NationStates Jolt Archive

In response to the awful pacts being made, such as the dictatorship, the anti Human Rights pact, it's time to step up to the plate, and rightfully defend belifes. 200 years ago A girl organized many and fought a battle in the name of certian beliefs. Beliefs that she hopped the world would follow. Many have many haven’t, but now it's time to step up the battle for democracy.

*Like a great deal of the other pacts I mentiond above, this is to seve the intrest of Democracies, either military, mutually, trade, and so on

*To promote and sustain Democracy in the world, left or right, center, mostly to partially, even moralistic any one who would stand up for the right to freedom

*You will not have to join any other alliances, (such as the U.N.) and you will not have to move to any region. (Unless you really want to)

*Denounce opression, support fundmental rights, be an outpost in your region.

*Allies are encouraged

*You can request help from us, if you are trying to become a stable democracy



So that's it for now, you can also read DEMOCRATIC THEORY BELLOW

DEMOCRATIC THEORY

First Written in 1801 by Yasashii Himura, Amended by the Order of the Hawk several times.

Through my early life I was taught by a great philosopher. A man bearing the name of the old ways of Ancient Rome, his name Julius C. Martin. Name from Julius Caesar, the ancient Emperor of Rome. He taught me how Rome was a glorious and free republic to an extent, I was taught the ways the nation was ruled, and I was taught the basic principals of Democracy. A real rarity in the world, today, as so many are Capitalist Dictator Ships, Monarchs, etc. From his teachings I have drafted my theories and principals of Democracy. So that one day, a nation, maybe mine, can go off of it, to form a Fee Nation that is made for and by the people. Regardless of Race, Gender, Religion, Ethnicity, and anything else that nation use to abridge the fundamental human rights.

FUNDAMENTALS:
Whereas all Humans and Non Humans (amended as of 1948) in a Democracy must be entitled to these basic and inalienable rights

Freedom of Belief, Religion and Conscience
Freedom from Death, Fear, Persecution
Freedom to chose, and represent for their Government
Right to be considered equally and fairly by the law
Freedom from Forced labor, and slavery

These are rights that I consider to be giving out on the basis of existence, not Government. Tyranny sees none. In Totalitarianism, you are ruled by fear, and the expectations of your Hire officials. Totalitarian states are ruled by greedy, power-hungry, selfish, and corrupted beings, with no sense of humanity. Who care nothing of the people around them, and only care for themselves. Why should any person have to be forced to adopt this belief, this idea, and this religion? Who does such things, selfish people.

Why some democracies fail:

No one said Democracy was perfect. The world is never flawless. Flaws are what make up our character. But some democracies have failed in the past for many reasons.

A. Too much representative
If only fat –cat senators in a Capitol can do anything with laws of the land, it is too easy for them to become corrupted. Bribery, extortion, many crimes are committed by selfish people. If the public gets more of a say in how things are done, then it becomes easier. While they may not always agree, in a democracy, not everyone gets their way. But people should get their way, once or twice in their life. Under the watchful eyes of the People, not just the rich, but the poor, the farmer, the merchant, the fishermen, all the people, can corruption remain un-spread. With a thousand voices speaking out, it becomes easier to know what the ideals of your people are, and going off of these, you can reach a compromise. Now of course this doesn’t mean one would have to resort to Full Direct Democracy, a representative can just as easily work. With a good combination of the two, it will work. Allow the people to speak, and at the same time, allow the government to guide them in the right direction

B. Ignorance and Apathy
Too many people are left with out a clue of who they are voting for really is. Vicious mudslinging on every side tarnishes the truth. People must be educated from early on, about their patriotic duty, and why they must vote. They must understand if they don’t want a bad Prime Minister, or bad senator, they must chose wisely, and be taught of all their campaigns.

C. Rival parties
While I don’t disapprove of any parties, if all they do is bicker and fight, and consider themselves sworn enemies, nothing gets done. Parties need to be taught when to debate, when to get alone, and when to just plain be friends, thus increasing compromise, and friendly relations. No party should be excluded from specialized councils, from the Parliament floor, from any debate.

D. Corrupted Governments
Those who rule a nation, should have a compassion for the people they rule, as well as the lands. They need be un cynical in nature, a person of the people, a person that has the intent to do good. Because Checks and Balances are often sloppy they don’t see growing threats. People can abuse office and power, they do it all the time. (Amendment added in 1944->) Capitalsim is a major cause of this, to many greedy corporations fund these political parties. If Business is always allowed to reign free than too much evil can come out. (<--Clause Stricken and revised, at the time many capitalist nations we’re enemies, and we’re blamed for supporting fascism) (Back to original context-->) Strong checks and balances are needed. These should be taken up by people who are pure of heart, and of mind. The Government should not lie to it’s public, accept in a true and needed common interest.



CAN DEMOCRACY SUCCEED? (ANNEX Added 1991)

Yes. At the Second World War their we’re only about 144 lonely democracies out there. Now there are twice as many. Kanami is one of these. Kanami hasn’t had major crises in the Government since its inception. Kanami has low poverty rates, crime rates, corruption rates, bribery, threats, and extortion. We are a shining example of successful democracy. Everyday people are speaking on the Parliament, and the people are cooperating in harmony. Of course we are still no social utopia. Disputes arise, disagreements turn ugly, and bad choices are made. But again, nothing is flawless.

OBLIGATIONS:

We should seek to end tyranny in the world. To give all people a chance to live in freedom and peace. Both domestically and internationally, I pledged to help anyone in need. A nation seeking to reform, a person seeking asylum because the do not have the right to believe what they believe. Because they saw an evil regime slaughter, force their loved ones to fight, killed them for the fun of it. This nation and these people should stand by. While of course you can be in your right to peacefully disagree. After all, their may be times we have to send our people off to war, to die. Not everyone will like this, and so be it. Now this doesn’t mean we walk into every dictatorship and topple it, because that simply won’t work. We have to go to a nation in the greatest need, and one that is ready to covert. A democracy should have friends and allies on both sides, even ones that aren’t as fully democracy as I would like. Weather they are rich nations, poor nations, if they see eye-to-eye on many things, why not? Trade, sustainable development, is vital in international politics. Maybe you can even reform a Government without force. Jumping on every band-wagon may seem like a good idea, but it is not always. Watch closely at the alliances you join, you may not like it.


ARTICLE V:
Dictatorships often claim they are peaceful, and that Democracies are the ones who bring violence, but if that is true, why is it, dictatorships march into a country and seize it by force. They claim to have equality, but they don’t. No one is equal under the law, because the law is ran by one person. That person is supreme and all mighty, and everyone below him, is not. True equality is about a person being equal to someone of a different race, or his/her elected officials. You are forced to bow down to one and one alone. He doesn’t see you as his equal he sees you as his lesser. I have traveled and have seen great many things is autocratic nations. I see half-breeds, put on display, I see people shot down in the street, I see people imprisoned with out a trial. Innocent people go to jail and die, because it is so easy to frame someone. Dictatorships are about one thing: Power. They do not care about anyone else; all they care is about staying powerful. They fight with violence to keep control and stay ahead in the world. Diplomacy should always be the first route, not the last.

ARTICLE VI:
A common misconception is that freedom if perfectly free. Not true, while it is always better to use the pen than the sword, sometimes, a fight is required to stay free. Sometimes force may be needed to free others. No one likes death, I know I don’t, but it is the price to pay to protect your freedoms. Which is why the Military should only be voluntary, and militias must be allowed to keep up. Now in a strong republic a militia may not be needed, but in a fragile country that is trying to get back to freedom, must. Again no one likes to see human life used at the expense, which is why allies are a must. Democracy is a wonderful thing, and must be protected at all costs.

ARTICLE VII

A good Democracy is judged by how the Government treats its citizens. Especially it’s worst off citizens. Again with more Direct Democracy, incorporated with Representative, important issues can be brought to attention. All the basic needs of a citizen should be met, even before dealing with international affairs.


In closing:

Use this as your guid. It doesn't have to be followed literally, especially if you disagree with some of the things I have stated. Just keep what I have said in mind.

Yasashii Himura

Democracy is tyranny from another source... the majority.

I don't think so

I'm afraid Tyrranicalopia is right. Death to democracy!

OOC: Actually, In real life I'm sort of supportive of democracy, but seriously, dictatorship doesn't mean bad. If handled correctly, it's better than democracy.
However, that's really hard, so democracy's OK too.

Kanami I agree with you. Too long have we been standing quietly as one by one a democracy get corrupted by the enemy and be turned to a government run by evil. I will stand by your side to ensure democracy will remain as strong as it is.

I don't think so

OOC: Just a kind suggestion from me - your report seems to refer a little bit too much to the current situation in real life with democracies. There are way more democracies on NS than your report suggests, and while some may choose not to RP, I'm sure the number is at least 10,000, if not much more.

[ooc:] Because I like this nation...

[ic:]

~~~~~~~~~~~~
We, the Libertarian Concordance of Czardas, wish to join this pact as one of the staunchest defenders of democracy and human rights. However, we have come under attack by the forces seeking to oppose and destroy democracy, using "Death to Democracy" as their battle-cry. All nations who seek to defend the democratic way of life, please send some kind of aid; already the Czardaian Navy has been decimated and hostile armies are moving inland to destroy the cities of the Concordance.

~Kari Alhoun, Czardaian Foreign Minister
~~~~~~~~~~~~

There are way more democracies on NS than your report suggests, and while some may choose not to RP, I'm sure the number is at least 10,000if not much more.

Read the statement again.


Czardas, if I'm not mistaking you we're also an aid in Kurona last October, definalty you would be freindly.

Yes, I seem to remember that RP as well.

As Secretary of the International Alliance of Safety and Peace's (http://s15.invisionfree.com/IASP/index.php?act=idx) military, we would like to extend the long arm of friendship to your new alliance.

Like wise thank you

Like wise thank you
Thank you. May peace and democracy be with us.
-Rian Julian, Secretary of the IASP's Military
"Sic Semper Fi."

"Yet another Marxist-Leninist terrorist guild created to foment violent revolution and upheaval in the name of 'democracy.' Democracy is tyranny by majority. It places the entire fate of a nation in the hands of the masses, who are more often than not far too obtuse, short-sighted, and ignorant to comprehend what is best for them. The best form of government is an iron-fisted, albeit benevolent, dictatorship, that allows social and economic liberties to flourish, yet smashes any semblance of dissent. Look at Parthia, for example, or even RB, for that matter. We have utterly renounced the plague called democracy, and yet our people are happy, healthy, and live long, productive lives. I would rather have stability and prosperity at the expense of political freedom than ochlocracy and chaos. Perhaps Augusto Pinochet said it best: 'Democracy is the breeding ground of Communism.' I pray that those who view democracy as sacrosanct may one day see the light and change their minds. Until then, I can do nothing more than pity them for their short-sightedness."

--Generalissimo J.L.--

"Yet another Marxist-Leninist terrorist guild created to foment violent revolution and upheaval in the name of 'democracy.' Democracy is tyranny by majority. It places the entire fate of a nation in the hands of the masses, who are more often than not far too obtuse, short-sighted, and ignorant to comprehend what is best for them. The best form of government is an iron-fisted, albeit benevolent, dictatorship, that allows social and economic liberties to flourish, yet smashes any semblance of dissent. Look at Parthia, for example, or even RB, for that matter. We have utterly renounced the plague called democracy, and yet our people are happy, healthy, and live long, productive lives. I would rather have stability and prosperity at the expense of political freedom than ochlocracy and chaos. Perhaps Augusto Pinochet said it best: 'Democracy is the breeding ground of Communism.' I pray that those who view democracy as sacrosanct may one day see the light and change their minds. Until then, I can do nothing more than pity them for their short-sightedness."

--Generalissimo J.L.--
And dictatorship is tyranny by miniroty. I say majority is better, no?

And dictatorship is tyranny by miniroty. I say majority is better, no?
Mr. Julian. Ah. Tyranny by majority leaves rule to the ignorant, does it not?

Mr. Julian. Ah. Tyranny by majority leaves rule to the ignorant, does it not?
Define ignorant. I assume you mean not in your little dictatorship's group.

Let us end opression, the force of greed and selfishness and physical domination.
Let us be fundamental, passing around our vision and our word for the universal knowledge of the true rights of all beings.

The Holy Empire of Intracircumcordei breaths life into democracy as the stronghold of the faith, and the Emperor as gaurdian of all true and sacred in all things spirtual and temporal the defender of the Imperial Crown, vowes to uphold true democracy of the will of the almighty.

We ask of all of reality to as will be lend support to the cause of the Empire, and lend your ears, your eyes, your arms, your hearts and your will to the cause of our almighties Empire, in equality and unity.

Let us support true Belief
Let us support true Religion
Let us support true Conscience
We must relize our true everlasting immortality, and live up to our ideall, fear not death fear not. We are free.
Choose your life, and represent yourself, send your emisary and never surrender.
No one can take away our will to do as we please as equals, stand up for your conviction we are the law, we are equal in the law.

We act as we please do nothing that isn't of benifit to you, as society.
Slavery is a deception we have the ultimate choice to act as we wish, do not be deceived.

In truth there is no tyranny if we do not submit.
We are free, we are a state of peace, in a sea of torment, and we shall bring tranquility by calming the waters with our wisdom in rightness.

We must help those who need help, in bettering our society.
We must lend our wisdom to help other assist our society by removing the barriers in difference of focus of completion.

We must provide asylum for those confused into thinking they are oppressed or at a disadvantage, we must assist them in bettering our society.


we seek friends and allies for trade and sustainable development for the betterment of our society, let us together better our society.


We are all equal
We strive to create this universal equality.
We must give everyone the capacity to voice their own veiw and act their own life. We must strive to make an accepting and cooperating society.


Let the forces choose themselves, and let the aged guide in wisdom, and the capable be the wise regardless of age. Stand up for true democracy, the will of all. Full majority in the almighty. In the real world the truth that speaks for cooperation and social unity, guding for the benifit of all rather than just the priveleged few. Let us be unbiased towards any and all, what we offer offer to all, everyone with equal rights, equal voice. Our actions based upon objects rather then people. Say that if you are this way you are this way, if you are an apple you are an apple. If you can lift 50 lbs you can lift 50 lbs. Base our actions on the truth of the physical, and the universality of society in the spiritual. Our consensus in society of mind is recognition of universal acceptance and lack of bias other than what stratifies as acceptable communication, that we all must be striving for.


Let the government be the whole of society, rather than making inequaity and chaging democracy to an instance of time rather than a state of being. Full democracy of the state of all in faith, universal and equal. In the almighty we trust and strive.


Long live True Democracy longlive the Emperor! Long live the Holy Empire of Intracircumcordei. Long live the Imperium. Long live our Society, the Almighty , the faith.

Ah grand Empire, a speach that would have truly made Yasashii Himura proud, and in tears from it's powerful statment.

True but shame we cant do nothing but watch as Czardas is about to fall under the iron fist alliance of Warmaster. If you guys can assist Czardas, our nation will remember you as heros.

We will help, and join this unino of Democracies

Czardas is under attack, we will lend a hand

Let us end opression, the force of greed and selfishness and physical domination.
Let us be fundamental, passing around our vision and our word for the universal knowledge of the true rights of all beings.

The Holy Empire of Intracircumcordei breaths life into democracy as the stronghold of the faith, and the Emperor as gaurdian of all true and sacred in all things spirtual and temporal the defender of the Imperial Crown, vowes to uphold true democracy of the will of the almighty.

We ask of all of reality to as will be lend support to the cause of the Empire, and lend your ears, your eyes, your arms, your hearts and your will to the cause of our almighties Empire, in equality and unity.

Let us support true Belief
Let us support true Religion
Let us support true Conscience
We must relize our true everlasting immortality, and live up to our ideall, fear not death fear not. We are free.
Choose your life, and represent yourself, send your emisary and never surrender.
No one can take away our will to do as we please as equals, stand up for your conviction we are the law, we are equal in the law.

We act as we please do nothing that isn't of benifit to you, as society.
Slavery is a deception we have the ultimate choice to act as we wish, do not be deceived.

In truth there is no tyranny if we do not submit.
We are free, we are a state of peace, in a sea of torment, and we shall bring tranquility by calming the waters with our wisdom in rightness.

We must help those who need help, in bettering our society.
We must lend our wisdom to help other assist our society by removing the barriers in difference of focus of completion.

We must provide asylum for those confused into thinking they are oppressed or at a disadvantage, we must assist them in bettering our society.


we seek friends and allies for trade and sustainable development for the betterment of our society, let us together better our society.


We are all equal
We strive to create this universal equality.
We must give everyone the capacity to voice their own veiw and act their own life. We must strive to make an accepting and cooperating society.


Let the forces choose themselves, and let the aged guide in wisdom, and the capable be the wise regardless of age. Stand up for true democracy, the will of all. Full majority in the almighty. In the real world the truth that speaks for cooperation and social unity, guding for the benifit of all rather than just the priveleged few. Let us be unbiased towards any and all, what we offer offer to all, everyone with equal rights, equal voice. Our actions based upon objects rather then people. Say that if you are this way you are this way, if you are an apple you are an apple. If you can lift 50 lbs you can lift 50 lbs. Base our actions on the truth of the physical, and the universality of society in the spiritual. Our consensus in society of mind is recognition of universal acceptance and lack of bias other than what stratifies as acceptable communication, that we all must be striving for.


Let the government be the whole of society, rather than making inequaity and chaging democracy to an instance of time rather than a state of being. Full democracy of the state of all in faith, universal and equal. In the almighty we trust and strive.


Long live True Democracy longlive the Emperor! Long live the Holy Empire of Intracircumcordei. Long live the Imperium. Long live our Society, the Almighty , the faith.
What an amusing speech. What a fruitless speech. When your empire falls, only myself, the Lord Hu'fievren, shall judge you.

Democracy relies on the fact that people will stay informed...this is rarely the case in just about any situation. A dictatorship, as long as the leader stays benevolent and un-corrupt, will work a hundred times better and more efficient.

Democracy relies on the fact that people will stay informed...this is rarely the case in just about any situation. A dictatorship, as long as the leader stays benevolent and un-corrupt, will work a hundred times better and more efficient.
Let's see. How many Dictatorships have fallen? Nazi Germany, the USSR, and thousands more.

Also being an IASP nation, Quaon has already spoken for us. However, the Democratic Republic of Hamilay also wishes to express its support for this worthy cause. We wish best of luck to your alliance.

Democracy relies on the fact that people will stay informed...this is rarely the case in just about any situation. A dictatorship, as long as the leader stays benevolent and un-corrupt, will work a hundred times better and more efficient.

Ah, therein lies the problem of a non-democratic government. A dictatorship or absolute monarchy may work fine when the leader is benevolent, but that is rarely the case. "Power corrupts: absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Risban prefers the quote: "Power corrupts. Absolute power is kind of neat."



And, I'm going to let other people do the arguing:


When great changes occur in history, when great principles are involved, as a rule the majority are wrong. The minority are right.
--Eugene Debs

Democracy is only a dream: it should be put in the same category as Arcadia, Santa Claus, and Heaven.
--H.L. Mencken

Democracy encourages the majority to decide things about which the majority is ignorant.
--John Simon



I believe Thomas Jefferson sums of Democracy quite clearly in this one:
A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine.


Likewise, Hermann Goering points out that a Democratic Nation is no different than a dictatorship when it comes to war:
Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.




All in all, the Emperor does not trust the masses of the Grand Imperium to rule the country for themselves. They go about, happy with their civil liberties and the opportunities for success offered to them through capitalism, safe and protected by our military, not needing to worry about things, for they know that the Emperor and the Imperial Parliament have things under control.

OOC: Hehehe. Dictatorships are only perfect in our own lil' NS world. Democracies are mostly perfect here, but there are some people that actually roleplay them realistically. In real life, none of the systems is perfect, but dictatorships tend to fare a lot worse than democracies because it's usually the people who get fed up of being oppressed.

You say the rule of the majority is the rule of the ignorant, but it's the other way round. In democracies, you need the best education possible (along with other equally good areas such as social welfare, for example). In dictatorships, on the contrary, you need not good education, since informed, free-thinking individuals are a lot harder to manipulate by the dictator than ignorant ones.

And about corruption, heh, you're going against human nature if you think all the government can stay uncorrupted. As they say, power corrupts, and the citizens end up suffering. But of course that doesn't happen in NS and every tyranny is perfect and benevolent to the people, who live cheerfully despite having no right whatsoever to lead their country into a better future.

OOC: Realize dictatorships aren't always bad. If you put limits on the dictator's power, it works.

The Holy Empire of Intracircumcordei is considering attempting an intervention in the current war that is occuring with Czarna.

Our economy recently went into a recession (droppin from powerhouse to thriving) and so our next years security budget may take a hit.

We are carefully considering how we may assist this dilema. We have currently not been able to sort out a working response and we continue to discus the matter.

We also have a number of small mostly observation and aid deployments in various other areas; we however, are uncertain if these enagement will stay low key or will escalate, thus we need to consider our resources carefully without potentially being required to withdrawl from other engagements, and gaurentie peace and security within Imperial Administered Territory.

We are still doing logistics and attempting to peice together a 'good' scenario for any invovlement in Czarna.

Our hearts go out to you.

One of the only strategies that came to mind was bombarding the invading militaries positions with radiating materials such as ground rod dust but it would cause long term environmental damage. Obviously the supply etc.. is an issue for any engaged force for that long of a period.

Any suggestions on a working engagment strategy?

Well Seeing our enemies, the most of our concern is the damn parthian scum. Not saying they are well renowned for their atrocities but the fact they have the nations of Roach Busters to back them in case they need help. So I would sugguest we leave Czardas against the Parthians while we concentrate on warmaster and the rest of them. Hopefully this will free Czardas of the huge odds stacked against them.

Risban prefers the quote: "Power corrupts. Absolute power is kind of neat."



And, I'm going to let other people do the arguing:



--Eugene Debs


--H.L. Mencken


--John Simon



I believe Thomas Jefferson sums of Democracy quite clearly in this one:



Likewise, Hermann Goering points out that a Democratic Nation is no different than a dictatorship when it comes to war:





All in all, the Emperor does not trust the masses of the Grand Imperium to rule the country for themselves. They go about, happy with their civil liberties and the opportunities for success offered to them through capitalism, safe and protected by our military, not needing to worry about things, for they know that the Emperor and the Imperial Parliament have things under control.
Misquoting good and decent men does not advance your arguement.

Misquoting good and decent men does not advance your arguement.
Fine. Let's see a real quote:

"Democracy is hatred at its finest: multiple ideas have a tendency to clash."
-Jacob Arad, Former General of the Zolonic military for the last Hu'fievren of the Golden Age of Zolony.

Fine. Let's see a real quote:

"Democracy is hatred at its finest: multiple ideas have a tendency to clash."
-Jacob Arad, Former General of the Zolonic military for the last Hu'fievren of the Golden Age of Zolony.
"You who hand over power today will find rewards tommorow."
-Eden Laurice, Famous Quaonion Philosper.

OOC: Realize dictatorships aren't always bad. If you put limits on the dictator's power, it works.

Guess what, that doesn't happen. All dictators have absolute power, their is no Limit

Guess what, that doesn't happen. All dictators have absolute power, their is no Limit
OOC: Giving dictators limited power isn't a dictatorship, it's a monarchy.

Misquoting good and decent men does not advance your arguement.


Misquoting them? You please explain how those are misquotes. These people said these things and they were written down. Go google them or whatever, but they are definately not misquotes.

Misquoting them? You please explain how those are misquotes. These people said these things and they were written down. Go google them or whatever, but they are definately not misquotes.
Resorting to lies won't help you. Any fool can search the internet, and prove you wrong. Unless, of course, you have decided to control the internet in your nation.

We do not take away civil liberties from people in our nation. The Internet is open to any and all websites. In times of war or emergency, the Ministry of Intelligence has the ability to check emails coming in and out of the country, but it only does this during war-time, which is quite rare for Risban.

As such, I would like someone to find on the Internet that these quotes are wrong.

As I stand that they are not, then it is quite clear that the deplorably misinformed nation of Quaon cannot think of any way to successfully refute the arguments presented by the aforementioned quotations and has thus resorted to standing by the illusion that they do not, in fact, exist.

(OOC: Is this OOC or IC? If it's OOC, I'm sorry, but I'll have the mods move it to General.)

(OOC: Is this OOC or IC? If it's OOC, I'm sorry, but I'll have the mods move it to General.)
OOC: This is IC
IC:
Yes. I guess that's why any citzen of a nationstate with a internet modem can go to the following website and find your quoatations to be false: http://www.quotationspage.com/

[OOC: I was under the impression that it is an IC thing. They created a union to stand against the various unions of dictatorships, and now those with autocracies are refuting democracies in an apparently casual debate manner.]

[OOC: I was under the impression that it is an IC thing. They created a union to stand against the various unions of dictatorships, and now those with autocracies are refuting democracies in an apparently casual debate manner.]
OOC: Agreed, or I wouldn't be having my alt argue with my. lol

We hardly see how a mere link can argue that the quotations provided are false. Again the ignorant nation of Quaon has failed in proving their point.

We will point all nation-states to access the following websites on the world wide web and know that these quotes are, in fact, correct:

Wisdom Quotes, where a majority of the aforementioned ones came from (http://www.wisdomquotes.com/cat_democracy.html)
Supporting the Thomas Jefferson quotation. (http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/a_democracy_is_nothing_more_than_mob_rule-where/225983.html)
Again, supporting the Jefferson quote. (http://www.famous-quote.net/thomas-jefferson-quotes.shtml)
Supporting the John Simon quotation/. (http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/democracy_encourages_the_majority_to_decide/7967.html)
Again, supporting Simon. (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/j/johnsimon125586.html)
Supporting the Debs' quotation. (http://www.quoteworld.org/quotes/3556)


We stand by our stance that the poor people of Quaon are unable to refute the arguments and have thus resorted to challenging their very existence.

We hardly see how a mere link can argue that the quotations provided are false. Again the ignorant nation of Quaon has failed in proving their point.

We will point all nation-states to access the following websites on the world wide web and know that these quotes are, in fact, correct:

Wisdom Quotes, where a majority of the aforementioned ones came from (http://www.wisdomquotes.com/cat_democracy.html)
Supporting the Thomas Jefferson quotation. (http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/a_democracy_is_nothing_more_than_mob_rule-where/225983.html)
Again, supporting the Jefferson quote. (http://www.famous-quote.net/thomas-jefferson-quotes.shtml)
Supporting the John Simon quotation/. (http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/democracy_encourages_the_majority_to_decide/7967.html)
Again, supporting Simon. (http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/j/johnsimon125586.html)
Supporting the Debs' quotation. (http://www.quoteworld.org/quotes/3556)


We stand by our stance that the poor people of Quaon are unable to refute the arguments and have thus resorted to challenging their very existence.Your quotes mean absolutly nothing. Why does it matter what a select few people say? That doesn't make democracy wrong, no more than me saying "Hitler was a great man" makes Nazism right.

Your quotes mean absolutly nothing. Why does it matter what a select few people say? That doesn't make democracy wrong, no more than me saying "Hitler was a great man" makes Nazism right.


It is not who said them that truly matters, as the misleading nation of Quaon is attempting to make it seem. The arguments they present are the important things, arguments that have yet to be truly refuted by this supposedly "democratic union."

Well Seeing our enemies, the most of our concern is the damn parthian scum. Not saying they are well renowned for their atrocities but the fact they have the nations of Roach Busters to back them in case they need help. So I would sugguest we leave Czardas against the Parthians while we concentrate on warmaster and the rest of them. Hopefully this will free Czardas of the huge odds stacked against them.

The Allied Union of Velkya would like to point out that the leaders of the nations of Parthia and Roach-Busters are just imperialistic scumbags. We would also like to point out that the well-educated, well-informed, and well-off population of the Allied Union, when compared to that of many nations of the world, is largely capable of making smart, informed decisions about it's populace. While we respect dictatorships and monarchies which strive to preserve the rights of their people, we are happy with our current state as a nation in which sovereignty rests with the people, not with a elite majority, and would not have it any other way.

It is not who said them that truly matters, as the misleading nation of Quaon is attempting to make it seem. The arguments they present are the important things, arguments that have yet to be truly refuted by this supposedly "democratic union."
Two words refute your entire arguement. The first is Nazism. The second is Hitler.

Two words refute your entire arguement. The first is Nazism. The second is Hitler.


We hardly see how these two words refute the logical arguments presented in the aforementioned quotations on democracy. You are merely generalising dictatorships with the Nazis and Hitler. They were an extremely imperialistic, murderous dictatorship, and not the standard. Furthermore, the arguments presented in the quotations have nothing at all to do with Hitler and the Nazi vermin who supported him.

Again, the ignorant nation of Quaon has yet to logically and successfully refute the presented arguments.




To the honorable nation of Velkya, we applaud and thank your understanding that not all dictatorships are not led by evil madmen and that some of the autocracies in the world do, in fact, attempt to deserve the civil liberties of their people. Too often the word "dictator" is connected to evil, much because of certain individuals like Hitler. Perhaps your enlightened people can teach the ignorant people of Quaon a thing or two.

*Thumbs up*

We'll leave you the lesson of teaching that not all freedoms belong in the ballot box, Risban. You and your government are in a better position to do so.

-EDIT WOOT 1,400!-

We hardly see how these two words refute the logical arguments presented in the aforementioned quotations on democracy. You are merely generalising dictatorships with the Nazis and Hitler. They were an extremely imperialistic, murderous dictatorship, and not the standard. Furthermore, the arguments presented in the quotations have nothing at all to do with Hitler and the Nazi vermin who supported him.

Again, the ignorant nation of Quaon has yet to logically and successfully refute the presented arguments.




To the honorable nation of Velkya, we applaud and thank your understanding that not all dictatorships are not led by evil madmen and that some of the autocracies in the world do, in fact, attempt to deserve the civil liberties of their people. Too often the word "dictator" is connected to evil, much because of certain individuals like Hitler. Perhaps your enlightened people can teach the ignorant people of Quaon a thing or two.As we are an extremly educated people, and also invest 2,621,954,941,542.72 USD in education, please refrain from calling us ignorant.

Also, let me add to that list:
The USSR
Iran
Iraq
Cuba
WW2 Japan
And Many More Dictatorship Nationstates

Ah, so, now we're just naming the dictatorships that have gone bad. They always seem to get the most press, don't they? Well then...


Justinian of Rome
Constantine I of Rome
Julius Caesar of Rome
Caesar Augustus of Rome
Caesar Marcus Aurelius of Rome
Trajan of Rome
Hadrian of Rome
Theodosius I of Rome
Antonius Pius of Rome
Tsar Catherine the Great of Russia
Tsar Alexander I of Russia
Tsar Peter the Great of Russia
Oliver Cromwell of England
Anwar Sadat of Egypt
Lorenzo de Medici of Florence
Alexander the Great of Macedonia



The Grand Imperium of Risban tries to follow in the footsteps of Roman Emperor Marcus Cocceius Nerva, the only Caesar who has been praised with the words "Imperium et Libertas"--also Risban's motto. Nerva was the only Caesar to fully bring to Rome Autocracy and Liberty at the same time. He is the example that Emperor Scorpius attempts to follow and, thus far, has been doing a good job of following.

The dictators listed above were great and powerful men and women who benefited their countries greatly. Shall we begin to list now the corrupt democracies out there, or should we not bother doing so?

Ah, so, now we're just naming the dictatorships that have gone bad. They always seem to get the most press, don't they? Well then...


Justinian of Rome
Constantine I of Rome
Julius Caesar of Rome
Caesar Augustus of Rome
Caesar Marcus Aurelius of Rome
Trajan of Rome
Hadrian of Rome
Theodosius I of Rome
Antonius Pius of Rome
Tsar Catherine the Great of Russia
Tsar Alexander I of Russia
Tsar Peter the Great of Russia
Oliver Cromwell of England
Anwar Sadat of Egypt
Lorenzo de Medici of Florence
Alexander the Great of Macedonia



The Grand Imperium of Risban tries to follow in the footsteps of Roman Emperor Marcus Cocceius Nerva, the only Caesar who has been praised with the words "Imperium et Libertas"--also Risban's motto. Nerva was the only Caesar to fully bring to Rome Autocracy and Liberty at the same time. He is the example that Emperor Scorpius attempts to follow and, thus far, has been doing a good job of following.

The dictators listed above were great and powerful men and women who benefited their countries greatly. Shall we begin to list now the corrupt democracies out there, or should we not bother doing so?Those are all of the ancient past. In the past, dictatorships worked. However, in the present day, democracy reigns supreme.

Those are all of the ancient past. In the past, dictatorships worked. However, in the present day, democracy reigns supreme.



The only ancient ones mentioned are those of Rome and Greece. Likewise, Sadat reigned in the 20th century.

Democracy only reigns supreme because alliances like this force it upon people.

Furthermore, how is there any difference between an autocracy in the ancient world or today? You say that in the past, "Dictatorships worked"--so, what? Democracies in the past did not work? What is this to stop someone from saying that autocracies "work" in this day and age as well, hm?

The only ancient ones mentioned are those of Rome and Greece. Likewise, Sadat reigned in the 20th century.

Democracy only reigns supreme because alliances like this force it upon people.

Furthermore, how is there any difference between an autocracy in the ancient world or today? You say that in the past, "Dictatorships worked"--so, what? Democracies in the past did not work? What is this to stop someone from saying that autocracies "work" in this day and age as well, hm?
Dictators reigned surpreme because people did not ask the questions we do today.

Well it seems that Czardas is in dire straits.... being pumled and a land occupation insuing...

Czardas didn't seem to request involvment or suggest it...

It was suggested we coordinate an attack against warmaster?

I really have no intelligence on the situation.

Pity it seems to see them be pummeled as they were.

To all Czardas, you may immigrate to our newly annexed territories and find new homes if you wish. If your ports open and you are allowed to relocate contact us, and we will send you boats for relocation.

Here was their last distress signal

[ic:]

~~~~~~~~~~~~
We, the Libertarian Concordance of Czardas, wish to join this pact as one of the staunchest defenders of democracy and human rights. However, we have come under attack by the forces seeking to oppose and destroy democracy, using "Death to Democracy" as their battle-cry. All nations who seek to defend the democratic way of life, please send some kind of aid; already the Czardaian Navy has been decimated and hostile armies are moving inland to destroy the cities of the Concordance.

~Kari Alhoun, Czardaian Foreign Minister
~~~~~~~~~~~~

And the topic webpage is right here http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=448631

IC:

Any Ideas for a defence or liberation?

Is there some way we can help?

What about getting together a coalition to liberate the Island Should it be taken?

Who will sign on to the LIBERATE OUR DEMOCRATIC BROTHERS COALITION

let us not go down IN defeat LET US orgaznize for the Imancipation of our commrades in consensus, who is with us?

---

Looks at watch... 'tic.. tic.... tic'

'shehechchchehshshehhhcheh '


"paratroopers you say Praetor Shenshi" Lugal Hen Fu Shao Exclaims. "What a brilliant idea"

'shehechchchehshshehhhcheh ''shehechchchehshshehhhcheh ''shehechchchehshshehhhcheh '

"No, manacins... you see they will think they are paratroopers and waste their bullets on them.....," the Lugal responded.Then after a bunch of Manacin attacks we can throw in a suprise real air raid... but use the manacins as 'decoys...', pointing to a map of the Island.

Turning now to face the Emperor ' We may have a plant but we may have to take supplies from various malls, throughout the Capital, and use state powers to take over the manakin factory...


Totus Fides Eyes open then sorta frown in a crease in his aged forhead. "Do what needs to be done, but make sure we don't take it up the (*%$" Why not put boody traps in them too, just to (&(&*( with them a bit"

the minute hand continues to turn in the Casa Miitare...

tic.. tic... tic.

I think I will make for a meeting between us all. The Alliance of Democracies is officated.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=471025 Meeting Thread

Offical Imperial Statement

Well isn't this...nice. Well I can see far this Democratic Union isn't going to last, espically not against the Great Dictatorships of this World such as Parthia, Roach-Busters, Automagfreek, and a string of other nations. Democracy is a spawning ground for liberalism, liberalism is in turn a spawning ground for immorality, and in turn immorality is a spawning ground for anarchy and chaos. The ideal of Democracy is nothing, the people may think they are free, but in many cases they are just being used by politicans. Democracy is nothing more than Popular Dictatorship, with a few laws which can be avoided to supposedly 'limit' Presidental Power.

Democracy is a shame at best, an illusion, the Japanese call it Genjutsu. Genjutsu is the Art of Illusion, and I believe that best defines Democracy. Just a side note, despite popular belief some dictatorships aren't genocidial ego-maniacs with a god-complex for World Domination. And there are plenty of Dictatorships out there whos people live in such wealth, hapiness, and peace that it would put most Democracies to shame.

Signed,
Lord Protector York

[ooc:] Jagada, it's "immorality", not "immortality". Immortality means living forever, which I don't think was what you meant. Just as a side note. ;)

[OOC: Lol, yea, sorry about that. Thanks.]

Death to Democracy!

Signed,
Houston Watkins
Secretary of Foreign Affairs

At the expense of certain groups of people who's heads are hunted by the nations irresistable arm of authority? Democracy acts as a safeguard to keep the genocidic men from shedding blood freely on anyone they feel are undesirable. In today's era, democracy is essential to prevent absolute global conflict and cleansing of certain groups. The dictators you worshipped has put people into virtual and actual slavery.And it is not to say we do not have strong democracies, how about praetonia, Sarzonia, Hogsweat, Pacilitia. They are some of the proudest defenders of freedom and its sons and daughters. However I do critisize them for being inactive. You will probably be saying the same things about how we dont have strong dictatorships if we democratic nations ran the show around here.:p