fire at a legion of 250 tanks at medium range.

[[[(1000*30) / ( 3 * 1 *1)] / 1.5] / 5]

[[[30000/3] /1.5] /5]

I get 1333.3333 etc. However, because I specifically said in the formula to ROUND TO THE NEAREST THOUSAND, I get...

~1000 hits.

A maximum of 1000 hits / (3*1*1.5*1)

OMG! Then I get...222.222 etc. However, because I specifically said in the formula to ROUND TO THE NEAREST HUNDRED, I get...

~200.

So the damage is a maximum of 1000 injuries, 200 of which result in death.

Holy shizer! 50 tanks remain in the legion, all of which are damaged.

Likewise, if you'll compare that to...

10,000 injured rednecks running up to and firing their shotguns at a legion of 100 heavy artillery, at point blank range..

Hits = [[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / s] / (a + f)] (Round to the nearest thousand.)

Casualties = [Hits/ (d*h*s*m)] (Round to the nearest hundred)


[(60,000 * 3) / (1 * 2 * 2)] / 20] / 3]

OMG! I get 750! Round to the nearest thousand...

~1000

Casualties = [1000/ (1*2*20*2)]

12.5

Round to the nearest 100. NO CASUALTIES.

I am running the numbers, and I don't understand how you can say that these numbers aren't working.

super bump

OOC: bump?

Europeans, Canadians, Mexicans, and everyone else can suck my United States of American fat one. Like, seriously, right here buddies:

<^>(-_-)<^>


We use standard.

That said, we should use miles, simply because it's easier to measure on a large scale. Miles are longer.

Besides, it doesn't effect the realism of the rp, because all RP discourse won't be taking place in the actual battle thread. So it's not like people are gonna be saying to each other "Move a foot that way" in the rp.

12 inches = 1 foot
3 feet= 1 yard
1760 yards = 1 mile

That said, I'll run some numbers through the formula and see what I get.

Really fucking mature. The entire world uses metric execpt the US because its culturally backward. prime evidence is the nazi himself. And before anyone else gets their fucking panties in a bunch, I too am american and will say what i damned well please about my own RL country.

Hits = [[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / s] / (a + f)] (Round to the nearest thousand.)

Casualties = [Hits/ (d*h*s*m)] (Round to the nearest hundred)


Ok, let's presume that 1000 non moving healthy reserve RPG (Rocket Propelled Grenade) infantry fire at a legion of 250 tanks at medium range.

[[[(1000*30) / ( 3 * 1 *1)] / 1.5] / 5]

[[[30000/3] /1.5] /5]

I get 1333.3333 etc. However, because I specifically said in the formula to ROUND TO THE NEAREST THOUSAND, I get...

~1000 hits.

A maximum of 1000 hits / (3*1*1.5*1)

OMG! Then I get...222.222 etc. However, because I specifically said in the formula to ROUND TO THE NEAREST HUNDRED, I get...

~200.

So the damage is a maximum of 1000 injuries, 200 of which result in death.

Holy shizer! 50 tanks remain in the legion, all of which are damaged.

Likewise, if you'll compare that to...

10,000 injured rednecks running up to and firing their shotguns at a legion of 100 heavy artillery, at point blank range..

Hits = [[[(r*e) / (d *h*m)] / s] / (a + f)] (Round to the nearest thousand.)

Casualties = [Hits/ (d*h*s*m)] (Round to the nearest hundred)


[(60,000 * 3) / (1 * 2 * 2)] / 20] / 3]

OMG! I get 750! Round to the nearest thousand...

~1000

Casualties = [1000/ (1*2*20*2)]

12.5

Round to the nearest 100. NO CASUALTIES.

I am running the numbers, and I don't understand how you can say that these numbers aren't working.


Your numbers are not working because your formula is inherrently flawed. I told you that at least twice that I know of, probably more.

Seeing that this formula is unworkable...as I predicted, oh about 24 hours ago, I suggest the Fuhrer come up with either a better formula...that would be one that works...or we will go with my suggestion.

Furthermore, We shall be using the metric system...that is unless everyone wants to convert before hand all the information that they have on their military hardware. I have been researching and purchasing for the past couple of days and everyone uses metrics. Now why would they do that? Because you have to be less than stupid to fuck them up!

I Give the Fuhrer 24 hours to come up with a workable formula or we will use my formula whether he likes it or not. Im getting really tired of his immaturity and am starting to get an itchy launch sequence finger.

Further more upon reading his text, the majority of which is usuable, I have a problem of his designation of the country bumpkins...etc. It seems he completly discounted the possiblity of them being trained rapidly into a guerilla force...much like the Vietcong. But then again...I expected that. I will be working out an acceptable solution to the possilbity of training irregular forces--one that should make the Elletian Victory even more interesting.

Also I dont believe the nuclear option has been fully covered either.

My thinking is that a nuke blast would basicly destroy all life withing a 5Km radius of ground zero. Thereby being able to eleminate cities, farms, armys whatever, and as we all know they must land eventually.

something to consider.

Your numbers are not working because your formula is inherrently flawed. I told you that at least twice that I know of, probably more.

Show that they are flawed. You keep claiming that they use decimals. Not after you round. Either show that they are flawed, or shut the fuck up.

Furthermore, We shall be using the metric system...that is unless everyone wants to convert before hand all the information that they have on their military hardware. I have been researching and purchasing for the past couple of days and everyone uses metrics. Now why would they do that? Because you have to be less than stupid to fuck them up!

You are an American. I am American. We know standard. We'll fucking use standard. It's the American way, gosh dammit. Besides, there's no conversions necessary. All of the "military hardware" has been given a standard measurement.

Further more upon reading his text, the majority of which is usuable, I have a problem of his designation of the country bumpkins...etc. It seems he completly discounted the possiblity of them being trained rapidly into a guerilla force...much like the Vietcong.

It doesn't discount the idea of them being trained rapidly. It does discount the idea that they could be adequetly armed, or adequetly funded. I put a full 10 percent of the population being full military, another 5 percent as being a police force. Expecting anything good over that point is just ridiculous.

That said, if you don't like my formula and my text, then I dare you to come up with something that includes as wide a range of variables as does mine. Otherwise, you need to shut the fuck up.

If you do come up with something equally good, we'll put it to a vote.

Also I dont believe the nuclear option has been fully covered either.

My thinking is that a nuke blast would basicly destroy all life withing a 5Km radius of ground zero. Thereby being able to eleminate cities, farms, armys whatever, and as we all know they must land eventually.

something to consider.

We aren't using nukes. A) Nukes are often used against civilians and non military casualties. We aren't going into the effects of civilian casualties on gameplay. B) They don't fit inside of our time contraints. C) They're just really, really cheap, and unbalance gameplay. D) They require a system of defense to counter them, which, frankly, doesn't fit in with the other game mechanics.

Show that they are flawed. You keep claiming that they use decimals. Not after you round. Either show that they are flawed, or shut the fuck up.



You are an American. I am American. We know standard. We'll fucking use standard. Besides, there's no conversions necessary. All of the "military hardware" has been given a standard measurement.



It doesn't discount the idea of them being trained rapidly. It does discount the idea that they could be adequetly armed, or adequetly funded. I put a full 10 percent of the population being full military, another 5 percent as being a police force. Expecting anything good over that point is just ridiculous.

That said, if you don't like my formula and my text, then I dare you to come up with something that includes as wide a range of variables as does mine. Otherwise, you need to shut the fuck up.

If you do come up with something equally good, we'll put it to a vote.


Fuhrer, I already have, twice. back read the thread. Also when one does the formulas correctly, that would be by following the mathmatical order of 0pperations--a theorem that should have been taught to you had you more than a fourth grade education you could plainly recognize. My formula, which I posted a few days ago is in there, and your main complaint about it was "It doesnt take into account the skill of the soliders...boo-hoo-hoo".

As I explained before...casualties are caused by the amount of lead in the air, not the individual skill of each soldier. Never has been. It might take into consideration the moral of soldiers...but thats something thats not exactly calcuable.

As for standards, I can see that you have not visited any of the storefronts in this very forum which sell military hardware. Each one of them uses the metric system. Therefore it is only logical that the international standard would be also metric.

As for the training of guerilla forces you seem to neglect the fact that Vietnam utterly defeated the united states during that war using guerilla forces. Good or not, they are effective and pose a major obsticle to any would be invader.

I suggest you stop skewing the rules, conventions, and formulas used in this RP towards your own advantage. Quite Frankly its getting annoying and im quit ready to drop an IGNORE Bomb on Berlin just so I dont have to deal with you anymore.

Metric makes far more sense than Imperial for calculations. That's why it's the unit used internationally (even in the USA) for scientific work.
Best thing is to run in metric, then convert to Imperial units if you find that easier.
Take an example. Might not be a good one, but...
The weight of 200 infantrymen with full kit.
Weight of a man is in stone, or maybe pounds. Weight of his kit is in pounds. Carrying capacity of transportation will be in tons, or possibly hundredweight.
Conversion factors between those are messy.
Whereas in metric....weight of a man: kilograms. Weight of his kit: kilograms. Carrying capacity of transportation: kilograms.
See why it makes sense?
Even if the specific example is irrelevant, the ease of calculation holds true for all situations. Factors of ten are easy. Factors of 16, 12, 1760, etc, are not so easy.

We aren't using nukes. A) Nukes are often used against civilians and non military casualties. We aren't going into the effects of civilian casualties on gameplay. B) They don't fit inside of our time contraints. C) They're just really, really cheap, and unbalance gameplay. D) They require a system of defense to counter them, which, frankly, doesn't fit in with the other game mechanics.

Time Constraints? We have all the time in the world to have this war. Ellelt will defeat you, we dont care how long it takes, neither do we care how much real estate we have to sacrifice and then liberate in the process.

As for your complaints...One, Since when did fascists care about civilian causalties? Never has stoped anyone from using a weapon, radiological, biological etc before...if those are your beliefs take that shit to the UN...thats what its there for. Two, They dont fit into "our time constraints" Correction...they dont fit into your time constraints.

Three...No actually nuclear weapons are not cheap, I should know having already purchased a few. Do they unballance game play? Yes of course, everything unbalances gameplay...troop numbers, weaponry, skill, moral, the rules...in short everything. That argument should be sufficently dead by now.

Finally, They dont fit with the game mechanics. NO, right now they do not, which is why I brought up the issue...actually in the intrests of being fair...truth is I have enough of a nuclear arsenal already...that I could turn Europe into glass without a second thought. I actually was trying to be fair by working them into the mechanics of the game...but "allowed" or not they shall be a part of it.

It also should be noted that In a previous post i stated that i drew insperation from WW2, However that this is not a replay of WW2 by any means. Make a note of that.

Now if you have any further complaints that are not totally juvanile, I would like to hear them.

Very well then. YOU come up with a better system.

The hits formula:

[(r*e)/d]/[(a+f)/s]*Number of units=number of hits (that is shots fired)

Casualties:

(d*h*s*m)/hits

Function: Using the casualties and hits formulas determines the percentage of the units destroied per round of battle all decimals will be rounded to the nearest whole number any decimal that does not reach a whole number shall be considered as injuring. All injured units would be considered to have 1/2 combat effectiveness.

Example: Tank battle at point blank range between panzers and T-34 (most extreme example), T-34 attacking: 100 panzer and 100 t-34 each.

[(5*2)/1]/[(3+1)/1]*100= 500 "hits"

Casualties:
[(1*1*1*1)/500= .002

actual casualties .002*100 = .2 meaning that for that first round of battle (that is 5 minutes) a total of 0 panzer destroied.

leaving:

100 t-34
and
99 panzer at 100% combat effectiveness, one injured.

The hits formula:

[(r*e)/d]/[(a+f)/s]*Number of units=number of hits (that is shots fired)

That formula doesn't work. Lack of skill increases the damage done. Fix that problem.

I was going to side with the Reich, but two things have popped-up.

1) I have no idea what's going on. This, surely, is the most complicated RP I have ever seen that doesn't involve dice, cards and a small plastic representation of Napoleonic Armies.
2) As one of those 'fucking europeans' that use the incredibly sensible, useful and univerally-accepted METRIC SYSTEM, I am somewhat loathe to defend someone who pours so much bile upon it.

I was going to side with the Reich, but two things have popped-up.

1) I have no idea what's going on. This, surely, is the most complicated RP I have ever seen that doesn't involve dice, cards and a small plastic representation of Napoleonic Armies.
2) As one of those 'fucking europeans' that use the incredibly sensible, useful and univerally-accepted METRIC SYSTEM, I am somewhat loathe to defend someone who pours so much bile upon it.

Actually, one of the main problems is with the Fourth Reich itself, The Fuhrer insists on having a mathematical formula for computation that involves skill. I think I have fixed the problem by inverting the skill formula....country bumbkin being one professional soldier being 20. A rather simple fix really.

Also, I dont know why you would want to support someone of his caliber. He is nothing more than a spoiled little boy who wanted to start a war over a debate in the UN over a proposal.

True I did say his proposal was an utter waste of the UN's time as did many other representives but i have after analizing their positions come to the conclusion that one---His attacking me is partly ideological, and two--I am the only very active UN participant that has a nation with less than 50 million people in it.

As for the actual start of this war...The fourth Reich's air forces invaded Elleltian airspace, after requesting him to remove his forces from my air space he launched a nuclear divice at my south-eastern frontiers which hit my Ally Serpovia some 75 KM inside their boarders Thus causeing a state of war to be in effect.

I have already warned him many times to keep a civil tounge in his head otherwise I will drop a IGNORE Bomb on Berlin...and there will be no war for him to lose.

Alexander I. Serpov
General Secretary of the Communist Party of Ellelt
President of the Council of Ministers of Ellelt.

The Fiefdom has a proud history of supporting unattractive and plain insane regimes, though they have always been unattractive, insane and CIVIL regimes. A line, therefore, might have to be drawn under this case. That is, however, unless suitable waxing of the Dear Leader's ego takes place.

The Fiefdom has a proud history of supporting unattractive and plain insane regimes, though they have always been unattractive, insane and CIVIL regimes. A line, therefore, might have to be drawn under this case. That is, however, unless suitable waxing of the Dear Leader's ego takes place.

My Dear Brother Uncle Noel,

Let me be first to apologize for my bretherens apopletic behavior. His enthusiasm seems to get the best of him sometimes. I attribute this to the extreme ideological and theological differences between the Fourth Reich and the Communist Heathens of Ellelt who seek the utter subjugation of the human race.

Rest assured your support of the Fourth Reich and its allies would be greatly appreciated, and suitable compensation will be presented.

Your Brother in Christ,

Pope Jackal I

I just noticed this - doesn't 80% for logistics seem like a bit much? If someone has invested in efficient logistical systems, this can go down to a very low value, but even just regular good organization should be more like 50-75%.
Just saying.

Really fucking mature. The entire world uses metric execpt the US because its culturally backward. prime evidence is the nazi himself. And before anyone else gets their fucking panties in a bunch, I too am american and will say what i damned well please about my own RL country.

While I agree that the way that he said it is immature and unproductive, I must point out that your response was needlessly abrasive. Also, I resent the "culturally backward" comment (though I do not dispute your right to say it), and I believe that the lack of conversion to the metric system has a lot to do with the difficulties of full conversion dramatically outweighing how much it really matters.

Errikland:

We can appreciate your views, and yes perhaps i was abrasive, but that is after being subjugated to gross stupidity concerning the issue. Infact the whole cause of the war...Except for me defending myself...is stupid. It is over a resolution to repeal the Fair Sentencing Act passed by the UN of which I have a Mission to, as does the Reich.

He invaded my territory upon my informing him that his repeal proposal would fall flat which it has. It not getting the required amount of delegate support to bring it into legislative queue *that would be 6% of UN regional delegates have to support a proposal* it has subsiquently been removed.

Quite frankly, the people of Ellelt have no issue with anyone else here, we do not want war with you as we have nothing against you and would prefer to keep ourselves in the UN fourm as we find this style of RP less to our liking.

However, that does not mean that we will not defend ourselves if we are attacked or our sovereign territory encroached upon.

My Brothers of the Holy Empire of Errikland,

As a relatively new nation I cannot speak to the initial skirmish between the Fourth Reich and the Communist Ellelts, which brought forth this war.

However, I wish to bring to your attention the inherent hypocrisy presented in Ellelt's comminque to your government:

"Quite frankly, the people of Ellelt have no issue with anyone else here, we do not want war with you as we have nothing against you and would prefer to keep ourselves in the UN fourm as we find this style of RP less to our liking." - Ellelt

I find this statement to be in striking contrast with Ellelt's published profile:

Interests:
Bribing Un Officials, crushing capitalists, and in general being a minice to all opponents of the proletariat

As you can see, the Ellelt nation is not being honest about its true intentions. Their philosophy and their modus operandi is to destroy any nation which does not comport with its communistic utopian dream. Given the chance, the communist heathens would destroy your nation and enslave your people, destroy your religion and your modes of production.

I urge you in brotherly friendship to reject Ellelt's overtures of false friendship.

Your Brother in Christ,

Pope Jackal I

My apologies to anyone I have offended here. Very well, we'll use metric. Instead of having to edit all of that crap, we'll just presume that where it says "yards" it now says "meters" and where it says "miles" we'll presume it says Kilometers.

Will that work?

Secondly, How about this formula instead?

Hits: [(r*e*s) / [(d*h*m*a*f)]] Round to the nearest thousand.
Casualties: [Hits*1/6s] Round to the nearest hundred.



And we'll just change the skill values.

Professionals:6
Mercenaries/Reserves:5
SWAT:4
Regular Police:3
Conscripts:2
Rednecks=1

How does that work?

My Dear Brother Uncle Noel,

Let me be first to apologize for my bretherens apopletic behavior. His enthusiasm seems to get the best of him sometimes. I attribute this to the extreme ideological and theological differences between the Fourth Reich and the Communist Heathens of Ellelt who seek the utter subjugation of the human race.

Rest assured your support of the Fourth Reich and its allies would be greatly appreciated, and suitable compensation will be presented.

Your Brother in Christ,

Pope Jackal I

Your Holiness,

Your kind words appease our tempered spirit. We would like to help though, alas, we still have little or no idea what's going on.

As reward for your actions and humility, however, the ruling party has decreed that you shall be recognised as the legitimate Catholic Patriarch within the Fiefdom and we await your appointed Bishops and Archbishop.

Yours fraternally,

Uncle Noel

My apologies to anyone I have offended here. Very well, we'll use metric. Instead of having to edit all of that crap, we'll just presume that where it says "yards" it now says "meters" and where it says "miles" we'll presume it says Kilometers.

Will that work?

Secondly, How about this formula instead?

Hits: [(r*e*s) / [(d*h*m*a*f)]] Round to the nearest thousand.
Casualties: [Hits*1/6s] Round to the nearest hundred.



And we'll just change the skill values.

Professionals:6
Mercenaries/Reserves:5
SWAT:4
Regular Police:3
Conscripts:2
Rednecks=1

How does that work?


The Casualties formula will need to be reworked. You are assuming that every bullet fired will hit something of value and that to be quite frank is unreasonable. Sure every bullet fired is going to hit something...maybe a tree, or the ground or a person or a rock.

The armor and fortification values should be worked into the casualties formula as well, I am sure that you wont be sending infantry out in a tee-shirt Fuhrer and quite frankly I wont be either...I just spent a couple billion rubles on Kevlar vests, and we fully intend to use them.

Also note that the date of the begining of the war has been pushed back by one week due to the consumption of this week in debating casualty formulas.

The war will begin on 28 November 2006, If I dont drop an Ignore bomb on Berlin.

Your Holiness,

Your kind words appease our tempered spirit. We would like to help though, alas, we still have little or no idea what's going on.

As reward for your actions and humility, however, the ruling party has decreed that you shall be recognised as the legitimate Catholic Patriarch within the Fiefdom and we await your appointed Bishops and Archbishop.

Yours fraternally,

Uncle Noel

My Most Venerable Uncle Noel,

It is with a most humble and contrite heart that I accept the position as the Vicar of Christ for the peoples of the Serene Democratic Fiefdom of Uncle Noel. The Prefect for the Congregation of Bishops, Cardinal Francis Xavier, with my approval, will be sending to you the following shepereds for your flock:

Archbishop Fulton Sheen

Bishop Pio of Pietrelcina

Bishop John Bosco

Bishop Thomas Aquinas

These men of faith and piety will be instrumental in guiding our people to the true faith of Christ through his earthly instituted church: The One True Holy Roman Catholic Church.

As your shepered, I will strive to always be a beacon for you and the people. May the Almighty God grant us Peace and Tranquility during these turbulent times.

In Nominie Patris Et Fili Et Spiritus Sancti. Amen.

British Londinium would like to change its alliance status to neutral.

May I take Poland on the 4th Holy Reich's side?

No, poland has already been claimed by Blackhelm Confederacy also allied with the fourth reich.

Ah, I have just recently been enlightened. I would like to claim the Slovakia/Hungary/Romania/Moldova territory, if that is alright.

Moldova is considered part of the Ukraine so it belongs to me, but yes, you may have Czechoslovakia (both are joined as they were in 1989, per the factbook) Hungary, and Romaina.

Errikland:

We can appreciate your views, and yes perhaps i was abrasive, but that is after being subjugated to gross stupidity concerning the issue. Infact the whole cause of the war...Except for me defending myself...is stupid. It is over a resolution to repeal the Fair Sentencing Act passed by the UN of which I have a Mission to, as does the Reich.

He invaded my territory upon my informing him that his repeal proposal would fall flat which it has. It not getting the required amount of delegate support to bring it into legislative queue *that would be 6% of UN regional delegates have to support a proposal* it has subsiquently been removed.

Quite frankly, the people of Ellelt have no issue with anyone else here, we do not want war with you as we have nothing against you and would prefer to keep ourselves in the UN fourm as we find this style of RP less to our liking.

However, that does not mean that we will not defend ourselves if we are attacked or our sovereign territory encroached upon.

OOC: I understand your point of view, I myself can strike in such a manner when facing frustratingly idiodic and abrasive manners, I merely suggest that you think a little more about it first in order to avoid such overcompensation.

I do not care about the UN issues. Know, however, that I would never begin an IC war for OOC issues. It is bad form.

My Brothers of the Holy Empire of Errikland,

As a relatively new nation I cannot speak to the initial skirmish between the Fourth Reich and the Communist Ellelts, which brought forth this war.

However, I wish to bring to your attention the inherent hypocrisy presented in Ellelt's comminque to your government:

"Quite frankly, the people of Ellelt have no issue with anyone else here, we do not want war with you as we have nothing against you and would prefer to keep ourselves in the UN fourm as we find this style of RP less to our liking." - Ellelt

I find this statement to be in striking contrast with Ellelt's published profile:

Interests:
Bribing Un Officials, crushing capitalists, and in general being a minice to all opponents of the proletariat

As you can see, the Ellelt nation is not being honest about its true intentions. Their philosophy and their modus operandi is to destroy any nation which does not comport with its communistic utopian dream. Given the chance, the communist heathens would destroy your nation and enslave your people, destroy your religion and your modes of production.

I urge you in brotherly friendship to reject Ellelt's overtures of false friendship.

Your Brother in Christ,

Pope Jackal I

SIC:
To: Our Christian Brother, Pope Jackal I
From: Emperor Christian I, Sovereign of the Errikan Empire

I thank you for your effort to warn us of possible deception, and assure you that the Errikan People are more than aware of the great dangers of Communism, that cancer upon humanity. We were previously unaware of their stance established in this "profile" and shall be cautious in the future.
Yet again, I thank you for your warning.

OOC: This might be redundant, but where's the official set of rules?

Moldova is considered part of the Ukraine so it belongs to me, but yes, you may have Czechoslovakia (both are joined as they were in 1989, per the factbook) Hungary, and Romaina.
Superb. And thank you.

OOC: I understand your point of view, I myself can strike in such a manner when facing frustratingly idiodic and abrasive manners, I merely suggest that you think a little more about it first in order to avoid such overcompensation.

I do not care about the UN issues. Know, however, that I would never begin an IC war for OOC issues. It is bad form.


Oh Im quite aware that it is bad form, however, my nation was attacked by Fourth Reich, I did not attack him. Naturally, I would be required to defend myself. But it seems that Fourth Reich either has tired of the trouble of having a proper RP war over such a silly issue, or simply cannot access the internet as much as is usually required to perform an RP war.

I mean to be quite honest...i have nothing to gain by this, nor is this what I like to do...I would rather spend my time debating international law and being left the fuck alone. I find all of this rather silly and childish myself, I mean you have never heard of RL nations going to war over a debate in the RL UN.

BTW, everything in this tread is considered OOC

You are absolutely right, Ellelt, how absolutely stupid of me. Here is my new suggestion, then:

Hits: [[(r*e*s) / [(d*h*m*a*f*(4/3)]]] Round to the nearest thousand.


The armor and fortification values should be worked into the casualties formula as well

The way I figured it is this: If a person is wearing armor, and the armor prevents the person from getting struck by a bullet, it doesn't work by turning the bullet from casual to less than casual. It just prevents the person from getting hit. However, if you insist, here is my new idea for a casualties formula:

Casualties=[(Hits*1/6s)/(a+f)] (Round to the nearest hundred)


My apologies for not posting sooner, I had merited a 5 day ban for cursing someone out in the general section.

Well then you shouldn't curse people out. If you cannot control yourself then its perhaps best that I just drop the IGNORE bomb on you and not involve myself in this silly war over a UN resolution that wouldn't get passed anyway.

We UN nations expect a bit of maturity when it comes to the writing of international law, and why you selected me out of the other possible candidates...I have neither the time nor the interest in finding out. I have my own theories anyway.

That is unless you can find a way to convince me that we do indeed need to fight this war....as it is I already know I can kick your ass all over the forum, and have nothing to prove by doing so.

My MIGs are waiting....

That is unless you can find a way to convince me that we do indeed need to fight this war....as it is I already know I can kick your ass all over the forum, and have nothing to prove by doing so.

Really? Then test out that hypothesis.

Oh Im quite aware that it is bad form, however, my nation was attacked by Fourth Reich, I did not attack him. Naturally, I would be required to defend myself. But it seems that Fourth Reich either has tired of the trouble of having a proper RP war over such a silly issue, or simply cannot access the internet as much as is usually required to perform an RP war.

I mean to be quite honest...i have nothing to gain by this, nor is this what I like to do...I would rather spend my time debating international law and being left the fuck alone. I find all of this rather silly and childish myself, I mean you have never heard of RL nations going to war over a debate in the RL UN.

BTW, everything in this tread is considered OOC

I am referring to the thing with metric vs. American units, not the war. Hell, if you wanted to conquer him for the sole purpose of gaining control of his resources I would not call it bad form (I'm an imperialist myself); defense of your territory is even more justifyable.

Really? Then test out that hypothesis.

I Have nothing to prove to you or anyone else really and I am tired of you already. Have fun not existing.

*orders the Elletian airforce to drop the ignore bombs*

Well now that he is gone....I suppose there wont be any war. So the thread is now considered Closed.

Errikland...we have no need for imperialism at this time. That may happen later but not now.

I Have nothing to prove to you or anyone else really and I am tired of you already. Have fun not existing.

*orders the Elletian airforce to drop the ignore bombs*

Well now that he is gone....I suppose there wont be any war. So the thread is now considered Closed.

Errikland...we have no need for imperialism at this time. That may happen later but not now.


Wow. How incredibly Noobish.