NationStates Jolt Archive

ok, ive been thinking. Why does everyone from one tech (MT, FT, i dont know what magical tech uses as an abbreviation) avoid battles with other techs? I personally am an FT nation. and have only had one thread in which an MT nation activly interacted with my nation. Most MT nations just ignore FT nations! And magic tech, just think of the possibilities of a Magic vs Technology war! Battle Tanks vs Sorcerers. The RPing would be amazing! there could even be a thread where Magic AND Mt fight FT, or something like that. Spells being cast from the back of a Humvee, while dragons (or something) assists FIghters in the air!

Why must we all ignore each other? Think of the great possibilities to be had!

(please forgive any mispellings and grammar errors. mi tipin aint not 2 goood.)

I wondered what would happen if a Past-Tech Magic nation attacked a Post-Modern Tech nation. Maybe we could arrange it. Like a armed skirmish that ends in surrender but we have a really cool battle.

I'm an FT nation with various fantasy elements, such as Sorcerors and Magick; vampires, werewolves, daemons, spirits and things like the Azlu from Werewolf: The Forsaken.

I like a nice mix, while staying loyal to a WH40K Chaos base design. Whoever lives there, however, varies ;)

The only thing I don't like is mixing too much cross-genre tech.

It is a wonderful idea, but I think the reason most people auto ignore is the massive chance for "tech" or "magic" wanking. Along with this is far more difficult to RP, as everyone knows what happens when a bullet hits a kevlar vest, but what happens when a magic missile does? That fact probably scares away a few Rp'ers. I dont see anything wrong with having an OOC sign up to get the people together for a cross tech RP, but I do see where people are coming from when a FT nation enters a MT rp reletively unanounced.

ok, ive been thinking. Why does everyone from one tech (MT, FT, i dont know what magical tech uses as an abbreviation) avoid battles with other techs? I personally am an FT nation. and have only had one thread in which an MT nation activly interacted with my nation. Most MT nations just ignore FT nations! And magic tech, just think of the possibilities of a Magic vs Technology war! Battle Tanks vs Sorcerers. The RPing would be amazing! there could even be a thread where Magic AND Mt fight FT, or something like that. Spells being cast from the back of a Humvee, while dragons (or something) assists FIghters in the air!

Why must we all ignore each other? Think of the great possibilities to be had!

(please forgive any mispellings and grammar errors. mi tipin aint not 2 goood.)

Couple of points...

1 - For a MT nation to aknowledge the existence of FT nations, usually (not always) destroys the sense of "Modern Time"... Think about it, do we right now in real life know of any nations that are living on other planets and have technology that allows them to go near light speed...

2 - Magic and real life are hard to mix, because you will often have one person saying, "The USN Dreadnaught fired 39 cruise missiles at the enemy' hut," and then the magic person will say, "I put up a force field..."

Obviously I am taking the examples to extremes but you see my point. That is why in most stories (be it movies, books, or games) if Magic is involved either it isn't set in the modern time, or you don't see a whole lot of modern military power...
--Magic in medieval stories (no ICBMs)
--Magic in harry potter type stories (no Military)
--Well I could go on... but.... I am lazy and I think you get my point


(Other than that, not a terrible idea)

See you have to have balance; I mean, if a vessel fires missles; the magic guy can put up a forcefield; but it takes a hell of a lot out of you to hold a forcefield and hold it against such an onslaught; inevitably things would get through....It's a great idea and I'm all for signing up for a cross-genre RP, but there has to be limits, compromises and above all; control.

See you have to have balance; I mean, if a vessel fires missles; the magic guy can put up a forcefield; but it takes a hell of a lot out of you to hold a forcefield and hold it against such an onslaught; inevitably things would get through....It's a great idea and I'm all for signing up for a cross-genre RP, but there has to be limits, compromises and above all; control.

that was my point really, that it has to be controlled immensely...

I really wish that thread was up where Niancio and GMC had their very good argument. It used to be a sticky. Regardless, you can consider future tech as modern tech in a lot of ways. For example, what if a nation was just really advance, regardless of the year? So, you can have a cross-tech war and consider it a modern tech war..just most people don't because they think it's unfair.

For example, what if the USA went to war with Russia, and Russia had a secret project nobody knew about and released an orbital bomber? The US can't exactly say, "OMG LOLZ FUTURE TECH I IGNORE U!" So, yea...

I agree with Chronosia here, there has to be limits and rules. Orbital bombardement against MT nations is a godmod, as is using your l337 w1z4Rd to create an impenetrable forcefield that protects you from cruise missiles. We would also have to use some kind of system to determine the strength one weapon does to any kind of armour (as in what damage a magic bolt would do against an MBT, or how much damage a soaceship would do against an MT city etc).

I really wish that thread was up where Niancio and GMC had their very good argument. It used to be a sticky. Regardless, you can consider future tech as modern tech in a lot of ways. For example, what if a nation was just really advance, regardless of the year? So, you can have a cross-tech war and consider it a modern tech war..just most people don't because they think it's unfair.

For example, what if the USA went to war with Russia, and Russia had a secret project nobody knew about and released an orbital bomber? The US can't exactly say, "OMG LOLZ FUTURE TECH I IGNORE U!" So, yea...

Although I see your point... you put up a poor argument.

The simple answer is that FT nations are considered more than just having a secret orbital bomber... They are often on multiple planets, or use tech from sci-fi stories, or have space fleets... etc...

Plus, the reason everyone fires up the ignore cannon when a FT nation tries to attack a MT nation is that who wants to fight a war where someone is firing down meteor size missiles that vaporize the planet...

(Again extremes, so don't start bashing...)

Look at the Imperial Guard; now, apart from the Lascannons and Lasguns, etc; they're almost essentially Modern Infantry; but the Imperial Guard can hold the line against anything from orks, to Chaos, to Tyranids. If I was gonna invade someone; a well armed MT soldier; has just as much chance of cutting down a Khorne Berzerker in mid charge; as a bolter wielding Space Marine has of killing a MT Soldier.

Generally, FT is both "future tech" and "future times", MT is both "modern tech" and "modern times", and PT would be both "past tech" and "past times", right? (I know they stand for "... tech", but in practice it's also the time, right?) If your nation is in the future or the past compared to the time period I'm willing to RP in, my nation can not interact with yours. If your nation is FT only as in "future tech", I might accept RPing with you if you have a good reason why your nation is so much more advanced than mine. AFAICT a lot of "future tech" is really "GT" ("godmode tech"), though, and I ignore that no matter what. I also consider magic and aliens to be GT, along with some of the popular ideas in "MT".

I haven't RPed at all in a long time, though...>_>

very good points...

althuogh if magic and aliens are used correctly in RPing they are not at all "GT" as you put it...

How are Aliens godmods? I mean, its not unforeseeable that there are no extraterrestrial civilisations. To think man the only 'sentient' in the Universe is sheer arrogance. Magick is more of a Godmod since its almost certainly false in the forms in which it is invoked in RPing.

ANything to do with Magic and FT has to be taken with a grain of salt; Ft physics aren't out to actually work, or to pretend to be possible. Its about having fun. However; to say that MT and FT can never meet is just silly.

Besides, with the sheer volumes of Earths, its entirely possible to live out your MT life undisturbed. However, for those who wish it, there should be some form of exchange or interchange.

Although I see your point... you put up a poor argument.

The simple answer is that FT nations are considered more than just having a secret orbital bomber... They are often on multiple planets, or use tech from sci-fi stories, or have space fleets... etc...

Plus, the reason everyone fires up the ignore cannon when a FT nation tries to attack a MT nation is that who wants to fight a war where someone is firing down meteor size missiles that vaporize the planet...

(Again extremes, so don't start bashing...)


That's not a line drawn by FT or MT, that's a line drawn by poor roleplayers. I would be glad to fight a good roleplaying FT nation, but under no circumstances would I go to war with most FTers out there, for the simple fact that they wank.

The idea that an FT nation would use something to destroy a planet in one is wank when considering an MT/FT role play, and most of the time cross-time role players won't do that, or else it would turn into an ignore fest. But the same thing could be said about nuclear weapons. A bad MT roleplayer can turn you into a crater by just firing thousands of nuclear warheads. Of course, so would he - but that's besides the point.

Two problems offhand for a war type thread...

1. Size
The FT nations can be anywhere from 10-10,000 planets in size, depending on who you play with. You end up with people having populations in the quadrillions, meaning that they can field billions to trillions of soldiers which doesn't include droids etc.

2. Firepower

Once again it depends, low end you can chuck astroids at a planet until they are unable to intercept and and die. The high ground of space is a woderful thing when your enemy can't fire out that far. Medium is flinging moons at the planet, which no MT nation can stop no matter how many nukes they have. High end if DS/gridfire/Dahak, Death Star has a main gun that blows away planets, Dahak has many missiles that can blow away planets and gridfire has more power then a supernova.

Orbital bombardement against MT nations is a godmodOrbital bombardment on a limited scale (destroying a presidential mansion, for example) is possible today. The problem is it's very expensive for achieving such a small goal. (It might be effective at scaring the opposition into backing off, though...)althuogh if magic and aliens are used correctly in RPing they are not at all "GT" as you put it...I consider GT to be things that are, as far as we know today, impossible. You can have a great RP with magic, aliens, and FTL starships (Star Wars and Star Trek are like that.), but I'll still call it GT and sit out.How are Aliens godmods?I guess I see them as too big a wild card to make stuff work well.

An irrate FTer taking otu an entire world to prove his superiority? Ouchies :P I enjoy RPing with MTers. I RPed with Kriegorgrad once; my space marines invaded his capital; and it seemed to them to be some ancient prophecy come true. I saw it as an extension of WH40K Canon situations; where the great crusade came to liberate worlds, which ranged from adanced settlements, to worlds where humanity had descended into Barbarism.

Back when I wanted to unite humanity.

We had another RP where we encountered his just launched space fleet; and the 'Gods' returned; before the Kriegorians finally realised their mortality ;)

Me and Kazecistan had an Rp with an MT world discovered by numerous FT powers, and a struggle to save the world and keep it ignorant of the tumultous forces that exist beyond their world. Lovecraft said it best, I think

"The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity and it was not meant that we should voyage far."

But the entire point of cross-tech roleplays is moderation. Of course, a modern role play is never going to work if its between the Federal Union and Communist Mississipi - two bad role players. However, if I were to turn FT, and I was to go to war with Niancio I bet you twenty cookies it would work, because we're better roleplayers and would agree to moderate certain aspects of the RP.

Not that I want to get into a religious debate or hi-jack this thread, but...

I see them as too big a wild card to make stuff work well.

what is the difference between that and religion...

Not that I want to get into a religious debate or hi-jack this thread, but...



what is the difference between that and religion...In an RP, I don't see a big difference between aliens, magic, and divine intervention. Different people will argue that different combinations of the three exist IRL, but if you don't establish the rules for the RP to avoid 'wild card' scenarios, I might introduce Wks the sorceror who comes from the planet Xphnys and has the power to summon the Divine SWAT Squad.

I hope my position is clear enough now; I don't want to hijack the thread.

In a MT/PMT nation vs FT nation match-up, I would think it would have to be done in the way they do it in the first few seasons of Stargate: SG-1. Have the MT/PMT nation discover alien tech (like a Stargate) in their territory, have them figure out how to use it, and have them meet the FT nation. Depending on which FT nation they meet, they may have to fight for their lives, try to put down a inferiority complex, or something else. In SG-1, for example, the Goa'uld didn't come to Earth until after they had killed Ra. Some FT cultures, like the Goa'uld are very steeped in history and tradition. Plus, a bullet right between the eyes could ruin anyone's day.

ha. only got one post in then i had to log off. but im back now.

alot of people are using godmod as why they dont crosstech. that is a good point. what makes a rp good is the RPers! for example, im a FT nation. as previously stated. But i dont go overboard with it. In fact, aside from the fact that i have a Space Fleet with jump capabilities, all my tech is MT, almost. my infantry uses plas-lite rifles (basicly lasers) but they still are only as strong as the modern day marine. hell, even my cruisers still use 50mm guns! if you got a few good role players, i dont see any reason why a cross tech rp wouldnt work.

Just to get it out, only my space navy is FT, I use at the most, PMT for my "wet" navy.

Orbital bombardment on a limited scale (destroying a presidential mansion, for example) is possible today. The problem is it's very expensive for achieving such a small goal. (It might be effective at scaring the opposition into backing off, though...)
Orbital bombardement as in ''orbital bombardement the average FT-nation would use.'' It thus includes an almost unlimited amount of nuclear warheads mounted on extremely powerful rockets.

Orbital bombardement as in ''orbital bombardement the average FT-nation would use.'' It thus includes an almost unlimited amount of nuclear warheads mounted on extremely powerful rockets.

A canon FT group used in the Stargate universe, the Goa'uld, wouldn't use nukes. They fire a few shots and frighten a planet's population into submission.

A canon FT group used in the Stargate universe, the Goa'uld, wouldn't use nukes. They fire a few shots and frighten a planet's population into submission.I'm not familiar with SG so I can't adress that. However, the majority (I think, they're the ones I notice the most) of the FT nations wouldn't do something like that. If I played an MT nation, there are very few FT nations I would want to rp with, amongst them are Chronosia and The Gaian Ascendancy.

I'm not familiar with SG so I can't adress that. However, the majority (I think, they're the ones I notice the most) of the FT nations wouldn't do something like that. If I played an MT nation, there are very few FT nations I would want to rp with, amongst them are Chronosia and The Gaian Ascendancy.

Well, the whole point of a FT nation invading an MT or PMT one, in my honest opinion, would be get more land, slaves, and maybe have the natives worship them as gods.

Well, the whole point of a FT nation invading an MT or PMT one, in my honest opinion, would be get more land, slaves, and maybe have the natives worship them as gods.
You would be surprised at how many don't care about pesky things like logic and reason.

Very interesting here. I would also agree with Chronosia on this point. I think with moderation or control, it is indeed possible for different techs to do battle with one another. I role play as medieval tech, Japanese samurai to be exact, and I think the idea of my samurai army heading it off against a future tech or modern tech nation would be interesting. Since, for one thing, as an ft nation you tend to forget and don't appriciate what the old sword wielders could do, escpecially the Japanese. I could see a medieval army using its inginuity and raw skill giving a laser computer-boy a run for his money.

So, if someone makes the thread, I will deffinately sign up. Some Japanese Buddist priests believed that the Kami (spirits or ghosts) who controlled the world could take humans to different times, I can see my daimyo taking his army on a 'magic journey' to conquer the 'strange devils' in another world. :D

Very interesting here. I would also agree with Chronosia on this point. I think with moderation or control, it is indeed possible for different techs to do battle with one another. I role play as medieval tech, Japanese samurai to be exact, and I think the idea of my samurai army heading it off against a future tech or modern tech nation would be interesting. Since, for one thing, as an ft nation you tend to forget and don't appriciate what the old sword wielders could do, escpecially the Japanese. I could see a medieval army using its inginuity and raw skill giving a laser computer-boy a run for his money.

So, if someone makes the thread, I will deffinately sign up. Some Japanese Buddist priests believed that the Kami (spirits or ghosts) who controlled the world could take humans to different times, I can see my daimyo taking his army on a 'magic journey' to conquer the 'strange devils' in another world. :D


Now THAT, is a good idea!

Since, for one thing, as an ft nation you tend to forget and don't appriciate what the old sword wielders could do, escpecially the Japanese.
I beg to disagree, all officers in my army are issued a Mk. VI standard issue sabre.

As for the rp idea, that sounds fun!

I also fail to agree; many of my Imperial Officers and Commisars have sabres; and each of my Primarchs and my Emperor are skilled in close combat depending on their weapons; axe, sword, scythe, etc

I simply mean in underestimating your enemy. The US Calvary underestimated the Native Indians for years during the time of Western expansion, and in the Indian wars, causing a lot of deaths. (Custer, that idiotic fool, lost some 300 men because he underestimated them)

The same could be said for the French when they invaded Indo-China, the still sword weilding natives took quite a few frechmen to hell with them before the full force of technology pulled Indochina under France.

On the other hand you have the Brits holding off the entire Zulu army :P

that would be an interesting battle, Samaraui vs The Marines...

i definatly think the Marines would win, but the samaraui would take quite a few Marines with them before they go...

Chronosia, thats hardly a comparison. That totally disses the British Army. Comparing them with the french like that. :D (I have no respect what-so-ever for the french army, except for the Foreign Legion; and they weren't french)

Chronosia, thats hardly a comparison. That totally disses the British Army. Comparing them with the french like that. :D (I have no respect what-so-ever for the french army, except for the Foreign Legion; and they weren't french)
The French Army isn't totally worthless; they're good for target practice...
And the French cuisine is underestimated, there's nothing better than to lay French bread next German bread and watching it surrender.

The specific reason I maintain a Modern Tech Military, is because I want to RP with MT Nations. I may RP Future Tech most of the time, but I severly enjoy the MT scene, even PMT.

Its not to say that I would greatly enjoy a FT vs. MT battle, either me being MT or FT. It doesn't matter to me, I just try to keep things balanced. I ask questions, try to maintain the RP, and try to ensure that everythings OK with the other RPer.

Anywho, thats my two-cents.

(As an edit, if another RPer doesn't accept aliens, which I haven't seen yet, then I just use my Human Pop. It doesn't matter to me. Most of my MT rp's are human based, anyway.)

Ummm, just to clear things up, the French Army is perhaps one of the strongest armies in Europe, more so than the British Army. They have always been like that - they've just had low moral throughout their wars because of poor leadership. The British haven't had much in the way of military sucesses since 1917 either.

Thats true, they had to deal with Monty. I think the French army in itelf isn't too bad, other than its leaders. Give me a short corsican any day, and you have yourself a grand ole army.

Couldn't someone just use their main RP tech level and use a NPC nation as the other tech level one? That way, they can have other player Nations join in on both sides.

I'm all up for it. Someone just make the link.

PS- Come look at my nation intro : http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=9735258#post9735258

I found this pic and jsut had to show it. :D

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b184/Upum/Samurai/gi_sam2.jpg

((OC- Wow, I got mentioned as an FT that can be rped with. *wipes a tear* ..sorry, emotional moment. =^^= ))

I found this pic and jsut had to show it. :D

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b184/Upum/Samurai/gi_sam2.jpg

Dang, where did you find that pic? =oo=

Oh, the secrets I'm privy too! Mwuahaha. Nah, its a scene from the movie 'GI Samurai' where a Japanese modern army company somehow winds up in medieval japan. Good movie, but old, so none of those fun fun special pixel affects.

BUMP

Bump

Hmm, interesting find.

Indeed. Makes me wonder how the Japanese film industry works over there. =^^=

That, Gaian, we may never know... (presses the cd player and waits as errie music starts)

If you want to do a MT vs FT thread, just take a look at series like Stargate: SG-1, Stargate: Atlantis, and First Wave and movies like Stargate and Independence Day.

Seaquest has a point there...you could even say MT vs PT. Some of the civilizations they encounter in SG1 and SG Atlantis are primitive.

Yes. If one nation or group of nations in the thread is designated the good guy(s), then, no matter the odds, they are practically guaranteed the win.

Yup, I agree with both of you guys. If anyone wants to see a PT battle, come to the thread that Thrash started! Its getting good!

Yup, I agree with both of you guys. If anyone wants to see a PT battle, come to the thread that Thrash started! Its getting good!

Link?

lol, sry. here you go: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=447997

lol, sry. here you go: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=447997

Thanks.