NationStates Jolt Archive

yes yes, so the main thread isn't entirely cluttered with crap.

Spizania: Where are you?

Hazah! Alright I'll add my little response to the attack. It won't be that bad because we're pretty much anti-air when it comes to defenses at the bases. Especially since Whyatica might actually be tricking our nation and working with Juumanistran. The fact that Whyatica has as of yet not been attacked even once by them makes this more likely.

Ok....

Yurka, I have not a clue what you were doing with your air defense. The ballistic missile went after Whyatica's ships, and the cruise missiles carried mines to dump in the ports.

Just as a further note, those mines would only detonate if triggered by a Whyatican vessel not by Yurkan, and I'll provide demining services once the conflict is done.

Well anything launching in the direction of Yurka's port is going to be targetted. We don't know any of that IC.

Well anything launching in the direction of Yurka's port is going to be targetted. We don't know any of that IC.

Right, but you aren't going to have any ships sunk or any such. Just missiles approaching and then missiles dropping into the water, and no apparent affect to anything. An IC diplomatic note asking "Just what in the hell happened?" would suffice for us giving you that knowledge ICly.

Well more or less we'd aggressively investigate whatever went into what we consider "our" territorial waters. If they start blowing up Whyatica of course we'd hold you responsible regardless.

My tracking ships in my fleet will find the mines, and go "What the fuck?" to Yurka before attempting to dock. Or, conversely, a tracking ship will move ahead of the fleet and hit a mine, and go "What the fuck?" to Yurka.

Anyway, if any of my ships blow up, I'll declare war on you.

My tracking ships in my fleet will find the mines, and go "What the fuck?" to Yurka before attempting to dock. Or, conversely, a tracking ship will move ahead of the fleet and hit a mine, and go "What the fuck?" to Yurka.

Anyway, if any of my ships blow up, I'll declare war on you.

Assuming any of your ships make it to port of course. You've still got those 2000 anti-ship ALBMs directed at your transports to deal with, plus whatever other attacks may be made by me or anyone else.

Remember to state exactly how many combat naval units you have deployed by the way. For future reference.

I would've, but had to run off to class at the end of that. I'll post how many smaller combatants are in that sometime later.

As always, my posting time is limited, so assume my fleet is on the way (with transports and all, of course. <_<)

Oh, and *tag*.

Tag

Im here, i only noticed this ooc thread just now

Spiz, a few things.

The ships sam batteries blazed, rendering the missile strike impotent, the gunfire bounced off the carriers armour plating, apparently Kriegzimmer designed carriers really were tough.

"All secondary batteries target those escorts, give them everything we have!" yelled the Admiral as the deck pitched beneth him.

"All batteries opening fire!"
"Target all 25" Guns on the enemy superdreads, fire at will!"
"All main batteries opening fire!"
The combined firepower of two SDs, two SD-hunters and 7 DNs primary armaments roared as they hurled shells into the sides of the enemy SDs, while across the fleet hundreds of 5" RF batteries hurled tonnes of shells into the enemy escorts.

The 18" Guns of the Lance Class Cruisers and the Atlantis Battlecruisers opened up, dozens of guns hurling shells into the enemy aircraft carriers.
Attack boats skittered out of the way of the larger ships as they turned to present as many guns as possible to the enemy vessels.

Six Roma Class Battleships turned out of line and began closing with the enemy fleet, 20" Cannon blazing as they searched out unengaged enemy capital ships.
Three Atlantis class BCNs that had thier weapons removed and replaced with more ASHUM guns, armour and bigger engines, slashed out of formation and accelerated at the enemy SDs at speeds normally only attainable by the attack boats.

Thousands of aircraft took off from the fleets carriers, loaded down to do battle with the enemy.

The battle for the Whyatican Convoy had begun.

Even if the carrier decks somehow survived the impact from a rail slug or ETC shell (which both travel at extremely fast velocities), the tarmac would be damaged so that aircraft would not be to take off or land on the deck without major hazard. Secondly, your SAM batteries are not that damn effective. No missile defense is perfect, and one capable of shooting down over 4,000 missiles is pure godmod, especially with the size of your fleet. Lastly, there is no way in hell you'll be able to concentrate all your fire when your spread out several hundred kilometers, especially with traditional naval cannons.

The new colonial leader sat back and shrugged as he saw the HM government's message, finding it rather unbelievable that they could say such a thing after Yurka's colony was not only attacked by those rogue Whyatican insurgents, but bombarded from Juumanistran's soil itself! Of course they would publically make such a thing apparent to them through live, public broadcasts of the incident from captures taking from numerous satellites. If they still fought though, the colony would simply have to defend herself against yet another aggressor.

Yurka, relatively simple question:

What. The. Hell.

Where, precisely, did I give any indication that I was attacking you? Or, for that matter, there was any strike on Yurkan soil that could be blamed on me? Because I'm not seeing either: Juuman aerial elements are war-gaming in southern Juumanistran Skiberdeenia, but they're doing so around the southern Juuman settlements and over the flat southern sea plain and straits: No where near the border. You probably wouldn't even notice a thing, unless you were actively watching them.

Furthermore, I think you're giving spy sats too much credit. The fundamental problem with orbital surveillance is the fact that spy satellites are, as a rule, generally not in geosynchronus orbit. Thus, you can't just park one over an area and watch it. Secondly, it generates incredibly large amounts of useless information, so if you're looking for something in-particular without anything to give you a focus, you're going to be looking for a needle in a haystack. The are two reasons I was able to obtain the intelligence I did with regards to the Whyatica's air strike: Firstly, airborne and space-based RADAR assets, which had been previously mentioned, provided a point of origin for the flight. Because a point-of-origin was provided, it was fairly easy to go back and find the high-altitude and space-based, more the former than the latter, surveillance for the region and time period in question. Some food for thought.

Oh, and Yurka, for the love of God, the name of the nation is Juumanistra. Juumanistran refers to something or someone who is from Juumanistra. Not vice-versa.

This is the same plane Yurka and I use, but my planes are modified to be VTOL to fit better on my carriers. I have no idea how Yurka modded them.

User: Novacom Military Services
Unit Cost: 48 Million Novons
Unit type: Mass Production Multi Role Fighter
First Deployment: Battle of Divango, Tuesday September 11th 2001, Destiny Squadron
Height: 4 Meters
Length: 18 Meters
Span: 9 Meters
Weight: 20,809 KG
Engines: NMAJEDP-882/A Quad "Vaikus" Hyperfan engines, each deliver 20,000 lb of thrust, has Supercruising Capacity as well as advanced thrust vectoring (With Minor Modifications this can become VTOL)
Maximum Speed: Mach 7.3
Armament: 16 Hardpoints, 4 Internal, 12 External Capable of Utilizing any rocket, missile, bomb or any other type of armament in current production, capable of carrying in excess of 27,000 KG

Available for Export

The Vanguard Virage is the final stage of the Virage Fighter Jet Project, the Virage is a deadly design that is more than capable of swiftly destroying any enemy, be they on land sea or airborne, Capable of switching armament with ease as well as capable of being modified for any mission role at speed the Virage Fighter Jet is a deadly battlefield contender, boasting quad Vaikus Hyperfan Engines the Virage is capable of providing great speeds for very little fuel, with a range that many other similar jets from other nations envy the Virage is quiet often dubbed as the ghost, as it being completely invisible to radar quite often swoops in to deliver ordinance with remarkable accuracy, despite heavy electronic jamming.

The Virage is a highly durable craft and the Technicians friend, Pilots often pick up operation of this design early on and fast learn to take it to it's maximum potential, with a Virage no maneuver is out of it's reach no matter how daring, Pilots often refer to it as if there were no craft, merely them flying when asked to describe handling. The Virage had as one of it's design criteria the ability to mount any weapon of any type from any nation, a criteria which was fulfilled with ease, making the Virage a popular candidate for export.

Boasting advanced avionics the Virage is quite often the deadliest contender in the skies, often outmaneuvering even the Vaunted F-22 Raptor, even when piloted by a green pilot the Virage does not fail to impress. The Virage's firepower has been dubbed by many as sheer overkill, with the almost disgusting amount of weaponry it can capture coupled with it's nigh on un-detectibility the Virage has often been employed as a quick strike weapon for maximum effect.

The Virage was retired from Novacom Military service several years ago, however though such was the effectiveness of the design that the Military still continues to maintain several squadrons and Novacom Manufacturing has been astutely on the lookout for new customers which they can sell this powerful aircraft to and further build the Virage's reputation as lethal to an extreme.

Whyatica: No. Just no. There is no way in hell you're going to get that airframe, with that mass, up to Mach 7.3 with an engnie that has moving parts(WTF is a "hyperfan"?). To say nothing of the wonkiness your payload relative to your engines. Or the price. Or, well, everything else.

I'm guessing that's Novacom's hyperfan is a bad attempt to b.s. something that's better than the turbofan, even though it produces less thrust per engine than turbofans today.

Where, precisely, did I give any indication that I was attacking you? Or, for that matter, there was any strike on Yurkan soil that could be blamed on me? Because I'm not seeing either: Juuman aerial elements are war-gaming in southern Juumanistran Skiberdeenia, but they're doing so around the southern Juuman settlements and over the flat southern sea plain and straits: No where near the border. You probably wouldn't even notice a thing, unless you were actively watching them.

Alright. The Macabees launched an attack from behind your borders, to which nobody has claimed responsibility(And since its pretty easy to spot them going back from the way they came, I can pretty much surmise where they headed, and set up radar to look for them. I've had IC weeks to pinpoint exactly what happened on satellites). We've made some simple demands soon after it, stating what had happened, we received no response. The statement was public, so almost everyone would have seen it. Anything the Macabees does while in Juumanistra's colony, is being done by Juumanistra, the fact that we weren't sure who originally did the initial bombardment only supports this. Though after this next attack by the Macabees it would be impossible to not tell where its coming from as it darts across my entire nation and numerous orange dots... I mean troop deployments.

Which brings me to...

[OOC: Actually, it makes it easier, since the aircraft will mask my aircraft from your radar at even greater altitudes, and it will make it easier for my aircraft to engage yours if they try to scramble into the air. And realitically, you never knew it was me in the first place. In fact, with that aerial attack originating from Whyatica, for all you know it might have been the 'rogue air squadron'. And how do you pay for such a large air force and such a large army? All of this in your colonies, of all things.]


Yes. But once you start taking out any of my planes it will just mean releasing as many aircraft as possible to stamp them out. I have them all ready, and before you say I don't have that much in the way of soldiers, not that I have at most two million soldiers in Yurka's colony. As for the planes, I would like to point out that Juumanistra far surpasses me in aircraft numbers and artillery, as he'd gladly tell you. I can afford to have all of those aircraft there, due to the fact that my military budget is around 30 Trillion USD, and the fact that I'm undergoing Youth Patrol training.

I won't go into the Youth Patrol. But they're a group of young men and women aged 13-14 all the way up to 21. I've counted them when I did the military count. So one quarter of every single soldier there are essentially children who were there for war games. Nobody in my entire colony had any idea what was going on. The Youth Patrol War Games happen once every three to four years. Which is why nobody expects that we would go to war during the exercises, as anyone in the Youth Patrol is basically still in school and other stuff.


As for the Novacon Fighters, I didn't really look into them. But if they're wank I can easily augment them to something else and slap a Yurkan Label on them. I'll just mod them to more believable levels and just give them two flight modes or something if I need to.

I'll make a suitable response once I figure out exactly how far you could get in before you fired at the first patrol plane and dozens immediately went onto the offensive. We were expecting something like that ever since the first attack happened, as has been mentioned. The typical Yurka Colonial Citizen views Juumanistra as a warmongerer, along with the military. So its not as if something would be a huge surprise with all thats happened over the last few posts.

Only stumbled onto this by accident, and the engines are not wank, a Hyperfan is a type of Turbofan that has very little friction between the working parts, and as such reduces friction and increases fuel efficiency and speed, of course it has it's own disadvantages meaning some manoeverues are dangerous for green pilots to undertake and of course the engine does need to be inspected fairly well for any signs of wear and tear.

It's a Concept I ran into a fair while back, the name is just that, a name, you could call an apple anything you want it's still an apple.

Yes. But once you start taking out any of my planes it will just mean releasing as many aircraft as possible to stamp them out. I have them all ready, and before you say I don't have that much in the way of soldiers, not that I have at most two million soldiers in Yurka's colony.

You say that as if it was only 2 million troops. I have...what..60,000? And even should your aircraft be ready, it still means you have to scramble your men to the aircraft, and then you have to scramble your aircraft in the air. That could take as much as thirty minutes. In fact, the more planes you put in the air, the more time it will take. In fact, with the numbers you claim I wouldn't be suprised if it took hours - or else your radar control is going to be really confused. Even then, this is assuming that you saw my aircraft on radar, while being masked by the mountains.


As for the planes, I would like to point out that Juumanistra far surpasses me in aircraft numbers and artillery, as he'd gladly tell you. I can afford to have all of those aircraft there, due to the fact that my military budget is around 30 Trillion USD, and the fact that I'm undergoing Youth Patrol training.


Yea, but you have them all in your colonies, and not only that, but you manage to have a major navy in your colonies and a large military. Most of Juum's military are the badly trained home guards, which are largely unmechanized.


I won't go into the Youth Patrol. But they're a group of young men and women aged 13-14 all the way up to 21. I've counted them when I did the military count. So one quarter of every single soldier there are essentially children who were there for war games. Nobody in my entire colony had any idea what was going on. The Youth Patrol War Games happen once every three to four years. Which is why nobody expects that we would go to war during the exercises, as anyone in the Youth Patrol is basically still in school and other stuff.


Good, then I can assume that they are badly trained, had bad moral, and will be easy to sweep aside with highly trained mechanized forces, despite their numerical disadvantage.

Only stumbled onto this by accident, and the engines are not wank, a Hyperfan is a type of Turbofan that has very little friction between the working parts, and as such reduces friction and increases fuel efficiency and speed, of course it has it's own disadvantages meaning some manoeverues are dangerous for green pilots to undertake and of course the engine does need to be inspected fairly well for any signs of wear and tear.

It's a Concept I ran into a fair while back, the name is just that, a name, you could call an apple anything you want it's still an apple.

The Hyperfan is actually a step up from a turbojet. Hyperfans carry their own oxygen supply, and so are inherently inferior to a Turbofan. The problem was that since the air wasn't compressed during ignition the turbojet would get bad pulse rates [1:6]. The idea would be to carry its own oxygen supply, which is already condensed. What the turbofan does is that it has two compressors and it compresses the air, so it's air breathing, meaning it's lighter and can make up the weight with more fuel - it also has better pulse ratio [11:1 to 20:1]. The hyperfan would actually get less velocity than a turbofan, and less thrust for more fuel consumption - since it's non air breathing, however, it can be used in the upper atmosphere.

There aren't many air fields near the mountains. At most you would wipe out a few dozen planes from those fields before being swarmed a few kilometers past the mountains.

The 500,000 Youth Patrol members were all moved inward to take care of logistics, mainly moving equipment and prepping everything for battle.

Yes. But once you start taking out any of my planes it will just mean releasing as many aircraft as possible to stamp them out. I have them all ready, and before you say I don't have that much in the way of soldiers, not that I have at most two million soldiers in Yurka's colony. As for the planes, I would like to point out that Juumanistra far surpasses me in aircraft numbers and artillery, as he'd gladly tell you. I can afford to have all of those aircraft there, due to the fact that my military budget is around 30 Trillion USD, and the fact that I'm undergoing Youth Patrol training.

A few points:

1) As Mac pointed out, half of my forces are Skiberdeenian Home Guardsmen. While I'd say that they're not poorly trained by contemporary RL standards, they certainly aren't up to snuff as far as the regular Army is concerned and they aren't armed nearly as well as their regular Army counterparts.

2) While I probably do have more artillery than you, Whyatica, Banduria, and Xeraph have combined in theater, you're grossly mistaken on the aircraft. While the Juumanistran Air Force does maintain a very, very sizable active duty force, it only has the 3,348 aircraft in theater that I had previously detailed in the my OoB. That is going to change, in light of your spontenously finding two new airfleets and in resposne to the massive aerial contingents sent by Banduria and Xeraph.

3) I'm assuming you're using Thirdgeek for your military calculator. That puts your defense spending at $38tn out of a GDP of $88tn. Would you kindly explain to me how you even have a functional economy when you're spending 40% of everything your nation produces on defense? Quite simply, you shouldn't have a functioning economy, or much of an economy at all: I'm curious as to how you manage to have one.

There aren't many air fields near the mountains. At most you would wipe out a few dozen planes from those fields before being swarmed a few kilometers past the mountains.


Well, the idea would be to use the mountains to mask my approach, and given, yes, my missiles wouldn't have the range they normally would, I would still be able to target some fifty kilometers outside the mountains. But now that I know your terrain it's pretty much a worthless attack anyways. Do you have a topographical map so that we don't run into this problem again? Or at least, a description on how your colony is.

OOC: Macabees if you'd like to delete our posts on Project JACKHAMMER since you didn't have the complete topography yet that'd be alright with me. You can always come up with some other strategy after you see the landscape..

A few points:

1) As Mac pointed out, half of my forces are Skiberdeenian Home Guardsmen. While I'd say that they're not poorly trained by contemporary RL standards, they certainly aren't up to snuff as far as the regular Army is concerned and they aren't armed nearly as well as their regular Army counterparts.

2) While I probably do have more artillery than you, Whyatica, Banduria, and Xeraph have combined in theater, you're grossly mistaken on the aircraft. While the Juumanistran Air Force does maintain a very, very sizable active duty force, it only has the 3,348 aircraft in theater that I had previously detailed in the my OoB. That is going to change, in light of your spontenously finding two new airfleets and in resposne to the massive aerial contingents sent by Banduria and Xeraph.

3) I'm assuming you're using Thirdgeek for your military calculator. That puts your defense spending at $38tn out of a GDP of $88tn. Would you kindly explain to me how you even have a functional economy when you're spending 40% of everything your nation produces on defense? Quite simply, you shouldn't have a functioning economy, or much of an economy at all: I'm curious as to how you manage to have one.


1) Most of my forces are simple soldiers, while most of the defense is made up of those who work in the Law and Order faction. IE: Police officers. If I feel so inclined they could technically act as defensive soldiers, seeing as even they are funded better than most military powers.

2) I don't mind if it changes. But we're an "Empire". I doubt I'll ever field half of them at once, though it would take hours to do so at least, would put a large amount of strain on my military budget. What with all the fuel being wasted. At most I'll send small groups of a hundred or so to defend myself every now and then, or an entire aerial fleet to deal with naval targets if it could pour into my nation. Its all about defending myself, I doubt the population would complain about the burden on them. After all, they're the ones being attacked.

3) Honestly, Macabees himself has 39% into his defence budget. Its not that uncommon on NationStates. Gotta keep the crackpot dictatorships from taking advantage of us, and if we can get something off of them. Its actually $40,392,658,304,184.42 now anyways, 43%. Hell, Law and Order takes up another 34%, and Education takes out the next largest chunk at 12%. Thats the Imperial State's needs at this point.

What do you consider a functioning Economy? We're iron-fist consumerists. Everything the population makes goes back into the nation through mandatory consumerism. Thats the meaning of the term, so in a way its anything but functioning, especially with the tax rate at 100%.



So yeah, in conclusion we're an Empire with a heavy empasis on our military and police forces... Not uncommon in NationStates though. We fund our enormous military, but most of it is still at home in the Empire of Yurka for defense, or in the current Czardaian conflict, though we'll probably move them to this theater since it seems to be cooling down and we haven't sustained any significant losses. Not to mention the fact that our coast was just irradiated, which can only be a small look at whats to come.

Yurka, thirdgeek is ok for calculating GDP and (maybe) overall government budget, but spending 40% of your GDP on something completely non-productive in economic terms (ie. an army) will lead to your economy spiralling into the ground. Thirdgeek lets you come up with stupid numbers like that because thirdgeek is inherently unrealistic and was programmed by a mere moral NS player. Considering your GDP, you shouldn't have too bad a military, but 9000 planes in a colonial war? Errr... no.

Yea, I appreciate it. I'll delete it and re-write one later.

Actually, since I didn't really go into the ground war all that much, leave that portion there. For my air attack, meh, if goes awry, it goes awry - respond as you will. I don't want to re-write it since Juum already launched his offensive as well. I'll take it as it comes.

Yurka, thirdgeek is ok for calculating GDP and (maybe) overall government budget, but spending 40% of your GDP on something completely non-productive in economic terms (ie. an army) will lead to your economy spiralling into the ground. Thirdgeek lets you come up with stupid numbers like that because thirdgeek is inherently unrealistic and was programmed by a mere moral NS player. Considering your GDP, you shouldn't have too bad a military, but 9000 planes in a colonial war? Errr... no.

Well sure, a military isn't productive if you're a democracy. Though I use mine to get things done, along with engineering and other such things. Why should the main goal of any nation simply to be rich economically? We're rich economically, though most goes into Defense, Law and Order, and Education. The mainstays of a productive life, especially since everyone pays 100% income tax in the form of buying everything.

Though the defence budget it a bit warped, its how it came out, and I justify it by making my military more "multi-purpose" in their societal role. I'll probably take all of the %s and move them around at some point to make things less insane though. But Yurka was attacked by nuclear weapons before. Wars are attracted to where Yurka winds up going anyway.

I suppose 9000 planes are a bit much for a mere colony the size of Texas, but then again they were all shipped for Youth Patrol training. However I doubt 500,000 Youth Patrol members would ever need that many aircraft. I'll downgrade it to three air fleets, which would make 5400 combat aircraft in Yurka's colony. My naval force from Czardas will more or less use my current ports to dock and reload now that I need their assistance with the Juumanistran blatant attacks.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y21/Kutulmak/YurkaColony.gif

Theres the topography map. I think it speaks for itself, but the brown is mountainous, and the darker brown is even MORE mountainous, in such a way that it would be nearly impossible to move move vehicles over it. Note that the where the mountains don't meet with Juumanistra, Juumanistra told me there are mountains there as well, along the entire border. Theres alot of hidden surveillance equipment around that area, along with small groups of soldiers in bunkers.

Here are a few points about the Colonial Power of Preta...


The four cities shown contain 94% of the entire population, not counting the soldiers which are stationed all over since the Youth Patrol's war games were interrupted. The rest of the population live in small hamlets which are only there to watch over our fields. There are 90 Million civilians living throughout the colony. Of these 30% are first class citizens, 65% are Second Class, and the remaining 5% are unregistered or homeless.


The main purpose of the Preta Colony is to produce food for the Empire. Thus, almost all arable non-mountainous terrain has been converted to massive amounts of farmland, and nearly all large forests have been completely deforested to make room. They also grow Chemical Dyne Incorporated(See factbook)'s crops and have numerous research centers to manufacture the drugs which are spread throughout the Empire. Almost everything is connected by rails, both above and underground, sometimes both on the same line.


Noble House Preta has control over the colony. Every city is nuclear powered, though contains large backup generators beneath the ground. Likewise the nuclear reactor's cores are also underground to protect them, though strategic attacks can still strike at them.


The Western Mountains contain upwards of 40,000 well armed infantry and scouts, which will probably be leaving in droves every night after the initial bombardments. Their original purpose was to prevent foreigners from entering the company. The rest are near the port or North Western City.


Every Citizen is microchipped to keep track of them. Those who are not microchipped are arrested for not being registered. Due to this practice there are very few immigrants in the colony from outside of Yurka.


As for the military, any person you run into will be decked out in body armour and have a gas mask and usually infrared goggles. Those who don't will usually be Youth Patrol members who are assisting at the cities.

The reason for the Gas Masks are due to an a lmost unheard of tank outside of Yurka, the Banshee minitank. It probably won't see much use unless infantry begin to move forward towards the flatlands.

So you have no roads in the tallest mountains?

There are no roads in the darker browns. They opt to go around them, or if we need to get by it we've build a subway tunnel underneath it. Theres none along the Western Border.

There are no roads in the darker browns. They opt to go around them, or if we need to get by it we've build a subway tunnel underneath it. Theres none along the Western Border.

How do you go around them if the mountains expand from Whyatica's border to Truitt's border?

How do you go around them if the mountains expand from Whyatica's border to Truitt's border?

There are no mountains going from Truitt to Whyatica. The dark red is the default color Yurka was given. Thats the flatlands. Any roads we do have that need to go over the mountains go only along the lighter brown portions, or we simply have build subways or railroads through it.

Oh I see now. Ok, perfect.

hey everybody...

even though I haven't done much other than post the forces I was sending to the war, I have to drop out of this one. Some RL crap is demanding my attention ( Mom is in the hospital ) and between that and my job, I'm just not going to have time for an extended battle thread. So, see ya around.

See ya, sorry about your mom Xeraph.

Well sure, a military isn't productive if you're a democracy. Though I use mine to get things done, along with engineering and other such things.
A military is not productive. At all. If you use it for engineering projects then it isnt a military, is it? It's a state-run engineering firm with uniforms.

Why should the main goal of any nation simply to be rich economically?
I'm not syaing anything about your "main goal". Your main goal appears to be getting the most ridiculuously large military possible. The problem is that with 40% of your entire nation's production going into this non-productive military, your economy is going to be running a net loss. This means that next year, your GDP will be smaller. This means you will have less money in nominal terms for your military, but as you're still overspending massively as a proportion of your economy, your economy will still go down again the year after. Your economy will spiral extremely quickly into a black hole, you will lose the ability to pay your military and your people will starve. Your nation will collapse into anarchy as everyone mutinies and / or rebels and / or dies.

We're rich economically, though most goes into Defense, Law and Order, and Education.
All of these are non-productive. The latter can lead to greater production than otherwise, but only if these educated people are employed in a productive manner. Stuffing them into the military does not create wealth.

The mainstays of a productive life, especially since everyone pays 100% income tax in the form of buying everything.
...what? Buying things =/= income tax. 100% taxes mean that you are a Communist state. No one has any money to buy anything, because the state takes it all. The only way your people will even stay alive or have rooves over their heads is if the state gives those things to them. If (as your country is) spending virtually all of this money on employing absurd numbers of policemen and soldiers, they aren't going to get these things.

Though the defence budget it a bit warped, its how it came out,
Well this is your main problem. Calculators are inherently unrealistic. Use the calculator for stuff that your government cant directly control (like GDP, and GDPPC) but make up sane figures for tax rate, budget allocations, Etc. and dont expect to be able to say "the calculator did it" when people claim you're godmoding my using silly figures without RPing the consqeunces.

and I justify it by making my military more "multi-purpose" in their societal role.
Well doing this is ok, but as I said before if you have your military doing vital roles in society then it isnt really a military any more, only the bit that isnt doing something else is. The rest of it is just a bunch of factory workers or whatever in uniform.

I'll probably take all of the %s and move them around at some point to make things less insane though. But Yurka was attacked by nuclear weapons before. Wars are attracted to where Yurka winds up going anyway.
Doing that would be a good idea.

I suppose 9000 planes are a bit much for a mere colony the size of Texas, but then again they were all shipped for Youth Patrol training. However I doubt 500,000 Youth Patrol members would ever need that many aircraft. I'll downgrade it to three air fleets, which would make 5400 combat aircraft in Yurka's colony. My naval force from Czardas will more or less use my current ports to dock and reload now that I need their assistance with the Juumanistran blatant attacks.
5,400 is still absurd....


Ok, that post was longer than it was meant to be. But really this RP is not going to get anywhere if such fundamentals are at issue. It's extremely unfair to other members of the RP for one or two participants to use silly calculator outputs and economics that are just plain wrong to gain a massive advantage over all the others.

Spizania this is getting ridiculous now, I've been shooting at your carriers for an ungodly amount of time and you still take zero losses? I can understand a wrecked flight deck here and there, but zero sunk carriers is ridiculous.

5,400 is still absurd....

I'm back. How is it absurd when the DEMOCRACY I'm going up against has around that exact same amount in his own colony? I had the flu, but now that I'm here I can post.

@Questers: How exactly did you make it to that naval battle so quickly? I'd appreciate it if you didn't interfere, since you haven't posted moving any of your ships untill that point, so I doubt you would be able to get there in any reasonable amount of time. Not to mention you have no colonies in the area.

Why do you equate democracy to having a weak military? Historically democratic states have dominated the world.

Those carriers with damaged or destroyed flight decks are mission killed, they will not be launching fighters without a full overhaul in a grade one shipyard, i have 64 Aircraft Carriers, plus dozens of helicopter carriers, now dividing your fire evenly between them, you could go for hours and not sink a single carrier, if you want kills, concentrate your fire.

By my calculations, I have 11 ships firing at every 1 of your aircraft carriers. There is no way there are no sunk carriers as of yet.

I'm back. How is it absurd when the DEMOCRACY I'm going up against has around that exact same amount in his own colony? I had the flu, but now that I'm here I can post.

Hitler thought with the same mentallity. Little did he know that a Democracy across the sea produced up to a hundred times more than him.

Made a new little post in the main thread

Hitler thought with the same mentallity. Little did he know that a Democracy across the sea produced up to a hundred times more than him.
Of course, but more or less the US was much larger and richer than Germany.


Also on the whole 100% is communism, in some ways. A Compulsory Consumerist State is essentially one in which everything goes to the business which is the government. It would essentially be a government saying, "You must spend everything you make." Obviously it is the only realistic way that a nation with a 100% tax rate can have a private sector.

The definition came from one of the main sites on the different forms of government, so I more or less go by that. I keep shifting from that to a Corporate Police State. I find this means that Yurka is essentially a nation where Corporations and the economy are more important, followed by massive amounts of protection and military might. How else should a nation fund all that other than a 100% income tax rate?

I'm currently trying to get some more cash into other areas of the government, while maintaining Yurka's militaristic or police integrity. Need to keep that 0% crime rate and whatnot or else Yurka will just wind up as some type of Democratic lovefest or Communist freak state.

My main problem is that whenever something Corporate comes in I give them money without siding with people. I don't know why maternity leave should lower civil rights, since that essentially makes no sense. Its essentially stuff such as that which puts Yurka's Civil Rights at "Some" when they could probably be higher. Though its still better than a few "democracies" I've seen.


On a sidenote: Yurka is ranked 1st in the region and 608th in the world for Largest Gambling Industry.

Hazah!

Yurka, did you get my TG?

Yep. Most of my navy still at port will more or less be destroyed after Juumanistra's attack. There weren't enough there to count as a navy though. I'm sending an imperial fleet to clean up the "mess" thats out here though, along with moving my civilians forcefully if Truitt does not allow us to send them through that nation.

Hitler thought with the same mentallity. Little did he know that a Democracy across the sea produced up to a hundred times more than him.

Pwned.

<...>
As you siad yourself, the "business" is just the government, so you have no private sector. You wouldnt get any of the advantages of the free market, because you dont have a free market - the government owns and has an monopoly on everything, there is no venture capital and no innovation or new companies springing up. The silly military and police spending alone will destroy your economy, but combined with the statism you have a truely economically incompetent system there. You seem to have pretty scary personal political views (like thinking that democracies are evil and the state should spend vast proportions of peoples' money eliminating crime) that slant your entire way of thinking even when it flies in the face of all historical evidence (like democracies always being weak by definition).

Germany still stood up to Russia, the USA, and the allies on its own for an extremely long amount of time before it was defeated, taking out droves of allied soldiers in the process. Though by weak, we mean in the ability to protect their people, as has been shown in the past. Also, I factor in NS Historical Evidence.

Eh I should restate what I mean by the business of the Government. We make a profit off of the people, but Yurka still has a Private Sector, as has been mentioned. Its even called a "Power House", being the 608th most powerful gambling industry in NS. The business of the Government is essentially to run the government as a business. Economically I'm currently trying to raise my economic standing, even though Yurka does have some of the highest industries on NS, its not raking in as much as it should compared to the budget, even with 100% income tax.

"Large corporations tend to be above the law, and use their financial clout to gain ever-increasing government benefits at the expense of the poor and unemployed."

How could a communist state have Large Corporations such as that?

Yurka, both the British and Roman Empires (the biggest non-union empires in history) were democracies... (well OK, not always Roman)... neither of these were 'weak', per se.

<snip>
I reiterate - you have no companies. They have been taxed out of existance. Your NS page description contradicts itself like that because the NS description things are really inaccurate and generally pretty badly done.

Companies can do whatever they want. They are in many ways above the law according to the factbook. The 100% income tax won't override that, it can easily work around that. In anycase, to make things more sensible, and the fact that Yurka has always been against communism(when it affects us directly), I am currently lowering the tax rate.


And of course Questers, you mean the biggest non-union Empires in the history of the world. But if you look around nationstates many nations trump them, and they can hardly be called Democracies. Though the Romans did have a Caesar at many points.

Do I need to respond to anything?