NationStates Jolt Archive

OOC: After a few months of collaboration with The Freethinkers, I'm very proud to be bringing to light the newest weapon in Automagfreek's arsenal. It's construction (and the shipyard in which it was built) was first noted here: Automagfreek: Naval yards in full swing (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=377382) and seen for the first time in this RP: Domination (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=393450)


First off, I would like to thank The Freethinkers for all his hard work on this project for me, I am extremely thankful for the time and effort he invested. I would like to also note that at this time, this vessel is NOT for sale.

The Sentinel is named after the AMF's infantry units who have earned their place in history as one of the most feared fighting forces ever known. While not quite as large as the Doujin, the Sentinel makes up for it's lesser size with increased speed and firepower, as well as second generation Doujin armor. It's combat systems are interchangable to accept almost any configuration, so if and when select numbers of these go on sale, they can be custom built.

Without further ado, I present to you all the Sentinel class Super Dreadnought.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Name: Sentinel Class
Type: Command Battleship (Super Dreadnought).

Images:
http://img69.echo.cx/img69/9515/sentinelclasssmall1py.jpg

Larger image. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v195/The_Freethinkers/SentinelClasssmall.jpg)

Dimensions:802M L x 225M W x 25M D
Displacement (Fully Loaded): 2,200,000 Tons
Powerplants: 8-10 Pebblebed Nuclear reactors, total output of 2-3 GW
Propulsion Arrangement: 6 Waterjets (Four in main hull, one in each secondary hull). Bow thrusters and Azipod maneuvering thrusters for docking.
Speed: 27 kts (cruising), 31kts (conventional top speed), 33kts (flat out short range sprint)
Endurance: Limited to Nuclear Reactor life, ~15 years. Up to 12 months of stores can be carried.

Crew Complement
-Standard: 12,500 (including air group)
-Minimum: 8,500
Marines
-Standard: Space for 4,000 (8,000 in an emergency)

Cargo Capacity
-General Cargo: 16,000 Tons (Dry)
-Troop Equipment: Smalls arms, light vehicles and artillery can be carried and landed, but space is limited.

Onboard Craft
Boats: Rear well deck for boats, LCs and LCACs. Can accommodate up to 12 US style LCACs in a 3 x 4 arrangement. Fully enclosed when rear ramp is shut.

Aviation: One cross-hull flightdeck, 220m x 120m, four EM catapults going off to starboard, arrestor wires for ships landing on the port side. Four elevators to a two deck hangar, can support ~120 aircraft.

Radar:
LR air/surface search (phased array)
SR air/surface
Back up system.
LADAR (LOS only)

Fire Control:
Fleet Command System
Integrated Ship weapons system
Missile control.
Gunnery Control
Host arrays for multilink combat systems (such as AEGIS)

EW:
ECM/ESM
Chaff/Flare Decoy
Towed Decoy

Sonar:
Bow mounted array

Weaponry
-Artillery:
5 main turrets, either:
Triple Mounts for 15” Railguns (6,000 Rounds per turret)
Quadruple Mounts for 25”/64 ETC Guns (2,400 Rounds per turret)
12 x 10”/52 Naval guns
-Ranged Missiles:
There are 64 armoured hatches, each covering 4 slanted missiles tubes. These tubes are reloadable and up to seven reloads can be carried for each launcher. Total missiles carrying capacity is 2048 ASCMs, SAMs or similar.
-Self-Defence
76 x 6-barrel 30mm CIWS Units
44 x Light Cannon Mounts
-Underwater Warfare
4 x Twin ML 650 mm/12.75 inch MR Torpedo Tubes (180 Torpedoes/Mines/Depth Charges)
16 x ASHUM-style UWSC guns

Armour Type: Second Generation ‘Doujin’ scheme, combining the original Titanium VA/Ballistic Composite layers and lateral TVA rods, also now includes Ablative panelling and ERA, along with new heat absorbing solid layer to absorb damage from Plasma rounds. The ship’s frame is a Freethinker-style honeycomb type with additional shock absorbers and anti-shatter brackets placed along the frame.

Passive Protection Features:
-Double Bottomed hull
-Reinforced, displaced Keel
-Extensive firefighting and NBC equipment and filters.
-Pressure release systems to reduce missile damage.
-Multiple vertical bulkheads
-Ultra-Modern damage detection and reporting equipment
-Heavy Flooding and anti-flooding pumps
-Reserve radar and communication arrays.
-Extremely Effective Resistance to EMP attack through numerous design features.

Purchase Cost:~US$250,000,000,000

It is too tall for my taste. I suggest a name change, the Batman-ship-of-doom.
;)
A top down view would help me understand the configuration better also, if possible. Just a suggestion.

OOC: This will make much pretty boom.

IC: This will make much pretty boom.

-As quoted by King Linfield Hannon

As long as I don't have to face it, its all good.

I created a Super-Dreadnought class a while back when Doujin was very popular with his ships. I've only got 3 in my fleet, and very slightly smaller than yours, much bigger guns though. Mine is more AI runned with a less compliment.

And are you labeling this as modern tech? If so I'm going to chuckle, laugh, and stick a sad godmod tag on it unless it's (at minimum) future (as in 2015 minimum).

And are you labeling this as modern tech? If so I'm going to chuckle, laugh, and stick a sad godmod tag on it unless it's (at minimum) future (as in 2015 minimum).

OOC: I have RPed as a slightly post modern nation for at least a year and a half now.

Good. Just wanted to make sure you didn't mimic the Doujin (labeled as modern tech).

Good. Just wanted to make sure you didn't mimic the Doujin (labeled as modern tech).

I labelled the Doujin as Post Modern tech when I designed her, but of course what do the facts matter..

Good. Just wanted to make sure you didn't mimic the Doujin (labeled as modern tech).

OOC: Well, Freethinkers did design this thing, so I'm not sure if it's modern tech or post modern. There's actually nothing all that post modern about it really. The rail drivers that are mounted on it exist in real life (not quite at this scale, but the tech is out there), and it really is not that inconceivable to build something this size by modern day standards. But seeing as I RP as a post modern nation (tech ranging from 2000-2020 in some cases), I consider it post modern.

How many you plan to build? They cost over half of the US military budget, which is why I only have 3, capital ships for each of my major fleets. I'm modern/post-modern as well.

How many you plan to build? They cost over half of the US military budget, which is why I only have 3, capital ships for each of my major fleets. I'm modern/post-modern as well.

I have one built now, and construction on the other one only recently started. I don't plan on building too many, but I will definatly have a few of them out there. I already have a dedicated shipyard that works only on the Sentinel class, and funding is definatly not an issue.

OOC: Well, Freethinkers did design this thing, so I'm not sure if it's modern tech or post modern. There's actually nothing all that post modern about it really. The rail drivers that are mounted on it exist in real life (not quite at this scale, but the tech is out there), and it really is not that inconceivable to build something this size by modern day standards. But seeing as I RP as a post modern nation (tech ranging from 2000-2020 in some cases), I consider it post modern.

Yeah. Despite what these guys say, something of that size would not be possible, feasible, or even likely prior to 2015, 2020ish, at minimum.

Yeah. Despite what these guys say, something of that size would not be possible, feasible, or even likely prior to 2015, 2020ish, at minimum.


OOC: I would consider that statement more opinion than fact, as there is no way to tell what will be possible in the next few RL years (I'm talking around 2010). To say what will and will not be possible in the coming RL years is pure speculation.

OOC: Well, being realistic, nothing on that scale will ever be built simply because something of that size wont be needed, if its not needed, its not built, but even with the huge Supertankers and carriers present shipbuilding techniques are not pushed on anything but space and finding all that steel from somewhere.

On pure tech rating, ETCs and Pebblebeds are 2015 tech, so that settles that question on this ship regardless on your opinion of the size. However, Layertab, seeing as several qualified people in the subjectactually agreed with me on the size point, Im interested to hear how you formed your opinion.

Ho hum, could some one please at least google a site referencing marine architecture before they design these uber-ships? Post-modern or not, this creation defies several laws of physics and dynamics. Nice piece of imagination though.

Ho hum, could some one please at least google a site referencing marine architecture before they design these uber-ships? Post-modern or not, this creation defies several laws of physics and dynamics. Nice piece of imagination though.

OOC: Like?

Ho hum, could some one please at least google a site referencing marine architecture before they design these uber-ships? Post-modern or not, this creation defies several laws of physics and dynamics. Nice piece of imagination though.


LOL! What would you base this opinion on, and what laws of physics is this thing defying? Be more specific.

Only the best for the best.

OOC: Well, being realistic, nothing on that scale will ever be built simply because something of that size wont be needed, if its not needed, its not built, but even with the huge Supertankers and carriers present shipbuilding techniques are not pushed on anything but space and finding all that steel from somewhere.

On pure tech rating, ETCs and Pebblebeds are 2015 tech, so that settles that question on this ship regardless on your opinion of the size. However, Layertab, seeing as several qualified people in the subjectactually agreed with me on the size point, Im interested to hear how you formed your opinion.

I never said it wouldn't float I just hold the assertation that this thing would not be possible before 2015 at least. The resources alone to manufacture such a thing would drain a small economy. That'd be like putting a B-52 in the middle of World War II and saying "Yeah, it's workable." That's why I always say these huge superdreadnaughts are post-modern/future at the least.

I never said it wouldn't float I just hold the assertation that this thing would not be possible before 2015 at least. The resources alone to manufacture such a thing would drain a small economy. That'd be like putting a B-52 in the middle of World War II and saying "Yeah, it's workable." That's why I always say these huge superdreadnaughts are post-modern/future at the least.

Okay.

It is actually an interesting point, providing sufficient resources, but in NS you do have considerably more money, manpower and resources avaliable than in RL. With powerful economies nations with 4 billion would be able to build one.

Im also not quite sure on your point either. From this Im kinda getting the feeling you mean that it wouldnt be made before 2015 because of resource gathering? Or?

I never said it wouldn't float I just hold the assertation that this thing would not be possible before 2015 at least. The resources alone to manufacture such a thing would drain a small economy. That'd be like putting a B-52 in the middle of World War II and saying "Yeah, it's workable." That's why I always say these huge superdreadnaughts are post-modern/future at the least.

Eh, bad example. The B-52 could have been built if the design as given to them. Size was not an issue, because the US was building large battleships that were certianly bigger than a B-52. The jet engine was already designed by Germany (if I recall correctly), BUT the B-52 was designed to have either conventional propellors or jet engines. It was certainly feasible for that time period, but there was no need for a bomber with that kind of capability.

OOC: I think that people need to realize, when they speak of economies, that our economies aren't real world United States like economies - they may be tenfold the size of the economy of the United States - as a consequence we have more money to put into technological developement... Soooo, it is to say, said technological developement would most likely occur faster than in the real world - thus, SCRAMjets, and a lot of the technology to create this ship, would be totally plausable.

That's the problem with people who just critisize people's ships blatantly. They don't realize this isn't the real world. When someone says, "Where did you get that much tungsten?" -- well, it is NationStates - for all you know I might make it.

So, before I go on ranting, take that into mind when your critisize a ship.

Okay.

It is actually an interesting point, providing sufficient resources, but in NS you do have considerably more money, manpower and resources avaliable than in RL. With powerful economies nations with 4 billion would be able to build one.

Im also not quite sure on your point either. From this Im kinda getting the feeling you mean that it wouldnt be made before 2015 because of resource gathering? Or?

First off from what I've seen on the Doujin and this one these things take years to construct, much more than a modern Nimitz Class. In this current day and age, ports and channels and so fourth can support the Nimitz Class (though some cannot). The draft on this would require a LOT of ports to be dragged and made deeper. Hell I doubt this thing could come into NY Harbor mainly because I don't think it would be deeper enough to support that. The main thing, regardless of resource gathering, is that it just isn't feasible in the modern world. Hell even if you started building it in 2005 it wouldn't be ready until what, 2020ish?

Eh, bad example. The B-52 could have been built if the design as given to them. Size was not an issue, because the US was building large battleships that were certianly bigger than a B-52. The jet engine was already designed by Germany (if I recall correctly), BUT the B-52 was designed to have either conventional propellors or jet engines. It was certainly feasible for that time period, but there was no need for a bomber with that kind of capability.

The technology didn't exist in the midst of World War II for the B-52. Jet engines were barely enough to power small aircraft, let alone a 400,000 lb. bomber.

OOC: The first jet engines were actually designed by the British - but the Parliament didn't want to produce them since they thought that if they stuck to Spitfires more would be produces - so it was quantity over quality - their strategy turned out right..but, just as a note.

OOC: The first jet engines were actually designed by the British - but the Parliament didn't want to produce them since they thought that if they stuck to Spitfires more would be produces - so it was quantity over quality - their strategy turned out right..but, just as a note.

Stolen by the Soviets on a tour of a British factory. Funny huh?

The main thing, regardless of resource gathering, is that it just isn't feasible in the modern world. Hell even if you started building it in 2005 it wouldn't be ready until what, 2020ish?

Wrong. In WW2 the US made a destroyer that was fully equipped and ready to go in 4 1/2 days (Hitler was then quoted as saying 'We have lost the war'). With enough manpower and dedicated resources, a Sentinel could be produced in a matter of a few years (I'd say around 4 or 5). But in wartime, if personnel are doubled and enough resources are present, you could produce one of these much faster. Of course it would be more costly to do such a thing, and I wouldn't want to do it all that often for one reason: other ships need to be built and repaired, and spending large amounts of resources on just Sentinels is stupid.

The technology didn't exist in the midst of World War II for the B-52. Jet engines were barely enough to power small aircraft, let alone a 400,000 lb. bomber.

Hence why it was designed to have conventional propellor engines as well.

Wrong. In WW2 the US made a destroyer that was fully equipped and ready to go in 4 1/2 days (Hitler was then quoted as saying 'We have lost the war'). With enough manpower and dedicated resources, a Sentinel could be produced in a matter of a few years (I'd say around 4 or 5). But in wartime, if personnel are doubled and enough resources are present, you could produce one of these much faster. Of course it would be more costly to do such a thing, and I wouldn't want to do it all that often for one reason: other ships need to be built and repaired, and spending large amounts of resources on just Sentinels is stupid.


OOC: A jeep was rolling off (collectively... averaging all factories of production) every three minutes, and a liberty ship every three days..pretty crazy stuff! But, you have to remember that the United States was in the midst of total war too..so that might be a factor... peace time production is not even 1/100th of that.

OOC: A jeep was rolling off (collectively... averaging all factories of production) every three minutes, and a liberty ship every three days..pretty crazy stuff! But, you have to remember that the United States was in the midst of total war too..so that might be a factor... peace time production is not even 1/100th of that.

Yeah, it's quite impressive what can be done.

But of course if you're a country such as Automagfreek, you're always at war. ;)

OOC: Bah, Automagfreek! Would there be any way I could play with one of these ships? Maybe play with it and accidently hit Kahta? Or are these national property only?

First off from what I've seen on the Doujin and this one these things take years to construct, much more than a modern Nimitz Class. In this current day and age, ports and channels and so fourth can support the Nimitz Class (though some cannot). The draft on this would require a LOT of ports to be dragged and made deeper. Hell I doubt this thing could come into NY Harbor mainly because I don't think it would be deeper enough to support that. The main thing, regardless of resource gathering, is that it just isn't feasible in the modern world. Hell even if you started building it in 2005 it wouldn't be ready until what, 2020ish?

I see, Im beginning to get what you mean now. Its a question of when it would be finished off...

Well, a lot of the previous points you made are either held to be fact (notice they are tactical limitations as opposed to reasons it cant exist), or can be circumvented by NS Geography. You are right in fact, many RL ports could not handle her, and I had hell trying to find abig enough dockyard to build her.

As for the 2020 thing (actually, more like 2050, so our discussions went), thats an interesting statement, and goes back to fundementally, the fluidity of time in NS. I can RP 30 years in a dockyard building this, but by the same argument every weapon ever created would be a godmod, as it takes awhile to build.

Thats why many people place things in time by the technology it uses rather than the time to make the weapon itself. Now, the Doujin and the Sentinel are not meant to be realistic in the slightest, they couldnt justify the cost in the real world for the limited roles they undertake, bu in NS the political and military situations are very different, and, as such, vessels like the Doujin ad Sentinel would pprobably be seen.

Its all down to a matter of RP style. If you dont want to acknowledge the Doujin thats cool and everything, but stop going on it being a Modern Tech Godmod. I never claimed it to be modern tech and Ive never claimed it could be completed in a few years. The technology is there, and, with enough money it could happen. Its just not going to.

OOC: Bah, Automagfreek! Would there be any way I could play with one of these ships? Maybe play with it and accidently hit Kahta? Or are these national property only?

As of now, national property only. I'm not sure if and when these will be made available to the international community, probably not for awhile. That and I plan on adding some HOUND V2 mounts to the ship. *evil grin*

Also, I plan on doing Sentinel conversions for all the standard battleships being used by my Warchiefs. I may also do conversions for friendly nations in the future, before I ever think of selling a new one.

OOC: The first jet engines were actually designed by the British - but the Parliament didn't want to produce them since they thought that if they stuck to Spitfires more would be produces - so it was quantity over quality - their strategy turned out right..but, just as a note.

ooc: Here my esteemed friend is correct. The jet engine was first invented by Frank Whittle, and I know because my Godfather is a relative of his.

Bump

I see, Im beginning to get what you mean now. Its a question of when it would be finished off...

Well, a lot of the previous points you made are either held to be fact (notice they are tactical limitations as opposed to reasons it cant exist), or can be circumvented by NS Geography. You are right in fact, many RL ports could not handle her, and I had hell trying to find abig enough dockyard to build her.

As for the 2020 thing (actually, more like 2050, so our discussions went), thats an interesting statement, and goes back to fundementally, the fluidity of time in NS. I can RP 30 years in a dockyard building this, but by the same argument every weapon ever created would be a godmod, as it takes awhile to build.

Thats why many people place things in time by the technology it uses rather than the time to make the weapon itself. Now, the Doujin and the Sentinel are not meant to be realistic in the slightest, they couldnt justify the cost in the real world for the limited roles they undertake, bu in NS the political and military situations are very different, and, as such, vessels like the Doujin ad Sentinel would pprobably be seen.

Its all down to a matter of RP style. If you dont want to acknowledge the Doujin thats cool and everything, but stop going on it being a Modern Tech Godmod. I never claimed it to be modern tech and Ive never claimed it could be completed in a few years. The technology is there, and, with enough money it could happen. Its just not going to.

You never claimed it as MT correct. But Mr. Doujin did. Hell as far as realism, when it comes to NS and post-modern or future tech, realism sort of vanishes and it just becomes a question of possibility. This sucker is realistic I have to say in the dimensions, weights, etc. just that it isn't anywhere near modern is my basis of the argument. Hell yeah finding a dockyard big enough to build it, sheesh man $$$$$$$$$$$$.

Meh who cares. It's not like the stats are going to be mentioned in an RP. That's why when I buy things, I look at the pictures :P

ooc; The biggest ship on NS is the SeaDragon Class Ubercarrier. It has 3, 1600m long runways. Unfortunately, the damn thing's a bomb magnet.

OOC: Bah, Automagfreek! Would there be any way I could play with one of these ships? Maybe play with it and accidently hit Kahta? Or are these national property only?

hmmm.... shoot Kahta.... hmmmmmmmmm

I'll purchase 4 of them for $1,000,000,000,000 USD. Money will be wired upon confirmation. Thanks!

OOC: Its a thing of beauty. One day I'm going to get around to designing my own Super-Dreadnought.

I'll purchase 4 of them for $1,000,000,000,000 USD. Money will be wired upon confirmation. Thanks!

As stated in the first post, this vessel is not for sale at this time.

Bump

OOC: Well, I posted the original armour scheme for the Doujin on the NATO forums, so you can edit that for the Sentinel if you want. Remember the improvements I listed though.

WOW. I almost regret not being a MT nation. That is a cool design job.

OOC: heh, pic looks stupid in my opinion and landing aircraft sideways seems a bit wierd (if ive understood it correctly and looked at the pictures properly)

However looks like a pretty good ship, if slightly under powered :P

Is this thing trimaran?

I only ask because I would think that it would need some extra stabilizing force to keep it from flipping over in a good wind with the mass distribution seeming so high up.

And the batwings likely wouldn't help the issue.

Is this thing trimaran?

I only ask because I would think that it would need some extra stabilizing force to keep it from flipping over in a good wind with the mass distribution seeming so high up.

And the batwings likely wouldn't help the issue.

Well, with a 4:1 length:beam ratio I cana ssure it is both stable and a trimiran, although yes that isnt too clear from the picture.

The batwings are decorative but because they counterbalance each other (and are only as wide as the hull anyway) they aren't too bad. They make excellent passive electronic and communication arrays and provide some abalatove protection for the central command column, as well as lookin good.

I was more concerned about the fact that they would act like sails in a crosswind.

OOC: very interesting...

i read earlier a post about ETC guns being at least 2015 teach, im afraid i have to disagree with that.

Firstly, what goes on in the military is hidden from us a lot of the time, or hidden as much as it can be legally. So by that i am implying that yes, i believe that some nations, e.g. the US, have planes, guns etc that are far more sophisticated than some people may think, even if still under the research stage. With increased funding im sure that if secret projects exist they could go way up the tech ladder, just look at how much tanks developed in WWII, a tank built in 1943 was near enough obsolete only 2, or three years later!

Look at this site: http://www.oz.net/~coilgun/theory/electroguns.htm

Read the sections

" High Velocity Artillery" and "Stretcher-Size Logistic Supply and Medical Evacuation Vehicle".

The idea of the second section named " could be built using available technology. ". And thats all the stuff we know about...lol. Even if my first point is wrong it shows that it IS POSSIBLE NOW to use Electromagnetic launchers, and so something very close to that type of Gun.

In conclusion to my research i think that with nations working together(in RL) and proper funds this type of energy could be used efectively by the military in the (very) near future.

[OOC: I've heard (recently) that the technology behind ETC guns has been in place since the 1980s and that ETC guns are feasible now. Then again, perhaps I'm reading into feedback on the class of ship I designed recently the wrong way.]

OOC: very interesting...

i read earlier a post about ETC guns being at least 2015 teach, im afraid i have to disagree with that.

Firstly, what goes on in the military is hidden from us a lot of the time, or hidden as much as it can be legally. So by that i am implying that yes, i believe that some nations, e.g. the US, have planes, guns etc that are far more sophisticated than some people may think, even if still under the research stage. With increased funding im sure that if secret projects exist they could go way up the tech ladder, just look at how much tanks developed in WWII, a tank built in 1943 was near enough obsolete only 2, or three years later!

Look at this site: http://www.oz.net/~coilgun/theory/electroguns.htm

Read the sections

" High Velocity Artillery" and "Stretcher-Size Logistic Supply and Medical Evacuation Vehicle".

The idea of the second section named " could be built using available technology. ". And thats all the stuff we know about...lol. Even if my first point is wrong it shows that it IS POSSIBLE NOW to use Electromagnetic launchers, and so something very close to that type of Gun.

In conclusion to my research i think that with nations working together(in RL) and proper funds this type of energy could be used efectively by the military in the (very) near future.


I agree entirely. I tend to assume that if something has been tested functional, then it can be used with only a little bit of tweaking. Pebblebed reactor blueprints exist TODAY, but no reactor has been built because of a freeze in reactor construction by developed nations. ECTs have worked for a while. Railguns are entirely possible... IF you can find a way to get the power to run them. Scramjets are getting less plausible, but more because of the exotic materials needed and the limited utility inharent in the design.

But I also need to disagree with macabees when he stated that because this is a freeform RP, we can RP having whatever resources we want... perhaps someone has found a mine of carbon nanotubes that naturally formed in a 1 in a billion chance. Well... technically yes, you could do that... however, it's impolite to do that. Just as it's impolite to RP having an army that is unsuportable by your logistics arrangments... potentially you do produce Elvish Waybread, but it's just not cricket to massproduce fantastically espencive materials cheaply.

Admittedly, I violate that rule myself. My current nation has a species of spider that can actually be farmed in groups... they communicate with each other through pherimones and while never friendly, they have a social structure. This, I admit, is not realistic. There are a lot of unrealistic flora and fauna in my nation... however, I feel like this is more than compencated by the fact that they are all hostile to humans and my country is fragmented into four city states, has a fixed population of about 3 million, and is stuck with technology marginally worse than was available to the great powers at the begining of WWI. Being able to massproduce spidersilk is a small thing compared to those disadvantages.

In any case, /hyjack on RPing resources. Freethinkers, magnificent job as always. Perhaps you could give me a hand designing armored steam fishing vessels? =) This is CHardonay, btw, the person who was constantly screaming about the doujin's main guns.

Stolen by the Soviets on a tour of a British factory. Funny huh?
Actually, the British Labour government elected just before the Potsdam conference decided to sell the most advanced British jet engine to the Soviets (the Rolls-Royce Nene), who used it on the MiG-15. The then government thought such a kind offer would lead to amity between the two nations, not realising Stalin was in truth little different from Hitler (not as rabidly anti-semitic, but equally bloodthirsty).

But I also need to disagree with macabees when he stated that because this is a freeform RP, we can RP having whatever resources we want... perhaps someone has found a mine of carbon nanotubes that naturally formed in a 1 in a billion chance. Well... technically yes, you could do that... however, it's impolite to do that. Just as it's impolite to RP having an army that is unsuportable by your logistics arrangments... potentially you do produce Elvish Waybread, but it's just not cricket to massproduce fantastically espencive materials cheaply.

......

In any case, /hyjack on RPing resources. Freethinkers, magnificent job as always. Perhaps you could give me a hand designing armored steam fishing vessels? =) This is CHardonay, btw, the person who was constantly screaming about the doujin's main guns.

Well, no problem with consultancy ;) Join the queue, heh.

As for the resource thing, its a difficult subject to move around, really, I do know what you mean about people claiming different resources and stuff, and you are right it is very bad form to overstipulate resources you have avaliable just to give yourself an advantage. But then again it is realistic to assume you are not a complete waster with regard to resources and certainly the bulk of building material would be reasonably easy to find, process, buy and work with in the time space even these gargantuan things take up, especially given the sheer size of the NS world and trading capability avaliable.

Generally, Im usually willing to play off one resources against another. My infantry are demon cross-breeds, but there are so few of them avaliable I have little capcity to project force with help from allies. My navy has extremely powerful surface combatants but has limited manpower so the number of weapons equals out. Its a difficult line to cross and generally so long as people are willing to keep to limited good fortune it isnt really too much of an issue.

As for the guns, well, as you can see the Sentinel mounts smaller pieces, and the Doujin herself will be rebored with 25" guns soon enough.

Generally, Im usually willing to play off one resources against another. My infantry are demon cross-breeds, but there are so few of them avaliable I have little capcity to project force with help from allies. My navy has extremely powerful surface combatants but has limited manpower so the number of weapons equals out. Its a difficult line to cross and generally so long as people are willing to keep to limited good fortune it isnt really too much of an issue.

As for the guns, well, as you can see the Sentinel mounts smaller pieces, and the Doujin herself will be rebored with 25" guns soon enough.

Exactly. So long as your carbon nanotube mines are balanced by a complete lack of agricultural land, I might consider RPing with you. It all comes down to how well the person RPs... if they can carry it off, mazel tov. If not, then it turns into godmodding... and infinite resoiurces are an symptom of nOObishness.

Heh, how long's the queue? If I promise you a really interesting problem as opposed to yet another BCGN, might I get bumped forward? =)

And they're being rebored? Wonderful! Now the barrels won't sag =)

With the ETC thing: yep, i read that in the 1980's ETC guns had been tested: " the XM291 tank gun developed originally for the future Abrams upgrades in a 120mm configuration " "has been under development since the mid 1980s " lol, 1985 or so, good enough for me, its modern tech enough, its just that in RL the need for them isnt here, so nations havent produced them, on NS there is a need, and nations have the money so they WOULD be produced in theory, perhaps much longer ago as many more wars would have taken place!

Exactly. So long as your carbon nanotube mines are balanced by a complete lack of agricultural land, I might consider RPing with you. It all comes down to how well the person RPs... if they can carry it off, mazel tov. If not, then it turns into godmodding... and infinite resoiurces are an symptom of nOObishness.

Heh, how long's the queue? If I promise you a really interesting problem as opposed to yet another BCGN, might I get bumped forward? =)

And they're being rebored? Wonderful! Now the barrels won't sag =)

I agree with you completely, i aim (but dont) to RP that well, to those high standards.

The trouble is though, everyone perseves the NS world differently, in theory costs for some materials could be super cheap, i dont know exactly but as an average EVERy nation could be producing much more than RL nations, so everything would be cheap, or it could produce less. From that you can see that it could be very complicated, thats why i suppose much of what we do is done to RL speed, range etc, even though needs on a world of this size would be different, eg inter continental missiles would be MASSIVE, maybe the same warheads but the range would have to be massive to get opponents situated in GREAT landmasses, who knows how many millions of KM in land a nation could be!?!

Generally, Im usually willing to play off one resources against another. My infantry are demon cross-breeds, but there are so few of them avaliable I have little capcity to project force with help from allies. My navy has extremely powerful surface combatants but has limited manpower so the number of weapons equals out. Its a difficult line to cross and generally so long as people are willing to keep to limited good fortune it isnt really too much of an issue.I follow a similar idea when it comes to my military. I RP with an enormous (for my nation's size) 5,000-plus ship navy. However, I also RP with a small (though effective for its size) air force and a small (and somewhat lacking) army. Also, many of the ships in my navy have been refit several times and are just a few steps away from being floating hulks.

That's how I've accounted for a much larger navy than most countries my size would have.

Bump

Hence why it was designed to have conventional propellor engines as well.

I think you're thinking of the B-36 there, props and jets with 'six turning and four burning.'

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v453/GMCMA/Other%20stuff/B-36.jpg

Also, removed the [img] tags on page one because the image is too wide for the page.

[EDIT: And hosted a smaller version myself, before anyone notes the image is back]

I didn't save it, so I have no clue what format it is.

I didn't save it, so I have no clue what format it is.
It looks like JPEG, as some of the colours are blurred into each other. You might want to ask Soviet Bloc to resave into .gif or .png format. It would look better.

Well, it looks fine to me, and as long as it's visible I suppose it really doesn't make a difference.

AMF, you never cease to amaze me...good thing we've never had any sort of conflict.

OOC:

I claimed to be Modern Tech, but I held a different definition for Modern Tech than you did I suppose - as you will find by reading past posts of mine, I stated my tech range up to 2010/2015, generally just 2010 but I believe I said 2015 at one point in time as well.

tag~ for reference