NationStates Jolt Archive

Today at 13:17 (AST) the Upper Parliament unanimously passed the proposal of the called "Erdzig Law" which called for the complete and total banishment of all forms of religion in Avadria and the Empire itself. The proposal was then passed on to the Emperor himself and was signed into law at 13:49 (AST).

The law, named after the late Minister of Justice Maximillian Erdzig who tragically lost his life in the terror attack which prompted the temporary ban, was proposed by both Minister Edbren and Minister Kurgen. It was quickly passed by the Upper Parliament and sent on to the Emperor within a matter of minutes.

It was also announced that Minister Edbren as well as Minister Kurgen would be willing to address all questions and concerns the international community may have with this law.

Loren Archer, Exterior Minister for Khwarezmia, applauds Avadria's proposal.

Too long has religion been the cause and excuse for war.

Loren Archer
Ext. Minister

JRV condemns this latest move by the Avadrian Government as completely in violation of freedom and tolerance.

- Ministry of Foreign Affairs (and Trade)

*brrring**brrring* *brrring**brinng* *brring**brr-

"Southern Affairs Section. Greta Kunstler speaking. How may I help you?"

"...seriously, the Axis desk! I'm on the f**king Axis desk. Jim, let me tell you what I've learnt on the Axis desk this morning. The Axis regional assembly has not minuted a scrap of business since - wait for it - Christmas Day. Yeah! Bugger all for 34 days! The glamour of a career in the Diplomatic Corps! Bunch of useless Nazi -"

"Hello? Sir?"

"Oh. Shit. Um, hi. This is Billy Asanwe, I'm on the Axis desk at the Foreign Office in the Democratic Republic of Phonque. Listen, I've got to ask you about this whole Erdzig thing."

"Yes, sir, what would you like to know?"

"Well, basically, what do you mean by 'outlaw' religion? I mean, I'm taking it as read that you're going to shut down churches, and I'm guessing you guys don't have too many synagogues to start with, right? But, like, are people going to be allowed to pray by their beds at night? Or what if they just believe in God and don't tell anyone or pray or anything? And, perhaps most importantly of all, what are you going to do with religious adherents visiting from another country? Are you really telling me that Avadria is never going to have another Cliff Richard concert?"

I condemn this move by Avadria. No state that has forcibly supressed religion has lasted. To supress the free will of men is a crime. I sincerely hope that your Emperor rethinks his position on this issue.

Zachary Harrison
Prime Minister
Kingdom of Malkyer

Official Statement from The Grand Imperial Empire of The Island of Rose:

Well well well, a far leftist nation has gone over the extreme and banned religion. I congratulate you... kidding. How dare you ban religion. I am a Roman Catholic, and this offends me. But you probably don't care. Also, the Rosian Roman Catholic Church, which is in no way connected to the Government, is in that nation. All Priests are being withdrawn as it is, and any harm brought on them will be met severely. That is all.
Sergei Ilyanov
Counciller of Foreign Affairs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Byeltsin.jpg)
http://img158.exs.cx/img158/7559/tior26gx.gif
Protector of the Seven Stars

((OOC: I know we didn't RP it, but it adds more drama. Also, Sergei's a socialist but he hates far leftism. So meh. Or maybe you guys are Nazis who knows XD))

Official communique

Banning religion is something that Zoogiedom would never do, and we aren't pleased that Avadria has done so. However, what we're here to do, as we've done several times before, is to warn other nations to leave Avadria alone. Mind your own ... er, affairs, and don't even think about infringing its sovereignty. We all know that that never comes to good end.

Public Address from the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

The Empire of Avadria will not retract this law. All churches, synagogues, and the single mosque will remain as museums as they have for numerous years. No public or private gatherings for the sake of practicing relgion will be allowed and no relgious texts will be sold or distributed. Failure to comply with this law will result in steep fines, jail time, and eventual re-education.

As well we would like to remind you that the Empire of Avadria, although condemns religion, is not a leftist state. We are in a sense a facist state, but hardly a 'Nazi' state.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

Official communique

Banning religion is something that Zoogiedom would never do, and we aren't pleased that Avadria has done so. However, what we're here to do, as we've done several times before, is to warn other nations to leave Avadria alone. Mind your own ... er, affairs, and don't even think about infringing its sovereignty. We all know that that never comes to good end.

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

Although we may disagree on this issue, I must extend thanks to you for supporting our right to govern our people the way we want to. In many situations Avadria has stood up for smaller nations whose sovereignty was threatened by a larger power. We are glad to see a similar gesture granted to us.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

Official Statement from The Grand Imperial Empire of The Island of Rose:

Well well well, a far leftist nation has gone over the extreme and banned religion. I congratulate you... kidding. How dare you ban religion. I am a Roman Catholic, and this offends me. But you probably don't care. Also, the Rosian Roman Catholic Church, which is in no way connected to the Government, is in that nation. All Priests are being withdrawn as it is, and any harm brought on them will be met severely. That is all.
Sergei Ilyanov
Counciller of Foreign Affairs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Byeltsin.jpg)
http://img158.exs.cx/img158/7559/tior26gx.gif
Protector of the Seven Stars

((OOC: I know we didn't RP it, but it adds more drama. Also, Sergei's a socialist but he hates far leftism. So meh. Or maybe you guys are Nazis who knows XD))

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

I would like to remind you that the Empire is hardly a 'leftist nation' but it is indeed our right to govern our people in the manner we see fit. As well, any clergy associated with the Rosian Roman Catholic Church will be stripped of their Avadrian citizenship (Pending or not) and returned to your nation immediately.

As well any members of the clergy who have been enrolled in Re-Education program will be immediately released and returned, although we cannot guarntee their loyalty to the Church or your government.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

((OOC: It's fine and it does add a bit of drama. But all of the Churches have been closed long before the Erdzig law and the two month ban were initiated. So religious meetings happen in liscensed households with groups no greater than 10 people. That is until the law was passed. Now they cannot meet in groups at all.))

*brrring**brrring* *brrring**brinng* *brring**brr-

"Southern Affairs Section. Greta Kunstler speaking. How may I help you?"

"...seriously, the Axis desk! I'm on the f**king Axis desk. Jim, let me tell you what I've learnt on the Axis desk this morning. The Axis regional assembly has not minuted a scrap of business since - wait for it - Christmas Day. Yeah! Bugger all for 34 days! The glamour of a career in the Diplomatic Corps! Bunch of useless Nazi -"

"Hello? Sir?"

"Oh. Shit. Um, hi. This is Billy Asanwe, I'm on the Axis desk at the Foreign Office in the Democratic Republic of Phonque. Listen, I've got to ask you about this whole Erdzig thing."

"Yes, sir, what would you like to know?"

"Well, basically, what do you mean by 'outlaw' religion? I mean, I'm taking it as read that you're going to shut down churches, and I'm guessing you guys don't have too many synagogues to start with, right? But, like, are people going to be allowed to pray by their beds at night? Or what if they just believe in God and don't tell anyone or pray or anything? And, perhaps most importantly of all, what are you going to do with religious adherents visiting from another country? Are you really telling me that Avadria is never going to have another Cliff Richard concert?"

((OOC: I'm not quite sure what is going on at the beginning of your post... but I will pretend like that part never happened and address the final paragraph))

"The churches, synagogues, and mosque will remain in their current state as museums to the purpose of what they once served. As well all public and private gatherings for the purpose of religious discussion and/or practice are outlawed. What can be done in an individuals home is up to the individual. However it is highly discouraged that they perform worship rituals of any sort.

Any religious supporters from foreign countries who enter Avadria with the intent of spreading their faith will be arrested and held by the Avadrian government. However numerous circumstances may lead to the prosecution of the said criminal in the Avadrian court system.

And for Cliff Richard, I have no idea who that man is. I am certain he would be arrested and tried as a criminal as well. And I'm also certain that he would be an amazing failure of a musician in my nation."

"Well, okay. Thanks for your time, Greta." *clunk*

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Travel Advisory - The Empire of Avadria

Citizens are strongly advised against all non-essential travel to all parts of Avadria due to the Avadrian Government being a bunch of Nazi morons. Although they do know a thing or two about music.

Issued by The Axis regional desk (EO Billy Asanwe) -- 15:21 -- 28/01/05

>>Adding "Avadria" to black list......

>>Data Transfer complete.

>>Ceasing all trade with "Avadria".......

>>Estimated losses in Iuthian revenue: $00.00 (USD)

>>Electronic Transfers blocked, mailmerge sent to Iuthian business owners...


After some concideration it is our decision that following the new laws which ban their peoples religious practices in the nation of Avadria, we can no longer trade with such a poor led nation which must oppress it's people in an attempt to stomp out a few terrorists who will now undoubtably find additional support from those who can no long pray in their churches, synagogues, and mosques. These building not only serve a communities religious needs, but also provide a community centre from which many people support each other through. To ban such places would likely only further enrage such people.

A much better solution against terrorism is to have a community which supports attempts to uproot such terrorists by actively supporting the community. If a community is opposed to terrorists, it makes opperations in that community much more complicated for such criminals as people are morely likely to tell the government of their actions then to hide them away.

While cleary this is your governments choice to make, we feel you are making the wrong choice and are doing little more then endangering yourselves further, as such we cannot trade with such an unstable nation any long.

Thanks,

Foriegn Minister Mick Lakely, Iuthian Diplomatic Corps.

Moronyicka condemns these acts.

-King Jedo

OOC:

As well all public and private gatherings for the purpose of religious discussion and/or practice are outlawed.

Ok so not even private gatherings (ie: in their own homes)

What can be done in an individuals home is up to the individual.

Wait... What? Isn't that a contradiction?

From the office of the Shihasha, soverign leader of Candrah:
I find that your knee jerk reaction to a simple terrorist attack to be appauling and foul in the extreme. Therefore the Dominion of Candrah has no choice but to impose the harshest of restrictions on your trade and monetary funds.
Furthermore we appeal to the citizens of your blighted regime: If you wish to worship elsewhere, Candrah will assist you. Our transports stand ready to ferry out anyone who wishes to leave. You are welcome in Candrah. You are welcome in Souptopia, if you don't like our religion. You are being heard.
And just to make sure that you understand, any attack on any of our transport will be seen as a act of war and be treated as such.
I have spoken.

Moronyicka condemns these acts.

-King Jedo

OOC:



Ok so not even private gatherings (ie: in their own homes)



Wait... What? Isn't that a contradiction?

OOC: What is meant by that, is that what a family or the individual plans on doing in their own home is totally up to them. However inviting people over and assemblying your own makeshift church is illegal.

From the office of the Shihasha, soverign leader of Candrah:
I find that your knee jerk reaction to a simple terrorist attack to be appauling and foul in the extreme. Therefore the Dominion of Candrah has no choice but to impose the harshest of restrictions on your trade and monetary funds.
Furthermore we appeal to the citizens of your blighted regime: If you wish to worship elsewhere, Candrah will assist you. Our transports stand ready to ferry out anyone who wishes to leave. You are welcome in Candrah. You are welcome in Souptopia, if you don't like our religion. You are being heard.
And just to make sure that you understand, any attack on any of our transport will be seen as a act of war and be treated as such.
I have spoken.

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

I will skip the formalities here. First and foremost it was not a simple terror attack. It claimed the lives of our Minister of Justice as well as numerous civillians. As well this conflict goes back at least twenty years when the North Avadrian Liberation Front almost collapsed the throne.

Second off, the religious minority of Avadria is just that, a very small minority. Soon the first wave of re-educated ex-christians will be released, now completely loyal to the state just like everyone else. No one will be sent to your nation , not a single person. We have already sent a large bulk of people to South Africa and do not plan on releasing any more.

Furthermore, we will not attack any of your ships, however their passengers and crew will not be allowed to disembark, and fuel and other supplies will be sold to your crews at an immensly inflated price. As well HZD agents will board your vessel and search it throughly, seizing any and all cargo deemed threatening or illicit. Therefore we believe that it would be in your best interest to discontinue any plans to send such ships to Avadria.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

>>Adding "Avadria" to black list......

>>Data Transfer complete.

>>Ceasing all trade with "Avadria".......

>>Estimated losses in Iuthian revenue: $00.00 (USD)

>>Electronic Transfers blocked, mailmerge sent to Iuthian business owners...


After some concideration it is our decision that following the new laws which ban their peoples religious practices in the nation of Avadria, we can no longer trade with such a poor led nation which must oppress it's people in an attempt to stomp out a few terrorists who will now undoubtably find additional support from those who can no long pray in their churches, synagogues, and mosques. These building not only serve a communities religious needs, but also provide a community centre from which many people support each other through. To ban such places would likely only further enrage such people.

A much better solution against terrorism is to have a community which supports attempts to uproot such terrorists by actively supporting the community. If a community is opposed to terrorists, it makes opperations in that community much more complicated for such criminals as people are morely likely to tell the government of their actions then to hide them away.

While cleary this is your governments choice to make, we feel you are making the wrong choice and are doing little more then endangering yourselves further, as such we cannot trade with such an unstable nation any long.

Thanks,

Foriegn Minister Mick Lakely, Iuthian Diplomatic Corps.

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

The Empire of Avadria acknowledges Iuthia's decision to halt any potential or future trade with our nation. However this decision will not at all cause us to back down from our stance against religion. For years the government has taken small steps to eventually wash the pointless rituals and fairytales from our culture. This move was merely the final large step to completing that plan. I would like to note that the current Emperor has felt a passionate desire to rid the nation of these practices ever since he took power twenty nine years ago. Finally his dream has come to a realization and it will not be destroyed.

As for the subject of terror groups in response to this deicison, we believe that the response from such groups will be miniscule. All ready thousands of formerly religious Avadrians are being sent through rigorous re-education programs that will transform them into loyal subjects of the Emperor. These people along with the other Avadrians are the community, fiercely loyal to the Emperor, country, and flag, that will actively seek out and report criminals within their communities.

We feel that this was the proper, just, and intelligent choice to make and nothing can convince us to back down. The Empire will continue to remain a stable, prosperous society for years to come.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

We still view the move as a some what over the top reaction, and surely if your country is so avidly loyal it's only a matter of time before you find such terrorists if you know what you are doing... sending thousands of people to re-education centres (something which reminds many of terrible acts done by other nations) you will undoubtably create more terrorists, not only in your own nation from those who were friendly, god-fearing or otherwise, but also from other sympathetic nations.

I can't see how re-education centres for a minority is morally justified as a way of stopping terrorism, if you simply worked harder at rooting out terrorism and working with religious communities to remove the dangerous portion you wouldn't be pissing off so many nations. Instead you will attract attention from the likes of Belem and other religion obcessed nations who incist they can interfere with your nations laws regarding religion, Belem as used nuclear weapons on nations for much less regarding these matters...

I honestly can't see the difference between what your nation is doing, and what other nations have done in the past to remove unwanted minorities... by removing their freedom and forcing them give up their religion, most of which are not a threat and in most cases provide a boost to charity funds and community strength.

We do not concider this the inteligent choice, mearly a way of stamping out minorities, an act which will create more hate then anything else. You have been warned.

Foriegn Minister Mick Lakely, Iuthian Diplomatic Corps.

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

The connection between terrorism and re-education is nearly non-existent. The purpose of the camps is merely to help the people become more loyal to the Empire and remind them of their nationality and culture. The terror groups on the other hand are radical anti-Royalist groups who have been against the Emperor for a great deal of time. They fly the banner of religion but have their own agenda. There are no individual religious oriented terror groups. The attack in Amhurst was an isolated incident not attached to any specific organization.

As well, Avadria will protect itself against any agressor over this matter. We too are a nuclear capable nation and will not hesitate to use them if it comes down to it.

The removal of religion is not a means to 'stamp out' minorities but rather a way to incorporate them back into the regular community. In no way, shape, or form would we eradicate the minority as a means of bringing about change.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

I condemn this move by Avadria. No state that has forcibly supressed religion has lasted. To supress the free will of men is a crime. I sincerely hope that your Emperor rethinks his position on this issue.

Zachary Harrison
Prime Minister
Kingdom of Malkyer

Except the greatest nation of this world, Chellis?

We congradulate Avadria on its move in banning religion. Secular nations must stand strong together, and Chellis would be glad to stand with the soldiers of Avadria on the battlefields of idealism, if the need ever came. Let no nation attempt to force ignorance on your people, nor infringe your borders. We would like to set up preferential trade agreements with Avadria, to help an ideologically-progressive nation grow. We can see who will lead the future, and it will not be the foolish followers of religion.

If you need us, let us know.

The Republic of Wong Cock has improved secularisation by removing this formula "So help me god" from all official oaths.

Further, religious activity was given the same right as cultural or sports activities, with religious organisations given the same rights and duties towards society as sports clubs and similar associations.

On the economic field, religious organizations have two years time to transform into a non-profit organization. They have to comply with the anti-discrimination law within a year.

From the office of chairperson of the joint Candrahn defense force:
I was informed of your attempt to seize and search any craft entering your air space. Well, I am persoanlly disappointed. Perhaps you were unaware of who we are. No matter. This is the final commmunication as we has terminated all relations with you blighted gaggle of terrorists and madpeople.
All planes that recieved orders will continue to fulfill them. Any attempt to interfere will be met with deadly force.
So you best be advised to do nothing and continue your *re-education*.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
[OOC: no planes were launched because there is much Beaucracy in Candrah]

To Avadria, From Chairman of the Council for National Defence Mohammed El-Shabazz:

We do not see this move to abolish religion as being a good or neccesary move. I myself practice Islam, but in accordance with the democratic nature of Karuchea, do not force Islam on the country and as freedom of religion is one of the essential freedoms for the people. I hope that we could send a delegation to your country to meet with you and discuss religion and see if this move is a move by dictatorship or a genuine rejection of religion by the people.

"We will be placing your nation on our list of states that sponsor terror. We have compelling reasons to believe you perpetrated those terror attacks against yourself as an excuse to ban religion."

Czar Roger Fabus

Except the greatest nation of this world, Chellis?

We congradulate Avadria on its move in banning religion. Secular nations must stand strong together, and Chellis would be glad to stand with the soldiers of Avadria on the battlefields of idealism, if the need ever came. Let no nation attempt to force ignorance on your people, nor infringe your borders. We would like to set up preferential trade agreements with Avadria, to help an ideologically-progressive nation grow. We can see who will lead the future, and it will not be the foolish followers of religion.

If you need us, let us know.

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

We offer our thanks to the nation of Chellis for standing alongside us in this matter. The Avadrian people would glady take up arms alongside your nation to defend our lands from such agressors. As well we again offer your thanks and accept your offer to establish trade agreements with Avadria.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

Minister of International Commerce
Gunther Walton

From the office of chairperson of the joint Candrahn defense force:
I was informed of your attempt to seize and search any craft entering your air space. Well, I am persoanlly disappointed. Perhaps you were unaware of who we are. No matter. This is the final commmunication as we has terminated all relations with you blighted gaggle of terrorists and madpeople.
All planes that recieved orders will continue to fulfill them. Any attempt to interfere will be met with deadly force.
So you best be advised to do nothing and continue your *re-education*.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
[OOC: no planes were launched because there is much Beaucracy in Candrah]

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

Any and all Candrahni aircraft entering Avadrian airspace will be forced to land at the nearest international airport. The aircraft will then be seized and the crew detained. I do not care who you are and it certainly will not affect our decision. But perhaps you should ask yourself who you are dealing with in these matters.

I can assure you that the Avadrian government and the Avadrian people are not a 'blighted gaggle of terrorists.' And if it comes down to armed conflict I will let you know one thing:

'Vet liban fuz daet Empir, Vet todan fuz daet Empir.'
'We live for the Empire, We die for the Empire.'

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

To Avadria, From Chairman of the Council for National Defence Mohammed El-Shabazz:

We do not see this move to abolish religion as being a good or neccesary move. I myself practice Islam, but in accordance with the democratic nature of Karuchea, do not force Islam on the country and as freedom of religion is one of the essential freedoms for the people. I hope that we could send a delegation to your country to meet with you and discuss religion and see if this move is a move by dictatorship or a genuine rejection of religion by the people.

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

First and foremost, Avadria is not a democratic nation. Instead we choose to remain under a stable, unifying, leadership. As well you may promote 'freedom of religion' where as our government promotes 'freedom from religion.' It must also be noted that through the education system and other means the Avadrian religious community has shrunk significantly. Roughly one percent of the people were registered to subscribe to a religious belief before the death of Minister Erdzig. This is due in part to the education system which enforces science as an explanation to lifes mysteries and the flag as an object of worship.

We would be willing to accept a delegate from your nation, however we are set in our ways and will not under any circumstances back down from this law, especially under the influence of the international community.

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

"We will be placing your nation on our list of states that sponsor terror. We have compelling reasons to believe you perpetrated those terror attacks against yourself as an excuse to ban religion."

Czar Roger Fabus

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

Unlike your nation we would not perpetrate acts of terror against our own people to influence support for our laws. This law had the support of the Lower Parliament, was passed unanimously by the Upper Parliament, and signed by the Emperor. The unfortunate death of Minister Erdzig only served as a means to push this proposal sooner. The passing of a law of this sort was inevitable.

I can assure you that Avadria is not a 'terrorist state' by any means. However your decision to define us as one under those circumstances begs the question; Have you added yourselves to that list?

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris

From the Desk of the Minister of Foreign Affairs

Unlike your nation we would not perpetrate acts of terror against our own people to influence support for our laws. This law had the support of the Lower Parliament, was passed unanimously by the Upper Parliament, and signed by the Emperor. The unfortunate death of Minister Erdzig only served as a means to push this proposal sooner. The passing of a law of this sort was inevitable.

I can assure you that Avadria is not a 'terrorist state' by any means. However your decision to define us as one under those circumstances begs the question; Have you added yourselves to that list?

Minister of Foreign Affairs
Gerhard Norris


"Fine, good point, we'll remove you from the list. And no, we're not on it, my government is fine and fair. I am not my father and will not be repeating his mistakes."

Czar Roger Fabus

"We appreciate your decision to remove us from the list"

-Gerhard Norris

Office of the President
69 King Avenue
Vvardenfell City

To:Avadria

We officially condemn your government's action in banning all religion from your lands. We ask you to consider repealing this law and again showing respect for people's beliefs. This is coming from a nation that respects religion but has nothing to do with it politically.

President Jimmy Carville
20:15, 01.31