NationStates Jolt Archive

I'm looking for a larger nation to invade and take over Sel Appa. We will be under your rule for a certain period of time and then we will revolt and probably win. Now, I don't want a lumbering giant that can't be defeated. I want something that will conquer us, but we can put up a good fight and win at first.

PLEASE NO RANDOM POSTS, INFLATED OR RIDICULOUS POPULATIONS, ARMY SIZE... THIS IS A PLANNING THREAD, NOT IC!!!

If you have no idea what any of that means, don't bother posting or TG me for clarification.

Sel Appa is about the size of Brazil and has a socio-capitalist economy. Government-owned utilities and transport among other things. We are in the year 2012.

Questions? Comments? Think your antion works? Please reply!

If anyone replies...I expect it to start in a week or so RL.

[ooc: I might aid whoever is attacking you in return for a fair share of your industries and markets, but I'm a little bit smaller than you (although probably with a more powerful military)... I might be back eventually.

Alternately I could pull the same trick as we did on Nueve Italia—help another force take over and then quickly turn the tables on them and seize power ourselves, but with the war in Ankhmet I won't be able to spare that many troops...]

Population wise we're about half your size, military wise we've got about 4 times your budget (and hence a stronger military). If the pop difference is too great for consideration as a larger country, we'd be willing to join a coalition.

Hmm, this post will prrrobably come to nothing, but...

At the moment, my nation (Beth Gellert) is in two parts, the Igovian Soviet Commonwealth, which is a small borderline anarchist nation based around Finland and containing only a few million people, and the Kingdom of the Geletians, containing over five and a half billion people and being a fairly authoritarian parliamentary democracy newly engaged in the free market.

The Kingdom of the Geletians is suffering some internal dissent as workers -lead by the copper miners- engage in popular take-overs of private industrial concerns and clash with police and private security. The Igovians are sending agitators to stir-up more trouble.

As a result of this, the High King and the Parliament might see a war -especially against someone with moderate socialist leanings but relatively little success (if I may speak harshly of your economy!)- as a good way of increasing patriotism and distracting from revolutionary ideas, as well as a good way to pack trouble makers off to get shot!

In the end, revolution at home and probably desertion in the ranks (maybe sympathy with the enemy if you have socialist types in your nation) would enable you to revolt and throw us out.

I don't know, does that appeal?

Hrm... Pale Rider Arms is always looking for new subjects for hostile takeovers, I don't see why they couldn't move on to try it on a government eventually. And having a client state has always looked like fun to me. PRA would be acting on its own, so you wouldn't have to deal with the entirity of the Otagian war machine, which is rather large. And since they're relatively new at the whole invading thing, you'd stand a good chance, at least until the learning curve catches up.

Up to you, of course.

I don't really use NSEconomy stats, but it might be ok anyway. I shall take all the offers into consideration. I might not go with this idea at all if I want to develop the new chancellor more, but most likely, there will be a war.

I'm willing to conquer. As well i will be willing to install a goverment that is colonial and make your nation into my own little province as well put in a goverment that favors only Imperial citizen settlers and the people who became Imperial citizens.

Well, Quaon is pretty large, but you'd have to give us a really good reason (morally justifiable) to invade (mass genocide, attacks on our land, etc.)
We're pretty much based around the concepts of the forming of the USA, but not how they have actually been carried out in real life.

Yah, I don't care for any of the calculators myself. They... well, they're rubbish.

Well, whatever works for you, eh. Don't go doing something you'll regret (I'm still re-making Beth Gellert a couple of years after joining because I let the wrong things happen).

And just a general warning I can't help giving to Quaon: be careful that your opinion on the size of your nation doesn't get you into trouble! Far from being, "pretty large" your nation is equivalent to roughly 4% of the Kingdom of the Geletians, and we're not the biggest about! If we were the USA, you'd be Ecuador by comparison.
That doesn't matter here except that you'd struggle to repulse an invasion by Sel Appa, let alone to succesfully invade its territory (unless you happen to be a military genius, of course, in which case, well, fair enough!).

Oh...I thought that the said country that wanted to be conquered was small. They have over a billion! I've got no chance unless I could figure out a way to land a few nukes in their city. Maybe an alliance of Nations could team up against them. Like, maybe they're threatening to commit mass genocide or start a nuke war, so a group of nations attacks with as much force as humanly possible.

I doubt there will be any genocides or anything like that. If your nation is looking for copper, we have it produced by the hundreds of thousands of metric tonnes daily. There are huge copper mines all over the place. There is a legend of a huge sheet of 2.5 Trillion tonnes underground that could supply the world for centuries. Only a legend though. So, if you like copper...(obviously copper is my favorite metal). Other incentives...we have a large merchant fleet which travels mostly in the region though. We have progressive science beliefs...little fossil fuel use...shrinking landfills(actually they are almost all gone). You could invade us because of our large atheist population.

Well, the Kingdom of the Geletians might take interest in the copper aspect. We too are traditionally big copper miners, having a major district and city called, clumsily enough, Sygun Copper Mines, but are having trouble since joining the world market.

People in our wealthy nation resent the fact that cheap copper from slightly poorer nations such as your own is being bought by Geletian firms and government as well as our traditional export customers. Lowering or abolishing minimum wage thresholds, cutting welfare, extending working hours, laying-off miners, and so on, have contributed to discontent as we try to compete. Attacking Sel Appa would potentially be popular with those quietly harbouring thoughts along the dirty cheap foreigners line, and might scare workers into making do with the tough new conditions or risk losing all their work to a potential Sel Appan colony. If something drastic isn't done, our government fears facing out-right revolution, and if not that then certianly an electoral defeat in the near future.

The fact that you don't use fossil fuels is a worrying trend to a traditional coal exporter, too. The High King would quite like to make an example of these silly new-age types who don't like his coal!

The atheist thing wouldn't work so well for us, since most of our population is either atheist or something of a druidic persuasion and disinterested in the religious affairs of others. The government can't even get many of its own people to accept Christianity, despite numerous initiatives to that end. But economically and -more important- politically, the Kingdom remains interested.

If it came to war and you decided to face the Geletians, you would be up against an entirely modern-tech foe with an actually somewhat dated military, but a fierce warrior tradition. Most troops still use FN-FAL derivative rifles, receive support from Lynx helicopters and late-mark Chieftain battle tanks, and the navy is traditionally not well commanded, as we have limited maritime tradition (though it is fairly large, these days). However, the Geletians would be many in number, and though their generals may be inexperienced in modern war the troops themselves traditionally have no fear of death and are very imposing physically.

I suppose I'm saying that, with BG, we can play it whatever way suits. On the one hand we can be ferocious and powerful in order to overwhelm your defences and make a possession of your nation, and on the other we have little experience of modern warfare (mostly tribal in-fighting until recent years) and our military leaders might make a tactical or strategic error and allow you to win against the odds, and we have revolutionary ideas in our ranks and may mutiny against our own inept commanders at any moment.

The other downside of deciding to play with the Geletians as your invaders, of course, is that you'd have to put up with me rambling on like this :)

In the event Beth Gellert grows weary of you, I will offer to invade based on ideology, a shortage of copper, etc... I'll think of more reasons if I need to. Just give me a call.

I'll only invade for religious reasons. What's your religion?

I'm thinking BG as the way to go. Perhaps you would be interested in our almost no-labor copper mining. It's 90% mechanized. Robots just go down and mine: they are programmed to seek out and mine copper. Very valuable technology for copper users. Our currency is based on copper and our coins are made of copper. Copper is our pride and joy. In addition, you may be interested in our huge reserves of copper: over 2.5 trillion metric tons. It was once proposed to make a copper wall around the capital as protection, but dumpes on aesthetic grounds (who wants to look at a copper wall...well I would, but Sel Appans wouldn't.

Hehe, I'm mildly unnerved by your specific metal fetish, but we'll let that go ;)

Well, if you do want to go ahead with it, give me a nod if you'd like me to start a thread in which perhaps the High King/Parliament consider the possibility of an invasion plan. I wonder, would it be somehow closed or partly closed? It's obviously mainly your thing, if we go ahead with it, but I'd just want to be sure that it doesn't start a massive pile-on against either of us, though I don't mind involving others reasonably.

Either way, I'm in no rush. I should probably go and sort out my military and figure-out exactly how we'd justify any potential war. Perhaps I'll just start posturing against you and increasing tensions until somebody snaps.

I'll start a pre-war thread probably tonight. I'm thinking maybe Sel Appa will defeat the invaders, but might not. Thanks all who volunteered, I'll keep you in mind.

I think it would be good as an invitation-only. But, people can TG us to get involved and maybe limit the people involved.

Ah, very good. I'm easy going, you can win or lose or whatever, so long as I can eventually get on to revolution in the Kingdom of the Geletians it's okay by me.

OOC:I might be small, but i would like to send troops to the aid of the Sel Appians, in exchange for ten million tonnes of copper ofcourse, i want to cover my presidential palace with burnished copper sheeting :D

I love when people don't read the first post.