NationStates Jolt Archive

FASAN commanders after seeing that the Gan ning would need backing up at closer ranges have ordered the development of a short range version.

Name: Sun Jian Type Ia SSM Anti-Shipping missile
Length: 3.8m
Wing span: 0.98m
Diameter: 0.4m
Range: 110 Km
Speed: 350 m/s (Mach 1)
Flight altitude: 4m
Payload: 215kg time delay HE warhead
Weight: 640kg
Penetration: 48 cm of reinforced steel
Guidance: Active Radar
Propulsion:
2x Han Taik LK-12(i) solid-fuel boosters
1x Han Taik T-3b turbojet sustainer engine
Launch Type: Costal, Naval, Aircraft
Launch Method: Closed bottom multi launch-container
Launch angle: 11 to 65 degrees
Estimated price per unit: 750,000 USD


Description:
The Sun Jian utilises a standard wave skimming pop-up attack strategy on targets.

Launcher:
The launcher unit used in costal and naval situations uses a four-missile box unit. On aircraft missiles are usually attached to rails.

OOC: Nice job, but we already use a modifed BunkerBuster bomb for antiship duties.

OOC: Only 48cm of penetration? Man my cruisers and even some destroyers could take that.

OOC: That's still more than a foot of armor. Do your ships have 1 foot of armor on all sides?

OOC: Everything cruiser and above does, destroyers do in certain places, and the srmor is stronger then reinforced steel.

He's got a better missile....trust me. Even if your ship have two feet of armor its gonna go right through on his better one.

OOC: Even if he's got a penetration of 1000mm he's not gonna get my cruisers depending on where the missile hits, any of my Battleships, Carriers of SD's can take 1000mm with ease.

But don't get me wrong, it's a good missile.

[OOC: I saw your old missile, but when most of the conversation was developed I was in Spain, so I couldn't contribute anything. On terms of range, especially what Axis Nova said, don't pay attention to anything they told you. The SS-N-19 anti-shipping missile, which is considered old generation in Nation States, has a range of five hundred kilometers, consequently, the range to your older anti-ship missile was more than adequate.

An ICBM has a range of around three thousand to six thousand kilometers, while yours had a range of around four hundred kilometers last time I saw it.]

nice

OOC: Even if he's got a penetration of 1000mm he's not gonna get my cruisers depending on where the missile hits, any of my Battleships, Carriers of SD's can take 1000mm with ease.

But don't get me wrong, it's a good missile.

Oh yes...the SDs...my nation can take those out pretty quickly... Anything that big and the large and that armoured has a nice weak spot in all that armor.

So before you go waving massive SD's and thinking they are the beginning of the end for any nation, just remember that one ITTY BITTY INSTY TINY WITTLE FLAW!

OOC: With the range, it's irrelevant whether the missile was designed in 1978 or 1998 - unless somehow one's engine has its fuel efficiency magically tripled or even quadrupled (which is highly unlikely with those capable of achieving high speeds), you can expect a similar range. Factors such as payload (the more, the shorter range it is unless you increase the missile's size itself), speed (higher speed automatically consumes much more fuel), altitude (at higher altitudes, air density is lower thus your missiles will have an easier time), airframe design, engine type, and targeting (don't tell me your 3000km missile is tied to magic satellites and can automatically compensate for the movement of the advesary's ships :rolleyes: there had been IRL, not surprisingly, enough problems with long-range AShMs in terms of fratricide/hitting neutrals even with direct datalinks with aircraft) all affect a missile's range.

In this case, the date of design of the missile is irrelevant: what is relevant is the components in it. So far, I don't expect to see any missile that can fly 3000km at a speed of Mach 5, and carrying something like a warhead that is 1/3 of the missile's total weight, and /still/ can be carried on an aircraft. Sorry, it's not happening - dates are irrelevant.

OOC: And how would you do that? Unless your PMT or FT SDs can take alot of damage.

(Let's continue this throug TG as not to clutter the thread)

[OOC: It is relevant corcerning modern superalloys and other metallic composites, consequently affecting frame construction, as well as modern fuel injection processes. So, there are minor advances in military technology which would effect how much range to allow. Nonetheless, a 3,000 kilometer range for an anti-shipping would be ludicrous, and that's not what I was implying. What I was saying was that a range of five hundred kilometers is possible. Of course, it has a lot to do with the size of the fuel deposit, wether it's a sea-skimmer or a standard cruise missiles, and the size of the warhead, but that's not what I was trying to discuss - I was trying to make it noticed that just because it's classified as an anti-shipping missile doesn't mean it has to have a range of fifty kilometers.]

-snip-

Umm...what do you mean. This range is of 110 km, and it goes Mach 1. This is completely possible in MT. Even the Harpoon is a better weapon.

Umm...what do you mean. This range is of 110 km, and it goes Mach 1. This is completely possible in MT. Even the Harpoon is a better weapon.
OOC: If you ever noticed, I was replying to another comment about missile ranges in the thread. Which I consider, is relevant.

OOC: If you ever noticed, I was replying to another comment about missile ranges in the thread. Which I consider, is relevant.

Oops, sorry disregard then. Considering the last missile was kinda like the specs you were talking about, I thought this was a little fire on him to. It took like 5 versions, but it is good now....now this missile is fine and I hear complaints. I just didn't get what it was about.

Oops, sorry disregard then. Considering the last missile was kinda like the specs you were talking about, I thought this was a little fire on him to. It took like 5 versions, but it is good now....now this missile is fine and I hear complaints. I just didn't get what it was about.
OOC: I should've clarified who I just responded to as well, perhaps.

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Overall, I'd say that the specs of this missile looks somewhat fine, and the range could increase somewhat by about 2-3x. Pop up is nice, but should be optional considering that the pop-up phase is what makes the missile /extremely/ vulnerable to close-in defence systems. Other than that, the penetration figure still seems a bit high (I'd recall that the Harpoon itself had a figure of around 4 inch/10.16 cm - this missile, due to its speed and warhead, could have a higher penetration figure, but 18 inch is probably a bit too high).

A good start at designing munitions!

OOC: I should've clarified who I just responded to as well, perhaps.

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Overall, I'd say that the specs of this missile looks somewhat fine, and the range could increase somewhat by about 2-3x. Pop up is nice, but should be optional considering that the pop-up phase is what makes the missile /extremely/ vulnerable to close-in defence systems. Other than that, the penetration figure still seems a bit high (I'd recall that the Harpoon itself had a figure of around 4 inch/10.16 cm - this missile, due to its speed and warhead, could have a higher penetration figure, but 18 inch is probably a bit too high).

A good start at designing munitions!

Well a thing with the penetration is that the armor type is not listed. So stronger or weaker armor or even poor quality armor can be affected differently. If you have a wood ship this thing will penetrate only 18 inches? If it was solid DU armor would it still go 18 inches? That's the problem really. Comparing the penetration when a main stat isn't listed clearly, it could be something else.

I wonder what Nimitz-class carriers armor is though. I have never been able to find it. How thick is it and would a missile like this or a Harpoon be able to break through?

OoC: whats next the Zhou Yu?or the Zhuge Liang? or perhaps the Sima Yi?

lol no the rest of the RotTK cast appear as names for my ships. Though i do sometimes steal parts of their names for my characters.

on to the talk about the missile, some people say the penetration is too low and oters say it is too high so im going to keep it as it is.

I might however increase the range a tiny ittle bit along with the payload.
Does everyone think that is feasable?

Name: Sun Jian Type Ib SSM Anti-Shipping missile
Length: 3.8m
Wing span: 0.98m
Diameter: 0.4m
Range: 120 Km
Speed: 350 m/s (Mach 1)
Flight altitude: 4m
Payload: 235kg time delay HE warhead
Weight: 640kg
Penetration: 260 mm of reinforced steel
Guidance: Active Radar
Propulsion:

2x Han Taik LK-12(i) solid-fuel boosters
1x Han Taik T-3b turbojet sustainer engine

Launch Type: Costal, Naval, Aircraft
Launch Method: Closed bottom multi launch-container
Launch angle: 11 to 65 degrees
Estimated price per unit: 750,000 USD


Description:
The Sun Jian utilises a standard wave skimming attack strategy on targets, with option of a pop up manuever.

Launcher:
The launcher unit used in costal and naval situations uses a four-missile box unit. On aircraft missiles are usually attached to rails.



So what do people think of this version.

Last Call before it is confirmed