NationStates Jolt Archive

This thread concerns the conflict in the Eastern Albanian Mountains between the KLA and French "peace-keepers".

Details on the Albanian Mountains (from wikipedia):

The 70% of the country that is mountainous is rugged and often inaccessible. The remainder, an alluvial plain, receives precipitation seasonally, is poorly drained, and is alternately arid or flooded.

The rivers have deep valleys with steep sides and arable valley floors. Generally unnavigable, the rivers obstruct rather than encourage movement within the alpine region. Roads are few and poor. Lacking internal communications and external contacts, a tribal society flourished in this area for centuries.(end quote)

There are many isolated and (possiblly) xenophobic tribes in the northern areas. The Albanian government has been attempting to reach out to them, dating back to Zog revolt. However the police station, the school, and the government offical remains the exception, not the norm in the eastern areas where this is all taking place. It is possible that there are people who do not even know Albania is a country. Some taking shots at the "peace-keepers" is not hard to imagene.

Current French movements:

Upon discovering that the KLA has fled to the interior, the French began reconessance flights over the interior mountains and continue the propoganada campaign. They dispatch aggressive armored car and foot patrols into the interior to root out rebel outposts. They also set up a semi-permenent camp in the area, prepare to biouvac for the winter, and continue operations in the interior.

Several Interior Tribes refuse to allow the peace-keepers entry to their villages, citing that they are not led by Albanians.

Realizing that they are facing very mountainous terrain the French commander sends back to France for a crack Alpine Division. It is immediatly mobilized and prepared for transport. It will arrive in two or three weeks.


Current KLA movements:

They have broken up into groups of 100-200, and have winter colthing (civilan, not military, but it will keep them warm). They are setting traps for the french (planting bombs on narrow mountain roads for example) but otherwise avoiding them. They also have food which they looted before they left and they can always barter with local tribes. Over 5000 of the KLA are Albanians from the area, so they will know all the little mountanous short cuts. As for ammo, they are avoiding the fight at the moment and conserving it. Sympathizers will probably send food to the area under the guise of trade.

OOC: Tag

OOC: Tag?

OOC: You forgot about the 4 Battalions of Germans with the French.

Also, I reiterate my statement on your godmodding. The rebels, unless under control of the Albanian Government, are a separate entity and thus you do not have control over their actions. Either GB or one of the other Mods has to rule on that.

And I sure don't remember you saying you were building forts along the Worker's Railroad ;)

OOC: I have been given default control of the rebels to make the game easier (there are two other civil wars for the mods to deal with, VP even asked me if I wanted to be the Fascist rebels in Spain). Second the Trans-Eurasian rail road would be built through a mountain pass. Forts have been established on the mountain passes. Check the Albanian news thread.

I've also been given control of the Balkan's Ethnic Albanian community.

I am not god-modding!

OOC: Tag means I am basically posting a place-holder so I can do a search for it later.

Where were you given control? Or did you just assume that you had it? Your evidence is weak.

VP gave it to me! He posted it on the main thread and you can ask him.

I know you were given control of the Albanian Ethnic people, but it would be godmodding to assume you have control of both sides of the conflict. You cannot control the rebels and the governmentm regardless of ethnicity.

OOC: I have been controling the rebels since conflict broke out and VP and GB were okay with it. You wouldent know as you have entered into this late!

Also the rebels are not currently fighting the Albanian government (they are fighting the French), although they may in the future.

ooc
the way wars are handled.... you tell me by telegram what you want your forces to do, and so does your opponent. I game it out and report results. Amestria controls both the KLA and his regular forces. Jensai controls the French and Russian peacekeepers, Macedonia controls the Yugoslavs, and Parthini controls the Germans unless he hands control over to someone else. There is not sufficient space to deploy 30 German divisions due to terrain restrictions, but Albania can be conquered. It was during the historical World War I for example and the Greeks damn near overran it fighting the Italians in World War II (January - February 1941). I am very familiar with the terrain, having gamed out several situations in that area for other games, so I know how things look.

telegram me intentions and I will let you know what happens.

May I advise a trip to Chatzy?

OOC; Currently in Chatzy.

OOC: I have been controling the rebels since conflict broke out and VP and GB were okay with it. You wouldent know as you have entered into this late!

Also the rebels are not currently fighting the Albanian government (they are fighting the French), although they may in the future.

Unless the Rebels and the Governemt aren't really different sides.

The Brazilian Civil War is a bit like that, where there are three different Rebel factions, each with separate (and not necessarily compatible) goals and methodologies.

But, they are all on the same side.

So the Ruling, by precedent, is, if Amestria wants to play both the Government and KLA, that's permissible, but only if they're both considered the "same side." And it's going to be rapidly obvious that there's collaboration between the two, since most of the involved countries suspect it already anyway.

If Amestria wants to keep them separate, however, Galveston Bay as War Moderator, or an appointed deputy acting in that capacity, will have to run the KLA.

OOC: The Albanian Government will do nothing towards the rebels. No collaboration, no opposition. They will try to come up with a diplomatic solution to the conflict. Also the Albanian government has very little power in the area where the rebels are (one or two police stations, maybe a state school, thats all). It will be the same way things have gone so far.

(unless the rebels turn against the Government, which could happen)

The Worker's Railroad has been opened up to French and Union Forces for peacekeeping operations. However, geneal closure of the Railroad is still under way.

Union forces are not allowed into Albania! Any that try to enter by the railway will be turned back.

3 Divisions of the Worker's Army have been placed along the Yugoslavian/Albanian border to provide protection against any rebel incursions. 30 tanks and 12 Zeppelins will accompany them.

The Albanian government feels that is unnecessary and excessive, as there are no longer rebels on Yugoslavia's southen border.

The Moderators' Rulings on guerrilla warfare have been reiterated time and again. But I will once more repeat a few essentials.

The successful guerrilla wars of Vietnam and Afghanistan were fought in the context of a post-WWII global economy, with a military industrial complex and global transportation infrastructure that gave angry men, and sometimes angry women, virtually unlimited access to weapons and ammunition and other necessities of military campaigning, allowing them to remain in the field as long as their will to do so remained unbroken. The global economy that allowed them to do this has not yet been established in E20. The only possible way for a guerrilla war to "work" until that becomes the case is for it to be sponsored by one of the current superpowers, such as the US, Britain, or possibly Germany. Otherwise, the maintenance of military action is a task so vast and expensive that only a true State can presently undertake it.

Moreover, the effectiveness of guerrilla warfare is still disputed among many otherwise intelligent people. To this very day, in the United States, there are many people on both ends of the political spectrum, some of them quite influential, who do not realize that the Vietnamese defeated the American Army in the field, but instead blame/credit the domestic Antiwar Movement for "emboldening our enemies/making a difference." Personally, I find such a notion to be insupportable by the actual evidence, but the existence and prevalence of such attitudes shows that military planners (and most ordinary citizens) still have a surprising faith in the capacity of conventional forces to effect a military victory even in "low-intensity conflicts." It took the French and the US twenty-seven years to finally pull out of Vietnam. It took the Soviets more than ten to realize that Afghanistan was unwinnable. There is no way that any country in the 1920's is going to take "some bandits in the hills" seriously when the Pentagon and most of the American people still refuse to recognize, thirty years on, that the NLF/NVA actually kicked the crap out of the most powerful military the Earth has ever seen. And did it in their pajamas.

The Albanian government feels that is unnecessary and excessive, as there are no longer rebels on Yugoslavia's southen border.

The more troops to help facilitate and protect the Albanians the better i would think. Just for the record that brings the Border strength up to 8 divisions, or roughly 75,000 soldiers. That should be plenty enough to defend from the KLA, defend Albanian civilians, defend Serb civilians, and rebuild homes. We appreciate the German peoples hospitality in this situation.

ooc
I had assumed those numbers Macedonia..

The KLA and Yugoslav/French/Russian force defends the border tightly and constantly patrols, including crossing over into Albanian territory. The KLA continues to try and cross the border. The result is constant patrol actions between the two sides, and the weather takes a toll.

losses September 1923 - December 1923
Yugoslav military losses 3,000 killed, 8,000 wounded
French losses 500 killed, 2,000 wounded
Russian losses 100 killed, 500 wounded
Serbian civilians 100 killed, 500 wounded
Ethnic Albanians in Kosovo 1,000 killed (atrocities, unsanctioned)
KLA killed 4,000

KLA is running out of ammunition unless it gets resupplied by Albanian Army

100,000 refugees in Albania will require nearly $5 million to house, feed and provide with medicine or roughly a third of them will die during the winter.
Western contributions dried up after reports of atrocities committed against Serbs were received in the West.

The Albanian Army does not supplie the KLA with anything. However, nationalist sympathizers smuggle them ammo (a lot of people in Albania own guns).

The KLA begins a policy of refusing battle until the summer.

OOC: GB can rule how effective the ammo smuggling is in keeping the KLA supplied.

All refugees who wish to return to Yugoslavia are sent back (properly clothed and fed). Those who do not wish to return are moved to the coastal areas in a decentralized manner (to stop more artifical food sortages).

OOC: The mods. need to rule on how many refugees wish to return and how many stay. Also a significant, and the closest, amount of aid is provided by the Italian State, and they do not care about atrocities. I'd say the refugee problem will be taken care on the Albanian side before the aid runs out completely.

The Frenc government begins supplying food, tents, and clothing to the Albanian government to be used for the refugees. The propoganda campaign continues and patrols are increased, with agressivness being the key. The crack Alpine Division has been deployed into the mountains and plans to enlist local guides and trackers to help locate the rebels.

In the disputed areas all guns and ammunition are ordered registered and confisticated. When the are is stablized the weapons will be returned.

German zepplins and French planes begin aggressive recon and attack missions against rebel camps when the weather permits.

OOC: Many local tribes will not want to give up their weapons.

November 1923

The Red Fleet comes off station in Turkish waters, and takes up station in the Adriatic. Italian warships sighted near the Albanian coast will be warned off as being in violation of the Russo-Albanian agreement. If they enter Albanian waters they will be fired upon.

X-Post from here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=9735677#post9735677)

The French parliament recieves word of the German movements and convenes an emergency session.

As the Albanian government has proven itself to be incompetent, unco-operative, and appear to actually be in league with the KLA it is hereby declared that a state of WAR is now existing between France and Albania.

French troops in Albania are ordered to deploy the Alpine division to tie down the KLA, while the two Infantry divisions and the single tank regiment are to sieze vital railway depots and, of course, the Trans-Eurasian railway. The Russian divisions under French command remain in Yugoslavia.

The Ottoman General Staff, has send with the permission of the French Government a team of Ottoman Army officer(about 20 officers) to watch and take notes on how the French fight wars and etc. They going to meet the French units, by ship to Yugoslavia and meet the French Army over there.

Czechoslovakia would be interested in deploying 2 squadrons of reconaissance and 1 squadron of fighter aircraft to aid the French in their struggle against the terrorist regime of Albania. We can also deploy 12 modern PA-II armored cars to help garrison Serbian villages from the marauders. Since the KLA terrorists are not known to possess mobile artillery, the armored cars would essentially be able to protect somewhat large areas from infantry enroachment as long as infantry support is provided to prevent them from getting swarmed.

In Albania some hard decisions were made. The Army realized that they were about to conduct a gallant last stand as soon as spring came. Many officers were appalled by the governments backing of the rebels in Kosovo, who were committing atrocities. They were even more appalled because they realized that no one was going to save them except maybe the Italians, and as those were Russian ships offshore and not Italian ships, that looked hopeless.

There was only one thing to do. On Friday, December 23, elements of the army near the capital suddenly left their barracks and took up positions surrounding police stations. Other elements, generally intelligence officers and staff officers, went to the homes of the senior leaders of the government, backed up by troops and the few motor vehicles the government had. The Presidential Guard was surrounded in its barracks by artillery and infantry with machine guns and ordered to surrender. It swiftly did when it became clear that resistance was hopeless.

The President, and most of his senior leaders were killed as they rested in their beds or taken out and shot. By morning it was over. The commanders of the Army announced martial law on the radio as dawn broke over the mountains, and sent word to the Brazilian Embassy asking them to mediate a settlement.

Meanwhile orders went out to the army units on the border. Pull back 10 miles and secure all refugee compounds, and all villages. KLA members are to be ordered to surrender or shot if they resist. Captured KLA members will be held for trial for war crimes and murder.

This information is passed to the Brazilians to pass on to the Russians, French and Yugoslavs as well.

OOC
The Army is not interested in committing national suicide to save a bunch of bandits. It just spent a decade cleaning them out of their country, and they sure don't want to die defending new bandits who are worse than the ones they fought. They will fight if the French and Yugoslavs move past the 10 mile buffer zone, but only then. The Army mainly wants a deal that allows Albania to remain independent. The last straw was the order to storm the embassies.

Armestria, I am sorry, but this would certainly happen. Its not as if you have been invaded yet and had a chance to drum up a lot of nationalistic fervor. Your officers are going to be realistic, and competent, and smart enough to cut a deal to save the nation.

The Union immediately recognizes the new military Government of Albania.

The French also recognize the new government and order the troops to resume operations against the KLA.

The Yugoslavian Parliament hereby recognizes the new government of Albania, and will assist in the transportation of refugees(if this is still happening) to France and Germany. Also all forces are told to pull back to the borders and not move past the buffer zone.

The Worker's Republic hereby recognizes the new Albanian military and continues to offer sanctuary for the Albanian ethnics, no matter the nationality.

ooc
this is not going to magically end the KLA attacks, but they will eventually all die or surrender to the Albanian army over the course of the winter as they are now without any support and they will have eaten up all the spare food available in their sanctuaries and exhausted their ammunition.

IC
The Army will ask for terms, basically seeking to avoid having to pay reparations if possible in exchange for handing over the leaders of the KLA to Yugoslavia for trial as criminals. The Army will seek guarantees that the Yugoslavian government will ensure that no further atrocities are committed against ehtnic Albanians in Kosovo as well. They realize they are in no position to make demands, but nevertheless will try at least for that.

The French are willing to accept those terms, but would also like amnesty to be offred to the KLA rank and file as an inducement to surrender.

Personally, I thought these terms (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9734053&postcount=91) were pretty reasonable, along with an amnesty for low-ranking members of both militias.

As Tito has said we agree with Moscow's thoughts on this topic, and nothing will be held against the new, sensible, government of Albania. We assure them that the atrocities will be stopped by force if needed. We are glad that Albania's government has been purified of it's extremists, we are just sad it had to be done in such a bloody manner.

Personally, I thought these terms (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9734053&postcount=91) were pretty reasonable, along with an amnesty for low-ranking members of both militias.

if those terms are offered to the Albanian military government, it will hurriedly accept them.

if those terms are offered to the Albanian military government, it will hurriedly accept them.
Then the Red Fleet will stand down as a gesture of good faith and return to the Black Sea.

Is my embassy still needed to mediate on an agreement as Galveston suggested?

Is my embassy still needed to mediate on an agreement as Galveston suggested?

ooc
for now we will assume that your diplomats handled the actual negotiations and that they were successful.

IC
As winter continues in Albania, nearly all of the KLA surrendered or died in combat or because of harsh conditions. Without resupply, and having outworn their welcome by the hill clans, they found themselves isolated and hopeless. The few hundred that remained were in small groups and were little more than bandits now. When spring came the Albanian Army would ensure that they too were eliminated as a problem.

The military appoints the Minister of Trade, who they had not taken out and shot, as the new President and informs him that they expected elections in the fall. Needless to say he agreed completely.

We would like to put forward the following regarding the elections.

As suggested earlier by the USA that I should mediate here the Brazilian Embassy makes some proposals:

- Elections should take place within 6 months.
- As Albania is currently stable, there need be no foreign troops stationed within Albania as this will only bias public opinion as to the status of Albania. Some may see Albania as being under occupation, hence a rise in support for nationalistic sentiment.
- Instead we propose that a peacekeeping force of 20,000 men be stationed on the borders. Preferably of completely neutral countries. For example, Belgian, Dutch and South African peacekeepers. These at least share a common heritage and are completely neutral to potential civil strife. They will be stationed in Yugoslavia and in the case of trouble will immediately head for trouble spots.
- The places where the Albanian border forts are will become a de-militarised zone until after the election. That way, no one faction can sieze the power of the forts.
- Election observers from Sweden, Switzerland and Burgundy will be used to ensure fair elections.
- Each party shall abide by a spending limit set by the observer nations for advertising and propaganda. This will be a fair election.
- The Albanian Military and other possible pressure groups will be closely monitored for any attempts to sway the election by anything other than democratic means.

We are open to suggestions.

Deepest Regards,
Brazil's Embassy in Albania.

ooc
for now we will assume that your diplomats handled the actual negotiations and that they were successful.

IC
As winter continues in Albania, nearly all of the KLA surrendered or died in combat or because of harsh conditions. Without resupply, and having outworn their welcome by the hill clans, they found themselves isolated and hopeless. The few hundred that remained were in small groups and were little more than bandits now. When spring came the Albanian Army would ensure that they too were eliminated as a problem.

The military appoints the Minister of Trade, who they had not taken out and shot, as the new President and informs him that they expected elections in the fall. Needless to say he agreed completely.

ooc: you mind if I put the above stuff on about elections?

We would like to put forward the following regarding the elections.

As suggested earlier by the USA that I should mediate here the Brazilian Embassy makes some proposals:

- Elections should take place within 6 months.
- As Albania is currently stable, there need be no foreign troops stationed within Albania as this will only bias public opinion as to the status of Albania. Some may see Albania as being under occupation, hence a rise in support for nationalistic sentiment.
- Instead we propose that a peacekeeping force of 20,000 men be stationed on the borders. Preferably of completely neutral countries. For example, Belgian, Dutch and South African peacekeepers. These at least share a common heritage and are completely neutral to potential civil strife. They will be stationed in Yugoslavia and in the case of trouble will immediately head for trouble spots.
- The places where the Albanian border forts are will become a de-militarised zone until after the election. That way, no one faction can sieze the power of the forts.
- Election observers from Sweden, Switzerland and Burgundy will be used to ensure fair elections.
- Each party shall abide by a spending limit set by the observer nations for advertising and propaganda. This will be a fair election.
- The Albanian Military and other possible pressure groups will be closely monitored for any attempts to sway the election by anything other than democratic means.

We are open to suggestions.

Deepest Regards,
Brazil's Embassy in Albania.
These proposals are acceptable to the Union.
- Union Supreme Council

These proposals are acceptable to the Union.
- Union Supreme Council

Albania will also accept them

ooc
as the military knows it can always act if it needs to

Yugoslavia will accept the foreign peacekeepers and is sending engineers to the Kosovo and Macedonia region to create camps for the peacekeepers to stay in.

Shall we take the propositions as accepted then?

The Foreign Office of Great Britain has granted permission for South Africa to send peacekeepers to Yugoslavia for the purpose of monitoring the situation in Albania. We will send two infantry regiments (the Cape Town Rifles and the Natal Native Regiment, about 7000 soldiers) to Egypt via the Cape-Cairo railway, and from there they will be shipped to Yugoslavia.

Stanley Frazer
Minister of Defense

OOC: Brazil asked for troops, I sent 'em.

The Foreign Office of Great Britain has granted permission for South Africa to send peacekeepers to Yugoslavia for the purpose of monitoring the situation in Albania. We will send two infantry regiments (the Cape Town Rifles and the Natal Native Regiment, about 7000 soldiers) to Egypt via the Cape-Cairo railway, and from there they will be shipped to Yugoslavia.

Stanley Frazer
Minister of Defense

OOC: Brazil asked for troops, I sent 'em.


We thank you for your generous gift. They will be billeted in Yugoslavia for around 6 months until elections have been completed and the international community is sure there will be no backlash against ethnic minorities. A realistic timescale to pullout is around one year. The troops will only enter Albania if there is evidence of a serious breach of the peace. Once again the Brazilian Mediating Commission thanks the governments of both South Africa and Great Britain for allowing this deployment.

Deepest Regards,
Brazilian Mediating Commission.

OOC: For technical reasons:

IC: The Worker's Railroad Commission welcomes the South Africans.