NationStates Jolt Archive

What the title says, I RP MTG slivers and it's almost impossible to find an RP that won't ignore me for being non-human, why is that?

[OOC: In FT, I play Omar Guilds, and I have not ignored you, I just have been busy with other things.]

[OOC: In FT, I play Omar Guilds, and I have not ignored you, I just have been busy with other things.]

I know not everyone ignores non-human nations, I'm saying most, almost every other RP I try to get involved in ignores non-humans almost as a matter of principle.

Your slivers are really wanky. You use your entire population for your military, and mobilize millions of slivers in an instant, and they have all sorts of powers. My advice:

Play a condensed, edited form of slivers with technology, different roles in society, and basically mroe adaptible to generally accepted NS play.

Honestly my theory is that it's because most of the good RP's are either closed, earths, or character RP's, which I don't do very well, everybody left that isn't in the above categories, with some noted exceptions(Aust and Omar right off the top of my head, theres more I just can't think of them right now) seems to hate NH nations, or in the case of the earths I've looked at you pretty much have to be human to join.

IMO there should be two new forums, one for FT rps and one for Earth RP's, closed RPs should be limited somehow...
Its not gonna happen though :P

Several nations play slivers like that, and are prominant members of the NS community.

Would I ignore you? Nope, because then I'd have to ignore myself, being a 99% non human nation.

Several nations play slivers like that, and are prominant members of the NS community.

Would I ignore you? Nope, because then I'd have to ignore myself, being a 99% non human nation.
Well, yes, I suppose, but I felt as if it was a bit much. But each to their own, I suppose. I was giving advice on what some people that ignore the Slviers might use as an argument.

What are slivers? Just curious... Warheaven, a RP'er in the Temporal Symposium is RP'ing as slivers, and he RP's them as some kind of snake or something?

Could someone enlighten me on what slivers are, and where they come from (book, movie, etc)?

Your slivers are really wanky. You use your entire population for your military, and mobilize millions of slivers in an instant, and they have all sorts of powers. My advice:

Play a condensed, edited form of slivers with technology, different roles in society, and basically mroe adaptible to generally accepted NS play.

I'm playing them as they were originated in MTG, a hive society that has everyone able to fight, although I did change and seriously tone down alot of the abilities, the Crypt Sliver for example(which I didn't use) would have run something like this:

Crypt Sliver: All slivers can bring other slivers back from the dead

definitely not acceptable, so I canned it.

Sliver hive culture and physiology pretty much removes the ability of the slivers to develop any sort of non-biological sliver-based technology(meaning all sliver technology is basically contained in the slivers themselves) a being without hands cannot use a gun, or at least not a conventional gun, and a non-conventional gun would cause just as many fits as being non-human does.

I mobilised all of them because without the whole hive I would have been crushed in a blindsided slaughter by the Decimators, the whole sliver hive is an army, they can all fight to varying degrees of success(mnemonic slivers don't make good shock troopers for example) and they all do if necessary. The queen is very anti-imperialist and would see the sebecians actions as a possible threat to her given time, so she said "If we kill them now they can't kill us later" and went to do it, since the Omar removed her reason and the sebecians backed down she backed off. A single sliver is pretty easy to kill, but with just one dead sliver out of 3 million(a pretty much minimum number required for any sort of effectiveness) it's not so bad, whereas one dead out of say a hundred is a full 1% total reduction in force and probably the loss of an ability for the force in question as well.

All slivers are different roles in society, various castes if you will, but each caste can perform the duties of certain other castes to a greater or lesser degree of success. A sliver is a part of a whole, they don't attack in just a thousand or so, they swarm, they're practically insects, if you've ever kicked an ant hill you know the idea, and they serve the specialised general role in society that ants do, worker ants work, but they can fight, they're not very good at it, but they can fight, warrior ants don't just guard, they serve other roles as well, it's the same thing witrh slivers.

What are slivers? Just curious... Warheaven, a RP'er in the Temporal Symposium is RP'ing as slivers, and he RP's them as some kind of snake or something?

Could someone enlighten me on what slivers are, and where they come from (book, movie, etc)?

They're a creature from the card game magic the gathering, warhaven is pretty much right about them being snake things, so I'll just post the sliver factbook I made and hope that helps. http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8812927&postcount=3

This is a question I'd be very interested in seeing the answers to.

What the title says, I RP MTG slivers and it's almost impossible to find an RP that won't ignore me for being non-human, why is that?

Well, the reason I don't RP with sliver nations is because those kind of creatures scare the heck out of me. ;)

Well the thing about silvers is is that they're not very... believeable... in my narrow-minded view of the world. I can always imagine my soldiers trying to fight off hoards of flying silver-thingies, but I like fighting against people that use guns. Nothing against silver-using nations, of course; some of them are very good RP-ers. I also don't want to take the time to learn about all the different kinds of the things.

You should TG Warhaven. He's a buddy of mine, and he's an all Sliver nation.

(*Is an all Drow nation. ^_^ *) He rps very well, so it's a pleasure to be part of his rp circle.

I've played with insect folk.
I've played with furries.
I've played with Opusian penguins.
I've played with dinosaurians.
I've played with minotaurs.
I've played with Lycans.
I've played with Aliens. And Predators.
I've played with ratpeople.
I've played with... you get the idea.

I would not play with slivers.

Why?

Very wanky. Every description looks like you took it directly out of the card game - and most would not aid society in any meaningful fashion. As such, we could not see "variable evolution" giving way to such a thing as it is described here. Everything is centered around combat and combat abilities, and as such, makes the race generally unplayable.

There are certain aspects which simply don't work. "Toxin, 60% fatal without antivenom, 10% with". Sounds gamey. Toxins have problems when they cross lines, particularly neurotoxins - when you're dealing with something not from your solar system, how do you know the chemicals you are toxifying are even present?

Our reaction would be "Nuke it from orbit. Repeatedly. It's the only way to be sure". Followed by "Don't worry about them".

Now, if you have something to show this as playable and not an "argh, combat!" species, we might consider it. However, as presented - heck no.

We will also add - that you even play this race makes you look even worse in view of your "my FT race will attack an MT race, it's fair!" stance earlier. These things are highly unfair in combat, period.

There is plenty non-human filth in FT, maybe you should try that era. If you're interested in it, that is.

"filth"?

Oh ye of little... *ahem*

Alright, first, I am a Non-human player...

The Sacred Sindarin Empire of Aelosia is an elven Empire, of Tolkien-based, inmortal and awesome elves. Even more, it is a Empire of Tolkien based elves using FTL drives for allmighty starships that can travel faster than light and enter warp dimensions. they use Eldar weaponry from the Warhammer 40,000 range, including levitating tanks, monomolecular needles, growing regenerative armor and half-bionic biologic implants...

Is that wanky?. I'm sure it is, from a special point of view...

Almost everything you can do is wanky, with the clear exception of historical based nations that place themselves in the 21th century and fight wars and develop a culture like the ones we know...

Yet, you have absolutely every right to play a sliver nation. As a matter of fact, I find the concept very interesting and know at least another 50 players of this roleplaying game that would think the same as me, all of them talented AND experienced players who display a high amount of quality in their roleplay.

I'm familiar with the slivers from the Magic: The Gathering game, and I know that their hive culture and their all-or-nothing way to live, their increased evolution rate and their society as a whole, with all the possibilities over it, could be wanky. We had a problem like this one when we roleplayed a war with a Tyranid player...(You need to be familiar with the Warhammer 40k range to be familiar with Tyranids, but as a whole, they're similar to the Aliens of the "Alien" movie, and could be defined as "space slivers"), but then he managed to present his Hive Fleet as an interesting force attacking Mars and all the nations that colonized it, and presented a fresh and wonderful rp to almost all involved, making us forget the wanky possibilities of such army and instead making us really enjoying the rp as a whole.

What's my point with this little warped speech?. My elves could be wanky, aye, to most modern-day tech nation, as your slivers are. It is not easy to stop slivers with M-16 rifles and normal marines...Then the main problem is about choosing the right rping partners. Most modern day nations will ignore you because they're not interested in you, but many others, not modern-day based, could display an interest for your concept if it suits them.

Why I can rolplay those wanky elves and most of the time get away with it?. I roleplay them with FLAWS, as any culture and civilization does...They're agile and nimble far beyond human imagination, but also frail and delicate. They are wonderful snipers, but make poor shock troops. They're disciplined and brave, but they usually engage the enemy outnumbered two to one. the secret to not be labeled as a wanky players is to not roleplay your people as invincible and over powerful, but instead to give them the edge of having weak points.

There are thousands of ways to be wanky, starting with the 500,000 nuclear heads most countries sport, even as they are modern day nations. Nations capable of mobilizing million of troops in just a day, that's wanky. Playing non-humans is a way to be wanky is you're unable to present them as a force that CAN be beaten. So I encourage you to keep roleplaying your slivers, although making them interesting not only for you, but also for the other players involved in each one of your roleplaying threads. Good Luck with everything.

From Vastiva:

"Our reaction would be "Nuke it from orbit. Repeatedly. It's the only way t be sure". Followed by "Don't worry about them".-----> Now even this can be wanky, if you can assume that your nation is capable of really nuking an entire population from the orbit. It is easy to judge, but only with detailed and interesting roleplay something can be catalogued as wanky. Not even nations of my size and tech level would assume that you can easily nuke an entire nation from orbit with ortillery.


And this one was another Advise for a Better and More Satisfying Roleplay...

Thanks for reading:

Aelosia's Player

From Vastiva:

"Our reaction would be "Nuke it from orbit. Repeatedly. It's the only way t be sure". Followed by "Don't worry about them".-----> Now even this can be wanky, if you can assume that your nation is capable of really nuking an entire population from the orbit. It is easy to judge, but only with detailed and interesting roleplay something can be catalogued as wanky. Not even nations of my size and tech level would assume that you can easily nuke an entire nation from orbit with ortillery.


And this one was another Advise for a Better and More Satisfying Roleplay...

Thanks for reading:

Aelosia's Player

... hmmm, someone who didn't get the movie reference (to Aliens)... Meh. So yes, the response you gave looks mildly silly.

In short, I would not choose to play with such a species - as presented, without flaws and with only massive plusses depending on what was there. Given the wide range of abilities, dropping hordes of nuclear weapons (or rocks - kinetic damage is so reassuring) would seem the only plausible answer.

Or if you want to go really far FT, destroy the whole planet or make the sun go nova.

The Ascendancy Sphere also heavily rps with non-human civilizations, with one in particular, the Ascendant Avian Lords, the core reason why the Ascendancy even exists as it does.

Non-human also extends into the spiritual realm, as we have Angelics within the Ascendancy Sphere. In fact, we have humans, Avian Lords, Angelics, Krysallians, Energon, Grecians, and far many more, all across several galaxies, and across 3,000+ Star Systems within our sphere.

In the end though, the core leaders are still human, on the surface at least. =^^=

I'm strictly PMT but I'm engaged in a wargame scenerio against goblins with demonic gophers as an ally. I don't care. The problem with non humans is that its hard to be sure, a lot of people rp non humans because what ever race their playing is 'superior' and thats not the way to go about it, you end up with a wanktastic race that no one will play with, you have to think of a story for your race, I usually invent an environment first, what kind of terrain does their home planet have, what kind of wildlife, plant life, atmosphere, what part of the food chain do they belong to, what toher species do they have symbbiotic or parasitic relationships with? and from there you can assign advantages that would be useful for survival in this environment, and disadvantages that could result in leaving it. I have a race that is very predatory, claws, very agile and muscular, stealthy, relatively damage resistant skin, all in all something most people wouldn't want to RP with. except that originally they relied on pheromones released from some native plant life when disturbed to more easily hunt a detect prey, the problem was that the pheromones were addictive, so when they leave their home planet they have to some how deal with the addiction or they weaken and go crazy and stuff, and because of the atmosphere fo their home planet they have trouble breathing in an earthlike atmosphere. and a few other disadvantages. the key is to have fun.

personally, slivers are very easy to get very wanktastic with, you have to come up with some reasonable weaknesses, some limits to the power sharing and stuff like that.

BTW: I;ve always wondered: with no hands or other manipulative appendages, how exactly did slivers achieve interstellar travel?

WARNING!!!

To make the sun go nova is the worst wanking ever!!!!

Do not try it at home!!!

You'll be ignored by anyone with at least some conscience of being serious!!!

Erhm...that's all. I personally prefer slivers over suns going novas by someone's hands. Thanks

The problem with non humans is that its hard to be sure, a lot of people rp non humans because what ever race their playing is 'superior' and thats not the way to go about it, you end up with a wanktastic race that no one will play with, you have to think of a story for your race, I usually invent an environment first, what kind of terrain does their home planet have, what kind of wildlife, plant life, atmosphere, what part of the food chain do they belong to, what toher species do they have symbbiotic or parasitic relationships with? and from there you can assign advantages that would be useful for survival in this environment, and disadvantages that could result in leaving it.Bold by me

*Basks in being the most extreme example he is aware of*

WARNING!!!

To make the sun go nova is the worst wanking ever!!!!

Do not try it at home!!!

You'll be ignored by anyone with at least some conscience of being serious!!!

Erhm...that's all. I personally prefer slivers over suns going novas by someone's hands. Thanks

Are you, like, serious? Because you are turning out to be somewhat amusing. :D

My nation has running SETI program... I'm still waiting for any word ;)
My problem is: can you RP your nation in a way that I'll feel that it's extra-terrestial? 'Couse I don't want to deal with humanoid, feudal society with technology and philosophy that is based on that from Sol 3...
For me non-human doesn't mean "less human" or "non-human apperance" or "non-human gov. style". It means non-human (almost) everything! Master of Orion 3 was the most realistic game/movie about space-empire ever... But it was getting boring fast and was to complicated for me ;)

[OOC: I ignore your Slivers because you use them to have your entire population in the military and give them all ub3r weapons that dont need ammunition.]

The reason I would not RP with your Slivers or whatever? Because nothing like a gas that I know of increases the length of talons, or the strength of them. Thats just stupid.

Birds are much better to base things off, that or reptiles.

ooc: I'm confused here, what are these 'silvers' you talk of.
Enlighten me.

Well the thing about silvers is is that they're not very... believeable... in my narrow-minded view of the world. I can always imagine my soldiers trying to fight off hoards of flying silver-thingies, but I like fighting against people that use guns. Nothing against silver-using nations, of course; some of them are very good RP-ers. I also don't want to take the time to learn about all the different kinds of the things.

Nicley put. Simply, that is probably the main reason that you are under the impression you're being ignored. Personally, I don't like the whole idea of a non-human nation. Though, as Burnsian said; Some of them are very good Roleplayers. I have nothing against fantasy style roleplay, however I do believe there is a time and place for fantasy RP. I think having two sperate forums is actually a rather good idea. I for one, don't really wish to roleplay with an elven prince or orcish warlord.

Modern weaponry, specilization, democracy, dictatorship, and tactics that of the current and modern day government are much more realistically based on the decisions made in N.S.

Though, as I said. I have nothing against fantasy roleplay. But also, as I said, I don't think it fits in and I for one probably won't dileberatly join into an RP concerning them.

Are you, like, serious? Because you are turning out to be somewhat amusing. :D

I AM trying to be amusing. Yet, there is a serious part on that post. Making suns going nova is a wank that noone is going to accept at all :)

I'm strictly PMT but I'm engaged in a wargame scenerio against goblins with demonic gophers as an ally. I don't care. The problem with non humans is that its hard to be sure, a lot of people rp non humans because what ever race their playing is 'superior' and thats not the way to go about it, you end up with a wanktastic race that no one will play with, you have to think of a story for your race, I usually invent an environment first, what kind of terrain does their home planet have, what kind of wildlife, plant life, atmosphere, what part of the food chain do they belong to, what toher species do they have symbbiotic or parasitic relationships with? and from there you can assign advantages that would be useful for survival in this environment, and disadvantages that could result in leaving it. I have a race that is very predatory, claws, very agile and muscular, stealthy, relatively damage resistant skin, all in all something most people wouldn't want to RP with. except that originally they relied on pheromones released from some native plant life when disturbed to more easily hunt a detect prey, the problem was that the pheromones were addictive, so when they leave their home planet they have to some how deal with the addiction or they weaken and go crazy and stuff, and because of the atmosphere fo their home planet they have trouble breathing in an earthlike atmosphere. and a few other disadvantages. the key is to have fun.

personally, slivers are very easy to get very wanktastic with, you have to come up with some reasonable weaknesses, some limits to the power sharing and stuff like that.

BTW: I;ve always wondered: with no hands or other manipulative appendages, how exactly did slivers achieve interstellar travel?


By using the winged sliver, leaving the atmosphere and taking a very long time to get anywhere.

I've got some pretty massive limits to power sharing, most of them don't exceed ten meters, some don't exceed ten feet.

The reason I would not RP with your Slivers or whatever? Because nothing like a gas that I know of increases the length of talons, or the strength of them. Thats just stupid.

Birds are much better to base things off, that or reptiles.

It pulls the skin away from the talon, by doing that the talon is effectively lengthened, like when a person dies and the skin draws away from their fingernails. A combination of chemicals contained in the surface of the talon and the pheromone mix together and form a harder sheath for the talon, it's like mixing things together and getting something that sets really hard, and consequently since it's on something sharp, really sharp.

[OOC: I ignore your Slivers because you use them to have your entire population in the military and give them all ub3r weapons that dont need ammunition.]

That's interesting, cause your army must have some issues if their bladed weapons require ammo. The only ranged weapon any sliver posesses is the chemical flamethrower, which runs out pretty fast, that has a range of only 100 yards, pretty small compared to any gun on the market. A sliver is a weapon, it's that simlpe, they were genetically engineered to be weapons, it is their only designed purpose, after achieving their freedom they utilised their combat abilities to build a civilisation, since that was all they had to work with. They aren't up against very good odds facing a modern army outfitted with anything better than an M-16, since the bullets can hit them alot farther away than they can hit back.

Here you know what, if anybody can come up with seven slivers that don't have an ability that can be used outside of combat I'll stop using slivers, all noncombat ability uses will be detailed as the cases are presented to me.

First of all, its not that you're nonhuman (at least I dont thinks thats why) its that you use your enitre population in your army. This is a big no no for anybody. This alone is likely to get you ignored on sight. Add that to the fact that your tech is utterly wank tastic... it only makes things worse. So my advice to you is to seriously rework things with your current nation or make the move to modern tech.

First of all, its not that you're nonhuman (at least I dont thinks thats why) its that you use your enitre population in your army. This is a big no no for anybody. This alone is likely to get you ignored on sight. Add that to the fact that your tech is utterly wank tastic... it only makes things worse. So my advice to you is to seriously rework things with your current nation or make the move to modern tech.

Disd you even read the reasoning for those situations and occurences, or consider that they are at a huge disadvantage against just about anybody when they're at over 100 yards, one on one human with M-16 versus Muscle sliver at fifty yards the human is gonna win, unlesst the human does something stupid.

Disd you even read the reasoning for those situations and occurences, or consider that they are at a huge disadvantage against just about anybody when they're at over 100 yards, one on one human with M-16 versus Muscle sliver at fifty yards the human is gonna win, unlesst the human does something stupid.

Well, let me say that im sure that the RP community doesnt care since you still use your enitre population for your army.

(and youre trying to use these things in MT?)

So far I've got:
toxin sliver
barbed sliver
synapse sliver
mindwhip sliver
spined sliver
horned sliver
and maybe Acidic sliver

Not that I don't want you to use slivers or anything, if thats what you want to do then do it, but you should at least creae non comabatant slivers and not mobilise the entire population for any reason other than immanent nuclear anhiliation

You should probably stick to using slivers in FT. No MT nation is going to want to, or be able to, face a 67 million strong wave of death. Without nukes at least...

So far I've got:
toxin sliver
barbed sliver
synapse sliver
mindwhip sliver
spined sliver
horned sliver
and maybe Acidic sliver

Not that I don't want you to use slivers or anything, if thats what you want to do then do it, but you should at least creae non comabatant slivers and not mobilise the entire population for any reason other than immanent nuclear anhiliation

I'll give you toxin, barbed, spined and mindwhip.

Synapse can be useful in the queens breeding programs(and are being used in that capacity in an RP with Omar).

Horned sliver isn't on the list and does not apply in this case.

Acidic sliver can be used in conjunction with drones to carve out the mountain the hive lives in, the acidic blood is much more effective than digging with your hands.

You should probably stick to using slivers in FT. No MT nation is going to want to, or be able to, face a 67 million strong wave of death. Without nukes at least...

I wouldn't use more than a million against a medium sized MT nation, I'd use as much as necessary against a big nation like RB or AMF, but not a small to medium nation, and since the kill ratio would be about ten to one until I reached melee the fight would be pretty fair for the MT nation, although I will admit I haven't tried to use them in very many MT RPs, just one with Dumpsterdam and another with the crisis of secession dude, I forget who it was right now.

I wouldn't use more than a million against a medium sized MT nation, I'd use as much as necessary against a big nation like RB or AMF, but not a small to medium nation, and since the kill ratio would be about ten to one until I reached melee the fight would be pretty fair for the MT nation, although I will admit I haven't tried to use them in very many MT RPs, just one with Dumpsterdam and another with the crisis of secession dude, I forget who it was right now.

Can you explain the logistics of this?

*Admits to being completely and utterly oblivious of slivers*

But anyway, given that I recognise a Tyranid nation with its entire population in the military (Hive Fleet Sicarius), given that I have several nations with concepts that are blatantly, errr... Disregarding things like, uh, the economy...

Well, to put it simple: It does not depend on sheer numbers. It depends on the way you play it. Having a nation that has its entire population in the military, due to $Backstory, works, so long as basic NS stats are recognised (And sometimes, if you manage to raise sufficient interest, you don't even need to do that... Admittedly, such does generally require ooc agreements and predefined storylines).

So, for Mini Miehm this would mean that his entire population in the army still means that his overall capacities with regards to achiving a given goal are still in no way better than the capacities of a nation with comparable game statistics but a different (Lets say, more conventional) backstory/ playing style.

Which is, generally, achived through downplaying during peaceful interaction and simply taking horrendous casualities during violent interaction (A wonderful example being Newbish Delight, a Spacedy Goblin nation. It has more RPed ships than it has citizens, according to NS statistics. But the casualities the goblins take during, well, pretty much everything, be it peaceful or combat, balance it out).

And given the last few posts Mini Miehm made, I suspect him to pretty much intend, well, exactly that.

And if people scream bloody murder over numbers, well, their loss.

Can you explain the logistics of this?

No transports are required since they transport themselves through the winged slivers ability, food is what ever they find to eat, including dead enemies and slivers, pay is not given for being in the military, or anything else for that matter, since they live for the bettermenmt of the hive they wouldn't accept money for anything they do, the hive mind allows communication over long distances, it could be jammed by the proper chemical combinations but it's a pretty good way to do things, no ammunition costs since there are no guns, no equipment costs at all for that matter, since they couldn't use a tank if they had one.

*Admits to being completely and utterly oblivious of slivers*

But anyway, given that I recognise a Tyranid nation with its entire population in the military (Hive Fleet Sicarius), given that I have several nations with concepts that are blatantly, errr... Disregarding things like, uh, the economy...

Well, to put it simple: It does not depend on sheer numbers. It depends on the way you play it. Having a nation that has its entire population in the military, due to $Backstory, works, so long as basic NS stats are recognised (And sometimes, if you manage to raise sufficient interest, you don't even need to do that... Admittedly, such does generally require ooc agreements and predefined storylines).

So, for Mini Miehm this would mean that his entire population in the army still means that his overall capacities with regards to achiving a given goal are still in no way better than the capacities of a nation with comparable game statistics but a different (Lets say, more conventional) backstory/ playing style.

Which is, generally, achived through downplaying during peaceful interaction and simply taking horrendous casualities during violent interaction (A wonderful example being Newbish Delight, a Spacedy Goblin nation. It has more RPed ships than it has citizens, according to NS statistics. But the casualities the goblins take during, well, pretty much everything, be it peaceful or combat, balance it out).

And given the last few posts Mini Miehm made, I suspect him to pretty much intend, well, exactly that.

And if people scream bloody murder over numbers, well, their loss.

Thats pretty much the way it would run.

No transports are required since they transport themselves through the winged slivers ability, food is what ever they find to eat, including dead enemies and slivers, pay is not given for being in the military, or anything else for that matter, since they live for the bettermenmt of the hive they wouldn't accept money for anything they do, the hive mind allows communication over long distances, it could be jammed by the proper chemical combinations but it's a pretty good way to do things, no ammunition costs since there are no guns, no equipment costs at all for that matter, since they couldn't use a tank if they had one.

Thanks you just explained why most people will ignore you in a RP.

Thanks you just explained why most people will ignore you in a RP.

That doesn't make much sense, you are only considering the positive aspects of the sliver bond, instead of noticing the whole massive slaughter that would be involved in any combat against modern forces with assault rifles.

That doesn't make much sense, you are only considering the positive aspects of the sliver bond, instead of noticing the whole massive slaughter that would be involved in any combat against modern forces with assault rifles.

Or nukes, or disease warfare, or gas, or tanks, etc. etc.

Im going to put it bluntly, you need to use proper numbers for your military. Most people usually take around 5% of their population for their military (even this is stretching it). And this would most likely be in wartime only. Add that to the fact that youre ignoring all logisitcal requirements and giving your troops the power to fly = not a very good time for anyone. Maybe you would find more people to RP with in FT. I say this because the vast majority of people who RP MT are looking for realism. Not a fight with MT non-humans.

.

Horned sliver isn't on the list and does not apply in this case.


wait, what list? I was using the official wizrds of the coast card list, what list are you using?

And what about blade slivers?

Thanks you just explained why most people will ignore you in a RP.You ignore people for being incapable of using heavy equipment or ranged weapons? *Blinks*

Well, I guess you're of the honourable kind, not wanting your opponent to have, say, disadvantages.

You ignore people for being incapable of using heavy equipment or ranged weapons? *Blinks*

Well, I guess you're of the honourable kind, not wanting your opponent to have, say, disadvantages.

Considering im a logistics freak it seems unfair to me that just because his race are bugs(?) or whatever that he can ignore having to feed, or transport them. Hell, even the Tyranids had things to move them around (they ate everything though). So at the very minimum he could at least create some kind of transport or something.

wait, what list? I was using the official wizrds of the coast card list, what list are you using?

And what about blade slivers?

I'm using the list I came up with and toned down for use on NS, it's in one of the earlier posts.

Blade slivers would allow a drone to shape and form things much more exactly because of the increased sharpness of the talons, a drone could construct new area where the stone is weak in some spots and extreme tolerances must be maintained.

Considering im a logistics freak it seems unfair to me that just because his race are bugs(?) or whatever that he can ignore having to feed, or transport them. Hell, even the Tyranids had things to move them around (they ate everything though). So at the very minimum he could at least create some kind of transport or something.

The tyranids had a biological transport, my troops are a biological transport, I don't have to ignore feeding them, if theres nothing for them to eat I have to transport it somehow, very few of their abilities make them superior to any modern military force, the only one I can think of would be sending in a bunch of nuclear slivers, however since I only have like five of those that plan is pretty much out.

Actually if it makes you guys feel better I'll breed a transport sliver, big armored and pretty much like a zerg overlord in most respects, except for survivability.

The problem with Slivers as taken DIRECTLY from Magic is that you're only going to SEE the combat-oriented ones in the game. If I were a Planeswalker, why would I bother summoning the Dowsing Sliver, or the Construction Sliver, or the Painting Sliver?

In other words, if you want to make a viable Sliver nation, take a page from nature - base it on an insect colony/hive. Not EVERY bee is a warrior, not every ant is a warrior, there are always members of the population who serve other purposes than fighting.

THAT being said, I'd have no problem playing with an all-Sliver nation which has its total population as a military force. Because I'd just default to Magic strategy, and develop a "Wrath of God" or "Nev's Disk" to annihilate their entire population in one shot.

Twinkish? Sure it is. But so is what you're doing.

The problem with Slivers as taken DIRECTLY from Magic is that you're only going to SEE the combat-oriented ones in the game. If I were a Planeswalker, why would I bother summoning the Dowsing Sliver, or the Construction Sliver, or the Painting Sliver?

In other words, if you want to make a viable Sliver nation, take a page from nature - base it on an insect colony/hive. Not EVERY bee is a warrior, not every ant is a warrior, there are always members of the population who serve other purposes than fighting.

THAT being said, I'd have no problem playing with an all-Sliver nation which has its total population as a military force. Because I'd just default to Magic strategy, and develop a "Wrath of God" or "Nev's Disk" to annihilate their entire population in one shot.

Twinkish? Sure it is. But so is what you're doing.

Not Larry's disk, anything but that!!! I made noncombat slivers, the drones, all purpose menials, like the zerg creature of the same name, except for the whole turning into buildings part.

Ohh, two other things:

1) You'd almost never have the entire MILITARY-oriented population availible for direct attack at any time anyway - insect colonies almost ALWAYS isolate the Queen, and a good portion of combat-capable Slivers would have to remain near her for protection.

From an RP-oriented standpoint, killing the Queen would effectively destroy the entire population.


2) Slivers are basically the concept of hive-mind taken to the extreme - not only can they think as a single organism would, they can also use each other's special abilities. This bond makes it possible that someone could develop theoretical weapons which would strike through the bond.

In other words, someone could invent a gun which would strike one Sliver, which would then pass through the network to affect ALL nearby Slivers.

The key to solid (and FAIR) roleplaying is that for every positive your army possesses, there should be a negative - and all too often, the negative stems DIRECTLY from the positive.

Ohh, two other things:

1) You'd almost never have the entire MILITARY-oriented population availible for direct attack at any time anyway - insect colonies almost ALWAYS isolate the Queen, and a good portion of combat-capable Slivers would have to remain near her for protection.

From an RP-oriented standpoint, killing the Queen would effectively destroy the entire population.


2) Slivers are basically the concept of hive-mind taken to the extreme - not only can they think as a single organism would, they can also use each other's special abilities. This bond makes it possible that someone could develop theoretical weapons which would strike through the bond.

In other words, someone could invent a gun which would strike one Sliver, which would then pass through the network to affect ALL nearby Slivers.

The key to solid (and FAIR) roleplaying is that for every positive your army possesses, there should be a negative - and all too often, the negative stems DIRECTLY from the positive.

I'd go with that, unless the queen and the overlord mobilised, they're tough mother fuckers and they'd probably be able to take out a tank(not easily, but they should be able to do it) that said I wouldn't use the queen at anything other than greatest need, because the queen can fight sure as hell, but if she dies then I gotta hope my experimental breeding was a success and a queen would be able to take over from hibernation.

Personally i don't see much wrong with usign a hive race (be they Slivers, Aliens, Tyranids or Starship troopers Bugs) as long as you play it entertainingly.
Unfortuantly msot Modtech players or post mod players stick to RPing a more or less realistic earth comp[osed of creatures that exist in RL (ie humans only, no elves, goblins, orcs or bugs) mainly as it keeps thigns a bit simpler. Now when you move to future tech then non human races pretty much have to become part of the experience and a big Bug hunting war would no doubt be good fun and rather interesting.
Of coruse then if you want to be based on more than one planet you absolutly need soem sort of transport creature, unless all your creatures cna survive hard vacum for 1000s of years.

Not all people are RPing these 'sliver' things, but it sounds like I should be OK with a few people.

I say this because the vast majority of people who RP MT are looking for realism

Heh. Realism is a rare thing to see here, whether it be in FT or MT.

I AM trying to be amusing. Yet, there is a serious part on that post. Making suns going nova is a wank that noone is going to accept at all :)

OOC: Care to bet on that one?

By using the winged sliver, leaving the atmosphere and taking a very long time to get anywhere.

I've got some pretty massive limits to power sharing, most of them don't exceed ten meters, some don't exceed ten feet.

OOC: Uhm, it really doesn't make a difference, as biochemically, it doesn't work 'instantly'. And there's still nothing about any sort of relationality which makes them anything but bugger-warriors.

Well, I believe the ignoring of non-humanoid nations is caused by the lack of knowledge of their abilities and limitations. Most fools..erm..people believe that non-human means without weakness, which is most times untrue. All races, weapons, ships, etc have some sort of weakness, hell even the neigh invincible Death Star had a major weakness.

Someone take a look at my factbook.

I have nothing against Rping with a non-human nation, past, present or future.

Unfortuantly msot Modtech players or post mod players stick to RPing a more or less realistic earth comp[osed of creatures that exist in RL (ie humans only, no elves, goblins, orcs or bugs) mainly as it keeps thigns a bit simpler. Now when you move to future tech then non human races pretty much have to become part of the experience and a big Bug hunting war would no doubt be good fun and rather interesting.The amusing thing being that 99.99% of all MT/ post MT players are anything but realistic. A nation of several billion people, with an economy that exceed's the US per capita capacities? Unsupportable in any kind of 'realistic' scenario.

Next to zero technological development over decades, with multiple conflicts being fought out? What are they? Bugs?

RL territory based nations, fitting several billion people ona territory that fits less than 100mio IRL? No change in the landscape, no hyperurbanisation, no famines, everythign stays the way it was?

Yeah, right.

Frankly, the MT 'enthusiasts' are just plain kidding themselves when they claim to be realistic.

Modern tech is perfectly realistic. The 0 tech growth is odd, but it cant be done any other way. People trying to fit their nations into RL territory is stupid and unoriginal I agree, but not everyone does that.

The amusing thing being that 99.99% of all MT/ post MT players are anything but realistic. A nation of several billion people, with an economy that exceed's the US per capita capacities? Unsupportable in any kind of 'realistic' scenario.

...such as a planet stated to be "the size of Jupiter", or multiplanar, or however, involving hundreds of thousands of nations... :rolleyes:



Next to zero technological development over decades, with multiple conflicts being fought out? What are they? Bugs?

Not Guilty.



RL territory based nations, fitting several billion people ona territory that fits less than 100mio IRL? No change in the landscape, no hyperurbanisation, no famines, everythign stays the way it was?

Yeah, right.

I agree with you on this one.



Frankly, the MT 'enthusiasts' are just plain kidding themselves when they claim to be realistic.

I'll settle for "playable" each and every time. This is, after all, a game.

Alright, look.

This thread was made on the simple fact of curiosity of one man/woman/boy/girl's of why their nation was directly being ignored. It is rather clear that with the current circumstances of his RP there are some who would rather not play with such a nation and that there are some who would not mind doing so.

Now it's really starting to go out of hand and turning in to some kind of flame war over some stupid post regarding one persons curious efforts. The total fact that people are arguing so heavilly over something so stupid is somewhat beyond concievable. The truth is NationStates is hardly that detailed of a browser based game, it is simply the more you stick around the 'better' or 'greater' your nation gets and some choose to roleplay. No one has to roleplay, and quite frankly alot of the people who choose to suck at it.

As Vastiva stated, it is just a [skip over this part should you be offended easilly by harsh wording] God damned mother fucking game [you may continue reading] So everyone get over yourselves in thinking what you consider right to be right and wrong to be wrong just because perhaps you have been here longer than someone else or you claim to have more intelligence and realise that it's not real, it's really not that important and if they want your oppinion on why they are being ignored. Give them an oppinion. Not some f***ing flame against someone else who posted before you.

The amusing thing being that 99.99% of all MT/ post MT players are anything but realistic. A nation of several billion people, with an economy that exceed's the US per capita capacities? Unsupportable in any kind of 'realistic' scenario.

Next to zero technological development over decades, with multiple conflicts being fought out? What are they? Bugs?

RL territory based nations, fitting several billion people ona territory that fits less than 100mio IRL? No change in the landscape, no hyperurbanisation, no famines, everythign stays the way it was?

Yeah, right.

Frankly, the MT 'enthusiasts' are just plain kidding themselves when they claim to be realistic.

Hence why some of us play a rather more restricted type of RP ;)

Actually take the numbers side of it out and it is more or less realisitc, it is people dealing with people, yes soem of the tech does push the boundaries but many Rpers stuff is based priamrily on thier experience of the world aroudn them and intellignet life outside of Homo Spaiens simply doesn't exist there. most people see the world being made up of other people and write stories involving humans and warfare or a more or elss conventional level where space travel doesn't exist, which to them would be the only possible soruce of interaction with "other" races (apart from uplifted chimps, dolpfins and gorillas).

OOC: Care to bet on that one?

Yes. Try it in a serious thread and everyone will ignore you. Including me in the first place, yes. After all, if you can do it, I could undo it :P

Yes. Try it in a serious thread and everyone will ignore you. Including me in the first place, yes. After all, if you can do it, I could undo it :P

actually, super nova inducing weapons are FT's nukes, few people roleplays them well and they're rarely used but it isn't a always a wank or a god mode, I've seen a couple of supernovas induced thatwere very well RPed and weren't wanks

actually, super nova inducing weapons are FT's nukes, few people roleplays them well and they're rarely used but it isn't a always a wank or a god mode, I've seen a couple of supernovas induced thatwere very well RPed and weren't wanks

Not just nova weapons, but a lot of the big ultra-powerful FT toys. Planet destroying weapons, nova weapons, black hole weapons, so on and so forth are all FT's equivelent of nuclear weapons. They're strategic weapons that have no place in your average war and require the OOC consent of both parties to use in good faith.

I myself try to never ignore a race if its creator/RPer isn't a wanker of some type and rPs weaknesses as well as strengths.

So there. Also, all races out there, kindly slide on over to my thread and post your species description. Thanks! It'll help me determine who's out there....and who is to be shot on sight.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=417646

actually, super nova inducing weapons are FT's nukes, few people roleplays them well and they're rarely used but it isn't a always a wank or a god mode, I've seen a couple of supernovas induced thatwere very well RPed and weren't wanks

Aelosia, you lose the bet. :p

Modern tech is perfectly realistic. The 0 tech growth is odd, but it cant be done any other way. People trying to fit their nations into RL territory is stupid and unoriginal I agree, but not everyone does that.Care to explain how you get the resources for your multibillion nation? Oh, right, Jupiter sized planet. Care to explain why it has the gravity of earth?

It cannot be realistic. Different, yes. But not realistic.

...such as a planet stated to be "the size of Jupiter", or multiplanar, or however, involving hundreds of thousands of nations...Neither of which is realistic, no?

The 'No' is rhetoric

I'll settle for "playable" each and every time. This is, after all, a game.Oh, certainly. I have no problems with understanding the reasons for playing this way. I do however have a problem with claiming that it is realistic. NS is fundamentally unrealistic, and nothing can change that.

actually, super nova inducing weapons are FT's nukes, few people roleplays them well and they're rarely used but it isn't a always a wank or a god mode, I've seen a couple of supernovas induced thatwere very well RPed and weren't wanksAnd I would still tell anyone going that way to fuck off. The only nations I have that would recognise them are Ruet (Short for 'Ridiculous Übertech'), Holy Divine Trinity (God), and The NS Multiverse (Yes, you're a part of it, too. Everyone is). Needless to say, not a single one of this nations is even remotely serious.

And, as far as I'm aware of, in the circles Aelosia/ me are interacting, this is a somewhat, shall we say, common attitude?

And given that Aelosia is playing with friggin WH40K eldar stuffs, and me being at the very least a psychic cyborg nation in space, I would guess that we're kinda FTesque, no?

So, yeah, I would guess that inducing novas would result in, oh, quite a few people telling you that you're a wanker.

Aelosia, you lose the bet.She said serious thread. And as far as I am aware of, serious threads with suncrushing weapons don't exist. All I have seen were wankfests of magnificient proportions.

Amd indeed, given that NS nations generally fit on a single planet, I find it kinda hard to imagine an NS nations blowing up stars that wouldn't be of the ludicrous wank level. It would be kinda like a modernish nation throwing around multigigaton nukes as continent crushers, just less feasible.